NHS preventing baby from dying at home

>>134931372
>socialists will defend this

>>134931372
Its a waste of taxpayers money

>>134934334
To let the baby die at home?

>>134934177
Nothing to do with the social care system, or hospital. Hospital initially offered the same treatment that they were going to get abroad, but the parents initially refused before the situation got worse. It's the court system, not the hospital, that is preventing this.

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>>134934177
Socialists and leftists are defending it.

It is a political case now, with the state on one side and the life of a white baby on the other. What side do you think these rat fucks would pick?

They need to be purged. All of them. Leftist traitors must fucking die.

>>134934177
read the story, cracker

>>134931372
can some of you brits inform me why they had to get the hospital's permission to try treatment in America?

In America, you dictate where you and your children get treatment.

>>134934177
besides, kid was full potato. god knows we don't need more of those running around corrupting the gene pool.

>>134931372
Reminder that single payer healthcare is absolute dogshit

Reminder that those who work in the government don't actually use the system they created

Reminder that liberals deserve the gas for being so retarded they won't let a baby have a chance to live

>>134931372
Selfish family wants to keep the kid on in pain just so they can take him home, not only that but the fucking life support machine doesn't even fit through the door of the hospital.

>>134934511
Yeah because all the equipment, a member of staff has to be there at all times. What you think they just want to turn the ventilator off and take him home in a buggy? No they want to take all the equipment (that won't fit through their front door) and a specialist to be there 24/7. Because they don't plan on switching off the ventilator at home, they plan on taking him there and just keeping him alive on life support for as long as possible. You really should read the case before commenting, makes you silly.

>>134934890

This is why you don't let emotional retards make decisions. These people are not in a position to make a rational judgement.

>>134931372
Capitalism is private ownership of property. Socialism is state ownership of people.
The baby is the state's property to do with as it pleases. Guess it was in the mood for a dead baby.

>>134934867
why should the baby have had a chance to live? a chance to infect the gene pool when he grew up? are you retarded? kill yourself fag

>>134934692
You can't shop around if you're on the NHS, I think you can if you go private though

>>134934692
Because our healthcare system is based around "first, do no harm" rather than "first, open your wallet".

>>134931372
>britbongs
>not damp cumrag euroshits that force their smelly laws on Britania

>>134935109
Why do Redditors think like this? Capitalism isn't the private ownership of property, capitalism is the use of capital to generate revenues. Do you just parrot what you hear on radio?

>>134934867

>>hur durr niggers should all die doesnt matter if they are brilliant they are niggers

>>white baby that can't survive on its own and never will needs to be kept alive with tax payer dollars


drooling retard

>>134934692
Your insurance company dictates that, kid.

>>134931372
They take glee in killing whites, obviously

can someone actually explain to me why the UK and EU courts wouldn't let the parents take their child to the USA for treatment?

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Oh, and this is a recurring pattern with leftists. They are always in favor fucking euthanasia, assisted suicide, etc. Basically a "just let them die" mindset disguised as compassion.

I've seen it before. Ex gf had a grandfather that was in poor shape. He was still talking though, he wanted to go to a retirement home that had higher care than the one he was in. But one side of the family (the more r-selected, leftist, fucked up side) convinced everyone that he was delirious and that she should be taken home to die, which is what eventually happened.

Same thing here, leftists don't really see the value of a human life, so when someone challenges their god (the leftist state), the cloak their desires for death in compassion.

Fuck them. I hate leftist fucks more than niggers, jews, all the rest. The traitors need to die painfully.

>>134931372

The baby is too white.

>>134931372
They are tax cattle at this point. The saddest thing is they will lash out at you if you point that out, they'll defend their welfare state and multiculturalism until the end.

Sorry for the black pill.

>>134931372
muh single payer.

>>134934692
Because the duty of care is to the child, not the parents.

GOSH back in January had agreed for the treatment to be done in this country but for a few reasons it wasn't.

Reason 1.

Charlies condition deteriorated and he suffered seizures (due to increased swelling in the brain).

Reason 2.

The American doctor repeatedly refused to come to the UK to assess the child until a court demanded that he came and asses the child.

Reason 3.

The American doctor was essentially a snake oil salesman that sold the parents false hope, his nucleoside treatment hadn't even been tested on mice.

>>134935125
The baby had no chance to live.

>>134935347
Read the case.

>>134935339
Too sick to travel, as said before the American doctor was told to come here, he wouldn't because his treatment was a false hope for shekels, all called out by numerous doctors.

>>134931372
The UK seems like the biggest Western hellhole on the planet. I do not say this to upset the bongs. I say this because it seems true. The state or whatever the fuck you call it over there has way too much power over it's people.

>>134935135
So essentially, the court was the "death panels" people tried to scare people away from obamacare with.

>>134935223
Isn't money the issue? The other guy said the NHS wasn't going to pay for it?

>>134935339
Political reason: he can't be helped

Real reason: hes white and threw a stink. That can't be allowed.

>>134935675
This is the 206th thread today bashing England. Why the hate? No seriously why the hate? You haven't read the case (if you had you'd be on our side) so seriously why the hate?

>>134935339
The high court ruled that he couldn't, it was too dangerous

So leftists will fight claw, tooth and nail for the mentally ill (trans) to have the "right" to choose which bathroom they want to use, but they don't give two shits about a parent's right to let their child die in their home?

Once again this shows that leftists are fucking sick in the head.

>>134935612
>called out by numerous doctors
got a link? not trying to be a cunt but I'm curious since I had not heard that

>>134935681
>Isn't money the issue? The other guy said the NHS wasn't going to pay for it?

The treatment offered in the US was experimental. It was agreed that the treatment was not going to help, so the NHS didn't fund it.

>>134935612
>The baby had no chance to live.

Still not a reason for the government to decide that. Muh slippery slope but this sets a bad precedent that will only serve to be abused in the future.

>>134935227
>blaming the EU

But you notice all the Union Jacks defending the hospital in this thread?

the cynical cunt in me says this is some elaborate money making scheme from the parents.

>>134931372
Unless you want the baby to suffer greatly, I'm sure they'd have to move tons of equipment and shit to the parents house just to wait for potatoes inevitable demise. Can't really fault the NHS for this. It's not like the parents could pay for the treatment.

Our healthcare is just stuck in such an awkward middle ground that the leftists have pushed us towards, and the right has allowed to happen. It reminds me of our college industry, where the government subsidizes them at insane levels, then get surprised when the prices rise. Where prices would be cheaper any other way but this. If the government took it over completely it would be cheaper, if the government got out completely it'd be cheaper. Yet here we are.

>>134935284
I never said niggers should die but you should faggot

>>134935125
Every baby deserves a chance to live you fucking darkie

>>134935789
I don't care about the case. I don't care about the baby, or the family. I care that your doctors are not allowing the child, who is going to die, to go home and die there, with his parents. And why the fuck would a judge make that call? Why are the parents not allowed to take their child home, so he can die there?

>>134936019
How did the government decide that?. Basically every doctor involved, both here and in the US, agreed that the experimental treatment was futile. It was basically one guy offering the treatment.

>>134935284
Those without white skin and nordic genomes aren't even people. They're apes mimicking intelligence. A single white child is worth of the lives of every single individual with impure genetics out there.

White lives not only matter, but they're the only ones that do.

>>134935125
Your existence is the best case you could make for your argument.

>>134935789
They're niggers, spics and "German"-Americans.

>>134934867
the baby is deaf, blind and severely brain damaged, it's been dead a while.

>>134935789
I love you bongs. I think the decision was correct. I'm more interested in the larger question how you guys decided when you're no longer going to treat someone because it isn't worth it, as it seems it that was pretty much what happened here.

Does this kind of shit go through the courts often?

Who decides that you no longer get treatment because the cost outweigh so far outweigh the benefits?

>>134936241
typical peasant, mad that we shouldn't have to support his retarded inbred child

>>134935938
The doctors that were brought into the courts (EU and UK courts) to peer review the research done by this American doctor.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/charlie-gard-professor-michio-hirano-help-sick-baby-drug-financial-interest-gosh-nbt-great-ormond-a7858341.html

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/charlie-gard-latest-updates-scan-sick-baby-sad-reading-great-ormond-street-hospital-lawyer-a7853546.html

Hard to get copies because of confidentiality but the independent doctors brought into the courts to review the treatment/care options.

>>134936019
For the 6 billionth time, the government isn't making the decision. There was a thread about this 3 days ago, Americans got completely rekt in it trying to say this was the government making the decision when it isn't. Just stop using that argument....

>NHS and courts are gubmint

no they are not. The doctors didn't even make the decision, which is why it was taken to court because the parents and doctors could not agree..

>>134936102
Because the hospital is in the right..

>>134936252
If you don't care about the case or the baby, shut the fuck up.

>socialized healthcare won't have death panels

>>134936384
>Who decides that you no longer get treatment because the cost outweigh so far outweigh the benefits?

Please remember that this was an experimental treatment which every doctor in both the US and the UK agreed would be useless. Everyone apart from the guy offering it, and charging a lot. If treatment exists he would have and did receive it

>>134936574
I ran it through archive
>http://independent co uk/news/uk/home-news/charlie-gard-professor-michio-hirano-help-sick-baby-drug-financial-interest-gosh-nbt-great-ormond-a7858341.html
https://archive.is/b6qfH
>http://independent co uk/news/health/charlie-gard-latest-updates-scan-sick-baby-sad-reading-great-ormond-street-hospital-lawyer-a7853546.html
https://archive.is/BJKE3

>>134936264
So you don't think any chance should be taken to save a life?

>>134936574
Fuck off. I told you exactly what I do care about, and you still have not answered my question? Why are the parents being barred from taking their dying child home, so he can die there? What gives them that right, exactly?

>>134934585
> leftist
> traitor
Seems like redundant wording there, brother

>>134936000
So money really was the issue, the parents could have paid for it if they had the means.

What are the standards the NHS uses when they decide to deny care? Here you say the treatment was too experimental. What if an extremely expensive treatment would prolong someone's life merely a few weeks? Is there somebody that steps in a says, "Nope, too expensive for too little of benefit"?

>>134936614
>Everyone apart from the guy offering it, and charging a lot.
He actually said his treatment wouldn't work when he was asked to come here. He didn't know what type of MDS the child had, he just opened his mouth like the Pope did and Trump did. Without knowing a damn thing.

>>134936709
Again from the last thread. This isn't about a chance to save a life, at the very best (even though it wouldn't work) it would buy a few days of time. Not that the nucleoside treatment would work. So just stop. Just stop now.

>>134936781
You have no argument, you cannot comment on this case considering you know nothing. Be quiet you retard.

>>134936709
I mean, where do you draw the line? If your relative was ill and I told you I had a brand new unproven treatment and charged you $5 million would you pay it?

>>134936614
>Everyone apart from the guy offering it,

No, actually that guy said he didn't know the case was as advanced as it was, and seemed skeptical even about his experimental treatment working.

>>134936384

it's not about the cost for fucks sake. the issue was that an experimental treatment had no realistic prospect of success. experimental treatments aren't covered by any insurance group or by public health because they have not been clinically proven to be effective.

the decision to remove life support was in the child's best interest to reduce its suffering. it is not a financial decision to remove the child from life support.

>>134936252
>I care that your doctors are not allowing the child, who is going to die, to go home and die there, with his parents. And why the fuck would a judge make that call? Why are the parents not allowed to take their child home, so he can die there?
>>134936574
>If you don't care about the case or the baby, shut the fuck up.
Why is the Britbottle so afraid to answer the question? Why is he so afraid, /pol/?

>>134936964
I see you still have not answered my question. Why don't you just answer it?

>>134936981
>>134936964
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/charlie-gard-latest-lord-robert-winston-interference-cruel-unhelpful-pope-vatican-donald-trump-a7825071.html

>>134936976
If I had the means I would do whatever it takes for a family member.

>>134931372
Apostasy from God.
The State is the new god.
Submit and die, avoid thought crimes in the meantime.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQ4GbcuBvUQ

Here's a FAQ I just found for anyone interested

http://www.gosh.nhs.uk/frequently-asked-questions-about-charlie-gard-court-case

>>134937159
The treatment didn't work anon

>>134936614
>get lung cancer
>terminal, 2 weeks left
>every doctor you visit reduces it by a day
>live for 20 more years, die at 82
It's like doctor's aren't omnipotent. Hmm.

>>134937108
>>134937114
Because if the dimwit had read my earlier post he would know that I already answered it.

The hospital has a duty of care to the patient, not to the parents.

The hospital equipment will not fit through their front door, which is why he cannot go home.

We can't even send the elderly back to their homes if the care standards aren't good enough or they aren't adapted for their needs. Because it opens the hospital up for being sued.

Now shut the fuck up.

>>134931372
Breeders, get fucked.

>>134931372
The Spartans had this right 2500 years ago. Take this abomination and throw him off the cliff of woe.

Preserve the gene pool.

>>134937212
And if i had a child I don't care how infinitesimally small the chances are. I'm not going to my grave eventually knowing I didn't do everything possible.

>>134936614
>If treatment exists he would have and did receive it
Sure, not surprising in the case of a child. Is that the same for a 95 year old man, or is there some mechanism that says enough is enough.

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>>134934867
Exactly, want to know how to get faster healthcare? Have a family member that works at a hospital.

t. Canadian

>>134934915
I don't blame them, I would try something sneaky too if the socialist government was trying to murder my child.

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>>134936019
the parents couldn't pay for it, so unless some charity wanted to keep the baby alive for however many years, to the tune of probably tens of millions of dollars, it's up the NHS. They knew it was a fruitless effort so they said let the kid die in peace. seems reasonable to me. If I payed tons of tax dollars into the NHS, the last thing I'd want my tax dollars to go towards is someone who will even in the best of circumstances be a vegetable all their life. It's a no brainier for me. Just let em die peacefully.

>>134937332
I'm not sure what you are trying to say

>>134937380
What if that treatment (your decision) means that child dies screaming in agony as a result and your last few moments with your child weren't peaceful, they were haunting screams as an experimental drug is pumped into that child?

You think that's the lesser of the two evils? When those are your only two options, put yourself in the position of the care givers, the doctors and specialists that have been put in charge of the child's welfare and care. You wouldn't subject a child to unethical, untested treatment from a shekel grabbing kike in America.

What more do you want? This doctor openly admitted that his treatment wouldn't work, he offered false hope when he shouldn't have. This "chance of treatment" "chance of being saved" is a null and void point, there was and is no chance. So get it through your heads, everyone before you start typing and remember that the doctors haven't killed him, the courts haven't killed him, no one else but his genetic disorder have killed him.

>>134935293
And you dictate your insurance company, until democrats and neocons let them get a monopolistic grip on individual states.

>>134936000
>It was agreed
Such a weasel phrase

>>134936574
>independent
>...

>>134937342
plebbit spacing, assmad, inb4 6 gorillion butthurt walls of text

>>134937448
No, a patient can refuse treatment of course if they so choose, a doctor will usually advise you of the severity of the situation. Nobody decides if you die or not if thats what you mean

>>134937883
>It was agreed
>Such a weasel phrase

well it was agreed by the doctors and the high court

>>134937883
>German flag
Go prep your bull Heimlich.

>>134937903
Americans are idiots, join me in banging your head against a brick wall. You'll get far more stimulation from it than a debate with retarded Americans.

The child is going to die, it's over and it's done. Blame the parents for cursing the poor mite with poor genetics.

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>>134931372
Fucking socialists, I swear I'm going to kill them all.

>>134934334
>>134934915
After the government refused to let them threat the baby with private money. Go fuck yourselves.

>>134931372
I suppose this is our daily reminder that the UK is not a free country.

>>134935058
>This is why you don't let emotional retards make decisions.
One of the workers of this organization (Great Ormand Street Hosptial) said they would kill the children of people who voted for Brexit on public television.

>>134938078
>After the government refused to let them threat the baby with private money. Go fuck yourselves.

Please read the thread, or even just google the case

Parents are idiots who wanted media attention and fame.

Who the fuck wants a deaf, blind and brain damaged child that would need 24/7 care/attention for the rest of its life, and just sapping tax payer's money?

Just kill the thing already.

>>134938223
Enjoy slavery.
It will come back around to you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qCuaPUVFbzg

>>134931372
Jew want a white baby to suffer, they love it

>>134931372
IDK but next time a Muslim decides to drive a van of peace into a crowd I'm not gonna feel bad for them.

>>134938161
Go to bed son. You're embarrassing yourself.

>>134938161
>said they would kill the children of people who voted for Brexit

what? lmao. A worker from there said on question time she hopes brexit voters kids get sick. Stupid fucking comment but she didn't say she would kill children you retard

>>134938069
That's pretty harsh, sir. I'm actually trying to out what keeps you bongs from going to the doctor for anything and everything. Basic economic theory pretty much suggests that when a good (like health care) is totally free, people will consume a shit ton of it. What keeps you guys from going to the doctor every time you've got the smallest issue if you never have to pay?

>>134938223
The baby would have been treated for free here in the U.S. but your government wouldn't let him come.

>>134931372
The case is simply the British government asserting they are always and totally in control of their citizens' life and death. You only have the freedom mommy government lets you have.

>>134938771
All of this has been answered already. I dont have energy to keep going over this. There is a page from the hospital website linked in the thread

lil baby btfo

>>134935223
>Do no harm.
>100% chance of death.
You have a funny interpretation of harm.

>>134938708
nothing stops you from seeing the doctor if you think you have an issue. Most people that aren't hypochondriacs will not waste their time going to a doctor if they don't have real problems.

the freedom to go see a doctor if you think you have a problem is important because it gets the ball rolling faster if you get diagnosed sooner. putting off a problem because you don't want to pay $ to see a doctor could lead to irreversible problems. early prevention is cheaper to treat and offers the highest survival rates.

>>134939122
I've noticed Americans keep making the argument that if healthcare is free at the point of use then everybody will used it all the time, it just doesn't make sense. Like this sort of thing

>Basic economic theory pretty much suggests that when a good (like health care) is totally free, people will consume a shit ton of it.

>>134939324

>it just doesn't make sense

What the fuck

>>134939477
Explain how it makes sense, please

>>134939532

A supermarket sells wine. The government sets the price of said wine to 0. What do you think will happen?

>>134938324
i would want them to let me die if i ever needed that kind of care

>>134939677
So what, people are going to give themselves diseases to take advantage of the NHS? Also a luxury good like wine is in no way the same as a healthcare service

>>134939677
Bro how many heart surgeries do you need in the average lifetime? 1? I can drink 500 bottles of wine in a year, though.

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>>134931372
>WeRe NOt goInG tO ALLow yOU to sAVe yOUr BAby
>aND WEre nOT GOIng TO allOW yOU tO TAKe iT hoME

>>134939677
this is a wtf analogy. what are you going to do? keep breaking your leg to access this premium healthcare service?

give yourself aids so you can get that delicious hospital food?

what the actual fuck man.

>>134938981
Iddy biddy baby
>iddy biddy boat

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>>134931372
"HEY! HEY!! LOOK AT ME! I'M THE PARENT NOW!"-NHS

>>134937679
They're absolutely free to switch to private medical care in their own home that they pay for. The free market still exists in the UK.

They don't want to pay for it.

The machines that are keeping him alive literally can't fit in the house they live in. One particular machine doesn't even fit through their door.

They've been offered a private hospice and they're even moaning about that. They keep making outrageous and unrealistic demands and idiots lap it up because it apparently proves some wider narrative about socialised healthcare that they want to shovel.

>>134942210
Yup, and most of the media here in the UK will take any opportunity to shit on the NHS.

>>134942210
Can you provide a source on the private hospice thing? I hadn't heard that.

>>134935675
There's lots of sanity remaining in England. One particular bitter piece of sanity is that palliative care is often better than experimental treatment.

>>134934334
I would hang you from a tree so high the fall would decapitate you, you and everyone like you. I often wonder what happens, what region of the brain is underdeveloped to where some people (people like you) are just not quite all the way human. I think nature intended on this so we could use you like any other animal and not feel anything when we need to put you down. You're a NPC.

>>134942210
The state shouldn't be involved. All orher arguments are moot.

Is it possible to just sink Europe at this point?

>>134942427
You have to admit that your GPs aren't doing a good job serving as a face of NHS.

>>134944006
Why? I can't really think of examples of GPs acting badly

>>134944193
My impression of your GPs was that they are a bit dumb and incompassionate. I had a GP send me away saying I should come next week if my symptoms remain. I had a GP "google" (on their information system) my symptoms. I had a GP say they have no idea what my symptoms are about. In the end, I was fine in all these cases, but the negative perception of GPs accumulates. I feel if I had something serious, it would go completely unnoticed until it would be to late to do anything.

>>134945108
Yeah well thats fair, on the other hand I have only had good experiences. I guess its just luck really, or maybe the area you were in. Doctors are people too and I'm sure there are lazy or rude ones like any other profession

The socialist shithole that is much of Europe will suffer. They are lead by GHOSTS and are on a train into another dimension....

>>134945353
It is true perhaps that I didn't live in a nice area.

>>134936302
Wew.

>>134936366
Like you Brits are far behind: Poos, Pakis, and nogs.

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>>134936366