B-B-BUT COMMUNISM DOESN'T WORK!

>>134042372
>that it can't be better

You're implying that we think that equality is great to begin with.

We don't think that "communism would be great only if it worked".

Communism is the ultimate politically correct ideology.

that's a big post

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>>134042372
>Capitalism isn't optimally efficient at running anything.

>>134042372
how would it work without having the gov take your shit....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mcf9CLMQuRQ

>>134042372
go back to your video games

Nobody would work if they got the same as everyone else.

>>134042372
>Imagine a computer. A governing computer

Dropped.

I'll say no to false gods ruling over me thank you

>>134042714
How can you think equality isn't good? Isn't it a core virtue of being American? Isn't it a pretty irrationally hateful opinion to think some people actual deserve the depravity of poverty? Is a man not at least entitled to shelter?

>>134042747
Not sure what you're trying to say friendo

You still end up with a moneyed class under communism.
Haves and have nots never goes away

>>134042372
>This obviously isn't a meritocracy or you're arguing that the rich are working literally thousands of times harder than the rest of us.
My dad is an engineer. He almost certainly works harder than somebody taking my order at McDonald's. My mum is a manager. Same with her.

>>134042805
It would be more like the government giving you shit. The OP is implying a UBI

.>>134042967
Read the OP. Everyone doesn't have to work. To value the life of a people by their labor is archaic.

>>134043016
Not ruling over you, and not a "false god." Just a fucking algorithm to make sure you and everyone else has enough to get by, health insurance etc.

>>134042372
>How can we make the world better if we use its current state as evidence that it can't be better? We have grown too used to class disparity that even the poor will defend it.
Go fucking read about the Soviet Union and China. Both had more extreme disparity than anything in capitalist countries. If you don't want to be poor, you can work harder. That's not a fucking option in communism.

>>134043023
>How can you think equality isn't good? Isn't it a core virtue of being American?

I'm not an American, and we already had a taste of your "equality".

The lack of the commie lingo in your post disturbs me greatly though.

>>134043023
The core virtue of being an American is that the individual is more important than the state.

>>134043096
What's your message?

>>134042372
We already have section 8 housing and food stamps.

>>134043299
That both my parents could not be replaced by just anyone, so they deserve higher pay. Supply and demand, bitch. I'm taking computer science at uni, and by virtue of the difficulty of it, not just anyone could do this either, so i deserve more than someone making a coffee once I graduate. Supply and demand.

>>134043069
I'm not saying the rich should not exist. Just that they should be less rich.

>>134043096
That's cool to hear but I still don't see why someone who works at McDonalds shouldn't have a livable wage. Restaurant jobs can fucking suck. Are you telling me you believe that any billionaire or millionaire in this country works just as hard as their money would suggest, by the definition of a meritocracy?

>>134043496
So, WHAT is your MESSAGE related to the OP specifically?

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>>134043023
Equality is a meme, no one is equal to one another, be it intelligence, beauty, skill and the willingness to better themselves, Communism in practice only drags high achievers down to the lowest, some people can't be made to perform better, so in leu of that Communism rectifies that by putting a machine gun on them to force them to work. Plus once a Communist system is implemented, it's becomes mandatory, so horrible in fact people risk death to get out from under it. But you won't listen, not until the Marxist leninist boot comes crashing down upon your throat, and then the people you radikals oppressed will be clamoring to see their revenge enacted upon you intellectuals, and the strongmen within will let them, just to return some sense of functionality rather than anarchism.

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>>134042372
Fuck yourself

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OlB_xNOAn1c

I made a theme song for leftypol.

Mine is the faith, the practise of the graveyard
Pray to heaven, the coming of the vanguard

And we will purge the kulaks, and kill all the jews
And murder everyone, who wears red shoes

We will ensure, with sword and bomb and gun
In this trouble earth, that there's only one

Bring me dear leader, I want to bow and pray
And if I ever blaspheme, lock me away

Send me to the gulag, I want to be your lesser
I need absolution, one and only master

Beat and whip the ignorant, burn all you find that's wrong
Destroy all dissent, the nation must be strong

Elect leader head-case, stuff all the Poles
Burn free elections, power to the proles!

is this b8?

>>134042372
I remember being 18 and having no idea how things actually work but still coming up with dumb ideas about how the world should work.

Ahhhh.
Youth.

>>134043496
The idea of supply and demand is archaic. If the demand for your work, by some force of the market, were to plummet, you would have no job and no value under capitalism. It would be unethical for you to have to suffer for something like that. A governing A.I. that balances the economy wouldn't mean that everyone gets the exact same amount of money, it would just mean there's a minimum that a person cannot dip below and a maximum that they cannot rise above. This maximum could still probably be high enough not to effect your parents.

>>134042372

Imagine the government advocating for a 100% tax on everything. Thats communism. Now fuck off.

>>134042372
"communism doesn't work because [historical example where corrupt people fucked it up]"

Just going to point this out there. If you have to start your argument with something along the lines of "ignore these historical examples", then you didn't have an argument to begin with.

>>134043676
But do the more intelligent and beautiful really "deserve" more than anyone else? If someone is born hideous are they to be predestined for a shitty life?

There is fucking nothing about the philosophy of communism that implies machine guns. You must be mistaking the idea of it for a historical shitty implementation, but the truth is that this philosophy is based on fundamental truths of human nature.

And with the amount of currency that exists we could still afford to have an upper class. Just maybe dad can't own a second yacht.

>>134043764
Not only is this cringe as fuck but you aren't addressing any actual content of any actual argument. The fundamentals of the belief system I'm proposing directly contradict the presence of a dictator or any kind of oppressive government force. But I guess the only thing this board understands is identity politics and strawmen? You know you're more similar to those leftists you hate than you realize.

>>134043897
nope.

>>134043976
Then give a historical example of communism, implemented to a tee of its actual definition, that has failed.

>>134042372
wah i want to take other people's money because they're more successful than me

>>134042372

> there isn't a solid justification

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>>134042372
>B B B But Muh Bread Lines.

>>134042372
Why do we want everyone to have enough to live? Why is this in any way desirable?

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>>134042372
>Imagine

Stopped reading right there, faggot. I don't need to imagine, we know communism is terrible

>>134044798
These questions answer themselves. How can you have so little concern about the well being of humanity.

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>>134042372
Good post OP. In communism, work is the means to an end. In capitalism, work is the end in itself. In this way, capitalism is inherently inefficient.

>>134042747
Lol'd

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>Centralizes all resources and industry to the government creating a political Bourgeoisie
>Most famous Communist leader kills numerous citizens
"B-but it wasn't real Socialism"

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>>134044989
If you care for the "well being of humanity", you wouldn't give everyone on the planet the resources to breed with.

Free breeding will shred your genome faster than DNA. Unless you want the entire population to look like pic related in 3 generations.

>>134044606
Okay, I'll do so after you give me a single historical example of capitalism that was implemented to a tee, and that has failed. This is why your argument is invalid. You're merely adjusting the scope of your argument to avoid the admission of failure.

>>134042372
Communism: good concept, wrong species

>>134045142
Natural selection at it's finest.

Imagine a world in which machines excise the fetal brain to use as feed for local wildlife and replace it with a microchip that produces ant-like behavior. A society, all of us working together, doing our part. It would be so beautiful

>>134044218
Deserve has nothing to do with it, and an ideology on paper means nothing marxs writings aren't fit to wipe ones ass with, when that ideology is put into practice in the real world it quickly devolves in to who is the most barbaric survives, now I know you think you will be some important card carrying member, but no, you will be working in the mines or the fields if you aren't deemed a danger to the revolution because you won't like the equality that communism offers. Like I said, you sit and have these high minded ideals that mean nothing when it actually gets put in practice. You are infatuated with something that can't exist in reality. Something that should have sat on a shelf to be laughed at by sane people.

>>134045074
>creating a political Bourgeoisie
That's the literal opposite of what I'm proposing and also the literal reality of capitalism.

A computer doesn't need to be paid.

Communism is cool. Watch Wall-E.

>>134042372

The issue is that when you consolidate all government activities into the hands of literally 5 or 6 people, that's probably less ideal than having an aristocracy even.

>>134045152
>Communism: good concept, wrong species
#
yeah you need to be an ant

>i-i know how to make communism work
>let's just completely change basic human nature and become soulless drones
>COMMUNISM 1 EVERYONE ELSE 0 I WON MOMMY
Kys idiot

>>134045142
I don't think giving the poor money will make them any more likely to have kids honestly. Living in poverty isn't stopping anyone nowadays from having 8 fucking kids, they might as well grow up in slightly better circumstances? For the sake of the future?

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Communism is nearly 200 years old yet and never, in all this time, produce a successful and sustainable Nation.

Its time to realize your opinions will either uplift the entire world or throw it down into the Pit. You are all so very important to how this world operates, please realize this and start living accordingly.

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>>134042372
>communism is great
>it just failed and turned into a genocidal dictatorship this one time
>and this other time
>and this other time
>and this other time
>but this next time it'll work, i promise you!

Wow, it's almost as if we oppose the outcome of the attempt, rather than the idea itself...

>>134042372
>>Inequality is a fact of nature! It is necessary and natural that there be a lower class
>This is a shitty attitude.

An even shittier attitude is believing you are entitled to something without earning it. Especially something that was earned through the hard work of others.

Go fuck yourself.

How about the fact that every political regime nowadays is mixed? There is no pure capitalism. Because capitalism failed just like pure communism.

>>134044218
Yes, they do. Precisely because they are better then the rest. Suggesting otherwise is a direct affront to the nature of reality. Communism was invented to destroy us, by getting us to ignore this basic reality. Karl Marx waxed a number of poems to Satan where he covers this intent in detail. Communism, and I say this with zero hyperbole, is a satanic idea.

https://archive.org/stream/MarxAndSatan/MarxAndSatan_djvu.txt

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>>134042372
>your people are starving but it's okay because you shot up a dog into space with stolen capitalist technology

didn't read your post anyway, it's most likely just retarded drivel coming from a larping western teenager that's never seen what communism looks like

neck yourself

>>134045144
Okay, The United States. Capitalism is failing. It does nothing to stop its own stagnation and the pooling of wealth among the minority. If a system running "successfully" involves millions of people in poverty and millions more in exploitation than I wouldn't consider it successful.

I''m not avoiding anything. None of the failed historical examples of communism people throw around actually apply to the ideas I propose. An infallible computer, and modern ethical efficiency have never been applied to wide scale communism.

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>>134043023
>equality
>a core value of being American
No, you're confusing equality with the idea that anyone can succeed with enough drive to do so and with enough hard work.
You're confusing equality with the ideal of the American Dream

>>134042372
>>134043241
>historical example where corrupt people fucked it up
The reason why all the historical examples are fucked up by corrupt people is because putting all that power into the hands of a few will inevitably lead to corruption. Having the government take control of everything and make it all "equal" will inevitably lead to corruption within the government. Why does the government have to have anything to do with it? Well, who else is going to enforce the equality?

As for your AI god- who will program this AI? Who will create it and who will service it and repair it if it breaks and who will maintain it and its physical systems and who will update and adapt it for changing times?

Will the AI be self-aware and be able to do all of this on its own by itself? Will it create robots as extensions of itself to maintain its physical systems and will it change its own code to adapt to changing needs? If the AI is self-aware and adapting to this degree, who is to say that it will agree that communism and "equality" are the best systems? What if it decides to run society in a different way?

>>134043867
>>134044218
>it would just mean there's a minimum that a person cannot dip below and a maximum that they cannot rise above
>But do the more intelligent and beautiful really "deserve" more than anyone else? If someone is born hideous are they to be predestined for a shitty life?
So what, should we hinder and put restrictions on those born with advantages? Should someone who is naturally gifted be handicapped and disabled so that they will not unfairly rise above the "equality" of the rest?

Jesus, man, you almost sound like you want "Harrison Bergeron" to be a reality

>>134045338
Its easier to argue against strawmen, isn't it?

>>134045604
>Communism is nearly 200 years old yet and never, in all this time produce a successful and sustainable Nation.

What is China

>>134045731
sorry, wrong url.

https://ia802707.us.archive.org/21/items/MarxAndSatan/MarxAndSatan.pdf

Its worth the read.

>>134045921
Fake news

>>134042372
communism doesn't work because we're humans not robots

So many replies and not 1 person mentioning that such a computer/algo would be created by a bunch of humans who would automatically become an elite and without a doubt add things to the code which benefit themselves.

>>134045808
The US isn't failing last I checked, and even if it was, if I applied your same logic then I could say that "it's not true capitalism".

>>134045361
What mines? What fields? Obviously a governing computer could be designed not to send anyone into the fucking gulags.There is very little fucking labor nowadays that cannot be done through automation. There is less and less need for a working class. You cannot use historical precedent to argue against this because there is no historical precedent.

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>>134045892

>>134046009
It's because it's such an obvious argument, that at this point people are just having fun picking at OP, the class dunce.

>>134045892
>What is China
Ironically, it only started becoming successful when it started embracing capitalism. The only "communism" that exists in China is as a pretext for the corrupt kleptocracy that the CCP uses to rob, hoard and embezzle the wealth produced by the people in ironically capitalistic ventures.

>>134045711
Democratic capitalism failed for entirely different reasons, primarily because of it's overwhelming focus on the material while completely ignoring the metaphysical and the focus on individualism. Individualism is a death of a nation, the "freedom" is a lie that leads to complete decadence with time.

Capitalism isn't really a political ideology, it's more of an economic system so I assume you're referring to democratic capitalism.

>>134043023

Dumbass "equality" as opposed to British aristocracy/monarchy. They knew about shelter. You may be onto something though, equality is the right of each and every man born in a woman's body to have his cock surgically removed at taxpayer expense and be showered with public acclamation for so doing.

>>134045968
You should know well enough that meme has no effect on anyone here.

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>>134045892
hahaha

>be in communism
>be smartest man alive
>live whole life working for some NEET.
No thank you.
Also, can someone explain to me what Marx meant by communism requires stateless, classless and moneyless society?
What prevents you from keeping your crops you grow to yourself?
Seems like authoritarian government has to form one way or another.

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>>134045892
nice try

>>134045657
>An even shittier attitude is believing you are entitled to something without earning it. Especially something that was earned through the hard work of others.
I agree with you, and this is why I'm completely against capitalism. It rewards parasites and punishes hard workers.

>>134042372
Communism is a Jewish invention, kill yourslef kike

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>>134045892

>What is China

>>134046194
> capitalism failed
> hurr durr it's just because of hurr durr
> communism failed particularly in one specific country due to X
> hurr durr commuism dont work

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>>134045892
China isn't Communist, anon. Not even really by name any more. And China is especially not Marxist. Heres a whole bunch of sources proving this.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2011/01/03/5-myths-about-the-chinese-communist-party/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D3HCv2Sf_7Q
https://www.bustle.com/articles/8836-is-china-a-communist-country-why-americans-cant-be-ignorant-about-china-anymore
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8538023
https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2015-06-30/china-is-a-communist-success-story-kinda-

I know many of you anons enjoy larping as commies to piss off the natzees, but if any of you are sincerely communist, please educate yourself on the matter from the opposite side -- not just pro-commie propaganda. Its even worse than a doomed strategy: Communism is inherently anti-white.

>>134045880

I don't follow, what do you dislike about the world I described?

>>134046379


>https://youtube com/watch?v=D3HCv2Sf_7Q
https://hooktube.com/watch?v=D3HCv2Sf_7Q
>https://bustle com/articles/8836-is-china-a-communist-country-why-americans-cant-be-ignorant-about-china-anymore
https://archive.is/JNdUP

>>134042372
Communism and Socialism never made the avarage man richer. It always works for a small group of people, the rest is fucked. A basic history book should be enough to understand this.

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>>134042372

>>134042372
>I just implied capitalism doesn't have corrupt people involved in its mechanism, and inadvertently disproved my own post, because I'm an idiot.

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>>134045892
China is more Capitalist than Communist you filthy anon

>>134046079
Are you Jewish?

>>134046317
Not only is it Jewish, its openly satanic. It was designed with the sole intent of sowing chaos and disrupting the natural order. There is no such thing as equality anywhere in existence. Without inequality nothing would work, matter wouldnt have formed, evolution wouldnt have occured, ceullar respiration would be impossible. Inequiality is a fundamental feature of reality. communism is an abomination, a thought virus, that relys on our inherent desire for gibs.

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>>134046425
from one of the sources I gave. capitalism + communism is NOT marxism or nazbol

>>134046471
>Communism and Socialism never made the avarage man richer
Tell me moar. 60s and 70s were the only times in the history of Russia when there was real middle class and it was much richer than the majority of people in Russian Empire. It also went much worse after USSR. Nowadays the Russians are still poorer than then.

>>134042372
>for communism to work you need to wipe out humanity.
classy commie.

>>134045892
China is a heavily socialized authoritarian state with a limited free marcket. When mao tried true communism back in the 50s and 60s millions died of starvation. They are not true communists

>>134042372
>First word is imagine
That's the problem. You can imagine thousands of realities that are not our own. Atop ignoring human nature and stop living in ideological fantasies.

>>134045495
I said a computer. It would be impossible to sway in the favor of a special interest.

>>134045550
LITERALLY nothing in the OP implies we change human nature or become "drones." You're quoting a made up antagonist because you know you have no real argument.

>>134045657
>the hard work of others
Read the OP. Automation. No one asked to be born and we're all the same deep down. The only coherent solution when you deconstruct all the bullshit is that we all deserve to at least live peaceful lives.

>>134045632
Give me an example of communism, implemented to a tee, that has failed.

>>134046025
False equivalency. The U.S. does exist under true capitalism, to its definition, and there is still too much suffering.

>>134046009
Believe it or not this is avoidable. If the code is intractable and available for public scrutiny then no class of people could get away with changing it.

>>134042372
>bait
Im fine with communism in a sense, because i can get free shit without working, but thats also the reason why it wouldn't work lul

Only idiots believe in communism.

As material creatures, we have material needs. Those individuals who cannot produce enough to sustain themselves (either directly or through the market) do not deserve to continue existing.

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>>134046317

Communism is not chaos. It is harmonious order.

>>134046554
No, all religion is social control.

>>134042372
>equality is better than equality
no.

>>134046919
I am not talking about religion.

>>134046849
Really now? It seems to me as if there are quite a few programs which tax the rich, and give to the poor. Thus once again, by your own logic, "it's not true capitalism".

>>134046885
Only idiots believe in capitalism

>>134046849
>>134046962
What I mean by this, is that earlier you said "to a tee", which would mean a system which is 100% communism. I, also said "to a tee", which would mean 100% capitalism. The issue here, is that one can simply turn your argument against you, to show how foolish it is.

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>>134042372
>imagine
I imagine you swinging from a rope by your neck as a helicopter parades you above main street as an example of what all communists deserve.

Just cut the shit and admit that all you want us to be a Commissar for some bullshit bureau to rule over everyone else. You shitheads don't even believe in any of the trash you spew.

>>134046960
I'm also not jewish by blood. My ancestry is in northern europe.

>>134046919
And isn't Communism, all about social control?

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>>134042372

>Communism has failed every single time causing horrifying amounts of human suffering
>it will totally work according to some asshole on the internet if we do it his way

Jesus Christ OP.

>>134042372
the poor will always exist, as there will always be people too stupid to realize that paying $$ for wine and circuses on payday will leave them with nothing to buy food with or pay rent.
So of course, you just program the computer to give everyone a house...maybe have amazon do a weekly food delivery, so they don't starve....and make sure all the utilities are covered too, because that poor idiot won't spend a dime of his gibs on those bills....better make healthcare covered too....everyone gets house calls so they don't have to find a ride to the doctors office....and give everyone a car too, in urban areas mass transit passes....and phones too, everyone needs a phone and a computer and free education too....and free diapers and formula....and of course, the monthly gibs check too....

socialism doesn't work, not even a little bit....because it creeps in and more and more things become "rights" that are paid for by other people who no longer have the right to the products of their own labor....so one slave class works, in an attempt to be free...while the other slave class consumes crappy commodities and thinks they're free....all the while ((they)) get richer and our chains get tighter....

>what is survival of the fittest

>>134047309
If you read past the first word you would notice I am advocating for quite the opposite of power belonging to "some bullshit bureau."

>>134046849

> The catastrophic failures to implement my idea only mean we have to keep trying

>>134046267
>It rewards parasites and punishes hard workers.
Parasites exist in all systems. Capitalism can be create parasites who use accumulated wealth and influence to strangle the market. In the early 1900s, we had unregulated monopolies. And even regulated capitalism can be corrupted by the well established and early adopters who use their influence to lobby for restrictive regulations, patent laws and litigation to strangle any future newcomers. But capitalism didn't start off with the goal of creating these parasites. And even now, it's still evolving, people innovate and find new ways to topple old regimes and create new markets.

Communism, however, intentionally creates a class of parasites and forcibly infects society with it. Everyone is sick, everyone is bled to feed the parasites, and everyone slowly dies.

>>134047492
>one slave class works, in an attempt to be free...while the other slave class consumes crappy commodities and thinks they're free....all the while ((they)) get richer and our chains get tighter...

Its almost as if you've described modern capitalism. Its almost like you didn't read the OP.

Theoretically ALL LABOR CAN BE AUTOMATED. this seems to poke some holes in people's common arguments against communism, how one class will steal from another... It would be more like the middle class consuming the lower class and much of the upper class, and we all benefit from the smooth runnings of robot labor.

>>134047528
Read the OP. There has not been any implementation of this idea in history.

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>>134045808

>NOT REAL CAPITALISM

>>134048019
Fine, if we take capitalism in America now and adjust for the "un-capitalist" things about it, if we imagine its actually true capitalism, there's no possible way it would be any less unethical. It would be worse.

>>134042372
>Imagine.
Like how people imagined food during communism?
Fuck off.

>>134046893
you cant trick me Goldenstien!

>>134046183

This.
Thank you for articulating so concisely what I've been thinking of years about modern China.

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>>134047521

>>134047846
>>ALL LABOR CAN BE AUTOMATED
so who fixes the robots? more robots? who makes them? more robots....have you ever read a book called One On Me? Literally about a society where The Machine makes everything and it costs money to get a job! well, there's more to it than that, but that's the basis of the book....a society of indulgent consumers who are given everything by the machine....great book....
but any way, in any society there will be "workers" even if the "work" is youtuber...they will attempt to work their way to freedom....the other class of slaves, won't even notice their enslavement....

>>134046230

A fucking feudal system but without a single lord.

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lol fucking nerds.

>>134048394
I do enjoy the fact that people now have to pay to see his grave. I find the irony amusing.

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>>134042372
>[historical example where corrupt people fucked it up]
There you go, that's the empirical data modern communists do mental flip flops to ignore:
>communism fails because it aims to somehow perfect humanity by forcing everyone to adopt counter-factual propositions to human nature
Just like lolbergtarianism, that thinks everyone will just magically agree to obey the NAP, and not violate the commons if its ever in their personal self-interest. Surprise surprise, both systems are promoted by jews.

ps - similarly, there is no computer system that cannot be hacked. Whoever is the system administrator, is effectively Stalin.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-BZylziBKI

It doesn't work because it doesn't work tldr

>>134048490
Must it really run counter to human nature that there be no class of people in poverty..

>>134048490
I could at least somewhat see anarcho-capitalism. In theory people would start to pay for protection in order to enforce the NAP, but that really leads back into a circle when you think about it. At that point, isn't the company giving the protection effectively the government?

>>134048490
>Just like lolbergtarianism, that thinks everyone will just magically agree to obey the NAP,

its not "magic" you dumb bastard. its an "agreement" do you know what an agreement is? specifically a mutual agreement? stupid toothless goober. flag checks out tho

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>>134042372
>[historical example where corrupt people fucked it up]
This might appear as a strawman if EVERY Communist country wasn't corrupt and trash. They weren't even really communist because communism doesn't work. North Korea has private businesses operating because, like every communist country ever, the people kept starving.

Didn't even read the rest of your post btw.
Saged.

>>134045892
China is much more capitalistic than communistic.

If this were to happen i would completley dogfuck at my communist job and bust ass doing under the table stuff for non taxable money

>>134042372
A communist literally wants to live in the matrix. The blue pill meme is real.

>>134048830
I actually didn't even think about that, but now that you mention it.

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>>134048617
If that's the norm throughout all human history, why are you so resistant to the prospect that that was how we evolved, to have a pyramid-shaped hierarchy? Also, you're promoting the full-automation meme ITT: once you've eliminated labor, who will be the consumers to purchase the products? All those extra mouths will suddenly become "lazy eaters", and you can expect a massive population contraction a la the Holodmor, Stalin's little "miscalculation while de-kulaking the Ukraine".

>>134048638
>At that point, isn't the company giving the protection effectively the government?
Any semblance of libertarianism/anarchism ever conceived would (and therefore has) quickly become Feudalism.

>>134048667
>do you know what an agreement is?
Something that requires an enforcement mechanism, because if none exists, self-interested rational actors violate the "agreements". For some reason autists imagine that everyone follows the law without compulsion, just because "rules are rules and everyone naturally wants to follow them". That's only reality while you still live on your little trust fund or in mommy's basement; that's not reality for 98% of the planet. Human beings are vicious to each other if they do not fear the consequences, that's the norm.

>>134042372
Capitalist countries are corrupt too yet they work out 1000X better than scumbag commie countries. Imagine if America wasn't corrupt.

>>134049018
Pretty much what I was saying. Just comes back into a circle, since humans are naturally social, and thus form some sort of hierarchy.

>>134048780

Every communist country had thriving black markets to provide the goods that the government was too incompetent or tyrannical to provide. Attempting to have a few shitty bureaucrats run something as complex as an entire economy shows that communists have no concept of what an economy actually is.

>>134049028
It's only corrupt because of Cultural Marxism.

>>134049042

So Hitler was the good guy after all?

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>>134042372
>>Inequality is a fact of nature! It is necessary and natural that there be a lower class

>This is a shitty attitude.
Cool spook.
>How can we make the world better if we use its current state as evidence that it can't be better?
Nice implication that we should make the world a "better place". More spook.
>We have grown too used to class disparity that even the poor will defend it. But looking at the amount of currency that exists, its clear that people don't really have to suffer.
Why is the quality of other people's lives my inherent responsibility?

In conclusion, you're incredibly spooked and you should stop trying to make that my problem. see pic related.
thanks

>>134046359
that file name

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>>134049160
You're right. Hierarchy is necessary for large scale social organization; higher IQ groups tend to become hierarchical, while the lower IQ ones (many African bushment, Amazonians, etc) tend to remain "egalitarian" with no vertical social order. Hierarchy corresponds to IQ.

>>134049329
>gay ass spook meme
Is it some kind of rule all of leftypol agreed on to only post with pirate flags, or do you all pick that flag instinctively?

>>134042372
Thanks to communism whole western block has shitload of catching up.

Thanks to communism we lost our elites/officers/inteligence.

Thanks to communism Ukraine lost over 10% of population.

Also if you like communism so much move to BEST KOREA or Venezuela.

PS. People like you deserve 9mm aspirin to back of the head. BERIA STYLE.

>>134042372
Eastern Europe is still not quite recovered from communism, decades later.
The system that built the west is the best there is.
Not all men are equal, argue that to Charles Darwin

>>134049477
i'm not leftypol, also skulls are cool

>>134049477
"egalitarian"
One word which has such vastly different meanings to different ideologies.

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>>134042372
>Imagine a computer. A governing computer that takes data from the country and always ensures that every citizen has at least enough to live is not a ridiculous idea. There are a small number of people in this country that have too much of the money and there isn't a solid justification. This obviously isn't a meritocracy or you're arguing that the rich are working literally thousands of times harder than the rest of us. With automation nowadays we don't even need that many workers relatively when you look at the entire population. Just let people who wish to make additional money seek careers (with an upper income ceiling that would still be considered rich by today's standards, just not outrageously rich) and let the rest live. Capitalism isn't optimally efficient at running anything. Things become obtuse if it happens to generate capital, people gain incredible power by manipulating money and create monopoly to keep their wealth, or maybe they're born into it. Poverty just doesn't have to exist.
So you literally have to use fictional technology to ensure that communism works. Nice.

>>134043023
>How can you think equality isn't good? Isn't it a core virtue of being American?
No, it's anti-American to think so.

>>134049569

''From each according to their ability. To each according to their need''. you dummy.

>>134042372
fucking retarded piece of shit, иди нaхyй дoлбoёб eбaный, кoммyнизм y нeгo блядь paбoтaeт cyкa.

>>134049632
How about to each according to their abilities. I'm not here on this earth to carry retarded niggers like you. You dying would be a net benefit to me.

>>134049632
So slavery then?

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>>134049609
Egalitarian general means "favoring a horizontal (rather than vertical) social order in terms of class, access to resources, etc". Egalitarianism means "favoring a more level society"; hierarchies in terms of status or resources are antithetical to egalitarian values.

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>>134049632
He seems to misunderstand what Charles Darwin said, and what he wanted. Probably another "Darwinist" who believes prominantly in social darwinism.

>>134049799
Slave morality

Your idea relies on a deus ex that some god like AI will make it all work out becuase communism obviously is so difficult to make work that a level of AI that high would probably be the only thing and even the AI itself would come up with a better sysem anyway

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>>134049632
>From each according to their ability. To each according to their need
I'm suddenly feeling very needy, but not all that able

>>134049721
Exactly. How does the human race progress and advance if it doesn't favour the ambitious and the 'able'?

>>134046471
If you think monetary wealth is the best measure of a system, I think you misunderstand what communism is for, or what politics is about as a whole.

>>134049885
yeah, come on, this retard disregards any commie-ass regimes because "hurr muh corrupded pepoles durr". As a fucking ex-ussr, I cannot be more angry, commie ass-clownry left russia in a deep shit that we still living on, for almost 20 years.
BUT YEAH, NO COMMUNISM EVER TRIED, DUMBASS COMMIE RETARD

>>134049946
It doesn't "progress" under communism; Marx postulated that Communism would be the end stage of human history, the final form.

>>134049946
I forgot where "ambitious and able" meant taking inheritance money and doing fuck all for your wealth, while people live their whole lives laboring and barely have anything to give others when they pass away. Meritocracy is a "noble" system to want: the current system is not that.

>>134049885

Capitalism is more stochastic as a system than communism. That means any AI will have it easier to simulate society and make decisions accordingly than a capitalist AI. it will always beat the shit out of a competitor AI if there was a cyberwar between communism and the decaying capitalism in the future. From that perspective the victory of communism is certain.

>>134049958
It's obvious you lack education on what exactly happens in communist countries. Your fictional delusions don't translate into reality, sweetie. Marx was a useless idiot and I'm glad he died in poverty.

>>134049946

I don't know, ask the Soviet Union that in a span of 40 years went from medieval feudalism to having nukes and putting people in space while fending off the greatest powers in the world in the process.

>>134050086
Muh projections, muh ad hom.

>>134049999
What did Marx know, he couldn't even feed his own children

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>>134050038
Should a man not be able to leave wealth for his children? Is improving your children's lives not one of the main factors driving humans to work?

>>134050111
you fucking clown, this armsrace left people dying of hunger, and literally made them live worse than poverty. Fuck those rockets, all this was for is a stupid show-off

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>>134050081
Ah, but a totalitarian AI would beat a communist AI everytime.

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>>134050131
I'm just saying, Marxism is an anti-progressive ideology. Once humanity reaches the communism stage, according to communists themselves, that's the "end of history" -- no more progress.

>>134050111
>Communism is great when it rides the backs of Nazi's accomplishments
My fucking sides

>>134050038
'The politics of envy'
So you want to steal the wealth that others have generated for their families?
Why not make your own? All it takes is hard work and dedication and rational decisions.
You may not be a millionaire at death but you've earned it on your own merits and built up something for your kids to build off, that's if you haven't raised them to be fuckwits.

>>134050152
No, it isn't. There are many other factors, and clearly childrenless families wouldn't work if that was the case.
I am saying Meritocracy breaks down if you simply inherit wealth and never have to work to support yourself, defeating the idea of "earning" what you have. To support meritocracy comes with conflict with this.

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>>134050111
And then collapsing in on themselves. Fucking genius.

>>134050111
Are you fucking 12? Have you ever had a conversation with someone who grew up in the USSR?

>>134045808
>capitalism is failing
Stop saying this retarded line, it's doing its jobs perfectly. And it's job is to allow competition with consent. People are getting rich, capitalism works. It may not work for all people, but it works for me and I don't want anyone trying to fuck up what I have for a chance to see a false God in their life time.

>>134042372
Would you look at all that success...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzDyReSh3KI

>>134050374
even worse - right when ussr started to live off selling natural resources, all those CPSU jackals started to grab more and more, until its literally came to three wars, where russian soldiers were sold off by politicians to be slaughtered. Every commie faggot should learn russian history, and enjoy today's dead cities, because its horrible.

>>134047607
regulations create monopolies

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwNi4iWDgM8&t=638s

>>134050308
"The politics of envy"
Muddying the waters is fun, I know.
"So you want to steal the wealth others have generated for their families?"
You mean the money they inherited? As in, the money they didn't make themselves?
"Why not make your own? All it takes is..."
Man, you are one of the people who thinks all poor people are just embarrassed millionaires, aren't you? Yeah, that is a load of crap. "Hard work" goes so far in a system such as ours. Oh, and hard to make "rational decisions" when you don't have much access to education when you are poor, or have never been born from money so don't understand economics. Yeah, "rational decisions" for the rich.
"You may not be a millionaire at death but you've earned it on your own merits...."
Yes, that is true. Doesn't really make a point, though.
"...and built up something for your kids to build off, that's if you haven't raised them to be fuckwits."
Except that thing they are "built off" is tiny in poor labour families, so that really doesn't make much difference to the argument I made.

>>134050215

why? it would be an authoritarian capitalist or a socialist? it would still be more of a complex system to resolve, communism can easily optimize for our very genetic information since we are meant to maximize our chance of survival, and communism aims for an harmonious society that keeps human survival as much (longer) as possible. We can see how the current capitalist world is unestable everyday, we can see the wars and calamity past system have caused because they don't act like an organism with a goal of survival but more like local competing groups that can cause the whole extinction of the species.

>>134050213
This man speaks truth.
People that never experienced communims, worship it as best system.
People that lived thru communism. or seen what it did to thier country hate it with passion.

Every fucking leftie college boy supporting communism should get 5 year vacation in BEST KOREA in some rural village.

>>134050672
>communism aims for an harmonious society that keeps human survival as much (longer) as possible
Funny how catastrophic of a failure it is at that. Even your precious USSR, for the fraction of people that didn't starve to death, had a shorter life expectancy than US did. Completely and utterly BTFO. You're a retard, gj.

>>134050704
Because all communists and leftists support the DPRK now?

>>134042372

communism doesn't work because it is extremely vulnerable to corruption and it is extremely inefficient.

>>134050651
>the money they inherited
This has always interested me -- is there something fundamentally morally wrong about inheritance? Shouldn't families struggle to maximize their opportunities across generations, not just within the discrete lives of individuals?

>>134050704
what this >>134050618 man says is very true, So spread the word mate

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>>134050672
>communism aims for an harmonious society that keeps human survival as much (longer) as possible
And that's why you will lose. In the age of automation where humans are parasites, the system that views humans as nothing but a resource to be expended is going to win over the system that desires to lead to human prosperity. Not only that, but the totalitarian AI doesn't have to worry about pesky things like democracy or the worker's will, they can make the most efficient decision everytime.

>>134050747

USSR was just our first attempt, and without the current technology , in fact they failed to apply the cybernetic project that would automatize the whole state. More attempts will come in the future. Your nation the United States is a poison.

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>>134042372
I actively want to prevent equality

I don't know if you've gone outside and talked to the average Joe on the street lately, ESPECIALLY here in America, but the vast majority of people you will encounter are fucking stupid. Either they are stupid or they are assholes, or assholes and stupid.

Not a single fiber in my body contains any desire to provide these people with anything more than they can grab on their own. God only knows how many more resources would be lost to the winds if they were divided among billions of morons.

Also the only way you're going to force people to treat people equally and fairly no matter their etc etc etc describers in a stateless, classless society is mob enforcement. That of course relies on well over a majority of people being completely convinced of and well educated in your system, and not lazy enough to forget to act as their own police force. Sounds like extremely wishful thinking.

>>134042372
Most of your argument is that capitalism in your opinion doesn't work so lets replace it.

Right now there is enough money in the world for the "poor people" to live off. But over time as the needs and wants if the "poor people" increase once they get a taste of the high life style, so does the cost. Eventually you're going to need a dictator like figure with the military as his finger tips to keep everyone inline and taking a fair share.

Then comes another issue. Brain drain. How do you prevent people leaving your country to withdrawing from society all together? In a socialist/communist society, how do you stop people becoming nihilistic and going "oh what's the point, I'm always going to be in this position regardless of where I work". Again, in that situation it becomes a governments job to force these people to work so that they can maintain the massive social programs that cost a lot of resources.

Money in today's world is a massive motivator. The desire to be rich in order to be comfortable is huge. Even with "mah automation = communism", we still need stimulation in other scientific areas so that humans can keep up with a automation.
Also prematurely adapting communism before we even have the technology for fully automated systems in every industry is stupid. If it works out that say <70% of the population can't be employed, perhaps a welfare program of some kind might be needed. But even in that situation the resources required by someone to distribute the food and daily essentials is massive.

>>134050761
No, they should just EXPERIENCE the wonders of communism. It allways end up the same way.

EVERY FUCKING TIME it end same way.

>>134050824
>>134042372
>Communists finally get their wish of a President AI to guide humanity
>It implements the 4th Reich and puts all the expendable communists in camps

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>>134050863
You do realize that automation makes communism literally impossible right?

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>>134050824
>the system that views humans as nothing but a resource to be expended is going to win over the system that desires to lead to human prosperity
That's the most jewish thing I've seen posted here all year.

>>134050788
I don't care about "morally wrong".
I care about "fairness" that people on the right like to claim, yet seem to ignore when it comes to their strange and distorted version of meritocracy. They wonder why the class gap gets bigger - inheritance plays a large part, since mostly only the rich stay rich and the poor stay poor. Yet this is "fair" without paying attention to the how "merit" part.
And why shouldn't people struggle to maximize the oppurtunities for ALL the people in their community? for all those people in other generations? It seems kinda silly to think your family doing well-off itself being worthwhile in the long run when they are but a tiny part of the whole.

>>134050213

Yeah I'm sure your babushka was dying of hunger in the 60s faggot. That must be why most of your country wants the USSR to come back.

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>>134050953
I'm not saying I want that future, but commie anon was saying that his system was the most efficient when it clearly wasn't.

>>134042372
>A governing computer that takes data from the country and always ensures that every citizen has at least enough to live is not a ridiculous idea.
Yes it is you fucking moron. Every single time that has ever been tried the result has been the same. Do you know what it is? Shortages and gluts. A supermarket in the USSR for instance would have no toilet paper for sale for weeks. When they finally got a shipment of it, they would get far more than an ordinary store would need. The people would then binge buy and horde it because they knew the supply chain was unreliable.

And why did this occur? Because central planning is simply not possible. There are too many individual variables with regard to exactly how much of any given thing people need. It's impossible for a government bureaucracy to even understand them, let alone keep up with their change over time. Remember, bureaucracies are inefficient by definition.

Meanwhile, capitalism gives profit incentive to all the individuals involved so they can make their best possible choices given their unique circumstances, means, and wants and needs. Individuals will ALWAYS be more efficient at evaluating their own needs than a government bureaucracy ever could be.

But if that weren't good enough for you (and it should be) communism is no longer a theoretical problem in the 21st century. We have had relentless examples of it actually being implemented in history by a very diverse group of cultures from very different places around the planet. And every time it was ever tried it resulted in millions of innocent people murdered by their own damn governments. We can't afford to try that experiment again. It failed, it will always fail, your batshit ideology doesn't work. Stop trying to use it to justify your own poverty and lack of ambition.

TL;DR communism is dumb and so are you.

>>134050863
You all similar to you are a fucking dangerous self-destructive faggots, who wont stop if world became a wasteland. Stop sucking Soros dick, get to live in some fucking Tajikistan, and if you LOVE hunger, poverty and essential alcoholism, then you are just a miserable wreck of a human.

>>134048490
Milton Friedman isn't an anarchist you bumbling retard.
Always de muh jjooos people who stand out in a thread with their retardation

>>134050990
>I don't care about "morally wrong".
>I care about "fairness"
pick one

>>134051012
lol fair enough

>>134050285

> Sergei Korolev was a Nazi

t. retarded ancap faggot

>>134050922
Again, that is a very un-nuanced view of communism and politics, but it seems that is a common trend on 4chan, no?

>>134051011
Only old farts want to ussr to be back, you asshole. I am all for hyperpower capitalistic country.

>>134050990
Communism isn't fair though. If I build a house, you don't get to live in it just because you're mentally disabled. You should be put in a gas chamber and leave me alone.

>>134042372
>imagine a governing computer
So you're saying communism only works when humans are taken out of the equation.

>>134051067
I am suggesting their moral system is flawed insofar they don't care for equality yet they do.
I hardly care for what I do for purely moralistic reasons, since that alone isn't what makes a system tick.

>>134051085
>Be a mentally disabled 1st worlder
>Argue with people from ex-communist countries about the merits of communism
Legitimate autism

>>134050374

> had nothing to do with needing to spend enough on defense to counteract NATO

The fact that they lasted as long as they did with how much they had to counteract is proof itself

>>134043023
>How can you think equality isn't good?
Because when equality trumps freedom of others its no longer equality, but oppression. Fancy to get shot in the back of the head for the good of the state? Too bad, because thats what commishit always leads to.
>Isn't it a core virtue of being American?
Equality under the law and equality of opportunity. The core of being American is being free in pursuit of liberty and happiness.
>Isn't it a pretty irrationally hateful opinion
Nobody gives a shit about your emotions.
>Is a man not at least entitled to shelter
Parasites are entitled to shit.

>>134051115
The edge must hurt - maybe you should go in for me because clearly you must be in pain.

And that is such a blatant load of crap that I don't know where to start. Social Darwinism is a disease, just like you.

>>134051079
Aaaand you are an imbecile, Korolev had his jaw broken by the GULAG officers. He LITERALLY had to work, just not to get his family executed. You imbecilic moronic retard.

>>134051112

Of course you are, all pol russkies are self hating hohol tier retards.

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>>134051205
>had nothing to do with needing to spend enough on defense to counteract NATO
They had nukes, that was defense enough.

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>>134051063
>Milton Friedman isn't an anarchist
Would you characterize him as an ancap, implicitly or otherwise?

https://youtu.be/lMb_72hgkJk

>>134051164
But what's unfair about inheritance?

>>134051196
> use ad hom as an argument and think this will fly

I'm sorry, does your mummy know you are on their computer?

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>>134042372
>Imagine a computer
Stop.
You know your Ideology is shit when the only time it works is in hypotheticals

>>134051269

And singlehandedly matched all of muh capitalist NASA as a result. Thanks for proving my point.

>>134051242
зaбeй бpo, этo пpocтo oхyeвший кoллeджный чepвяк, кoтopый нe гoлoдaл дoльшe 10 минyт, a eгo мoзги пpoмыты copocoм и coтoвapищaми

>>134050775
It's what happens to people when you remove all responsibility, accountability and incentive and feed them from the (not so) bottomless state purse.
If you study the circumstances, you'll see that it's the reason Chernobyl happened.

>>134042372
suck on a hose in a bucket of shit communism is kike enslavement you faggot

>>134051303
I am saying that meritocracy breaks down when it comes to inheritance due to the whole "get what you put in" idea. It is "unfair" insofar it breaks this so sacred bullshit they uphold.

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>>134051355
>And singlehandedly matched all of muh capitalist NASA as a result
Probably should have spent more resources on not collapsing in on themselves then. That's just poor prioritizing.

>>134051267
>owning a house you built is social Darwinism
Hahahahahahahahahahah

>>134051283
Being commishit has nothing to do with being Russian. In fact its antithesis to it, that's why we still full of alcoholics and opiate users. Read Dostoevsky and Solzhenitsyn you fucktard.

>>134050863
Whats wrong with the current system faggot? You owe everything you have to it.
Compare a poor person in the west to a poor person in Africa. Compare a poor person in the west to a poor person in the west 100 years ago.

>>134051303
He's a libertarian you dummy, he wants a government, just a smaller one which in theory is a standard conservative objective.
Are all conservatives influenced by da joo too?

>>134042372
>There are a small number of people in this country that have too much of the money and there isn't a solid justification.
How much is too much? Why do you get to decide? Why shouldn't wealth resources be concentrated in the people who have demonstrated by accumulating them that they are the best managers of them?

>This obviously isn't a meritocracy or you're arguing that the rich are working literally thousands of times harder than the rest of us.
They produce thousands of times more value, yes. Otherwise they would not command greater salary. Although I think you're making the classic communist mistake (probably on purpose) of conflating wealth with income.

>With automation nowadays we don't even need that many workers relatively when you look at the entire population.
How many is that many? Stop speaking in vague generalities, or we know you're just spouting agitprop.

>Just let people who wish to make additional money seek careers (with an upper income ceiling that would still be considered rich by today's standards, just not outrageously rich) and let the rest live.
Interesting choice of words. Setting aside that you don't get to decide what's outrageous or not, what exactly do you mean by let people live? Because I bet you would say something like give them free shit. But I would say that let people live means not subjecting them to the government system that killed over 100 million people over the course of 70 years. Communsim didn't let the Ukrainians live during the Holodomor, or the Kulaks, or the countless millions who were tortured and murdered in Stalinist purges and GULAGs.

>Capitalism isn't optimally efficient at running anything.
Proofs?

>Things become obtuse
This sentence doesn't mean anything.

>Poverty just doesn't have to exist.
The Soviet Union was so impoverished that it eventually collapsed. Communism does not eliminate poverty, it creates more.

>>134051355
BItch, please, soviet aeronautics was funded instead of foods and goods. Nothing proves your point, parasite. If all money that was spent for food economical sector in US was spent for NASA, USA would have a fucking japanese-ass mechas flying around.
Also your dad called, asked if you would lick his vagina.

>>134051477
Let it be known that reading comprehension isn't needed to write here.

>>134051355
Both US and USSR rode the backs of Nazis. I think we all know who was more prolific

>>134051430
>meritocracy breaks down when it comes to inheritance
People competing to give their progeny advantages isn't meritocratic? DO you think inheritance springs out of thin air, or do people compete to produce what they leave to their offspring?

>>134051507
>He's a libertarian you dummy
Does he or does he not believe in the complete deregulation of the economy, and that unrestricted capitalism is an absolute moral and objective good?

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>>134051477
To be fair, most commies would claim that the house, having been built by you, is thus owned by you, and you can do whatever you want with it, except rent it out. For some reason they hate renting.

>>134050914
Basically that was my point. Equal resource distribution is near impossible in a commy government even though that's their whole premise for why they think communism is the answer (lol).
>>134051030

It is impossible to have a communist government that isn't centralised. With a capitalist system, you can have communities running and mostly governing themselves with little outside intervention. So local law made by people the community know, and local business can mean high quality consumer goods, especially in the case of food. This is why white suburban neighborhoods are so successful, clean and pleasant places to live. They take the initiative to have their own, local programs.

>>134051538
>It's unfair to build a house and keep it to yourself evil Nazi
xD

>>134051517

Yeah you faggots sure were starving during the space race. Nice hohol tier insults, must be from all that krokodil that only appeared once glorious capitalism took hold

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>>134042372

Honestly, almost 99% of these commie posts are made by burgers, it's not even funny anymore.

I don't even understand how can you fall for the "you're all going to be equal meme" since most of you guys that post this shit have it better than the working class(which btw will be the ones who will judge your fate).

The only equality you'll get after the commie regime comes into power is probably a nice and cozy room in a re-education facility.

>>134051578
Their children didn't do anything for it. Their progeny means nothing if everything around them is collapsing. you are but a tiny part of the society around you, and that doesn't really change as time goes on.

>>134051659
> Don't make poor old me read

>>134051578
Only in areas in which no 3rd party is involved and it's just the seller and the buyer, then the government should stay out yes.
He takes a more pro government position in something like polution, which affects everyone

>>134051541

>USSR rode the backs of Nazi scientists by letting them destroy half of it and then escaping to the US when it could actually get anything of value from them.

>>134042372
>This is a shitty attitude.
Value judgement.

>How can we make the world better if we use its current state as evidence that it can't be better?
Why do you think your ideas are necessarily better than every other idea?

>We have grown too used to class disparity that even the poor will defend it.
Blatant class baiting. If the poor (so-called) aren't angry why are you?

>But looking at the amount of currency that exists, its clear that people don't really have to suffer.
More trite commie hyperbole. Wealth and suffering are unrelated.

>Lets look at it completely rationally.
That would mean rejecting communism out of hand.

>Right now there exists enough U.S. currency to keep everyone above the poverty line.
If you don't understand monetary policy why do you think you can make better monetary policy?

>Renewable energy and automation will soon make almost all of the labor force obsolete.
Why don't you use your future predicting crystal ball to learn next week's lottery numbers?

>The only option then to keep such a country afloat is a perfect governing computer, coded with a neo -constitutional A.I. of sorts to keep everything stable.
If the only option is something that doesn't exist, then it seems that isn't the only option.

>The free market can fail and crash if left alone, but if it drove itself with autonomy, then there is the real future.
You have no idea what you're talking about. The market can't *fail* that's literally impossible.

>>134051355
Do you know how many smartest people fled commishit USSR and how many great minds Russia lost because of red terror?
We would be the leading economy instead of stagnating shithole if not for commishits.

>>134051681
It's slave morality. Ressentiment. These people are such huge failures as human beings they dream of communism to make them feel less like losers. Capitalism didn't fail, they did.
>>134051684
If you get the opportunity you should kill yourself

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>>134051663
Jesus fucking christ you are delusional. Have you EVER FUCKING SEEN SOVIET SHOPS? Motherfucking self-assured retard, you make me fucking sick.

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>>134042372
why are you here.....

>>134051502

Is not sustainable, the world has just a temporal capacity for this unstable and chaotic system that just cares for profit and not for humans.

>>134050914
>>134051030
>>134051511
>>134051603
>>134051742
It's interesting that they don't reply to actual serious, thought-out answers but the bait answers from people trying to troll them.
>YOU GUYS DON'T ARGUE PROPERLY REEEE
>/POL/ IS SO DUMB
Yeah I wonder why no one bothers?
>*throws kfc bucket* YOUR REPLY IS TOO LONG I WANT REDDIT TLDR

>>134051828
> Speaks of slave morality
> claims that capitalism isn't a dying system and that people only fail themselves

Man, must be hell inside your head.

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>>134051684
To be fair to both sides, while capitalism certainly doesn't manage 100% meritocracy, it at least does a better job of it than communism, which doesn't attempt any meritocracy at all.

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>>134042372

>Stop with these "Wasn't real communism" memes
>IT WASN'T REAL COMMUNISM!

>>134051863
>ueee unstabel keotik
>literally us has economic uprise
r e t a r d

>>134051603
Ultimately, it seems impossible to have a communist government. They all seem to destroy themselves given enough time.

But another way to state your claim is to say that it is impossible to have a communist government that isn't totalitarian and corrupt. That one at least seems borne out by history.

>>134051863
It will be sustainable when we kill off useless people like you. Communism clearly is unsustainable given how hard it failed.

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>>134051905
Why is capitalism a dying system?

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>>134051897
Oh. You're just shitposting. I should have known from your flag.

>>134051750
I think you guys will really shine after a century or so.
Western Europe is done. Even the most optimistic projections are bad news. They still think they can wield Islam and they have no control over their borders

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>>134051684
>Their children didn't do anything for it.
But their ancestors did, specifically so their own genetic line would have advantages.

>>134051731
Stop bullshitting, Milton Friedman is an ancap, just more low-key and understated about it than most. He believes in capitalism exempt from governments, even if he's a minarchist for other reasons.

>>134051982
BEKUZ IT NOT GIVES US FREE SHIT REEEEEEEE

>>134051345

Pointing out that they're speaking from real experience and you're speaking entirely in poorly sourced fiction isn't ad-hom.

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>>134042372
>Imagine a perfect world where communism work.
>See communism works scubs
You fail to understand that humans and communism will never go together why can't you create a new system which doesn't starve us all and takes away all incentive to achieve high paying jobs when we could be waiters for the same salary as doctors

>>134051905
You don't understand what slave morality is. Marxism is very much it

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>>134051863
>Is not sustainable
Been around for 250yrs....
ok anon lol, I have a feeling your faggotry is not
sustainable.

>>134051908
Not in a monetary sense, no. I don't think it claims to do so, nor does it see use in it. I simply think that meritocracy can be something more personal and more meaningful than a cash payout. And then again, depends what we mean by "communism" and what "meritocracy" is encompassing here. Many people use it to mean "money" since that is all it is really represented in.

>>134051863
It's not the 1800's anymore faggot.
Have some faith in humanity

>>134051950

if you think millions of proles will just let themselves being killed by the capitalists you are delusional, that won't happen.

>>134052023
He was not an anarchist, he said so himself on his show Free to Choose.
You're talking out of your ass, nothing new for a mouth breathing moron who blames the jews for everything.
And absolute loser, on par with a black person saying da whyte peepo keepin a nigga down baka

>>134051269

Korolev was CPSU, so nobody gives a fuck, except (You), kys scum

>>134051943

There is a new stock market crash predicted for next year.

>>134052014
I wasn't shit posting until they just completely ignored my reply. I'm just pointing out they when /leftypol/ come here they complain that no one wants to have a serious discussion, but when someone does they ignore it.

>>134042372
>This is a shitty attitude
And this is not an argument. There are people who are smarter than me, and there are people who are more stupid. I don't want to bring someone down just to serve some authoritarian ideology, and don't really want to be brought down myself. Equality of outcome is an out of touch concept.

>>134052023
Which isn't them, hence it makes no sense. Their genetic line makes no difference in the large scheme of things if said society crumbles. Must I repeat this again?

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>>134052095
Money is just a representation of material wealth. Although if you are talking about some abstract quality then yes, capitalism does not provide meritocracy for such things.

>>134051597
That's private property and its not allowed, because its inevitably leads to "inequality".
Say you build a second house to your kids and now you have 2 houses. Well your lazy, good for nothing neighbor doesn't like that so he rats on you to secret service and you're trialed as a traitor and sent to the GULAG. Enjoy being a slave in Syberia. Also all your assets are ceased by the state and your children and wife now live in one tiny apartment together with 5 other families, while your houses are given to some high up commi bureaucrat as dacha.

>>134052181
Like this shit.
Where is your source?
Why do you think this?
>>134052143
>you're delusional hurr durr
NICE ARGUMENT
REALLY STRONG

>>134046194
>Individualism is a death of a nation, the "freedom" is a lie that leads to complete decadence with time.
In the19th century when Individualism flourished (seriously for an 21th century people 19th would look like ancap world) we seen strongest nations ever. In the end of the 20-21th century when collectivism conquered world and put its control boot on all actions of the individual we see opposite.

>>134052169
yгy, пиздeц кaкoй oн был пapтиeц, иди нaхyй cтaлиниcт eбaный
>>134052181
I predict that you suck your trans-mother dick.

>>134052156
>He was not an anarchist
You're parsing semantics: he believes in "anarchism for capitalism and the economy"; limited anarchism is still anarchism.

>>134051750

Everything of value your country has was produced under communism. Every bit of infrastructure, every bit of complex technology, everything you export, every bit of history in the last 100 years you can be proud of. 25 years of the most extreme hypercapitalism in the world and all you've managed to do is scrape Siberia for whatever resources you can export with the least effort and make some mild iterations on technology developed in the 80s when the USSR was falling apart.

USSR defeated the Nazis, created the H bomb, won the space race, brought about universal literacy, uplifted the central asian niggers, brought about numerous Nobel Prize worthy breakthroughs, had refined culture. Post-communist Russia is a decaying husk living off the leftovers from its communist past, indistinguishable from Nigeria in terms of accomplishments that would stand the test of time, with its musical heritage consisting of mimicking american nigger rap from a decade ago.

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>>134052030
I'm expecting them to say "automation" or some shit, as if privatized automated warbots won't put down their little communist rebellion (which I would be glad to assist them with)

>>134052143
I doubt there are millions of people useless enough to think Communism is a good idea. Most proles are doing great in capitalism. Leave your house some time and have a look.

We would literally just be cleaning out the drug addicts and mentally retarded, like you.

>>134052079
source pls

>>134052061
Claiming I am disabled and such is, however, as if that makes anything I say useless.

>>134052209

>dindu nuffin
>ebil Stalin

oh (((you)))

>>134051847

It's no point to argue with them honestly, they will never understand what's it like growing up in my case in a post-commie country.

>>134051663

Also, it's actually funny how they try to make us feel insane by saying that "communism doesn't work" when we currently live in a fucking post-commie country and we saw what happened to it whilst the communists had control.

You had a ration card with which you'd take your daily rations from the "supermarket" like 1 and a half bread per family and so on.

I had relatives that were sent to those "re-education camps" just because they spoke against the government while being in a church.

You had rats everywhere ready to turn you in for an extra ration of fruits because they were so scarce back then, so please don't try to pursue people to fall for this bullshit again because it will never work.

>>134046669
>60s and 70s were the only times in the history of Russia when there was real middle class
>had no car
>(((real))) middle class

>>134042372
I'm not going to imagine shit. Your criminal ideology has killed millions of people and I am under no obligation to humor your delusional religion of theft. I don't care about your screeching delusions that being paid a wage is being stolen from. I don't care that you think that a magical centrally planned economy can divine prices out of the ether. I don't care that you think that the poverty of the third world is the fault of evil capitalists and not their own Socialist governments. I don't care what you think.

You will not take my property. If you try, I'll kill you. I'll shoot you in the belly and snapchat your screaming, blubbering death to your mother, and I'll have done nothing wrong. There is no more discussion to be had. We won the argument decades ago. You're not tricking anyone into this again.

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>>134052289
>USSR defeated the Nazis, created the H bomb, won the space race, brought about universal literacy, uplifted the central asian niggers, brought about numerous Nobel Prize worthy breakthroughs, had refined culture.
And then collapsed in on themselves, leaving them in their current miserable state.

>>134052242

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/jun/25/booming-stock-markets-distract-from-threat-of-excessive-lending

>>134051982
Expansionism is slowly taking its toll, environmentally and socially. I am not going to make a claim like Marx however and suggest it will simply collapse, but I am not going to be surprised that more and more resistance will brew.

>>134052289
Russia would probably be doing even better if not for Communism. Their culture and history was raped by the USSR. They probably wouldn't have needed to expend 30 million Russians to kill a couple million Germans with more competent leadership.

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>>134052254

нaхyй твoя мaмкa хoдит кaждый вeчep

>пиздeц кaкoй oн был пapтиeц

был, и Циoлкoвcкий был, a y цapeблядeй дaжe Meчникoв cъeбaл из oтcтaлoй фeoдaльнoй пидopaхии, кcтaти c пpaздникoм тeбя пpoшeдшим гoвнo

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>>134052289
>USSR ... created the H bomb
>CREATED THE H-BOMB
lolwut

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>>134052303
it's called the declaration of independence faggot

>>134052383
hahahahah, the guardian, why not CNN, you ass clown?

>>134042372
Communism does not need to work because we do not need communism.
Suppose it is as you say, suppose it is an economically better system. But it does not fit our temperament nor our soul.

>>134052354

>had no car

I think, your dad shouldn`t spent all his money on vodka, so he would be able to buy zhigul or volga

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>>134052184
>Waah other people didn't read my post and reply to it fast enough for me.
>pay ME attention! I'M the most important!
>I know, I'll use d&c to accuse them of being outsiders. That way they won't realize that I'm the outsider.

Shitposting.

>>134052374

> Face off the entire world in economic and military stand off
> Eventually get Gorbachev who was a capitalist puppet and willingly broke his country apart in the most damaging way possible.
> Haha you collapsed on yourselves.

>>134052437
ииcycий ж хyй, я yж нe нaдeялcя чтo нa фopчaнe бyдyт кoммибляди из poccии, ты жe хyжe чeм этoт oбocpыш кoтopый ни дня ни гoлoдaл и нe дoнaшивaл бpюки зa дeдoм. Oн тo нe пoзнaл вceгo гoвнa, a ты зaщищaeшь oбoccaный peжим. Peтapд нecчacтный.

>>134052451

>there are no financial crisises
>reeee

what a delusional faggot

>>134052302

proles will eventually revolt once most of them have lose their jobs to automation. doesn't need to be next year, and doesn't need to be visible right now in the streets, but you can go to a mcdonalds and see how a robot is already taking the job of a prole,. Next year there will be more and so on gradually, and in many other areas not just restaurants the automation will come too, what will people buy ? how will they pay their bills?

>>134052374
Man, I was kinda on his side until he got a huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge boner for the USSR without any form of criticism of it, and used "asian n*****". I guess I should expect that on /pol tho lol

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>>134042372
The only way to explore space is communism or socialism.
Even when USA went on the moon their economy was socialist. NASA was mostly state funded and taxes were much higher than now.
You want to know why? [spoiler]Because going into space is the most useless thing humanity has ever done[/spoiler]

>>134052338
>(((communists))) dindu nuffin
>ebil capitalistic traitors
Иди штaны пocтиpaй.

>>134052330

But you've been factually incorrect on your descriptions of the USSR and your arguments consist of describing an imaginary perfect system that will never exist. It can be reasonably inferred that you are in fact mentally deficient and lie somewhere on the autism spectrum.