>/pol/ won't ever be able to refute this Well?

>>133646705
You reap the benefits of paying taxes in a first world country every single day. You don't want to, you can live it up in prison.

You're free to move to Africa if you don't want to pay taxes...

What do you want? Have all of the benefits of living in paradise, but give nothing in return?

>>133646705
Did years ago. You volunteer to pay taxes because you knowingly consent to it every single time you trade commodities, buy goods or services or begin employment.

Taxation is EXACTLY 100% as consensual as the coercive methods corporations use to push their low quality products. Get fucked.

>>133646842
>You can just leave

Taxes are still theft, thought. Argue against the point in the OP not your made up strawman.

>>133647096
>Taxes are still theft
See: >>133647030
Either taxation is theft and corporations are in the wrong for using the exact same methodology of "consent" at gunpoint or taxation isn't theft. You have to choose one.

>>133646939
see
>>133647096

>>133647030
What company uses the threat of violence to get you to buy their shit?

>>133647096
Social contract.

Yes it's true you don't have a choice in it. The alternative however is anarchy which I know you fucking retard ancaps think is preferable.

>>133647096
You are free to leave, so it's not theft.
You choose to stay, so you can't complain.

It must REALLY suck to grow up in a first world country (in your case former first world). Suck it up or neck yourself.

>>133647261
They use the threat of starvation or homelessless instead. Doesn't matter if it's an actual gun or starving you, it's still a threat. If taxation is theft, then so is capitalism.

>>133647356
I guess mafias extorting money from you isn't theft either, just move somewhere else! The criminals shouldn't change their ways.

>>133647286
Wow a contract where both parts dont consent i.e. not a valid contract at all. Keep licking that statist boot that's been doing Canada so much good.

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>>133647374
>taxation and capitalism are connected

>>133647374
I don't think you understand what violence and force is. You're not entitled to goods other people created.

Also
>Implying companies won't compete for the oppurtunity to sell you food and housing

>>133647744
Move to Somalia then if you don't like it. You have that freedom.

I hear you Swedes sure like Somalian cock and I'm sure you'll get your fill getting raped by pirates in your lawless libertarian paradise.

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>>133647744
>I guess mafias extorting money from you isn't theft either, just move somewhere else! The criminals shouldn't change their ways.
You literally just described corporations. Congratulations, you're immune to cognitive dissonance.

>>133647834
They use the EXACT same methodology.

>I don't like to do X to get thing, but you control all the levers of power, so I still have to X to get thing
>Libertarians: This is consensual - UNLESS IT'S THAT FUCKING GOVERNMENT DOING IT HOLY SHIT AM I FUCKIGN MAD NOW!!!

>>133647955
I know dude. People die in taxation shootouts with the police all the time. We have to do something about this shit!

>>133648041
see
>>133647096

Can statist retards do anything other than repeat the same fallacy? Doesn't matter if I can move from here, taxation is still theft.

>>133647744
If the mafia makes sure that the area is taken care of, then why would I care that they ask something in return?
The government actually gives me something back with my taxes, the mafia would just take it and leave it.

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>>133646705
>implying there's anything wrong with theft

only difference is it's harder to fight off the state so that's why people accept it

>>133647955
>Implying companies won't compete for the oppurtunity to sell you food and housing
They don't when they have monopolies. If what you moron libertarians claim was true actually had any relation to reality, then every single ISP wouldn't charge exactly the same fucking price for internet service, since one could undercut them all and wipe them out. Funny how that HAS NEVER EVER HAPPENED. Why? Because economics is more complicated than simple libertarian pea brains can grasp. Monopolies actually cooperate for mutual benefit. That's why this never happens.

>>133648203
>Can statist retards do anything other than repeat the same fallacy? Doesn't matter if I can move from here, taxation is still theft.
And you know why they use it? Because they're throwing your bullshit back at you. Libertarians are the ones who are always saying if you don't like capitalism, it's still consensual because you can move. Not that that is even true, since literally every single fucking nation on Earth except maybe North Korea are capitalist.

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>>133648105
>Monopolies form in an unregulated market
How to spot a retard 101.

I can name several monopolies formed thanks to government intervention (healthcare, schooling, police and lots of different drugs). Can you even name a single monopoly created without state interference?

>>133646705
Taxes are what the people say they are. If we don't like current tax law, we exercise the control we built into the system. Namely, elections. If enough people feel strongly about something, we elect someone who agrees to make the change. Just because you don't like taxes doesn't mean the rest of us hate roads, utilities, emergency services, schools, a standing military an law enforcement.

>>133648477
Show me the ISP that gives the same internet as everyone else for less than $40 a month. Go on. Do it. Put up or shut the fuck up. Surely muh invisible hand will make this possible.

>>133648547
Does it make it okay to enforce your will on others as long as you have enough people agreeing with you?

>>133648627
I'm asking for a naturally ocurring monopoly, seems you can't come up with one. Now why is that?

>>133646705
Do you use any public services or drive on public roads? Why do you think you should have access to them for free? gibs gibs gibs, just stfu and stop being a nigger

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>>133646705
State revenue is a necessity for society to function.

>>133646705
My uncle hasn't paid taxes in over 20 years. He's in his 60's now so even if they did come for him, he would tell them to fuck off.

>>133646705
>>133647096

youre taxes go to funding things like the healthcare system fixing roads and funding the police and other state services.

>>133648803
>Implying I'd like to retain shit-tier public services

>>133648691
That vastly depends on what you're trying to enforce, on whom, how you do it, and how many people are with you.

>>133648477
Microsoft and Google

Also while there may be few examples of monopolies there are innumerable examples of oligopolies forming without state intervention which are nearly as bad.

>>133649058
>implying you still use said "shit tier" service therefore you will pay for them. I bet most of you faggots dont even pay taxes, especially seeing how tax return season is a fucking spending frenzy.

>>133649024
And the mafias provide garbage collecting services. Still theft tho.

>>133646705
>>/pol/ won't ever be able to refute this
What makes you think /pol/ would want to refute it? LIBTARDS are the ones who want lots of taxes.

>>133649058
then why dont you leave and go to an ancap paradise like somalia?
the state doesnt force you to stay and pay tax if you voluntarly live in a country youre agreeing to pay tax for it the state and the people live in a sybiotic relation tax funds public services like the police and fixing infastruture without tax the gov would not exist.

Is there anything more insufferable than a fucking Ancap? These autists deserve the bullet more than anyone else.

At least Ancoms won't waste your time trying to convince you to believe in their shitty ideology.

>>133649258
>And the mafias provide garbage collecting services.

the state doesnt force you to stay and pay tax lad you could just move to an anarchist country if you dont like paying tax.

>>133649391
see
>>133647096

Because I'd like to change my country for the better because I love my people. As a belgian, I'm sure this is foreign to you.

>>133646842
>confirming what OP is implying
If you refuse to pay for Shaniqua's nigglets they'll throw you in jail. Its theft

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>>133648627
It does, look at Romania which didn't intervene with internet companies, they have among the fastest worldwide and it's cheaper than in North America. The US had a total mess of government regulation during the early XXth century then it tried to force competition under Clinton which resulted in a bubble then more regulation after the bubble.

>>133649391
A failed state like Somalia is not ancap. Also niggers.

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>>133649508
How's that statism working out for you, my canuck friend?

>>133649625
Tax reform is a completely different issue. We're talking about tax in principle. It's not theft when it's pretty fucking clear what you're paying for.

>>133649574
>As a belgian, I'm sure this is foreign to you.

>he doesnt know what molembeek is.
>Because I'd like to change my country
how do you expect youre country's goverment to exist with no tax do you think that money that pays for things like poluice comes out of a magical donkeys asshole?

A failed state like Somalia is not ancap. Also niggers.
it kindof is lad theres nothing stopping you from building youre black market monopoly there.

>>133649649
that speed is important so that people download all those propaganda TV shoes and watch all that youtube teenage anal sex tutorials in 1080p... and then, out of gratefulness become ersatz-indian programmers

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>>133649159
A monopoly is when 100% of a market is owned by 1 actor and no new actors are allowed to enter. Pic related is not a monopoly.

Besides, one of the reason microsoft and windows OS is so large is because almost all government agencies use windows on their computers.

Give an example of such an oligopoly then?

>>133649857
It absolutely is theft, it is involuntary.

A thief can steal $500 from you and then give you a new television, it is still theft.

>>133649830
>statism

agian how woud you get service like the police and firemen working with no money? do you want ((businesses)) religating that?

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>>133648727
>>133648477
THAT'S LIKE, NOT A REAL FREE MARKET

>>133649857
How is that related? I can take your money and punch you then claim it's clear you paid to get punched, it's still theft. When the buyer doesn't want his money taken away, you can give him whatever you want it's still theft.

>>133649970
Private security exist and people would want to pay for private police or as you can see in the US, community watchmen are a thing there. Also if there's a state it's not ancap. That's like claiming you're single because your relationship isn't doing well.

>>133650180
A lot of those are already handled by private businesses, simply paid for by taxes through government. And what's wrong with those things going private?

Leftists want the government (appeal to authority) to commit crime for them.

>>133646705
>is true

>>133646705
Paying taxes is fine if it truly benefits the nation
Unfortunately, that's not the case at all in the west

>>133650147
>THATS LIKE NOT A REAL MONOPOLY

>>133646705
>What are public services

>>133650163
>>133650263
>2 for 2 leaves
Hell no, get the fuck out of my menchies. Fucking faggots.

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>>133649970
>how do you expect youre country's goverment to exist

I don't. Private actors do things better since they dont operate on force.

>pic related is what you get what you google molembeek
Statism really tarnished your identity.

>>133650180
Yes, businesses will do it better.

There was literally an article recently where a Dominos pizza delivery man got to a grandmother in a disaster area faster than police and firemen. The police are literally outpaced by Dominos, how the fuck is that acceptable in a first world country?

>>133647955
and you're not entitled to live in a society with infrastructure you dumb nigger, you have to pay for that

>>133646705
There is nothing to refute taxation is theft but I prefer to stay out of prison so I pay

>>133650263
what's wrong with those things going private?

you would have to pay for those company's it would essentaily become a circlejerk of monopoly's.

>Statism really tarnished your identity.

do you honestly think bussnes is any fucking better in that regard especially since bussneses want as much profit as possible thats how you get fucked up trade deals like the tpp.

pure fucking jews in this thread

>PAY YOUR TAXES GOYIM
>PAY FOR SHANAENAE'S 12 KIDS RAYCISS!

taxation is theft. you fucking statist slaves are retarded

>>133649508
>At least Ancoms won't waste your time trying to convince you to believe in their shitty ideology.

They'll straight up kill you.

>>133650505
Privatize it. Our toll roads in Canada are the best roads in the country.

>>133646705
>Organizing people and improving their life is theft
This is only true when the state is owned by jewsih (thanks to a previous ancaplike state) and use your money to bring nigggers to the country or just robb it.

>>133650210
>>133650361
define free market and monopoly then, instead of using strawmen to make yourself look retarded.

>inb4 you google the definition and copy paste it here

>>133650400
to empisise my piont better if you dont pay for the private business police force you would be shit out of luck.

or a better example monopoly's would squash any competitors with no state to regulate.

>>133650714
>ancaplike state
wtf is an ancaplike state? Ancap is stateless you fucking dumb nigger

>>133650849
>Ancap is stateless

>inplying businesses would not just replace the goverment.

I just wish taxes weren't so high. Being in the highest bracket sucks. Your every thought is bent on protecting as much of your income as possible all the time.

>>133646705
Yeah I know, nothing you can do about it though. We had this argument before (see: Whiskey Rebellion and American Civil War) and the "pay your taxes or we'll fucking kill you" side won every time.

>>133646705
No one is forced to be a citizen of any country. You can revoke your citizenship at any time. If you want things from the society, like protection from niggers by police officers, you have to pay for them.

>>133650631
What do you mean a circlejerk of monopolies? If there's more than one it clearly is competition and not a monopoly. Also you don't have to pay, you can do it yourself, buy a gun, put bars up your windows if you don't want to pay someone else to protect you.

Also if you're concerned about monopolies, why do you trust the one entity which is by definition a monopoly?

>>133650714
It is always true, if you want to organize people and improve their lives it goes better by convincing them than by forcing them.

>>133650803
So if you can't pay someone you're not entitled to their labor, how is that wrong? And can you point out where that has happened? Monopolies only happen because of state intervention. If a private company provide better security cheaper, what's wrong about them having more clients?

>>133650631
>>133650940
>monopolies form in a free market
How to spot someone who is economically illiterate. Give me an example of a monopoly emerging from a free market.

There are plenty of state-induced monopolies (schools, healthcare, certain drugs, police, it obviously differs a bit from state to state but you get it).

>>133651175
>monopoly emerging from a free market

Monopolies are everywhere. For instance, an oil company in East Siberia has a monopoly over oil that comes from East Siberia**. If you will only buy, for some reason, oil from Eastern Siberia, then this oil company can charge a monopolist's price on you. If you're brand-loyal to Lenovo for some reason (say, seeing the Lenovo logo makes your productivity quadruple), then you're forced to suck it up and pay whatever Lenovo charges you, up to a monopolist's price (which is the productivity you can extract from the product.

Monopolies are the very foundation of capitalism. At equilibrium (that is, a perfectly competitive market), profits go to zero (approximately) due to competition, which forces corporations to break equilibrium temporarily, get an edge over their competitors, establish an ephermal monopoly over a niche domain, or as we know it, innovate

>>133646705
I am voluntarily paying taxes in order to pay for public services like police, firemen, road maintenance, and some other things I'd like to not be paying for like healthcare.
The best form of government is one that has simple, rational and non-intrusive rules that are heavily enforced to ensure the welfare of the nation, as well as a strong military to make sure nobody will roll in and take your stuff and shit on your NAP with their superior firepower.

>>133651175
What about this, faggot?
>>133648547

>>133651154
>So if you can't pay someone you're not entitled to their labor,


dont pay for tm protection braket company
get raped or robbed nobody to call.
get in a car crash shit out of luck as you got no money.

buy a gun, put bars up your windows if you don't want to pay someone else to protect you.

>how to spot a nigger who never lived in africa if only i could tell you how retarded it is what youre saying right now.

>>133651154
>Also if you're concerned about monopolies, why do you trust the one entity which is by definition a monopoly?


also are you realy that retarded to think company's dont fuck with people when the get too big and cocky?

for example he abomanation that is the media.

>>133651383
>an oil company in East Siberia
That company has a deal with the russian government to get 100% of the oil there, again thanks to the state.

>brand-loyal to Lenovo
It's not a monopoly because you're a retard who pays overprice because you've got a hardon for a certain brand.

>Monopolies are the very foundation of capitalism
No. Provide something to back that up. I ask you for monopolies that emerge without the state's help and you just give examples where government interfere.

>>133651383
Where does the east Siberian monopoly comes from? You can't just will it out of your ass, humans are enterprising and will create competition unless the state prevents competition from arising. Even during the Standard Oil days there were plenty of competitors, they were simply less good. Also you liking a company more than price/quality isn't a monopoly, it's a personal choice.

What kind of commie definition do you have of a monopoly if there is competition? Also why would profits be at zero if there's competition? It's clearly not the case with plenty of industries with competition like electronics manufacturers or oil distributors, ISP.

>>133651703
So you want to be entitled to someone's labor without paying them? That's what I'm getting from you, or you know rely on community as I've said above, community watchmen like in the US, call your friends if you're in trouble.

>>133651854
That's just vague as fuck, what about the media? They don't have a monopoly.

>>133651854
Most of mainstream media is state run. How you can be this disconnected from reality?

>>133651130
I'd like to cancel my subscription to Israeli foreign aid please, I no longer want that.

>>133652064
Scared?
>>133651662

>>133652183
You're justifying taking away from people against their will be saying you have people agreeing with you. You're just saying democracy is mob rule but more organized.

>>133646705
Locking money away from the economy is also stealing anon

>>133650775
it was irony, ancaps are always making mental gymnastics to make monopoly and freemarket examples not fit.
>>133651154
>implying this is possible

>>133646705
I don't have a gun to my head, and I understand the need for the concept of taxes.

Funny how your pic doesn't depict communism or socialism.

>>133652326
Yes, that's called a representational government. If you don't have enough votes on your side to sway an issue, OH WELL, grow up.

When will /pol/ take the second-to-last redpill:
Everything about libertarianism makes 100% perfect sense, it is logically consistent, well thought out and philosophically airtight.

The sooner you admit that the sooner you can move on to the final redpill:
Although [everything above] is true, human nature is not compatible with ancapism, People are not rational actors and do not think logically about every single thing they do. Libertarianism would only function in a computer system that treats all people as the exact same individualized "economic units" (this is why autism is so common among libertards

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>>133646705
Taxation is NOT theft because (((they))) own your currency. You are "borrowing" it from them. Interest is collected in the form of taxes. It's usury, not theft.

>>133650645
Most of these fucks don't acknowledge the really shitty side of paying taxes. Like the state run media, healthcare for Laqueefa and Ahemed, and unemployment for lazy niggers.

>>133646705
By using the state's currency you are acknowledging their rule is valid and thus consent to taxes

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>>133650775
Free market gives you the opportunity to create a monopoly. It's basically why it's a thing.

>>133652861
Exactly

>>133646705
>When there's roads :(

>>133652604
>Funny how your pic doesn't depict communism or socialism.
that would be the bottom example

And having a "need" to steal money from people doesn't make it not stealing. You want to argue necessity or justify it then do it, but call a spade a spade.

>>133652861
Anfarts utterly BTFO of existence

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>>133652718
How about you stop justifying theft? I don't see how me saying mob rule is wrong means I'm a child.

>>133652861
Except we don't want to use their currency, we are forced to. Sometimes you're even forced to use someone else's currency.

>>133648547
You get an initiative on the ballot and it passes with a majority vote. A judge then dismisses your initiative as unconstitutional.
Now what?

>>133652784
>(((they))) own your currency
yeah except this is just untrue. My money comes from my employer, not from credit.
If by some circuitous route the actual dollars originally came from debt that still doesnt make my money theirs. It's the debter's responsibility to pay that money back.

>>133647096
You don't benefit from theft. With taxation you may do so. Thus taxation is not theft.

>I want all the benefits of taxes like police, roads, street lights, school for myself and children, ambulances, fire fighters, quality roads etc.. But I don't actually want to pay taxes myself

Not how it works.

>>133653349
>you don't benefit from theft
That isn't the definition of theft, benefit has absolutely nothing to do with it.

>>133652861
except if I try to mint my own currency, and get any actual traction in using it, the federal government will use lethal force, or the threat there of, to stop me.

>>133653349
Who are you to judge if I benefit from something or not? Respectfully Commissar, you're full of shit. Theft comes from lack consent, not from whether one party chooses it's okay.

>>133653461
I don't want those things to be given by government, they're forcing us to use them, that's how they justify taxes. Can I opt out? They can stop providing me those services and I stop paying taxes.

>>133652861
I use Bitcoin nigger, eat shit

>>133653349
>With taxation you may do so
so if I'm one of the people who pays more in taxes than receives in government benefits you're ready to agree that it is immoral to tax my income?

>>133646705
What's wrong with double standards?

>>133653737
I don't know. No one ever tries to make the argument that taxation is theft but it's OK for the government to do so.

>>133653461
Fucking privatize them you silly cunt, it's all better quality when private anyway.

>>133653520
>benefit has absolutely nothing to do with it.
Exactly. Thanks for agreeing with me.

>>133653633
Every day you go out and willingly and knowingly use those roads. Just because you don't want or like something doesn't mean you aren't benefiting from it.

>>133646705
Who is pointing the gun? Who is hurt or killed for not paying taxes? No one gets arrested either.

>>133647261
>>133647955
Who is threatening to kill or hurt someone for not paying taxes?

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>>133646705
>choosing to stay in the state
>choosing to use its currency
>choosing to engage in taxable behaviors
>choosing to whine about it instead of taking action to change it.

inb4

>BUT MOM DOING STUFF IS HARD!
>UNLIKE BEING A SUCCESS IN WARLORD RUN FREE MARKET I'LL TOTALLY BE THE BEST ROBBER BARON EVER!

>>133653896
Again, because government uses forces to be the only to do that. They're threating others not to create and threatening me to pay for their lack of work. Also it still isn't related to theft, theft is when something is taken against your will, regardless of whether you judge I benefit from it or not.

>>133653992
Police officers, people trying to live innawoods.

>>133653633
No you can't opt out, it's impractical. You're going to stop using the roads? If something happens to a loved one, you're not going to call an ambulance? Or you're going to not want one called on you? If you're stolen from, beaten or killed, you're not gonna call the police?

>>133653896
No I'm not agreeing with you dipshit, "benefit" is not in the definition of theft, therefore taxation IS theft, because despite benefitting from it, you are being stolen from, that is theft.

>>133646705
how does being robbed get me roads, healthcare, education or law enforcement without it being taxation ?

>>133654118
The government, of course. If you don't pay taxes, you'll be arrested. If you resist arrest using effective methods, you'll be killed.

>>133654242
So the state makes a system that is impractical, forces me to use it and pay for it? Also I can call an ambulance, get a doctor, private security, defend myself. And private roads are also a thing. Why do you assume only government can provide when we have examples of the private market doing it?

>>133653843
What are you trying to say? You want people to have to start paying a monthly bill to a specific company if they want to be able to call the cops? And if they don't then they can be victimized and there's nothing they can do about it? That's retarded.

>>133646705
This is pure nigger thinking. Tax is what white people pay to keep a civilized country.

>>133654467
Yep.

>>133654467
How is people paying for the services they use retarded? Do you think people should be able to freeload on taxpayers by using services they don't pay and by being on welfare? Why is it different for private companies?

>>133654472
Tax is what white people pay to feed Bongquisha's seventeen kids

>>133654686
Then the solution is to remove Bongquisha, not the government.

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>>133646705
The problem isn't with paying into a system that helps the poor (charity), the problem is with being forced to do so---especially when there's no guarantee as to where the money goes after it is taken.

All laws are, fundamentally, death threats. Taxation is just a life-long mugging with extra steps.

>>133654587
>>133654577
Most people don't want other people to be able to be murdered and robbed from, and get no justice, just because they didn't pay a bill. And what about the children who can't pay, it's open season on children because they can't pay their police bill?

>>133653546
Until your edgy ass mints its own currency that is of use for your fellow anfart/lolbertarian you're gonna follow tha law and pay taxes for the better of the nation like everyone else

>>133654743
Why do you say that? You think genocide/deportation is easier than rolling back welfare? Are you mental?

>>133654312
>thief steals 20 USD from you
>Gives back product worth 10 USD
>Wow thanks!

The middle man of government only makes it more exspensive for the individual, even if you make a really low wage.

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>>133646705
(you)

>>133654457
The system isn't impractical, you opting out of using the services taxes deliver is impractical. You won't really be able to avoid all the benefits taxes bring, and the government won't have a real way of stopping you from getting those benefits.

>>133654836
>You think genocide/deportation is easier than rolling back welfare?
Yes. Historically, when has a democracy ever rolled back entitlements in a meaningful way for an extended period of time? On the other hand, when was the last genocide? One is more common than the other.

The image is deceiving in that it portrays the state as taking but not giving back. A thief takes all your valuables and leaves you. The state takes a portion of your income -as well as that of everyone else in the country, and in return you enjoy infrastructure, security , healthcare etc.

>>133654780
Is it open season on kids because they don't pay taxes? Parents would pay. Also why do you think they can't defend themselves? If it weren't for a lot of government laws about the use of "reasonable force" a lot more people would defense themselves rather than rely on police especially since the job of the police isn't to prevent murder or robbery but to catch the criminal after it has happened.

>>133654780
Maybe you could help foot that bill for them voluntarily? Why does the state need to force you to do a thing you already say you are willing to pay for?

>>133654902
>"Steals" 20 USD from you
>In return get 20 USD in goods and services that you use every day

>>133654909
>>133655005
see
>>133654902

Thats the only way to achieve free universal healthcare, free state/public education...things that i would defend with my life if needed,

>>133655005
Not to mention that in an ethnically homogeneous state, the man is essentially pointing the gun at himself. If your state is a foreign actor, you have bigger problems than taxes.

>>133654983
>democracy
Cancer. I do not believe in democracy, the state should be abolished, and all its services privatized, that is where I stand.

>>133655082
How can we possibly get back the same amount when achmed lalal gets an iphone too???

>>133646939
Taxation is theft desu. I remember in Netherlands, the state gets the health insurance money even from your private accounts, if you don't pay in time.
Here, they just take them before I get any money from my employer, he is forced to pay then for me.
How is that not abusive ?

>>133654146
>Again, because government uses forces to be the only to do that.
But you ARE benefiting from the taxes right? That doesn't happen with theft. In fact, we have a word for theft with benefits, we call it taxes. We call taxes, taxes because it's not quite the same as theft. In fact, taxes is a better descriptor.

>>133654246
Exactly, benefits is not in the definition of theft. Thats why we call it taxes. Thanks for agreeing again.

>>133655117
What are economies of scale? There is no way that you as a private individual can reaonably pay to have thousands of miles of motorway for example built off just your own back.

>>133655082
>Adding 20 politicians that manage a service or product doesn't make it cost any more!

Product+politician costs more than product alone.

>>133655016
>Is it open season on kids because they don't pay taxes?
It's not open season on anyone even those that don't pay taxes because everyone, regardless of if they pay taxes, gets the same benefits. And what if the parents refuse to pay, or if the kids don't have parents. I can then shoot said kids in the face, and not face any punishment. That's how you want your country to work?

>>133655316
Maybe I'm not the only one to use a private motorway? Maybe other customers exist? Strange notion, I know.

No taxes = no police, roads, schools, hospitals etc.
Oh, and you also have to grow your own food

>>133655030
And if everyone chooses not to foot the bill voluntarily?

>>133655255
Ah I see.

Don't mind me then, I'm going to take $1000 away from you by force and give you an apple in return, it's just "taxation" right?

You have brain damage senpai

>>133655318
Policians do more than just mediate road building, and if you were to do it all yourself you would almost certainly hire someone to manage it all which is basically the same thing, except his salary is paid for by just you alone.

>>133649649
It's order out of chaos. Yeah, for 10 years there was absolutely no rule regarding wires / cabling

>>133655005
Those things can be supplied by the private sector, usually more cheaply and a better version of the service or good too. Also that's still unrelated or whether it is theft, if I take your money but leave a nice drawing on your fridge is it okay because I gave you something in return?

>>133655082
More like
>steal 20k from you
>pay useless bureaucrats
>give some money to drunken natives and immigrants on welfare
>pay yourself
>give you a fraction of your money's worth in services

How ungrateful.

>>133655255
If I cut off your leg you'd benefit but it's against your will (therefore wrong) and an actual doctor could probably cure whatever you have instead of hacking off you leg and calling you ungrateful. That's a more apt comparison.

>>133655370
If the parents don't care how is that any different than now, there's plenty of kids being neglected and abused despite the state existing, is this how you want the country to work?

>>133654909
So, in return, I get an elephant to feed...

>>133655398
So rather than have use of the road at only maintenance cost, you have the use of the road at maintenance plus owner's profit?

>>133648627
Here, gigabit internet line costs under 10 euros

>>133655555
Sorry, you can't go around killing kids without facing judgment because they didn't pay their police bill. Try moving to another country.

>>133655238
That's not an issue of taxation, that's an issue of the government is spending taxpayer money, which is a legitimate grievance, but separate.

>>133655628
You know the private companies the government pays to build and maintain the road make profit too, right? With government you pay for the profits, maintenance AND the politicians salary. All while being forced.

>>133655763
>Being this out of arguments

>>133655628
These dumbfucks think net neutrality is screwing them. They are fucking idiots while calling people cucks at the same time.

>>133656162
Do you think any ancaps are in favor of government regulating the internet?

>>133655837
Yes I know, however the road itself is not run for profit.

simple solution, just replace "taxes" with a kickstarter-type campaign collection and let those who can donate do so; so that they feel part of the system in contributing directly rather than this taxation loophole bullshit that just makes for hoarding ANYWAY. encourage volunataryism and encourage small-mid business and quit with the international global market place bullshit that's clearly not working out.

>>133656401
Yeah bro, the contruction workers or their manager doesn't want to make some money. Neither do the politicians.

>>133655465
>>133655555
Yes, exactly. Thank you for agreeing with me on the definition of taxes. Now you've shifted the argument to state and citizen rights and clearly the right to revolt which we can argue about that if you want but its kind of off topic in the thread.

loltarians seem to be only capable of "gotcha" arguments. You guys can do better than this. Come on.

>>133655419
Dumbass summerfag, shouldn't you be in daycare right now?

>>133654909

>Taxation
>In return, you get a more powerful government to tax you even harder

>>133656715
Your definition is stupid.
>take $10,000 from someone on the street at gunpoint
>give them a piece of chewing gum
You're saying you wouldn't go to prison for armed robbery for this? You think this isn't theft?

>>133656569
Are you intentionally missing the point? Public roads do not have a charge to use them, other than maintenance taken from taxation which is spread out over all taxpayers. If they were all private, they almost certainly would. This means you have to pay directly to use it, the cost is pread between only those that use that particular road at any given time, and also includes the cut of the person running it for profit.

>>133646705
Dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb.
Taxation is a
Fantastic deal for all your country does for you.

>>133656950
So there should be no government at all?

>>133654909
>Courts which never punish the guilty

Do I really have to bring up cases where having money absolves you from having to follow the law? Thank you greatest ally.
The Saxons had a much simpler method. If someone committed a crime against your family then one of your family could commit the same crime back. If someone murdered your brother then you could murder the murderer. But only you or someone from your family. You couldn't nominate someone from outside of your family to do it. Tell me that isn't a better method.

>>133657094
Would you prefer there were no courts at all? Or perhaps private courts enforcing private laws?

>>133646705
Don't make money Anon.

>>133656997
Public roads very much have a cost associated with them apart from maintenance. State bureaucracy costs a whole lot and is one of the factors that government services aren't worth the tax you pay to recieve them.

The cost for state roads isn't lower because it's spread out over each person, every person in the system also has to pay for roads they don't even use. It's not a better deal for the individual, if it was then you wouldn't need to force people to take it.

>>133646705
Why would we refute this? It is true. Taxation is theft. You are coerced into paying the expenses of politicians that misuse your hard earned money all the time.

>>133646705
Roads.

>>133646705
Thieves don't build infrastructure with the money you fucking idiot

>>133657660
Some do

>>133655198
Then who will you call to protect your property? You're going to have to keep watch over your property 24/7. And guess what, now there are groups of people out there who will band together to kill you and take over your property. Of course you can team up with other individuals to help protect your property in exchange that you help protect theirs. Guess what that is? Government.

Violence is the truth of this world. Government, taxes, the police, currency, are institutions that keep violence at bay. So you better be one tough motherfucker if you no longer want those institutions to exists.

>>133657749
Private security agencies.

>Go to someone's house
>They say you have to take your shoes off to stay there, you go into the house and take off your shoes (consent)
>They say they will feed you since you follow the rules of the house
>You stay there awhile and suddenly say "Fuck it why cant I just live here and not consent to the rules?" instead of just leaving

You consent by remaining there as a citizen. If you don't like the rules and the methods they utilize taxes then save up and leave.

>>133657496
You pay for the ability to go wherever the road network takes you. Yes any particular individual probably won't travel every mile of it, but if you choose to go somewhere you're not paying through the nose to go down dirt track beacuse it's not one of the main trunk roads, instead it may be less used than a motorway, but still in half decent condition (and there at all).

Decent access is strongly linked to economic activity. A good public road network benefits the country, and every individual and business in it, by far more than it costs in tax.

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Holy shit. I remember when /pol/ was libertarian. Now you edgy faggots invite government into your lives. Cuckoldry of the highest degree. Kill yourselves

>>133657749
google "fraternal society"

>>133657747
Only if you are starting from the assumption that taxation is the same as theft, which is a circular argument.

>>133657997
It's just summerfags, there are still lots of libertarians here. After summer the nannystate children will be back in school.

>>133648547
What about when all your tax dollars go to Israel and arming rebels in third world shitholes? Kill yourself

>>133654909
> you get roads that are already built and are never fixed
> when they do make new roads they overpay some contractor with no incentive to finish it on time
> Judges are paid to legislate laws for the left
> Police are paid to write frivolous tickets and rob us for even more money.
> Some rural communities are forced to hire private contractors for the fire brigade in which you have to pay even more because taxes don't actually go to this
> You pay to have some asshole shake you down every time you travel
> You pay crooked cuck politicians to rob you of money and freedom
> You pay feds to spy on you.
> You often give politicians bonuses you never asked to give them
> You don't consent to any of this
> But you still have to pay or go to jail

Taxation. Is. Theft.

I'll pay who I want to pay when I want to pay it, and it is none of your business to have my money that I earned.

>>133657988
Why would I pay through the nose to use a shit road? I'd only be forced to payfor it if some giant entity pointed it's military and police at me.

I understand the use of road networks, you don't need to explain it. But if the deal is so good, why do you need to force people to take it? Surely people would want a good deal out of their own volition.

>>133657749
Look at South Africa. Private security is as important if not more than the police ( because the later sucks )

>>133646705
>I want to live in a society created by all of you while contributing nothing
>WHAT DO YOU MEAN THAT'S NOT FAIR, AM I BEING DETAINED?!

Honestly we should just deport tax evaders.

>>133658074
Taking something without consent is theft, no matter what it's called.

>>133646842
Not an argument against the OP and you know it.

>>133646705
>what are roads
>what is free education
>what is an army
You get something for return, with progressive taxes some win and some lose. But the end result is a more stable society which benefits everyone.

>>133658513
> Tax goes to bettering society

Great tale, m8. Now tell me one about the Easter Bunny and Santa Claus and all the other things you are naive enough to still believe.

>>133646705

Except its missing the part where the guy on the bottom get shit in return like safety from the military/police, roads, etc. Yea its not spent very efficiently but that picture is still dumb

>>133658378
>Why would I pay through the nose to use a shit road?

Because it's the only way to get where you;re going, beyond going off on safari just to visit the 'rents.

>>133658597
>Government start world wars that slaughter millions mercilessly over minor issues
>Statist boot licker thinks this is a stable society

>>133656967
The person doing that isn't the government but lets say it was. Lets say the government levies a 100 percent taxation for a piece of gum. It is taxation and you should really consider revolting at that point.

>>133654909
>paying police to take away your freedoms
>paying for some faggot politician to take away more of my money and freedoms
>paying for some shitskin's welfare while they remain a cancer on society

Two sides of every coin my friend

>>133658727
> You're going to travel the way I demand and pay me for it too.
> And it will be on the road I make for me according to my plans.
> Fuck no its not your road you need a license to use it.
> You don't like it? Fine. I'll send your ass to jail? Fight back and die.

Sounds like coercion to me.

>>133658516
You consent by continuing to live in and enjoy the befits of being in a country where that is the system. You are free to leave at any time. Do you forgo following the law any time you find it inconvienient?

>>133658727
There are more than 1 road building company, more than 1 road to any city.

Now stop dodging the question: If the government package deal is so good, why do people need to be forced to take it? Don't people want a good deal out of their own volition?

>>133646842
>i'm brainwashed

>Sweden

Yeah ok.

>>133658597
> You get the safety of the police
> You say as the cops stand back and allow leftist riots to burn up neighborhoods in "protest"

>>133658906
But the government forces me to use their services. It's illegal not to go to school in Sweden, for example. So I'm consenting by being forced?

also
>You can just leave
The robbery victim can just escape the robber, it is still robbery going on.

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>>133658513
Kill yourself you statist cuck. Your tax dollars go to some cocksucker politician who doesn't give a fuck about you, and then uses more of those tax dollars to fund globalization in third world shitholes

>>133658444
>>133657830
Do private security works for free?
No, you still have to pay for security. Except now you clearly mark yourself as a target and you can't leave your compound either without an entourage of people. It won't be long before someone with charisma band together a larger group of mercenaries to fuck you over. Because what exactly is stopping people from hiring/bribing those very same "private security"?
>>133658051
And how do you know that fraternity is on your side? How do you make sure everyone in it is not a selfish and corrupt?

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>>133655117
>every road you have travelled on, every doctor you have needed, the security of your state and literally every other service you take for granted isn't worth a slim portion of your salary

>>133658903
>Community gets together because roads are good for everyone
>This costs money, but they know this
>Pony up
>need some way to mange this, and ensure representation of those paying
>Vote in a comittee
>Oh wait whoops that's local government and they're asking for money to pay for this shit
>HELP I'M BEING ROBBED
>I DO NOT CONSENT

>>133646705
Situation A:
>"Ay cracka ass muhfugguh gimme dat wallet nigga 'fo I buss a cap in yo honkey ass ya err me? Gimme dat shit whitey!"
Result: You have your money stolen and you get shot if you resist.

Situation B:
>"Good morning Sir! It is I, the tax man! I'd like to collect a small portion of your gross income in order to pay for public amenities like roads, hospitals, public transport and construction of infrastructure!"
Result: You get to help build society and positively contribute to it. You can leave if you don't want to pay.

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>>133659001

>>133659215
> The robbery victim can just escape the robber, it is still robbery going on.
Yes. 100%

>>133659304
>slim
try close to 50%

I could pay for those things with 10% of my monthly earnings if the state didn't make it so exspensive and convoluted.

Bad goy, bad!

Shaniqua's 17 children are an excellent use of your money!
Public sector offers better services than private sector!
People who can just forcefully take your money will provide you the same service as people who have to compete for your money!
Mayor's coke habit is of great benefit to you personally!
The state, which has no reason to be responsible cos it can just take your money again, will always be responsible! The state will never waste your tax!

Eliminate taxes and you just eliminated all the shitskins and leftists too. All the leftist nonprofits depend on YOUR taxes to import shitskins. All the shitskins depend on YOUR taxes to reproduce.

TAX WAR = RACE WAR

>>133659215
>But the government forces me to use their services.

Do they? Who's stopping you and some like minded individuals from for example building your own roads and services? Or buying a 4x4 and driving it through someone's fields (beyond that angry farmer obviously).

>>133658847
No it would be considered theft.
Theft: give something get nothing in return
Tax: give something get something (protection, roads, research, and so on) in return
If it is theft then you have a duty to revolt and overthrow your government.

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>>133659350
>Criminals killing criminals
>Any worse than this.

Yeah ok.

>>133659608
The government? It would be illegal to start my own schools here for example. At best I can become a government contractor.

>>133658934
>There are more than 1 road building company, more than 1 road to any city.

Any city maybe, but not everyone lives in a city. I can think of hundreds of little towns where there is literally one road through rough terrain, that would have no hope of having the quality of infrastructure were it not for the government building it.

>No taxes ever
>No one paying for your countries soldiers to train and receive guns and work on better weapons and bombs
>Any country that does have it's citizens pay for those things can just waltz in and take over now

>>133659756
Don't you worry my little cholo friend, they kill plenty of mexican civilians too.

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>>133659320
>Good morning, Sir! It is I, the corrupt politician! I'd like to collect a large portion of your paycheck, and as you make more money, I'm going to take even more! What am I going to do with that money you ask? Well I'm going to give it to Jamal here to pay for his living because he doesn't work! I'm also going to send it over to Israel because they're our greatest ally! But I can't forget about using it to destabilize countries that have nothing to do with us! Have a good day, goy!"

FTFY

>>133659779
>It would be illegal to start my own schools here for example

Private education is illegal in Sweden? That's news to me.

>>133650671
there the best roads because they have more money to maintain them, not every road can be a toll road or noone would be able to afford getting around you fucking mongoloid

>>133659534
This

>>133659819
They'd be built if people wanted them. Why would people that want a road not go out on their own volition and hire a company for the job? You don't need to force people to do things they want to do.

>>133660026
We live in a democracy. The republicans control everything. All they have to do is get rid of all the welfare since them niggers don't vote anyways. Problem is rural retards who voted for Trump also benefits from those welfare.

>>133659319
That is called fallacy of composition, friendo.

> Generally speaking people like all roads.
> People generally pay for roads with taxes.
> All taxes go for roads which are good, so you should pay for them.

The fact is most taxes are spent wastefully in ways that screw us all over. It is equivalent to robbery since the average person has little to no say in how the funds that are coerced from them are used. That is all up to the ruling class, which we all know there is more to politics than simply the right people who represent everyone running.

There is no reason people here should be paying taxes to a corrupt government. It would actually be a smart move for most of us to collectively stop at once and boycott the government until they use our money that they coerced more efficiently.

>>133659256
I should still have the choice to pay for private security instead of the police.

>>133660128
Yea, what now? How can I choose not to use the services when it's illegal to do so?

>>133659487
>try close to 50%
Want to know why Scandinavia has nearly objectively the highest HDI in the world? You don't have to like taxation, you just have to realise that it is necessary to your lifestyle.

>>133660334
for
>>133659318

>>133660235
>They'd be built if people wanted them

No they would not, and certainly not to the standard that they have with the government doing it, because they're a small relatively poor community who simply can't afford the millions and millions it takes to build transport infrastructure. It represents more than they all see in their entire lives combined.

>>133646705
No income, no tax simple as that.
If you dont want to pay taxes go eat nuts off trees or something.
Tax anyways is paid so that public services can be run and that the goverment can pay for its expenses i.e the public services.
Seeing that youre a Swede i would expect you to know this.

>>133659987
Except they don't.

Most kills are drug related
It's an issue but my people do recognize as one.
Please leave PewdiePie

>>133660423
OK, well that's bullshit. It isn't here (UK). Go lobby government.

Any idea why that is?

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>>133646705
We live in a civilized society
We pay taxes so the basic functions of the government can work
That's how nations work
If you are a deluded ancapmemer you should go to any African shithole where there are no taxes and no government or laws,nor roads

A mile of road costs 2million USD when the US government (who also pays for shitty bureaucracy ) does it.

A town of 10k people would have to pay 200USD per person and mile of road (less without government bureaucracy), how is this more money than they would see in their lives combined? You're completely disconnected from reality, this could easily be financed in a matter of months without having to force anyone.

>>133660472
> No they would not
Where there is a demand for something, there is someone willing to work to supply it. Basic economics you uneducated dunce.
> not to the standard that they have with the government doing it
>Implying the government has great standards when it comes to maintaining and building roads.
> They usually hire some rent an illegal company with no obligation to finish to pocket the money while they half ass the job
> Implying private citizens can't do better.

>>133660527
>No income, nothing for thugs to steal from you. Simple as that.
> Implying that not having a job is a reasonable solution to anything

You sound

>>133648727
This is bad a bad argument. In every first world country where business would be large enough to create monopolies they would necessarily run into government intervention at some level, even if it were insignificant enough for it to matter. But you'd still be able to argue that it wasn't a "natural monopoly" due to semantics. Stick with the concepts and avoid the communist argument ("REAL communism has never been tried before!").

>>133661093
meant for
>>133660472

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>>133659756
>>133659350
Both of your countries are shit. With Sweden, I have to worry about my wife getting gang raped and beheaded. With Mexico, I have to worry about my wife getting gang raped and hanged from a street light.

>>133661129
We need to be on even terms regarding what a monopoly is first.

What do you define as a monopoly?

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>>133646705
ftfy

>>133661136
They live in the sticks. That a lot of miles of road to get anywhere. It's also not just a mile of road in the best possible conditions, or even average like you are quoting. It's up hills and down glens, over rivers and through mountains. It's the most expensive a road can be, unless it's little more than an animal track.

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>>133661200
100x this. Taxes are part of a social agreement whereby those protected by the monopoly on violence held by the state directly support that which they are using for protection.

It's not as if you're paying money for absolutely no fucking reason.

>>133661200
>accuses someone of using a strawman
>with his own strawman

>>133646705
Taxation is protection money, not the same.

>>133661608
Theoretically I would say, now here in Sweden it's replace-your-own-people-bux

>>133661608
This is closer to the truth. Taxation isn't a literal robbery, but it is patently an extortion scheme.

>>133661539
So what would that cost then? You don't even know the price of it, yet you proclaim it to so exspensive it can't be funded. Your arguements has no basis in reality, they just have a basis in your fondness for government.

It might cost more than 200USD per person and mile, it's still not unrealistic by ANY stretch.

>>133646705
Taxation is theft
t. Ancap

>>133659256
You're missing the point. We all agree that you need security and it costs. The difference is, that in SA there's a lot of competition in this private sector and people get the best for their buck, while the state forced pay is basically wasted money.
You can regard countries as larger bands. There will always be a bigger or meaner group

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>>133646705
Taxes pay for the postal services, police, firemen, road maintenance, etc.
If the average individual were made responsible for maintaining every bit of their property, including sewage, plumbing, gas, and other utilities, we'd be beyond fucked.
Taxes also help with food regulation. If you want to buy food with no real regulations, just go to any chinatown super market. Look at how filthy the conditions are.
Stop being an ignorant dunce and go look at what your taxes actually help pay for. Maybe you won't be such a child about it.

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ENLIST NOW WE NEED YOUR HELP

GET IN HERE

>>133661038

>>133661038

>>133661038

>>133660408
No, you don't have a choice. Property is backed by violence. Choice don't mean shit, only violence matters. Do you think by saying "it's my property" the bandits will go away? No you can only do that if you have a gun to protect your property. So either you are the most violent motherfucker around or you are going to get fucked by the most violent motherfucker around.

It is the consensus of the people who live around you that decides whether there is an ultimate source of structured violence, that is the government to take care of everything. You do not decide by yourself.

>>133662333
>Mafia takes 20 bucks from you
>Gives back postal service worth 10 bucks
>Woah thanks!

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>>133647096
>Taxes are still theft, thought.
So what?

>>133662599
So you couldn't refute the OP. Which was the point of this thread.

>>133662476
If there is no practical way to voluntarily organise a postal service, and postal service is considered a good in society, then yes, that is a beneficial arrangement.

>>133662476
You are more than welcome to deliver that package to the US yourself. It'll cost you a lot more than $20.

>>133662710
War is murder.
Laws are slavery.
Democracy is mob rule.
What's your point?

>>133659913
Soldiers could easily join PMCs and get better pay, better equipment, better benefits, and their employers would actually care if they get hurt or die because soldiering is actually a valuable skill and difficult to train and replace for.

>>133662855
>If there is no practical way to voluntarily organise a postal service

There is a practical way. Hint: It's not thanks to government magic.

>>133662855
You don't think a fucking postal service can be privatized? Paying someone to take something to someone else? You think only a government can do this?

>>133662927
To start a discussion with statists, if you already agree that tax is theft then maybe you should argue with people who think otherwise rather than with me.

>>133662186
South Africa is fucked because of niggers. Of course there will always be a bigger, meaner group, that is the government that provides the ultimate source of violence to keep people in line. Your problem is one of corruption. If the government does not constantly show how the taxes it collects benefits the people instead of specific individuals, then it will be subject to revolution. People are not stupid. Shit hit the fans precisely because people no longer see tax as tax but as theft.

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>>133663231
It's irrelevant if taxes are theft or not.>>133662927
The majority would still prefer to have organized wars, laws and some sort of self determination instead of anarchy.
The point you should be making is if taxes are beneficial to the majority of society or not, I would argue that they are.

>>133663115
>>133663101
Note I used the conditional form. We were discussing postal service as an example.
I am aware postal service can be easily privatised in this day and age. Things like building infrastructure, maintaining an effective military and resolving disputes cannot.

>>133661810
>So what would that cost then?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forth_Road_Bridge

This is a bridge near me. It cuts out a 56 mile round trip to get over the Forth estury. It alone cost £20 million in 1960s money. They're build a new one too, that's estimated to cost a cool £2 billion. This is connected to Scotland's capital city too.

Here is the rest of that transport improvement contract, going through the highlands: https://www.transport.gov.scot/media/33650/motorway-trunk-road-programme-july-2013.pdf

On average it is costing £20-£100 million per section (24 sections total). Sometimes less, often more.

>>133663115
The postal service in Trinidad and Tobago is owned and operated by a private company in New Zealand. It can be done successfully.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/TTPost

>>133661810
>>133663595

Also note that that's an upgrade, not having to start from virgin earth.

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>>133646842
>benefits of paying taxes
Prisons are funded by taxpayers.
Rule of law itself is cheap. Productive people that pay into the system get very little in return.

>>133663574
They might be beneficial in some regards, but there is no doubt that a private actor could perform government functions at a better price while providing better quality.

Why would you think a monopoly on certain services/goods would benefit your average individual?

>>133646705
>country with great public infrastructure and services that rely on said infrastructure
>country with no public infrastructure nor services that rely on said infrastructure
>both have taxation
Answer this: are the two above countries different? If yes, then there is no double standard.

>>133663428
>how the taxes it collects benefits the people instead of specific individuals, then it will be subject to revolution
>implying that revolutions are not organized by foreign powers
Corruption is hard to prove and fight. Trust me, my country is basically run by thieves , I know this problem. But US has problems also.

>>133664030
>but there is no doubt that a private actor could perform government functions at a better price while providing better quality
You mean like healthcare in the States, where they charge you $50 for oxygen mask in the amber-lance?

>>133662464
I don't see any bandits faggot. Produce bandits after my property or get the fuck out.

I don't need the police to protect me from bandits. Really the way the law is, the law is protecting the hypothetical bandits from me, you fucking retard. People get sued for going too harsh on robbers. Why in the ever loving fuck would I want to pay for that?

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>>133646705

>>133661314
I'm not personally debating you and overall agree with you, I just find the former post somewhat disingenuous as an argument against the existence of natural monopolies.

>>133664030
>Why would you think a monopoly on certain services/goods would benefit your average individual?
Because the point of a govt. is not to make a profit and its ultimate goal is to serve the citizens. The private sector seeks to make as much money as possible, a govt. does not.
>m-muh free market
Has major limitations which you would know about if you actually knew econ.
http://www.investopedia.com/terms/p/perfectcompetition.asp for example, plenty of political economists put criticisms of unregulated capitalism in their own works, it just seems that the Austrians and Neoclassical ignored them along with many more important things.
If you want historical examples you can look at industrial era working conditions prior to workplace regulations.

>>133663595
2 billion quid over Edinbourgs ~500k population is 4000 pounds per person for this bridge. Then there's also the fact people outside of Edinbourg would want the bridge, so they would chip in too. That thing can be financed in a year privately. (34 pounds a month need to be donated per)

This idea that it costs an amount of money that people would never see in their lives is complete bullshit. Again, it is not unrealistic, but you don't care about wether or not it is realistic. You're dead set on defending the very state that's ripping you off.

>Use public goods or government subsidized services
>Surprised when you are taxed
Nigger tier

>>133664767
340 pounds per month per person*

>>133646705
>/pol/ won't ever be able to convince me of anything because I'm a brainwashed fucktard

not even gonna bother trying
fuck off

>>133664866
That represents more than I pay in rent ever month.

>>133653191
The Judge only permits ballots he personally agrees with. You've just pushed the power over to the judge

>>133664499
You think the law means shit without a group of people with guns to enforce it? Look at syria or libya. Once you remove the main source of violence you leave a vacuum for a bunch of smaller tyrants to come in and enforce their rules. Go fucking live there or in Somalia and see how that works out.

>>133646705
A true American will give Trump his money and fucking thank him for using it to make America great again.

Anyone who disagrees with this is a fucking traitor or someone who hates America.

>>133664986
Good thing you wouldn't be forced to pay for the bridge then.

>>133665201
Quite. Thank god for tax.

>>133664740
>If you want historical examples you can look at industrial era working conditions prior to workplace regulations.
That occurred under a state, and when the workers tried to strike for better conditions, which is well within their rights in an ancap society, the state literally burst onto the scene and mowed them down with machine guns like during the Ludlow Massacre. The army was very often called in to break strikes.

So those conditions would have been far shorter lived if there were no state, the reason workers were abused for so long was due to the state.

>>133665269
>Thank god that I don't have to pay
>Except for when I'm forced to pay
hmm...

>>133665201
Also, because I live here. It's pronounced Ed-in-buh-ruh.

>>133665441
I am quite happy to pay my share through tax, but not to the point where I am homeless.

>>133665534
https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edinburgh

Different languages have different names for different places? Swedish pronounciation is just Edinburg.

>>133665682
That's fine if you are, but it doesn't justify forcing other people to pay tax.

>>133665415
>That occurred under a state, and when the workers tried to strike for better conditions,
They were blocking the factory, thus violating the NAP.
There were plenty of people willing to work for that wage which is why you had unemployment.
If you look at the actual numbers it didn't matter if all the workers quit, there would be plenty more willing to work for the same shitty wages tomorrow.

>>133665927
It's obviously linked, but we pronounce it bu-ruh (or sometimes bu-row in England) rather than burg as in burger.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_burgh

>>133666016
We all use it, we all see the benefit and understand that it costs money. 99.999% of people are fine with (reasonable) tax to pay for public services as a concept.

>>133649159

Both Microsoft and Google have reaped massive profits from their dealings with the Federal Government. Government is Microsoft's largest single customer, which they secured by allowing nice back doors into their software for the NSA to use, among other things.

Google was basically kickstarted by the CIA, works hand in hand with the government (particularly so during the Obama administration), and they passed legislation to help them. This may be in the reverse, as they passed legislation to remove the monopolies on data monitoring to companies like Google and Facebook, and allowing the ISP's to do so as well.