Universal Basic Income

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4 options.

1) Fascism: retraining programs and mass conscription to give people work and purpose

2) Socialism: automation replaces as much work as possible, people do whatever they want to do in their free time (probably laze around)

3) Capitalism: the poor either figure out how to survive or starve to death, automated warbots defend the property of the capitalists from revolution

4) Social Democracy: UBI is implemented, you can still work but the rewards are decreased due to high taxes

>>133068707
You haven't thought through the math if you actually think this is a viable idea.

>>133068801
>5) Some shitty combination of all of the above

this is what will actually happen

>>133068707
In a society with UBI I would refuse to contribute to such retardity and just decide to help crash the system as quickly as possible. I would play video games and masturbate to anime girls all day long.

im ready to get my ubi and just smonk weed

>>133068707
Set fires.

>>133068961
>>133068980
This is basically what would happen.

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>>133068707
Basic income cannot work in a capitalist society. It only works in principle if half the population is already working and the country has a commodity that generates enough to supplement a UBI.

Norway and Alaska are the only examples i can think of

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Regulate and restrict automation

>>133068801
>Fascism: space program and architectural wonders for the glory of Terra*

Op is a deep thinker

>other than communism which is dumb.

I would kill niggers and spics. What other answer is there?

>>133068707
I would be run as a law maker and make it so raw milk could be sold in Kentucky.

>>133068810
We would just need to increase corporate taxes back to something like they were in the 50's. We could also eliminate a lot of current welfare programs which are incredibly wasteful by replacing them with a far more efficient UBI.

>>133069195
This is irrelevant to the topic as those activities would still be illegal, regardless of the economic system.

I like where your head's at, though.

>>133068707
Well we already know what niggers would do.

>>133069232
running*

>>133068707
>what would you do if your income were taken care of?
As a parasitical R selected subhuman, I would immigrate to any country foolish enough to implement this and hoover up as much free stuff as I possibly can so I can have a horde of bastard children that will eventually turn into criminals and have bastard children of their own until my virus-like genes have completely devoured the host society.

>>133069281
And why would I choose to keep my business in the US?

>>133068707
>what would you do if your income were taken care of
I would eat my government approved insect flour based nutrient square and live in the same city I was born in because universal basic income can't cover moving costs while doing nothing but playing MMORPGS to fill the void

>>133068707
It's something that will be required when, and only when, automation is delivering utopia.

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Cool, just doubled my income. Now I can buy property and rent it at exorbitantly high prices after I collude with my friends.

>>133068937
Damnit.

>>133069128
Automation is the commodity which generates enough wealth to supplement a UBI. It generates far more wealth for developed than any natural resource ever could. It's the primary reason behind massively increased worker productivity in the last 50 years.

niggers would spend all of their money on stupid shit and then ask for more

>>133068707
I'd become more of a random statistic than I already am. The rich would have widen the gap more than it already is by decentivizing trying to get ahead. The rich would stay rich forever. I'd be considered null and void on a whim.

>>133069350

And don't forget that they're monitoring you and if you complain about it they turn off your chip and you starve to death.

Inevitable. With increasing automation, falling profits, stagnation of wages, and increased cost of living, basic universal income will be the only way that neoliberal capitalism (or rather any semblance of it) can survive

>>133068707
90% people would do jack shit? Have you talked to anyone lately about their hobbies outside of whatever garbage job they have?

>watch movies
>video games
>cooking

Those are hobbies to these people. No building, no researching, almost no outdoors, no projects, nothing. Don't tell me people have no time. I have 3 kids and can work on my hobbies.

>>133069603
"Useless eater" is the industry term.

>>133068801
5) civic nationalism: there is a UBI but you would still have participate in society by some form of civic participation

>>133069140
No. There is no use in creating a society in which most of it's people toil away wasting their lives doing meaningless tasks which could be done by machines. Even if this made sense to do, corps would cheat their way out of paying into the automation taxes and meet any kind of human quota the way they game the tax system now.

ubi will fund stuff like this video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9eC0O7DHZ0

>>133068801
>1
This is probably what most countries will do.
>2
2 is actually gonna look like what you describe as three.
>3
I think you have a very inaccurate view on how enterprise and capitalism works. But then again this is defiantly something (((they))) would do.
>4
Then why the fuck will anyone work?

I think I would actually make pretty good use of this, but I still think it shouldn't be a thing.

>>133069128
A ubi is the only way capitalism will be able to work if the concept of earning a living becomes obsolete.

>>133068707
Leave the country because socialism leads to communism which leads to death.

>>133068707
I get anxiety if I don't work.

>>133068707
This is the most over used topic on this board pushed by those living in a 'the sky is falling' world. Automation will not over throw the working class. It will be akin to the printing press, the radio, the television, and the internet. The industries will evolve around the implementation of automation as well as those working jobs in those fields. Not only is this the same hysteria of when the first automobile hit the streets, it's also blown far out of proportion. Automation is not nearly advanced enough to be self reliant and fully functional. You still need people to operate your systems, build and maintain your systems, as well as produce the parts needed to put the system together. If you are someone who is fearful of this upcoming so called rise of the machine find your place in it. How is your current position or job effected by automation and how can you capitalize on being an innovator before someone else tries your idea? If you would like to get a little Alex Jones on the topic why is it that MSM is pushing the hysteria and the rolling out of UBI? Does this not feel oddly like wellfare 2.0? Is there not a single person here curious as to why the government is trying to encourage us to take free money from them? It seems to be a little fishy and frankly I don't want to be told what I can and cannot do with my own finances. As Rothschild said, you countrol the money supply, you control the country. Think about it.

Will never happen

Do you think the government will just freely give out money without a tax base to support it?
If that's the case than a huge faction of the working class will just become NEETs while the govt overprints money to compensate everyone which will lead to hyperinflation

>>133069530
/thread. UBI isn't going to magically make people content with just above the poverty line, or make them magically fiscally responsible.

>>133068707
I like the idea, but the US has to change a lot before it can become feasible. We would have to have some serious reforms to ensure that people aren't just here for the gibsmedats. Maybe, to be a citizen, you have to show that you will actually work and not just live on UBIbux

>>133069185
I can't see it working until we have the technology necessary to make a highly decentralized form of communism work (Startrek Communism). We need three things:
1. The technology to convert energy into the forms necessary to sustain human life for next to nothing
2. Governments to buy the rights to these technologies and make them a public resource available to all
3. Abundance of energy

>>133069689
Can I just draw some shitty crayon 5 minute drawings once or twice a month repeatedly stating that this is being done to the best of my ability and that you simply don't understand the drawings and claim I'm trying to advance the arts?

>>133068707
UBI wouuld just lead to hyper inflation and devaluation of whichever currency was distributed as the UBI. It's literally the most retarded fucking idea on the planet after human induced global warming.

>>133070003
this will never work in the US but it might be ok in europe

at least up until like 100 years from now

>>133068707
What would I do? Not work, that's for sure.

>>133069281
t. Didn’t do the math

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>>133068707
We should just give everyone 1 million dollars a week, then we will ALL BE RICH RIGHT!?
fucking clueless commies

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>>133068707
Don't fall for the fucking meme. It's a refundable tax credit rebranded as a revolutionary new idea. They want you to think this is a trailblazing idea with insufficient evidence for evaluation. It's not new. It's a refundable tax credit. You can decide if those have worked or not in the past.

>>133068707
probably a lot more drugs and a lot more video games

>>133068707
People keep talking about UBI because they want to turn people against the idea, because the first two questions always asked iare

>Can our country actually afford this (pls pls say yes)?
>Why the fucks would millionaires get it too?

Negative income tax and the 20 hour work week are the way to go. You pay people who actually need it until they get a decent job and you increase the scarcity of labor.

Of course, this is all predicated on full automation, which we are decades away from at minimum using weak AI.

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>>133068707
>Universal Basic Income
Oh gee whiz, it's this thread again. It's like nobody knows how this universal basic income thingy going to end up in reality.

>>133069929
UBi doesnt mean you don't work. You can receive an income and still be productive with your day. But automation just means that your human labor won't be able to compete IN A MARKETPLACE with automated goods and services. i.e. you won't be able to make quality/quantity that anyone would want to spend their money buying.

>>133068707
I am pro-basic income.

However, the implications are that those who would rather not rely on that system (myself included) will take full advantage of it.

If we start receiving basic income, all of that money will end up being diverted to food, shelter, and utilities - and nothing remotely comparable to what we have today.

Basically, we're already seeing something similar here: Our welfare state has been partly responsible for driving the bare-minimum monthly budget for basic needs up to about $500 on average, which happens to be the average welfare check.

On basic income:

-> You aren't going to be able to buy yourself lab equipment and tools to learn and explore nature.

-> You won't be able to buy a new computer for at least a few years, maybe a few decades.

-> You won't be able to buy a new car. Ever.

-> You will never own land.

>automation
I'm not worried, I'm in sales

>>133068707
>what would you do if your income were taken care of
Should that say "income WAS taken care of" instead?

>>133069331
If we want wealthy companies to stay in America what we need is a smart, educated population which is not forced to spend much of their time working long hours for little pay. Look at the number of incredibly successful tech companies in California, a high tax state. Companies look at a lot more than taxes when deciding which country to base themselves in.

Doesn't work.

>>133068707
KEEP THE PLEBS OCCUPIED WITH BUSYWORK 9-5 OR THERES GONNA BE TROUBLE

DONT JUST CUT UBI CHECKS AND LET THEM DO ANYTHING, MAKE SURE THEIR TIME IS LOCKED UP MAKING WIDGETS OR WHATEVER

>>133068707

i'd do nothing and become an empty nihilist obviously.

What you thought I was going to change the world? Why bother.

>>133068707
I'd sure eat a lot of shitty junk food and watch more TV!

>>133069781
It's funny that this is the attitude most people have. "If I got free money from the government, I know I would use it to do great things but I don't want it to be a thing because everybody else would use it for shit"

>>133069383
Automation won't deliver utopia on it's own. Automation just drastically increases productivity, using those gains to achieve utopia is a political victory, not a technological one.

>>133070043
only if you can prove your functionally retarded, we can use that drawing as fuel for the home we will place you in.

>>133068707
nothing
>like every other animal ont his planet would do
we would cease to evolve because we would only pass on weaker genetic lines
>we would cease to be our creators image.

It's a serious option, but ONLY for highly developed monocultural, ethnically homogeneous nations. In those places the government can provide basic income from tax, but also rely upon the people to be self-sufficient and maintain a defensive force.

Basically, only for our dream world. Not for here. But I DO encourage it on the basis that I think that it will destroy our governments.

>>133068707
>What would you do if you gave the state absolute power over your ability to feed, clothe and house yourself?

>>133069140
No that's retarded

>>133068707
run around fixing people's shitty assembly line built houses for food and goods - constructionism is the only answer

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>>133069499
I would argue that automation doesn't actually accomplish this, however, i will acknowledge your line of thinking because Germany is an excellent example of automation being the type of strength to supplement UBI via trade surpluses (technically Japan as well but thats an entirely different story).

Automation is a trap tho. If your economy is balanced with a wide portfolio of advantages then you have an entirely adapting economy that benefits from automation. But, the problem is in implementation because peak production is a thing and eventually the production machine becomes so complex that the cost of solving the problem automation indirectly creates destroys the purpose it was intended to do.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10176151

Pic related is Mark Blyth. Watch some of his lectures if you have the time. He argues that it may actually be beneficial to an efficient balanced economy to not have full employment and that UBI may be more effective in a "sharing economy" due to the information age and its disruptive technology (think socialism lite)

>>133068707

Simple. Some people don't deserve any income to live.

>>133068810
To pay 12 grand a year per person we would have to double our federal spending.

It's a pipe dream.

>>133069530
>>133069994
Yup, and that's the nice thing about it. People will still want more than what the UBI is giving them and will seek employment or entrepreneurial ventures. Early UBI experiments have proven to increase entrepreneurship and have not resulted in large losses in labor. Those leaving the workforce often did so to raise kids or educate themselves.

>>133070760
Also, if you have a (((service))) economy like us, it will entirely disconnect the population from labour. Thus, making them totally a commercial unit.

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>>133068707
Background checks. Not everyone should be entitled to UBI. It can works but only if the governments really get their shit together and try their hardest to make it work.
>Every abused, sold/bought or addicted to "heavy" drugs?
>Been to prison for X reason?
>Have you not finished school?
>Do you own a bussiness?
>Are you working a full time job that pay well enough?
>Ever had serious problems with the law?
>Are you in a gang or have commited a series of minor crimes?
>You haven't lived here for at least 7 years, don't speak the language or haven't work here before?
No UBI for you.

My idea would be for citizen to apply then background checks, then an appointment to sort the things out and even get housing and a financial plan if there is the chance.
UBI could go so well if everyone tries their best.

>>133070850
>will seek employment or entrepreneurial ventures
yea just like all the niggers without income are doing now, you fucking retard

>>133069650
Yea like I said, the concept of earning a living will become obsolete because robots will be able to outcompete humans at everything.

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>>133069672
Cooking is a real hobby, man. But I agree with you. My mates think it's weird I wanna build and create things rather than consume them...

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>>133068707
Only lazy niggers, useless and unable to get around in life dream about it.

>>133070003
>>133068707
fuck off back to plebit

>>133068707
Universal Basic Income for Universal Basic Work. You spend time every day growing enough food to feed yourself/your family, and you can do whatever you want with the rest of your time.

What's that Lassie? People can and do already do that? You mean UBI is just a bunch of whiny millennials who want their iPhone and birth control paid for by someone else?

Fuck off.

>>133070894
The only way they can be applied in a fair way is to give it to all those who socially not not, at least, to negative things; preferably just positive social things. Income cannot factor. That removes incentive to work for higher positions.

The point is to raise the minimum spending power from 0 to x.

I'd probably try to go back to school for something related to exercise physiology while training my ass off for MMA

>>133070894
>Do you own a business

Literally what the fucks the point?

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>>133068707
> Cant own a business because only possible business would be the large corps and automation
> Going to school would be a waste of time because everyone else would be going to school flooding any job markets there would be active
> Cant build a house somewhere nice
> Cant do anything except consume
Be drunk and do nothing until I have to get a job because the UBI is worthless because if inflation.

>>133068801
>2) Socialism: automation replaces as much work as possible, people do whatever they want to do in their free time (probably laze around)

Can someone tell me what is wrong with this? Isn't the goal of machine production that we don't HAVE to work?

Honestly, it most people can just laze around and have free time, that sounds like a paradise. Saying "work gives you purpose" is pretty dumb, for most people, work is shit.

>>133069948
>Automation will not over throw the working class
I know someone who lives near steel plant in Legnica. Work that used to be done by 30 men now takes 3 men operating high-tech machinery. What are those 27 men supposed to do now? Nobody seems to want to answer that question.

>>133070982
Oh I agree it can be, but these are people who cook normal food and frozen food. Not experimenting or anything. Something like Jas. Townsend and Son would be a hobby or even just attempting stuff like that often.

>>133070508
because I've been jobless before and I didn't just turn into a meme like everyone claims

focus a strong nuclear family with a white woman and 2.5 kids.
Create cultural exports
Participate in law making and governance.
Volunteer to aid those in need; and refugees of war, and brutality.
Study history and language, better my mind and body and become learned.

If only I didn't have to work 40 hours a week in a job I hate.
IN:B4
>Literraly a cuck and a cry baby for complaining, go die starving and diseased in the jungle if you don't like it.
>leaf

>>133070318
Unless you work. Just because you get a ubi doesn't mean you won't be able to find anything to get payed for.

>>133069873
There are so many reasons wrong with that statement that i can't even begin to unpack it.

You can't have a ubi without a way to pay for it and if earning a living is obsolete then you have no jobs.

No jobs = no economy = no taxes = no ubi

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>>133068707

Why are leftists coming here pretending UBI is ever going to be something they'll qualify for?

We already have welfare, and that needs a major overhaul.

Put your shitty Gender Studies degree to use, you fucking faggots, and stop shitting things up with 10 posts every hour about MUH UNIVERSAL BASIC INCOME IS GONNA HAPPEN AND I CAN BE A PROFESSIONAL PROTESTOR ALL DAY RIGHT GUISE shit.

Literally, hang yourself.

>>133071062
>Universal Work
>Machines do the jobs

Really makes me think.

>>133068801
3 gets my penis hard

>>133068707
I own a second home that I rent out. If UBI were to go into effect, I would raise rent by the same amount as the UBI. Extra UBI for property owners, non for renters.

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>>133068707
Some people are already living this dream. I am paying for it.

>>133068707
get high and post here

>>133069140
You cannot fight the inevitable

>>133070236
Negative income tax seems like a pretty good way to implement UBI. The 20 hour work week I'm not so sure about because a lot of people will want to work more than that and others will not want to work at all. It just seems like if left unregulated it will balance out pretty well.

>>133068707
i would do nothing personally
i would sell my house get an RV and just live on the road.

>>133068707

I make 6 figures. My house is paid off and I have significant savings.

I'd quit my job, become a parasite and remove over 1 million dollars in lifetime taxation from the government's purse.

>>133071299
>flag
Yes, because a robot works my home garden.

>>133070379
Education won't save you. if everyone could code it would pay as much as a wallmart wage cuck.

>UBI

Top kek. Enjoy paying 30 dollars or whatever for a loaf of bread and some milk

>>133068707

>Universal Basic Income

Shit has already been tried... it was called soviet russia. Get ready for bread lines.

"automation" is wildly exaggerated in order make you more accepting of widespread government gibs and general reliance on the state.

Governments use this as part of a two pronged attack (coupled with the *we need more immigrants to stay competitive* narrative) to make people on both sides of the fence welcome globalization with open arms.

Don't fall for obvious (and contradictory) freedom grabber tactics.

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>>133068707
>>133068707
What happens if the ubi u give someone isn't enough?
What do when tyrone spends all his gibs on pic related instead of food for Stacey's kid he fathered

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>>133071213
I don't get how anyone could eat frozen foods and 2-min noodles all day; but it seems to be the norm.

On topic though, the welfare state here is pretty close to UBI and it's fucking shit. Niggers rort the system to never work. The worst bit is that minimum wage and entry level jobs pay less than it, so there is no real reason to actually work...

>>133070236
>Negative income tax and the 20 hour work week are the way to go

People will always wind up working less if the income is guaranteed to an extent.

The Negative Income Tax was tested and bore that out.

>>133068801
>you can still work but the rewards are decreased due to high taxes
Very few people here know about one of the primary rules of economics. "People will respond to economic incentive".
>rewards are decreased due to high taxes
People will just not work unless the reward is worth it.

>>133071519
Guess what buddy? You're already not being paid because it's your own garden.

>>133070648
what the fuck are you talking about

>>133069128
alaska doesnt have basic income, just about $1000 per year and is based on how much black gold they sell

>>133071696
If only he could eat cash.

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>>133068961
>Not doing that now

>>133071270
Money has no objective value i dont understand why others dont get this. They think you can give out it out for free and it will still have value.

>>133071642
You can use the advent of mass job automation as an argument against immigration. Robots doing unskilled labor means no more need for Paco and friends to hop the border.

>>133068707
nothing

>>133069762

>Then why the fuck will anyone work?

Access to luxury items, status, etc. Even if UBI works, we still couldn't possibly afford give everyone a comfy middle-class lifestyle.

>It seems to me like the only real option for developed countries in the heavily automated world we are rapidly approaching
We can worry about solving that problem when its actually a problem.

>People say it's not a political reality in America at this time, and I agree, things are still pretty comfortable right now.
Its neither politically feasible, nor economically feasible, nor remotely necessary, so why are people even talking about? Oh right, people want more gibs.

>Some people say innovation will save us from a jobless future, this does not seem to be likely as new high tech innovative industries are not creating nearly as many jobs as they are destroying (think Netflix vs Blockbuster). This is different than previously in history when automation and greater technology would actually lead to more jobs being created.
Hurr durr doom and gloom technology and automation are gunna tuuk r jobs. Get real. There's an astronomical amount of work to do before everything is automated and requires little to no intervention. The world will still have jobs for the foreseeable future.

>Others say education will save us, but we don't pay workers based on the value they create anymore, productivity has entirely delinked from wages.
Libtard shill detected. No, your shitty burger flipping job doesn't create $15/hour worth of value, and it never will. Jobs can never sustainably pay more than the value they create, and they never will.

>The only thing that matters is the scarcity of the workers skills.
Welcome to rudimentary economics. Gold is worth more than rocks, because I can't just walk outside and find millions of pieces of gold sitting in my driveway.

Why is this topic coming up all day all of the sudden? Must be the fucking shills again.

>>133069313
You mean K selected.

>>133068707
nothing stupid

>>133071165
Why should someone who doesn't contribute to society even be allowed to live? If we get automation, why not just cull the population down to the people who are smart? It would be exactly the same as having all the people just doing drugs and fucking, but the quality of life would be better and the smart people could pursue meaningful things instead of trying to keep the idiots alive.

>>133070793
Finally someone sane in this thread. we should just purge everyone who can't compete with the robots to produce anything valuable. If you can't contribute to society then you deserve to die.

>>133071654
Yup that too, many people who dont work hard enough can't get out of it, it's almost like the system is designed to lull them into it and prevent them from rising out of it.

>>133071963
you w0t m8

Masturbate, play video games, and shitpost like the rest of the neets on pol.

>>133071645
that's the kick in the head, isn't it

I can see ubi working in a all white society or an all asian society. But in a society with africans or Hispanics? That is where the dream starts to falls apart.

>>133071696
Whoa, whoa. Its like, I'm doing work and then using the results of that work to get the necessary things to live.

What if, like, we could all do different jobs and earn "points" for every hour we work, and then use those points to get goods and services from other people who have different jobs?? We would all have an incentive to specialize to earn more "points" when we work, and our points would be part of a system so that other people would get points for their work from US!

This idea makes way more sense than stupid old Capitalism, I learned about this in my first semester of college.

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>>133068707
This is communism mate.
Fuck that.
I will never surrender myself to the gov for a few shekels.
And I really hope everyone around me won't become a government drone.

>>133071891
Don't tell the globalist ruiners that. They'll just point out that you hate diversity because you don't want to eliminate white people.

>>133071670
>was tested and bore that out.

Sauce? Every NIC experiment I've read about worked out well, though they were all small scale.

I'm not sure if the welfare queen argument makes sense here (are we talking about two different things?) because NIC is basically a more efficient welfare system without the incentive to stay unemployed to prevent losing out on welfare benefits.

This is completely possible. If robots do everything including create themselves and maintain themselves, while creating everything we need and taking care of us.. Which is a hell of a jump in technology as robots now are barely able to walk. Then yes the world will be like nonstop highschool. We would be as productive as we were in highschool.

Masturbate, play videogames, and shitpost like the rest of the neets on pol.

>>133071073
>The point is to raise the minimum spending power from 0 to x
Exactly. If you have so many people that cannot work because of general health issues or "poor education" but, are good law abiding citizen, why don't give them enough to live a decent live.
I mean, here in germany we have already a big welfare system but, by law, it sole existence and some of it's procedures breaks a few laws. The thing is that with our current system, they give money to anyone. Criminals, junkies and immigrants that have worked for a year and then go into endless unemployment etc... making them bound to the jobcenter and also a dead weight to it.
Since i too am "unemployed" i have seen the inner works of this institution and to be quite honest, it wastes so much money on senseless bs it's revolting. UBI would be much cheaper for this country.

>>133071082
Would you not accept free money?

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>>133071975
>scientists should be given basic income
word

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>>133071989
Who would design something like that?

>>133068707
you really think the elites won't just use their wealth and automation to automate an army to kill the useless no-jobbers? why would they pay us to do nothing?

>>133070894
implementing that fucking bureaucracy would probably cost more than just giving it to everyone

>>133071779
>a basic income is a form of social security in which all citizens or residents of a country receive a regular, unconditional sum of money, either from a government or some other public institution, independent of any other income.

That literally describes the Alaska Permanent Fund

>>133070850
...or they'll just vote for whichever party wants to increase the UBI by taxing the productive citizens more

>>133071975
Well if there was a UBI there would have to be a catch. Like i think Zuckerburg wants to pay people to play in his virtual dreamworld. Or they would hook your brain up to a global network so everyone is on the same server.
>>133072312
Well elites do like people to control and play with. Thats basically society now if you hadnt noticed.

>>133072312
So that we spend on their products.

Our economy is less about production than it is about making the money flow properly, for a lot of kind of fucked up reasons.

>>133072376
basic income is like $20,000 a year, enough to provide for a minimum level of cost of living

Jew scheme to crash this plane with no survivors.

>>133068707
Seems great until you realize libshits want open borders, and black people exist.

>>133072461
And where does that money come from? What is being done to generate that kind of value? Why not just get people $20,000 a year jobs so that they aren't relying on the government for when the pot of money eventually dries up? They also would be in control of their own labor and could work more or less to make more or less money if they so choose.

>>133068707

Companies will always want to retain talent. The key to low unemployment in any environment is education.

>>133068707
Read a real economics book for once in your life. Economics in One Lesson is a great place to start, you can get it for free all over the Internet.

>>133068707
I'd put it into bitcoins because any currency under UBI will loose all value.

>>133072154
You're literally ignoring the whole point.

>>133071299

It's not extreme socialism for the fun of it. It's mass unemployment caused by machines to the point where entire sections of people don't have any jobs.

>UBI starts
>Keep having kids untill the UBI stops paying extra per kid
>more babies of all kinds (maybe whites stay at 56%???)
>massive over population
>Can only afford to live with UBI
>bankrupt sate
>millions die

>>133068707
UBI will lead us to the society in the movie "The Idiocracy" Most people will become braindead consumers, spending their gibs on mcdonalds, coca cola, beer, porn and xbox, sitting at home in their recliners watching TV that is 100% advertisements and propaganda. It is the jewish endgame.

>>133071327
This is exactly what would happen to all basic necessities. Their prices would go up to what the market could bear. Literally just creating inflation and ruining investments

>>133072627
>And where does that money come from?
that's the question that everyone asks but nobody knows the answer to. it's probably an impossible solution to a problem.

>>133072716
>falls for cryptofiat meme

>>133072322
Yeah, but money is not really a problem. It surely ain't gonna work if you're stingy.

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>>133072783
>Implying it already isn't
Anon, pu-lease.

>>133071138
>New business opportunities will arise to serve the needs of people in the age of UBI, not all of them will be automation dependent, there will be a lot of social work and art.
>Employability is not the only reason people go to school and I think we will see and change in how education is viewed in the age of UBI.
>Yeah, I agree, rentism will be a problem. A lot of people will move to cheaper areas.
>People are naturally driven to create, and so they will. What people are capable of creating is not limited to what is imminently economically valuable.
But if you want to drink and play MMOs all day, you are free to do so. You won't be as happy as those who are doing interesting work of their choosing and creating interesting new things, but hey it's your life.

>>133068707
>Give me your thoughts on this.

I can't claim to be knowledgeable about the intricacies of it but I have to work, it's how I'm wired. I enjoy working on something and then seeing the paycheck I get because my work was valuable to others. It seems to me that in order for someone else to make an income without working you would have to take away some of the income from those who are working. From my perspective getting less from a job means that the value of my work is not as high even if I was selling my labor at a premium and some rotten rat stole it after the fact. This would cause me to do more work for myself rather than for others, and since I don't have to pay myself the income for those rats who are not working shrinks by at least my contribution, not to mention the contribution of others who were getting my money before but aren't now are not because I have opted away from income and toward subsistence.

In short I don't see how it is sustainable in the long run.

>>133072571
if god existed there would be only white people.

>>133072786
It happened in Australia when the government was giving out a first homebuyers grant. The price of houses went up by the amount they gov was giving out overnight.

>>133071167
The answer to that question should be simple: Live.

I think that UBI at the bare minimum is an idea that deserves to be studied and not just swatted down. But it seems like when you factor for how many jobs are getting wiped out by automation we're heading in a trajectory where it's going to be necessary, and not a choice.

>>133072786
I agree, UBI cant work alongside capitalism because it would all end up going to the owners of the goods and property in the end.
Solution: Universal price control
But then we have regressed into communistic totalitarian state

>>133071270
If it no longer makes sense to pay humans to do things because robots can do everything for better and cheaper, then the concept of earning a living will have to become obsolete. The question then is what do you do? Three options: 1. communism, 2. a UBI, 3. a purge.

>>133072437
Wrong. The 'elites' hire people and make products to sell to get the money of people to become even wealthier. You can't become wealthier if you are the one producing shit and everyone is taking from you. At best it would be 0 sum and why go through the effort of maintaining a company when you can stay just as wealthy otherwise? They care about the flow of money if it has positive numbers for themselves.

>>133068707
Education as it is in America today is a pointless waste of money. People need to teach kids how to start and grow a company.

>>133073025
Price controls haven't worked well for Venezuelans

>>133072461
UBI can actually come in a lot of various forms. Its just a set amount given indiscriminately and unconditionally. In theory its argued to solve poverty by offering a minimum amount to live on.

>>133072627
>>133072790
Think of the job you do (or if you don't have a job think of other people's jobs). If a software or physical robot can do those jobs, and the cost to the business to use these things is one tenth of the cost of hiring a real person, then that person who was layed off could be given 9/10ths of what they were being payed.
Obviously the whole thing is a meme to get you to willingly surrender more things to the state and become less in control of your own future.

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>>133068707
>What would you do if your income was taken care of?
Why don't we ask these fine folks?

>>133071554
This. You can't expect wages to go up just because the population is more educated.
More money gets funneled up as people get more educated because smart people eliminate the need for employees with robots and automatic systems.
If you were to make a computer program that automatically processes all your business expensiveness as you use your business credit card you would eliminate the need for accountants.
The computer would report any unusual purchases or transactions and everything would have to go through the computer.

>>133068707
I enjoy work. I like feeling productive. I like feeling like I'm contributing to something. I don't want to get paid for just fucking existing.

Personally if we must do UBI, I'd rather not do it with money. Our automation is producing goods, so exchange goods for services. Make people work for shit, like cleaning up disgusting cities like LA

>>133072786
so we need different levels of UBI?

>>133073093
>conveniently ignores what becomes of the money supply

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>>133073093
>muh robots
It's literally a fantasy that is only real in your mind.

>>133070850
>Grow up getting free money for nothing
>zero work experience
>Probably figured out many ways to scam the system for extra gibs
>selling drugs and mugging people make s you money
>jobs are so scarce that people are given money just to not starve to death
>Employers looking for super motivated and educated people in a sea of lazy neets

>Somehow these people will start working.
>Not just blowing all their money on stupid shit and cry for more

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Communism, the thread.

Who pays the taxes necessary to provide the UBI monthly payments?

>>133071228
I smonked weed once and I turned into a meme

>>133073291
japan looks so clean because they hire a ton of people to pick up trash and clean the place. we couldnt do that here because people would scream that their tax dollars were being wasted.

>>133069140
>Regulate and restrict automation
Remember the movie interstellar?
Do you really want to be the guy who sows and reaps the crops or would you rather have an automatic tractor that does it?
Do you want to be the guy who's one job is to screws on lug nuts on the front right tire of cars and trucks in an assembly line or would you rather have a robotic arm do it?

>>133071270
There would still be roughly 30% employment excluding new jobs which rise out of the UBI society. There would still be trade so there would still be an economy. Companies would still make money which could be taxed and people would still be paid wages which could be taxed.

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>>133068707
>What would I do if my income were taken care of?
Stop working and become a drain on society most likely

Why the hell do you people this type of thing would work out well?

>>133068707
Civilization has always been built on the backs of slaves.
Robots are just the new slaves, or would you rather be.
At least slaves have a purpose and a reason to keep them around.
Do you?

>>133068707
As long as policing and soldiering are not automated I'll probably keep doing those things. I don't like the idea of handouts, or of idle people. I imagine we'll just have better and more distributed birth control so population will fit labor.

>>133071167
The answer should be obvious: cull the 27 men who can't contribute. They deserve nothing but death.

>>133073290
this, if you've ever talked to someone who dole bludges (games the benefit system)
they're all drug addicts or extremely lazy human trash.

I seriously think Universal income is a mistake but I do believe something like 'living wage' being introduced could help

>>133073417
The government will tax the corporations based on use of automation. Surely nothing can go wrong here

>>133071975
what about when humans are obsolete, and a computer program can do your STEM job, shall we kill you too?

>>133068707
If we had a very small population and everyone was relatively competent amd employed UBI would be fine.

The vast majority of the US is neither of those.

>>133068801
5) Libertarianism: leave me the fuck alone and let the free market lower the cost of goods to the point that I have nothing to do but argue about roads all day

Everyone of those points are authoritarian bullshit and Capitalism doesn't even belong there, it's not a political ideology.

>>133073507
>There would still be roughly 30% employment excluding new jobs which rise out of the UBI society.

Where are you getting this from? How would new jobs be created from a ubi society?

Not dismissing you just curious about your source

>>133072904
I pirate my videos and movies because I can't stand advertisements.
The only thing good about advertisements is that I can get up and use the restroom or get something to eat without having to upset my family because they have to pause it.

>>133068810
This. I just roughly did 30 grand times 300 million. That's 12 trillion fucking dollars.

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>>133068937

>>133073111
Trips don't lie, but, no, economics is not zero sum. People ("elites") are always trying to make it zero sum and this is called rent-seeking behavior.

>>133071327
Well if your rental home is in a highly desired area this strategy would pay off. However, if it were in a less desirable area then people will not be willing to shell out that much for your rental. You'll be competing with a lot of other renters. This is why we would see a lot of people migrating across the country to cheaper areas.

>>133068707

Who paid for that giant advertisement? Where did it come from? That is questionable shit.

>>133073025
Money has no inherit value even if you price control. Now why would a governing body give you free time just for existing? They wont. Theres always a catch. For Alaska its oil revenue for a technocracy its slavery or death.

When are we going to have universal basic sex? Everybody should get some sex, just enough to get by everyday. Those who want more can go out and work and sweat for it.

>>133073703
Sure, the human race can be proud of creating something that has surpassed them.

>>133068707
Being realistic, the most likely scenario is a Mad Max future where everything falls apart and the wealthy realize they're slaves to the system too late for it to matter when they realize that post-financial-collapse they have no power, wealth, or influence. Water crisis. Rampant brutality. Culling. Raiding. Raping. Cannibalism.

Ideally we move into a future where we restructure cities and build to the heavens in a paradise made possible by fusion energy and advanced robotics. Skyscraper farms, masterworks of modern construction. Gleaming, glorious metropolises from your wildest dreams. Every human being a king, educated and provided for. Brought up to take part in the grandness of a humanity set to conquer the stars.

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>>133073916
>Confusing sex and food

alright

first take all the EBT, all the section 8, all the medicaid, medicare, all the free handouts already given out, and add it up

then divide it equally amongst the entire US population

now THAT would work. Bill gates would even get his check to wipe his ass with

all the freeloaders would suddenly realize what it feels like to have others taking away part of your money

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>>133073916
This is the only correct answer

>>133071517
i guess you sell personally to china

>>133071580
UBI is the exact opposite of communism. I'm going to assume you are joking here.

>>133074005
Canada, you guys legalized dog fucking so don't lecture me about what sex is. Ok?

>>133071327
I would move into a van and save up until I could buy property.

The problem with UBI is twofold.
#1. It normalizes an end for society inwhich all the power (control over distribution of money) ends up being concentrated into a small number of hands.
#2. Money is just fucking money. You can't eat money. You can't wear money. You can't live in money. There's no such thing as free shit. To feed, clothe and house those who can't or won't work for it everybody else must ultimately be made to make food, clothing and housing that they themselves will not benefit from.

>>133068707
>UBI
>Not pants on head retarded

i would smoke insane amounts of weed and contribute to absolutely nothing.

i would quit my 6 figure maintenance job and just bum it. Why the fuck would i work if i could just get paid for doing nothing?

>>133068707
watch anime every day and play video games and masturbate,k then eventually kill myself after I raise kids and they move out. Why give a fuck about anything?

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>>133073916
>implying this would work out just swell

>>133070379
A smart and educated population will spend less money. Why would I stay here when I could pay less in taxes and make more in sales elsewhere?

>give people free shit with the hopes that they'll have time to enrich the world
>not just paying people to enrich the world

Also
>all your money is given to you via allowance by rich Jews
>proletariat literally have 0 power since they can't strike anymore
>Jews tell you what you do if you want the allowance
>dance monkey, dance!

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>>133068707
nature follows the past of least resistance.

The only reason anyone is trying to advocate legislation for universal basic income is so they can sink even further in to degeneracy than they already have.

>>133073916
"Universal basic sex" already exists.

It's called prison.

>>133071272
UBI is the welfare overhaul.

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>>133068707
1000$/month is nothing.
5000$/month would be unfair to those still working


May God forgive whoever has to put this system in place.

You are all unfair, there is so many trillions of dollars evywhere but only in the hands of few white people.
If we would try then everybody would be happy and we would need no wars.
So don't laugh, it has never been tried.

>>133068707

Here's the thing.

Machines break. Need installation and maintenance. Power. Etc.

There will be a MAD market for people to build, troubleshoot, and repair these machines.

>b-bu but how can human labor even compare

Shut the fuck up.

At the point that human labor can't compete with automated production is PRECISELY the point where the need for human labor shines.

Let's say LOT#11278 goes down. The company is now losing literally THOUSANDS of equivalent man hours of lost productivity for every day that machine remains broken and not in proper working order.

So your fixer technician jobs are now highly in demand and lucrative.

TL;DR the sky isn't falling and saying we'll need UBI is telling everyone you have no idea how markets work.

>>133074319
$5600/y is considered a living salary in the US.

>>133069707

automizing people's jobs takes away what little social leverage they have.

>>133074373
Again thats not how money works. Once that wealth is in the hands of many we crash and burn.

>>133073784
You are telling people producing stuff to give their money to people not producing stuff. Economy isn't zero sum and is in fact in positive numbers because the money flows from producer to producer as they seem fit to increase wealth but wealth is not increased at all by people who don't produce and just leech. In this case, it would *at best* be at a balance between wealth loss and gain (0 sum) but obviously would be a loss more likely than not. Wealth wouldn't be created at a higher rate than it is consumed in a society with UBI. You cannot take money away from producers and give it to pure consumers on such a large scale and expect wealth to go up.

>>133074130
Yea and with a UBI I would at least have a way to earn some money. One day they're going to realize that I contribute no value to my company or they'll just cut the whole department. I'm too dumb for coding and too ugly for prostitution so idk what I will do except become homeless

>>133074319
You can live off of $1000 a month. Rent in a shitty run down three bedroom apartment sharing a room with 2 others would only cost you around $150 a month. You can eat rice and beans for around a dollar a day, $30 a month. You now have 820$ spare change to blow on drugs and video games every month

>>133069948
>Automation will not over throw the working class.

It already is removing a lot of white collar jobs from the market like certain actuarial functions that can be substituted by a program

>>133073875
>. For Alaska its oil revenue for a technocracy its slavery or death.
Why?

>>133068707
So basically welfare for everyone. As someone who thinks welfare recipients should be sterilized, and their children removed from the home...I am against a UBI or any kind of communism. The only think that works is totally unrestricted capitalism with a small government bending to the will of the market.

Helicopter cash that inflates the economy to the point where it's completely ineffective because business would just adjust pricing relative to its value.

In a capitalistic society money depends on value, value comes from work, not from handouts.

>>133068801
>1) Fascism: retraining programs and mass conscription to give people work and purpose
Sold. It's needed, desperately.

>>133074630
Problem is that many wouldn't do that and spend it on iPhones and big screen tv's.

>>133074410
>MUH TECH JOBS
This is literally the most retarded argument ever. The point of automation is to save on labour costs. There's lots of automation technology already available not being applied yet for precisely this reason. Except that every year more of it reaches a level of refinement where it becomes significantly cheaper than the human cost to maintain and operate it. If it costs less money than an internal payroll to operate the machines then there is less money going out to support tech jobs in the first place.
This is why you are a retard
This is why people like you should just fucking stop breathing to save air for themselves.

>>133068707
I make a good living, I have no debt save for retirement and investing, have some toys, I'm solid middle class and I'm super happy.

I also suffer from serious depression issues and sometimes suicidal. At my lowest I've been told, give up, get on SSDI. Just live on welfare.

Fuck that. I'm hungry, some days I stop working and hate life, but I want more.

If my income was covered. I'd be back to lowest tier and having some self worth helps. So you know what I'd do if my bills were covered? I'd get the highest paying job I can.

Then what? How will you punish me? There's no way UBI can't punish those who work and I mean aside the massive tax needed. Stuff like UBI is a dream for now and many years, unless you want race car drivers, brain surgeons and actors to make less than someone cleaning a toilet.

>>133074484
How can you know this? If I had the money I would spend it and it would be good for economy.
I would buy nice clothes and shoes, a nice car, maybe buy something nice for my children.
The money would be moving around more instead of sitting in some bank account!

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>>133073482
people there don't even think to litter in the first place.

>>133074636
Human existence isnt worth someone elses time. UBI would work for the short term like say if you got sterilized for it then they would cull the population to balance birth rates to skill set.

>>133073744
Even if you pirate movies, you are still watching "propaganda". If you think Ads are the only """brainwashing""" method then you still need to enter the rabbithole, mate.

>>133074134
>#1. It normalizes an end for society inwhich all the power (control over distribution of money) ends up being concentrated into a small number of hands.
Because right now, the state could not decide to fuck us all over and get money out of the street, amirite?
>#2. Money is just fucking money. You can't eat money. You can't wear money. You can't live in money. There's no such thing as free shit. To feed, clothe and house those who can't or won't work for it everybody else must ultimately be made to make food, clothing and housing that they themselves will not benefit from.
So, if you want to keep the current economy working, even if it means "cheating", you adapt the system to serve your people, not viceversa.

>>133074217
>Is afraid of the jew
>still thinks UBI over the current system is a bad idea

>>133074609
Well, most of the people who defend their oh so dear "capitalism" think that by the rule of the "survival of the fittest" they will become rich and people like you should just die off.
It's pretty sad that these people worship a failing system that only benefits the "elite" they so much hate.

It can work but we need another world war to kill off a few billion people first.

In all honesty Automation on that kinda scale where you have to implement UBI probably won't happen for a very long time. Not in our life times at least.

>>133074837
The money is meaningless (and worthless) without the productivity that backs the money.

>>133074319
>unfair to those working
no you idiot, everyone gets it. you work if you want more

>>133074884
>muh politicians serve the people
How's that working out for you Hans? How about I report you for posting on this eebil neonazi website. Let's see how well your government serves you then.

>>133069689
I think you mean
>Civic nationalism: there is UBI, except you (white people) are the largest demographic by a large margin still in the work force and most of your income is distributed to the system which minorities use as a crutch and not a way to lift themselves up.
If you're going by that definition of CivNat, that is.

>>133074989
Yea, work to cover the massive amount the government has to steal from you to redistribute.

>>133075082
What about taxing the machines as if they were real people?

>>133072094
This.

>>133068707
Test this in Iceland first.

>>133074813

>my argument relies upon the machines coming out of the ground and making and maintaining the machines

Cool story bro. You will always need a prime mover when it comes to finding new solutions or ways to find a spectrum of new solutions and craftsmen and technicians to create and experiment with the first prototypes that began life on a chalkboard.

You're just mad because this will be the rise and return of the "blue collar" work force that has started dying out.

How did you think humanity felt when the blacksmiths saw the first industrial iron forge?

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>>133074410
>There will be a MAD market for people to build, troubleshoot, and repair these machines.

What about other machines that fix or replace broken machines or ones that have self diagnostic capabilities/backup functionality?

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>>133075043
>Implying i'm not already being monitored
Also, you illiterate piece of shit, you really could need a few more lessons on how to read.
But, anyway, why so butthurt, mate? Touched a nerve? Do you feel intellectually inferior all of a sudden?

>>133068707

I think in the face of automation modern nations should embrace declining birth rates. Close borders and freeze all but specialized needs for immigration.

As the population shrinks the need to automate becomes necessity not disruptive.

Universal income should not be utilized. It creates a dependency on the state. People should thrive for independence from the state.

Automation should be embraced to relieve the need for capatilism. It should be utilized to create sufficiently independent households/family units that produce their own needs and requirements.

Capatilist ventures should be encouraged to promote growth of sectors outside the realm of automated self reliance.

Quite simply nations embrace automation to create a self reliance and independence outside the state.

Capitalism should be the driving force for people who want more while simultaneously not being the only system for which people can live.

UBI is never going to happen.
Money is an abstract thing.
It used to serve as a motivator for production and allowing people to pursue self-interest in the process.
The shekel-worshiping kikes ruined it all though. You people's retarded belief that money has any intrinsic value is a product of your goy training. They care only about their bank balance. They lack the level of moral agency to care for how all their scheming and market speculation effect the fundamentals behind the money itself.

>>133075343

And how do you know those self tests or BITE are working properly?

What do you do when the alarm code comes in and you are now in repair?

What if the fault exists for which there exists no backup or the failure is the result of several faults gone undetected/unrepaired?

There exists no world where the outcome of enhanced automation is that human endeavor becomes less meaningful.

Automation only enhances and multiplies the productivity of human work.

>>133075337
For starters because integrated circuits don't do a whole lot of moving the vast majority of machine repair is mechanical. It's not uncommon for large operations with machinery that replaces the need for hundreds of labourers to have a single equipment mechanic on site. You are literally retarded... like absolutely literally, you would have to be the biggest retard on the planet if you unironically believe that there's going to be 100 technicians operating an automated production line that replaces 100 jobs. You have to be completely fucking retarded. And even designing it doesn't require 100 people. The only job sector that has grown significantly in the west has been the fucking service sector. Even your faggy white collar work isn't safe. In fact it's less safe. Computers have reached the point where they are starting to make decisions now. And many of those decisions are better than the ones humans make. So it's the opposite way around. You stupid retarded faggots should learn how to flip burgers. (although that's going to be automatic soon too). The only reason it hasn't happened yet is because frozen hamburgers stick together and it requires a lot of dexterity to pry them apart.

>>133068707
I don't know why so many on this website assume people would become complete degenerates with such a system.
You might as well ask if free time is a good thing.

What do rich people with enough money do now?

>>133075984
>What do rich people with enough money do now?
Degenerate activities.

>>133075984
Because the majority of people will be lazy if allowed to be, especially niggers. Why work if you don't have to?

>>133075185
What would these robots be creating exactly? The problem is always exponential growth(birth rates) and the devaluing of the human being. Its already going on today bub. In a robot world they probably chop up babies and distribute them to the elite for longer life. Is that how you want this world to be? Humans living as cattle in a dystopian future lorded over by a select few?

>>133076165
If a self driving truck takes a job from a truck driver should the truck pay taxes?

>>133076325
Why even have the truck at that point? If we get to a point where all of the money (and thus access to all of the world's resources) are concentrated into a small number of hands why even bother having the truck? The truck is just carrying consumer goods for the consumers. But why have consumers if you get to a point where you don't need them anymore?

>>133075984
>You might as well ask if free time is a good thing.
How dare you take (((free time)))? Why are you not working right now, comr--- i mean, fellow worker? You should work so you can contribute to our society by growing money trees out of nothing because that's how the economy works.

>What do rich people with enough money do now?
They pay us to earn money for them so they can live life to the fullest.

>>133076158
So, why are we still giving those people free money? Free money should only go to good, law abiding citizens.

>>133068707
A man named Guy Standing has written a fair bit about this concept.
He's an economist that teaches in London and New Zealand.

>>133076325
No as the truck driver is now obsolete. Like i said the robot future can only happen with population downsize or Dystopia.

>>133076444
There is no such thing as free money. The government has NO right stealing money from people to give to those who refuse to work. Welfare, social security, SSI, all need to go.

>>133076513
Most of the population just becomes obsolete.

>>133068707
I would be fine with UBI as long as it was a replacement for welfare. I think our welfare system is a complete joke.
One thing I disagree with a lot of people who are pushing for this says it frees people up to try new things. They say more people will start up companies and put more risk on the table knowing there is a safety net. I disagree with that. I think people will just spend more time smoking weed and playing video games.
I am all for the government giving me $1000/month.

>>133076513
>>133076442
So the real question is how long does it take before the elite try and kill us all.

>>133076693
Why should the government take from me to give to you?

>>133076717
As soon as it's cheaper to automate all of production than it is to import 3rd worlders and crash the job market.

>>133076325
It is called corporate tax.

You'd have to raise it, since that worker they replaced is now on welfare.

>>133075900

>majority of machine repair is mechanical?

And?

Are you saying that technicians only swap circuit cards and run a self check then button the equipment up?

>they tuk err jerbz

We are going to have to adapt. Humanity didn't devolve into Mega City 1 when the transistor radio, the electric light, and the internal combustion engine were first made.

>computers are starting to think

Computers do what they are programmed and designed to do. I think you like to pretend that every factory is filled with sentient android T-1000 that effectively provide the broad scope dexterity and ability of humans while exercising no autonomy....except in cases where it's convenient for your argument.

UBI is dumb and will always be impractical because scarcity will ALWAYS be a thing.

I'd learn Hebrew and study the Dead Sea scrolls

>>133075745
Why would it not be working properly?

Why would it be hard for any modularized system to be repaired by another machine?

Why would a fault exist where there is no backup?

Answering questions with questions is fun and I don't even have to think of the consequences for my proposal.

Thank god the automated distribution technology spreads my meaningful shitposting thus enhancing it by multiplying the number of people who see it. You're right!

>>133076607
You still think that money is your right and you demand control over it. Aw, that's just adorable.
So, if the gov has no right to give "your" money as welfare, why has it been doing it for years?

Anon, money has no real value. Economy is a just a worldwide hyperbolic monopoly game.
If you control the money, you can cheat the game how you want.
So to speak, the gov could just take your money, give it to an homless person and flip you off. And you could not even have a say in it.

>>133076828
Let's just hope they prefer their cities with people in them.

>muh automation

If your job can be automated, kys

>>133077070
When the government does that, the people have the right to rise up and replace the government. Fuck the bottom feeders. They could die for all I care.

>>133076717
They wont kill us they will let us die out. Look at the southern united states. That or send us into a war so nobody is the wiser.
>>133076828
I dont know. I think they are importing 3rd worlders to speed up our demise as they are getting impatient. Like really theres no excuse to be accepting immigrants into the EU like they are. Once those migrants have 10 kids on welfare LOL the eu is just done.

>>133076915
Your head is so far up your ass, spewing out shitty strawman arguments that I'm just going to call you a faggot and move on.

>>133077070
>might makes right
We shall meet in the field of battle.

>>133071862
This. UBI and other similar schemes will just create runaway inflation. The elites are pushing this upon us because they own all the assets.

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>>133077139
So, for example, should you due to some unfortunate series of events, end up on the bottom, should we let you die or give you another chance?
>They could die for all I care.
Oh, that's your answer then.

>>133077256
Shut up, kid.

>>133077033

Because machines wear out and break. Wiring gets heated and insulation breaks down. Mechanical wear and corrosion of parts, breakdown of gasketed surfaces, and replacement of filters and lubricants.
Heat damage or obstructions, loss of power.

>repaired by another machine

So you built a machine to troubleshoot the machine? Great. Who troubleshoots your specialized troubleshooting machine?

Unless we do an infinite regression where machines build themselves out of the ground from nothing requiring no maintenance.

>fault exist where there's no backup

You have either created a needlessly complex machine with redundant backups for redundant backups every where OR you prioritize high wear or stress areas or areas of criticality and the fault can exist outside of that.

The problem isn't automation. It's that you want to justify your current NEAT status thinking that autism bux are the way of the future and you're not lazy. You're a prescient ahead of the curve.

>>133073492
Look. Robots make the lower and unskilled working class obsolete. they're already becoming more and more unemployed as automation continues to replace low-skill labor. We're talking worldwide, billions, the majority of the population, not being relevant, being unemployed, and living in poverty. This is a mistake, because one of these things will happen.

1. Brutal, blood soaked worldwide revolution beyond your wildest nightmares, we're talking shit that makes the Haitian revolution blush, and the French Reign of Terror pee in its pants out of fear. This is an apocalypse situation, and the only thing that will emerge from this is either pure, unadulterated communism, or otherwise complete and total chaos, setting our society back thousands of years from the destruction of technology, the burning and destruction of information, and total, every man for himself anarchy devoid of any order bigger than a family, tribe or clan.

2. An entire useless and brainwashed caste fed off of meager welfare, controlled by propaganda and pornography. Proles from Orwell's 1984.

3. Genocide

4. A society where eventually all human labor is obsolete and our society becomes so decadent, weak, unconcerned, and oblivious that a small group of fringe terrorists who despise modern humanity nukes us back to the stone age.

5. Humanity itself becomes obsolete after the singularity is created, the machines take over the world.

UBI is just a gateway to lazy people stealing from the productive.

its funny how its greedy to want to keep your money but you arent greedy if you want to take it from other people

>>133077168

>strawmen arguments

If by that you mean "what is my current job and business is booming" then yes.

Strawmen all day erry day.

>>133077371
You see that won't happen since I have the knowledge and skills to rebound. The homeless and chronically poor are damaged and mentally challenged individuals. I think they should be kept from breeding.

>>133072627
No one seems to understand that the money wouldn't "come" from anywhere - it would be printed out of thin air. Our currency would be devalued and hyperinflation would set in.

>>133068707
1) Use muh gubbamintz gibz to hire actors and crews to make films/videos.
2) Invest free money in distillation equipment and sell booze.
3) Find a low cost place to live and save my money.

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The future looks interesting that's for sure.

>>133077563
Oh, sure, you can rise up but, what if you can't or are not allowed to?
How do you think most people became homeless? Because they wanted to?
Anon, confidence is good but arrogance is the weakest of shields.

>>133068707

At the end of the day, the women will want to fuck the best producers or men of the highest status.

Thus men will create means to compete with each other to demonstrate that caste system at women's demand.

And there will be a novel mathematical unit to make it most direct and convenient for women to compare the efforts and ability of the men they choose, designed by men.

The capitalist system is going nowhere. The only question is. How will you rise to meet the challenges the changing institution requires?

>>133074837
t. price of goods go up to what market can bear
t. you've created inflation and now more people are struggling

>>133069949
It won't be the government, it will be facebook/amazon/google doling out their version of a crytpo currency that you can spend at their partner sites.

Don't try to create an exchange for these cryptos either, they'll just cut you off.

>>133076717
They are already trying - see the never ending Russia rhetoric. They want to start a war in Syria that snowballs into WWIII so they can ship all of the proletariat to the Middle East to die.

>>133068707
>people no longer have to work for shelter, and food
what is the point in living then?

>everyone is jobless because robots took their jobs so we have to tax the people who own the robots so we can pay everyone to not do their job anymore
literally how retarded do you have to be to think this would ever work?

>>133078133

And the increase prices reflect a signal that this market is profitable with room to expand.

So large companies invest in personnel and infrastructure to meet market demand, supply goes up, and prices drop to meet the cost of production making people better off with more plentiful and cheaper goods.

Or has no one here taken an economics class and understand that price is a signal or indicator for people to make decisions on implementing the means of production?

Plebes. All of you.

>>133078299

Well, like God, you'd have to believe in the existence of a unmoved mechanical mover perfect in every fashion and incapable of being improved upon or replaced.

And then assume that a UBI will mean jack shit when the standard of living of a country is dependent on its production and money in and of itself is useless.

>>133070318

Maybe you are on to something. Yes, UBI is going to cause inflation. If you were on the poverty line before UBI, you will still be there.

What has been the driving motivation of central banks for the past several years? To drive inflation. They are terrified of a little deflation, because the enormous debt bubbles they have blown over the past decades will pop.

The entire asset pumping scheme the fed came up with post '08 was a failure. The wealth effect did not cause the rich to go out and spend more. Duh. The fed, or (((they))) want to open a tap of money to the lowest levels of the economy, knowing full well that it will do nobody but themselves any good.

it's pure fucking genius. Con the idiot sheeple into accepting a UBI and inflate away all the debts that exist on the books today.

>>133077109
kys
>http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2015/05/21/408234543/will-your-job-be-done-by-a-machine

>>133078262
To enjoy themselves?

Hell. This is complete propaganda. Democratic bribery. I'm hoping that was installed by a random activist group and not a government.

<Create automation for self reliance and independence. There won't be a need for universal income.

Solar power. Automated greenhouses to produce food. Automation of water processing and so on.

When the individual has automation to provide themselves with the necessitys to live. Universal income becomes a moot p

>>133068707
Automation is probably how they plan to acheive the goals of the Georgia guidestones. They will take away your jobs and let you die alone on the street.

>>133078721

>automation will make all work useless

But that's impractical and infeasible by any person with even the most cursory understanding of how goods start as raw materials and are delivered to the consumer-

SHUT UP AND SUPPORT AUTISM BUX GOYUM!

>>133078686
so then just be a junkie and overdose and die

>>133078985
Yea.

philanthropy will be much more powerful, something to think about

>>133069140
Found the communist

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>>133069140

>>133068707
>It seems to me like the only real option for developed countries in the heavily automated world we are rapidly approaching, other than communism
It isn't. Another (better) option is to give every citizen the right to a government job. That would be cheaper because most people wouldn't exercise that right (because they could make more money in the private sector) and the government would get something for its money.

>>133069195
Do you ever stop and think that maybe being edgy is in other words being childish?

>>133071963
No. It's R selected