National Capitalism General

As long as it's not ancap, fuck that retarded ideology.

>>132876164
cool

>>132876280
I hate to agree with a commie but this. LfCap>AnCap because Minarchism>Anarchism and that is because objective law>polycentric law

>>132876164
that would literally be the most autistic ideology ever

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>economy
Good.
>government power
Good as long as you allow private contractors to compete with the public sector on a for-profit basis.
>Christianity
Why?
>Islam and Judaism
Again, why?
>freedom
Good.
>lobbying
Good.
>immigration
Why? As long as we uphold a national Castle doctrine and abolish welfare, muhnorities shouldn't be a problem.

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>>132876164
Do you know that separation of church and state meant that the government would not pick a specific sect of Christianity to follow? You can't separate Christianity and the US government, but the US government cannot be solely Methodist, Anglican, Catholic, Protestant, Mormon, etc.

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>>132876164
So it's basically Mussolini's Italy, Franco's Spain and Pétain's France?
>>132876792
>le epik based muhnorities guyssss!! Loool
>>>>>>Reddit

>>132876745
And that is precisely why it's such a great idea.

>>132876570
Yeah, this ideology makes me happy. I hope it gains more traction.

>>132876745
That's a good thing.

>government power will be limited to killing off dissenters and generally whoever they wish
That doesn't seem like much of a limit.

NatSoc works within limited government, free market scenarios where a group of consenting individuals agree to work together in that manner. As long as they do not impose on any nonconsenting people and only take measures to defend against aggressors.

Capitalism cannot exist within NatSoc scenarios, however. The well intentioned but ultimate downfall of the economy is created not by the limited welfare of NatSoc nations (govt subsidizes for the very elderly is about the only welfare I would be anywhere near supporting), but the regulation and nationalization of corporations. This mixture of half of column A, half of column B leads to the engineering of a market which has historically never provided a healthy market, has always without fail provided inflation, and creates cracks in the govt infrastructure where markets need to be fluid but the govt cannot allow it for stability's sake.

>>132876985
>that flag
I didn't say that muhnorities were "based,"I simply said they wouldn't be a problem if they were starved of what makes their communities so shitty and we had the right to shoot them if they invaded our property.

>incorporating shitskin country's policy
>not realizing (((capitalism))) is the ultimate blue pill

Reminder that Objectivism is the only possible /final/ redpill.
Libertarianism is incomplete Objectivism. Objectivism without the epistemology.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erytcpYpzRk
Objectivism is Nationalist, Capitalist, Individualist, Egoist, Libertarian, Minarchist, and Meritocratic all rolled into one. Cultural Marxists are terrified of Ayn Rand as she represents the American Constution completed; a rejection of the Primordial evil that is Altruism that the US founding fathers lacked. Epistemologically validated, metaphysically defined, and ethically expanded, Objectivism is the greatest threat Commies have ever encountered which is why they cannot even bear to have it discussed as a philosophy.
The dreaded, horrible secret that academic philosophers face (and why they do not even allow the notion of Objectivism as a philosophy) is that Objectivism is not -a- Philosophy but THE Philosophy. Hers holds the particular distinction of being the first ever formulated META-Philosophy. And psudeo-intellectuals the world over are perpetually butthurt over this incontrovertible fact. Yes fact, I do not exaggerate. Including it among their other disaparate half formed, half actualized "philosophies", they find it eats everything it comes into contact with. This disrupts their vested interest in keeping a fanciful salad-esque collection of philosophies to catalog away and do nothing objectively meritous with it on their own terms. Despite what these sorts of people would have to say it isn't Ayn Rand but academia as it stands that is "the joke".

>National inherently internationaist system

>>132877216
They're inferior subhumans, you fucking retard. Minorities are a problem by merely existing and they should stay in their own shithole countries. The master race must destroy the slave races.

>>132876996
>>132877086
on a serious note. If you're already ok with government interference, why not provide basic welfare as well?

>>132877385
Wow, that's edgy.

>official state religion
>Separation of church and state
All ancaps are fucking retards.

>>132877305
Says the ideology literally built by Jews

>inb4 oy vey and backpeddling

Shoo shoo shlomo

>>132877359
In terms of immigration it's very nationalistic.

>>132876164

Its funny because only kids who have never had a job in their life and live off their parents shill for this type of shit. Why the hell would you want your boss to have the ability to make you his complete bitch?

>>132877537
>implying capitalism wasn't designed by British Jews

>>132877393
Because I don't like poverty shackles.

>>132877514
>edgy
Back to Faggdit. You are probably a subhuman yourself.

>>132876164
>((()))

>>132876164
>naming yourself after a term invented by a Jew, then adopted by Jews

lol

National Socialism is transcendent, economy is not central.
If you make it central, you're basically just a different form of liberal ideology.

But I guess ancaps don't care about anything that is traditional anyways, as they want trannies to adopt kids, farm weed and eat eachother's shit freely.
When you're already okay with that, ideologies that go beyond a one dimensional facade are out of your reach.

>>132877616
Capitalism is the very natural exchange of goods and services. I want you hooknoses out of my natural economic system.

Meanwhile, Bolshevism is LITERALLY the base wants of Jews given a political platform. You're either a kike or completely mislead, and either way, you have to go.

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Starting an ancap community:
Keynesians economists, democrats, communists, pedophiles, and leftists are humiliatingly executed on live tv every weekend.
Only whites and east asians.

Alright who wants in?

>>132876792
>Why? As long as we uphold a national Castle doctrine and abolish welfare, muhnorities shouldn't be a problem.
You absolute fucking retard, you live on land your ancestors died to maintain.
Why give literally everything away except the tiny bit you own, just to be consistent on autistic principles that aren't practical anyways?

Your grandchildren will likely grow up among niggers getting raped and beaten up in your utopia, and the very very best case scenario they live in a teeny tiny bit of a closed community whilst the rest of the land your blood was spilled for is given away to liberals adopting millions of niggers. You literal fucking cuckold, what the fuck is wrong with you?

>>132876164
This is retarded

>>132877809
>the natural exchange of goods
That occurred before capitalism existed and btw my flag is just irony. There isn't a flag for the anticapitalist Nietzschean views I have.

>>132877691
natsoc and lolbertarian both make logical sence.
this is just sadistic as a ideology and people would flee your country as fast as possible

>>132876164
>Pinochet's Chile.
Universal healthcare and ~50% of market being controlled by government? No thank you fuck off.

>>132878030
this

>>132877809
>Capitalism is the same thing as free enterprise in a fedual society
W r o n g

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Hitler's NatSoc Nationalism was a psuedo-Nationalism of the subjectivist Mystic variety Rand describes.
Nationalistic Mysticism is where the mystic collectivism of racial groups, economic classes, or the leftist parts of organized religion is replaced with the "Nation". True Nationalism lies in the affirmation of the societies that free men wish to craft and the self interest (isolationist if they choose) objective reality demands they live by. Objectivist NatCap Meritocracy is the only world a free man can live.
NatSoc is Soxialist first and psudeo-Nationalist second. Ayn Rand's criticism of it and Hitler in 'Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal' is irrefutable. As far as stereotypical kikes go, Hilter was far closer to a kike than Rand. Dumbfuck Hitler would have unwittingly paved the way for GloSoc if he had won so thank fuck he didn't. NatSoc is the maymay. The patently moronic notion that Nazi isn't leftist is Soros-tier counter narrative in work. Hitler was just a filthy statist socialist.
>B-but NatSoc is different
>muh Hitler indentified Socialism differently
And he didn't know what the fuck he was talking about. I don't give a shit how he thought his Soicalism was/should be; it matters what it actually IS.
Hitler beleived in massive public works programs, complete gun control, government control of the economy, and cradle to the grave benefits. NatSoc wasn't diametrically OPPOSED to Communism; it competed with it.

>inb4 hur (((Ayn Rand)) was a bitch
Reminder that all these smear attempts by commie, cyrpto-commie, and NatSoc shills of Ayn Rand are borne out of their gut wrenching realization that Objectivism is the greatest threat they have ever encountered which is why they cannot even bear to have it discussed as a philosophy. ALL of the adversaries she describes in her novels are EXACTLY what /pol/ describes as the sterotypical kike. Kikes exist but Rand is quite literally the most based jew to ever live. I do not exaggerate.

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>>132876164
>Economic and individual freedom
>lobbying banned.

oh im laffin.

>>132878261
This
>>132877809
Google Mercantilism numbnuts.

socialism causes us to self-destruct.
is it ancap without the retarded open borders nonsense?

>>132877802
Read Ayn Rand's "Capitalism: The Unkown Ideal" and try to tell me the Big Bang wasn't the thing that created Capitalism. Every OTHER economic system was created by man. Cowardly men.

>>132876985
>">>>Reddit"
>kekistan flag

take your own advice dipshit.

>>132877993
What constitutes as "white"?

>>132876792
>t.cuck

>>132878699
There's a thing called irony.

>>132878115
Sadistic? It's about preservation and freedom.
Inb4 muh poor darkies need their gibs.

>>132876164
So basically nationalism with some free trade policies of the people but heavily regulated when it comes to the outsiders.
That's cool but I fail to see how this is capitalism. Capitalism is always shilling for open borders and free movement of the capital because it makes the accumulation easier and the rich always want to pay their taxes in (((Luxembourg))) or other fake country set up solely for this reason.

>>132878597
Basically

>>132876164
Like the idea but it needs a better flag.
Perhaps combine the yellow from the Ancap flag and replace the black part with red from the NatSoc flag?
Having a pure yellow flag is kinda ugly, desu.

>>132878923
>of the people
should be for the people

>>132876164
Stop posting this flag, seriously.
Cringe

>>132878691
I'm not going to read a book by a Jew, I've heard the arguments anyways.

The point is that an economic system shouldn't be central. It's not important. It's only one of very many factors of a traditional state.
But as to what you were replying to, capitalism is a term invented by Jews, then other Jews adopted it to hoist money laundering as the highest virtue. It's a retarded name. Call it free enterprise, I don't care, it's just not important. Wealth is not important.

You're a coward for not standing up for something greater than yourself, for your highest ideal to be comfy & cummies.
It's not an ideology, it's basically some rational attempt to replace ideology with something inferior.

>>132878923
Economically open borders and immigration open borders are different concpets numbnuts.

>>132876164
what is wrong with national socialism?

>>132878927
fuck ay sign me up
where's the fucking flag option?

richard spencer is right
>they need us more than we need them
until he starts talking about economics and
>muh star exploration
and
>muh student loan debt

its complications from big gub/socialism is what got USA into the problems they face today.

capitalism is awesome, and we owe a debt to our (somewhat boring) puritan English/Dutch ancestors to giving us the philosophy of maximum freedom & productivity. we don't need a bunch of moslems or mexicans to be great again. we need borders and neighbors who respect the same values.

>>132879170
what is right with national socialism?

>>132878960
>aesthetics vs morality
but the faggots in the sales department aren't wrong. we need a sexier brand.

>>132876164
A jews paradise

its sad you dont realise

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>>132879049
How about the most anti-kike Jew to ever walk the face of the earth then stupid? Open to read one of her books?

Debate me.
>>132877349
>>132878317

>>132878699
I'm retaking the flag, dipshit.
>defending a BASED NIGGER LOVER IN A MAGA HAT
You go back too.

>>132879494
Jews always shill for communism.

>>132879170
Read >>132878317

>>132879668
true
another reason why Ayn Rand is awesome

>>132877385
Is this the new shill tactic you kikes adopted?

>>132879668
Some Jews shill for communism others for capitalism but no Jews shill for Fascism. Really makes me think.

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>>132879395
what is right with national socialism:
>Only ideology to have defeated a degenerate democratic society collapsing into chaos.
>Ideology not based on wealth
>Ideology that respects blood
>Ideology with a versatile economic systems that can adapt to changes, unlike ancap or commies
>Respects family values, provides everyone with work that can provide for their family but doesn't allow freeloaders
>The leader is more than man
>No Jewry
>A revival of myths, the creation of customs that have the grand ability to develop into true traditions
>initiation as part of government functions

What is wrong:
>Bases it's power on the people instead of basing it on powers above humanity.
>Uniforms and aesthetics way too cool, might attract people simply looking for that

I would like to see a Constitution and maybe then I'll sign on.

>implying billionaire capitalist care about the concept of nations

Do you think the likes of Bill Gates and the Koch brothers (aka capitalists) care about borders?

>>132879545
>first post starts with objectivism as the final redpill
ahahaha

no

Modernity's main problem is objectivity.
Also, myths are great.

>>132879668
Because communism is controlled position to jew capitalism, think about who is best off in a capitalist and communist system.

socialism (some types) is the only system ive seen which seems to piss off the jew

>>132876164
This just sounds like natsoc.

>>132880235
*opposition

>>132880127
That's why we have border guards and helicopters.

>>132880364
Uh, no sweetie. Border guards and helicopters won't stop billionaires from shipping their labor costs overseas.

>>132879903
fascism is unpopular with everyone except skinhead morons, they are smart enough not to go on the losing side and ake the best with what they've gt to enslave us.

I hope your not white because the fact you cant see that easily make me wonder if your dog typed that post

>>132880581
>implying Knut Hamsun was a skinhead moron
There is more to it than your strawman kikeshill

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>>132876164
What do you think about Pic related?
Kinda like it, even though I'd prefer Christian National Anarcho Capitalism. Also it would only be christian towards other white people and Asatru towards the shitskins.

>>132880538
There are ways to make it cheaper to stay in the country. Trump campaigned around such ideas.

If this isnt the best oxymoron I've seen.
So the state will be based on meritocracy, but no niggers of any kind allowed based on a collectivist racist principle. But hey, it's meritocratic as fuck y'all!

>>132880810
>BLACKED FLAG

>>132876164
It's called the GOP you fucking tard

>>132880944
>campaigned around such ideas

Ideas that FAILED. Carrier still shipped out those few hundred jobs that he allegedly saved through bribes before he was even president.

Trump is a cuck. Deal with it.

>>132880175
>Modernity's main problem is objectivity.
>Also, myths are great.

Wat. What does this even mean? Explain further. You just vomited this out didn't you?

>>132881085
I hope the gop becomes more like this.

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>>132881085
Wrong. The GOP is infected with cuckservatives, and mixed economy advocates.

What we need is a Objectivist Laissez-faire party.
I had this idea for a "Meritocratic Party". Declare the Republican Party a failure to the right and vow to push it to the "center" (which I view, essentially, as a giant Middle Ground Fallacy anyway) and claim the right in its stead. Invite all Libertarians, Constitution Party members, and Paleocons disgusted with the GOP and form this new Meritocratic Party. It would be necessary to get a bunch of big name supporters to simultaneously endorse it and even convert some big name celebs in a surprise event. Can't be a "minor" party like the old Libertarians, this has to be a threat as a major one on it's inception.
Imagine if Trump made this statement while also extending an apologetic olive branch to PaleoConservatism while also expressing his disdain for neocons, RINOs, cuckservatives, and "crypto-Democrats" (as I like to say). Imagine.

In this new 3 party America the new Republicans in the ""center"" would be able to say the this society is a Constitutional Representative *Republic* and their party simply reflects this reality. So then the Democrats and Meritocrats to either side must say that their intent to do is is to modify the society with more Democracy and Meritocracy to the left/right respectively.

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>>132876164
no niggers or jews? Sign me up!

>>132876164
>natcap
Stop being a faggot and making words up. Can't wait for you summerfags to go back to school

>>132876792
>Good as long as you allow private contractors to compete with the public sector on a for-profit basis.
How do you compete with public sector when your customers are forced to pay for for their services whether they like it or not?

And furthermore - if the goal is to have the most efficient value system, that will shape people into good hard working men, then shouldn't Judaism be perfect for that?

Christianity is a clusterfuck of crazy protestants, brainless catholics who follow whatever the Pope says and Orthodox Christians who can't adapt for shit and still lurk in their medieval collectivist mindset.

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>>132881225
What's the point discussing this with someone this far gone?
The Renaissance revived the decrepit end stages of Roman civilisation, it celebrated reason as a god and lowered tradition to vague folk myths resulting in nobody really understanding why anyone did anything, as it just was not rational. Rationalism is a disease that need its head smashed in.

But I'll talk about something a little more material, since that's clearly the world you're operating in. Because even there, objectivity is a cancer.
I'll take your objectivity and relate it to the retarded 'nationalism for all peoples' argument, as that clearly is the objective take, right? Why would you be for nationalism for your own people, but not apply that equally across the board?

Well, you can't have nationalism for all people.

The entire idea of 'nationalism for ALL peoples' is retarded exactly because it results as a justification from someone who did not develop nationalism from a starting point of tradition. Hitler was right about complaining about eternal objectivity and Germans being unable to take their own side unconditionally.

First of all I don't think you can actually make yourself care about it beyond social signalling of a moral worth you took for granted coming in (which underlines the paradox of it, as the nihilistic objective approach to nationalism still relies on an assumption which would be deconstructed too if the nihilism was consistent.)
And secondly it's impossible, as we share this earth and will naturally come into conflicts where to be nationalist will have to mean to step on other peoples' nationalism.

Nationalism should be developed from tradition, as trying to do it from the ground up is shoddy and impractical. Nihilism has pulled at threads we don't know how to put back together and it has given us little to no insight in to why it was there to begin with.

>>132876164
>Claims to be a capitalist
>Wants to ban lobbying
m8 you're retarded

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FUCK OFF JIDIF

>>132882585
I guess you know an idea is good when shills start trying to discredit you by falsely calling you a jew.

>>132881592
>Objectivist Laissez-faire party
That was the LP. To get more popular the politicians were forced to pander to idiots. It happens to every party under universal suffrage and your party would undergo the same process.

>>132876164
>>Islam and Judaism straight up banned obviously
NO

Islam is redpilled af, you retard! Stop watching propaganda!

>>132876164
>Government's power will be limited to securing borders, helicoptering commies and shitskins, and ensuring voluntary contracts are upheld
So, your whole government is cops?
Basically a military force?

>>132877609
Hes your boss you stupid fuck

>>132877393
The default state of human living for hundreds of thousands of years has been without welfare, bud. You have to provide a reason as to why it should be done first.

So I ask you: why should the government be responsible for providing citizens something that nature has thoroughly demonstrated them to be perfectly capable of acquiring themselves? Why make them dependent on state handouts when they could have autonomy from what may eventually become a corrupt government?

>>132877393
>Welfare
People will always abuse it, I would say the only welfare allowed should be for those injured in the line of duty (cops. firemen, soldiers etc.) or whilst working for the government, that can no longer work and nothing more.

>>132882032
You're a Kantian/Hegelian then. Understood, a subjective irrationalist.
>objectivity is a cancer
Why? Expand on WHY something you state is true and not merely THAT it is.
>And secondly it's impossible, as we share this earth and will naturally come into conflicts where to be nationalist will have to mean to step on other peoples' nationalism
This tells me you do not properly grasp the notion of Capitalism let alone NatCap: you believe in the patently moronic notion that it is dog eat dog. In Capitalism BOTH parties profit.
Steping on other nation's interests is a inevitabiliy like you said, but this is a good thing. The furnace of competition can will, and does solve all disputes and in under the minarchist lead of objective law; dominated parties know they don't even have a case to remain butthurt about it.
Do not open your mouth to tell me about the "tradition" you mystics purport. The only traditions that do not deserve to be discarded are the ones that can make their case that they are objective and meritous. The advent, and later success, that is America proves this.
>Nationalism should be developed from tradition
What fucking traditon? Whose and for what purpose? Nationalism should be developed from tradition
Make the case WHY this is true, not just that it is.

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>>132878115
>people would flee your country as fast as possible
Late 19th and early 20th century America would like a chat.

>>132883406
Kind of, but the people will have the right to their own weapons so the government can't oppress them. Similar to old USA.

>>132876792
>Kikes subvert the entire population and have ''''subjective'''' morality, also a history of ritual sacrifice and promoting prostitution and pornography as well as other degeneracy (see weismar)
>Islam the political, religious and all encompassing ideology that is designed to be spread by deceit, violence and promotes killing/throwing acid in the face of your own children and relatives if they do not follow it to the letter.
>Immigration, the cause of most problems in the west with welfare, social services being out of control, cultural destruction, criminals fleeing prosecution, housing shortages etc.
I wonder why we'd want to ban those things?

>>132881085
The GOP shills for open borders, retard.

>>132883138
Watch this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erytcpYpzRk
People mock the Libertarian Party for a reason.
Entertaining the notion of even allowing embarassments like Gary Johnson are resultant from the things outlined in this video. See the reason the Libertarian PARTY was a bad idea is because it presents an unclear picture and avenue of attack for the left. An "Authoritarian Party" will never be made and for the same reason the Libertarian never should have. Even though Libertarianism is king.

>>132877993
take out the anarchy and I'm in you mental case

>>132877722
>Summerfags trying too hard to fit in
Jej

NatCap won't work. Nationalism is for poor Rednecks who ironically rely on goverment, either as a working guy (cheap housing, etc.) or as trailer trash.

Rich people don't vote for nationalists.

Plus: If you support Austrian School economics, than you have to support lobbying, because Austrian-Schoolists opens the door for anyone who has money.

>>132884618
He said the same thing I did. The politicians invite everybody and the core of the party loses meaning. The word "liberal" used to have a clearly defined meaning and the socialists subverted and stole the word.

>b-but they'll never steal "objectivism"
Your party will either get subverted or remain irrelevant. It's democracy in action.

>>132885340
That's a lot of universal assumptions.

>>132876164

>we want a limited government
>all it has to do is monitor the racial makeup and political leaning of all citizens and kill anyone they find "wrong"

Every time.

>>132885342
Which is why this problem is solved by putting it's polically axis under the banner of "Meritocracy".
Perfectly digestable by the layman. We can say:
>The Democracy/Meritocracy relationship is the relationship bteween quantity and QUALITY.

*political axis

>>132886006
Right, because everyone has the same standards for merit...
You could easily stretch "meritocracy" to literal communism. "Ooh let's let the commissars decide who should be rewarded."

>>132885955
Pinochet did it and created the Miracle of Chile.

>>132886427
I'm sure that will be attempted, that is to be dealt with lster. As all operational difficulties should and will be. Not attempting the best option merely because you have identified potential caveats in advance is the will-destroying REAL cause of medicority in the world.
Worse we'd get is the implication that Meritocracy=white supremacy
And they blew that tired old load too early.

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>>132876164
i would subscribe to this
but its onyl rebranding nat soc
since nat soc is capitalist jsut with strict regulations

>>132878030
>being this scared of brown people

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>>132887005
>since nat soc is capitalist jsut with strict regulations
You're a fucking idiot.

>>132887163
A lot of it is just capitalistic with regulations

>>132886871
>that is to be dealt with later
I'm sure that's been said before. Usually by people without a plan. Imo you're just repeating the same process that LP went through. You'd have to go after voting rights or wait for genetic engineering to kick in to have any hope for a libertarian society. Anyway can you explain what maintains this objectivity of the law under objectivism? I never really delved into objectivism that much.

>>132877993
Having slow inflation is good(period:1970-2008) ,in 2008 you see the big crisis boom and very large inflation. But it wasn't the good standart removing that contributed for the slow inflation but perhaps the fast insutrialization and modernisment during this era which helped investments and production that was automized which contributed to the variety of products on the market. Giving the women rights to work was pretty irrelevant for the money printing, since without them, wealth given to the men perhaps in larger quantities would still reach the womenin the households who have a tendency to spend their husbands money. And by that we have the same thing.
Immigration laws are cuckholdry,

>>132876164
nice flag senpai

>>132876164
>Economic and individual freedom will be of constitutional priority
So I can sell drugs without legal repercussion?

>>132876164
>Immigration limited to Aryans and intelligent whites.

So everybody on /pol is banned from the country ?

>>132876164
what the fuck is this retardation
>Economic and individual freedom will be of constitutional priority.
you're not a fascist then are you

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>>132876164
if you dont want to be edgy and want something that could acctualy work this is fix

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>just give the Jews all of your money! It's economic freedom!

we need another holocaust

>>132876792
Because it's still true National Socialism, just a different color flag.

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Brilliant.

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ITT people who love hyper capitalistic society's and see no problem with degeneracy. Enjoy your women in the workforce,fat consumers and slutty girls buying clothes

No wonder commies want free trade, they realize it's a shitty globalist system that destroys cultures

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>>132877385
>kekistani flag
>calling others inferior

>>132888517
Wat?

>>132876985
Mussolini's Italy
That capitalist

No

>>132876164
That's just Fascism

>>132889039
It's a bit of fascism, fascists aren't that capitalist as what OP is saying

>>132876164
destroy the welfare state

>>132879789
No it's just that the Nazi types aren't really any different than Jewish supremacist ideology.
Talmudic Judaism is one of the oldest forms of ethno supremacist ideology which has been the central reason why jews historically have been hated everywhere they go because people that subscribe to these supremacist ideas themselves hate everyone that isn't them and are on the receiving end of backlash for that attitude.
The key is ending the cycle of "no I'm best and should rule" and just trade amongst each other and respect private property both at the individual level and at the national (not necessarily States nations exist detached from states as a nation is simply a people of same culture and language living in a geographic location) level.

>>132889219
Most certainly

>>132887552
>Usually by people without a plan. Imo you're just repeating the same process that LP went through.
Correct. If our plan for actualizing the Meritocratic Party was insufficient it would perish.
But don't be a determinist. That's what the crypto-leftists want.

>Anyway can you explain what maintains this objectivity of the law under objectivism? I never really delved into objectivism that much.
I find myself trying and failing to remember a collection of quotes from 3 of Ayn Rands Book's. All I can do is send you down the rabbit hole.

Let's sart with the mechanism that Ayn Rand used to present her philosophy to the common man The "This is John Galt speaking" speech from Atlas Shrugged. https:/www/watch?v=8F5nhYo5nx4 this is a 3 fucking hour long speech so do it while doing some menial task if you haven't the time.
Altas Shrugged is perfect to read in audiobook for the first time so do that after if you are curious to the context the speech is in. Joh Glat's speech is the only thing one needs from Atlas however.

Before to watch that video however watch this speech (shorter) by Rand herself. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ooKsv_SX4Y This almost directly answers your question.
Next read what I consider her two mastewroks: " Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal" and "The Virtue of Selfishness"
Finally to round everything out (read further of works if you so wish, "Philosophy: Who needs it" is good) read Leonard Peikoff's "Objectivism: The Philosophy of Ayn Rand". He is her designated intellectual heir and he did a stellar job of formalizing her work.

>>132889241
>Talmudic Judaism is one of the oldest forms of ethno supremacist ideology which has been the central reason why jews historically have been hated everywhere they go because people that subscribe to these supremacist ideas themselves hate everyone that isn't them and are on the receiving end of backlash for that attitude.
Wrong it's cause they were good bankers and traders so they can squeeze all the gold out of the peasant, also killing Christ and since they had no homeland they lived on the fringes of society surviving off of the vices of humans, whore houses and such

>The key is ending the cycle of "no I'm best and should rule" and just trade amongst each other and respect private property both at the individual level and at the national (not necessarily States nations exist detached from states as a nation is simply a people of same culture and language living in a geographic location) level.
You mean like the Nazi's were in the middle of when the Jews came a knocking cause "lol muh international capitalist profits are at risk"

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mfw /pol/ is a real marketplace of ideas, a place with true diversity of thought

we have libertarians, ancaps, socialists, nazis, anarchists, trumpers, alt-righters, etc., all in one place, all shilling their ideologies, criticizing one another, asking questions. and then you've got autists who invent their own movements on top of that

pretty cool

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Lookin good.

>>132876164
Capitalism is just anotger side of tge same jewish coin,nice try schlomo.

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>>132880062
>Only ideology to have defeated a degenerate democratic society collapsing into chaos.
Nazi Germany lasted what?
5 years before starting the biggest war in human history for invading and occupying territory that was never German.
Protip Nazi Germany lost any and all legitimacy as a genuine movement of nationalism the second they took and occupied Czechoslovakia that had never ever been German and instead became a movement of state worshipping protectionism.

>>132890043
You're thinking of corporatism.

>>132889898
HEATHEN you forgot about us Templars!

>>132889484
fugging spoiler alert :DD

i'm halfway through the book currently, now i know there's gonna be a speech at the end >:-DDDDD

>>132889484
>don't be a determinist
I'm not. Just wondering what's the point of repeating the same process and setting back the libertarian movement at the same time by splitting the voters instead of just polishing the existing established brand. It's not beyond salvation like pol would have you believe.

>Altas Shrugged
Think I'll just go and read it. I hear it's good.

I remember Rand saying that it should be like the separation of church and state. But that's pretty silly to me. The lawmakers have a non-voluntary impact on people's lives and someone needs to control them. Just going
>I dunno it's objective and shieet
doesn't do it for me. Thanks for the suggestions.

>>132890065
Rhineland is German and was militarized
Sudetenland was owned by Germany and Austria in ww1 and was populated by ethnic Germans not Czechs
Danzig was German

Please learn history and geography

>>132890276
Corporatism gets rid of Jews and the cancer parts of capitalism if the right government is in. AKA Fascists

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>>132876164
BETTER FLAG COMIN THRU

>>132884137
You can't just take statements out of sentences and pretend that they stand alone.

Viewing international relationships as economic competition is retarded exactly because you're eternally objective. I have a side in this conflict, and it is my side. Things that would be illegal for any company to do to another company would have to be done by nations to other nations.
Suppressing a nation that wants something my nation wants too would occur, and if they're better, then we'll play dirty so we win. Infiltration, subversion and murder.
Not everything is fucking companies, you sperg.

>Do not open your mouth to tell me about the "tradition" you mystics purport. The only traditions that do not deserve to be discarded are the ones that can make their case that they are objective and meritous. The advent, and later success, that is America proves this.
>hurrr muh cummies give me muh cummies
Ahaha, okay.
Fucking Americans.

>>132890582
op's flag looks more iconic and to the point 2bh

>>132890844
it also looks ugly and unsymmetrical as shit

>>132876164
This has been my ideology all along

>>132890065
The war was started over Danzig, which Poland refused to negotiate on.
All they had to do was say they were okay with Germany reunifying with it and the League of Nations would've let it happen, but Poland had a war guarantee and would much rather hold on to more favourable pieces whilst Germany was led into a war Poland hoped Germany would lose, giving Poland if anything the security of keeping their advantageous position.

Ultimately it was the Brits who started the war and kept it going until all hope for a future European world was lost.

>>132881170
Only because tax reform has hit the gridlock of D.C. Without tax reform to undo the damage of Obama, US businesses are at a severe disadvantage.

>>132890971
Op's flag is symmetrical

>>132876164
these principles are incompatible

>>132876164
Any ideology that has to put ''capitalist'' in the title is redundant.
What people still seem to not understand that capitalism is just an absence of socialism/communism. Capitalism means that the government isn't involved in regulating the market, whether it's taxes or quotas.
When you are advocating for capitalism you are advocating for libertarianism/anarchism so when you also advocate for nationalism you are contradicting yourself. To protect borders, kill commies and deport shitskins you need resources which are going to come in the form of taxation.

To me the perfect form of government is a government that tries to be as small and as libertarian as possible, but implements some socialist policies that serve the interests on the nation like taxation to fund a military that can protect the nation. What I want is kind of like a small NatSoc state. NatSoc Germany was too big and too authoritarian, taxes were too high and it had too much welfare. Take the same concept and have a low % tax system with less spending.

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>>132890582
original flag do not steal!!!

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>>132890844
its literally hambone's flag though

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>>132876164
Will it be pro gun?

>>132891104
no, it isnt.

>American education

its imbalanced besides the point.

>>132891440
The change your flag to the snake flag or something. Fascism and Natsoc is all about being authoritarian. There is no such thing as small goverment fascism

>>132891447
better than the OPs anyway.

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>mfw I see capitalists complaining about immigration

>>132890435
>Think I'll just go and read it. I hear it's good.
It is. Christopher Hurt narrating John Galt's speech is spine tingling though so once you get to the speech switch over to the audiobook if you wish. I'd recommend it.
>I remember Rand saying that it should be like the separation of church and state. But that's pretty silly to me
She expands why it isn't in Unknown Ideal
>The lawmakers have a non-voluntary impact on people's lives and someone needs to control them
Rand notes that Democracy is actually perfectly fine for this. Meritocracy for everything else.

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>>132876985
>mussolini or fascism is capitalist
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascist_Manifesto

>>132889484
>>132890435
Fucked that link up https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8F5nhYo5nx4

>>132889819
>Wrong it's cause they were good bankers and traders so they can squeeze all the gold out of the peasant,
No one anywhere has hated honest trade anon. Jewish trading and banking practices come from their culture of supremacism because "who cares if you rip off subhuman goyim lmao".
> and since they had no homeland they lived on the fringes of society surviving off of the vices of humans, whore houses and such
Again if you believe that you're the master race and must rule why would you not promote such things against your "enemy"? On that note though implementation of massive government policies to regulate morality only further opens up avenues for corruption and decay of society at a Much broader scale the US war on drugs is a huge example.
The state of Israel only exist as such so your point of "because they don't have a Homeland" doesn't hold water anymore the issue is the fundamental culture that a large enough portion of Jews hold to be a problem.
> You mean like the Nazi's were in the middle of when the Jews came a knocking cause "lol muh international capitalist profits are at risk"
As a general rule there's nothing wrong with individual business owners not doing business with anyone they don't like and seriously the Nazis were far from innocent and like all socialist collectively punished large swaths of people that they had zero right to punish. Also see
>>132890478
They went further than that so it simply doesn't hold water.
>>132891016
>war guarantee and would much rather hold on to more favourable pieces whilst Germany was led into a war Poland hoped Germany would lose, giving Poland if anything the security of keeping their advantageous position.
>Ultimately it was the Brits who started the war and kept it going until all hope for a future European world was lost.

Or the Nazis could have been pragmatic as well and not literally invaded nations because they didn't get everything they wanted.

>>132891615
I come from a libertarian background. The NatSoc flag makes more sense to me since I've spent all my life around AnCaps.
They rant all day about how taxes are socialism, how we don't live under capitalism because we have taxes and laws etc. I say, ok, that makes perfect sense and we live under socialism right now, so let's change the socialist policies and use the government resources for the interests of the nation. That makes perfect sense to me, and now they REEEEEEEEE to me about how I am not actually a NatSoc even though they describe every western country as a socialist country.

Taxation is socialism.
Nationalism needs taxes to fund a military and a police force to enforce borders.
You can't be a nationalist without incorporating socialist policies into your ideology.

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>>132876164

>Judaism banned

There goes all of your successful businesses/businessmen! All you'll be left with are the ones who are so subversive that they'll give up their own Judaism to continue jewing people

>>132891447
this one is perfect

>>132877216

So you would be happy with being partially outbred and replaced by a foreign hominid subspecies fucking your daughters and exerting influence over your civilization as long as they were high status, intelligent, and powerful?

So basically a degenerate shithole only for white people?

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>>132892090
the new /ptg/ of /pol/ but yet all I hear is....

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>>132891881
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascist_Manifesto
oh god fuck mussolini. giving the vote to pic related

>>132876164
>>132892090
Meant to do OP not you

>>132892039
>>132891016
>Ultimately it was the Brits who started the war and kept it going until all hope for a future European world was lost.
And this is an absurd claim as well.
The bongs were certainly not innocent in the war but for your claim to hold any water the Nazis would have to have genuinely only have fought a defensive war after they took what was German national clay.
They didn't they invaded nearly as much of Europe as the Soviets eventually did and the French were positioned entirely for a defensive war due to fears of German invasion from the very end of wwi.

The Nazis dug the grave they rightfully fell in the only problem is that the crimes of the other side go unspoken of and continue

>>132876985
>Mussolini's Italy, Franco's Spain and Pétain's France?
Nothing near it.

>>132892378

Yes it will be horrible, please stay away and don't come here, you would only end up oppressed because we hate the color of your skin and we would do a racism to you.

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>>132876792
>"Why ban Islam and Judaism?"

>>132877216

>lets starve sub-saharans africans of what makes their communities so shitty

You're going to remove their DNA?

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>>132892090
a belief in the idea of surplus "theft" is what makes or breaks socialism
taxation being used to correct this "theft" is a common tool
however, taxation that is not based upon correcting magical theft, is not capitalism but its not socialism either. its some guy that doesnt trust the market to accomplish the goals of what taxes carry out now. its monarchy. jrr tolkien was a self described AnMon

>>132892039
>No one anywhere has hated honest trade anon. Jewish trading and banking practices come from their culture of supremacism because "who cares if you rip off subhuman goyim lmao".
Wrong again uneducated ancap, it's because Christians wouldn't do any usury so Jews would, this let them get ahead in the medieval world and obviously this ruined/debt enslaved and made a lot of peasants angry, and yes if your honest trade is being a greedy kike selling Miley Cyrus slut action 1 to teenage girls that is bad

>Again if you believe that you're the master race and must rule why would you not promote such things against your "enemy"?
No such thing in natsoc it actually believes each race should control it's own destiny

> As a general rule there's nothing wrong with individual business owners not doing business with anyone they don't like and seriously the Nazis were far from innocent and like all socialist collectively punished large swaths of people that they had zero right to punish. Also see
Nazis were not socialists you were free to run your own business provided it didn't harm the state, and the people did not own the means of production

>>132892090
Your not natsoc, if you believe in a non powerful authoritarian government and a relatively free market your not even a fascist

>Taxation is socialism.
No taxation is taxation Marxist socialism is controlling the means of production and hitler had an entiryly defintion of socalism rather then the one your thinking of

fucking please read up on definitions of words, you can't argue against anything when you can't even get the economic of policies of actual Marxists right

>>132876164
Less focus on excluding religion for the sake of religion. Focus on creating ideals that negate Judaism and Islam, like banning forms of usury, etc.

>lobbying banned.
All that would do is drive the activity underground. If you were a libertarian you'd understand this.

Trying to get money out of politics by prohibition is like trying to save a sinking ship with your bare hands. Because as long as the power exists, money will find its way to it, one way or another.

The only viable solution is a strictly enforced constitutional limit on power, such that there is little incentive/payoff to lobby for favors. Here in the US, pretty much all we're missing is the "strictly enforced" part.

>>132891440
Dude you're a Minarchist. Drop the NatSoc.

>>132891440
>To protect borders, kill commies and deport shitskins you need resources which are going to come in the form of taxation.
I just want to know if you say that because you cannot imagine a way to do so without taxation because they exist.
Hell the security industry in America is huge exactly because the government cannot actually do it effectively.

I can start you down the path anon and I understand at first glance it seems absurd but once you actually sit on the points made when you equally and fairly compare government defense and these proposed options government defense makes less and less sense.

https://mises.org/library/private-defense-no-laughing-matter

And if you don't like reading this has similar content to first dip your foot into.
https://youtu.be/PUhbI-8eWYQ

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>>132892734
I don't take any trouble with the whites only policy, but with the liberal policies it will make society look the same but without any niggers or minorities.

>>132893253
This

Don't call yourself a natsoc, your just a conservative who wants low to no taxes and to keep being moral. Your doing the equivalent of calling yourself a progressive Shria Muslim

>>132893382
>mises institute
oh boy

>>132876164
Why don't you just name it "ersatz natsoc", since that's what it really is.

>>132893086
>Christians wouldn't do any usury so Jews would
he just said that. or do you think usury is not a symptom of talmudism?
wait are you not a goy

>>132893570
Because the bible says don't do usury but the Jewish one has no such thing, nothing to do with supremacy it's just the Christian didn't seize the "free market" of banking just waiting to be created.

A vegan is not a Muslim because they don't eat pork. A jew banker is not a Jewish supremacist if he does usury in 1100 ad France

>>132876164
Christianity is Judaism. Ban all Semitic religions, faggot.

>>132890987
Welcome brother.

>>132891565
Of course

>>132893445

That would be far from the same; that much less degeneracy, crime, and civic fracturing would be life-changing. I also don't completely agree with your premise beyond that since getting rid of leftist trends like the welfare state would do a lot to change the culture and type of adults we produce.

However, I'm not a natcap, for reasons similar to the social/cultural concerns you raised. For one thing, for civilization to proposer we need an institution powerful enough to uphold the patriarchy and prevents women's liberation; the relationship between men and women remains the defining lynchpin of society and a collapse in birth rates, cultural cohesion, and even peoples' biological/hormonal traits soon follows when it goes awry.

That's about the number one problem with libertarianism, maybe even matching mass immigration because it usually precipitates it- an uncoerced free market will never ignore the female 50% of the population as potential employees and consumers. That brings women out of the home, gives them their own money, and destroys the family unit. Libertarianism is feminism.

>>132893086
>it's because Christians wouldn't do any usury so Jews would, this let them get ahead in the medieval world and obviously this ruined/debt enslaved and made a lot of peasants angry, and yes if your honest trade is being a greedy kike selling Miley Cyrus slut action 1 to teenage girls that is bad
Anon Jews were disliked before Christianity again this practice of ripping off others is because of their supremacist attitude.
> No such thing in natsoc it actually believes each race should control it's own destiny
Well no that's the very old position of classical liberalism. Nazism warped that and justified advancement at expense due to their absolute despisal of trade. Same effect was had with Malthusianism and the British empire which we're still suffering from today and frankly isn't too far detached from each other.
> Nazis were not socialists you were free to run your own business provided it didn't harm the state
Uh huh and what did that actually mean in practice?
Simply put no you're absolutely wrong the only people I see trying to call Nazi policy anything to do with Capitalism is leftist. The shit people had to go through to do even very very very basic function of a business all had to meet extensive written bureaucratic approval to Nazi officials adhering to a largely centralized planning model. Your own argument is openly and freely admitting that no they don't own their own businesses because if you cannot run it how you wish to make it profitable for yourself and beneficial to your customers it isn't yours. It's like saying a child owns their room in their parents house.

Short explanation with a few examples
http://tomwoods.com/ep-446-no-progressives-capitalism-isnt-fascism-heres-what-nazi-germanys-economy-looked-like/

Book on the subject I know you won't read
https://mises.org/library/omnipotent-government-rise-total-state-and-total-war-0

>>132893253
Minarchists don't want to deport shitskins, get rid of kikes and stomp out degeneracy.
Not everything is about economy. Although I value capitalism and want a smaller state, getting rid of kikes trumps all that.
I don't like high taxes and I'd prefer if there were no taxes at all, but if Hitler got resurrected and promised to get rid of kikes I'd vote for him in a heartbeat.

You can't get obsessed about retarded labels and just go ''ha, they're national SOCIALISTS, you sound more like a Neo-CapAnarchPaleoLibertarian'' all day as if these labels perfectly describe the ideology you're talking about.
A big part of NatSocialism is hatred of jews. Until someone comes up with some dumb label like ''AnarchoGasKike'' I am going to stick with NatSoc.

>>132890661
Fuck you're stupid. You still did not present the WHY of your arguments.
You didn't because you know you can't. Whether you know it or not Immanuel Kant dominates your mind and I pity you.

>>132876164
I like it. It's the best of ancap and natsoc.

>>132894555
Please take off the flag, your contradicting yourself on so many terms. Taxation is a key policy in fascism and Natsoc.

Just call yourself a righting minachist or a mix of hoppe and minachism. Using a natsoc flag and advocating for those things is making you look stupid

Your just a libertarian who likes whites, so call yourself that rather then a fucking Nazi

>>132894555
>AnarchoGasKike

Samhydeism

>>132876164
>>Christianity will be the main religion, however separation of church and state will be maintained.
>>Islam and Judaism straight up banned obviously

This won't work, you can always go underground. You'd have to do this constructively by enshrining laws that can't be overridden, and figuring out how to prevent them from being turned against you.

here is my ideal socio-economic system: USA ca. 1999

>>132894555
>Minarchists don't want to deport shitskins, get rid of kikes and stomp out degeneracy.
Says fucking who?
>You can't get obsessed about retarded labels and just go ''ha, they're national SOCIALISTS
Hilter's supposed differentiation of "his" socialism was bullshit. He was operationally most certainly a socialist. >>132878317


Your hate "kikes first, work out the rest from there" method is laughable. Unpopular opinion incoming.
The Jews out Meritocracy'd us and their spot (right wing ones at least) is well earned and I begrudgingly salute them. We should have outcompeted them and we did not. Butthurt NatSoc kiddies need not apply.
The Jews have leftists elements that I suspect they despise. Scapgoating the Jews for ALL of the worlds goddamn problems is a mental shortcut of the same breed Stalin committed with the Kulaks and Mao with the 'city dwellers'. I secretly cannot fucking stand ((())) posting. Imagine if we shilled successfully to the point that our based Jewish allies started using the word "kike" to described be their non-Judaism practicing Marx fellating cousins in a MASS surprise event. (((Zuckerberg))) ect.

>>132894513
>Anon Jews were disliked before Christianity again this practice of ripping off others is because of their supremacist attitude.
No if you refuse to sell bottled water because it's not fully natural or something and I do I'm not a supremacist, your just not embracing the free market then. Doing usury does not make you a Jewish supremacist it just means the dumb goys will take your money. Just like dumb consumers will buy dumb things in capitalism

Uh huh and what did that actually mean in practice?
>Simply put no you're absolutely wrong the only people I see trying to call Nazi policy anything to do with Capitalism is leftist. The shit people had to go through to do even very very very basic function of a business all had to meet extensive written bureaucratic approval to Nazi officials adhering to a largely centralized planning model. Your own argument is openly and freely admitting that no they don't own their own businesses because if you cannot run it how you wish to make it profitable for yourself and beneficial to your customers it isn't yours. It's like saying a child owns their room in their parents house.
Did the workers own the means of production?

YES OR NO

NAZIS = NO
NAZIS = NOT SOCIALISTS
THE ACTUAL FUCKING SOCALISTS GOT SHOT IN THE HEAD IN THE NIGHT OF THE LONG KNIVES. FUCKING DO SOME REASEARCH HOLY SHIT

http://www.ub.edu/graap/nazi.pdf

n private, Hitler also said that "I absolutely insist on protecting private property... we must encourage private initiative"

Hitler also believed that individuals within a nation battled with each other for survival, and that such ruthless competition was good for the health of the nation, because it promoted "superior individuals" to higher positions in society.

speech in front of an audience. Drafted by Albert Speer, this address emphasised the "self-responsibility of industry". After the war was won "private initiative of German business will experience its greatest moment".

>>132888970
Take away the social programs and collectivism and it's virtually the same thing as what OP described.

>>132894513
>>132895637
Hitler also expressed his belief in "the further development of humanity through the promotion of private initiative, in which alone I see the precondition for all real progress."

olicies of privatization in the 1930s.[54] Between the fiscal years 1934/35 and 1937/38, privatization represented 1.4 percent of the German government's revenues.[55] Among companies that were privatized, were the four major commercial banks in Germany that had all come under public ownership during the prior years; Commerz– und Privatbank, Deutsche Bank und Disconto-Gesellschaft, Golddiskontbank and Dresdner Bank. Instead of making important investment decisions, and determining the use to which their funds were to be put, the private banks merely had to provide the technical facilities for covering government expenditure or financing new investment—the volume and composition of which had been previously settled by the government.[56][clarification needed] Also privatized were the Deutsche Reichsbahn (German Railways), at the time the largest single public enterprise in the world, the Vereinigte Stahlwerke A.G. (United Steelworks), the second largest joint-stock company in Germany (the largest was IG Farben) and Vereinigte Oberschlesische Hüttenwerke AG, a company controlling all of the metal production in the Upper Silesian coal and steel industry. The government also sold a number of shipbuilding companies, and enhanced private utilities at the expense of municipally owned utilities companies.
NOT SOCALISTS, LEARN THE DEFINITION OF SOCIALISM BEFORE YOU GO BUZZWORDING EVERYWHERE

>>132894916
Yeah, with none of the Socialism or pseudo-Nationalistic Mysticism

>>132887525
National (((Socialism)))

We need fascist capitalism, not that cucked lolbertarian/ancap bullshit. Capitalism + moral values + patriotism + elective monarchy + copter rides = success

>>132896009
>promotion of private initiative,
By which he meant governmental promotion of private initiative.
Contradiction in terms. One does not promote private initiative as if it needed it. Apologists for Hilter's blatant anti-Capitalism need to do and stay go.

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>>132895923
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism, since it is the merger of state and corporate power." t.Mussolini

No not much in common in fascism since fascism is both anti capitalist and anti socialist

>>132895111
Sounds like some left wing kike is scared of ''N-n-nazis''
No matter how you look at it and how hard you try to divide and conquer by giving people obscure labels, no matter what you say, my ideal form of government is still close to NatSoc Germany.
Just because I dislike taxes and only begrudgingly accept them as necessary for nationalism, pro-white and anti-jewish policies doesn't mean I am some minarchist.
I am not an ideologue. I don't sit around all day and talk about how taxes are theft (even though they are) and how immoral they are (even though they are). I am a pragmatist and what we need is to turn the current socialist states into something that resembles NatSoc Germany. That is the only way we can clean it up, get rid of shitskins and save our civilizations.
Also as a pragmatist I would never describe myself as a NatSoc in public, this is just what I see myself as coming from a AnCap background. In public I just call myself a right wing small government guy.

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>>132894555
>Minarchists don't want to deport shitskins, get rid of kikes and stomp out degeneracy.
Who would stop a minarchist from doing that if he so chooses?

>>132894027
>t. Jew

>>132896103
Go away froghurt

>>132896232
Of course Hitlers anti-capitalist but he's also anti Socialist going off everyone's definition of socialism. Fascism and natsoc is "Third position" beyond left and right they view capitalists and marxists both equally as enemies


If the word for Socialism meant the colour red, Hitler called his socalism purple

>>132896185
No.
Capitalism=laissez faire
Moral Values=Objectivist self interest
Patriotism=Meritocratic Nationalism, or Isolationism optionally
Elective monarchy=No. Fuck no. Kill yourself.
Copter rides=Yes

>fascism
Fuck that anti-individualist leftist filth

>>132876874
>SCAR
shit taste desu

>>132896410
>Sounds like some left wing kike is scared of ''N-n-nazis''
>No matter how you look at it and how hard you try to divide and conquer by giving people obscure labels, no matter what you say, my ideal form of government is still close to NatSoc Germany.
>Just because I dislike taxes and only begrudgingly accept them as necessary for nationalism, pro-white and anti-jewish policies doesn't mean I am some minarchist.
>I am not an ideologue. I don't sit around all day and talk about how taxes are theft (even though they are) and how immoral they are (even though they are). I am a pragmatist and what we need is to turn the current socialist states into something that resembles NatSoc Germany. That is the only way we can clean it up, get rid of shitskins and save our civilizations.
>Also as a pragmatist I would never describe myself as a NatSoc in public, this is just what I see myself as coming from a AnCap background. In public I just call myself a right wing small government guy.

You are for
Small government
Small taxes
non authoritarian government

The only point you agree on is no Jews. So call yourself a right wing minachist. You are not a natsoc or a fascist. You are a minachist who wants border control

If you disagree with a government on 99% of his things but agree on one thing you are not one of them

>>132895637
>No if you refuse to sell bottled water because it's not fully natural or something and I do I'm not a supremacist
Yes but if you only do it to people that aren't your own in group you are.
> Just like dumb consumers will buy dumb things in capitalism
That isn't the argument being made.
The point is that Jews are particularly hated everywhere they go before Christianity and beyond Christian Europe and your merchant claim because they don't just do these things they do it entirely in a supremacist framework. There's always been middlemen and interest based banking they aren't new concepts and yes other groups that have fulfilled this role have been scapegoated to some extent (Thomas Sowell documents this in his book"Black rednecks and White liberals") but nowhere near the consistency that Jews have. Jews in particular for several thousand years have unlike any other culture over time have held onto a belief system of literally being chosen by God himself to rule the world which leads to proportionally more of them acting on this belief system and leading to collective punishing of the whole group.
>>132893450
>Lol Hitler oh boy
If that's your rebuttal you're no different than Marxist claiming anything not marxist cannot criticise marxism.

Ever think that maybe the most forefront proponents of Capitalism have a valid opinion and criticism on calling something Capitalism or not and not taking the word of leftist characiture?

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>>132896622
Sure he called it purple. It fucking wasn't.

>>132895506

I'm no going to touch too much on your point about Jews outcompeting due to meritocracy, because that would take an entire new thread (also it would suggest that you believe our current political, financial. and cultural institutions in which jews are overrepresented is effective and functional, reflecting merit of those who run them, and that's a bag of retardation all of its own; hell, they aren't even functional for the jews themselves, who other than the orthodox are race mixing, not having children at all, and dying out).

But I will say that if any foreign ethnic group were able to outcompete a tribe in its own nation via meritocracy, then that's a powerful argument against meritocracy. If I were a sub-saharan African, clearly the whites and chinese will always gain power if they're allowed in the country and it's a meritocracy. For me, the material benefits derived from being governed by more intelligent hominids would not be worth the blow to self-determination, masculinity, testosterone and pride that comes with foreign influence over your genetic in-group (that's completely subjective and many people will obviously disagree with that; I won't condemn them for it). I'd rather furiously protect my borders and do my best to emulate the superior societies; in the sub-saharan case, by following a robust genetics program that funneled power and the heavy incentive to breed to the high IQ extreme outliers while sterilizing many of the rest, giving Africa a chance to not be shit 300 years from now.

>>132896448
The retarded label would stop them.
If a minarchist is advocating for a big enough government that it can accomplish something like exterminating 6 gorrilion gorrilas then he isn't a minarchist. Then he is more of a NatSoc, and if you don't like that label then maybe he is just a right wing authoritarian.
There are only so many socialist ideas you can implement before it stops making any sense calling yourself some anarchist or ''minarchist''.

>>132896622
See
>>132896986

>>132895304

>my ideal socio-economic system includes a 98% government-subsidized population of 35 million sub-saharan africans and the mass importation of 3rd world immigrants

really made me think

>>132896986
>Did workers own the means of production?
>Did hanz the coal miner own the coal mine along with all the other workers.

If no then it's not socialism. End of discussion
If yes then Socalism

>>132878317
>((((((((((((Alisa Rosenbaum)))))))))))))
I thought Rand was intellectually stimulating in 9th grade, then I realized she was just another kike who justified nihilistic egomania.

OP, you are mentally disabled and this post is bait.

>>132876164
You can't be remotely nationalist under capitalism. See the modern world for examples.

>>132897271
Just because Hitler's socialism wasn't as retarded as Marx's doesn't mean it wasn't still retarded.

>>132876164
>economy will incorporate elements from pre-corporatist America and Pinochet's Chile.
Ok
>Christianity will be the main religion
>however separation of church and state will be maintained
>Islam and Judaism straight up banned obviously
How the fuck you get second one with the first one? Cause the third one is not enough.
>Economic and individual freedom will be of constitutional priority.
>Constitutional.
No. Delete this and it will be ok.
>lobbying banned.
Ok
>Immigration limited to Aryans and intelligent whites.
Meh.

>>132897548
Did the workers own the means of production

Yes or No

>>132895506
>>132896998

Oh, I forgot to add- while "hate the kikes first and start from there" may not be a good policy, starting from the basis of removing minorities as a whole actually can be- not so much as a matter of long term socio-economic philosophy, but simply as a matter of triage. As a matter of strategy. Demographics are the most pressing and immediate issue; and the most fragile one (this is exponentially
more true for the US than it is for Europe). The genetic legacy and cohesion is the hardest thing to gain back once lost. We can recover from
communism, we can't recover from
becoming mulattos.

Philosophies can go on and out of
vogue; governing institutions can rise and fall, and ideology can lay dormant for 1000 years and be revived in the span of 3 afternoons. But you fuck up the gene pool, that's that bucko, at least with the technology we have.

>>132876164

How would a natcap society address the meteoric rise of automation and AI workforce replacing physical, intellectual, and even creative labor?

>>132897293
>9th grade
>nihilistic egomania
Confirmed for leftist talking points. Either a brainwashee or cyrpto-leftist.
Ayn Rand specifically critiques nihilism in her rejection of Nietzsche's and Stirner's inferior Egoism. You've either never read her books or have just read Atlas.

>The highest tribute to Ayn Rand, is that her critics must distort everything that she stood for in order to attack her. She advocated reason, not force; the individual’s rights to freedom of action, speech, and association; self-responsibility not self-indulgence, and a live-and-let-live society in which each individual is treated as an END, not the MEANS of others’ ends. How many critics would dare to honestly state these ideas, & say “..and that’s what I reject?” .Barbara Branden
Confirmed

>>132897973

kill the poor with robots

>>132876164
Are NatMods welcome?

What are you capitalist going to do when your system starts failing due to greed, and what are you socialists going to do when your system fails due to laziness? You need a balance, do what's best for the nation's people based on the current circumstances. Sometimes the businesses need a break to thrive, sometimes the people need a bailout to survive. Moderate economics and compromise are the way forward.

>>132877993
>keynesianism began in 1975

>>132897656
That's Marxism. Instead the Authoritarian state owned it. You're trying to imply Marx and his means of production beliefs were the avatar of socialism or something. I aint stupid faggot.

>>132897656
No
Any taxation takes away people's means of production. When you use your own body to produce something and the government takes a portion of the product, you do not own the means of production.
You're a brainwashed lefty.
>If no then it's not socialism. End of discussion
Jesus Christ.
It's only under socialism and communism when the workers don't own the means of production. Your body is your means of production. Any taxation is the government owning your body.

>>132897271
Read up

https://mises.org/library/why-nazism-was-socialism-and-why-socialism-totalitarian

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>>132897568
Something superior:
>Meritocratic Monarchy
>Ethno-nationalism
>Traditional/conservative/natural social order
>Free market laissez faire Capitalism
>Low taxes
>Small budget for defense, science and intelligence services
>Inmigration limited for high-skilled workers or investors with a belief system compatible with ours.
>Physically removing commies and subversive groups.

Steps:

>Take the power with a populist strategy
>Mantain power and give it to the natural aristocracy
>Physically remove commies and subversive groups
>Eliminate gun control
>Decentralize power
>State is no longer necessary: natural order

>>132880843
the first christians were anarchists naturally, being treasonous criminals of the roman state

>>132898116

So a natcap society would just be a conglomerate of a few families who own the means of AI automation.... basically an ancap society.

>>132898168
>greed
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qoSZ-dVmC0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JeJuySjCL5g
>You need a balance
So you're a mixed economy cuck, gotcha. Esssentially a Neocon.
Laissez-faire or death faggot.

Boy howdy, there are so many spooks in here, I can hardly see a thing!

>>132898285
So no the workers didn't own the means of production and there was still private means of production and rich people.

Therefore not socialism

Was all property communally owned and/or regulated by the community as a whole
Yes or not

Obviously not since you still owned your own house and goods so it's not communism either.


Okay so we have come to the conclusion the nazi's were not socialists or communists whenever or not you think they had bad economic policies.

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>>132898427

>Meritocratic Monarchy

>>132898390
Hitler did make a specific point that Nazism was specifically about socializing the very people of the nation to avoid what you describe.
But that's not just missing the point but taking it to it's radical antithesis of the point

>>132876164
National capitalism in itself is a meme.
You either want to make money or you want a planned and protectionist economy.

>>132876164
Nah im good

>>132898391
Your turn now. Did the workers own the means of production

Yes or goddam no?

>>132898390
Taxation is not the government taking the means of production away and giving it to the people, it is them taking some profit of it. If the workers don't own the means of production it's not socialism or communism

>>132880581
>losing side
>lost because every major kiked country on earth to wage total war on it for half a decade for it to collapse, not because of internal weakness
really bakes the brain beans

>>132898572
>justice is the opposite of altruism
>objectivists actually believe this

>>132898427
>Meritocratic Monarchy
Contradiction in terms. Or else you have so special meaning cooked up in your head, then by all means: enlighten me.
>Ethno-nationism
Yes. If US marxism is irreversible an the white race doomed then I actually want to pass the torch to the Nips.
Have them make their own equivalent to the constitution except +Objectivism this time.
A rejection of the primordial evil that is Altruism.
>Traditional/conservative/natural social order
Modernism (not post-modernism) plus these constraints, yes
>Free market laissez faire Capitalism
Yes
>Low taxes
Yes. No taxes is dumb.
>Small budget for defense, science and intelligence services
Constantly in flux as per the desires of the nation but yes
>Immigration limited for high-skilled workers or investors with a belief system compatible with ours.
Yes. Switzerland, Poland, Japan, and non-kike-Israel being the best ones.
>Physically removing commies and subversive groups
Please God.

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>>132876164

Fuck capitalism of any sort.

>>132898938

There is an argument to be made that that is basically 99% of all successful joint-stock corporations in the world

>>132897271
>>Did workers own the means of production?
In the socialist stage, the state centralize all the means of production "in representation of the workers". The "communist" stage is when the workers have the means.

But coming back to nazis: The ownership of the means of production were private, but under the orders of the government.

>What Mises identified was that private ownership of the means of production existed in name only under the Nazis and that the actual substance of ownership of the means of production resided in the German government. For it was the German government and not the nominal private owners that exercised all of the substantive powers of ownership: it, not the nominal private owners, decided what was to be produced, in what quantity, by what methods, and to whom it was to be distributed, as well as what prices would be charged and what wages would be paid, and what dividends or other income the nominal private owners would be permitted to receive. The position of the alleged private owners, Mises showed, was reduced essentially to that of government pensioners.

>>132899584
Altruism is the primordial evil skipper. Only irrationalism is worse.

>>132899592

Every CEO is a meritocratic monarch.

>>132881015
Maybe you missed the "nationalist" part, jihadovich?

>>132891016
>invade country
>they started it

>>132899096
>Yes or goddam no
Refer to
>>132898958
>>132898391
And actually read you pedantic fuckwit.

This is literally muh not real socialism crap.
The Nazis worked in their means to achieve this goal which is nuanced just like how Bolshevik socialism is nuanced as is anarcho socialism is nuanced.

>>132899823
...not inaccurate. I know what you mean.
Monarch implies a whole host of other details. So it is the wrong word to use.

>>132876164
Stop with this bullshit. Just lets keep what we have without any shitskins/non-whites and liberals faggots. Only pure white Christians with what we have.

>>132899738
>De facto government ownership of the means of production, as Mises termed it, was logically implied by such fundamental collectivist principles embraced by the Nazis as that the common good comes before the private good and the individual exists as a means to the ends of the State. If the individual is a means to the ends of the State, so too, of course, is his property. Just as he is owned by the State, his property is also owned by the State.

We can agree that Hitler was not marxist, but that doesn't mean he was not a socialist. Socialism existed before Marx (see utopian socialism and much other socialists with other opinions)

In resume: all marxists are socialists but all socialists aren't marists

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>>132877809

Capitalism is a system built entirely off of the exploitation and domination of the working class by the bourgeoisie, and the propagation of consumerism is used to dogmatically keep the proletariat uninformed, uneducated, alienated and separated in order to further cement the power of the state and the bourgeoisie. It is inherently against the natural order or natural law of how human beings in interacted with each other in societies before the dawn of capitalism.

>>132876164
Let me get this straight; you want to ban the Jew yet make the merchant king.

>>132898427
you have been reading some Hoppe, so to speak

>>132899592
>Contradiction in terms. Or else you have so special meaning cooked up in your head, then by all means: enlighten me.
I'm fucking sick so I have one. Take a family that is naturally aristocratic (genetics) and then make the decendets compete for the throne.

>>132876792
faggot

>>132900207
your ID is right, you are a faggot

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>>132900374
te-hee
but Hoppe was no monarchist

>>132900068
Okay then

Were the Nazi's aiming for the workers controlling or regulating as a whole the means of production.

Nazi's took some policies form the left aka some social welfare and some from the right aka racial laws,religious policies etc. However under no circumstances can they be called socialists since they were not working for communal ownership of the means of production nor for making everyone equal in wealth

Taking into consideration the starassierists who were the "real" socialists here all got purged for being socialists in the first place

>>132899096
You've clearly never read any libertarian literature or spoken to AnCaps, or even listened to Not an argument Molyneyx, yet you're lecturing people on whether or not they should call themselves minarchists.
You've obviously only heard the far left perspective. I've spoken to them, and they all believe in these really crazy mental gymnastics about how taxation isn't the government taking away people's means of production. Complete insanity. As if owning means of productions only refers to fat people with money bags in their hands and tophats on their heads.
Your body is your means of production. All fruits of your labor belong to you. If you are forced to pay taxes, you do not own your own means of production.

Even if you disagree with the idea, you've obviously never fucking heard of this libertarian perspective, yet you think you're qualified to tell people what they believe.

>>132899738

Part of the difficulty when assessing the socialism argument is that we basically see two iterations of the National Socialist German economy: war-time, and gearing up for war. So we rely on a relatively small set of data, and the stated goals of the leaders at the top. If you'd looked at the major liberal democracies during WW2 like the US and U.K., they would look pretty damn socialist too with their food rationing and heavy industry run by state mandate.

>>132900090

Yeah, I can't quite make up my mind about that

>>132900545
He is AnCap but defended monarchy over democracy and said it was a form of achieving AnCapism

>>132900649
That's absolutely true. All western powers used militar keynesianism. But I think we have to look at what Hitler said in Mein Kampf to have a clear opinion.

>>132876164
It's like national socialism - welfare & regulations + meritocracy + social darwinism.

>>132900860
>said it was a form of achieving AnCapism
He say there's no way back to monarchy (Democracy, te God that Failed, Chap. 5)

>>132876164
I was on board till you said banning Islam and Judaism.

>>132900150

>Lets just rewind the video tape back a bit, then wait for a different ending

So you want to preserve classical liberalism- fine. How will you do it? The constitution didn't do it, your grandfather's 90% white christian country didn't do it.

>>132900625
Your the one saying it's okay to call yourself a Nazi when you disagree with everything but jew and racial policies.

When in fact you could agree with 99% of minachist policies and disagree on the immigration bit putting you way closer to the minachist category rather then using the natsoc flag.

I'm not gonna talk politics with someone who calls himself a nazi but wants small government, small or no taxes, and a much lessened authoritarian. If you want all of that you are no longer a nazi

>>132900889
>welfare & regulations
Where did op say that?

>>132900207

imagine actually believing this

what a cold and dim imitation of life

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I feel like this is a better flag.

>>132901090
Good societies don't create institutions that create degenerate, dependent masses of lumpenproliteriat. Get redpilled on the nature of welfare.

>>132901077
You've not made any actual argument against anything I've said because you do not understand it. You can't understand how libertarians and right wingers think. There is no debate here. I can debate with retarded lefties like you because I've looked into your perspective,
You haven't even bothered to look into what libertarians consider to be socialism.

>>132900207
>exploitation and domination

Explain how profit inherently involves domination.

Explain how interest inherently involves domination.

Explain why this "domination" is unjustified. And do it without appealing to general moral theories.

>>132900577
>Were the Nazi's aiming for the workers controlling or regulating as a whole the means of production.
Yes through the function of the Nazi party.
It was a workers party in name and action.
> However under no circumstances can they be called socialists since they were not working for communal ownership of the means of production nor for making everyone equal in wealth
Again read what I posted
The Nazis system for socialising was through the people themselves as opposed to Marxist socialism Bolshevik socialism or anarchist socialism.
Again read nigger

>>132900545

Are you sure about that?

Cities and land owned entirely as private property by individuals with unrestricted sovereignty, which they can pass on to their children? Sounds like monarchy to me.

>>132901693
Hoppe calls it "natural aristocracy".

>>132901542
You are pretty based. Flag make me double take though.

Migrate on Page 10 peeps
>>132890859
>>132890859
>>132890859
>>132890859
>>132890859

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>>132897093
You just don't get it

>>132901630
>Yes through the function of the Nazi party.
>It was a workers party in name and action.
No private property and ownership was kept in natsoc Germany, the workers also didn't own the means of production either nor were any attempts made to abolish private ownerhip or give workers control of the means of production

The Nazis system for socialising was through the people themselves as opposed to Marxist socialism Bolshevik socialism or anarchist socialism.
Again read nigger

So not actually socialism but just some social welfare, and a name made to attract attention during the hard times of the Weinmar

Got it

>>132901542
I don't give a fuck about you, i'll talk with the other guy but not someone as retarded as you who calls himself a minachist nazi. This is my last post to you

>>132895506
>t. I don't understand how the Jews gained and consolidated their power through crime, occult devilry, and nepotism

>>132901824
A lot of NatSoc are just leftist infiltrators who want to turn /pol/ into a commie-friendly shithole. A lot of them speak very negatively about capitalism, they avoid talking about race and they keep trying to shift the conversation to social class.
You should be suspicious of people who have NatSoc flags or call themselves ''Nazis''. There is a NatSoc party in America that keeps punching right constantly and uses commie vocabulary calling eachother ''comrades''.

>>132902227
I do. That's why I qualifeid my statement with "right wing ones at least"

>>132901824
heads up on his retardation. He's a minachist on everything but the racial and anti-semitism laws but wants to refer to himself as a Nazi dispite being anti-authrotian anti-tax and anti big goverment

>>132902175
You really are a retarded leftist kike
>you who calls himself a minachist nazi.
I didn't call myself a minarchist or a nazi. Or both.
You were slipping up earlier when you were misusing the term ''fascist'', but now you're not even pretending. You're now blatantly calling everyone a nazi and oy veying your dick off.

If you don't understand what people on the right consider to be socialism, then your opinion is completely worthless.

>>132902263
Exactly. You fucking understand.

Why I wrote this:
>Reminder that all these smear attempts by commie, cyrpto-commie, and NatSoc shills of Ayn Rand are borne out of their gut wrenching realization that Objectivism is the greatest threat they have ever encountered which is why they cannot even bear to have it discussed as a philosophy. ALL of the adversaries she describes in her novels are EXACTLY what /pol/ describes as the sterotypical kike. Kikes exist but Rand is quite literally the most based jew to ever live. I do not exaggerate.

>>132902175
>No private property and ownership was kept in natsoc Germany, the workers also didn't own the means of production either nor were any attempts made to abolish private ownerhip or give workers control of the means of production
Again for the third time that is the Bolshevik means to socialism.
Hitler and the Nazis had their own take which again read both their own fucking literature and what I posted on how they are socialist not just in name but action.

There's retards that say the USSR wasn't socialist either and they're as wrong as you are

>>132902810
go to the /nsg/ in the catalog and argue your shitty point there