STOP DEMONIZING CIVIC NATIONALISTS

>>132211527
I am a based kekistani civic nationalist. Fuck actual racists like Richard Spencer. My dad is black and my mom is white, but that doesn't mean shit

>>132211741
What do you want in politics?

>>132211527

So you support a multi-racial society bound by a singular culture?

If so, how do you prevent it from devolving into multiculturalism? Throughout Human history multi-racial societies work, but when you add different cultures to the mix it ends in a disaster since culture is ,ultimately, a way of life.

>>132211741
Stop trolling nigger I don't like civic nationalists faggots neither but op is right.

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>>132211527
>Stop dissenting with my views

>>132211741
>My dad is black and my mom is white, but that doesn't mean shit
>>132212050
>multi-racial society
People of different skin color are rivals because the sexdrive isn't colorblind at all. You can be a civic nationalist if you want to but this doesn't go away.

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>>132212050
If we divide our movement, we will never seal the border, stop the invasion and kick the Mexican squatters out. That should be the number one priority, not virtue signalling to other people on the Right about how our values are more pure than theirs. Priorities are important and even the purest ethnic nationalists NEED the support of the civic nationalists right now, even black civic nationalists, in order to slow and hopefully stop immigration for enough time to sort out our next steps.

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>>132211527
Trump is fucking CGI. You worship a litteral puttpet. The real trump died 14 years ago and the deep state is using his legacy of corperate shilling to control the bootlickers. It all pretty obvious if you weren't a cucked pleb shill faggot.

>>132212136
No, he really fucking isn't. Civic nationalists are fucking retarded because they believe people will sumbit to an ideology and not their racial tribal bullshit like they have been doing for fucking hundreds of years. You think all the welfare niggers and spics will suddenly join the cause? Fuck no. Civic nationalism will not be a thing in our lifetime or at least in America's timeline. Same shit with Nat socs and Ethnic nationalists, it's just wishful thinking and amounts to nothing more of a circle-jerk. It's literally just "BASED BLACK MAN" retardation.

>>132211527
>Mexicans can fuck my wife as long as they do it LEGALLY!

fuck off civicuck

>>132211527
>people still saying civic nationalist as though it isn't a slur

>>132211527
kys

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>>132211527

Nah, the stupidity of civic nationalism needs to be exposed much harder. You are still fundamentally scared of the mean lefties calling you a racist. This gives them a power over you that will enable them to take over your movement and turn it into an impotent joke, much like they did with the gop and are currently doing with the libertarian movement.

The time for war draws near, if we are not united as a strong tribe we will fall.

>>132212392
>calls people retarded
>can't spell "submit"
>thinks human civilization is only "hundreds of years" old
>thinks whites will join up over national lines, instead of killing each other which has been the norm since forever
The real retards are the white nationalists, and it really pains me to say that. If you think French people and English people, or American and English people, or Irish and Swedish people, or people from ANY OTHER number of countries, will just agree to live together now, despite zero precedent of ever having done this, just because there are large minorities of Mexicans or Muslims living in their country, then you have no concept of history or human nature.

>>132212422
Fuck no. The Mexicans need to get the fuck out, immigration needs to be stopped for several years, there needs to be an IQ test for any new immigrants after that, and racial demographics should not be altered.

>>132212453
Using it as a slur is a divide and conquer tactic that is being used against us. If you are not a shill yourself, then you are shilling for the shills without realizing it. Civic nationalists are NOT the same thing as cuckservatives, who don't respect our national sovereignty. Trump is a civic nationalist and he wants to build a wall and limit Muslim immigration. Those are positive goals for any ethnic nationalist. The cuckservative would want to tear down the wall and increase Muslim immigration!!

>>132212667
Explain how it's not stupid to expect Americans and British to put aside 250 years of differences, or English and French to put aside 1000 years of differences, and live together in some kind of white homeland despite there being no precedent and no real positive public sentiment for it happening.

>>132212667
moderate ethno-nationalism is fine, going over the top, like nazis do, harms the ethno-nationalist cause.

the sexdrive isn't colorblind, so neither should be any of us. doesn't mean you can't make friends with someone with a different skin color but be aware that when it comes to society as a whole, you and them have potentially conflicting interests. they try to increase the relative standing of their people, you care about your own.

OP is right, but this place is a mess.
Perhaps it's too late.

>>132211527
It's a nice font to put on in public, but that's about it

>>132212724
well, conflicts between whites and PoCs will increase in coming decades, which will prompt a partial white exodus from western europe into east europe, where people will receive firearms and training for a reconquista.

it's quite clear that this will happen and that there will have to be a prolonged build-up for this to occur. but happen it will.

>>132211527
>implying trump ever had any credit

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>>132213002
>Spain
Pretty much says it all, desu.

>>132212724
>nitpicking at a spelling error
You're a fucking retard m8. I didn't even mention whites grouping up at all and I was referencing the United States when I said hundreds of years old though I guess I should've been more specific so autists like you wouldn't sperg out. No need to get defensive because people call out your ideology for being retarded.

>>132211527
I don't have to be a civcuck nationalist to support trump

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OP

>>132211527
>>132212315
>>132212724

I completely agree with you. I want to be a righteous person in an unrighteous world and that's why I support civic nationalism for countries where white people are not the indigenous people of those countries (like Australia and the United States, for example) while still secretly aiming for those countries to ALWAYS have a white majority and openly aiming for those countries to ALWAYS abide ONLY by Western culture, whereas I support hardcore ethnic nationalism for countries where white people are the indigenous people of those countries (i.e. European countries). Civic nationalists are usually kind-hearted people yet, at the same time, they are not push-overs. Fuck cuckservatives, though. I am against divide-and-conquer tactics, except when it comes to cuckservative faggots.

>>132213222

Trips of truth! Kek is on my side! Thank you, based Kek!

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I prefer Cultural Nationalism.

>>132213310
and not just because of
>le flame shirted centrist
either

>>132213222
>>132213269
don't be that faggot pointing out his own fucking get less than a minute after posting. just sad.

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>>132211527
C0incidence? I think not.

stop trying to force everyone into some faggot ideology
we ALL need to work together to burn the bank kikes, then we can split up into faggy little factions, so they can rise up and enslave us again

Civic nationalism is OK as long as you pair it with a healthy dose of racism.

>>132213222
There is no reason why a civic nationalist can't hold the view that racial demographics should remain in constant proportions, and may not be affected by immigration. It's what everybody considered to be common sense before the 1970s.

>>132213269
This kind of shit isn't helping.

We don't need to condemn the Kekistani retards, but we need to retire these memes. The cringe is getting out of hand and it's really embarrassing to watch these people drape their pseudo Nazi flags over their backs at our political events.

>>132211980

A re-focus on cleaning up the garbage in this country.

Isolationism until the rot that infects us is routed for good.

>>132213405
pretty much as soon as the election ended people started in-fighting and acting like contrarian hipster faggots.

>>132213475

>The cringe is getting out of hand and it's really embarrassing to watch these people drape their pseudo Nazi flags over their backs at our political events.

And you complain about D&C?

>>132213483
Didn't he die recently?

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>>132211527
Okay, I could get behind that. But I'm a white nationalist before and American nationalist.

/pol/ is wrong about ethnic nationalism. For hundreds of thousands of years, humans mingled together therefore there is not a single ethnic group that kept their bloodline pure. The only way to preserve America is to follow the Bill of Rights and Constitution to keep America as it should be.

>>132213536
If you had read the sentence before that one, you'd know that I'm not advocating divide and conquer. We just need to retire a few memes. If after that there are still people who want to go out in public with green facepaint, green pseudo Nazi flags flying and purple-lipped Pepe printed on posters, that would end up being a good way to identify the plants by the left who are only wearing those retarded things to discredit us.

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Civic nationalists are globalists.

>>132213475
>There is no reason why a civic nationalist can't hold the view that racial demographics should remain in constant proportions, and may not be affected by immigration.
>It's what everybody considered to be common sense before the 1970s.
You challenge your own fucking argument. Civics on /pol/ are the worst of the lot because you're deluded enough to believe everyone will come to the decision to create your dream Libertarian ethnostate entirely of their own accord.

I wouldn't be surprised if you started saying that all the non-whites would decide to leave for the best of the nation if you just talk about "muh constitution" enough.

>>132213669
This is a lot like the lazy arguments you get here which amount to "some Normans came here a thousand years ago so what's so different about letting in Africans and Pakistanis"

Yet more arrant nonsense.

>>132211527
The ethno-nationalists didn't even start this conflict, the civics tried to throw us under the bus to prove to the libshits they aren't "racist". We had a good thing going together until T_D decided to purge their board and turn into militant virtue-signallers.

>>132213722
This. It's an incredibly transparent attempt to take control of growing nationalistic sentiment and bring it more in line with their goals. They're turning an impassable road block in to a speed bump.

>>132213669
You're right, but for the wrong reasons.

>For hundreds of thousands of years, humans mingled together therefore there is not a single ethnic group that kept their bloodline pure.
If this were true, which it isn't, then different human races would not exist. On the other hand, if all WHITES had the natural proclivity to intermingle, then there would be no nations, and white majority countries would be natural allies only. That's also not true.

>>132213685

Autistic kids are going to be autistic kids no matter what you do.

You might as well accept it. They aren't pipe bombing people, I don't give a shit if they turn off normies with their autism.

To me, anyone who willingly self-applies a label at this stage of the game is just a useful idiot. Especially when half of said labels are just media creations to dismiss conversation.

>>132213737
>Civics on /pol/ are the worst of the lot because you're deluded enough to believe everyone will come to the decision to create your dream Libertarian ethnostate entirely of their own accord.
>
>I wouldn't be surprised if you started saying that all the non-whites would decide to leave for the best of the nation if you just talk about "muh constitution" enough.
This is a strawman.

>>132211527
Seconded

>>132211527
You achieve the same outcome as multiculturalists. Fuck off cuck.

>>132213869
Agreed and the proud boy oathkeeper try hards who discredit ethno nationalism for pr are degenerates

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>mexico is more dangerous than syria
>let's invite all of mexico into america what could go wrong
you deserve everything that you're going to get

>>132213978
Your ideology is built of straw.

Name one thing white nationalists have accomplished for the West. One.

Were we to leave it up to them, they'd be shouting about the coming race war until the last white man choked on his vomit in his mother's basement after a 3 day stint of shitposting on a Mongolian fly fishing forum.

We're tired of failure, we're taking matters into our own hands. If Trump disappeared tomorrow, white nationalists would be just as much useful idiots as they have always been.

>>132211527
America has been civic nationalist with bretty good results (also had high standards). Receiving white population of compatible cultures.

So it's not necessarily a bad idea.

>>132214084
heh fuck you nigger, you'll be sorry on the day of da rope!
any day now...
soon...
you'll see...
I swear its gonna be so cool...

>>132213722
>Civic nationalists are not nationalists

I don't even know where the fuck this idiot is getting this. Civic nationalists do recognize nations. That's why we call them civic nationalists. Do you not understand what "civic" means, you fucking Swedish idiot?

Some civic nationalists don't care about racial demographics, others do. Maintaining a 90% white/10% black racial balance in America isn't a white nationalist view, but it can be held by a civic nationalist. It's a MORE conservative view as well, since it's not a call for change.

tl;dr stop strawmanning civic nationalism

>>132213828
Humans migrating is normal. America is mostly German, Anglo, Irish, and Central Africans. In the next 300 years, perhaps the people that lived in Europe will be in North America, Africans w/ Middle Easterns will be in Europe, Chinese in Africa.

>>132213959
Whites will continue existing no matter what. White genocide is not real. White people will still find one another.

>>132213869
Don't use T_D as an example of civic nationalists.

>>132214177

>since it's not a call for change.

Have you looked at our demographics lately?

It would be a LARGE change.

>>132214123
>60% white
>enitre regions irredeemable infested with niggers and mexicans
>COMMIEFORNIA
>lick Israel cock all the time
Breddy good resulds.

>>132211527
The Kalergi Plan.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LTwYpqrkpY

Civic nats are part of the problem

>>132214084
name one thing a shitskin subhuman ever accomplished for the west. one.

now let's deduct points for all their shitskin brethren so while the .01% did add something the remaining 99.99% did so much damage it's a net negative.

guess what you shitskin subhuman your race is inferior and has about 30-40 less iq points than whites, asians, and jews. you can't compete and you always will want gibs. you exist as nothing but a fifth column and divide the nation cause your subhuman tribe will always look for its own interest before the nations, whites, and doesn't want equality

>>132214084
>Name one thing white nationalists have accomplished for the West. One
They essentially built it, given that moderm white nationalism is built upon perennial ideas. Even if I would agree much of its modern manifestation falls in to self parody - as with most counter-cultures it's become defined by it's detractors.

>>132214084
No matter how you slice it, having shitskins and kikes infesting western nations is not a good thing.

>>132214004
No, you do not. The civic nationalist answer to immigration - Trump's answer - is to close the southern border, deport a lot of Mexicans, and stop Muslims from coming here. The multiculturalist answer to immigration - and by the way, there is no such thing as a multiculturalist, only power-hungry authoritarian statists - is to import millions of stupid peasants from the third world to replace the intelligent white citizens, and in turn vote for more authoritarian policies, giving more power to the government until the nation has been sucked dry.

>>132214055
Good snark. Still not an argument.

>>132214238
Strawman.

Until 1964 the migration was 99% white. Directed intelligently.

Everything, and I say everything today has been contaminated with the egalitarianism cancer. Nothing to do with meritocracy.

>>132211527
White nationalists are too dumb to understand what you're saying

Simple people think in black and white, literally

>>132213869
>>132214015
Oath Keeper isn't even a coherent political ideology.

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itt: jews

>>132214188
>Humans migrating is normal.
You either missed or chose to ignore the point of my post.

Your argument is essentially that what is ought to be, or rather that what is ought to be in it's most exaggerated form.

>>132214403
No, that is a strawman - or plain retardism. First you wrote that US had pretty good results with civic nationalims and now that I pointed out how fucked up murica is thanks to that you come up with that they were ethnic or racial nationalists up until 1964? The only thing we just learned here is, that as long as there is ethnic or racial nationalism everything goes down the shitter.

>>132214210
I wouldn't even mention it but the day they purged their board and sent all the alienated racist redditards over here was right before the civics started trolling /pol/ en masse. It was clearly coordinated by reddit.

>>132214390
Nor is "deal with it", which is what yours amounts to.

>>132214554
*everything is alright and when civics take over everything goes down the shitter.

>>132214554
>they were ethnic or racial nationalists up until 1964?

They weren't. Check your premises.

>>132214528
Before Anglos, somebody else lived in England. Ethnicity should not be equal to Nationality. Nationality means the state, not ethnicity. Therefore, you should look into preserving the national interests.

>>132214592
Is that REALLY what my argument amounts to, or are you strawmanning again?

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>>132214446

>>132214188
>humans migrating
Humans are not a migratory species, we aren't birds you dipshit. Migration implies an eventual return. That doesn't happen, the scum of the world move into the nice places, don't leave, and permanently shit it up

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>>132214500
you can still be a civic nationalist and believe in designated ethno cities and states

>>132211527
Civic nationalism is fine in my opinion, as long as the white population stays above a certain percentage. Anything below 80% is unacceptable, and that's still being rather generous.

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>>132214749
Seasonal migration is just one form of migration.

>>132214637

>Ethnicity should not be equal to Nationality.

And yet, it does. When you think Chinese, do you think of an asian? When you think of Italy, do you think of Libyans? It's human nature.

>Therefore, you should look into preserving the national interests.

Are you neocon faggots really going to try to pivot this into an "American Interests" episode again?

You'll have to kill me if you want that to happen.

>>132214835
>When you think Chinese, do you think of an asian?
Yes.
>When you think of Italy, do you think of Libyans?
No.

Were both of these answers supposed to be the same?

>>132214835
When do you think of Chinese do you think of Han and Manchus? No you don't. China is a nation, not an ethnicity.

>>132214623
>almost only european immigration allowed
>everyone disliked the nogs and spics
>~90% white
They were not civics.

>>132214637
>nation means state
Wew lad that is bullshit

>>132214907

Considering ~90% of china is Han, yes, I do.

>>132214938
Yes, they were civic nationalists.

>>132212724
>IQ

Why need that when we can just accept white immigrants like Trump said in this video

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Mob-8wN6kpU

Plus I want to get South African Whites out of their hellhole too.

>>132215001
Because most "European immigrants" are going to be Somali-Swedes and Libyan-Germans if we don't screen them for IQ.

>>132214819
>look the AMH migrated over thousands of years interbred with Neanderthals, Denisovans etc resulting in different groups with massive biological differences who then themselves wandered a bit for thousands of years
>LET'S BRING ALL NIGGERS TO EUROPEAN COUNTRIES MIX EM ALL TOGETHER (and kill whitey)
Fuck off you piece of shit. KYS

>>132213669
>ethnic group that kept their bloodline pure
Yet somehow distinct groups do exist, weird how that works huh?

>>132214907
You're ignoring the fact that the Han and Manchus fought numerous genocidal wars against each other.

>>132214685
No that's exactly what it amounts to. You're either trying to redefine your defeat as a victory or you're just too much of a cretin to follow your ideas through to their ends.

Keep passing off all criticism as whichever logical fallacy you want to pick off of yourlogicalfallacyis but no amount of doing so is going to make your position sensible.

I have FAR more respect for one race-type civics than people like you because at least their position makes some degree of sense, if built on a faulty premise. You're taking solid foundations and wasting them by building a rickety shitshack on them whereas they're building a decent home on a sinkhole.

>>132215088
You're strawmanning again.

>>132211527
So when a Democrat does a mock photo its bad and across the line, when he does something showing violence it's fine for Republicans? More hypocrisy from the right.

>>132214965
>>132214977
>>132215113
Ethnicity should not be confused with Nationality. You should put Ethnicity with Community into one category. Do Race Supremacists feel communal with somebody outside their race? They don't.

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>>132214819

>over 200,000 years

But it'll be okay if we do it in 15, right?

>>132215121
Give specifics or fuck off.

>>132214981
You are retarded and whatever yo write is woth shit after this:>>132214819
>>132215129
>STRAWMAN!!!
>why
>STRAWMAN YOU RACIS!
Get fucked plebbit scum.

>>132214938
Exactly. Anybody who wasn't outright racist was only because until past 1980, 50% of all counties in the US didn't have ONE non-white in them.

Many people weren't racist as much in the past before diversity because they literally had no opportunity to be racist.

>>132215142
Go to bed, Shareblue. You're drunk.

>>132215069
>Somalis and Libyans
>He actually believes this

This is why I don't like civic Nationalists, They live in this false mindset and are extremely against white immigration. That's why nobody likes them, They're against white immigration or boosting up the white percentages here. Europe is whiter then us thus the white immigrants like Trump said will be from Europe/Angloshpere and Southern Africa.

>>132215144

My point is, there is an area between supremacy and bending over for immigrants.

It's objective reality that this country ran better when it had a far higher white demographic.

>>132214637
>Nation means state
I guess that means Kurds don't exist because they don't have a state.
Fuck of only retards use nation for definition of a state and not the people

>>132214938
>Not a single word about race or ethnicity in the Constitution.
>All equal under the law.
>NOT CIVICS
Whatever.

>>132215148
Anon said that different groups of people migrated to the British Isles, which is true. The other anon said that humans have never migrated and this must be some kind of fluke, which is what prompted that post. tl;dr, stop strawmanning.

>>132211527
is Civic nationalism the new Libertarianism?kek

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While liberals are already claiming victory saying "demographics are destiny", they are missing a crucial detail: Trump's interest in White Immigration

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mob-8wN6kpU

Trump wants to increase Immigration for whites while denying most of the third world if not all. He's interested in repealing the 1965 immigration act.

As a result the Non-Hispanic White birth rate Will grow even more if he succeeds in this plan. The immigration of whites will probably come from Europe/Anglosphere/Southern Africa at the most. SA because Trump supported the apartheid and might want to help them out as well.

This might completely reverse the demographic downfall of America if they happen to breed. The Non-Hispanic White birth rate is slowly rising and with this plan for white immigration it will only continue to grow more. With this plan, Mass Deportations, The RAISE act and Lowered Taxes.

We will stay a white majority country for a longtime.

>>132215174
Stop strawmanning if you want anyone to engage in any kind of serious debate with you, then.

>>132215217

He was saying we need to screen by IQ so we don't get libyans/somalis, anon.

>>132215169
Specifics on what? We're talking about abstract ideas, no amount of numbers and graphs are going to make a difference. If you can only cope with the concret then you need to go find your carer before you have an autistic spergout and hurt yourself.

>>132215250
>IT HAS TO BE WRITTEN INTO THE CONSTITUTION TO COUNT
>WORDS MATTER MORE THAN DEEDS YA
I guess the ancient tribes of Europe were civic nationalists too by your definition.

>>132215271

What I said is not a strawman.

You're saying migration happens, which it does.

Over the course of time FACTORS larger than what they're attempting to do now.

>>132215217
I have met black "Swedish" immigrants in America, but OK. I guess that didn't happen because you greentexted some words sarcastically.

>>132214981
They also thought blacks were monkeys and had barns full of them for slave labor.

>>132215352

You haven't been to Minnesota, I take it.

>>132215296
God I hope so. I really don't want every place in the US to look like Georgia or SoCal

>>132215304
Read this
>>132215296

If Trump was considered a civic nationalist he would be open to continuing the Hart-Celler act. Which he's not, He's pro-white immigration which is something those Kekistani retards don't want.

>>132215352
They wouldn't be considered white to immigration officers. It would mostly be whites coming in.

>>132215303
I fucking predicted it.
You can't just scream strawman and not add why it is a strawman. You also can't just scream "WRONG" without telling why someone is wrong. Get out of my face civic cuck.

>>132215229
>>132215248
Will a person's look in 300 years bother you? You're not alive by that time. At least 10-60% of your future kin will mingle with other 'race'. You can't stop what's inevitable. Nations can be preserved provided it doesn't become so corrupt, not ethnicity.

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>>132211527
>STOP DEMONIZING CIVIC NATIONALISTS
stop being niggers.
and stop trying to make my kids niggers.
and stop trying to get my kids to fuck niggers.
and stop trying to let niggers into this country.
and stop promoting niggers so you can get good goy kosher points with your retarded boomer fag friends.

>>132215327
Well you could start by summarizing my argument as you perceive it, instead of just calling me a cretin.

>>132215347
Calling things a strawan is a shield he uses to protect his feefees.

>>132215352
Plus what about Afrikaners/Boers why deny them access here? You want Poos or Chinks who lie about their IQ levels just so they can scam the fuck out of everybody.

>>132215347
I didn't mention modern movement of people.

>>132215419
Yes you baiting faggot. A man wants to leave his heritage as he intended. I want my blood to be pure until Ragnarök and beyond.

>>132211527
Most of us just scroll straight past the shill threads anon. They are barely more subtle than eceleb hate threads

>>132215250
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naturalization_Act_of_1790
>This law limited naturalization to immigrants who were free white persons of good character

>>132215419

It's not the look that bothers me.

It's the objective drop in quality of life that has happened.

The loss of community, the replacement of culture, the basal human fear reaction to those that are different. You can't rout this out of human instinct. It doesn't work like that.

>>132211527
your post is wrong

>>132215335
Keep fooling yourself. Your origin, or your nobility, did not matter in the eyes of the founders.

>>132215411
A strawman is a strawman because you are simplifying or misrepresenting an argument in order to make it easier to defeat. Do you not know the definition of a strawman argument? Quote which one of your strawmans you actually believe to be a valid argument and I'll be happy to explain why it isn't.

>>132215435
Again, you've taken it extremely personally when I've clearly been referring to your general type throughout the thread. If you can't distinguish between that and my more personal attacks then you should genuinely go to a Doctor, you might legitimately be an autist. I suppose that's ad hom though, right?

>>132215510
The founders could never even consider a different migration to this.

>>132215419
>Will a person's look in 300 years bother you? You're not alive by that time
Yes it will bother me, you are not arguing with a nihilist
>At least 10-60% of your future kin will mingle with other 'race'. You can't stop what's inevitable
>I-i-it won't w-w-work do-n't even try
Lmao, somehow it worked for millennia or two to keep my distinct ethnicity alive

>>132215581
You haven't presented any more complex of an argument, if you've presented one at all. There's no simplification occurring.

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>>132215510
Civics want "High IQ" Shitskins over Whites, That's how you can tell they're anti-white. Like Trump said in that video we need to completely restore white immigration for the states and completely limit third world immigration entirely. Otherwise you'll have shitskins lying about their education like Nigerians,Poos and Chinks who only come here to scam and take jobs away.

America doesn't need more brown immigrants, They've fucked our country up enough since 1965. Restore the 1790 immigration act or just make most immigrants white.

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>>132215250
>free white person

>>132215581
Now you give us the definition of a strawman but not why my argument was one. Wanna know why? because it wasn't. Yours was a strawman. You compared thousands of years of extremely slow migration with modern immigrants who flood white countries in a matter of a few years.
>>132215571
>Keep fooling yourself. Your origin, or your nobility, did not matter in the eyes of the founders.
Why did the US then almost only take in Europeans up until 1964?

>>132215641
Okay move your goalposts, but I just proven you wrong, they did talk about race. Its from the first congress.

>>132211527
>all ethnicities join forces and fash up
>divide america up into ethnocities/FFA zones
>leave degeneracy in the dust

>>132215596
I haven't taken anything personally. You're just not giving me anything substantive to work with, so I'm asking you to put more effort into your posts.

>when I've clearly been referring to your general type throughout the thread.
That becomes a problem when you are completely misrepresenting my argument and just building your own strawman in which you erroneously equate civic nationalists with cultural Marxists. Why would I waste my time replying seriously to something so ridiculous?

>>132214188
>white genocide isn't real
White people accounted for 25% of the global population in 1950. Now it's on track to be 10%. In 1970 whites made up 80% of California's population. Now it's less than 40%

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/California#Population

http://buchanan.org/blog/pjb-the-way-our-world-ends-985

>>132215661
>if you've presented one at all
Why is this a question to you? Are you unable to identify the arguments that I have presented in the thread? Did you read any of my posts?

https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2016/03/how-sophisticated-test-scams-from-china-are-making-their-way-into-the-us/474474/

>>132215816
You High IQ plan won't work for shit, Shitskins will still find their way into our country. Australia and Canada did the same and they're flooded with Chinks and Poos.

>>132215759
Reminder that Spain has 6.1 Illegals in their country. A lot of them are Mestizos too, So you're probably talking to a Mexishit.

>>132215865
*6.1 million

>>132215571
>founders didn't care about national origin
That's why they kept niggers as slaves right

>>132215678
>Civics want "High IQ" Shitskins over Whites
Set the test high enough, and no non-whites will be eligible to emigrate.

>>132215759
Quote which one of your posts you want me to explain why it's a strawman. I already asked you to do that, but you still haven't. Want to know why? Because you're afraid of my answer.

>>132215903
Or what about calling the natives "merciless Indian savages" in the Declaration of Independence

>>132215906
https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2016/03/how-sophisticated-test-scams-from-china-are-making-their-way-into-the-us/474474/

They will just set their IQ levels higher, Look at the the chart that contains countries by IQ and it's mostly Chink countries. We will be flooded with fake business men and not whites.

>>132215816
>misrepresenting my argument
Here you go again, placing the blame on us when you haven't represented anything of significance to be misrepresented.

Why don't you put more effort in to your posts instead of being a slimy cretin and throwing the names of "logical fallacies" around with gay abandon.

>>132215985
Yeah, because disqualifying countries that use fraudulent tests isn't a thing.

>>132216011
>repeating back what someone just said to you as a response to them
How old are you?

>>132215906
Yet more idealistic thinking. You people are the biggest utopians for all the utilitarian image you present.

>>132216045
Asians have higher IQ's just deal with it you cuck

>>132216045
You do realize Trump wants more white immigrants right? If you disagree with that video and the evidence I backed up you're basically saying that Trump isn't a civic nationalist. If we try shit like Merit-Based immigration or IQ immigration we will only be flooded with Asians and Asians only. Australia and Canada mostly get Asians and the same will happen to us. We need mostly white immigrants, None of this IQ shit.

>>132215760
It was taken for granted. Since the others didn't counted as people.

Receiving a good quality migration makes you a great country. It happens to be white. In no sense it equals to white nationalism.

They were trying to break with an ethnic European model that they considered to be obsolete.

Nothing wrong with opposing civic nationalism if you are consistent. But if you love Trump and claim to oppose civic nationalism you are either a liar or deluded.

>>132216109
>claiming other people are copying you
How old are you?

>>132216134
Calling a practical solution to a problem "idealistic," "utopian" and "utilitarian" isn't an argument. It's word vomit.

>>132216189
Except he wants more white immigrants and less third world ones. Did you watch the video I linked, Trump is not a civic nationalist.

>>132214745
Just as predicted, you completely missed the point

Whether blacks are subhumans or not doesn't matter as long as they are supporting us

>>132215660
>Norway has been white for millennia, so that won't change in the future
You might want to take into account the exponential growth of immigration and the modern technologies which allow this immigration to happen. It used to take 4 months to travel from U.K. to Australia in the 1800's. Now it takes less than 24 hours

https://museumvictoria.com.au/discoverycentre/websites-mini/journeys-australia/1850s70s/

>>132216237
So you want America to become a Chinese/Poo colony? Because that's what IQ immigration gives you.

>>132215816
>I haven't taken anything personally. You're just not giving me anything substantive to work with, so I'm asking you to put more effort into your posts.
>>132216011
>Here you go again, placing the blame on us when you haven't represented anything of significance to be misrepresented.

It's plagiarism, is what it is.

>>132211527
>We need to re-establish national sovereignty first.

agreed. and that means no persons with dual citizenship in the United States Government, period.

>>132216286
This is another strawman. I made my view on this clear in an earlier post. I did not say that IQ should be the only factor.

>>132216239
Trump wants to enforce the law and protect the American people

Extreme vetting, deporting illegals, etc.

He doesn't want to genocide entire groups of people like white nationalist morons. He understands there are good and bad people of all races.

>>132216164
>It was taken for granted. Since the others didn't counted as people.
If it was taken for granted why did they explicitly said "white people"?
>Receiving a good quality migration makes you a great country. It happens to be white. In no sense it equals to white nationalism.
Again it not just happened to be white. It was by the law.
>They were trying to break with an ethnic European model that they considered to be obsolete.
Funny, other faggots that spout that shit pretend that ethnicity did not matter until 19th century.

>>132216343
Trump wants more white immigrants, You just have to accept that. Are you pro-ANC and do you want White South Africans to be genocided? They have a shit education system over there. Your IQ tactic won't work for shit nor help whites at all. America mostly took in whites before 1965 and it should stay that way.

>>132216401

>>132215296
I'm sorry you're fucking retarded, But Trump wants to keep the immigration system the way it was before 1965.

>>132216265
>supporting us
You've got to be kidding. Despite your bending over backwards for these nogs and treating them like kings they vote democrat across the board. Every region, both sexes, and every age group, ALL majority dems BY FAR. Instead of fighting a losing battle why not just get rid of the savages? They hate our guts anyways. I live near a nest of these creatures, they want us all dead.

>>132211527
trump is shit

>>132216401
Also vetting is what Australia did and now Melbourne is becoming another Beijing.

>>132216278
You should probably read the conversation chain before posting. And you are not breaking any news for me, its kinda insulting when some dumb faggot comes into conversation and dumps some basic bitch knowledge on you.

>>132216237
Bit of a simpleton aren't you? Sorry for using big words, lad.

>>132211527
>my double digit IQ can't comprehend what's going on

>>132216445
Great, bro. I accept it. I have no idea why you think I don't.

>>132216302
>the practice of taking someone else's work or ideas and passing them off as one's own
I certainly am not passing them off as my own.

>>132216604
You just can't seem to stop with the name-calling, can you? Have you ever formulated an actual argument in your entire life?

>>132211741
MONGREL

>>132216564
Yes don't believe these delusional idiots. Australia was all white with the 'White Australia policy', once it became le based civic we were swamped with asians and are on our way to a white minority in 20 years.

>>132216509
>Instead of fighting a losing battle why not just get rid of the savages?

You don't understand. We can't get rid of them. There is literally no way we are ever going to genocide an entire race in the US, 99% of Americans don't want it.

Once you understand this, you can start thinking about how we can use them, instead of how to get rid of them.

>>132216616
I think America overall would be better off that way. Repealing the 1965 Immigration act would save us from minority-majority status. Plus the whites in Southern Africa need to find somewhere to go, Before the government starts killing them.

>>132211527
you have to go back

>>132216659
You denied copying me. It's certainly dishonest and vindictive to act like an elementary schooler as you did.

>>132216402
The system worked very well until 1965, receiving white immigration without distinction of nationality, ethnicity, creed, or any other circumstance. All the same under the law. The founders were enlightened elitists who had not even considered another model of immigration. This was common sense at the time, and they did not try to force a sense of belonging to a group except America. WE THE PEOPLE

Their common sense was institutional racism, and apparently white nationalism for some.

>>132216265
>only the current support of blacks matter
That's a very shortsighted view: I recommend you take a trip to the ghettos of Chicago, Baltimore, or New Orleans and then form an opinion on whether minority support for a zeitgeist agenda is what's important

>>132216660
Those in glass houses and all that.

Also suggesting I've never done so in my life is a bit of a strawman, by your nonsensical definition at least.

>>132216684
Merit-Immigration would be even worse, America needs a complete restoration of previous acts that benefit white immigrants. Hopefully Trump manages to get that through without being fucked over. America is already bad enough, It would be even worse with those Chinks and Poos running around and fucking over businesses. Civic Nationalism is almost impossible considering nonwhites vote against things with nationalist in the title.

>>132211527
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ud6sU3AclT4

>>132216775
Are you really trying to protect the intellectual property of a fucking 4chan post? Get your Jewish lawyer to sue me, why don't you?

>>132216811
>Those in glass houses and all that.
Quote one time I have name-called in this thread.

>>132216792
>The system worked very well until 1965
??? The system would have worked very well past 1965 if it had not been changed. What kind of argument is that. You know that a Jew was behind that law change right?
>WE THE PEOPLE
And they meant white people, since they were at the first congress...

>>132211527
>We need civic nationalists to make the world go round.
Sounds like the same (((reason))) we need the (((banks)))
>Civic nationalists do not harm ethnic nationalists' goals at this stage of the game anyway
Civic nationalists are good goys.
Race realists need to be realistic about the solution, to break (((their))) hold on Western society you need to break the (((banks)))

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>>132211527

Americans only push civic nationalism because they have no specific ethnicity.

I'm ethnically English before I'm nationally British. All my ancestors were English, this was also the case for the original American population.

The white Americans of today are generally a mixture of several European peoples, making an individual say, a quarter Italian, a third Dutch, a tenth Irish, etc.

What makes somebody American is nothing more than a passport at this point.

>>132216920
Close. I'm trying to protect the intellectual INTEGRITY of a 4chan BOARD by calling out the many dishonest and disingenuous statements you and others have made.

>>132216938
>Have you ever formulated an actual argument in your entire life?
I was referring to this. I couldn't give a toss about name-calling because I'm not acting under the pretense of civility.

>>132216775
Civic nationalists are soft brained retards. The nationalist part is great, the civic not so much. Apart from it being a pretty much made up term, it's a slippery slope towards a nationalist version of socialism (which is pretty much all socialism before 1970), and not in the NSDAP sense

>>132217017
You're not helping your case.

>>132216703
That's the thing, millions of people would love to just get rid of them but feel guilty and are scared of liberal retribution. As racial awareness becomes mainstream more and more will be on board with the idea of getting rid of them. We don't even have to kill them, just sterilize them and ship them back to their own countries. End gibs for them and they won't even want to be here.

>>132216239
The fact that Trump wants more immigrants from Europe doesn't mean he isn't a civic nationalist. All he said in that video was:

1. Illegal immigrants vote for the Democrats, so it makes sense for Republicans to oppose illegal immigration
2. It's hard for skilled and highly educated people from European countries to immigrate to the US, which is bad

One can easily believe those assertions without being a racial national. One can explicitly believe in racial differences without being a racial nationalist.

>>132217014
A country that mostly has white Americans (Mixed Ethnic or not) and usually gets White immigrants would be better off for America. We were a white melting pot, that's what made our country special. The South is filled with British and Scots-Irish who label themselves as "American" since they've been here for so long. Even having decedents in Southern Brazil which mainly consisted of Soldiers who fought for the South that fled to Brazil during the end of the civil war.

>>132216960
Yes, I see other homogenous nation states resisting non white immigration heroically. Oh wait.

As I say, all that was taken for granted. Where is white nationalism?

>>132216884
>>132216884
Yeah. A lot of the asians here are Uni students. What people don't seem to get is the sheer population size of China and India means, even in an elite high iq immigration model you would still get overwhelmed by non white immigration. The Chinese middle class is around 500 million people now, and the Indian middle class is over 100 million, to say nothing of the rest of the world.

You can not maintain a white majority without explicitly legislating it and maintaining it with that volume of people.

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>>132216920
>Are you really trying to protect the intellectual property of a fucking 4chan post? Get your Jewish lawyer to sue me, why don't you?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ

>>132217031
Well that's not name-calling, so you're just being disingenuous by drawing a false equivalency. I don't care if your feelings were hurt when I challenged you to formulate better arguments. That's your fault for emotionally investing your ego into your constant and vindictive attacks against me. Crying and blubbering because I fought back won't earn you any sympathy.

>>132217043
>Civic nationalists are soft brained retards.
Great argument.

>>132217132
Bannon wants to bring over White South Africans and Trump also mentioned Anglo countries too. He wants to restore the white immigration standard that America had Pre-1965 while limiting the third world. Him and Sessions supported the 1924 immigration act and how it mostly let in Europeans and Other Overseas whites. And I think he might want to repeal the 1965 immigration with a more beneficial one to Overseas whites and Europeans

>>132217014
Nationalism and ethnicity are not the same thing. Ethnicity is derivative of naionslism. Nationalism inherently corresponds to pride as support of ones nation. That can be based on some kind of ethnic identity, but equally can be based on concepts of sovereignty and governmental systems/rule of law

>>132217017
Kike, can you explain to me why we need the (((banks)))?

>>132217258
What makes you think I have the ability or interest in doing that?

Selectively breeding humans via Eutelegenisis (sperm donation eugenics) is the only sensible way to fix the world.
nationalism does not, and will not, work, because we are so connected from by free trade.

>>132217204
>>132217204
I was suggesting that you haven't presented an argument in your life either you absolute dunce. I thought I made it obvious enough but Civics never fail to astound.

>>132217222
Get off molyneuxs dick. Not everything is an argument. Discounting a whole persuasive statement because of one line which you took offense to is moronic. You gonna ask for 'muh proofs' next?

>>132217155
>Yes, I see other homogenous nation states resisting non white immigration heroically. Oh wait.
What is that even supposed to mean? Do you want to say that the immigration on which is on the levels of displacement that we have today was desired by the majority? Did we ever get referendum on if we want to be displaced? No? Then fuck off
>As I say, all that was taken for granted. Where is white nationalism?
"Only whites can come and be citizens" is not just taken for granted its explicitly exclusionary of other races.

>>132211527
>civic nationalism has more chances of getting implemented than ethnic nationalist

You are wrong my friend, and i will tell you why. The moral relativity that underlies the current civil nationalist movement, born of imageboards and reddit, is inherently degenerate. "It doesn't matter if you are a fag/nigger/kike/tranny/fatso/whore, as long as you think like us!" says the civil nationalist, and that's why your most prominent leaders are degenerates that can't really go beyond being anti-pc. Ethnic nationalism involves clear values and a moral code, it's not plagued by the relativity Jew. These values are only strenghtened by the fact that their purpose is to strengthen and protect your tribe, not otherwise. That's why the media freaks out about Richard Spencer to the point of inciting violence against him, while gleefully laughs at the so called "alt-lite". That's why Spencer is still around, growing slow and steady, after facing the most heinous backlash, verbally and physically, while it takes nothing to character assassinate people like Milo into oblivion. And do not confuse ethnic nationalism with the likes of David Duke and other degenerates, because racism without value is just racism, it will never be something more.

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>>132214084
>Name one thing white nationalists have accomplished for the West. One.
Create your country
http://www.indiana.edu/~kdhist/H105-documents-web/week08/naturalization1790.html

>>132217414
>I
Have you replied to me a single time in this thread?

>>132217429
>a persuasive statement
Is that what you call it when you generalize a whole group of people and name-call them "soft brained retards"?

>>132217536
Who are you quoting, Italian?

>>132217301
>I have the ability or interest in doing that?
Because you were making the point that civic nationalists were a vital part of the movement.

Every civic nationalist will defend banks over people.

Have you ever been to rural America? Banks enslave and degrade rural America. Civic nationalists support the disintegration of national sovereignty.

The only true nationalist solution is a racial revolution. Civic nationalists oppose the racial revolution which will be the final solution.

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>>132214177
You idiot, the whole point is that there is barely any sunlight between a nation and its people. You've just confirmed every one of his points by not realizizing this and considering a nation to be just the material and legal content. What you call a nation IS NOT A NATION. Replace the culture, replace the people, up in flames it goes. The idea here is often that you just need "skills". For example, civic nationalist think it's a great idea to brain drain the middle east for intelligent people, because intelligence is the most important metric. After all, why wouldn't a shitskin with an IQ of 150 be a doctor over here? Meanwhile the culture rots around them but that's okay since that's for their (non-existent) children to deal with.

>>132217563
Your newfaggotry is showing a lot now. The guys in this thread have been remarkably easy on you by 4chan standards.

>>132216884
>>132216884
The world just needs to stop immigration period. Stay in your own fucking country. If you don't like your country then improve it. We have too many people as it is. And this Jew-tier argument that we need foreigners to add to the workforce is a special type of horseshit

>>132217563
Back to plebbit, your type doesn't merit proper arguments

>>132217632
What the fuck are you even on about? Fuck off with your retardation.

>>132217651
>strawmanning AGAIN the idea that I think IQ should be the only standard for immigration
Instead of only reading what you want to see in my post, why don't you read every sentence and TRY to comprehend what I actually wrote?

>>132217665
You have no idea what I'm capable of.

>>132217460
Civic nationalism is Intrinsically superior to ethnonationalism, because it allows the addition of the best of the best, of any other human group. Meanwhile, ethnonationalists will be forced to choose only among the best of their own group.

It simply must be directed intelligently in those aspects that wish to be enhanced. Make it as strict as you want. Is a winning idea.

>>132217792
You know a lot about reddit, huh.

>>132217702
>Goy don't help whites like Afrikaners get out of their country
>Goy don't allow whites to move here, stop all immigration so browns can massbreed in your country and not have to worry about leaving

Fuck off with this stop all immigration crap, that won't help shit for us. We need to make the majority of Immigrants white rather then third world. And limit the amount that can come each year. To at least 250,000-500,000 like the RAISE act is doing. But only with whites being the majority of immigrants. As well as Resettle the Boers and Afrikaners who the South African government is trying to kill. Half of American blocks have no people living in them anyways. We aren't remotely overpopulated.

>>132217133
Why must we continue to add to this (((melting pot)))? The pot is full.

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>>132217954
Nothing wrong with white immigrants only

>>132217536
>It doesn't matter if you are a fag/nigger/kike/tranny/fatso/whore, as long as you think like us!" says the civil nationalist

>Ethnic nationalism involves clear values and a moral code

Do you realize you just completely contradicted yourself?

You just defined ethnic nationalism being about how people think, which is civic nationalism.

That's why civic nationalism does work, because it is about morals and values, and not about skin color.

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>>132217817
Are you autistic or something? You did the same thing with another poster, picking something out and then discarding the entire post as bad faith cause of "muh strawman". I explicitly said "FOR EXAMPLE" before the IQ thing you fucking idiot. Are you one of those insufferable retards who can't have a conversation unless the other guy agrees to exactly your terms and perspective?

The point is that civic nationalists consider the people and the nation to be largely independent, replaceable, and in some sense "it's up to every civic nationalist what to make of that". Of course IQ isn't the only metric but what kind of moron thinks that "high IQ = yay" is a strawman of civic nationalism. God I almost want to point out the irony here of complete autism not even understanding what a people means, and instead focusing all of their efforts on engineering a "nation" that everybody in theory could live in.

Anyway, you're the one arguing in bad faith here, so no more replies for you bb. Have fun arguing using fallacies and formal definitions, we'll see how reality treats the civic nations open to all (except of course those who wouldn't enrich it)

>>132217105
If only 1% of the US population wants ethnic genocide, then the other 99% of the population will gladly kill you instead.

I don't think you understand how few people want what you want, the vast majority of the population are centrists.

>>132211527
Civ Nats need to stop punching right i dont know what posses them to pick a fight with Ethno nationalists.

>>132218161
>You did the same thing with another poster, picking something out and then discarding the entire post as bad faith cause of "muh strawman".
Talk shit, get hit. Try to do a better job not saying ridiculous things next time.

>>132217853
Why are you goalpost moving? We were talking whether founding fathers were white nationalist or not. Which I guess you don't disagree with considering that you just gave up the premise that they were not in favor of arguing that immigration is good.

>>132218268
Oath Keepers are white knights, not civic nationalists.

>>132217920
Shitskins can get deported and the legal cunts can get repatriated with financial incentives back to their homeland in a real world scenario. I see nothing wrong with taking some afrikaaners and the odd Irishman but I'd rather have very strict immigration and work on broke ass w. Virginia whites getting jobs, not some foreigner. Immigrants don't just rock up and that's that, they need to contribute to the economy with labor and that means one less job for a native son

>>132217563
>can't comprehend a dynamic IP
You continue to make me suspect your autism given that you can't work this one out.

>>132218305
lol. i encourage everyone reading to check out this fucker's (((discussion))) with burgerbro and then filter him from the thread.

>>132211527

>Civic nationalists do not harm ethnic nationalists' goals

They still want to import the worlds peasants into Europe. The only thing that is different about them and globalists is that they believe their patch of land is better than the others. Not the people, the land and how people behave on that land. Thats it. Different ideas, same end goal as globalism.

>>132218305
Stop shitting up this thread, you're contributing nothing

>>132218349
That's why shrinking the numbers but still allowing white immigrants would be a win/win. Areas of America will get whiter while illegals and refugees will be replaced with American workers.

>>132218442
Can't really argue with that

>>132218422
I'm the OP. I contributed the thread itself. You are only posting here because of my magnanimity in starting and then directing the conversation.

>>132217817
>What the fuck are you even on about?
I'm saying demographics are fate and the only way to stop the demographic decline of the white race is if white people revolt and overthrow the people enslaving white people.

Banks are forcing people to work three jobs to pay for mortgages and then they still steal their house.

Civic nationalists are in a struggle with snowflakes and liberals. Ethnic nationalists are in a struggle to preserve the white race, their enemies are packs of niggers on crack or muslims overrunning and raping the women of Europe.

It's not the same struggle.

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Can we all agree that punching right only hurts our common cause and that the enemy is defined as the globalist right and the international left. I get the feeling that the big Civ Nat players were given orders to Night of the Long knives the radical elements in Trumps coalition but have failed and now it is brewing into open war.

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>>132218268
It's simple, they hate our guts and consider us to be standing in the way of compromising with the left on the ONE. IMPORTANT. ISSUE. Cernovich and other reddit civic nationalists still see politics as choosing from a menu of ideologies in a democratic system, and then having those groups sort of cooperate and expand their influence. They figure that we can just make our message more appealing and reasonable considering our current times, so that it might actually be implemented. Also, they have enormous problems with conceding any moral highground about there being no moral highground. A lot of atheists, redditors, civic nationalists, libertarians etc get real upset when you talk of degeneracy, because more important than their objective engineering perspective on how to design society is their belief that we should "live and let live", i.e. up to the point where anybody should be able to live anywhere as long as they "do their job" or participate at least. This seems to me another reaction to the idea that maybe some kinds of people can't live together in soms kinds of nations. A group of whites living among mudhuts would go equally insane as the reverse, and this extends far beyond race to the culture of a country too. But anyway, they
1) Either don't believe in racial differences or believe free association will fix all that (black people underclass, not our fault, etc)
2)Can not be within 10km of criticsm of moral relativism.
Now that I think of it, it's actually remarkably similar to how atheists react to christianity (note: not religion in general, only christianity)

>>132218378
If you really are the same Brit as earlier in the thread, then it's all the more confusing that you would continue to spout non-arguments as if you thought I would start taking you seriously eventually. Can't you learn?

>>132218712
Tweets like that can be made by anybody, you know. I've never even hear of kekistani free press. Sounds like some account that liberals created to discredit us.

>>132218712
>Now that I think of it, it's actually remarkably similar to how atheists react to christianity (note: not religion in general, only christianity)
You nailed it mate. Their belief system seems to be completely incompatible with the idea of homogeneous racial groups seeking self determination.

>>132218676
>that punching
>hurts our common cause
>the enemy is defined as the globalist right
The enemies are
1.(((banks)))
2. Liberals
3.(((chosen)))
4. Muslims
5. Asians
6. Africans
>I get the feeling that the big Civ Nat players were given orders to Night of the Long knives the radical elements in Trumps coalition
And this is why the Nazi flag is BS, because everyone posting from a Nazi flag is a fucking cuck.

>>132218888
yes, and now read the rest you insufferable cretin.

>>132218337
The tounding fathers were not white nationalists, since they could not conceive other way of having a nation than being white. Were the ancient greeks, wn? Under your point of view, they were. But it's a natural occurrence in civilization.

So, in a sense, they were racially aware. But all people are, from a subconscious level. At no time was a condition in the creation of US.

>>132219002
*founding

>>132218888
This too but when you have boomers like Bill Mitchell and traitors like Cernovich .... I mean what do Civ Nats expect us to do? just lie down and die? it is not our nature we have been fighting the long war for decades.

>>132218649
>Civic nationalists are in a struggle with snowflakes and liberals. Ethnic nationalists are in a struggle to preserve the white race, their enemies are packs of niggers on crack or muslims overrunning and raping the women of Europe.

Good luck ever preserving the white race, when half of the white race wants to see themselves wiped out

If minorities are such degenerate retards, why can't you just get of them?

Because they are being protected by LEFTIST WHITES. Understand your true enemy.

>>132218993
Quote fully or not at all okay Bolshevik.

>>132218049
>>>132217954
>Nothing wrong with white immigrants only

BRO. Do you realize what that map is telling us? The globalists are blocking us from establishing mountain hideaways in our own western land! That's why they don't let anyone live in the Rockies!

>>132217853
Civic nationalism wouldn't help the 'best of the best' from leaving your country like they've done for the last decades

>>132218747
>>132218888
>that liberals created to discredit us.
What is your solution to the liberal problem?

Exactly you have none.

Racial revolution solves the liberal problem. Your inability to make one argument about race shows what a major cuck you are.

You don't care about America otherwise you would see that times are dire and America needs a revolution where white people stand up for their dignity and self preservation.

The demographic clock is ticking and the US is getting closer to some major tipping points from which there will be no return.

Civic nationalists don't even acknowledge demographic reality of Western civilizations.

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>>132219159
They are being protected by a brainwashed mob. Aside from the worst of the worst, all those WHITE LEFTIST WHITES will roll over to any ideology that's fashionable and mainstream at the time. This is how it's been everywhere since the beginning. Democracy, "all are equal" constitution and a non-stop open psychological warfare that took at least a century brought us to this place. Yes they are traitors, but they don't realize any of it. They often don't even understand the war we're in, figuring it just another democratic speedbump where we have to show the racists what the enlightenment was really all about. The enemy isn't the leftist white, we are all brothers in the end. Ours is a psychological war and you lose when you become nihilistic or murderous, same when it comes to lefties.

>>132219299
Goddamn globalists. They're also keeping us out of the northernmost parts of Alaska, just check the map if you don't believe me

>>132219319
And on to the filter you go you commie kike.

>>132211741

Great bait man.

>>132211741
Weak b8 'man'

>>132219159
>when half of the white race wants to see themselves wiped out
If white elites destroy their societies they deserve the fate that waits for them, it will be a racial revolution just not a white one.

>If minorities are such degenerate retards, why can't you just get of them?
Manpower, there is not much Nazbol support in the West otherwise there wouldn't be a problem with liberals.

>Because they are being protected by LEFTIST WHITES. Understand your true enemy.
>>132218993
Here's my list of enemies.

>>132219174
>Quote fully or not at all okay Bolshevik.
Sure thing Kikester.

Civic nationalists are right wing liberals. They undermine the spirit of progress inherent to Western races. They will not advance the interests of the majority race of their host countries.

Civic nationalists are the same type of parasitic leech on society all liberals are.

>>132219002
>The tounding fathers were not white nationalists
They were, you have no proof that they were not while I do have proof that they were
>since they could not conceive other way of having a nation than being white
But they already knew that non whites countries exists, how could they not conceive that?
>Were the ancient greeks, wn. Under your point of view, they were
No they were Greek nationalist, obviously. They did consider anyone non Greek to be Greek. What is your point?

>>132212724

The Kingdom of Portugal, Castille and Leon, Navarra and Aragorn hated and fought each other all the time.

But because we were white and Christian, we all joined in the battle of Navas de Tolosa to send the moors back to Africa.

We don't need to all become the same, as in a white ethno state.

All we need is to feel and enjoy the Navas de Tolosa spirit!

>>132214055

Yes indeed sir, yes indeed.

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civic nationalist are not real nationalists

>>132214403
white isnt a nation nor an ethnicity

>>132219836
What anon means is that it did not occur to them to engineer a nation as something that does not specifically belong to and serves its people. Its people, not "the people" or "anybody willing" or "the free and brave" or the "workers of the world". Hence, the idea that anybody in the world, of any culture or of any race, could join in the economy AND in government does not make sense to them. It would be a literal act of treason, since civic nationalist try to engineer a country as an abstraction apart from the people, and have no problem inviting others in. The idea of divorcing a nation from its culture, race and identity is the essential core of the globalist philosophy. Civic nationalists, if they ever were to unite, would quickly find that they either have to fracture again or we can basically make every country in europe a copy of the others in terms of their legal structure. Then people can choose where they want to work and live! HMMMMMM..........

>>132214084

This guy has a point.

Unless of course you consider any half decent white (male) person who lived before 1965 to have been a white nationalist.

>>132220078
This is true but for the Americas it is somewhat different their governments pursued the obliteration of their ethnic identities and replaced it with an American one.

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>>132220154
He's just a DnC Shill /pol/ has become flooded with them.

>>132220126

Your comment should be read by all, specially the civic nationalists themselves.

>>132220073

Great text in that illustration of yours.

>>132220126
I understand that part, but I already proven him wrong. Founding fathers DID favor whites over anyone else, its provable fact and he has yet to post anything disproving it.

I think civic nationalism is a great idea it's like a weaker more pallatable form of an ideology for people who would probably be opposed to nationalism in its traditional sense to swallow just like how watered down communism is socialism

>>132220154
The second KKK (est. 1915) was a white nationalist movement. It stabilized the US, preventing it from slipping into either fascism or socialism. Once it succeeded in cementing the American identity as a White English speaking Protestant nation, it rapidly disbanded. Without the second KKK the US would probably have fragmented in the 1920s or 30s, and there would have been western nation strong enough to stand against the communist block.

>>132220186
not true.
all americans still identify with their immigrant or slave ancestors somewhat.

>>132220591
You are so autistic holy crap. You DON'T understand that part then

>>132220595
It's more dangerous than you realize. It was civic nationalism which shattered America's political cohesion in the 70s. We were stable as a White English Speaking Protestant nation. Once that identity was thrown away for the myth of America as a Judeao-Christian society, and a "propositional nation", our politics began to rapidly deteriorate.

>>132220591
I have already explained it to you.

You are die-hard romantics with no pragmatic insight. You can defend your race and culture with civic nationalism. That's why you will always be easy to defeat.

>>132220695
Real Americans still have a national identity rooted in the colonial era, the stories of the founding fathers, and the ideal of America as a frontier nation. The slave/immigrant classes are populations which never fully assimilated and as such are not real Americans.

>>132220078

Yeah... unless:

1) Europeans and their somewhat pure offspring in other continents have to face non europeans, who will immediately constitute a threat to the European gene pool. Therefore, in non European lands, all Europeans are genetically similar.

2) If Europeans have a lingua franca like Latin or English, then Europeans can communicate to each other, and giving that the vast majority of European languages are genetically similar, thus express more of the same ideas when compared to other, more distant languages, if we can also take into account that our literary movements were rather similar comparing with literature from other places, I'd say that if we manage to have a lingua franca like Latin or English, then we arguably have the same language to an extent that non Europeans do not.

3) Given that a European culture exists, consisting of all that is common to the many, many different cultures of Europe... considering we basically have (had?) the same codes of honour and propriety/politeness...

4) Given our History can be understand as the History of a hundred families living in the same village,,,

5) Given that our religious is roughly the same, be it Indo-European Mythologies or the various kinds of Christianity... I can also argue that our spiritual needs and faults are to some extent similar... much more so than when compared to the rest of the world...

I don't Europe to become a huge Nationality like European Union wants it to become, no matter what.
But god damn, I have so much more in common with a treacherous Greek or depressing Finn than I have with a Moroccan, or the average Brazilian, my own brother's bastard sapwn...

>>132220595
The proper perspective is that civic nationalism, socialism, free capitalism and communism are all watered-down version of globalism. None of these groups have any interest or reason to preserve nations, not even the civic nationalists, since they consider the structure of a nation to be a product of intelligent engineering, like maximizing security and profits. The fundamental tenet in all of them is to destroy national sovereignty (as it lies with the PEOPLE, not a document or legal system). Every information source around you is turned against the idea of civic nationalism being anything other than reasonable. Just like classical liberalism (the hallmark of all centrists) is supposed to be the best of ALL worlds. But there is not a gram of monarchy in liberalism, and there is not a gram of national sovereignty in civic nationalism. What if the people suddenly decide they'd prefer their democracy to be white? OOPS! Well fortunately civic nationalists will have anticipated this obviously fallacious (and hateful!) perspective on the world, and fortunately we have designed our (((nations))) so that won't happen.

>>132220610

good info.

>>132221065
US history proves you're wrong. Civic nationalism, in the form of the myth of the "propositional nation", has been the dominant ethos of the American political elite since the 1960s, and it's why US politics is so polarized and unstable today.

>>132220735
I don't understand you. Since you are plain wrong they did engineer a country for whites. That is a fact.
>>132221065
You have yet to post anything disproving me wrong.
>You can defend your race and culture with civic nationalism
Defending your race and culture is ethnic nationalism you tool. You literally posted fuck all to prove or even argue your retarded premise.

>>132221319
The second KKK was a fascinating phenomenon if you give it some research. It was essentially a militant nationalist movement which distrusted the state, and so never sought to institutionalize itself as part of the state the way a fascist movement would. It prided itself on being an "invisible empire" which preserved the republic by subverting the government instead of instituting a formal dictatorship.

>>132221240

You are really bright for a Dutch.

Now seriously: Civic Nationalism is a joke. It is a transition road.

It leads either to true Nationalism or to Communism. (Socialism, Liberalism, etc are all Commuism to me, although I know that with Liberalism it is hard to argue such a thing).

Civic Nationalism is such a joke the wind will make it fall, it has no ground whatsoever.

Think about it this way: Wasn't Civic Nationalism the actual core (and I'm dead serious) of the Soviet Union:
Surpass your nation, your religion, your morality, culture, everything. You are the new man and this is our civic state. Also, be Nationalistic in a Civic/Soviet way.

However, I'd argue that some civic nationalists are actually making the road towards true nationalism, they simply haven't been red pilled yet.

>>132212050
>If so, how do you prevent it from devolving into multiculturalism?

The same way every single major nation of today was formed. The same way great empires like Rome lasted for so long. Enforced assimilation, up to and including having people to change their names if they want to belong.
Persecution of those who relapse or try to practice their old ways in secret in case of exceptionally persistent and pernicious foreign cultures, like Islam.

Note that this still may not be sufficient if racial divide is strong enough to greatly hamper intermarriage, as in the case of blacks. But it is still infinitely preferable to ethnic nationalism of today, becasue the latter clearly does not work and causes an unending cycle of division and disintegration.

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>>132221513
I know you don't understand me and I've stopped directing my posts at you a while back. You live in a world of formal definitions and facts and proofs and fallacies, and whenever you see something that doesn't go to your liking you pounce and strut around victoriously.
>"That is a fact."
I am trying to explain what another anon meant by his comment and all you have is "no no, they really were X, it's a fact." Nigger terms like "white nationalists" are INVENTED to describe things, they are not something to be diagnosed. You get exactly 0 points for finding it somewhere when people disagree with the content of what you're saying. They were not white nationalists in the modern sense of the word, they weren't X nationalists at all. Everybody was a nationalist for their own country then. You're a fucking retard and you seem to get off on enforcing formal rules on a discussion. Note that the result is that over half of your posts are "WRONG, FACTS, PROVE ME WRONG, FALLACY, STRAWMAN" and others. If I had to take a guess I'd say you're under 25 and only recently (2014?) got out of your dawkins/hitchens/harris reddit coma. You suck as an OP and should consider killing yourself.

>>132221726

I know you'll be offended but I think the KKK (or the idea I have of it) seems close to the bandits (bandoleros) of Southern Spain: A bunch of man of humble origin who said: Fuck it! There's nothing in it for me, let's go hide in the mountains and rob people who work for the "elites" and become local heros in the process.

As you said, some kind of rouge un-instutionalisable nationalism with a heavy anti-statism.

>>132221136
america isnt a frontier nation anymore, so maybe "real americans" are deluded. i dont agree with your definition anyway. there are no real americans, just americans
>>132221183
im talking about the general identity people carry for themselves. the idea of nation states is a recent idea from the enlightenment era, and most national european identities today come from that era.
the founders did have the idea of race and the effect of race on society, this is evident in their writings, however the problen of a "pure race nation" is not something they ever solved. ultimately civic nationalist is what the us became

>>132221839

No. First you have to expel them.
Then, you can assimilate those who want to stay and submit. You cannot assimilate them any other way.
You are a Russian, you should know better.

By the way, you'll never assimilate the Chechens and muslims of the Caucasus like you did with the muslims of the Volga, exactly because of that.
You missed a strong hand. Sure, you can kill them all in a heartbeat, but that will only breed contempt in the survivors.
A strong hand will be to give them an option: You either get the fuck out or you submit.

>>132222089
>america isnt a frontier nation anymore, so maybe "real americans" are deluded. i dont agree with your definition anyway. there are no real americans, just americans
>there are no real americans, just americans
Then how can you disagree with whites being an American identity.

>>132214300
>They essentially built it

Most of the glory and success of the West was built by people who self-identified as subjects to a monarch and members of a church, not as people of a nation united merely by blood.

Ethnostates only managed to decisively supplant monarchies across Europe, leaving a few with decorative roles, after WWI. Do you think it is an accident that this period also marked the start of the West's decline?

>>132221482
The most succesful, powerful, adaptative idea ever created. Since the dawn of time.

>>132221513
white
>they used the definition of human in the XVIII century

Can't wait to repeat my argumentation.

>>132221991
I'm not offended, and the English speaking world has a parallel for the bandoleros in the character of Robinhood. To understand the Klan you have to replace the Robinhood, steal from the elites, ethos with a vigilante ethos. The Klan saw their opponents as lawless invaders, not corrupt elites. Corrupt elites were seen as supporting the invaders, but the primary focus of the Klan's ire was on the Catholic immigrant classes who were seen as invading the country and subverting our democracy.

>>132221870
>You live in a world of formal definitions and facts and proofs and fallacies
Well I am sorry that I want some structure to the conversation, and that maybe someone could walk away from conversation being proven right. How shitty of me.
>no no, they really were X, it's a fact." Nigger terms like "white nationalists" are INVENTED to describe things,
>They were not white nationalists in the modern sense of the word, they weren't X nationalists at all
Hold up, so you bitch at me about my definitions of words when you project your understanding of white nationalism? Okay buddy. Founding fathers actually have more similarities with white nationalists since both of them want to limit USA only to whites, in that sense they are white nationalists since that is what white nationalists want to do too. It does not matter if the tern did not exist in 18th century.
>You suck as an OP and should consider killing yourself.
Lel you are just literal retard that wants everyone to play by his autistic personal rules.

>>132221740
>really bright for a Dutch
You are really kind for a Manuel.
Agree with everything else you said. I'm sad to think of the Russians who still haven't learned their lesson. I think it's inescapable to conclude that Communism is just another engineerd (((civic))) nationalist ideal. The people who push this stuff don't really care if it will actually stay communist (or civic nationalist), because the real goal is to destroy the old traditions. Both world wars were fought to destroy the monarchies, aristocrats and czars. The incidental byproduct of democratic <whatever> would collapse or could be taken over by international corporations eventually anyway. What's really dangerous is tradition.

>>132222325
its a race identity, not a nationalist one.
the only way you could reconcile the two is to have a "race nation" but the us was never a race nation because niggers lol

>>132222463
>they used the definition of human in the XVIII century
You can't prove that they did not realize that we and blacks, Asians and natives were same species. Not to mention that it does not disprove that they wanted to limit immigration only to whites.

>>132222623
The white indentity is a creation of the Americans to create a unifying factor for the Europeans in the US.
You don't just create a multinational/multiethnic society with people who have been killing each other for centuries.

>>132222623
lol i should probably post with my flag on come to think of it.

>>132222622
I'm going to add a Thanks for contributing to the thread your posts have given me alot to think about.

>>132222089
Actually America still has vast tracks of unsettled lands, and the frontier ethos is focused on the ideal of founding communities and social institutions instead of simply maintaining them. This ethos of founding is still very pronounced in American society and typically manifests as entrepreneurship. Also, unless you're using a proxy, it's not really your place to comment on American identity. I use the term "real Americans" advisedly. It is commonly used in politics by conservative ethnic Americans to distinguish themselves from the various "hyphenated Americans" who reject our authentic national identity.

>>132222717
>>132222222

They knew that (((others)))) existed.
Shut it down.

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>>132222559
>You live in a world of formal definitions and facts and proofs and fallacies
>Well I am sorry that I want some structure to the conversation
I just thought this was funny because you are Mr. Strawman himself, now acting all "well i'm sorry for wanting something good". You are definitely not older than 23.
>It does not matter if the tern did not exist in 18th century.
It does because the other anon and you were having a disagreement about it. See what I mean when I call you an autistic retard? You can't talk to people unless they follow your rules, which you yourself consider to be the rules of "rationality" and "logic". And then you say I want the same because I don't care for your rules! Talk about a blindspot.

Other than that have a nice day, I guess you can always take away from this thread that we're all bad debaters unlike you, right? We're just butthurt cause your intelligence and proper form outshines us all.

>>132222089
>the problen of a "pure race nation" is not something they ever solved

Don't understand this.

What you say is completely true. However, your fondness for the French Revolution -> Enlightenment -> Nationalism

as it is standard among the scholars of today, completely erases the facts that some forms of Nationalism preceeded said times. For intance, Rome, specially in the beginning, was pretty Nationalistic.
The old states of Europe before the French Revolution were pretty nationalistic in a blood and soil way FOR the nobility that commanded them.

When you accept that Nationalism is normal and that it derives from love to your family and make them succeed and make the world at our/their image, then, you'll suddenly see Nationalism everywhere.

Fast forward to today: Our identities are multiple: I live on the planet earth, in the continent of Europe, in the Iberian Peninsula... up to my street.

All I have and all I al I owe to those who came before me, who achieved it because of the Nation they created and maintained.
My Nation only exists because it is part of a Civilisation (and yes, a race).

Our identities exist and are multiple, even if we are not aware of them.