Ok /pol/, can someone explain to me why virtually everyone with

>>132138575
how new r u?

>>132138904
Not new at all, why?

It's all due to fiat money, anon. No gold or silver to back it up, no real wealth. Notice how volatile the economy has been over the as 40-some years, since Nixon took us off the Gold standard. The inflation crisis of the late '70's, the 1981 recession, the savings and loan crisis, the Great Recession...

This is also been coupled with outsourcing American manufacturing to China and India, and the decline of labor union membership (granted, they're lazy and they're thugs, but they take care of their own).

Almost all thanks to the (((Federal Reserve))). Read the book "The Creature from Jekyll Island".

>>132138575
>fact that real wealth for most of the population has been stagnant for decades

False premise and not a fact

>>132139111
checked because this has been a main /pol/ issue since roughly m00t recreated /pol/.

I suppose you've encapsulated it it with unusual clarity compared to most of the post-trump shit threads.

>>132139360
tbqh I haven't been on /pol/ for quite a while. I used to be a regular a few years ago, but I was more naive then so mostly only noticed the funny Jew memes.

>>132139815
Yeah I haven't really been hammering on it as in the early days. But now that all the BS shemitah stuff is old news it's probably about time to fire it back up within the more modern contexts of automation, replacement migration, geopolitical reorder, and the long-overdue hangover from 2007 that is entirely likely to hit this year or next depending on how things go.

But what's neat is we have brave anons like >>132139118
to recommend "The Creature from Jekyll" Island instead of it usually being me.

>>132138575
We've been in a hidden, un-discussed depression for a while. Wealth is all very well and good. It's not what they're interested in. The elites want to have something that you cannot have. They want you to be more manageable. They want society to progress beyond the days of some nobody redneck presuming to imagine that he has rights or has anything to say to policy-shaping leaders. If that redneck can get as rich as them then it mucks up their plans.

>>132139230
Maybe his phrasing was clumsy or a term was imprecise, but your response is completely ridiculous, especially supported by the data you have chosen.

>>132141323
And they want to take all the savings accounts, pensions, retirement plans, etc. That's been on the table for decades. Watch Illinois and see if they appoint a financial dictator like they did in other "bail in" failed states, globally.

>>132138575
Can you explain why you would try to help /pol/?

>>132141599
They want in real life what AT&T and Google want for the internet:
>pay to play, every step of the way.
Enabled by technology, they will bring about a more complete totalitarianism than has ever before been possible.

>>132141814
Can anybody with good sense and a conscience explain why they would help these fucks?

>>132141814
Because as much of a shithole as this place is, it's still the most open forum for discussion I've come across, and has shown me a side of society that I would've never believed existed otherwise.

Also, there's the fact that I'd rather look out for the material wellbeing of young men, because otherwise they'll do pointless shit like riot or fight each other over superficial politics.

>>132138575

It's because of immigration and outsourcing keeping wages stagnant. But leftist fucktards refuse to oppose the globalist menace.

>>132142135
Yup. The incoming profit model is all about setting up basically toll booths for everything because the goal is to eliminate private property ownership entirely, so even though people already are not fronting for ownership, it won't matter.

They'll probably start talking up a VAT for the US again before long.

>>132142288
This has nothing to do with left-right, friend. The "right " is just as complicate in this as anyone else.

The only thing that matters is if they have power or not. If you're in a position of authority, whether that's a CEO, a Democratic senator, a non-political head of a government agency, you're more than likely part of the problem.

>>132142477

Naturally the right is infested with proimmigration neocon faggots, but the difference is that they have to listen to us if they want to keep being elected. They will bend the knee for votes.

>>132142468
This is totally what UBI is. Once in place you can just eliminate all memory of money and have people thinking that consumables come from government in fairly apportioned rations, and there's no other way to feed yourself.

>>132139230
Then where did the middle class dissapear too :)??? Let me guess not into the growing masses of poor ;^)

>>132142809
I think this is what Trump was doing in endorsing that complete waste of time health care mess. Bashing the point into their skulls that they need him.

>>132142879
Right you are. And that's why they're pushing the automation thing even harder when it literally doesn't make any sense when you stop and think about it.

Now that folks are catching on more quickly, we'll see an increase in the exiting trend pointing out how this will play directly in to depopulation, transhumanism, and eliminating anybody who doesn't want to go along with it via technological arbitrage, economic slaver, the sick care system, and all the rest.

>>132142809
>but the difference is that they have to listen to us if they want to keep being elected
They really, really don't. Politics - on all sides - have been inundated with special interest groups and corporate molestation for decades now. Your average American worker now has about the same level of political clout as a subject in the Roman empire did. Everyone's livelihoods and communities are being utterly fucking raped before their very eyes, yet so long as there's funny political memes on twitter no one seems to mind.

>>132142264
An enlightened one. God damn its been too long. Its a major problem. Majority of pol has fallen for the smoke and mirrors. Army of subvertists doesnt help either. They will flood the thread soon enough. Good on you for inciting discussion. Ive been pretty demoralized as of late after determinning the scope of the whole damn thing.

>>132138575
Benefits have grown my leaps and bounds during this time of stagnant wages. If you factor in all the benefits along with the wages, the net is keeping pace relatively speaking.

>>132143485
South Africa is probably already set up pretty well to weather a financial storm though, no? I mean you guys already have to put up with shit all day every day and you're isolated.

BRICS is moribund so would you guys be affected significantly by the rest of the world going in to turmoil?

>>132138575
The reason why is the masses reluctance to adapt to a capitalistic society. They've been raised and molded to think that the only way to make money in society is to sacrifice your labor and time for it. The complete opposite of how to succeed in a capitalist system.

You don't give more time, labor, or even contributions to a capitalistic society to succeed.. You give it capital. You invest and use your capital to work. For some reason, no one does this. They simply try to put in more hours at work or get a promotion/new job. Saving and establishing a business with solid cash flow isn't a meme.

The end of aristocracy ended the artificial suppression of intelligent poor people, and the artificial support of unintelligent rich people. Once those barriers fell, we went through a couple hundred years of mobility as people sorted into their genetic positions. That's ending, though, as most people have fallen into their genetic position.

>>132143485
We're still out there, anon. We've just been drowned out by the swirling, brown oceans of shit that were unleashed after the election.

Just keep doing what you're doing and you'll start to see more of us.

>>132143485
yep current state of /pol being summer kindergarten and a shariablue/commie slide thread psyop makes this board /b tier .

>>132143877
>For some reason, no one does this.
are you kidding? the reason is that most people dont have capital

>>132143877
>no one does this
I think if you go outside you'll find most people still do this.

The unending problem with people spouting your line is that the replacement system is not proposed. I watched an interesting talk forwarded to me by one of my lefty friends. It was an old Jewish communist trying to convince the audience that more old fashioned communism just wasn't going to work and they had to face the fact that they all needed to help figure out what true communism really is.

It was actually a rather insightful talk. It just hit a wall at the end without having anything to offer other than
>welp
>idk lol
>you figure out how to do communism for me

>>132143214
There's a great NPR clip, maximally condescending about the stupid racist redneck scum in flyover country, that represents a journalist's notion of trying to be objective and listen to the other side (while constantly interrupting and explaining how they're wrong).
It followed a congresscritter to his town hall meeting in a Minnesota area where lots of violent illiterate diseased Somalis were dumped by the federal government. The news story here is the NPR reporter's surprise that people are not happy to wake up and learn that they now live in a version of Mogadishu with snow. There is a priceless exchange where a "racist" describes her child getting beaten in the head and face by a Somali playmate in an unprovoked and sudden outburst of rage, after they had been playing nicely for minutes. The congresscritter's priceless response to his entire constituency telling him that they did not want to babysit terrorists who physically attacked them within days of the meeting: "Well,honestly, I just don't understand what you want me to do."

>>132143778
>51% unemployment
>collapse of mining industry
>collapse of nationalized industry
>wholrsale corruption of billions of dollars
>nationalization of medcare (the only industry le Jews kept up to international standards, you DO NOT want to end up in a state mortuar-... I mean hospital)
>corrupt media inciting racial hatred
>next generation of government officials indoctrinate-, i mean studying in China.
Oh yes, things are rosy over here.

>>132144552
I don't mean to imply things are going well there. I'm just wondering how much of a margin there is for them to get worse. If the US, for instance, were to descend just to what you are already going through then it would probably turn in to an uncontrollable war zone.

>>132144396
The replacement system is those people who are unable to save up or earn enough interest on their capital will become the modern day servant class.

They'll take your orders at restaurants, manage them, cook the food, pump the gas, fix the cars, fix up the AC, build the houses, etc. They get paid for their labor, not for their capital. They could get paid for their capital, if they'd have the patience and discipline needed to save and invest for a few decades.

>>132144358
You can always cut modern luxuries, or begin using a little bit of capital to start. This thing, called patience, brings you a lot of fruit when growing trees.

Sure it isn't fair starting out when there are people who have parents that did it for them, or to help them get a long. Use it as motivation to give your kids, and their kids, a better life.

>>132144890
Isn't the growing renter class already being paid for labor since they have little to no capital (or even just massive debt -- paying rent on money that doesn't exist)?

I'm not sure what you propose to change such that those with capital would not use said capital to some advantage.

>>132144396
Thinking about it, capitalism and communism are one in the same.

A ruling class that gets served by a servant class. No matter what, you'll simply have people who will not serve, and short of killing them you'll have to end up serving them. Capitalism almost makes it so that at least the clever, patient people can escape from their wage shackles in favor of other pursuits. Not matter what you call it, it's the same shit.

Would you rather just be born into a servant class, maybe if you're lucky a ruling family, or would you rather atleast have the opportunity to get out of having your time stolen from you?

>>132144890
>They'll take your orders at restaurants, manage them, cook the food, pump the gas, fix the cars, fix up the AC, build the houses, etc. They get paid for their labor, not for their capital. They could get paid for their capital, if they'd have the patience and discipline needed to save and invest for a few decades.
It's already like that man. House prices in major cities all across the West have skyrocketed in recent decades, wages have not kept up with inflation in the slightest, career stability is in many ways non-existent. Sure, there are still pockets of places with cheap housing and ready jobs, but to bank on them solving these problems is to stick your head in the sand.

>>132145349
How does any system allow you to avoid having your time stolen from you?

>>132144544
Le Representative of the People is nothing but soothing words of empty promises. Its meme to convince people that their is someone actually listening.
>Spoiler Alert
There isnt. How fucking long till people realize this is anyones guess.

>>132145111
Can you rephrase that first line?

Of course capitalists would use capital to their advantage, and in this capitalist system we live in it is essential to use capital to get ahead, as it's the only way in this system.

>buy assets
>lower or eliminate liabilities
>give it a few years
>????
>profit

>>132145349
You.
Watch this:
https://www.hooktube.com/watch?v=RAGbPKM1RkI

>>132144716
They are doing everything in their power to further destabilize this shithole. Corporate greed is the only thing keeping us afloat. I imagine once theyve drowned the economy they will drop the apes crates of AK's to chase the whites of the valuable land and then the chinks will swoop in.

>>132145454
Solve what problems? There is nothing wrong here, it's simply the system doing as it's designed to do. Drive an even increasing wedge between those participating capitalists and those who simply use their labor to support their livelihood.

The only issue is that poor people will have to work more, afford less, and slowly move into a state of tent city living. They however have the power to change that by participating in the capitalist system for their advantage.

It really is only a problem for poor people or people who depend on an hourly wage or salary. However this system isn't built for them, so whatever. Get with the program and succeed or be ignorant to it and become a servant.

>>132145552
The system where you earn interest on your money enough so that you don't have to commit your time to earning it for a livelihood.

Ie. a capitalist system.

>>132138575
>This is the fact of life all over the world today.

No, this is the fact of life in the Western world.
It's called return to the mean.

Americans, and to a smaller extent Western Europeans, are used to a completely unsustainable lifestyle that was only possible because socialist ~half of the world was selling raw resources extracted with slave labor extremely cheaply.

These times are gone. Protectionist practices are fool's attempt at bringing them back and are going to make everything worse. They mistake the symptom for the cause. It's like trying to heal an ill person using makeup, trying to make him look like when he was healthy.

There's no economic reason why a person in America has to be paid 10x of what someone doing exactly the same thing in China earns.

>>132146181
How can you have a functional society where nobody is being productive and people just get free interest because they have imaginary money? I don't care if you call it capitalism or communism or doodleydooism. I just want to know what practical suggestions you have for adjusting whatever it is we are currently living in.

Otherwise it's about as effective as OWS: the haves just wait for the have-nots to get cold and go back home without having done much beyond virtue signal and give the police an excuse to use their police state toys.

>>132146080
What an unfortunate lack of empathy, my friend.

>>132138575
>real wealth for most of the population has been stagnant for decades?
My multiple tvs, guns, computers, and smartphone all beg to argue that...

>>132146080
>Just participate in capitalism bro
>Just start a real estate company or something

>>132146656
That's not because you earn more, it's because those things have gotten cheaper. Other, essential commodities though (property, education, healthcare, etc.) haven't though, and in fact have seen drastic increases in their prices, meaning that outside of some cool gadgets, we more or less have the same purchasing power we did in the 80s and 90s, even while global profits have exploded.

>>132145913
What does some guy who couldn't find peace in his soul and couldn't be content with his life have to do with what I said?

If you find peace and you're content and happy to spend your days as a servant or working as a stonecutter, than I am happy for you as you are an angel. However, some people don't. Some find it through serving themselves and allowing themselves to reign over servants so they can devote their time to pursuits of their liking, whether worldly or spiritually.

You're either serving, or being served. Choose which side you want to be on.

>>132146532
You can't. Some people would be made to be productive, this is the servant class I was writing about earlier. Some, the majority actually, are made to serve. They are being productive. The ruling, capitalist class, is earning interest off of their hard work and the value that they create for the companies that the capitalists have put their capital into. It is imaginary money, yet people continue to accept it, as long as they are willing to trade their time, energy, and even lives for it it will be worth value.

If you want a perfect society, you need one where everyone is serving and working and filling their role without question. It'd be heaven on Earth, and also eliminate all free will.

You can't have that on Earth where we have free will, hence you either have to serve or be served.

Reign in hell or serve in heaven type of scenario. Earth is simply a purgatory in between. You going to serve, or going to reign?

>>132138575

the world needs serfs too, bro

>>132146080
Youd do well on wallstreet. The exact reason for human misery. Let it be known that greed corrupted the best Earth had to offer. Debt is a cruel magic trick. All that labour could have been used for much greater means. Sturdy homes, infrastructure,education,space travel,energy,whatever would have followed. We could have colonized planets by now. But instead we buold useless fucking shit likes Bugatti Veyrons. Colonial Script was a decent system. Only failed due to outside manipulation. Even tally sticks worked. But to depend on such a system you need an honest human supervisor. And sadly due to people like yourself those wonderful systems will only remain as relics of the past.

>>132146623
I don't have that lack of empathy and am actually poor myself. I just realize how the world works, if anything it goes to show the lack of empathy of the world.

>>132146706
Or start out reselling toys or used books or some shit. Give it time and maybe one day you could be making real estate deals.

Just because it seems far fetched doesn't mean its impossible, or should even be mocked. You should get with the program before the gap gets even bigger.

And before you guys come and say, "theyll just tear down your walls and eat you!" That's what police and military are for, and they're simply modern day mercenaries.

There are several approaches to the issue but I believe all the mainstream ones overlook 2 crucial facts:
1. women liberation drastically increased the workforce supply, lowering salaries
2. the technology made many people redundant while population grew, which increased commodity prices
You can't escape it. People have Jootube and FakeBook and smarter phones but they paid for it by forfeiting their market value.

>>132147061

That's just if you want property in "good" areas where society is well established and you get a lot of value from living there, and if you want an "official" education (education itself, see Khan academy, online harvard course vids is nearly free) and if you want "modern" heathcare.

>>132147781
It is truly sick, and I don't hold it to be my ideal scenario. It simply IS the scenario and system that we have in place for us at this moment.

>>132148218

It's mostly this.

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>>132138575
You know what it feels like?

You're playing an online FPS. You are a skilled player. You can usually win a deathmatch at the top of the leaderboard if you put in some effort. Sometimes the noob players will call you a 'tryhard' or a 'cheating faggot' but you know they are just bad players. But then the next match a cheater joins. Blatantly hacking - wallhacks, aimbots etc. despite you're best efforts you get absolutely rekt. There's no chance whatsoever. You try to kick and ban this player, but vote kicking is disabled and you can only leave in disgust.

>>132145349
It's almost as if medieval peasants had more civil liberties than we do today. Work for your feudal lord, but you are guaranteed a place to live, food on the table, and to get married young.

>>132148379
I love this description of it.

If you're playing a game (life), why would you play it fair? If it is life/death, as life is, why would you play and limit yourself to a sense of morals, ethics, and virtues?

If you took that FPS seriously and had the need to be number 1 on the chart, you'd cheat as well. You simply love the game too much, you value the sportsmanship, the challenge, the feeling of accomplishment that comes from a job well done. Other people prefer to just have the reward.

Read "You Gentiles" by Maurice Samuels

https://archive.org/details/YouGentiles_414

I don't agree with it, but it is the war we are fighting.

>>132148629
Yep, also they weren't coy about it either, everyone knew their place and were content to work and contribute in unity. No matter their place on the ladder.

I think as soon as we started worrying about "civil liberties" as opposed to "right and wrong", just that feeling you have in your stomach, we went wrong.

>>132148784
Because we're not god damn kikes

>>132149026
Yeah, they're evil.

That's what I'm fucking getting at here. It's how the world works, it's how it is. Until you either adapt, or exclude people who don't hold the same values as you, you will have this struggle.

>>132148919
There's nothing to stop a return to feudalism within the current system, nor a commune, nor another Mondragon or other sort of co-op. But perhaps apropos of the thread topic, it seems people would rather complain or hang aroundi n academia, or perhaps get paid to give speeches about it instead of putting any of these ideas into implementation.

Meanwhile you have people, with or with out much capital, going out and trading their time for money to make a living, even if it's fundamentally undermined by the banking system. I don't see how imaginary ideas compete with that. I own power tools and the skills to use them (a form of capital) and I have in the past put them to use fixing things for people in exchange for money so that I could have food and shelter.

If you can't give me a better alternative then what use are you to me?

>>132148784
The Kabbalistic books hold a lot of knowledge regarding human psychology and such. They had such powerful knowledge at their disposal. Those books are REALLY old. Thousand of years. They must have seen the destruction their methods caused. To continue on that path...They enjoy suffering. Almost like they feed off of it.

>>132143485
The 1% keep these retards busy with dumb issues such race and nation to distract from that.
They too 89iq to care about the concentration of wealth.. the 1% already won when these retards for the majority of the 99%

>>132149361
My alternative are nation-states for people who recognize the same morals, ethics, and standards as each other.

Sure, you have a form of capital in a seperate system from our own, however it's not the capital used in this system. You need to be with people who appreciate and are willing to accept your form of capital as payment. In the society we're currently in, they aren't willing to, therefore it isn't. It is what it is, not what you'd like it to be.

You want something different, as we all do, then we need nation-states for people to be amongst people who share common values.

>>132149159
>The world will not be destroyed by those who do evil but by those who stand by and do nothing
Id rather die than take the bread out of my fellow man's mouth.

>>132149613
The destruction builds them up.

They want Israel to be above, and a light, unto all other nations of the world. It's in the old testament.

It's out there, it's obvious that they are working towards making Eretz Yisroel the center of the world for Jews only. The issue is getting people to do something about it, I feel as though the boiling point is approaching..

>>132138575

Who cares man. This obsession with material shit is what is fucking up our society. Who cares if you don't live in as big of a box as some other person. Who cares if you don't pimp as big of a status symbol as your neighbor. What our society needs is cohesion and culture. People need to listen to Beethoven and not Beyonce. Etc.

>>132149975
Then you're a servant, at least you know your place in the world. Now just be happy with it, or move to a place where you're surrounded by like minded individuals.

>>132150198
>Who cares if you don't pimp as big of a status symbol

Sin cares, you're pride and envy will care very much and cause you to give into temptations left and right. Well, that's how it is for most people on this Earth unfortunately.

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Once you have a certain amount it means nothing and you are still a normal person, but everyone below you starts going full retard crab bucket.

You just end up being fucking annoyed by how clearly stupid and socialist everyone is.

>>132149865
I'm not sure where we're not seeing eye to eye here. Every time I go outside, I am surrounded by people who are very willing to continue operating the current form of the economy.

I simply don't understand what it is you're proposing to change in order to improve the situation. I could propose concrete things like avoiding TPP and TTIP to bolster the nation-state such as it is, reforming immigration policy to maintain social cohesion such as we have it, use Brexit toward a temporary Anglosphere alliance as a way to counterbalance the existing forms of globaism, compel the Federal Reserve to issue large zero-percent interest loans for major infrastructure projects, on and on.

That's not perfect, but those are actionable demands with the potential to restore what I think we're both angling toward. Or am I wrong?

>>132149789
Thats the thing. IQ is a fucking meme. All the people ive talked to has sharp intellect. But the problem is that they only take in relevant information. If you start to point out the holes in the system they start to get dismissive and defensive. They have been apart of the system so long that it has become part of their identities. To challenge the idea is to challenge them. To get past this barrier is the hardest part. Everyone is so comfy in their little bubble they will not step out of it to smell the shit in the air. But that bubble is gonna burst real fucking soon. And we need a way to enlighten people before its too late.

>>132150796
That's how it always works though. You only get a tiny fraction of people willing to reconsider their beliefs in the face of new information. So that's the set of people you have to work with. The rest either eventually die off or just go along with whatever happens.

Let's take the thread topic for instance. Not one time in this entire thread has anybody been accused of sucking Peter Schiff's cock. 10 years ago I used to get that very accusation on an almost daily basis. So what we see is a very real shift in public perception even if it doesn't seem like it on a smaller timescale.

>>132150796
>Everyone is so comfy in their little bubble they will not step out of it to smell the shit in the air.
Academy of Ideas in Jootube just released a vid about exactly that.

Free trade and immigration.

>>132151327
The Internet proved unfortunately there's no hope at all. It offers free information but people use it for creepy japanese porn memes and vidya.

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>>132138575
A man named Henry George came up with a solution to this problem more than 100 years ago

What you are taught as "capitalism" results in inequality and inefficiency because it lacks a theory to manage common resources. It doesn't even recognize that there is such a thing as common resources. Georgism corrects this flaw by not only recognizing common resources like land, minerals, water, fish stocks as such, but adds that by managing these resources with user fees, you can get rid of all other taxation and remove impediments to economic development. So under Georgism, regular folk are mostly taxed in proportion to the value of any land they may possess. The vast majority of people would pay a lot less than they currently pay in income, payroll and consumption taxes, but absentee landlords would pay a lot more, and the mortgage business of banks would be an order of magnitude smaller, because land taxes cancel the benefits of homeownership as an investment. The system also discourages the inefficient use of land, controlling sprawl and inefficient farming practices. Housing and transportation costs would be greatly reduced, thus allowing for a greater equality of opportunity.

fractional reserve banking and fiat money are part of the issue but land tenure is the most important factor in poverty bar none

>>132151870
Nah, the internet is really the key because the powers that be ultimately operate on information arbitrage and the small amount of unrestricted global peer to peer information exchange completely upsets the pre-existing playing board.

Just think: 10 years ago, would you expect to be shitposting with somebody from South Africa? 10 years ago I encountered exactly one on IRC who had special administrative access to a local router, and I had never really thought anything about South Africa at all beyond
>oh I guess it's good apartheid is over

Now at this very moment I have a radio program on in the background with a guy from South Africa being interviewed trying to get the word out about their situation. How much longer until, say, Alex Jones starts interviewing them and then the word really starts to get out?

>>132138575

neoliberalism is an unsustainable model
they're continuing on like 2008 didn't happen and when it happens again it'll be a few orders of magnitude bigger

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>>132138575
some of you seem smart so im going to georgepill you now

>Georgeism reconciles common land rights with private tenure, free markets and modern capitalism.

>Those who got the upper hand by securing land tenures would support public services, so wages and commerce and capital formation could go untaxed.

>To pay the taxes, landowners would have to use the land by hiring workers (or selling to owner-operators and owner-residents). This would raise demand for labor; labor, through consumption, would raise demand for final products.

>To pay the workers, landowners would have to produce and sell goods, hereby raising supply and precluding inflation. Needed capital would come to their aid by virtue of its being untaxed. Thus, George would cut the Gordian knot of modern dilemma-bound economics by raising demand, raising supply, raising incentives, improving equity, freeing up the market, supporting government, fostering capital formation, and paying public debts, all in one simple stroke.

>George's proposal enables us to lower taxes on labor without raising taxes on capital. Indeed, it lets us lower taxes on both labor and capital at once, and without reducing public revenues.

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>>132138575
> Georgist tax policy reconciles equity and efficiency. Taxing land is progressive because the ownership of land is so highly concentrated among the most wealthy,'8 and because the tax may not be shifted. It is efficient because it is neutral among rival land-use options: the tax is fixed, regardless of land use. This is one favourable point on which many modern economists actually agree, although they keep struggling against it

> Georgist tax policy contains urban sprawl, and its heavy associated costs, without overriding market decisions or consumer preferences, simply by making the market work better. land values are the product of demand for location; they are marked by continuity in space. That shows quite simply that people demand compact settlement and centrality. A well-oiled land market will give it to them.

> Georgist tax policy creates jobs without inflation, and without deficits. "Fiscal stimulus," in the shallow modern usage, is a euphemism for running deficits, often with funny money. George's proposed land tax might be called, rather, "true fiscal stimulus". It stimulates demand for labor by promoting employment; it precludes inflation as the labor produces goods to match the new demand. It precludes deficits because it raises revenue. That is its peculiar reconciliatory genius: it stimulates private work and investment in the very process of raising revenue. It is the only tax of any serious revenue potential that does not bear down on and suppress production and exchange. As I have noted, George's fiscal policy takes two problems and composes them into one solution.

>>132139118
When will people stop falling for the gold standard meme
Fiat currency is perfectly acceptable when it's not managed by fucking kikes

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>>132138575
> George's land tax lets a polity attract people and capital en masse, without diluting its resource base. This is by virtue of synergy, the ultimate rationale for Chamber-of-Commerce boosterism. Urban economists like William Alonso have illustrated the power of such synergy by showing that bigger cities have more land value per head than smaller ones. (Land value is the resource base of a city.) Urbanists like Jane Jacobs and Holly Whyte have written on the intimate details of how this works on the streets. Julian Simon (The Ultimate Resource) philosophizes on the power of creative thought generated when people associate freely and closely in large numbers. Henry George made the same points in 1879

>Georgist policies encourage the conservation of ecology and environment while also making jobs, by abating sprawl. It is a matter of focusing human activity on the good lands, thus meeting demands there and relieving the pressure to invade lands that are now wild and marginal for human needs. Sprawl in the urban environment is the kind most publicized, but there is analogous sprawl in agriculture, forestry, mining, recreation and other land uses and industries.
>Georgist policies strengthen public revenues while in the same process promoting economy in government. Anti-governmentalists often identify any tax policy with public extravagance. Georgist tax policy, on the contrary, saves public funds in many ways. By facilitating the creation of jobs it lowers welfare costs, unemployment compensation, doles, aid to families with dependent children and all that. It lowers jail and police costs, and all the enormous private expenditures, precautions, and deprivations now taken to guard against theft and other crime. Idle hands are not just wasted, they steal and destroy

>>132150200
You know what. 99% of people I meet cant tell me why they hold an opinion. "Its just the way it has always been". If a son grows up in a home where his father beat his mother the same rule applies. And when the day comes when she gets her first beating people will want to know why? "Its just the way it always been". We are thay kid anon. We have seen society crush and kill and maim and poison. It has been pushed down our throats since day one. But the one thing society can never take from us is the choice. The choice to either participate in the evil we see every goddamn day or to seek the better way. And do not tell me you do not have that voice from deep within telling you this is not how it is supposed to be. Because I know its there. Any why would a human have such a strange feeling in such affluent times? Because something is very wrong here. You know why the richest people on Earth are such degenerates? Let me tell you why
They bought expensive cars. They were happy for a while. They bought huge mansions. They were happy for a while. They got a pretty trophy wife. They were happy for a while. They did drugs. They were happy for a while. They fucked each others wives. They were happy for a while. They started fucking kids. They were happy for a while. They started killing kids. They were happy for a while. The hole just goes deeper. Eventually to destruction. Thays how desire works anon. Once you have it you no longer want it. And then you need more and more often. That is not where happiness lies.

>>132145454
Service economies are a meme. It's a financier's economy. Production outsourced, costs driven down by immigrant labor, or things bought from overseas entirely. The dominance of the service sector is just the result of the death of industry. All you're seeing is the movement of the economic heart from the industrial towns and cities to the financial capitals of the countries. With free trade each country naturally builds on its immediate comparative advantage. Ours is capital.

>>132139118

the 81 recession happened precisely because of the gold standard though
it was about to pop and nobody wanted to revalue their currency against the dollar to save it

>>132138575
It's just the way things work. Lots of growth at the beginning of a new technology, the low-hanging fruit is being picked, lots of spoils to go around.

Then stagnation, where the growth is harder to get. This is where the cracks start to appear (1980s). We are nearing the end of the stagnation period, about to enter collapse. Then, hopefully if we don't nuke ourselves, someone will come up with a new growth technology.

You see the same thing happen with companies. Growth is great at the beginning - shareholders, management and labor are all happy. Then, when growth becomes harder to achieve, infighting, bankruptcy. GM.

>>132151604
Dont know who that is but Ill take a gander.

>>132151870
No there is hope anon. Not all at once, one person at a time. Hope grows exponentially.

>>132152690
Even when kikes don't manage it (e.g. under Kublai Kahn) it manages to get abused anyway in the long run.

I'd suggest that the only realistic option is to expect that currencies turn to shit from time to time and be prepared at an individual level to survive when they start to get sketchy. Even under the current Bretton Woods based system, of which Keynes was a principle designer, Keynes admitted that the system would eventually blow up but probably not in their lifetimes.

The real dangers are demographic shift, loss of culture, loss of the means for a society to withstand a depression (e.g. by shipping all the production overseas and not being able to feed itself) etc.

The real use of something like gold is to be a basis for itra- or international trust as part of the basis for a new currency regime (or to revitalize an existing one).

>>132152565
Thats such a dumb argument.

>>132138575

>Starts a sentence with "Look, "
How to identify a stupid liberal.

Meanwhile, the government takes (took?) roughly 30% of my money and gave it to those who don't want to work, whilst getting nothing in return.

saged

>>132152324
Pros and cons my friend. Its a smart game they are playing. I realize that the tension here is building. But inciting fear in the Boer community will lead to arming. And the government would love to use that as an excuse to start a war. Its the ANC's last available move to stay in power. There had been two incidents already where non-community members have incited riots. By the Grace of God a boer their knew what was going on and told the people not to take the bait.

>>132152690
There's no problem with fiat that doesn't get a neverending debt ceiling.

>>132152690
we know, thats why we are moving towards bitcoin

>>132154030
Good to hear. It's clear that pretty much the entire world is being baited in to largely senseless local or regional conflict so that those with the existing monopoly on force can crack down and re-assume control.

That's one of the things that makes mass communication so critical at this stage of the game.

>>132154531
Youre right. Its worldwide at the moment. Makes one wonder when the trigger is coming. Poland and U.K just needs a little shove for the (((Holy))) War. How is the sentiment that side?

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>>132153652
whats so dumb about it?

>>132152690
The real solution is the silver standard. Precious enough to avoid runaway inflation, common enough to avoid a centralized banking monopoly of it.

>>132155023
I don't get the sense that the UK or Poland would be a trigger point, but I could be wrong. I was watching the Corbyn riot yesterday and what I saw was the usual mix of well-off white people being useful idiots. Event he ones wearing red masks were milquetoast. Perhaps we'll see more terrorist attacks, but it didn't look like the right conditions for violent civil tension.

The people of Poland have more balls, but they don't have a very big internal opposition force, so there again the conditions of civil tension aren't built up. And Poland, like Greece, is of key value to the Western world to avoid expansion of Russian influence. So the Western world is likely to act to keep them from destabilizing too much.

In the US, though, there's a clear trend of it becoming normal now to have a demonstration and a counter-demonstration in the same place. We already had riots last summer, establishing the precedent for lawlessness. It would not surprise me to see an escalation in the US, although I doubt it would spread beyond isolated events at this rate. But if were were to see a big enough economic collapse then that could result in the conditions necessary for unrest to start to catch fire.

I can't afford land but that has nothing to do with the wealthy.

>>132138575
>wow I know that place in Oblivio-

>>132155872
A demonstration for social rights in the USA is an oxymoron. You're doomed to be ruled by the corporations.

>>132146467

Good post, I think we are in for some shit the next 50 years

>>132156059
Doesn't matter. What we're dealing with here are people willing to go cause a ruckus out of outrage at an idea. It doesn't matter whether the idea has any merit or whether the ruckus would provide any remedy.

The danger in an opposition crowd getting tired of putting up with it, or property destruction, or whatever else and then taking the bait to escalate into a conflict. The opposition crowd is really in a bind at this point because they're being forced in to an impossible choice between standing by while the crazies go out of control or putting a stop to the crazies.

Meanwhile, the government, which would be the sane venue for dealing with lawlessness before it gets worse, is paralyzed and half of it wants violence.