The rational choice.

>>131713527
I am only 18 and feel this way. I know having kids is not for me. Waste of time

>>131713527
It is a rational choice seen through the lens of hedonism.

It's ok to be childless if you find other ways to dedicate your life to God and his will. But if you plan to have sex you better do it in the context of marriage and always open to procreation.

>>131713668
I am 18 and feel the exact opposite

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>>131713668
im sure your parents are very proud of you, faggot

Friendly reminder that ((they)) are trying to convince whites to depopulate themselves.

>>131713527

T H I S
H
I
S >>131715516

>>131713527
Get married and kill your wife after she pops out a baby. A funeral is cheaper than a divorce.

>>131715516
/thread

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>>131713527
Becoming a parent is no longer needed in 2017. Being a parent used to be important to have helpers on your farm, and someone to take care of you when you get older. Also it was the norm because birth control didn't exist. These days having children is pointless. You can travel the world easier than ever before, fill your brain with knowledge easier than before, meet and experience sexual pleasure with others easier than before, enjoy delicious food, etc.. Don't be a sucker. Being a parent is beyond exhausting, worrisome, and time consuming. Be smart and walk the path of least resistence.

>>131713527
I will never have children because I don't want to make a person go through the same shit I've gone through and am going through. Having children is extremely selfish.

>>131713527
I have 2 boys. I felt like you kind of until I had them.

It's extremely hard to account for, but procreating is not only part of the purpose of the universe (to animate experience to infinity), but there's something more, deeply personally rewarding and gratifying.

>hate the responsibility

You pinpointed it. You're mentally a child.

This thread should die pretty soon.

>>131715516
Nothing is more selfish than having children.

>>131718043
I agree with you, but couldn't you also argue not having children is also selfish?

>>131715516
Are you a Mormon or some shit?

>>131718399
There's nothing wrong with selfishness.

>>131718681
I agree. You didn't answer the question though.

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>>131713527

>>131718399
How is not having children selfish?

1) I work with kids who have severe developmental, emotional, or behavioral...handicaps. If I had to come home from work to that, I would likely top myself.
2) Even if my child was the paragon of health, I would not want to subject them to an ever increasingly fucked society in education (or lack thereof), consumerism, short attention spans, dwindling resources, etc
3) http://www.vhemt.org/whybreed.pdf
4) Ultimately, it's my and my partners money and time, more power to you if you want to throw more living beings into the pot of suffering, but me? I'm gonna keep taking pleasure in being in traffic, or a line, or looking for parking spaces and saying "well, at least I'm not making the situation worse outside my own presence here."

>>131718043
>Sweden
Yeah, I'm sure you've suffered beyond anyone's wildest dreams. I really wish you would though. Tortured for weeks until you were left mute, deaf, blind, and paralyzed, kept alive and forced to live out the remainder of your fucking pathetic existence trapped in your own weak mind.

>>131718399
Yes, that can possibly be argued. Selfish, towards other people who live, for example when you get pension but didn't put children into the world to work. But I'm thinking then the balance is between selfish towards people who live vs towards an unborn person. For the former it's a sliding scale, for the latter it's all or nothing, so the latter weighs heavier in my opinion. Not really much of an argument, but it's just what I feel. I'm most certainly also influenced by the society I live in. If I had lived in Somalia I might have felt I had no choice but to have ten children.

>>131713527

You are the embodiment of Nietzsche's last man. To live is to suffer, but a life of hardship is a great life.

Would you rather see everything your ancestors fought and worked to create engulfed and defecated upon by hordes of subhumans?

Niemals. Have children, work hard and fight for your civilisation. To do otherwise is to become the lowest most detestable vermin imaginable.

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monogamy
LOL
better cover be just the guy
monogamy is an abomination

>>131713527
Why do millenials make it sound like parenting is so hard? The only legitimately tough years are the toddler/baby years.

>>131719277
>A life of hardship is a great life

Why?

>>131718304

Having children means making a sacrifice so for the sake of your civilisation. So that you might preserve what your ancestors worked and fought to build.

>>131719166
Alienation. You uncivilized people have no experience of that.

>>131719094
I think the argument is that you rob your potential children of their existence. The real argument to be made is whether existence is worthwhile. From a utilitarian perspective, Benatar argues that the pains of life outweigh the pleasures, and neuroscience supports this perspective.

Personally I think it would be fun as fuck to be a dad and have a family, but we are in massive population overshoot and the reckoning will occur within the decade.

>>131719094
I agree having children is selfish.
I also agree not having children is selfish because it's the 'me me me' mentality. Only thinking about yourself, your pleasures, your goals, focusing only on you. Isn't everything we do selfish?

>>131716715

Nice try rabbi

>>131719277
Do you really think that you can guilt trip people into having children?

Someone who has chosen not to have kids obviously doesn't give a fuck about your children mate.

>>131719498
>Alienation

Boo fucking hoo. You guys are a joke, just like the millions of Americans on anti-deppressants because their parents yelled at them once.

>>131719498
No, you're just an insufferable faggot.

>>131718043

I had a pretty miserable childhood/adolescense and often cursed my parents for conceiving me.

But I would never end my own life and I would still inflict the same fate upon my children if necessary because anything else would be defeatism and cowardice

>>131719602
Triggered.

>>131719520
By that logic you should be reproducing constantly as much as possible because otherwise you're robbing potential children of existence.

Personally I don't think having kids is selfish (provided you can support them financially) but I don't think having kids is altruistic or virtuous either. It's just a personal choice.

>>131719565
But you could also argue that having kids is part of the 'me me me' mentality since some people see it as furthering their "dynasty" and want to live vicariously through their children thus subjecting them to a lot of pressure.

Every couple I know with children is divorced except one. The mother always gets the children. Single mothers raise degenerate children. I will not have my offspring doomed to a life of degeneracy. The odds of them having a normal, two parent home are stacked against me. The women get half, alimony, child support, and the kids, pets, house, cars, and leave the men with the debt.

>>131713527

yeh I agree

> muh legacy

your genes will fade to nothing after a few hundred generations

> you will die alone

what if

- your kids die in an accident
- your wife is infertile
- your kids want nothing to do with you when you're old

nothing is guaranteed

the most LOGICAL course of action for a western man is to build his wealth, leave his wealth under the safe umbrella of his first world legal system, and to pursue relationships with 2nd / 3rd world women

this is selfish and will maximise his own happiness. Just rent a place overseas, put nothing in her name. If kids are a happy accident then so be it.

>>131719944
That's what he said. Whatever your choice, it's based on your own while. Not having children is a choice most people make to have more free time, better career progression, etc. Having them is a choice people make because, well, they just want them. I don't think most people care about their "dynasty," people that want kids just like kids.

>>131719277
everybodys ancestors were retards generally.
if youre on this site chances are your parents were boomers or gen x

>>131720032
>The women get half, alimony, child support,

this sounds like such a nightmare desu

What is up with the people thinking anyone has a duty to your nation or race. I swear, you sound like other identiterians like feminists talking of their gender and sisters.

>>131720271
On your own whims*

>>131719277
>Would you rather see everything your ancestors fought and worked to create engulfed and defecated upon by hordes of subhumans?

nobody else seems to care. why should I?

>>131719565

Women and wealthy alpha men are selfish

it's only the suckers who hold society together, functional males, who trick their own minds into a slave mentality

>>131713527
sage

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>>131716715
Wow. I didn't think anyone one could do it but you literally sound like a pussy

>path of least resistance

>pic related kys>>131720147

>>131719631

Go ahead and die childless then you worthless faggot, be an evolutionary dead end and let others inherit the earth, it isn't for weaklings like you anyway.

You think you're being intellectual when you spout these semi-profound nihilistic platitudes, in reality you're just being a pathetic scum-sucking cunt.

Man up and impregnate someone or do the world a favour and rid us of your presence so it's more tolerable for us.

>>131720147
Of course a fag would say that

>>131719440

Because hardship and suffering make us stronger and able to achieve great things.

All the great men who's names echo througout history endured immense suffering so they could achieve what they did

>>131713527
Good. People like you should not breed, you'd be a terrible parent if nothing has value to you. Just don't go spreading your cancerous nihilism to others. At least let them have some happiness.

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>mfw all the TIME apologists and Bacchus degenerates in this thread
If you don't have children, or run from responsibility in general, then you are not only barred from complaint about the course of Western Civilization, but are viewed as a permanent infant in all others

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>>131713527
>>131716501

>>131720649
Just remember you are arguing about having children on a Japanese cartoon board.

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>>131720965

>>131720442

You can rise above the herd and distinguis yourself from them or you can sink to their level.

It's a personal psychological choice everyone has to make. One option is symptomatic of weakness, the other demonstrates strength of character.

>>131713527
The purpose of living this is to reproduce. We know this becauase things that don't reproduce die of and their lineage ceases. Everything from bacteria to us follow this.

>>131720821
Not true at all. Hardship doesn't automatically equal greatness. It isn't even a part of it. In most cases it's just a kick in the gut that has no purpose at all.

Napoleon was born with a silver spoon in his mouth. So was Alexander even. Mozart, von Braun, etc, most men that we consider great were born in priviledge. And even those that were hit by hardship. Like Beethoven and his condition, would've probably been better off without it. Very little of these men actually had hard lives.

>>131721002

What are you talking about?

>>131719520
"we are in massive population overshoot" if you mean "we" as in the whole world, then yeah. That is Africa for you. I think the Us might be close to an exception due to its unique culture, but all first world countries suffer from very low birthrates, which is increasingly becoming a problem. See how a lot of governments are trying to encourage marriage. Anyways, my point is, the mass population is not on your country, but in africa. The gigantic populations are in the countries with least resources. Your kids will not suffer from lack of resources, as they'll have education and proper food, and a lot of resources, as birth rates are going DOWN in your country.
Overall, do not fall in the "too many people being born"meme. You need a healthy amount of young people in a country to support it, especially now that people grow to much older ages. people in Africa need to stop procreating, not YOU.

>>131721268

It doesn't automatically equal greatness but it is a prerequisite. Hard-work is required too.

And you need to read some biographies of Napoleon, he had a very unhappy turbulent upbringing, as is often the case for great leaders.

>>131713527
You'll die alone and probably in some shitty home.

You feel life has no meaning because unless you make some amazing scientific breakthrough such as a warp engine your sole purpose is to reproduce. Loser.

>>131713527
>I just feel like life has no inherent meaning or value, no objective no morals no purpose.
>cretins need directions
you're free you idiot, that's what freedom looks like, no rails.
>Life itself and reproduction seems immoral, illogical, and irrational to me.
Well fuck off, there's billions trying to get on with it and it's only your comfy little fluffy life that lets you think like that without being shoved into a gutter.

>>131721268
they had both.
almost all men of history were men of at least some priviledge, but they also overcame immense hardships.

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>Antinatalists

>>131720821
>xhe fell for the triumph over adversity meme invented during the 1890s by robber barons to make life as a shitty factory worker dignified and to make success at the expense of your neighbors not look like the miserable theft it really is.

>>131721113
>the desire to rise above the herd is strength of character
You're a mess, you need to become part of the picture, not the centre of it.
Narcissism is not self esteem.

>>131713527
Wait what the Fuck

> life has no inherent morals
> having children is immoral

Ffs, think please. Quit being an edgy useless teenager and think!

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>>131713527
>Who here is an Anti-Natalist

Anybody who's childfree and white are basically bluepilled beyond belief. Especially white burgers, the less white children gives more room for Tyrone, Amhed and Pablo to shit up the place. AC is a ideology for edgy teenagers and leftist white couples and nothing more.

>>131713527
okay bye bye idiot

>>131722557
Why should I care? I'll be dead before that affects me, and with no kids to worry about.

>>131713527
Being a parent isn't easy, but it is rewarding. What these articles don't tell you, is the woman's biological clock goes fucking nuts in the late 20's/early 30's and she fucking NEEDS to have a baby. That's how we fucking survived as a species. Any woman who doesn't want children is a red flag and should be discarded.

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>>131719094
I suppose society could ask you to produce one child, but another man could do one for you.

Like, for example, I have 2 siblings. My brother has 2 kids and my sister has 3. So, if I chose to not have children, à portion of my genes and my duty to produce another human to take my place, so society can go on, has been served by my brother and sister. However, if I were an only child, then it would not be unreasonable for society to ask me to have at least one child to take my place when I leave this planet. It would kind of be selfish to not fulfill that much.

That's just my take.

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>>131721981
In other words Good Goyim who force their shit ideology on other whites. The Childfree Movement is filled to the brim with bluepilled whites who believe bringing in more white children is suffering but they don't bat an eye when some nonwhite is doing it. I'm surprised there are people on /pol/ who still believe in this shit.

>>131716715
Hedonism makes people even more shitter then they would as parents.

>>131722697
You'll be alive when it happens depending on how old your are, We'll be minority majority by 2040. You'll basically live to see yourself get genocided by Tyrone and Pablo my friend. Welcome to The Wiemar Republic 2.0 buddy.

>>131721439
>You need a healthy amount of young people in a country to support it, especially now that people grow to much older ages. people in Africa need to stop procreating, not YOU.

>breed because the govt. needs money

not a persuasive argument

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>>131722701
All of the articles are written by Jews, Proof being here.

>>131722984
>Breed because the Govt needs money

They're importing shitskins, they don't give a fuck if you breed or not. Schlomo is getting all the money with Third World Labor while whites are taxed to the brim. Times have changed, The government only wants third worlders, your "breed because the govt needs more money" argument would've been correct if it were pre-2008.

>>131722209

What the fuck are you talking about you pratt?

Being a centre and a part are not mutually exclusive.

>>131723234
>They're importing shitskins, they don't give a fuck if you breed or not.

neither do we, generally.

>Schlomo is getting all the money with Third World Labor while whites are taxed to the brim.
why would i want kids if that's their lot?

>>131713527
Selfishness <--- that goes away when you have a child and life has starts to have meaning but hey, don't have kids goy

>>131723234
>They're importing shitskins,

i don't believe they want to. if they are forced to import lower quality stock, then they must really be in a bad position.

>>131718304
The fucking Canadá of europe

enjoy no legacy, degenerates.

also, enjoy high chances being divorced and lonely in your 30's when your spouse suddenly changes their mind.

This is what happens in a society of narcissists.
"The idiots will just have the babies"
When you think they are, and should, but don't want to have children.
The one variable on both sides is that society doesn't support you so you have an overarching feeling you don't deserve to have them and think they do.
It's the opposite for them.

>>131720147
fucking queer neck yourself

>>131720649
It never ceases to amaze me how triggered some people get when you tell them you don't want kids.

Why do people get so upset about this?

I'm somewhere down that road, brehs
sometimes I feel like I've not fully matured until ive taken that final step and become a parent and inherit all the responsibility with it.

but the more rational side tells me life is more or less meaningless, and it's not so important to continue the family line, and life is better enjoyed with minimum dependents and obligations

>>131722984
im just trying to debunk that whole "muh overpopulation/ muh lack of resources" meme. Not arguing about why/why not to breed in this post. Anyway, the govt still needs money to pay your pensions when you are old., which you'll especially need if you dont have a son to take care of you.

>>131726864
Because literally the future of everything that has ever been important to anyone, ever, depends on the continuation of humanity, and more specifically, western civilization. The idea that we just sort of let ourselves die off because of something as retarded as a bout of nihilistic mind virus should absolutely upset large swathes of people. I'd be shocked if it didn't.

>>131727892
>collectivist nonsense
Why should I give a fuck?

The population is growing exponentially. We're in no danger of dying off unless we start firing nukes at one another.

>>131718195
If you love responsibilities so much why not start a foster home for kids. You could fill your life with responsibility cause that's the mature path. Right?

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>>131728870
Why not adopt an Afrikaner/Boer child if you love to help foster children so much? Or do you like niggers and chinks instead?

Anti-Natalists won't even bother going through adopting they just say things and move on.

>>131720649
Sounds like someone knocked up their sister.

It's literally just cumming in a girl. There is nothing holy, special, about creating life because your insect brain overpowering your feeble, weak mind.

There's nothing special about having kids. You fags who get triggered better be christcucks, at least then it'd make sense.

>>131713527
>Life itself and reproduction seems immoral, illogical, and irrational to me.
Why does it have to make sense? Why does their have to be a reason? Commit yourself to something you deem mighty, then when you're done, resign yourself to the scrap heap like everyone else before you

>>131729229
>White supremacist
>Not having or adopting white children