Anarcho-capitalist thread

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>>129753535
I think we outnumber the Nat Socs, which includes some unironic stormfront fags, but mostly LARPers.

/pol/ is an An-Cap board.

>>129753535
I'm not really an ancap but I have to admit it's as sexy flag.

>>129754010
/pol/ has always been edgy libertarians trying to trigger leftists with swastikas.
>>129754707
come visit us at /lrg/, youll become an ancap in no time :^)

Never forget that /pol/ was originally a libertarian board

>>129753535
>Be anarcho capitalist
>Have laws
>No longer anarcho
>Dont have laws
>No longer capitalist

Really makes ya think!

Ancap is pure insanity and anyone who unironically thinks that it would be a good idea needs to get their heads checked.

Money talks. If you can't into free market you simply can't compete and deserve to die.

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>>129754010
>I think we outnumber the Nat Socs

MFW

I miss the days of AnCrap /pol/ to be fair.

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Fuck commies

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>>129753535

>>129753535
TAXATION
IS
THEFT

Has the Bitcoin bubble burst yet? :^)

>>129757467
hey try googling the term "anarchism" before making retarded statements about it, alright bucko?

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>>129760241
just post the original quote

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>tfw i know ancap is the best ideology possible
>tfw i know that first we have to preserve the white race if i want this to ever happen
>tfw only a fascist state could achieve to preserve our race and stop the dysgenics state of our countries

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>>129753535

ofcourse /pol/ is an ancap board. 4chan is the pinnacle of the free market of ideas on the internet. we came here for freedom and privacy, these values happen to be important in anarcho capitalism aswell.

testing

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>>129753535
you're in the bottom-right square of the political compass, so this is a-okay with me. yep, you're all better than communist/fascist/natsoc fedora guardians by far.

>libertardians, i.t.t.

>>129760812
lol no

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Fuck off

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kys

>>129760449
(((ayn rand)))

>>129761138
nice argument kiddo

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Fuck off Pedo bear.

>>129761221
>pol is a sodomite board

No. Hell is for ever.

Serious question: How would an ancap country/society defend itself against a military invasion?

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>>129753535

You're so cool, bro. How do you restraint this much edge?

>>129761847 It won’t. However AnCaps don’t care about their nations.

>>129757747
Everyone who thinks the state will just stop growing needs to get his head checked.

so are yall cool with confederates? we've got guns and good food! (and muh states rights)

>>129753535

well... shit

>>129753535

Why yes I am just shamelessly bumping to see what the flags look like, thanks for asking.

>>129762659
it has to you retard. the state cannot be infinite in a finite world.

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>>129761390
What IF the child consents tho?

If you call yourself a “fascist” and support laze-fair economics you need to read/lissen to some theory. Fascism is more than just nationalism and dictatorships. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYXhOT1ZMEg

>>129753535
Burn this shit.

>>129761847
Voluntary forming of an army.
Invading an ancap country should be hard tho because everybody owns guns and there is no government structure to overtake.

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>>129763342 There’s no rules in AnCapistan.

>>129763000
trips I get fucking trips with a fucking recycling flag. Rule Britannia, Britannia rules the waves... yadda yadda

>>129763639 Without a state there is no country. If there’s no country what is there to defend. Also what about the people who’re to poor to afford a gun?

>>129763766
mental fucking breakdown

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>>129761847
>He doesn't have a McPocketNuke™ 9001 "Looter-B-Gon" Shrugger Edition from AtlasCorp®
There are a number of ways it could be done. With the state of modern weaponry (nukes), it's questionable whether invasion as such is even a viable tactic anymore. If you take that out of the equation, voluntarily formed military organizations could do it. The fact that many countries (e.g. USA in the 19th century) got by perfectly fine with only volunteers for defence purposes, proves that conscription and force are not necessary to form a highly competent military. The usefulness of hordes of conscripted grunts drops as technology advances. In addition (and most importantly), any invader would face the partisan resistance of every single proud property owner he tried to TREAD on. Think 'a rifle behind every blade of grass', except with probably something heavier than a rifle.

>>129763337
Wow you got me.
So it will stop when it encompases every aspect of your life, awesome. Even the most limited form of government will grow at one point in time because someone somewhere will call for regulation, insulation from reality or subsidies.

Ehh Bottom right, so close enough.

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this thread has autism

glory to der Staat :^)

>>129763695
Violation of prenegotiated contract of carriage.

>>129753535
I'm libertarian right.

Free market ftw

>>129763695
>no rules
>what is contract
>what is social conditioning
>what is basic fucking decency and ethics
What stops your pic from happening in real life on international waters? Nobody has jurisdiction there. So why don't ship captains declare themselves pirates and enslave their passengers?
Oh, yeah, because they're not fucking insane and would be arrested/ostracized from society forever if they tried.

>>129763695
shouldn't you have to declare the terms before they guy gets on the boat (fulfills the contract)?

>>129764626
Whoops

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>>129764159 Wars require lot’s of money to fund. This money comes from taxes. Also chemical weapons can be used to crush partisan resistance.

>>129764352
>Implying a big government is bad.

>>129763940
Property owners could get together and defend their boards together, you could call that a country.

If we look at western civilisation today even the poorest man could afford a gun if he wanted to. Also people could be hired as soldiers and you could pay them by providing them with a gun.

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>>129754010
Nah, you don't.

AnCap are okay in my book

>>129764850 No contract was signed. Also the free market erodes all social barriers. Why do you think gay rights started to advance at the same time the New Deal was scraped?

>>129757306


Libertarianism is retarded. I went through a phase where it was considered pretty redeemable, but not with the modern problems of the day.

Leftists will always destroy libertarians in America, wherever any debate can be had. That's a sad fact, but idpol means leftists btfo of libertarians every single time.

>Libertarian says that all people can have freedom and equal rights
>leftists get feminists and minorities to "positively discriminate"
>makes argument that libertarian system is full of systemic racism and sexism
>the target demographics fall for it without even thinking about it
>leftists get the black vote, point out that libertarians aren't "defending" (aggressing) their interests
>leftists promise free gibs to young people in college
>vaguely mentions reparations
>taxes raised through the roof to cover the gibs
>can't break the NAP yet
>surrounded by ideological and racial opponents, the severe declining population means free gibs loving minorities run the show now. They identify with their own people
>libertarians still think they don't have their own people because it feels racist and they're too good for that
>regressives finally feel it's time for full communism. The outnumbered, overtaxed, and regulated libertarians are finished off one by one, as they historically have been in communist states.

>>129765139 If that happens, you’ll no longer have anarchy.

>>129763695
*gets killed by kikes*

>>129761317
correct, thats her name

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>>129765101
>population and technology grow
>GNP gets bigger somehow
Woah....
B...bbased gommunism??!

>>129765101
>Implying a big government is bad.
Ok I am part of the big government now. I can do what ever the fuck I want because I am the government.
>Be my slave and pick cotton

>>129753535
wew nice,

>>129753535
>canadian roleplayers thread

Kill yourselves

>>129765101
What part of 'voluntarily formed military organizations' didn't you understand? If some people are willing to sign up to risk their lives to defend their freedom, even more will donate funds to the cause. In WW2, millions of people bought war bonds, donated metal, grew their own vegetables, etc. Because they believed in defending themselves, and realized it couldn't be done without cooperation.
>Implying a big government is bad.
You literally want a government that can monitor, control and convict you for everything you do or say at every moment of your life?
>>129765438
Kek, changing the subject because you got btfo

Why do they have 'Pirate' AND 'An-Cap'? Same thing, no? I chose pirate because I'm an 1337 (elite) haxxors (hacker) that torrents his obscure music. Torrenting??? You might have read about it in the last 'Wired' magazine.

>>129765657
Yes you do because the getting together is voluntary.

>>129753535
Fuck off gookmoot

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Long live Vulnavia

>>129762659
Eventually companies will simply play the role of the oppressor so I don't understand what these muh freedums charades are about.
Large companies, much like the state, don't care about the individual and would like to control him themselves.

>>129766414
Voluntary is the key word here, fellas. Voluntary exchange....the point I was getting at in my last post.

>>129766711
>play the role of the oppressor
buzzwords. either I have the right to disassociate or I am having my consent violated

>Anarchist
>Capitalist

lol

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>>129765555
A worthy get

This 100%.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Pgnng3bVlc

>>129761317
Was opposed to globalism Zionism and central banking.

Were Australian aborigines Anarchists?

>>129766414
why can't you people plant your standard on freedom of association? property rights and freedom of speech are weak positions. if you can seize freedom of association you've literally won the world.

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>>129766957

Couldn't huge corporations become de-facto states with territories and armies?

>>129757467
>be natsoc
>try to understand a complex political ideology
>fail miserably
>blame Jews

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>>129763695
Wrong. The creator has weaved natural laws into his creation. If you really think we exist in a universe we were suffer an eternal process of shitting and eating each other as life forms you are sadly mistaken and probably are a fedora shit skin.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57UBuxnicOA

>>129765260
Ironic, considering that NatSoc will literally never happen in America.
>inb4 Yurop
No one gives a shit about that Middle Eastern shithole anymore.

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>>129766957
>Communist
>Human
lol
>>129767147
No, private property anarchism is the most advanced political structure and depends on a huge foundation of philosophy, ethics, culture, etc. No savage culture respects property rights, because they don't really have the concept of production (property is that which you produce). They may not have a state, but they certainly do have tyrants - one for every tribe or village.

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>>129767294
Not today, pendejo cappy.

*hides innawoods*

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>>129753535
At least now I know the triggering potential when saying that all ancaps and lolbertarians are just deluded autists

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>>129762809
yeah you're fine
I also like minarchists, even if they're retarded
we want liberty.
don't let the narcissism of small differences stop us from working towards a mutual goal
leave that for our great grandchildren.

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>Every bootlicker in this thread:

Hello. Mom and dad never loved me during my growth years, so in order to fill this void in my being I need to exert my internal problems onto other human beings by participating in slavery called "government".

I actually care about people so much I think they should be required by gun point to help fund roads! So they can get to work of course...

I care about roads so much, that I'm going to completely ignore the fact that a clandestine guild of dark occult, child raping, baby eating, blood drinking, satanic, psychopathic, elite group of men that run the world and its politics through blackmail, murder, gematria, and drugs. Besides, current system does such a great job of taking care of them anyway. I've never seen a pothole in my life.

Ancaps btfo!

>>129753535
Glad to have the AnCap flag, just so long as Nu-ancaps assimilate with pol-ancaps, see you all in the next /lrg/

>>129760217
>haha, you are just dumb, you don't understand my intricate political philosophy

>>129767458
>have autism
>be ancap
that's it

>>129763695
>>129764916
>>129764850
lolbertarians and ancaps don't understand how contracts work

hahahaha

>>129767458
Wait, isn't what you said right only if it means he's wrong?

I mean, couldn't it be that he succeeded, and that's why he's blaming Jewish history?

You've basically presumed correctness, without explaining how you're right and he's wrong.

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>>129768171
>call someone autistic
>this is somehow an insult even though all the great geniuses in history were and half the billionaires in the world are autistic

>>129767750
>depends on a huge foundation of philosophy, ethics, culture

Nowhere has ever survived on the above without extreme coercion. It seems like getting any form of Anarchy to work would be akin to herding cats. How would you even begin?

>>129761390
>Chains of capitalism
Fucking communist, try living in Poland dickwad, we're under around 40-80% socialism and it hurts a fucking lot.
>>129757467
Anarcho-capitalism means no state how can your head not comprehend this?
>>129766957
Fuck off and give me an argument
>>129760555
Actually agree, but I hate the majority of your movement because they're filthy blamers of capitalism and socialists.
>>129765376
White nationalists are ok in my book, socialists aren't because socialism will lead to decadence of white people.
>>129767904
Agreed, I saw some faggot speaking about racism with an ancap flag, fucking faggot.>>129768171
You want to argue with me? The rules are we have logical discussion.

>>129767458
The never ending story.

>>129768102
>>129768171
>>129768473
>When someone's too retarded to understand your ideology, let alone insult it.

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>>129767784
We have an app for that.

>>129768653
With getting the state to only fund the army, the courts, the law to be funded on common sense, christianity and the NAP and as long as we have to, the infrastructure.

>>129766912
Not when someone creates a monopoly.

>>129768700
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQ9gBRZeZ1c

>>129768977
>direct link to Jason Unruhe
Change domain to hooktube, it's like archive.is for youtube

https://hooktube.com/watch?v=VQ9gBRZeZ1c

>>129768977
I won't watch your video unless you give me a logical argument you faggot.

Ancap is an economic system of peace.

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It's ironic to me that none of the ancaps or lolbertarians can effectively argue.

It's like a game of chess with a chicken. Worse than ancoms.

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>>129767628 And without a state there’s no way to stop people from violating natural law. There’s some very sick people out there.

>>129769101
Actually it is a social-economic system based on voluntary contracts and free trade.

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>>129768977
I lied. Ancoms and coms are way worse.

>>129768951

So a dictatorship of the proletariat?

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>>129759638
Nasty Socialists get shit done, amirite?

I consider myself libertarian but if you are an anarchist everyone will think of you as some edgy teen phase gone wrong.

>>129768977
retard.

What does your school say about early New England?
>Self-determined groups of religious capitalists
>Religious dogma became tempered over time
>lead to the rise of America
Are there any books that talk about this sort of thing but without rehashing all the typical libertarian stuff of the past 10 years or so? I was an early Ron Paul supporter but saw limitations with the "movement" he lead.

Can we team up to destroy totalitarian communists? I hate them so much

>>129753535
hehe

>>129769531
What the fuck are you talking about?
>>129769863
"Voluntary Communism" TOP KEK. Go watch Christopher Cantwell from the Radical Agenda. 1433 motherfuckers.

>>129768653
Well, full AnCap is the ideal. I'm not opposed to a minarchist state taking over to manage the transition - what's important for AnCaps isn't the lack of a state per se, but the degree to which private property is respected and protected in the society. If given a choice between a society that was stateless, but infested with savages and warlords who would steal your property, and a state that protected property with the exception of a reasonable tax, I would take the latter.
>akin to herding cats
Well, that's part of the problem private property anarchy solves. Without giant states needing to impose universal legislation, forced integration, tariffs and taxes, and so on, the cats would herd themselves into the optimal configuration. Everyone has a different idea about how to run his life, what general rules he wants his society to follow, etc. So why not let like-minded people form their own enlaves, freeholds, cities and micro-'states' where they can be among those who agree with them?

>>129766957
>Anarchist
>wanting actual anarchy and mayhem

>>129769971
Pls no bully, after we destroy subhuman bolsheviks we can fight with each other

>>129763695
is this supposed to counter ancap? because the cartoon is perfectly analogous to the state using coercion to get tax money which statists defend with "by living in this country you voluntarily agree to paying taxes. if you dont agree you need to leave"

>>129767904
Holy shit this. If you're an AnCap opposed to closing the borders or race realism you better change or go back to where you came from.

>>129769971

Your method of implementing Anarchy revolves around an army, codified laws and religious institution which all require enforced taxation in order to function.

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what's wrong with a libertarian ethnostate

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>>129769177
Don't be like that.

>>129754010
>stormfront
A vast mayority of them look down upon this place, and dont even come here.
t. an actual "Stormfag"

I mean, I'm not an Ancap, more of a Minarchist. But you have to admit, Anarcho Capitalism is retarded. A state will form, its inevitable.

And no I'm not gonna be a faggot and go HURR DURR CHILD SEX SLAVES HURR, because I at least understand Anarcho Capitalism.

And no /pol/ isn't Ancap, it's mostly either conservatives, stormfront fags, and Pinochet supporters.

There are the occasionally libertarian but we are the minority and most people you see who act like ancaps are being ironic faggots.

>>129770482
NOnonononoo. Revolutions include death of innocents. The only way for society to bring anarcho-capitalism would be enlightment through the eugenics of freedom ( natural selection of most intelligent and most hardworking people ).

I meant that we reform the state to esentially become minarchist, because anarchy is currently not viable. I'm talking about a progress of hundreds of years or maybe thousands.
>>129770130
Why are you a communist even? Why do you think it's better than capitalism?

>>129768630
kek, you are like a cuck who's proud to be a cuck
good riddance

>>129768700
I have argued countless times with you retards here. You guys are hopeless. I'm just here to make fun of you.

>>129768782
hahaha, yours is the simplest one

>>129769177
Ok give me an argument.
>>129770681
I mean I am an an-cap that doesn't mean I want to implement it right now. I say most of us don't because we have came to a conclusion of this ideology and most of us would have to be at least somewhat intelligent to understand this is the final stage of freedom that has a long way in front of us.

>>129768977
The full retard trope is here.

>>129770856
Ok then go be a fucking stupid idiot somewhere else commie goverment cuck.

>>129761847
How does Liechtenstein defend itself from invasion from Austria or Switzerland?

oxymoron: the thread

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>>129770503
Literally nothing

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>>129770503

>>129771009
Enlighten me on the oxymoron. Communism can never be voluntary.

>>129770681
>A state will form, its inevitable.
crimes will be commited, it's inevitable. doesn't mean there shouldn't be laws

>>129770977
>I have issues with authority because my daddy was not around to love me, and my mommy is a bitch

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>>129768700 Poland, Socialist. lol

>>129765927 You need the democratic right of the people

>>129771224
My mom is a great person and my dad is a great hard working man that has tought me very many important values of life.

>>129771187
the fact that orthodox anarchism is against any and all heirarchy, and therefore the employee-employer relationship in Capitalism, not just muh state as the google-for-theory posters here would have you think

now enlighten me on how communism can never be voluntary

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>>129770503

>>129771579
You think it's not socialist? 40% of our job income is stolen from us by a tax on work. There is a social benefit for unemployed, single mothers, families, for every child after your first one, benefits for the poor exc.
Where do you think the fucking money for that comes from? Taxes on food,water,electricity,clothing,alcohol,fuelexc.exc.exc.exc.
>>129771674
Because in order to have communism everyone would have to be a communst and I don't want to be under your fucking rule.
Also no, anarchy is just no goverment, and even if you say no hierarchy, in commie land you would have a hierarchy.>>129771710
Upgrade?
1433

>>129771086
This is what an ethnostate is.

>>129771604
>including spitting on what they've built through generations of blood, sweat, trial and error in favor of some retarded meme that's only popular online because the 2nd rate intellectuals promoting it are not listened to anywhere else

>>129770503
>When government--in pursuit of good intentions tries to rearrange the economy
Like monopolizing the money supply, you hypocrite Chicagoite kike?

Friedman was ok for the most part, but Chicago school people go pants on head retarded when they support government-produced fiat paper.

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>>129753535
It's the flag of underage and b&

>>129772066
Not true, point out exactly what I'm spitting on and stop using faggotry greentext.

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>>129771710 Did someone say market socialism.

>>129771674
anarchy is simply a catalyst to tyranny. I love you fags. You're like a welcome mat.

>>129771674
Communism can never be voluntary because its advocates all believe they will be immune to the historically verified downsides of it. I.e. Being card carrying members of The Party

>>129753535
>ancap tards cant hold all these roads

>>129772218
No exactness is needed. It's the entire ideology. Grab any point. That's it.

>>129771959
> in order to have communism everyone would have to be a communst
that's the idea behind accelerationism.
you might know this if you knew what communism was.

>Also no, anarchy is just no goverment
read Proudhon.

>in commie land you would have a hierarchy
please elaborate.

>>129772260
A potential communist tyranny, if these fags don't git gud

>>129771959

>Confusing Social Democracy with Socialism

>>129772443
It's also the idea behind third wave feminism, black nationalism, and good ol fashioned classism.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XxIbq7HkalQ

>>129771674
>against any and all heirarchy
How in the everloving FUCK do you get
>division of labor
>efficient organization of production
>literally anything done
Even the most basic level of human existence, group hunting, requires hierarchy. Because, believe it or not, we can get more done when we work together.
How is anything produced in an industrial economy? You need workers to turn the cranks of the machines, yes. But you also need engineers to design the machines and managers to dictate how they are to be used for maximum efficiency. You need businessmen to organize the large scale, long-term growth of the productive enterprise.
Without hierarchy, all that is out of the window. You'd somehow actually achieve a standard of life WORSE than what we had before civilization was invented.

>>129761221
KILL YOURSLEF FAGGOT

>>129761159
If don't get basic they will never get advanced

>>129754010
Fuck off jew

words are meaningless

>>129772757
https://www.thenation.com/article/worker-cooperatives-are-more-productive-than-normal-companies/

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>>129761159
ftfy

>>129772943
This

ancap is a simple-minded fucks ideology and will never happen, so just go back to your little groups and mentally jerk each other off over this fucking retarded fantasy.

>>129772757
>Even the most basic level of human existence, group hunting, requires hierarchy
i should rephrase by including the use of direct democracy as a means of organising both workplaces and militias

>But you also need engineers to design the machines
yes? okay? this doesn't contradict communist theory

>and managers to dictate how they are to be used for maximum efficiency
i disagree that only managers know how to go about making work efficient, look up worker cooperatives

>You need businessmen to organize the large scale, long-term growth of the productive enterprise
in a decentralised society? no. though perhaps in today's world where the focus is almost solely on producing commodities which are shipped internationally

>>129773531
If that were true, then why haven't worker cooperatives taken over huge portions of industries?
>inb4 muh oppression
Worker cooperatives didn't take over during the 19th century, when the US (for example) was as close to a true free market as has ever existed. If what you posted was true, then they should have out-competed conventional companies. But they didn't, and your're retarded.

>>129774054 Because in a free market you don’t win by being the most efficient or making the best product. You win by playing dirty. Something co-ops are unwilling to do.

maltabro here, I have mixed feelings about the new flags, country flags take away a bit of the anonimity which is good in /generals.

Not sure if I'm going to be using this one for long

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>>129773537
>>129761159
Neither understand economics

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So, this thing is coming up:
implyingrigged.info/wiki//pol/eague
It's like the four chan cup (a simulated tournament in Pro Evolution Soccer where every team is a 4chan board streamed on smashcast), but every team is /pol/ related
And /ancap/ is signed up.

This is the roster I come up in 5 minutes on a sunday morning (keep in mind it doesn't have to be too serious)
New Ideas are welcome
GET OUT OF MY PROPERTY!
8yo Sex Slave
Ancapistan
Bitcoins
Child Labour
Free Helicopters Rides
So To Speak
Local Warlord
Private Defence Agencies
Murray Rothbard
Non-Aggression Principle ©
Recreational Nuclear Bomb
Statist Cuck
Ancap Frog (hippity hoppity get off my property)
Roads
Somalia
David Friedman
McHospital
Child Consent

I

>>129774312
In a free market you win by making the only person that matters happy, your customer.

To the rest you can play as dirty as you want, but your customer is your god.

Why is red? shouldn't they be called Anarcho-communists and us Anarchists?

>>129774631
even /pol/ knows ancaps aren't real anarchists :^)

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>>129760217
If he just googles anarchism, he'll find the works of Bakunin and Kropotkin. Y'know, REAL anarchists and libertarians. Not you guys who (admittedly) co-opted the term.

>>129765555
I hate to say it, but the quads have spoken. 1000% correct

>>129774574
>Implying planned obsolesce and pooling isn’t a thing.

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>>129765555
> Taxes
> Left
> What

>>129775062
It is, cause it's cheaper to build something that will break in 5 years than something that will last 50 and in 3 will be obsolete.

>>129775062
It's not a thing

>muh 100 years bulb

That technology is useless. If planned obsolescence was a thing, it would be so easy to dominate the markets.

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>>129753535
ancapism in a greentext
>Lol states are not organic because of monopoly of force
>Lol private property is organic because of monopoly of force
>muh moralism
>muh taxes are different than rent

>>129775390 In the long term it’s a waist of resources. However it’s more profitable because it has to be bought more. So companies do it.

>>129775459
Planned obselescence does dominate the market you fucking desert dweller.
>iphone
>plasma TV's
>videogames
are just a few examples, all premised on sold on the idea that in a few years they will be obselete

>>129769741
Well at least natsoc has been tried
Ancapism is a pipe dream

>>129773984
>direct democracy
A cooperative farm is going through a drought year, and the harvest is thin. The workers on the farm are going hungry, and rationing has been instituted so as to conserve their seed stock. One day, lightning strikes a granary and destroys a few tons of grain.
In the democratic meeting, John (IQ: 130) votes for reducing the ration so as to conserve the seed stock. This would mean chronic hunger for everyone. James, and Adam (mean IQ: 85) vote for maintaining the current ration, meaning that only half their seed stock would be left by the next planting season. Floyd and Bertrand (mean IQ: 100) are caught in the middle. John argues long and hard, but he is outvoted. The farm settles on a compromise: the food ration will be reduced slightly, they will have 80% of their seed stock left, they will sell one of their plows to make up for the difference.
After a few years of this, the farm is inexplicably broke, and everyone staves.
Do you see why hierarchy is necessary? The most intelligent, forward-thinking, hardworking individuals must be in charge. Otherwise you get Africa. Private property allows hierarchies to develop voluntarily, and ensures that only the most productive people attain positions of power.
>in a free market you don’t win by being the most efficient or making the best product
You have no idea what a free market is. In a free market, you can't 'play dirty' without violating the NAP and getting McNuked. The only way to obtain wealth in a society of private property is to 1. Produce it yourself or 2. Trade for it in a voluntary agreement. It is not possible to trade without people agreeing to buy what you have to sell. If someone else comes up with something that people want more, you will inevitably lose business to him.

>>129775264 And that’s why third positions is the best ideology. #TheStateAndNationForever

>>129775783
It's not planned obsolescence, it's optimization of resources. You don't want to spend all the money it would take to make an everlasting plasma because people don't fucking care about it you moron.

>You made this table in wood instead of stainless steel, planned obsolescence!

Holy shit you guys are brainlets, if you want to talk about planned obsolescence at least use some cases where there's a shred of a doubt.

>>129776057 And in a free market. All the food would go to the richest individual. Also companies lie all the time.

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>>129753535

>live in ancapistan
>be wealthy warlor... i mean enterprising entrepreneur of completely free market freedom and prosperity
>own vast acreage of land which i lease to various ser... i mean tenants which pay me in either bitcoins or their own manual servitud... i mean labor
>get together with my fellow entrepreneurs to pool our resources in a freely agreed-upon contract whereby we share ownership of hundreds of thousands of square miles of land, and we rent out plots of land for a fee
>this fee is definitely not a tax and we are definitely not a government
>mfw

>>129754010
It's actually about 50% split between libertarians (including ancap) and fascists.

ALSO WTF HAPPENED TO THE FLAGS? IS THIS PERMANENT?

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>>129774452
Why isn't he on the roster?

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>>129776384 An optimization or resources would be making one Good TV very 20 years. Not 5 shitty ones every 4 years.

>>129760742
Helicopter rides for all who dont consent

>>129776590
>so to speak
But yeah, Hoppe is the guiding light behind /lrg, he's our leader.

>>129776057
>creating your own biased narrative to suit your argument
wew lad.
>farm drought analogy
this is what post-scarcity is for; current and near future technology can be utilised by farmers so that weather has no effect on the magnitude of food grown or raised, creating an abundance of food.

>>129765555
That would only be in a libertarian country with democracy and a lack of strong borders

I love how I won't be judged by my nationality anymore. These years that /pol/ had flags have been shit. /int/ 2.0 with less fun.

>inb4 Israeli

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i may disagree with ancaps but I cetainly respect that they uphold a certain ideal, in this case freedom, so very highly.
at least you make more sense than white supremacists, nazis, or all the leddit "kekistani" faggots.

>>129776590 He’s a faggot

>>129768956

All so-called "natural" monopolies are actually fractal offspring of the monopoly on authority we grant to the state.

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>>129776752
Exaclty, at first I wanted him on the team but then I put "so to speak" instead.

I thought about using pic related as an idea for the players kit.

>>129776391
>All the food would go to the richest individual
>I, Irving C. Capitalist, would rather spend my untold billions on filling up Olympic-sized swimming pools with ice cream and chocolate sauce, which I will never be able to consume, than on machines, materials, raw materials, managers, R&D and wages to increase the productivity and profit of my company

>companies lie all the time.
And states don't? If a company lies about its product/service, it is considered a breach of contract and you can sue or at least boycott them.

>>129776927
>Not understanding the purpose of a narrative illustration
Tell me, how exactly will this not happen in real life? People are not equal, they have different capacities for logic and long-term planning. And yet you want to give Jamal, who lives week-to-week, can't even manage a bank account and gets smashed at the pub every weekend, the same degree of control over giant scientific industries as the most intelligent and responsible members of society? You're delusional.
>technology can be utilised by farmers
Did you not understand that my analogy is a general one that applies not only to farms but to literally any productive activity that requires division of labor and long-term planning?
>post scarcity
Logically impossible. How do I know this?
>There is more than 1 human being in the observable universe
>There are fewer than infinity particles of matter and less than infinite available living space in the observable universe
If you're just going to claim 'robots will fix it' whenever your ideology runs into problems, what's the point of even having this conversation?

can someone explain the conceptualization of private property in an ancap world?

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Testing with my gaping butthole

That's pretty cool. Guess my country.

>>129778421

Centralplanistan

>>129776927
It's been 50 years since we achieved what Marx described as post-scarcity.

In these 50 years we have been able to increase our life expectancy by 20 years.

What you're claiming is that we should stop doing things right at a totally arbitrary point ignoring the fact that these arbitrary points are total garbage compared to what the future can bring if Capitalism is allowed to do its magic.

>>129776384
>selling a wooden table that is well made
>selling some stupid ikea crap that will break instantly for the same price
>same thing

>selling a cellphone that is water proof and has changeable parts so it can have updated hardware
>selling some shit with a glass screen that breaks with more than a finger weight of pressure, also cannot have hardware updated
>same thing

>taxes
>rent
>not the same thing
look around you you fucking kike

>>129770856
I'm ashamed I'm half Portuguese.

>>129770503
Friedman is a fucking traitor. He was an architect of the income tax system we have today and devolved into a neocon shill.

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>>129754010
wrong

No Antifa flag!? What the hell 4chan you racist xenophobic pricks.

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Ancap flag is #1 on the list of "new" flags.
Ancap #1
Ancap master race.

>>129754010
I've seen polls and it usually stays in a dead heat,natsoc tends to pull ahead but never by more than 4-5%
>>129763695
This is literally how nations tax people. what the fuck kind of ancap criticism is this? "Hey will you elect me to govern you?" "pay this new 40% income tax, fucking do it or I will throw you in jail"
>>129767893
Stef put it well, if you're against slavery you don't hang out with slave owners.
>>129761847
>NOBODY IN SOCIETY WOULD WANT TO PAY ANYBODY TO PREVENT TANKS FROM ROLLING OVER THEIR FRONT YARD
Ancap society could crowdsource payment for a military, but the group that does the military shouldn't be the same group that does the police force which shouldn't be the same group that does the courts which shouldn't be the same group that does the charity which shouldn't be the same group that does the water lines
>>129774452
100% voluntary?
>>129776649
This is dumb as shit, does anyone want me to respond to it?

>>129767458
But what happens when it really is the Jews?

>>129754010
Correct

>>129778237
You are owner of your body, therefore you're the owner of what you produce with it in interaction with nature.

Property rights are required to deal with scarcity in a non-conflicting way, establishing a first-appropriation method as nobody but the first has better claim on property.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sn5QNlDryOk

>>129778723
If they're for the same price, then why would I, the consumer, not simply buy the well-made wooden table?
You can't beat the logic of the market.

>>taxes
>>rent
>>not the same thing
When you pay rent, you're paying for the cost of building the structure/developing (increasing the value of) the land. Tax is not rent because the state does not increase the value of the land or people it parasitizes. Things like roads, hospitals, police, etc. complicate the question. Then the moral issue becomes that you don't have a choice whether or not you want to benefit from these things at that price. At the very least, the state is a coercive monopoly.

>>129753535
Because pol is WOKE

Libertarians get the most important unit of society wrong.
It's the Family not the individual.
I could never be a commie because of incentive, I left libertarianism because they cannot deal in the realities that are degeneracy. Nor can they deal with open borders and how this leads to them getting outvoted and eventually everything get stolen from them when commies/brown/poor people vote to take it.

>>129768700
>he actually thinks poland's problems come from socialism
wew lad

>>129775878
Why try something new when you can use an idea that's already been thoroughly debunked.

Becoming a dictator is the ultimate form of self interest.

>>129779660
But natsoc worked greatly
Took the entire world to bring it down

>>129778723
>selling some stupid ikea crap that will break instantly for the same price
>for the same price

Who would buy Ikea if it wasn't cheaper/better designed than robust tables.

People want good design at accessible price, that's what Ikea offers.

>selling a cellphone that is water proof and has changeable parts so it can have updated hardware
>Implying there are no options in the market if you want a durable phone
>Implying people want a durable phone instead of a good looking and slim one

>taxes
>rent
>not the same thing

By that moronic logic

>rape
>sex
>not the same thing

>sharing
>theft
>not the same thing

You're missing the key ingredient, CONSENT. , just kys, end with the suffering of having to live with a sub 90 IQ.

>>129779111
checked
Well, if they violate the NAP, they can get the fuck in the McOven™

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>>129762809
States are still government's retard. Guns are great though.

>>129779609
The family is the most important group in society. The individual is the only possible "unit", for you cannot subdivide an individual and still get something capable of moral agency.

Hoppean ancaps (ie. most of this board at this point) strongly value the concept of family. Familiar bonds and strong individualism are not incompatible.

Also
>libertarian
>open borders
>outvoted
only if you're talking about cucked minarchist libertarianism. That's not what this thread is about.

>>129761159
Oh look, a commie

>>129779609
So families should be coercive organizations? Doesn't sound like much of a family life to me. Surely families should be held together by mutual love and respect - by the fact that they actually WANT to be together - rather than by the state's gun?
What would be the value of having families that only exist because you force them to exist, rather than because they are inherently valuable to those involved?
Libertarianism is compatible with degeneracy, it's true. But if you want to fix that, you have to fix the society's basic philosophical/religious/whatever values. Good fucking luck fixing it by force.

>>129779609
I suggest that you lurk the upcoming libertarian right general threads as we treat often the issue of degeneracy and borders and I don't think anyone open minded to read it will think that what we support does not address those issues.

Taxation is theft.
Government is tyranny.
War is mass murder.
Conscription is slavery.

Such truths are self evident.

>>129753535

>>129780774
>Such truths are self evident.
Evidently not so self-evident given how little popularity ancap has as a political ideology.

>>129753535
>jew loving thread
Friendly reminder that 45% of the 1% is jewish.

>>129753535
My god

>>129781411
>>129781449

Don't like it? Leave my friend!

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>>129753535
Am I welcome here?

>>129781411
Friendly reminder that virtually all of the 1% had major government assistance in getting there.

Why wouldn't you want to help the poor though? I don't get it, sharing wealth seems to be the only logical way to make sure everyone is taken care of.

>>129753535
how do you feel about pirates?
aren't an-caps and pirates similar?

>>129781521
How about you leave to reddit, Jew.
>>129781601
>implying it will be better when every worker will be a sweatshop worker.

anarcho capitalism doesn't work without race realism

>>129777622
Could you elaborate on that? How is it impossible for some company to simply have an enormous advantage over other companies?

>>129781797
Whoa, don't you know historically /pol/ has been libertarian?

>>129754010
Nah fuck off mate, and take your meme ideology with you

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>>129754010
Wrong you faggot, open borders loving degenerate

>>129781297
People can be indoctrinated out of having common sense. That's why it's so important for the state to control education.

Think about it. If they really cared about education would government bother building and owning 'education' centers and employing 'education' personnel directly instead of, say, giving you a check if you can't afford it?

If you're hungry the government just gives you a check instead of building public supermakets, because it doesn't care what you eat.
But if you need education they will build education centers that they directly control instead of giving a check to parents so they send their kids to some private alternative. That's because what you have in your head it the important thing here.

>>129781984
I do know that, ron paul supporters.
But, there is a difference between making excuse for jews.
And i did not attack libertarians.(Though i hate them as much)

>>129782052
You don't need the state to protect you from shitskins if you don't have the state feeding them and keeping them alive.

>>129782139
You do realize the jews exert their power using the government?

>>129753535
Ancaps are utter retards. Their entire ideology will be laughed at as all jobs are automated and the only practical economic system is socialism.

>>129782139
Jew blaming is kiddie tier politics. There's a myriad of other lobbies apart of the zionist one. You just care about that because being a nazi and/or a Hitler fanboy is the edgy and contrarian thing to do and it gives you a sense of identity.

>>129782379
Name a single threat to the planet that is anywhere near as powerful as the Marxist kikes.

>>129782232
Yes I do, but giving them full power over the financial and now taking full responsibility of the government offices sector will be much worse.
Full control of propaganda, full control of employment, no resistance from the people.
>>129782379
I don't like any multinational investors, it is that the jews hold an insane power, and are using that power against our common interests, ancap will give them more power.

>>129782080
Of course. I'm just pointing out that those things being self-evident means little. In order to convince someone, you still have to fight through layers of indoctrination and government propaganda, which to them seems like an attack on things THEY consider perfectly self-evident.

Anarcho-capitalism is not an easy or simplistic ideology to sell. You generally need a more intelligent person to appreciate it and understand the complexities. I can't remember how many times I've reached the point where people go
>well, it makes sense and I see your point, but I still don't think it's realistic in this day and age
and then they completely forget about everything they just agreed with.

>>129782227
Except white countries are by nature more successful so shit skins will inevitably come to our countries for better opportunity and a higher standard of living

>>129780367
Ok thanks I will.
>>129780353
mutual love and respect...I'd say there is more than that. If we took a look at data of Poos even in western countries who generally have arranged marriages.
want to be together? Divorce is typically a short sighted move by the wife, where she has been conned into the grass is greener.
The two parent family is inherently valuable to society as a concept to hold up as virtuous. The two parent family is valuable to the children and to society. single parent families initiate much more force. But to get to the core, the data comparing outcomes of children from two parents and one parent is staggering.
The state's gun is more often used to allow divorce rape than to hold marriage together.
I am not against forcing people to raise children together(get married) in normal wedlock situations as used to be the social norm, still not uncommon today.
>>129780254
thank you for the response. I do forget about the ancap and minarch are not the same and some arguments cannot be applied to both.

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>>129782516

Weak degenerate Westerners in general. Don't even have to be Marxist, just have to lack survival instinct.

>>129778644 Marx predicted that if we achieved a socialist society, no a capitalist one.

Sure

>>129781549
Just keep your 100% voluntary indentured african americans out of my private property and we won't have to have a squabble involving several cruise missiles.

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Generic Political jargon

>>129782280
As much as i hate capitalism, it prevents automation(like any system where the consumer is also the worker), because without the worker there is no consumer, and without the consumer, the companies cannot make money.

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Wha' if th' sprog consents though?

>>129783047
Capitalism would take us to post scarcity, which would be the moment for revolution.

Well, capitalism took us to Marx's post scarcity 50 years ago. If we didn't care about management 50 years ago, today you and I wouldn't be debating what Marx said.

Release the buttsniffs!

>>129783261
Under our current statist system, youths are occasionally tried as adults. Evidently we consider those under the age of consent to be capable of being able to provide adult consent to other things.

>>129753535
>>129754010
Ethnic Nationalism > Civic Nationalism
Civic Nationalism is Globalism
Your ideals are noble until you consider they are destructive to your own people.

>>129783239 Than wu is automation curing under capitalism.

>>129783239 Than why is automation happing under capitalism?

Duck ramps.

/end thread

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>>129760215
kill yourself

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>>129783870
>not having an anarcho-capitilist society that becomes ethno-centric without breaking the NAP by refusing services to non-whites and refusing non-whites to even step on private property (eg all property)

I mean they'd probably all die/chimp out/leave without welfare before that anyway kek

>>129779284
How does that differ from the conception of private property in Prouhdonian Mutualism?

Suppose I make interaction with land at a single point in time. Do I own this land indefinitely?

>>129783676
I agree there should be an age requirement to being ancap.

Somewhere between the letter A and the color purple.

>>129782829
>I can't remember how many times I've reached the point where people go
>>well, it makes sense and I see your point, but I still don't think it's realistic in this day and age
>and then they completely forget about everything they just agreed with.
Iktfb. I just stopped caring at this point. There's no personal benefit in being a sperg. Whomever is oblivious to the laws of economics and incentives will pay dearly in the future.

And anyways I'm pretty convinced the future is gonna be decentralized whether we like it or people wants it or not. Nation-states and empires have been doing nothing but dissolve and break out in smaller and smaller jurisdictions thorughout the 20th centruy and this process is even accelerating.

Decentralization is the future.

>>129784765
This. It's coming whether people like it or not, so we win no matter what.

>>129784464
>Implying some CEO won’t decide to serve minorities just to get cash. Or minorities just create a center market with there privet property.

>>129784471
not fully versed in mutualism but I believe they stablish private property is only legitimate while in use?

If so, it differs in the sense that yes, you own that land indefinitely if you acquired that land legitimately, you have better claim on it than anyone else after you.

Another, different matter is whether or not people will use that claim, which would introduce the potential of squatting.

Proudhon certainly had some bright interventions and his friendship with Bastiat was a possitive. He admitted that private property is the best way to get rid of the state's grip and this is one of my core beliefs too.

Violate my NAP with your scud missile senpai.

Also why in the christ did they allow flag selection again? Country shitposting will have nothing on this.

>>129785289
So how exactly is indefinitely held land, well, held? What means is there outside of the state to dictate that land is, in fact, an individual's?

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>>129784464
Stormies are too dumb to fully understand the intricacies and full consequences of the exercise of freedom of association, which is currently restricted throughout all the western world.

As I already said somewhere ITT their politics are edgy kiddie tier.

>>129784969
Pic related (written as far back as in the 90's) predicted all of it and even today there are still things happening that go according to the trends they described. I didn't even know what libertarianism was when I read it, and they didn't even mention it, but eventually found it out because it pointed to many of the truths on economics, politics, history and society that libertarians contemplate.

>>129785657
A big old wall with a big old sign that says. "Not yours."

>>129785776
Preferably automatically patrolled by big old automatic turrets and surrounded with big old landmines and razor wire.

>>129785776
So that is essentially enforcing a non-voluntary relationship?

>>129785957
What is a voluntary relationship in this context, exactly? Anyone can take your property if they wish?

In that case, can we have a voluntary relationship between you, me, and your wallet?

>>129785936
With big old camera's connected to big old screens on a big old network. I feel ya bruh.

>>129785957
Depends on if the construct of language you use is subjectively understood or not.

>>129781663

Helping the poor isn't mutually exclusive.

You can donate to the poor all you want, why do you need the middle man of government to do so?

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>>129753535
aww yeah

>>129786346
Nobody wants to help the poor. That's the big secret coverup here.

The government is largely an autonomous system developed to do the work no one wants to do.

>>129773531
lol did the person who wrote that just skim the abstract?

>>129785657
Protection of one's property is one's responsibility.

There are multiple ways to protect your land, in most situations under anarcho capitalism, this protection will be most likely provided by private cities security.

>>129786276
Voluntary as in consisting of a relationship that does not require some sort of force to maintain.

But even so, suppose an individual owns a piece of property. He is a farmer that has worked this property for many years. He eventually has enough surplus to sustain himself, and so proceeds to employ individuals to work his property for him. He allows them to build housing on his land, but in return they must work his land exclusively. Is he not the king of this land?

Imagine a mobile assembly line that operates 24/7/365 where each interaction point is a modular job that can be done from anywhere by anyone at anytime with toggled automation.

idk about you all but I'm trying to plug myself BACK into the matrix.

>>129787080
All property, including life, requires force to maintain. Your premise is faulty.

>Is he not king of this land?
Yes. they would be his subjects so long as they are willing to live on his land.

>>129787068
>private city
how exactly would you divide up the city, based on familial realtions, dependant on how much property one owns, depending on how much military one uses to subdue the local populace. you truly have a fledgling ideology when all you can use is private wealth reserves and property especially with no mecahnism of government to enforce your rights.

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>>129786460 *Fixed it

>>129788311
Your religion is your government and that blows.

>>129788311
>no mecahnism of government to enforce your rights
Is government the only mechanism able to enforce your rights? How do they achieve this? When someone wants to rape your boipucci in a dark alley, do you bend over and shout
>if only government were here to protect me!

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>>129787080
Yes, the philosophical justification of property is that it is an extension of one's life and one's effort to sustain it. As nobody has the right to deprive you of life, nobody has the right to deprive you of the means by which you sustain and pursue that life: action (this is the root of freedom) and the material result of action (property). Property is the result of effort, of the work of one's mind and muscles.
Thus, it would seem that it is not possible for anyone to own virgin land, as it is not the product of anyone's effort. However, one has to consider the circumstances involved in coming across virgin land. If the land is untouched by humans, then necessarily you are the first one to discover it; thus, in claiming it as your property, you are not coming into conflict with anyone as there is nobody else on the scene. If others wish to use that land, then they must buy it from you at a mutually agreeable price. If they wanted to use it without having to pay you, then they should have gone out and discovered it first. Since they, in fact, did not, it follows that the discovery of new land involves an effort or cost (presumably a time cost), which they were unwilling to pay. What they are paying you for when they buy it is the effort involved in discovering the land.
Rapidly, of course, all available land would be 'homesteaded' in this way, and then
market forces would take over to redistribute land into the hands of those who can use it most productively.

>>129787080
>Is he not the king of this land?
I see where you're trying to get, but consider the following: Why are they not working somewhere else?

If they are working for him then it necessarily follows that the owner/king is providing them with the means to produce more that they otherwise would by working by themselves in another ownerless plot of land. Those means might be capital or the managerial capacities of the capitalist to arrange the force of his employees in a productive manner.

The creation of means of production requires work. They also require work to be maintained. If the workers decide to work for someone who provides them with the means to be many times more productive than they otherwise would, the voluntary contract that states that the capitalist is "taking" a small percent of such production is by comparison a bargain.

If you own yourself then, yes, you own what you produce. But one of the rights implicit in the ownership of the worker on his labor is to sell it if he wishes to. If you can't sell your labor then you don't really own it.

>>129789062
people are swayed to a cause regardless of money, if your only incentive to keep ownership and order within a city through monetary means you are sorely mistaken, look at religious fanatics, they aren't really swayed much by money more so in a cause that transcends material wealth. You wanna keep order between all these peoples you must have a mechanism that is stronger than voluntarism since people won't volunteer on mass depending on the circumstance.

>>129789169
also this: >>129789499

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>>129753535
I welcome it.

>>129789579
So big old walls with big old doors in them and a big old welcome mat.

>>129778327

brap

>>129782516
As far as I know marxist jewish are non existant or a tiny, tiny minority among those that could be atributted the jewish ethnicity. If there is a marxist problem I do not know, but I for sure don't hate the 99% of jews that just want to go on with their lives.

You dude just need to outgrow the memes.