DARK ENLIGHTENMENT

>>129586861
Criticisms of modernity are damning, but are much more on point than their solutions, but that is the case with every opposition movement. Overall, its like /pol/ for grownups.

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>>129586861
Any movement that presents itself as reactionary or conservative is bound to fail because people don't want to maintain status quo.
You should instead present your ideas as "revolutionary", a chance to bring "change" and "hope". This is how king nigger and Macron won the elections.
You don't even have to lie about it because right wing IS the revolutionary in current year +2.

>>129587029

>Overall, its like /pol/ for grownups.

Pretty much this. The alt-right is all about memes, shitposting and youtube videos. That's why it appeals to such a large audience.

Neoreaction, on the other hand, is actually an intelectual movement and you need to be well read to engage in their discussions. That's why the movement isn't that popular online.

>>129586861
Bunch of spambot humans weaving word salad that only serves to justify inevitable tech feudalist future.

Fancier /pol but actually less incisive and relevant because it's a bunch of typical academic bombast but coming out of the butts of crank non-academics.

Nick Land is entertaining at least.

>>129587186
The obsession with revolution, change and newness is part of the cancer of modernity.

>>129587186

The Neoreactionary movement doesn't plan becoming popular, they won't brand as "revolution" because false branding to fool stupid people is a thing democracies do. The movement try to get support from influent people rather than a lot of people, it's not a mob movement.

Basically a return to traditional values, a rejection of the "values" that started with modernism and degenerated into postmodernism? Sounds good to me if so

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NEEDS TO GO FURTHER BACK

>>129589987
One realizes modernity destroys all values, seeks to create new ones. Fails, looks to the divine source of all values. Can Christianity provide this source?

>>129590925
It's worked for many.

>>129586861
It's not really viable, because the core underlying flaw with reactionary movements is that the very forces compelling them to clamor for a return of the past in some way (values, tech level, etc) were influenced by the traditions that brought them there in the first place.

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It is the final redpill.

Obligatory reading:
https://radishmag.wordpress.com
http://socialmatter.net
http://atavisionary.com

>>129591245
Look how cucked monarchs are today, how can this be a solution?

>>129591452
today's monarchies are ceremonial and have been for over a century now

the monarchs need to be given back executive power

>>129591452
Aristotle favoured a constitutional gouvernment with a strongman monarch. A good one can do miracles but monarchy can easily descend into tyranny, which the constitution ideally prevents.

The English had something similar with the Magna Carta but whenever a monarch fucked up they took power away from him, instead of just slapping him on his head. Result is a constitutional monarchy where the royal daren't make a move and elected bureaucrats can do as they please.

>>129591652
So they'll enforce open borders? Every old dinasty is now leftist, and old aristocratic families are greens like Doria in Genova or the austrian president

>>129591223
so the only path is that of metamodernism and the dialectic between modernism and post modernism synthesizing something new?

>>129591881
that's why we need new monarchs of course

>>129592035
And how we choose them? Right of conquest like the passage from the Roman Empire to feudalism?

>>129592242
how were Hitler and Mussolini chosen?

>>129586861
I respect and cherish Enlightenment values, as should you. Those are the very conservative principles of Western Civililisation that this board bemoans the decline of-

>respect
>fortitude
>education
>stoicism

>>129592564
don't forget about
>progress
>tolerance

oh wait, that might just hurt your narrative a bit, won't it!

>>129592358
Don't know about mussolini, but Hitler was given the position of Chancellor by the Weimar Republic in hopes of keeping him and his right-wing alliance under control.
Then they held elections that gave the NSDAP absolute majority and Hitler purged the gouvernment.

Degeneracy enables amateur politicians to climb higher than they deserve, and this one thought he could hold the storm. Classic miscalculation on his part lol

>>129586861
Moldbug is mandatory reading for anyone who claims to be right-wing in the year 2017.

>>129592358
>>129592735
Mussolini got appointed as first minister by the king.

This is Tiranny, not Monarchy. It doesn't pay in the long term, look at Dionisius of Syracusa.

>>129592564

t. Brainlet

Respect, fortitude, and stoicism all belong to cultures and belief sets that predate the enlightenment by thousands of years. Especially stoicism, which I'm not sure why you included. The enlightenment principle which we most object to is egalitarianism, which you might call the defining principle of the enlightenment. It formed the basis for both the French Revolution and the American Revolution, both spawned by enlightenment thought.

>>129592688
ah, so because some values are less valuable than others when we think pragmatically about them, they must all be invalid.

thanks for pointing that out to everyone.

>>129589101
Attack novelty worship instead of culture. Argue that advertising is psychological abuse based on current year neuroscience progress. Argue that talking shit instead of making arguments is abusive, leave no grey area. Claim the usa is a post enlightenment liberty state and advocate for new amendment to constitution banning psychological abuse. This kills the part of our culture using approval and shame as social capital. This kills the part of our culture entrenched in mockingbird behavior. Instead of advocating for traditionalism as a cultural style advocate for modernist styles but with behavior based in agency. Argue that agency is made of self awareness and self actualization. Argue that limiting the lawful and non violent expressions of agency is abusive and inhumane.

This destroys cultural marxism behaviorally and ideologically without threatening continuance of government or regressing from modernist styles. We'll still be on social media, but we'll be shaming anyone that is not based in agency and is not msking an argument. This allows fully brainwashed mockingbirds to be directed properly even though they don't have self awareness and self actualization.

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>>129587186
>Any movement that presents itself as reactionary or conservative is bound to fail because people don't want to maintain status quo.

I think you misunderstand Neo-Reaction. NRx does not seek to preserve the status-quo at all, nor does it want to return society to a fixed traditional state. NRx looks back to those traditionalist writers like Evola, Carlyle, Joseph de Maistre etc as sources of inspiration, as an alternative view to the modern progressive poz. NRx is not like, say, the Amish who have essentially frozen themselves in time. NRx accepts that we live in modernity and we can't just reverse time to a prior state. Therefore NRx seeks a dialectal fusion between elements of tradition and modernity. That's as far as I understand it anyway, there are of course a range of opinions within NRx with different aims.

>>129593767
This sounds useless. Define a goal, define a vector of achievement.

>>129593767
so you want a second bite at the cherry and hope things go differently?

as I understand it, there was a time when the world was at that position of trad-modern fusion after modernism first began to coalesce, what would stop things taking the familiar path to where we are now?

>>129590925
I don't believe Christianity can provide anything for Western civilization. Scripture has been manipulated by Leftists and communists and the church leaders are working against our interests.

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>>129593767
Yeah I did not mean to imply that Neo-Reaction seeks to preserve the status quo. However this is the impression that people will get when they hear the world "reaction". Women go back to the kitchen, niggers go back to the cotton fields and so on (which is not status-quo at all but never mind that).

Let's assume for a moment you want to restore the monarchy. How do you convince people to accept this notion?
Say that you want to restore the monarchy and they will laugh at you for wanting to bow to pic related.
But if you say that you want a strong presidential system which effectively is similiar to the monarchy except for your king is dressed in black and doesn't wear clown - that will be considered a serious political position because it's acceptable in modern political discourse.
You should always appear modern and edgy even if what your trying to do is just restoring the former order.

>>129593767
>I am a modernist in many ways because I believe we created a modern world that has been taken away from what it could have been. The modern and that which preceded it are not necessarily in complete opposition. If people with our sorts of values ruled modernity, everything about the society would be, at one level the same, and in every other respect completely different. People would still drive contemporary cars; there’d still be jets; and there’d still be supercomputers, and so on. But the texture and the nature of life would be different in every respect.

>How so?

>Firstly, cultures would be mono-ethnic. Secondly, there would be a respect for the past glories of our civilization. Thirdly, we would not preface every attempt to be strong by saying “I’m sorry, I’m sorry for what we have done.”

>We’re not sorry!

>And we’ve stepped over the prospect of being sorry.

>>129594471
You never apologize for being based in agency, great start

>>129587186

There is Hoppe?

>>129587536
>Nrx
>intellectual
Moldbug sure is respected

> tfw they advocate constant change but when true change comes they are butt blasted

>>129586861
>Neoreaction Movement
>Neo
Anything that needs to put "neo" before its name is cancer. Reactionaries are reactionaries.

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>>129594794
>The intellectuals of the established order don't respect someone who challenges it

IMAGINE MY SHOCK

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>>129594471
Based Bowden.

>I’m critical of the ugliness and debauched modernity that it’s led to, a sort of barren and desiccated quality. But on the other hand there’s a part of me that admires thrusting modernism, and its energy and achievement, and I’m torn between the utilitarian, sort of dourness that a lot of modernity has become, and the freshness and energy that transpired at its beginning, so I tend to take in a Nietzschean way from different concepts like Romanticism and modernism, things which I like. I tend to view things positively rather than negatively. I tend to be dialectical, so there are parts of modernism which I choose to admire and revere, and there’s parts that have led on to things which I dislike or despise. So my view doesn’t tend to be either or. It tends to be synthetic in a sense, or syncretic, whereby I take up all sorts of tendencies and use them in a firmament of becoming.

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Like another user wrote, it's like /pol/ for grownups.

Higher level of discussion, less meme spouting, less dogma.

If anyone is interested in an NRx discord:
EhAaDc

Mandatory weekly book discussion, optional film/doc discussion

>>129595752
>Everybody’s mouthing somebody else’s ideas.