THEISM IS SILLY

>>129409579
REEEEE! YOU ARE GOING TO DIE SCREAMING AT THE STAKE, FILTHY INFIDEL SCUM!

Most of the internet is filled with non-believers but I still get a few who call this board Christian.

>>129409803

Stakes are not really popular here; steaks are though!

Western civilization was built upon Christianity. You remove the fundamental presupposition of morality, (God), and society will collapse.

>>129410130

Western civilization was horrific until they dropped the Christianity part and started picking up aspects of Roman government they stopped using. Enlightenment got rid of the last bit of priests and kings.

File: 1495685156397.jpg (37KB, 670x496px) Image search: [Google]

37KB, 670x496px

I am not biased;Jews and Muslims can also join this thread to lose their 'faith.'

Well, either theism is dying or people do not want their beliefs challenged.

I'm an Atheist Christian.
(Basically meaning that I think Christianity has the best memes, but I don't think anything happens when you die).

I guess my question is this:

Without some sort of "god" (being the idealized personification of "good"), how is it possible to claim enough moral authority to enforce or discourage behavior?

>>129411458
You argue about it and give your reasons.

>>129411422
It's just a low tier uninteresting thread, go to reddit

>>129409579
Explain consciousness
Explain the origin of the universe

>>129409579
So you believe in God but are against him? That's what an anti-theist is. If you believe there is no God that's atheism.

>>129411790
No u

>>129411930
Origin of the universe = the singularity. Our entire concept of time comes from the Big Bang, there was a singularity before the "Big Bang". Also, our universe may not be the only universe.

>>129413298
>there was a singularity before the "Big Bang"
where did it come from?
Also what created the laws of physics?

>>129409579
Do you believe there is no god, or are you more agnostic?

>>129413498
Let me just skip ahead in this argument

>where did god come from
>oh he came from himself
>why can't the universe come from itself?
>no reason, I just don't think it can
>no reason
>no reason

t. Christian.

Just trying to save us some time fellow theist. The cosmological argument has no probative value, though it is an excellent educational resource!

>Wasting time trying to argue on a matter that is a know unknown.
I'm not gonna give you a (You) either faggot OP.

>>129413780
>>why can't the universe come from itself?
Because that violates the natural laws of the universe
If you think that you have to admit naturalism is bogus

>>129413498
Maybe that singularity always existed. Our entire concept of time comes from the Big Bang. Also, laws are just descriptive, not proscriptive/pre-scriptive. Laws just describe what's happening.

>>129414152
God violates the known natural laws of the universe, if it exists. A universe causing itself would violate the known natural laws of the universe no more or less than a God causing the universe.

By asking me to doubt that the universe could cause itself due to naturalism, you're ignoring that your position violates naturalism as much, and also ignoring the possibility of some new understanding of the laws of the known universe (since our knowledge thereof is known to be incomplete)

>>129414205
>Maybe that singularity always existed.
maybe there is a le spaghetti monster
will you admit that you are not in the same position as a biblical literalist
>Laws just describe what's happening.
Well what causes things to happen they way they do?

>>129414152
How many universes can we examine? Also the "laws" just came after the Big Bang.

File: 1496963420609.jpg (31KB, 600x600px) Image search: [Google]

31KB, 600x600px

>>129409579
There is no good consequentialist argument for giving up religion. Atheists breed bellow replacement. They create the most genocidal regimes. They skew hi IQ (which makes the not breeding problem even more dysgenic). And to top it all off atheism rejects the only functional cultural transmitter of preferable behavior that humanity shows any evidence of embracing effectively. There are zero benefits to atheism. Argue against any religion you want. But atheism is suicide.

There you go. An atheist's argument for rejecting atheism. Time to get our LARP on you fucks.

>>129414446
>God violates the known natural laws of the universe,
Duh
God is above the natural laws of the universe
> position violates naturalism as much
I am not a naturalist

>>129414471
>How many universes can we examine?
how many do you have evidence of
>Also the "laws" just came after the Big Bang.
Where do they come from?

>>129411458

Morality is empirical as in we can verify the outcomes of actions on the interaction of sentient species.

>>129414451
Again, our entire concept of time comes from the Big Bang. The singularity existed BEFORE the Big Bang. That's actually a good conclusion to draw. I'm in a better position than a Biblical Literalist.

>Well what causes things to happen they way they do?

Shit happening. Laws just describe what's happening. They're not proscriptive.

>>129411930

I can go into those subjects but first explain why they have anything to do with a deity.

>>129414661
>how many do you have evidence of

One. Exactly.

>Where do they come from?

Most that I know of from the Big Bang. Also, I could say this a million times scientific laws are not proscriptive, but descriptive.

>>129414744
>The singularity existed BEFORE the Big Bang
How long before?
>hit happening. Laws just describe what's happening.
So you dont know

File: 9.jpg (42KB, 479x720px) Image search: [Google]

42KB, 479x720px

>>129411458
>I'm an Atheist Christian

>>129414555

Well, that fact that there is no evidence for a deity forces me to not believe.

>>129414559
>Duh
>God is above the natural laws of the universe
Oh, then your argument has no persuasive value, or probative value.

Think about it this way: you're trying to convince someone on the basis of one position maybe violating the natural laws, by persuading them to a position where the natural laws are violated. And then saying "well duh, the natural laws are gonna be violated.

How could you possibly think that was convincing?

Revelation 19
6 And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth.

>>129414832
It has to do with questions man cannot answer
>>129414938
>Most that I know of from the Big Bang.
How did they big bag change how the natural universe functions
Can you do it again?

>>129414950

You are asking 'what came before causality' which is an incomprehensible question.

>>129414950
>How long before?
Right before.

>So you dont know
No, I know. Shit happening is what causes shit happening (after the Big Bang). Scientific laws are just descriptive and only deal with things that came from the Big Bang. Our "laws" breakdown before the Big Bang.

>>129415169

>It has to do with questions man cannot answer

That is nice but they have nothing to do with deities.

>>129415182
Just wait til he realizes that the god he is arguing for is without properties beyond "causes the universe", and can just as easily be a nonsapient collection of atoms compressed into a singularity.

>>129415003
>How could you possibly think that was convincing?
Because I am arguing that naturalism is retarded
Not that things need to conform to it

>>129415169
>How did they big bag change how the natural universe functions

Laws are DESCRIPTIVE, NOT proscriptive. I swear you people are like creationists with the word "theory".

>>129415279

Theists seem to argue for a multi-organism outside time and space. It is baffling to me because of how little sense it makes yet how many people believe it.

>>129409579
if god dosnt exist how do you exist?

checkeye fedora head

>>129415182
>>129415230
>>129415279
I am arguing nothing other than naturalism is garbage
>>129415220
>Right before.
How long
> Shit happening is what causes shit happening
What shit?

>>129415364
Something determines how the universe functions
What is it?

>>129409579
Can you go on to joyofsatan ministries for me and try some of the demon summoning stuff. I've always wanted to try but ive been too much of a pussy.

File: Isle-Mao.gif (127KB, 666x557px) Image search: [Google]

127KB, 666x557px

>>129409579
ayy lmao

>>129414981
No this guy's thoughts exactly. Ive been wondering exactly this.

>>129415483

There is no evidence of the supernatural. As long as you can admit that the only thing you can prove is the natural world.

>>129415606

Joy of Satan ministries?

>>129415704
haah, your sanity is still intact,
>keep it that weay

>>129415704
Did you see my post? Would you be willing to try this for me?

>>129415430
I'm a theist, I just believe the cosmological argument is stupid.

The concept of a deity outside of time and space isn't too crazy, but the deity could also be a consequence of unique arrangements inside our universe, or the totality of our universe.

>>129415483
Well now you're arguing nothing other than that. When the goalposts were at the other end of the field, you were arguing for god.

>>129415704
>There is no evidence of the supernatural
How can the natural universe naturally create itself?

>>129415572
Big Bang is the basis for our scientific laws, which are only descriptive and not proscriptive.

>>129415782
Yea google it, joyofsatan.org

>>129415828

Yeah there was a quote at the top that said

"THERE IS NO GOD BUT MYSELF" "KNOWING THIS, WHO DARES WORSHIP THE FALSE GODS OF THE KORAN AND BIBLE?"
-SATAN"

So basically incoherent tribal ramblings.

>>129415851
>you were arguing for god.
where?

File: 1480942043567.png (73KB, 350x290px) Image search: [Google]

73KB, 350x290px

The empirical existence of the large g semitic god or any other deity doesn't matter and never did. That's not the point. If your prayed for a bike as if tha J-mann was fucking santy clause you're not worth your weight in fertilizer.

>>129415918
Maybe the universe always existed. Our entire concept of time comes from the Big Bang. The singularity existed before the Big Bang.

>>129415918

I have no idea what the word 'create' means without space and time. Your question is incoherent.

>>129415945
>hich are only descriptive and not proscriptive.
yes you have mentioned that before
Just admit metaphysics is just philosophy

>>129415955

Seems like they need to step away from 90s. Fire graphics are not trendy anymore!

>>129416056
>>129416061
So you dont have answers
That is all I needed to know

>>129416113
I'm telling you what the scientific understanding of a law is.

>>129416130
Haha yea it was also a bit annoying to read. Looks like they are also "nazis," if that's your flavor. But they have specific instructions for summoning demons and shit

>>129416200
You got answers, you're just an idiot.

>>129416200

You were asking me what happens when you divide by zero. We can not 'know' something that does not happen.

>>129416254
>I'm telling you what the scientific understanding of a law is.
I am aware

>>129416306
>You got answers,
>Maybe the universe always existed
>maybe
No I didnt

>>129416286

Seems about on par with Judaism, Christianity and Islam. I do not understand why you need fan-fiction to find meaning in your life.

>>129409579
I believe in God but and not religious.

Does this count?

>>129409905
Because it is nigger.
Eat shit.

>>129416366
Then you would understand that when I say laws are just descriptive and not proscriptive I'm not giving some wishy-washy philosophical bullshit answer/understanding, but a scientific one.

>>129416457
>>129416366

Are you claiming that you know how casualty formed before casualty existed?

>>129414992
Do you actually think a being that makes, preserves and encompasses all has to make his being known to your lil brain?
If you answer yes, then you're a rationalist and you need to kys asap.
Rationalism is low key materialism which is the most shitty metaphysical stance there is. It basically claims to know that there is only matter and there is no qualitative difference between any forms of matter. Eg your own consciousness is only quantitatively different from the shit you took last time.

>>129416457
Yeah, you're an idiot.

>>129416595
>but a scientific one.
Yes because science doesn't know
That is my point

>>129416586

Majority non-believers but the theists scream the loudest.

File: 1478763781635.jpg (391KB, 1280x1447px) Image search: [Google]

391KB, 1280x1447px

>>129415606
>almost got "those" digits
>tempting normies to play with fire
heh heh heh. But still thats not very (insert religion) of you anon.

>>129416603
Where did I claim to know anything
>>129416661
How is maybe an answer?

>>129416674
Wasn't aware the board had become mostly degenerate.

>>129411458
All Christians who follow Christ's teachings become atheists.

>>129416649
There could be something outside of what's natural. How do we investigate what is outside of nature? When is the good time to believe something to be true?

>>129416603
>phoneposter
damn bruh
u a smart gamer dawg damn...

>>129416815
That's one of the most retarded claims I've ever read.

>>129416649

>Do you actually think a being that makes, preserves and encompasses all has to make his being known to your lil brain?

I have no idea what fictional characters believe in. I suppose Odin could actually hate all humans as a god but that does not make him any less real.

>Rationalism is low key materialism which is the most shitty metaphysical stance there is. It basically claims to know that there is only matter and there is no qualitative difference between any forms of matter. Eg your own consciousness is only quantitatively different from the shit you took last time.

That is nice; can you prove a deity or the supernatural?

>>129410261
Christianity has 2.2 billion followers. American cultural values are Christian - if your heritage is from a Christian nation, then it's still 100% in you.

>>129416672
Science doesn't claim to KNOW pretty much ANYTHING.

>>129416814

It has been ever since the Stormfags invaded.

>>129415987
i have seen the supernatural, and my sanity is no longer intact, unfortunately, or atleast it's been shaken a la Lovecraft.

>>129414555
pretty easy to debunk when you know what this is.
here fag http://www.wikihow.com/Refute-Pascal%27s-Wager

>>129416969
>Science doesn't claim to KNOW pretty much ANYTHING.
correct

>>129416801

Well, you seem to want us to answer a question that is incoherent. I am asking why you want to know something that has nothing to do with a deity.

>>129417027
What is the benefit for being an atheist and being correct?

>>129416956
Western cultural values are largely from the Enlightenment. The Dark Ages was Christianity. Modernity dragged Christianity kicking and screaming into Modernity. Greeks and Romans understood killing and stealing was bad, just the same way Christians did.

>>129416987
so were you one of those "occupy" chumps or what

File: rage.jpg (10KB, 250x250px)

10KB, 250x250px

>>129416969

>>129416956

Our founding fathers were deists who formed a secular nation.

>>129416987
Fuck off you whiny cunt. You're one of the worthless niggers that tried to get moot to remove the board.
You still pissy that everyone here says nigger?
An hero you useless nigger.

>>129417166

Economic and social centrist.

>>129416918
Pretty good, maybe one day you'll remember it then.
Can we talk about the death on the cross and eloi eloi lama sabachthani?

>>129417198

You talk like some one from a third world country. I would rather be correct than politically correct; which is why I still post here.

>>129417150
reddit upvotes and chicken tenders

>>129409579
I have a question

Why is your sense of self tied up with a "not belief"?

You should sign off the internet and do some soul searching because I cant imagine a happy person going on /pol/ to be an edgelord militant atheist neckbeard for fun

>>129417150
Having a good way of thinking. Not believing bullshit. Seeing things clearly.

>>129417113
can you disprove a deity?
if not then what is the point of your shitty reddit tier thread?

>>129417378
How will that matter after you are dead?

>>129414992
It doesn't. There's no evidence for no gods either. BUT my argument is that pretending to believe is better for everyone.

>>129417225
oh I bet

>>129415606
If you have given it some thought and would sell your soul to the devil if he offered enough the deal is already sealed for as long as you have that mindset or until the payment is due.

>>129417150

That is like asking 'Why be correct?' Because you should seek the truth when ever possible.

File: IMG_5199.jpg (861KB, 2048x1365px) Image search: [Google]

861KB, 2048x1365px

>>129409579
So what about Scientology? It's not a "theism"

>>129417150
a more complex, happier way of life and a
better understanding of how things work.

>>129417460

Do you have evidence for a deity or are you here to shit post?

File: Klantreerome.jpg (394KB, 1186x1021px) Image search: [Google]

394KB, 1186x1021px

>>129416586
No, it's fucking not. Kill yourself Jew slave.

>>129417477
>That is like asking 'Why be correct?
The point of being correct is to avoid the consequences of being incorrect
>Because you should seek the truth when ever possible.
why?

>>129417574
I'm here to call you fucking names because you're a myopic blowhard

>>129416935
I'm not in the business of proving deities to bitches who don't even read the posts they didn't even reply properly to.
The point was that there either is a higher ordering principle than the aforementioned shit you took last time or no.
Either accept materialism or deny materialism.
Claims of personal gods are straw men used by euphoric kids.

>>129417574
>start a shit thread
>get mad when people shit post
>>129417558
why does this matter?

>>129417383
There's no freewill with an all-knowing God that knew your end-fate BEFORE he created you (when he could have created you differently or not at all). He knew what your end-fate would be BEFORE he created you and then created you that way.

Also, God supposedly wants you to know him, but puts out good objective evidence against him.

Moderation is because of secular pressure, not religious observance.

>>129417441

I do not understand how create non-truths can help a society. The reason theists breed more is because the dumb and poor push more babies out. Maybe we should learn how to speak well and still get our population laid.

>>129409579
I'm atheist and I tolerate christcucks until they forcing their shit onto others.

>>129417594
Fuck off larping useful nigger.

>>129417441
>pretending to believe
[rollseyes]

You can't pretend to believe, you either believe or you don't. Why do you think being dishonest is better for everybody?

File: Op sucks Dicks 2.jpg (45KB, 599x672px) Image search: [Google]

45KB, 599x672px

>>129409579

>>129417027
My argument is not refuted in the same way Pascal's argument might be. Pascal is arguing in a belief in God because of religious consequences. I am arguing that people are better of at minimum pretending to believe in God because of actual real world consequences we have evidence for. The only rational position is for smart people to LARP at minimum and for idiots to believe.

Ironically the argument for atheism assumes universal truth to be a good. It is derived from Christianity to begin with.

>>129417652

Having better information generally produces better outputs.

>>129417477
You fail to see it.

>>129417728
because unlike the religious I MAKE it matter by imbuing things with purpose. with my brain.

>>129417728

I listen evolution deniers all day so you can shit post all you want.

>>129417720

We live in a material world with no evidence so far of anything transcending the universe.

>>129416550
religion is something that satan can use to keep people from God. but this can be mistaken for the common western proclivity to isolate themselves and for forsake all communal activity due to paranoia and technology. satan can infact pervert any good thing and make it destructive.

a perversion faith can convince one to idolize good deeds
a perversion of grace can convince one to be completely idle
a perversion of mercy can convince one to tolerate sin
a perversion of justice can convince one of the necessity of tyranny.

but be careful not to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

>>129417900
We should all be third world idiots (or at least pretend to be), pushing out too many kids that we can't support ............ or maybe try educating people.

>>129417756
They breed more even when controlling for IQ

File: ath.jpg (84KB, 960x960px) Image search: [Google]

84KB, 960x960px

Why isn't atheism the most retarded religion?

>>129416859
We don't "investigate" it. We live by it. Through tried and true traditions of transcendence.
It's sad that most of these traditions are dead in the west.

A perversion of truth can convince people to do and believe bullshit.

>>129417901
Which is why the materialistic worldview fails, it ignores most of reality. The Christian tradition is the best representation of the nature of human reality there is which is why it produced the most successful societies in history.

>>129418247
Strawman.

>>129417376

I would not characterize my life in that way. Rather I see religion as a human pandemic that we need help getting over. Slowly we are getting past our superstitious beliefs.

>>129417901
then why don't you crack open a fucking book sometime instead of talking out of your ass for facebook likes

>>129418247

That is not atheism but good to see you are an expert on nothing.

>>129417843
See my argument about genocide regimes, collapse of breeding rates etc from earlier. Also abandoning what amounts to effective means for transmitting preferable behavior. I'm all for constructive use of religion. We're stuck with it like every other human foible.

>>129418249
We believe bullshit because ancient superstitious idiots believed bullshit. Kinda like what Islam is doing. Religion just fights Modernity. Their claims are bullshit, there was no literal Adam and Eve. How about we don't believe bullshit and try to be smart instead of fucking idiots?

>>129418348
That was largely because we moved away from Christianity. The Dark Ages were Christian.

File: 1497036642104.png (1MB, 1000x1328px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1000x1328px

I'm late to this faggy thread but there's no scientific explanation for animation and agency.

Why would rocks turn into bugs? I'm aware this is a very simplified metaphor.

>>129418348

We know of nothing else besides the material world. Christianity is a literal blood cult. I do not see how such practices could help humanity when they could deal with reality as presented.

>>129418403

Once again, petty insults yet no arguments.

>>129417900
if you don't believe something and you have reason not to, you won't. your argument is hereby pooped on.

>>129418202
Conveniently ignoring Marxist genocides and the current descent into nihilism and medications. Doesn't take into account the cultural evolution that created religion, allowing it to manifest benefits we don't even need to comprehend. Birds don't understand physics to fly.

>>129418359
I'd call verbose pseud faggots a bigger problem

>>129418167
So you claim that the universe exists without a higher ordering principle? Ie by pure chance?
And don't even try to mention cosmic laws etc, since by admission to materialism you claim such things are just as random as everything else is.

given the absurdity of existence itself i dont find the idea of an afterlife or some form of diety to be all that far fetched desu.

>>129418308
Noble lies are very real.

>>129418464
People are arguing for Agnostic-Atheism, not Gnostic-Atheism (like the Soviet Union, etc.). Capitalism lead to decreased birthrates. We shouldn't have tons of kids that we can't support, nor should we believe bullshit.

>>129418658

You are trying to ask 'why did non-life become life.' The answer appears to be that in the right conditions these types of chain reactions can occur. Most of the Universe however is either freezing or scorching; which means this does not happen say as often as a planet forming.

>>129418308
for sure, for in my youth i was fortunate enough to give the bible the benefit of the doubt, and take its word on faith as the wisdom of the ages.
it wasnt until my 30's after receiving a healthy dose of human experience that these seemingly arbitrary rules turned out to be quite brutally accurate

>>129418719
this isn't an academic debate buck-o

>>129418247
this shits garbage
still makes more sense compared to that fuckin bible

>>129418888
>Noble lies
What's to stop the Muslims from believing their "noble lie"? You going to kill a billion Muslims? or convince them to believe your bullshit that you don't really believe?

>>129418457
what is atheism then?

Just embrace deism like the founding fathers.

>>129418811

We are not sure if logic and mathematics stem from human creativity or are a product/discovery of the Universe its self. Without a quantitative way of explaining what predates the Universe we can not talk about any 'higher order logic' because you are speaking in terms of our cosmos with our fundamental limits.

>>129418957

This is a thread for people who want to get rid of their theistic beliefs or convince me otherwise.

>>129418947
You listen to the voices in your head when they tell you to kill your kid? Refrain from getting re-married? Stay in a horrible marriage until you die? That's not even getting into the Dark Age bullshit that Christian theologians supported. Christianity was like ISIS before the Enlightenment.

>>129419348

We lack a belief in a deity.

>>129418888
People who believe in noble lies are incredibly arrogant.

Plato was a fucking hack.

>>129418530
>We believe bullshit because ancient superstitious idiots believed bullshit.
People who were equal or greater than us in every respect except maybe nutritional standards. You can't escape religion, whatever it's origin.
>Religion just fights Modernity.
Sort of. You got it the wrong way around. Modernity (rationalism, materialism, individualism) fights religion, which, unlike modernity, is a human universal and constant.
>Their claims are bullshit, there was no literal Adam and Eve.
Don't you fucking understand that stories were the best technology for preserving wisdom at the time, considering available resources.
They served valuable purposes from teaching local custom to preserving universal truths.
>How about we don't believe bullshit and try to be smart instead of fucking idiots?
I suggest you get on it, son.

>>129418764

Well, than maybe you stop being so hard on yourself?

>>129416200
Talking to atheists in a nutshell, eh? They tend to not understand science even though it's what they worship.
>How can the natural universe naturally create itself?
I'm not a physicist but I believe that scientists have addressed this question. The tl;dr is that the natural laws of the universe were not constant during points of time during (and immediately after) the Big Bang.
Thus the "natural" laws of the universe (under which our galaxy was formed) did not exist. They could therefore be considered supernatural from the subjective human perspective.

>>129418670
>We know of nothing else besides the material world.
We have only recently started constructing the materialistic worldview through the scientific method and it's instruments. For most of human history the only thing to discuss was the subjective world of humans that is ruled by their psychology which is still not close to scientifically quantified. That's the world you live in and need to understand to "produce better outputs" and that's the world the Bible describes. Formal logic itself is about 2500 years old, it was formalized only 500 years before Christ the Logos made flesh and around the same time as all the first monotheists started defining God as the source of universal law like logic.

>>129418890
If you think the religious impulse can be extinguished you are a fool. It can be hijacked. But it isn't going anywhere. Zealous allegiance to heros and imaginary sky daddies is far preferable than zealotry for the state which will always be run by sociopaths.

Do you really think the masses are going to split hairs about varieties of atheism? You are seriously making a "but that wasn't true atheism" argument about the Soviets, China etc.

I'm not arguing that religion is good. See Islam. I am arguing that it is unavoidable, and can be good. Atheism has no upside. Unless you have a religious fervor for "objective truth" despite being unable to prove your position.

File: commie.jpg (42KB, 413x600px) Image search: [Google]

42KB, 413x600px

The most destructive ideology of all time is explicitly anti-theist.

File: 66685198.jpg (150KB, 500x478px) Image search: [Google]

150KB, 500x478px

>>129409579
>THEISM IS SILLY
Kinda like the big brap theory?

>>129419512
>this is a thread where I aggressively fellate myself and throw rocks at spectators

File: P1010405.jpg (1MB, 3072x2304px)

1MB, 3072x2304px

>>129409579
Fuck you God hates fags

>>129419543
do you also lack belief in no deity?

>>129419711

That was a long paragraph explaining how you can only show we live in a material world. The Jesus mythology can not be the center of logic when it is so illogical. No person can be 'sacrificed' for another persons wrong doings. Not only is that evil but we should all be happy that there is no evidence for it.

>>129419652
>People who were equal or greater than us in every respect except maybe nutritional standards.
>People who believed the Earth was the center of the universe and thought mental illness was because of demons, left handed people were evil, etc.

> human universal
Nah, there's people who don't have any religious bullshit. I don't see how the infancy of our development should be lauded anyways. Rape is a human universal and constant.

>universal truths
What universal truth? That we should fake that we believe bullshit? Might want to look at what the Buybull says about lying.

>>129419227
Violent Low IQ inbreds are a problem we have to deal with. I wouldn't consider Islam a noble lie. It's far too destructive. It's certainly as bad as some atheist regimes.

File: wbc_opt.jpg (43KB, 400x266px) Image search: [Google]

43KB, 400x266px

>>129420004
Don't fall for the atheism like meme. Repent for your sins or burn in hell faggot

>>129419850

>When you are a theist and you literally create a group to spread the 'good news' of your newest cult figure.

>>129419767
Agnostic-Atheism isn't Gnostic-Atheism, that's a pretty big divide. Not a "no true scotsman". People will always be idiots, we shouldn't encourage it.

>>129420004
ain't stopping skippy or the funny panda boys from their little pizza parties

>>129419524
it is unlike anything else when you hear the voice of God speak from the crevasses of your mind. it is irrevocably true and undeniable. occasionally upon the subjects of the grand scheme of things if that is what your heart deeply desires (though you will rarely enjoy such revelation), but constantly upon the subjects of your daily life and behavior (which you will typically not enjoy either)

>>129410003
>lol epic response XDDDDDDD
is this the bant that's gonna make me stop practicing my religion?

>>129419971

I do not understand what you mean.

>>129419850
We actually have good objective evidence for the Big Bang Theory, we can see shit moving away from a central point.

>>129419578
Plato was a hack. Atheism is probably his fault.

>>129420226
do you believe that no gods exist?

File: lageradam.jpg (49KB, 600x277px) Image search: [Google]

49KB, 600x277px

>>129414743
>morality is empirical

OK, Sam Harris. harm reduction and morality are not the same thing. the true version "Christian" Morality taught by Christ requires self-sacrifice. to prefer others, is a common translation. how does the less harm model account for this?

Not that you quoted Harris, but the argument is along the same vein. From this point of view, the moral good is defined by "that which does the least amount of needless harm". This rests on the assumption that there could at least possibly be either utopia or complete hell in the universe, harris would argue for instance that a place of indescribable torment is objectively worse than the alternative. i find this unrealistic because reality seems to be more along the lines of a zero-sum game, we have to deal with reality rather than creating "realms" in our minds and basing our actions in the real world on them. Marx also made this mistake, i believe, trying to apply the rules of the Matrix (the world of his imagination) to the real world. it seems as though where one person experiences bliss, another experiences some kind of torment, somewhere down the line. for every moment of free time or money a person earns, this is inevitably built on the backs of others, in one way or another. this fact is neither moral nor immoral and i dont believe most people do this on purpose. on earth at least, i believe in zero-sum.

Christian morality or religious morality in general is built upon self-sacrifice, not harm reduction. i dont believe the harm reduction model is realistic in the slightest because it is dreamed up out of thin air and built upon a hypothetical reality. A perfect Christian acting morally would push someone out of the way of a moving truck, getting hit themselves. The harm reduction model doesnt account for this balance, that one must die for another to live.

>>129420193

I have no idea what you said but sure!

>>129410261
>listening to an historical illiterate

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4pPLwAL_Qo

>>129420222

It was not even to you but yes.

>>129417163
This is objectively false. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Ages_(historiography)
>The historian of science Edward Grant writes that "If revolutionary rational thoughts were expressed [in the 18th century], they were made possible because of the long medieval tradition that established the use of reason as one of the most important of human activities"

>>129417188
Sounds like they didn't drop the Christianity part then.

>>129419971
One shouldn't believe things with no good objective evidence. I do lack belief that there's absolutely no deity. That's (Agnostic-)Atheism.

File: maxresdefault (1).jpg (286KB, 1536x1021px) Image search: [Google]

286KB, 1536x1021px

>>129420422
Your cuck self defeating ideology is stupid. Your beliefs have no purpose. God hates you faggot kike.

>>129420055
It's a noble lie to the idiots and we should laud idiots and their beliefs, right?

Also, for the millionth time Agnostic-Atheism !=Gnostic-Atheism ... and just because one is an Atheist doesn't mean they're a Commie.

>>129420599
Just means they are a faggot. Burn in hell God hates you leaf

>>129420208
Allahu Ackbar.

>>129420422
>objective evidence

Evidence has to be interpreted.

>>129409579
I don't give a shit about religion but you are all a bunch of unconscientious nihilists that have done more harm than good.
> Anti-theist
Gtfo an actually apply yourself to something ethical.

>>129420349

I find Christian 'morality' to be immoral. Any deity who created a hell would have to be placed inside of it to protect them from the crimes against humanity they were about to commit.

I do agree with Sam Harris and others that ethics and morality deal with the well being of social interactive beings. I do understand why the real physical world is not enough for you. Why do you do need to create fictional characters to reflect on being compassionate to others?

You are trying to base this off a crucifixion of Jesus and a resurrection of which there is no evidence for. The teaching of self sacrifice from a blood cult only seems sane because it has been watered down over the years. We are much better off discovering how to make a better moral society.

File: 635745993491170809-126320212_Paul-Walker-Westboro-Baptist-Church-Funeral.imgopt1000x70.jpg (33KB, 500x333px) Image search: [Google]

33KB, 500x333px

>>129420770
Mourn for your sins or die faggot. I'd hates you.

>>129420599
The noble lie was Plato's idea for explaining social stratification and was for the benefit of social order in his republic. It was not noble FOR its targets, but for the greater society. You saying Islam is a noble lie for Muslims is a shit use of the phrase which tells me you have no clue wtf you're referencing. Islam is demonstrably bad for society and for half of the people following it (women).

>>129420180
We don't need to encourage it, but we need to account for it. Rejecting religion is an utter failure to account for humans being idiots.

Also this thread takes a gnostic atheist position in that it is an attempt to talk people out of their gods.

My position is suitable for agnostic atheists and true materialists who aren't afraid of history or human nature.

>>129420349
It's built upon going to heaven (well-being) and not hell (not good well-being), not self-sacrifice. Killing others is cool as long as the voices in your head say so. A perfect Christian would push the person into the truck if they thought the voice in their head said so (see Abraham/Isaac, etc., etc., etc.)

>>129420685
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSMWQb5Huhg

>>129420374

Posting YouTube videos is the equivalent of saying 'I want to argue but they do it better for me.'

>>129419432
>We are not sure if logic and mathematics stem from human creativity or are a product/discovery of the Universe its self.
If you're not sure it means that you're agnostic. I'm not claiming you hav said otherwise, since I haven't bothered to read the whole thread.

And no we can't indeed approach such questions by means of mere logic and rationality, as I have pointed out. But you have to understand that living as we do today, without being immersed in religion our whole lives, is an anomaly. Both historically and prehistorically speaking. Religious tradition has allowed man to see beyond ourselves metaphysically. Rationalistic science has merely trapped us to lower forms.

>>129420419

Sounds like you do not understand what a deist means.

>>129420913
Exactly God hates you fag burn in hell or repent.

File: 33578673.jpg (19KB, 400x400px) Image search: [Google]

19KB, 400x400px

>>129420277
>good objective evidence
>objective
>cant see the edges of the universe to prove universal expansion, therefore no proof for contraction
yea no, that's not what we call proof
>>129420178
>when your an atheist and your dick is so small you have to shitpost in a Taiwanese testicle tying forum to compensate

>>129420419
>>>129417163 (You)
>This is objectively false. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Ages_(historiography)
>>The historian of science Edward Grant writes that "If revolutionary rational thoughts were expressed [in the 18th century], they were made possible because of the long medieval tradition that established the use of reason as one of the most important of human activities"

Torturing blasphemers is good because it helps them avoid the torment of eternal torture.

>>129409579
Only kikes, trannies and niggers believe in (((evolution)))

File: 1788768778.jpg (43KB, 600x600px) Image search: [Google]

43KB, 600x600px

>>129409579
I'm an atheist but I don't judge what people believe in.Fuck Islam though, that shit is for inbred monkeys.

>>129420977
Don't correct him, he's having fun virtue signalling, that's technically an atheist religious practice.

>>129420919
Actually, it's not. It's me saying you're an illiterate and it was for everyone else's benefit.

>>129421060
nigger

>>129414743
Accepting this proposal would lead to promoting useful religions. We've seen explicitly atheist society, and lots of people die.

>>129421107
t.muhammed

>>129420958

Religious practice like other superstitious beliefs is a simple correlation fallacy. You cheated on your wife, lighting strikes your house and you believe Zeus judged you for it. Technology and mass information seem to be unnatural and yes they seem to help us get over our problem of false positives.

File: a999wbcfunerals_2050081722-42918.jpg (33KB, 200x154px)

33KB, 200x154px

>>129421060
Repent or die faggot. God hates you so you better start caring what people believe. You think you are progressive because your atheist. You are just a faggot who God hates.

>>129420890
Christianity is bad for society (see Dark Ages). Modernity is because we moved away from Christianity.

>>129421095

Okay, if that is the case than I will just avoid it.

>>129421241
>Modernity is because we moved away from Christianity.

Learn how to structure sentences, fool. I'm not taking history lessons from illiterate fucks.

>>129421107
t. faroud

>>129421205
still here nigger kike? Fuck off while you can

>>129421241
God hates you

File: 187687687.jpg (68KB, 720x720px) Image search: [Google]

68KB, 720x720px

>>129421344
What are you gonna do bitch?

>>129421276
That's what cowards ruled by cognitive dissonance commonly do.

>>129421158

And we have seen explicitly theist societies where lots of people die. That is why religious neutral secular countries are so awesome.

>>129421411
God will let you burn in hell. God hates you fag

>>129421014
What the fuck does universal expansion have to do with anything?

>>129421420

I do think you understand what cognitive dissonance means.

>>129421411
this is my final warning

>>129421216
it also gives jugheads like you a platform
what a wonderful invention

>>129421491
Indeed, I do.

My work here is done. You are a total embarrassment.

File: 17867687876.jpg (15KB, 342x342px) Image search: [Google]

15KB, 342x342px

>>129421516
Yeah, i'm really scared.

>>129421527

And you can make vague insults for the same reason. Is life not amazing or what?

>>129421060
Love that Islam triggers nu-male female right activists.

>Just act like you believe bullshit
>long-term strategy.

>>129421593
You should be scared of eternal hellfire faggot. God hates you and your kin will burn along side you as you realize your mistakes for eternity. Repent pedophile Kike fag, God hates u

>>129421421
>religious neutral secular countries
funny seems to my like theyre being quickly replaced

>>129421572

>I made no arguments
>I added nothing
>My work here is done

ok

>>129421703
Larp harder.

File: 1496779783129.jpg (137KB, 1010x948px) Image search: [Google]

137KB, 1010x948px

>>129421516
chill out queer

>>129418736
I believe the consequences of atheism are bad. Therefore I act religious. From an existential perspective I am religious despite my atheism.

>>129421642
Well yeah, but they also kinda want to kill everyone else in the process.

>>129420422
Either
1. there's a god, or
2. there's no god
Those are the only possibilities, there's no third option. If you don't believe one of them you can't be right.

Atheists:
1. lack belief there's a god, and
2. lack belief there's no god
therefore they can't possibly be right about god and should be ignored.

>>129421788
What consequences are those?
How is acting dishonestly a good strategy?

>>129421716

They are being replaced with political partisan. I know you want to say your rival Islam is winning but we as non-theists have to wage that war. You guys are just watered down or mirror version of Muslims and Jews.

File: 1496821501552.png (98KB, 375x375px) Image search: [Google]

98KB, 375x375px

>>129421467
>What the fuck does universal expansion have to do with anything?
Are you seriously this stupid?
>huurrrr duuurrrr what is critical mass from universal contraction resulting in the big braaaaaaaaapppp.
Have you ever read a book on this theory in your short NEET life? What an Ultrafag.

File: WestboroBaptist4-1.png (262KB, 434x294px) Image search: [Google]

262KB, 434x294px

>>129421741
God will punish you for denying the word. I have told you the truth a out still deny. God hates you faggot kike pedophile who murdered Jesus. Fag enabler

>>129410261
Holy fuck you're stupid.

>>129410003
This is embarrassing.

Your IQ is in the double digits.

>>129421833
I reserve saying absolutely there's a God or that there's absolutely no God, because there's no good objective evidence for either. The God(s) that are usually proposed I don't believe in because they're contradictory and I can name good reasons why they don't exist. You shouldn't believe things absolutely (either way) without good objective evidence.

File: 1492373198107.png (415KB, 800x800px) Image search: [Google]

415KB, 800x800px

>Secularism rises in the West
>The West turns into a shithole
>Whites have increasingly lower birth rates
Atheism is so based!

>>129414555

I would hit it like a sledge hammer.

File: ronald-reagan-taliban-800x452.jpg (91KB, 800x452px) Image search: [Google]

91KB, 800x452px

>>129421823
>invade their countries for oil
>support their violent insurgencies and dodgy dictators for decades
>wtf dindu nuffin wrong why do they want to kill us
Nu-males are all emotions and no logic.

File: 1487815788123.png (306KB, 983x616px)

306KB, 983x616px

>>129421915
>when westboro failed but it's okay because you can post your retarded bullshit on 4chan and persuade retards into joining your cult

>>129422096

If my intelligence quotient was in double digits we would not be holding a conversation on the internet.

>>129421915
There's no freewill with an all-knowing God that knew your end-fate BEFORE he created you (when he could have created you differently or not at all). He knew what your end-fate would be BEFORE he created you and then created you that way.

Also, God supposedly wants you to know him, but puts out good objective evidence against him.

Larp harder.

>>129422155
Defeatest ideology. So dumb you are the definition of a cuck who has no real belief system. God hates you fag repent or burn

File: 1463983619910.jpg (82KB, 900x1344px) Image search: [Google]

82KB, 900x1344px

>>129420838
it's just stories though, and lessons learned written down on paper. i dont really think the bible should be read as it is in churches etc. because ministers will tell people that this is Gods command, because he said so to Jacob or Abraham, so hes saying it to you. Its always twisted and used against the stupid masses. obviously the ancient world was a place of extremes, and i dont think they were as squemish as we are now in terms of their stories. to anyone serious about theology, they almost all agree that it is allegory. the current state of the church probably needs to be dismantled, though.

scripture works like this, admittedly by the people who wrote it:

Once there was a race between a Tortoise and a Hare. The Tortoise plodded along, then the Hare was so far ahead that he laid down to rest. Eventually, the Tortoise overtook the Hare and finished first.

Allegorical reading: "OK, so if you persist even when the odds are stacked against you, the complacency of your opposition can sometimes pay off"

Fedoralord reading: WTF look at these fucking idiots. Why would a Hare and a Tortoise even race???!!! How did they even talk to communicate the terms of the race? In fact, biological studies have shown that Tortoise lack the mandible dexterity to perform such an action... XD

Christianity/islam etc is like a big Harry Potter convention run out of control. a group of people all using the same stories and characters to illustrate things in their own life.

>Why do you do need to create fictional characters to reflect on being compassionate to others?

because that's what everybody does. it is how we learn and empathize.

as for whether or not the real world is enough for me, nope, it isnt. my soul screams for JUSTICE FOR SETH RICH and i wont feel embarrassed about that. Seeking the kingdom of God is a worthwhile thing to do even if it isnt actually a real thing.

>>129420977
American cultural values are Christian - if your heritage is from a Christian nation, then it's still 100% in you.

>Our founding fathers were deists
Romans 2: 25-27
Circumcision has value if you observe the [Religious] Law, but if you break the [Religious] Law, your circumcision has become uncircumcision. If a man who is not circumcised keeps the requirements of the [Religious] Law, will not his uncircumcision be regarded as circumcision? The one who is physically uncircumcised yet keeps the [Religious] Law will condemn you who, even though you have the written code and circumcision, are a lawbreaker.

Mark 12:13-17
Later, they sent some of the Pharisees and Herodians to catch Jesus in His words. “Teacher,” they said, “we know that You are honest and are swayed by no one. Indeed, You are impartial and teach the way of God in accordance with the truth. Now then, is it lawful to pay taxes to Caesar or not? Should we pay them or not?”

But Jesus saw through their hypocrisy and said, “Why are you testing Me? Bring Me a denarius to inspect.” So they brought it, and He asked them, “Whose likeness is this? And whose inscription?”
“Caesar’s,” they answered.
Then Jesus told them, “Give to Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s.”

>>129422225
God will let you burn faggot. God literally hates you

File: 976859469549.jpg (20KB, 306x306px)

20KB, 306x306px

>>129422214
Yeah, because they totally wouldn't kill you if they had the chance.

>>129421421
The ones that take all their "secular" morals from decent religions?

American secular morals are Quaker morals.

>>129422350
People actually believed it. You have a very post-modern "It was all just a myth all along" interpretation that contradicts history and reality.

>>129420004
The point is we don't live in a material world, we live in a subjective world made by a human mind (or something). It's not really debatable it's pretty much the only thing we can be sure of, I think therefore I am. The materialistic worldview fails to describe or predict most of our experiences in daily life.

>No person can be 'sacrificed' for another persons wrong doings.
Why do atheists even think they have any business criticizing concepts they have not spent any time researching? It's always just the same soundbite memes. There is over 2000 years of literature on the meaning of sacrifice and how it relates to sin if you're actually interested.

>>129422350

At this point you are so metaphorical that we are making Disney movies. Yes, the heroes journey and mythological stories are powerful tools humans have for teaching and expressing ideas. The problem comes when you actually believe the stories are real.

>>129422465
Animals have morality, what religion did they get theirs from?

>>129422465

Religions pick their morality from our secular system. Just like religion tried to co-opt the idea of marriage even though Rome had it way before them.

File: 722-2b.jpg (113KB, 385x440px) Image search: [Google]

113KB, 385x440px

>>129422350
God hates you nu-male pedophile Kike faggot

>>129421898
antifa is the perfect example of atheists waging war. bunch of spoiled limp-wristed brats trying to be strong. you will be wiped away with a breath of force from an ancient tradition. for it was christians who transcended the ways of the world with its endless brutality, establishing their faith through love, and by this its adherents became the giants or the earth. now you wish to take on the religion of satans brutality without the force of love that has sustained us for thousands of years? id laugh if the ensuing slaughter werent so terrifying

>>129422538
1+1=2. I can know that. As far as we can best tell (not 100%) we live in an objective world that we subjectively experience. If it was all subjective, then why even bother posting, you're just talking to yourself.

File: s.gif (2MB, 383x576px)

2MB, 383x576px

atheist here

>>129422449
Not if I don't invade their countries and fuck their shit up, retard.

>>129422538


I reject your premise since we do live in the material world. Including your head which is made of matter. In fact we have no evidence of conscious life outside a physical brain in a highly evolved multi celled organism.

>>129422688
>christians who transcended the ways of the world with its endless brutality, establishing their faith through love

LOL, no.

File: Come+on+this+guy+is+obviously+at+some+sort+of+_3b79953a2e47eddc2de459c3d3d52e5d.jpg (153KB, 720x960px) Image search: [Google]

153KB, 720x960px

>>129422855
You go larping athiest pedophile Kike faggot enabler

>>129422827
Why are they invading the philippines then?

>>129420035
>People (pre-&historic) who by and large lived harsh lives, had to be both mentally and physically fit to even survive (often even that wasn't enough), ate a shitty diet, survived in conditions that would make any modern cuck kys real quick.
But I'm sure you're better in every way. Our ancestors ain't got shit on this generation of lazy, fat, euphoric, morally retarded slobs.

Also there's no people without the religious impulse. If you dare to claim otherwise go ahead and cite a civilization that was atheistic. Modern ones won't do since people living in them are busy trying to drown their lack of religious substance in ideology and scientism.
>Rape is a human universal and constant.
Yes, indeed the manifestations of evil are human universals. This is taught btw in all authentic religious traditions. Nowadays one might miss such teachings though, since we lack any proper moral orientation, unlike our savage, illiterate, smelly ancestors, right?
You getting the point?
>What universal truth
Unchanging truth if you will

>>129422688

Christianity is a new age fad. You guys are 2,000 out of the 200,000 years our species has world the earth or 1% of humanity's life span.

I would like you start acting like an adult and stop blaming your problems on a simple carrot stick method.

People know it's bullshit, they're trying to convince people to larp like they believe it and act like that's good and a long-term strategy.

>>129421881
Replacement by less "secular" societies. Vascilating between nihilism and totalitarianism. Increased depression. Loss of efficient transmission of norms. Utopian idiocy. Etc.

Is deception a good strategy? Until people are rational (never), it's going to be part of anything we do. Read Kahneman and Tversky. Then read Peterson's work. And after that, put away childish things like rationalism.

>>129420913
you know about the different testaments of the bible? Christianity relates specifically to his teachings rather than abrahamic writings. these are only included for context. regardless of that, i think you should rethink what you think are the ideal ethics for a christian, because it specifically states that it is exactly about self sacrifice. if you do not love God, how would you get into heaven? you think you could outsmart God? new testament authors have written about this dilemma extensively. this is where the expression "seek gods face" comes from, because one should seek the face of god and not his hand, or what he can provide for you.

>>129422982
>indeed the manifestations of evil are human universals.

Rape is good if God commands it. Genocide was good if he commanded it. Killing your innocent son was good if he commanded it. Taking the young virgin girls for yourself was good if he commanded it.

File: 2A019E5500000578-3140525-image-a-8_1435339708088.jpg (103KB, 634x421px) Image search: [Google]

103KB, 634x421px

>>129422958
>westerners only care about Asia now
Muslims been persecuted there for decades your news never covered it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malisbong_massacre

DUMB UNEDUCATED YANK

>>129423206
Peterson's an idiot who got destroyed by Sam Harris. Larp harder.

>>129421216
Religious practice is btw the only thing that keeps societies together. Anchoring a culture in monolithic, universal truth prevents people from spazzing out with materialistic relativism.
If you disagree, please cite a historical civilization that has existed without religion.
There is no problem with technology, there is however much amiss with morality today.

>>129422855
certainly you dont think christians endure the constant abuse and smearing of this secular society which we built for them out of weakness?
for we do not feel shame by this onslaught, we feel pity. for before our open eyes we watch the destruction of our societies, and are amazed that you would consider this destruction progress

File: westboro-god-hates-jews1-300x234.jpg (25KB, 300x234px) Image search: [Google]

25KB, 300x234px

>>129423343
You will bring in hell faggot. Just wait and you will truly regret denying Christ. He gave you life and you spat in his face. God hates you

>>129419432
maths and logic are obviously human creations.

10 fingers to count on
numbers called digits
fingers called digits
10 numbers make up mathematical language
coincidence?

our entire mathematical system is based on an arbitrary starting point. there is no reason to that other systems cant also be used. i bet they can. besides, its hard to even categorize what mathematics is, because it's a form of measurement, its not actually a "thing". we just use it to measure shit, which makes it more of an activity. its not an invention, its a method.

>>129422155
Okay but since atheists are guaranteed not to be right it's pointless to listen to them, except when they admit they don't know anything it proves their methodology is useless.
Theists at least have a chance of being right.

>>129423496
>a historical civilization that has existed without religion.

All the modern ones that we like.

>>129423589
The Enlightenment dragged Christianity out of the Dark Ages. Christianity was like ISIS before the Enlightenment.

File: 786876876.jpg (93KB, 414x508px) Image search: [Google]

93KB, 414x508px

>>129423331
What the fuck are you talking about?I have always cared about Asia, maybe not china.And I would think they would have a good reason to be killing muslims.But hey, when they start invading you, don't come crying to us because their goal is to spread islam everywhere you naive troglodyte.

>>129422627
They have evolved social behaviors and reactions to violations of such. Animals also display capacity for supernatural thinking.

Read Conrade Lawrence for more on that.

Which is exactly my point. Religion is an evolved capacity, just like morals. We will never get away from it.

Atheism is a failure to pick up the burden of society.

>>129423248
The stories teach lessons you seem to have missed.
As I've said in this thread before, stories were the best available technology to preserve knowledge.
I take your dodging every other point I made as admission of defeat.

>>129423617
How are (Agnostic-)Atheists guaranteed not to be right? Reserving believing something when there's no good objective evidence doesn't mean that one can't be convinced with good objective evidence.

File: Myles's True Self.jpg (358KB, 1280x1024px)

358KB, 1280x1024px

BIGGEST RELIGION REDPILL ------

LUCIFER IS A MOST HOLY GOD ABIDING SHAPESHIFTING ARCHANGEL.

Listen up Goys, the ultimate religious redpill is Lucifer (and by extention God) become WHATEVER FORM YOU THINK HIM TO BE.

Lucifer is the archangel who walks upon the earth guised as a man. He is gods first beloved child in his image before Jesus.

ONLY KIKES KNOW THIS, THIS NEEDS TO BE MAINSTREAM KNOWLEDGE. THEY HIDE BEHIND AN EVIL FRONT TO WITHHOLD THE TRUTH AND PROJECT EVIL INTO YOUR INNOCENT MINDS!!!!!!

ARCHANGEL LUCIFER IS NOT SATAN IF YOU SO CHOOSE GOYIM.

>>129423617
If you say there's ABSOLUTELY an even number of blades of grass on your lawn, I would ask why you believe that. I would reserve believing that. The same way I would reserve believing there was ABSOLUTELY an odd number of blades of grass on your lawn.

>>129422663
It's more complicated than that. Rome wasn't secular. Our secular systems derive from religious systems derived from secular systems...ad infinitum.

>>129423496

Religious practices can be part of a society but there is no evidence that they have ever 'kept it together.' Normally they end up taring countries apart from schism and infighting which is as human as yours to make false positive.

>>129423817
So the universe just appeared out if nowhere? God gave you life and you spat in his face! How dare you. No respect for what gave you the mouth and hands to type such retarded faggotry

>>129423615

We are creating a language in which we can make sense of quantity.

>>129423808
Animals do have a capacity to believe bullshit, that's correct (pigeons doing a little dance everytime to get food, etc.). Just because something is "natural" or "evolved" doesn't mean it's good. Rape is "natural". We will never get away from it.

>>129423628
Are you maybe saying we don't live in advanced stages of cultural decay? Us both being on pol tells me otherwise.
It's as if this decay has coincided with the decline of religion, looking at the last few centuries.

>>129423989

As I said before, religion is just normal superstition. If you think knocking on wood will save you from being shot it is the same as thinking Jesus will save you from getting shot.

>>129423996
The entire concept of time came from the Big Bang. The Singularity was before this (before our entire concept of time, "laws", etc.).

File: 1496959334291.jpg (56KB, 680x1020px)

56KB, 680x1020px

>>129422982
This guy gets it. The leaf doesn't get it.

>>129423995


>>129423815
>>129424169

>>129424169
We're probably in the best time to be alive (like it or not) (minus the Abrahamic religion that wasn't exposed to the Enlightenment for centuries fighting Modernity).

>>129421021
American cultural values are Christian.
>Western cultural values are largely from the Enlightenment.
i.e. Christian thinkers https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christians_in_science_and_technology
>Torturing blasphemers is good because it helps them avoid the torment of eternal torture.
This is not even a tangent. I get the feeling that you don't really know what you're trying to argue anymore.

>>129423343
Sam was too autistic to have a decent discussion. Debating the literal truth of religion in no way disproved its utility

>>129422982
What about slavery? It took Christians until the 1700-1800s to start figuring that one out. What human universals? Whatever God says is good is supposedly good.