When did you realize taxation is theft, /pol/?

>>127920199
How is it theft if you agree to the wage?

>>127920199
When I realized that my tax dollars were going to pay for things for illegal aliens that I don't have myself. Like healthcare.

After listening to smart guys like Peter Schiff, Mike Maloney, Jim Rickards and others. Income taxes should not exist at all, instead there should be a single flat consumption based tax (like VAT here in the UK) - that would be more than enough to cover the costs of a government more limited in scope.

>>127920199
When I realized that stealing is taking a thing somebody else owns or has earned under threat of violent coercion. The only essential difference between the government and a mugger is one of scale and complexity, the government steals from you on multiple levels, constantly, and is accepted as an institution. The mugger steals whatever you've got on you, once, and is not accepted by society.

Any transaction in which an individual or institution takes resources from a second individual or institution against their will or regardless of their will, and uses coercive behavior or violence to force the other's submission or agreement is theft.

>>127920199
You willingly consent to living in a society where taxes exist.

>>127920199
when i was 16 and got my first paycheck from my first job at subway

>>127921387
I gave no such consent.

>>127921604
Then leave.

>>127921808
This, I have no inherent objection to taxation as long as an actual contract is signed and agreed to, and so long as the party extracting the taxes actually provides the services it promises. In my state the roads are fucking garbage, we get polluted water alerts pretty often, the politicians are corrupt scumbags, the mail is sluggish as all hell, etc, etc, etc.

It's like a landlord constantly hiking up your rent but he never fixes anything and also consorts with criminals on the side. The government doesn't currently deserve the rate of tax money it gets because it doesn't come even close to providing adequate or acceptable service.

When a Libertarian pointed out what would happen if people stopped paying their taxes or if business' resisted. It was pretty easy logic to follow.

File: DBBwNmSU0AELRad.jpg (42KB, 1016x920px) Image search: [Google]

42KB, 1016x920px

>>127922199
Not an argument faggot

>>127920369
this guy thinks employers tax their employees.

get a load of this idiot everyone.

>>127920199
already did.
when do yu realize we live in a ancap society already?
The elite/rich have their MAFIA which is named "governament" and evry governament is the same....i wonder why.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYIC0eZYEtI

>>127922720
You are willingly a part of a society where the law includes paying taxes. If you refuse to follow our laws, then fucking leave. It's as simple as that.

>>127920199
you can always leave society if you feel like you're getting a rough deal. try your luck elsewhere.

>>127923389
Slaves aren't allowed to leave.

>>127923389
The US was at the height of its prosperity when there was no income tax at all (i.e. the decades before 1913). Higher taxes have destroyed the US economy, along with a fiat currency system and a central bank with far too much power.

File: 1495423464548.gif (2MB, 500x225px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 500x225px

>>127923892
>he doesn't know about plane tickets

>>127923892
I remember thinking like this when I was about 15 and i'd just watched zeitgeist.
you'll grow out of it. stop smoking pot to speed it up.

File: Ancap.png (313KB, 1000x1000px) Image search: [Google]

313KB, 1000x1000px

>>127920199
Because providing revenue for your own country to make hospitals, roads bring security and electricity is totally theft

>>127920199
When will you realize freedom isn't free?

ITT: Trumpcucks and Nazi faggots who worship a dead ideology from 80 years ago get butthurt by the only rational, logical ideology

File: 1495737221884.jpg (25KB, 641x530px) Image search: [Google]

25KB, 641x530px

>>127924085
> he doesn't know that all governments on earth steal from people through taxes

File: 1496207334805.jpg (68KB, 624x480px) Image search: [Google]

68KB, 624x480px

>>127924294
>corporate cock sucker mad that not everyone wants sex shops that also carry heroin on every corner

File: 1495617924140.jpg (40KB, 500x431px) Image search: [Google]

40KB, 500x431px

>>127924215
I could agree with you but then we'd both be wrong.

File: 1494303769215.gif (415KB, 480x238px) Image search: [Google]

415KB, 480x238px

>>127924509
>he doesn't know about somalia

>>127924609
>butthurt nazi faggot mad that his ideology will never ever make a comeback
Follow your leader and crawl into a bunker and shoot yourself in the back of the throat.

File: DAHLf9dUMAAVYu_.jpg (38KB, 675x562px) Image search: [Google]

38KB, 675x562px

>>127924763
> he doesn't know I hate niggers

>>127920199
The government needs our money to do their job. People bitch aboutmoney going to national defense. Well, that's part of the fed's limited powers. The government exists to protect the citizenry, not give wymen free healthcare.

>>127924896
but you're American.. I-I don't even?

>>127920199
>haven't worked in while bc college and job market
>finally get a job
>get my first check, physical because direct deposit takes a bit
>actually get to see how much the government takes and for what
Withholding taxes should be illegal.

File: 1494953515571.jpg (107KB, 615x623px) Image search: [Google]

107KB, 615x623px

>>127924807
Hahaha oh snookums libertarianism is dead too which you would realize if you ever read industrial society and its future. You see as society increase in population and complexity the government has to increase its apparatus of control or it risks exposing itself to a revolution and being out competed by foriegn governments you can no more decrease the government's size than you can stop the sun from setting stay mad faggot :^)

When did you realize anarchism never works (even with a very thin layer of capitalism) and a unregated market leads to whore houses, drug sellers and mass obesity

>>127925750
>People can't be trusted with freedom
>People can be trusted with extreme power over the lives of others

>>127920199
2008. The rise of libertarianism around Ron Paul's campaign first exposed me to these truths. I'd never really thought about it before.

You can say whatever the fuck you like to justify it (and you'd be wrong), but if you claim that it's not theft you are in complete denial.

>>127925709
Why are you still talking? Make like Hitler and put the gun in your mouth.

>>127920199
it's constitutional and legal theft

File: 1491547830957.gif (998KB, 410x258px) Image search: [Google]

998KB, 410x258px

>>127920199
Military cannot be privatized because of conflict of interests.
Private military owned by Jew A and roads owned by Jew B
Jew B has interests in seperate military company owned by Jew C, and denies access by Jew A on Jew b's roads, thus denying service to Clients of Jew A.

Privatizing everything would be a logistical Jumble fuck, and would ultimately, create States again. States are Organic.

INB4 "States are not organic because they are enforced with a monopoly of force"

All forms of property are enforced with a monopoly of force. Dont blame your failure as a business owner or entrepeneur on taxes. Whether those taxes be TAXES or RENT or TOLLS you be paying them. Stop bitching

>>127920199
When did you realize taxation is rent?

File: 18740453_725031751013927_8981298158761639084_n.jpg (9KB, 333x333px) Image search: [Google]

9KB, 333x333px

>>127926047
> lolberg can't defend his position and instead gets butt mad over teh interwebz
Shocking

>>127925940
The superior men can just like how in a animal pack the strongest and the best lead. Your father lead you and didn't trust six year old you.

Anarchism is not compatible with human civilisation just like communism is not

>>127925750
> people are degenerate
> I know lets give people the power to control the lives of others, that will stop degeneracy!

No socialism is degenerate, freedom breeds hard men, a strong community & good morals.....and as if the last 30 years people have become more free I mean come on, we've slowly become less free it's just that you can't stop people expressing certain things that are incentivized by the current systems like the welfare state.

>>127926223
^this

>>127922749
Do you like roads leaf? Or perhaps running water?

>>127920199
When I never use our (((free))) healthcare, but the smoking whale welfare cunt down the street is in there everyday. I pay for her smokes, food, rent, and healthcare.

ahahhaahahahahaha kill me pls

>>127920199
nigger opinion

>>127926223
> implying a ficticious entity can claim legitimate ownership over something
> implying a ficticious entity can even claim ownership at all
> implying you know anything about the concept of ownership

>>127920199
I stopped caring. Just respond to the incentives.

Taxation is just a way for the elite to keep you off the ladder and cement their position of wealth.

>>127920199
When they want more money off me than I make & offer nothing in return.

>>127926323
Power corrupts even the most superior of men. And then they start leading in the wrong direction.

Theft is taxation.

>>127926477
>implying the state is ficticious
>implying Hamlet is not literally Denmark

>>127926342
People need a guiding hand. Without your father and just a single mother you would become a even bigger faggot. Freedom breeds fat degernate fast food eaters who survive off selling drugs and smokes to children

>>127926630
And freedom corrupts more and on a more moral basis

>>127926717
> only individuals exist
> a ficticious entity called government can act
> actually only the agents of government can act no matter what they call themselves they are individuals
> none of these individuals actually claim individual ownership over anything
> therefore the ownership claim by the ficticious entity is illegitimate

States making corporations seperate entities to protect individuals is also total fucking bull shit.

File: For_a_New_Liberty_(first_edition).jpg (20KB, 200x295px) Image search: [Google]

20KB, 200x295px

>>127920199
After digesting all of Rothbard's reading, of course
and Locke
>Rothbard for a New Liberty (Libertarian Manifesto)
https://mega.nz/fm/ZjIlRR5Z
download away until it expires /pol/-lacks

File: ^2C9474DBDEB6CDA4CC562DD53732AFE97BDF2D3BD10829B9F4^pimgpsh_fullsize_distr.jpg (84KB, 720x960px) Image search: [Google]

84KB, 720x960px

>>127920199
When did you realize that taking anything is theft since nothing belongs to you? Your consciousness even steals the future.

>>127926985
You seem to be implying freedom has a lack of leaders, a lack of guides, a lack of role models, a lack of incentives & a lack of structure. Fat NEETs exist because they can sit in share housing on centrelink & stuff their faces without having to work to survive, you know damn well Libertarian alternatives to welfare are far better targetted than universal welfare.

>>127920199
If taxes are theft, property is theft.
No i dont mean your toothbrush, anon. Property, buildings, capital, factories, businesses.

>>127927358
> No i dont mean your toothbrush, anon. Property, buildings, capital, factories, businesses.
Arbitrary distinction is arbitrary

> property is theft.
Can't have theft without property, doesn't work that way. You could argue property shouldn't exist but not that private property is stealing from those that lack ownership, it's an oxymoron and you know it.

>>127927215
(((Rothbrand)))
(((Ayn rand)))

These conservative fascists are taking away my rights to homosexuality, drugs,and moral decay. Quick we need more freedom

>>127927167
That's incorrect.

File: 1494069168534.jpg (53KB, 599x510px) Image search: [Google]

53KB, 599x510px

Profit in wage-labour and tsxation are both theft. The exact same principle applies in both cases. But because it's the market doing it suddenly it's okay in your eyes.

>>127922199
To where? The moon? The toxic virus that is the nation-state has spread to every corner on earth except Antarctica, and even that little bit of inhospitable Terra nulius is guarded by men with guns who will shoot you if you try and establish a life there free of government.

File: 62d269b104f109a86669bbe7761ee607.jpg (55KB, 660x495px) Image search: [Google]

55KB, 660x495px

>>127927529
>laughs out loud at you
bruh if you're still stuck on the jew meme you must have stains in your underpants
use the thing between your ears sometimes and make your own opinions

>>127924763
Somalia is officially communist, they just don't have enough men with guns to enforce the ideology like other nation-states.

File: himagi.jpg (34KB, 350x300px) Image search: [Google]

34KB, 350x300px

>>127927985
t. t_d

>>127927357
Libertarian welfare judges people on just how much cash you make. It has nothing to do with how you are as a person.

And these "natural" leaders are simply the most greedey selfish ones not the best most moral ones.

>>127927529
That's the one suspicious thing about libertarianism. I think they're there as gatekeepers to misguide you from the real truths of anarchy.

>>127927184
That's why the abomination known as liberal democracy is foolishness. It creates a machine in place of a man. God save the King.

>>127927985
The biggest pushes and majority of people in ancap are Jewish

Simply a coincidence ignore this point goys

>>127925022
Unlike your country we actually have more than 5 square miles of habitable land scrunched up against the coast. The blacks live in the cities and the whites live miles away in he suburbs and rural areas.

>>127928178
>truths of anarchy
No such thing. Anarchy isn't even real bro. It literally cannot exist.

>>127928467
suburbs are part of the cities, I don't get why people lump them in with rural areas

>>127928512
> it's impossible to live without the federal reserve and the government Jews run, goy. Stop being silly, goy.

>>127921387
"What were you doing in that back alley at night? You deserved it"

>>127928178
Anachy cannot exist it is incomparable with human nature

File: Capture3.jpg (32KB, 192x157px) Image search: [Google]

32KB, 192x157px

>>127928143
>>127928398
>too much of an asp-burger to be able to read books of contrarian opinions
>has to fall back on childish insults and words they saw other people use
wew lads, good thing you guys are on the right side of anglo

>>127922300
Based upon all of the stuff you said about your state, I'm guessing you live in Michigan.

Everyone and their four aces when they bring up roads to a libertarian.

Roads, schools, utilities, infrastructure, and even most social, and even social services could be (and already is) paid for through excise taxes which most libertarians will agree to.

We are mostly against income tax which pays for two things. 1. Federal/State debt 2. Pension programs for government employees. Essentially income that government employees promised themselves to be paid for by someone else.

>>127928727
That's exactly what I said. Being in favor of a nation state means you love Jews and fiat currency. First thing to happen under anarchy is everyine forms a government. Anarchy is a temporary condition at best and a logical impossibility at worst.

Taxes in some form are necessary for any government to exist. There are currently not enough taxes in the united states of america.

>>127928800
Don't worry if the most famous libertarians and ancaps in the modern era are Jewish we should all judge each other by how much Jew gold we have

#based freedom
#based freedom jews

File: 1477529233468.jpg (51KB, 352x583px) Image search: [Google]

51KB, 352x583px

>you will never own anything in this world

>>127929023
>First thing to happen under anarchy is everyine forms a government.
You meam community. People build strong communities in anarchy.

>>127928770
but really, what were you doing in that back alley?

>>127922199
He thinks its fucking 15th century where there are lands free of the government let alone an earth spanning empire called Amerifuckyou that will go full AFT raid on your little estate like Waco or if you live over seas they will just cuck your government into going full Kim Dot Com raid on your ass. There is nowhere to hide

>>127929304
Community and government are the same thing. You dislike modern beaurocratic liberalism. You have no real beef with government.

>>127928773
anachy breaky heart on the other hand
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=byQIPdHMpjc

File: ten-things-we-learned-about-gary-johnson-from-the-new-yorker-400x250.jpg (15KB, 400x250px) Image search: [Google]

15KB, 400x250px

>>127929083
you're not even trying, are you?
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_libertarians_in_the_United_States

>>127929587
>Community and government are the same thing
Hahahaha nigger what

>>127929498
It's almost like having a large state is natural for humans and libertarian country's are doomed to degernate and fail

Libertaism/ancap and communism are all incompatible with human civilisation

Taxation is your fee for the governments enforcement of your spooky private property laws

>>127929775
I said the most famous in the modern era
Ayn rand
Rothbrand
That other old Jew with the glasses
And Gary cuck libertarians

3 out of 4 jewish

File: 1491811190083.jpg (19KB, 480x358px) Image search: [Google]

19KB, 480x358px

>>127920199

>>127928398
>Jews concoct ideology of being an anti-social, selfish money-grubbing cunt
>National Socialism is their greatest threat

Gee, you don't say.

>>127929837
What's the difference?

File: mises_0.jpg (16KB, 443x361px) Image search: [Google]

16KB, 443x361px

>>127930151
>That other old Jew with the glasses
>that face when you know he meant mises

>>127920199
You not like emergency services and free helathcare... oh

>>127931068
National Socialism was the greatest threat of the Jews who own the Federal Reserve. Jews play all sides. Just because Jews advocate for it it doesn't mean it's bad. It just means you need to dive deeper than what the Jew in the front lines is saying.

>>127932880
>What's the difference between a voluntary grouping of humans advocating for their own group and a bunch of psychopaths addicted to robbing you blind and lying to you constantly?

>>127933078
Mises was not a libertarian. Rand wasnt esther. Another example of a libertarian that descends from hebrews is Walter Block

File: 1306667295806.jpg (41KB, 600x684px) Image search: [Google]

41KB, 600x684px

>>127934197
He probably did not read wall street and rise of hitler

>>127924135
The fund to provide these services was acquired through threats of violence. It doenst matter for what the stolen money is going to be use, the main question is how this fund was acquired

Besides, these services would be better provided in a free market system, with competition and free price formation resulting in a more rational allocation of resources

File: 1477417264032.png (28KB, 456x474px) Image search: [Google]

28KB, 456x474px

>>127928717
Because they're really not. Sure their economies are intertwined but compare, say, Washington DC (aka chocolate city) to its suburbs like Fairfax, Virginia (aka WHITE PEOPLE) and you'll see two majorly different places.

File: .jpg (29KB, 318x475px) Image search: [Google]

29KB, 318x475px

>>127934740
well thanks for clearing that up, I agree with you Rand is not a libertarian
>http://www.zerohedge.com/contributed/2012-11-29/ayn-rand-was-not-libertarian
Mises (economically) had a lot of influence on the basis of which Rothbard wrote his theories. Just as Lock and Smith before Franklin and Jefferson, you have to see the cement mixers for the foundation.
>rethinks his previous post
maybe he meant Freidman?
idk I just was assuming he was a troll and was feeding him

>>127920199
>Burgers
>Bitching about taxes
Fuck off.

>>127930147
>Taxation is your fee for the governments enforcement of your spooky private property laws
>implying I can't just defend my own property without the need of government

Anyway, what the fuck is up with so many AusNiggers ITT defending a welfare state/big government? Are you all on the centrelink dole? Fucking degenerates

File: 1496273648538.jpg (512KB, 1288x1586px) Image search: [Google]

512KB, 1288x1586px

I think we should have only taxes on shit we consume, around 20% more of the real price not taxes in salaries that's fucking stupid

File: caligula 02.jpg (37KB, 708x399px) Image search: [Google]

37KB, 708x399px

>>127936416
You are correct, he really influencied Rothbard and Hoppe a lot but i think that classical liberal is a better term to describe him
>>127937084
One day i saw a meme with eric voegelin torturing karl marx with his refutations
of marxism

I would like to see a version with Hoppe doing the same to Stiner

>>127939347
>Stirner

Fixed.

File: praxeology.jpg (39KB, 482x598px) Image search: [Google]

39KB, 482x598px

>>127939347
truth, you made me look at my library and get pissed off at the current people who call themselves 'Austrian Economists' when they really are "Chicago Economists'.
>fucking praxeology
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Praxeology

>>127920199
>roads

>>127920199
When I realized the government literally never uses taxes dollars for anything useful and that they're basically all criminals.

>>127920199
25 years ago

File: rigtwinglpidiots.jpg (41KB, 754x382px) Image search: [Google]

41KB, 754x382px

>>127920199

>>127939986
>In fact, as noted by Max Weber, Soziolog;e, Weltgeschichfliche Analysen, PoUtik
(Stuttgart: Kroener, 1964), p. 4, the famed roadways of ancient Rome were typically
regarded as a plague rather than an advantage, because they were essentially military
rather than trade routes.

>>127920199
About two years ago

Sometimes I get a wave of depression hitting over me when I think about it

I've also realised that anybody who is a socialist is my enemy, and does not deserve my time

>>127920199

I'd bet you $5 that Jewish interests are responsible for the income tax and that the money is used to further causes that support the existence of Israel and Jewish identity.

>>127920199
It's not theft. It's a membership due. If you don't want to be a member of the country that requires said tax then fuck off to Somalia or whatever truely free country you'd like to live in.

>>127940376
There is no contradiction, the state has no legitimate properties

>>127924135
Is it okay to rape someone if the baby will grow up to cure cancer?

>>127920199
After I took out a bunch of loans to pay for government schools and then had the government take from my paycheck to give out loans to more people and keep me from paying my loans back

File: yellow.jpg (205KB, 866x640px) Image search: [Google]

205KB, 866x640px

>>127940758
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Aid_Highway_Act_of_1956
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pershing_Map

>>127926368
>because roads and water are unprofitable and only an altruistic institution like the government can supply us from it

File: 1478359466972.png (76KB, 216x196px) Image search: [Google]

76KB, 216x196px

>>127920199
September 24, 2013

>>127922300
>This, I have no inherent objection to taxation as long as an actual contract is signed and agreed to, and so long as the party extracting the taxes actually provides the services it promises.

THIS. I'd pay more in taxes if the services we're actually fucking good. And if there were a better system of service 10 miles down the high way I would contract with them next year and try them out. I have NO objection to governments or taxes, but when I get thrown into a metal cage because I don't pay them I'm going to disagree. Maybe in extremely dire times of a mass nigger alien invasion or some shit but you feel me.