Why is the French Revolution so Glorified When it was a Complete

>>127534397
Because it represents the manifestation of the ideological movement to overthrow altar and throne.
It ushered in the age of secular republics. Or, the "new world order," as opposed to the old world order, Christendom.

>>127534397

Because it was the first to happen in a relevant country (North American colonies were a backwater in 1776).

>>127534397
Because it kickstarted the end of monarchy, the fall of colonialism and stoped the shamanic genocide.

Shit was great, if you don't agree we have the guillotine ready for you.

Its the only war they ever won

One of the funniest historical tidbits is learning about just who was in the Bastille when they were 'freed' from oppression.

>>127534554
Again, the US prior to them was a secular country.

That's the thing, i always hear all these vague grand things about how it changed the world blah blah blah but i cant find anything about what different ideas the French Revolution actually brought to humanity

>>127535051
this
>>127535186
Yes, I know. We were the first secular, godless nation in recorded human history.
It brought the fall of Christendom after it had been theologically destroyed by Protestantism and ideologically destroyed via humanism in the Renaissance.

>>127534980
-t. historically illiterate swine who only knows history beginning in 1941

>>127534723
This. imo, the only reason people glorify the French Revolution so much is not because it actually did anything, but rather just because it was France and people are brainwashed to be obsessed with France and esp. Paris for whatever reason

Like why does almost every girl in their 20s dream of visiting Paris? Just pure pro-French propaganda

>>127535186
Again:
USA in 1776: South Sudan of the Brits
France in 1789: Second only to Britain

>>127534397
>glorified
By who? I don't think Hollywood has ever made a big movie out of it. The only one that comes to mind is 'Orphans of the Storm', which is almost 100 years old and explicitly against the event, painting it as a prime example of ideology run amok and social subversion leading to complete ruin.

>>127535051
French Revolution has the best tidbits
>It took Louis XVI several years to finally fuck Marie Antoinette after their wedding
>The day before the Estates General Louis fell from a ladder and would have died if it weren't for some nobody catching him (I strongly suspect he was suicidal
>Louis was frequently heard crying in his room when he thought himself unobserved
>Robespierre made several enemies because he was too autistic to recognize people he knew in the street, leading many to think he was snubbing them
>"Robespierre simply can't fuck and money scares the hide off of him" - Danton on Robespierre
>Parisians defeating the Prussian Army by Zergling Rush

>>127535596
Who's 'they' and how are they glorifying it? Even in France they seem kind of lukewarm towards it. They seem like bigger fans of Napoleon most of the time, with a bit of Danton lionization.

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>>127534397

Because most members of the ruling dynasty were murdered by plebs.

It was the first time when the class deemed high and mighty, was shown to be mortal, and expendable, by those considered expendable.

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>>127534397
Marie was the name of the first one; she had been servant of a notorious brigand quite recently put to death on the wheel, whipping and branding had been her penalty. She was fifty-eight years old, had almost no hair left, her nose stood askew, her eyes were dull and rheumy, her mouth large and filled with her thirty-two teeth, yes, they were all there, but all were yellow as sulphur; she was tall, raw-boned, having whelped fourteen children, all fourteen of whom, said she, she'd strangled from fear they'd turn out ne'er-do-wells. Her belly rippled like the waves of the sea, and one of her buttocks was devoured by an abscess.
The second was known as Louison; she was sixty, stunted, hunchbacked, blind in one eye, and lame, but she had a fine ass for her age and her skin was still in fairly good repair. She was as wicked as the devil and forever ready to commit any horror and every extravagance one could possibly demand of her.

>>127534397
Because of moralists.

Revolutionary ideology is always popular among moralists, because it justifies any crime in the name of whatever. French Revolutionism gave birth to Communism, Fascism, Progressivism and many other totalitarian ideologies. The radical followers of these ideologies are just giving credit to their forefathers who started this violent totalitarian nonsense.

>>127535940
Thérèsewas sixty-two; she was tall, thin, looked like a skeleton, not a hair was left on her head, not a tooth in her mouth, and from this opening in her body she exhaled an odor capable of flooring any bystander. Her ass was peppered with wounds, and her buttocks were so prodigiously slack one could have furled the skin around a walking stick; the hole in this splendid ass resembled the crater of a volcano what for width, and for aroma the pit of a privy; in all her life, Thérèse declared, she had never once wiped her ass, whence we have proof positive that the shit of her infancy yet clung there. As for her vagina, it was the receptacle of everything ungodly, of every horror, a veritable sepulcher whose fetidity was enough to make you faint away. She had one twisted arm and limped in one leg.
The fourth was called Fanchon; six times she had been hanged in effigy, and not a crime exists in this world she had not committed. She was sixty-nine, she was flat-nosed, short, and heavy; she squinted, had almost no forehead, had nothing but two old teeth in her stinking maw, and they were ready to fall out, an erysipelas blazed all over her ass and hemorrhoids the size of your fist hung from her anus, a frightful chancre consumed her vagina, and one of her thighs had been entirely burned. She was dead drunk three-quarters of the year, and in that condition, her stomach being very weak, she vomited over everything. Despite the batch fo hemorrhoids adorning it, her asshole was naturally so large that all unawares she blew driblets and farts and often more besides. Apart from acting as servants in the luxurious recreation palace the four friends had in mind, these women were also to lend a hand at all the convocations and render all the lubricious services and ministrations that might be required of them.

Because brown skinned people were there and they listened to other people and were not harmed as if they would not be able to do any good by what they were hearing.

>>127535623
France being more important doesn't mean that their copying of American ideals makes them more special lol

We've had several replies and literally not a single one has shown why the failed French Revolution was any more glorious than the successful American one, other than that France was more important at the time.

>>127535784
Except the people leading the fight were also the high and mighty.

If anything the FR darkly parallels today, where we have erstwhile anarchists and corrupt loonies dressing up their fascist behaviour as 'freedom loving' and 'diversity'

>>127534397

Why is the Syrian conflict and arab spring romantacized?

>>127536046
>>127535784
>>127535680
>>127535318
>>127534901
>>127534554
Do you guys even know the French Revolution was about totalitarianism?

>>127535784
Yea i'll give you this one. Finally a good answer, props anon

>>127536116
>If anything the FR darkly parallels today, where we have erstwhile anarchists and corrupt loonies dressing up their fascist behaviour as 'freedom loving' and 'diversity'

Which is why I say that if it were not for the mad philosophies of the likes of Locke, Voltaire, and Jefferson, we would have no SJW.

>>127535596
I wonder the same shit. It's like how everybody wants to automatically go to California.

>>127536075
>France being more important doesn't mean that their copying of American ideals makes them more special lol

Hm. What would the world be without France's strong free speech culture?

>We've had several replies and literally not a single one has shown why the failed French Revolution was any more glorious than the successful American one, other than that France was more important at the time.

France had a Republican revolution, which ushered a totalitarian regime that drowned the world in wars. So did America, the dictatorship is just better hidden.

Also, the French revolution led to the desctruction of the Thousand Year Reich.

>>127536075
Because the French revolution was actually a revolution, whereas the American revolution was really a war of independence, not a revolution.

>>127535957
Well said

>>127535784
t. learned history from Paradox Games

>>127535957
Better answer. Immediately after the opening of the Russian Revolution Lenin commissioned a statue of Robespierre.

>>127536189
explain.

>>127536232
SJW is just a modern incarnation of an attitude that has always existed. Losers who collect grievances and look for problems with society always inevitably rally together behind retarded causes and accomplish nothing good.

>>127534397
>>127536232
The FR didn't come out of nowhere.
>Protestantism: rebellion from theological authority
>Renaissance: rebellion from Christian philosophical authority
>French Revolution: rebellion from Christian temporal authority

Through this breakdown of Christendom, we get Marxism.

As Antonio Gramsci, the father of cultural Marxism states, "The philosophy of praxis is the crowning point of this entire movement; (...) it corresponds to the nexus Protestant Reformation plus French Revolution. It is a philosophy which is also a politics, and a politics which is also a philosophy"

>>127536326
Rejecting the Holocaust is free speech?

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>>127534397
The French Revolution was a good thing. Fight me.

>>127536516
Get outta here Jefferson

>>127536516
>fight you

But the Franks are fucking trash tier in AOE2.

>>127536195
Do you actually consider yourself knowledgeable on this subject? I suppose that the name 'Charles the First' means absolutely nothing to you.

>>127536481
The French Revolution was about the destruction of institutions which supported the arbitrary delegation of power if it was about anything.

>>127536648
Do you also think the America revolution was a bad thing?

>>127535051
Who?

>>127535186
Because France was a relevant country, unlike the US. It also happening in mainland Europe also spurred fear to their neighboring countries. And oh yeah, a huge part of the French Revolution was the existing bloated class system, that made it a unanimous progeny and focal point for all future class conflicts after it. If you actually study the aftermath--the Legal changes and legacy, and Napoleon, you will see it was much more significant than the US revolution

>>127536701
It's a complex issue. The revolutionaries railed against the Church.
They committed genocide against the Vendee, the Catholics who stood against them.

The French soldiers executed many of these Vendee in mock sacraments like tying a man and woman together nude and throwing them in the water (mocking of sacrament of matrimony and of baptism).

The revolutionaries paraded around the actual heart of one of their fallen, mocking the devotion to the Sacred Heart of Jesus.
They sacked the clergy and took over the Paris cathedral, enthroned a prostitute on the altar and crowned her "goddess of reason." One person complained that she was perfect in every way except for her teeth.

These "enlightened" individuals created a 'cult of reason', altered the number of days of the week, and instituted a mock religious system elevating human reason to the status of deity.

They sought the king's and the Church's destruction even after the king gave concession to them.

>>127536947
7 people. 4 put in there for forging and the other 3 were literal lunatics. One had been put in there by the family in order to avoid the shame of public scandal.

>>127536880
Honestly i feel that the Americans massively exaggerated Britain imposing taxes upon them.

I mean, Britain almost went bankrupt partly due to having to defend their American subjects from the French and Indians. Seems only fair that the Americans pay their fair share (though Franklin argued that the did but meh)

So i don't agree with a lot of the "grievances" against the King (though i agree with some, like quartering troops is bs) and think a lot of them were overblown (but then again, i didnt live back then)

So no, i'm not really a big fan of it, though some good did come out of it.

>>127537201
so i take it our old friends the jews were somehow responsible for all this blasphemy?

daily reminder that not only did the French Revolution bring democracy (the real kind, not the Am*rican one) and progressivism to the world stage, but it also rose the concept of nation stated that all the great States (minus tax haven city states) in the world are based around.

>>127537375
Well, the Masons were heavily involved. They claimed to have orchestrated the entire thing after the fact.

Napoleon, in his classical liberal madness, emancipated the Jews. Interesting enough, within one hundred years, France came to be ruled as debt slaves to Jewish usury.

The 1898 issue of Civilta Cattolica entitled The Jewish Question covers the perfidy of the day and touches on this issue.

>>127534397

One thing we have to thank the French Revolution for: Fine dining.

Here's how: Once the French nobility had fled or faced the guillotined, all the people they had employed found themselves unemployed. For the ones who worked in the kitchens of the nobility, the solution to this was to offer their expertise to the general public with food made to order from choices written on a card or "a la carte". This is why most culinary terms are from French.

>>127534397
I don't know but I suspect it has something to do with the jews

>>127537201
The revolutionaries brutalized the Catholic Church but I don't agree with classifying the French Revolution as being explicitly opposed to Christianity. Every institution which formed a part of the old regime had to go. It wasn't opposition to the church's tenants as much as the fact that it was so closely entwined with Feudal France. The revolutionaries destroyed the old calendar too, anything old had to go. The particular brutality with which Christianity was oppressed I think can largely be attributed to the natural attraction that counter-insurgency holds towards psychopaths and the zeal with which the Christians were willing to stand up for their beliefs, leading to a stricter reaction out of fear.

>>127537566
>the concept of nation
Bogpill me on why this is worth a damn. The French Revolution destroyed every smaller culture in France and replaced them all with Parisian. Not completely of course but France went from many dialects to the one language for all, for example. This is great for efficiency's sake but tragic for culture. Also bigger states start fuckhueg wars and get into all kinds of retarded politics, it's hard to accidentally annihilate half a continent when you're thinking in terms of villages and towns.

>>127537930
I don't think the jews played any part in the French revolution.

>>127538030
This is an obvious lie. Think of a major event, any major event. It was jews.

1789 is a story good enough to turn the cattle against their masters. If the parallels too today gain traction, they can just counter it by deconstruction what would be like deconstructing the narrative foundations of democracy in the west.

Promoting the meme of 1789 is how the right can win against the jew.

>>127534397
>And in the long term, it didn't introduce anything to humanity

Holy fuck, AMERICAN EDUCATION Y'ALL. Why are Americans so retarded? You're all pushing this "Americans are dumb" meme way too far.

The French Revolution started the trend of European countries becoming bastions of democracies and meritocracies. It started the decline of monarchies all over Europe and got them replaced with republics. It is literally one of the most important events in all of human history.

After Napoleon conquered Europe, he passed down the Napoleonic Code, with British historian Andrew Roberts describing it as, "The ideas that underpin our modern world—meritocracy, equality before the law, property rights, religious toleration, modern secular education, sound finances, and so on—were championed, consolidated, codified and geographically extended by Napoleon.".

The French Revolution and Napoleon really are responsible for making Europe the way it is today.

>>127537998
>but I don't agree with classifying the French Revolution as being explicitly opposed to Christianity
The entire Endarkenment philosophy is anti-Christian. It is made clear in Voltaire's, Locke's and Rousseau's writings.

Which is why I am confused why Christians of today identify with the revolutionary politics of classical liberalism when it is at its very foundations aimed at secularizing and dechristianizing society.

>>127538136
Got any examples of jewish involvement?

>>127538263
I'm kinda curious, why are you against the Enlightenment? Is it just because of its anti-christian bias? Or do you disagree with its basic tenets (i.e. liberty, property rights, equality before the law, etc.)

>>127534397
You're right. It was shit. Bit its significant because it was the first of many revolutions based on the same bullshit secularist thought. Technocrats were going to create an egalitarian paradise with "science" and "reason". The state was going to be run by scientists and wngineers, and it was going to be for the people.

This always turns out terribly.

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>>127538322
Communism. Which requires the abolition of absolute monarchy. Which means the jews were probably responsible for every modern revolution.

>>127534397
>In the short term, the French Revolution was a complete failure.

And in the long term it was a total fucking catastrophe.

>>127538263
The hardcore thinkers behind the revolution held strong anti-Christian sentiments but how long do the thinkers tend to hold influence in revolutions? Their manifestos, pamphlets, dictionaries, essays and all the rest were very scandalous but the heart of the revolution seems to me to have been hardworking people feeling fucked over by a system that forced them to supply gibs to a bunch of poncey do-nothings and a church which largely seems to not give a shit (I know abbes and nuns were often fantastic but many of the bishops are undefendable).

I have to say though, of all the anons ITT including me you seem to have the strongest idea of what you're talking about by far. Got to go now but maybe the thread won't be dead when I'm back.

>>127537375
Since (((they))) took over Britain how many none ((())) dictators/emperors do you know who were successful and didn't have an entire continent suddenly on their back?

>>127538263
This is why Catholics dislike Vatican II. It instilled democratic structure over the hierarchical. An entire society was made in reaction to this called the Society of St. Pius X, SSPX. They are recognized priests of the church

The entire Dark Enlightenment reactionary position proclaims the tragedies and flaws of Enlightenment ideals. It's one of the deepest red pills anyone could swallow

>>127538677
I'm aware of jewish involvement in the communist movement, but I was asking about examples from the French revolution.

It seems improbable to me that jews played any part in it since they were still second class citizens. Robespierre, Saint-Just, etc. were all French noblemen.

>>127538463
>property rights, equality before the law
These things existed before the Endarkenment.
The "liberty" it introduced is license. Liberty, as it was understood for over a thousand years in Christendom is the freedom to do what is right; not the freedom to do as you wish under arbitrary law.

I say arbitrary law because, without government having an objective foundation to operate from, you end up with the "laws" and societal decay that we have now: sodomite unions and the like.

In short, the fruit of this secularization is this:
>1000+ years of Christendom: Western civilization
>200 years of secularism: children confused as to which bathroom to use
>"liberty"

>>127537293
Because Americans never made their own money, which never pissed the British off because they couldn't collect interest off their own money, so they never made those paper notes illegal and never forced the colonies to pay the jew tax, which never lead to the revolution.

Right? Right. It was about tea. And stamps.

>>127538930
>without government having an objective foundation to operate from
This objective foundation is supposed to be the Bible? I think natural rights are a more objective foundation than scriptures, but that's just my opinion.

>you end up with the "laws" and societal decay that we have now: sodomite unions and the like.
I'm really unconvinced by this argument. Social degeneracy only started in the 1960s. How do you explain the preservation of conservative social mores during the period 1770s-1960s?

>>127538701
Yes, the French government was rife with problems at the time. Yet, the poison of secularization spread throughout the world and destroyed its ancient foundations.
It is hard to talk about the FR without first talking about the Protestant revolt, though, as they are both intimately connected in ideology.

>>127538844
Dominus vobiscum, fra.

>>127538930
>>127539173
And let's not kid ourselves the liberal 19th century was the apex of western civilization.

>>127539173
>social degen started in the '60s
>Not taking the degenerate 1920's, 1900's, 1870's... into account
You sound like someone whoes history starts with 1945

>>127539390
Well I mean yes there's always been degenerates, but rampant social degeneracy was contained. Following your arguments one can claim that the ancien regime was also degenerate because of individuals like the Marquis de Sade, but that would be silly.

>>127534397
Because Napoleon rose from the ashes and defeated six consecutive international coalitions.

>>127539173
The objective foundations of revealed religion that built Western civilization, yes and no. There is nothing wrong with the concept of natural rights insofar as it does not conflict with natural law.

Classical liberalism is, by nature, government by popular opinion. When a society is based upon the whimsical societal feeling of the day, there is no firm foundation.
Classical liberalism naturally leans leftward and organically tends toward further liberalism. There is no return to 1776.

>>127539222
My man.

I know nothing about the FR in that respect, however Catholics still talk about the Protestant Reformation because of what it did to government. The Enlightenment would not have happened if the PR didn't happen

I have zero doubt that degeneracy today is a result of the Enlightenment. "Free-thinking" man, unbound from duties of the divine. What you see today is what man really is without God.

>>127538853
>they were still second class citizens
Not behind the scenes. Rothschild had established enormous wealth by then and was a key financier in the Napoleonic Wars that followed. He and his family profited enormously from the French Revolution.

>>127535680
seems like they were dealing with all the problems todays society does . AKA first world problems

The Declaration of the Rights of Man is the greatest document in western human history.

Prove me wrong

>>127539647
>There is nothing wrong with the concept of natural rights insofar as it does not conflict with natural law.
Sorry, I actually meant natural law, not natural rights.

Also you do realize that the concept of "natural law" is a product of the enlightenment? (with Christian inspirations, granted)

>Classical liberalism is, by nature, government by popular opinion.
Not necessarily. For instance universal suffrage in the UK is super recent, it only appeared after ww2. But its Parliament is far more ancient.

Classical liberals are opposed to mob rule just as much as aristocrats.

Napoleon wasn't a failure. At least not until the invasion of Russia

Which French revolution? There were quite a few

>>127539601
This

>>127539765
Rothschild was not French, and I'd have less trouble believing you if you provided sources.

>and was a key financier in the Napoleonic Wars that followed
To the enemies of Napoleon, not to the French!

>>127539744
>The Enlightenment would not have happened if the PR didn't happen
Absolutely. It was a slow slide toward godlessness.

>Protestantism, 1517: Christ yes, Church no
>Freemasonry, 1717: God yes, Christ no
>Communism, 1917: God doesn't exist

Gramsci clearly saw this continuum. It has gotten so bad now that even the successor of Peter is marching in lockstep with Marxist thought; whether or not he considers himself Marxist. As long as the society has been pervaded with these ideas, people don't need to become Masons or Marxists or whatever, they've already come over to the 'secret society', they've already come over to their side.

>>127534397
It was the moment the international banking cartel had its first triumph over the aristocracy (their major barrier to national, and ultimately, world hegemony). WWI was the crushing finale, and WWII was clean up.

>>127536488
yes sir. I will defend to death to uphold that right!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEeSPc5oTcM

>>127540154
I know it's gonna seem like I'm baiting, but I'm not. What's so bad about godlessness?

To make it clear where I stand, I'm an atheist lolbertarian.

>>127538930
fuck you just opened my eyes.

>>127534397
Because it brought us the beautiful guillotine.

>>127535623
>USA in 1776: South Sudan of the Brits
Britain already knew the US was set to become economically powerful in only a few decades. See Edmund Burke's speeches in parliament, or literally anything that has basis in fact and not cliches for simpletons. There is no reason why the example of a relatively large Western nation wouldn't have influence on other western nations.
>>127535186
The Revolution itself was not an immediate success, but its echoes effected a great deal of change. Napoleon, who saw himself as the guarantor of the failed revolution, spread some of its values all throughout the continent europe.

>>127540020
The Church was speaking of natural law long before the revolutionaries set their axes to it. Their definition of natural law was an iconoclasm, a defacement, stripping God of his rights and relegating man, his pleasure and leisure, as the capstone.

>>127540149
>being this bluepilled
>reddit as fuck
He helped orchestrate the French Revolution so as to destabilize Europe, make a shitload of profit and subsequently enslave the now war torn countries with debt.

Of course there are no sources detailing the jewish conspiracy.

>>127540563
>Of course there are no sources detailing the jewish conspiracy.
Convenient.

>>127540596
Its an old and well known story. Look it up yourself

>>127540240
Man has absolutely no faculty over his own governance if God is not in the picture. There is no moral right if there is no God.

>but atheists can be good people too

Yes, but the object of goodness is not an abstract, it is provided from Life, from Being, from God. Goodness is alive just as God is alive. The only hope that Man has at being truly good is to pray for its presence on Earth, because Earth hosts Death. Man is bound by Death, not just physically but psychically as well. Man is tempted into blindness without ever really knowing it. That is human nature.

It's more theological than philological but that's how I personally see it.

>>127540240
I was never an atheist but I used to be an agnostic libertarian; basically a practicing neo-pagan.

I can't really answer that any better than a quick look around our society. This is the product of godlessness. As Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn said, this [bolshevism] happened because we forgot God.

>>127540651
>Its an old and well known story.
Unfortunately I'm inclined to believe that it's just that: a story.

>>127539647
anon do u have any reading to further my understanding of this

>>127540563
Source?

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>>127534397
It was good for the Jews so it is good history

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>>127540704
you have to go back

>>127540704
10 seconds on google

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rothschild_family#The_Napoleonic_Wars
>one instance, the family network enabled Nathan to receive in London the news of Wellington's victory at the Battle of Waterloo a full day ahead of the government's official messengers.[21] Rothschild's first concern on this occasion was not to the potential financial advantage on the market which the knowledge would have given him; he and his courier immediately took the news to the government.[21] It was then repeated in later popular accounts, such as that of Morton.[23][24] The basis for the Rothschild's most famously profitable move was made after the news of British victory had been made public. Nathan Rothschild calculated that the future reduction in government borrowing brought about by the peace would create a bounce in British government bonds after a two-year stabilisation, which would finalise the post-war restructuring of the domestic economy.[22][23][24] In what has been described as one of the most audacious moves in financial history, Nathan immediately bought up the government bond market, for what at the time seemed an excessively high price, before waiting two years, then selling the bonds on the crest of a short bounce in the market in 1817 for a 40% profit. Given the sheer power of leverage the Rothschild family had at their disposal, this profit was an enormous sum.[22]

>>127540670
Let me offer my viewpoint.

I fully agree that goodness is not an abstract notion, but instead of believing that it derives from the divine impulse contained within Man, given by God, I rather think of it in Darwinian terms as the product of the evolution of human behavioral characteristics: moral behaviors make for better societies.

So what I guess I'm saying is, I agree that moral relativism is pretty evil and that there does exist a moral way of life, but that rather of it being imposed by some deity, it is derived from human nature.

And in a society which understands and accepts that, God is not needed.

>>127540771
I would recommend a book published in 1899 on liberalism. It is online now:
http://www.liberalismisasin.com/index.htm
When the above book ends, the website owner put a bunch of other links that aren't relevant. Just a heads up.

Also, perhaps http://a.co/76uNfj8
It is a tome of a book, heavily sourced, but a real eye-opener.
You can find some of the author's speeches in lieu of this book online that are just as good and make great primers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tk6qjD2oRA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mbt6r8Zq1eQ

>>127541105
awesome thank you. is this the liberalism that people claim "is the real liberalism" before all this new left wing progressivism?

>>127540698
"""Religious""" countries like Huezil are just as degenerate if not more.

>>127540831
No.

>>127541057
Yeah I'm well aware of the Waterloo story, but that isn't really what we were talking about. The Kiwi was saying that the Rothschilds worked behind the scene to orchestrate the French Revolution and the Napoleonic Wars. What that wiki paragraph describes is just a speculative move from the part of the Rothschilds based on events they had no control over.

>>127541059
>spacing
>talks like a faggot
>enlightened atheist
>bluepilled as fuck
>loves jews
R E D D I T
E
D
D
I
T

>>127541310
Reddit spacing is a summer meme. I've probably been here longer than you.

>>127540240
Honestly, I think that the idea of libertarianism is generally good--in ideology. In practice, it could never remain that way and is as idealist as the Marxist utopia.
Human beings tend toward immorality without the guidance of law to curb this behavior. In a libertarian society, there is no authority to set morality for anyone as anyone has the ""liberty"" to define morality as one pleases.
Hell, one has the liberty to define liberty itself in any way they see fit to justify whatever debased proclivities haunt a person.

>>127541251
Yes--what we call today classical liberalism.

>>127541463
if that were true you wouldn't suck so much jew dick

>>127541477
is the ideal to go back to church and state dominance?

>>127541477
Well once again I'm very skeptical of the claim that freedom would breed debauchery. Wasn't the Victorian age one of increased modesty, despite it being ultra-liberal by today's standards?

The idea behind libertarianism as I understand it is that degenerate behavior would not be tolerated due to self-imposed social norms and due to degenerate behavior not being subsidized by the state (I think a big reason for today's social ills is the welfare state).

>>127541656
The funny thing is that I actually quite dislike kikes.

>>127541699
the ideal is small city-states governed by direct democracy as per rousseau's social contract

IT DID WORK.

Napoleon completley reformed the French system. The legal system, how taxes are collected, social mobility, no more tithes to the church, universities, etc. It was like going from Windows 95 to macOS Sierra.

>>127541853
Wait you're a rousseauist? The prototypical SJW? The ideologue behind the Jacobin movement? What?

>>127541778
>The idea behind libertarianism as I understand it is that degenerate behavior would not be tolerated due to self-imposed social norms
>DUE TO SELF-IMPOSED SOCIAL NORMS
You've answered your own question jew boy, read Hobbes, Rousseau, Kant, and Locke -- particularly Rousseau

>>127541995
Your reading list suggestion is completely at odds with the ideas you're expressing. Have you read those books yourself?

>>127541926
Rousseau wasn't an SJW at all in fact he thought women were unequal to men and had no place in the public sphere.

>>127535784
Except they obviously weren't expendable considering the fact that the revolution led France into a permanant state of being shit.

>>127541699
The Church and State dominance is really blown out of proportion--and was mainly demonized by protestants who were fleeing persecution by other protestants in England (for being Judaizing, no less; e.g. Puritans).

The Church offered the State the unifying factor of religion and gave stability through culture (deriving from the Latin cultus, meaning common religious devotion of a people).
The State executed its own laws on its own prerogatives. Sometimes it obeyed the natural law and the law of God as revealed through the Church, but mostly it did not.

There are more than a few times where the pope had to intervene and reign in a monarch who became a hinderance to the common good and health of Christendom.

That said, the Monarch and Church never held as much power over his government as the elected monarch holds today.

>>127542113
He was the very first SJW. He rejected reason, and instead based all his philosophy on his fee-fees, and with his stupid social contract gave an impetus to the establishment of totalitarian states.

>>127542055
They are all social contract theorists -- you're meant to draw your own conclusions. I mention Rousseau in particular because he believed man in the state of nature was apathetic and indifferent, not good or evil and that the state is both our salvation and our demise which is why his model only works in small city-states. Quit being a faggot.

>>127541778
>self-imposed social norms
Self-imposed social norms aren't self-imposed if one has the liberty to flaunt these norms which aren't officially agreed upon. It will all fall apart.

>>127542153
interesting. but what can we do moving forward?

>>127534397
coz we cut all the rich heads and killed god

>>127541059
That is where Darwinian views differ from Christian. Darwinian views like yours insist that goodness is present in Man. Christianity, and Judaism to some extent I guess, believe that Man is host to evil. That Man is very, very far from goodness. Man is not a complete picture. He is empty, cold and confused.

You also have to realize that many ideas on liberalism were a reaction to extremely hard times. The Renaissance came about after the plague and the 30-Years' War. The Protestant Reformation came about after Catholic corruption. Atomism came from a man who grew up with thousands of men being slaughtered regularly outside the gates of his hometown.

Evil begets evil and death begets death. What are we if we're not meant for something higher? We're stuck in this endless cycle of life and death, to what end? To make sure we live comfortable lives? In whose name? What's the point in life if we're going to die? What's the point of comfort if we're going to die? What's the point of ANYTHING if we're going to die?

Here is where we stand. This is why abortion is common, as well as suicide. The Netherlands or some fucked European country is starting to offer euthanasia as a prescription for depression and hopelessly ill or disabled people. We revel in death because we host it. Death is present within; evil is present within. Like I said earlier, look around and see for yourself what we've become.

Coming to Christ, for me at least, was a result of pain. Immense pain, seeing what goes on here on /pol and things which happened in my own life. I realized that men have nothing to offer me for comfort and neither do I. I saw Death and evil around me and in me and I needed to get it out.

It is much more personal than tribal. Evolution explains how Man became host to the divine. Evolution does not explain immaterial concepts like good, it did not create goodness. Love and pain are more than just reactions to stimuli. We are not machines.

>>127542212
He didn't reject reason, he understood that while our reason leads us to a higher existence it also creates insatiable desire

>>127542236
No, Rousseau thought man was inherently good and that civilization corrupted him, and advocated living in hippie communes.

>>127542277
>Self-imposed social norms aren't self-imposed if one has the liberty to flaunt these norms
The idea would be that despite the fact that, indeed, you would have the liberty to flaunt those norms, in return the community you belong to would that the liberty to choose not to associate with you. In essence, kick you out.

>>127534397

it was basically the first commi revolution.

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>>127534397
It depend for who.

>>127542482
Rousseau's primitive is asocial which removes any potential for good or bad. His primitive is only good insofar as he is imbued with basic compassion which enables him to avoid causing pain to others beyond what is necessary to meet basic needs. Just like any other animal. He advocated direct democracy, not "hippie communities" because he was Genevan -- direct democracy is still used in Switzerland today and it works. Don't be stupid. Everybody in this thread thinks you're retarded.

>>127542212
>He was the very first SJW.
He was THE SJW. 9/10 of SJW ideology can be traced back to him

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>>127538322
>Louis XVI did nothing wrong

This is the best book I've found on the subject. The whole thing kicked off when the kikes (Jacobin illuminated freemasons with banker backing) bought up all the grain leaving the people to starve while spreading rumors about how the king was living it up while they were sufferink. They imported printing presses and started distributing propaganda leaflets. The revolution was just another in a long list of conflicts makig up the greater jewish world revolution including "revolution" in england, france, russia, and two world wars.

>The French Revolution : a study in democracy by Nesta H. Webster
https://archive.org/details/frenchrevolution00websuoft

The French motto is the same as the freemasons - liberté, égalité, fraternité and the All-Seeing Eye can be found on their "constitution" - Declaration of the Rights of Man.

>>127534397
Given I know nothing about it, I'm going with the Jews until proven otherwise. I highly suggest everyone else take up this position in all matters, it is surprisingly effective.

>>127542396
Humanly, absolutely nothing. Liberalism will need to run its course (collapse of civilization).
Who wants to hear the above?
Who even cares?
As long as person X can remain a mediocre consumer and participate in the technological bobbles of the day meanwhile engaging in nearly any sexual deviancy available, there will be no change in a positive direction.

It can't go on forever--and it won't. In merely two hundred years we have managed to confuse and redefine even the most basic terms of existence: male and female.

But, hey, as SCOTUS Anthony Kennedy said:
>"At the heart of liberty is the right to define one's own concept of existence, of meaning, of the universe, and of the mystery of human life"
This is the culmination of the madness; the institutionalizing of relativism and the rebirth of illogical pagan thought.

But, theologically, there is hope.

>>127539226
The 19th century was when it all finally crumbled

>>127541059
>>127542428
But it also gets dangerously close to the idea of the opiate, a concept I've struggled with at times. But Man is guilty of the same thing. He places himself on a pedestal, and he proclaims that we're past our old deistic views, and that we CAN do it without God. Yet after the Enlightenment we mechanized warfare and caused two of the bloodiest wars this world has ever seen.

It is of my opinion that had the Catholic church retained some grasp over education after the Reformation, that we would not have mechanized warfare. We would not have made ourselves into killing machines. We would not have viewed life as a clock and ourselves as gears.

Your stance on goodness is not a scientific one but a philosophical one. Even though you have science to back your claim your view is still just the fruit of an idea. An idea that does not include God.

So why should you embrace something other than the idea you have now, when it works just fine? That is for you to decide. The power of faith isn't about reason but just that - faith. A surrendering of your own faculties, that you can reason your way around God, is the first step. Enlightenment views are prideful.

>>127542512
>It is a proof of the divergence of the tendencies of the socialist and the bourgeois pictures of history—and from now on there will be two distinct historical cultures running side by side without ever really fusing—that people who have been brought up on the conventional version of history and know all about the Robespierrist Terror during the Great French Revolution, should find it an unfamiliar fact that the Terror of the government of Thiers executed, imprisoned or exiled more people—the number has been estimated at a hundred thousand—in that one week of the suppression of the [Paris] Commune [of 1871] than the revolutionary Terror of Robespierre had done in three years.

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>>127542872
I know enough about it to tell you that your instinct is spot-on m8.

Louis was doing a lot to bring reforms to the people, but it was never enough because it wasn't really about any grievances of the people. Just another case of regime change for the purposes of installing their puppet.

>>127542396
My theological opinion on the solution is, we are headed for chastisement.

First, see
>>127540154

In the Jewish Midrash (pre-Christian traditions), they tell us that the flood did not come until man created marriage contracts with other men, and with man and animals.

>As it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be in the coming of the Son of Man
We are in that time again. We're officiating abominable unions.
There's only one solution here. Make your home a fortress from the brothel of a society we live in. If you have children, cut off the cable. Filter your internet. Instill virtue.
Civilization begins with your household.
Pray and make reparations and do penance.

This won't last forever. Note the years of the societal slide toward our modernity. I'm not saying something is to happen this year, but I do not think it is merely an ominous coincidence that we find ourselves in this position in this year.

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>>127539173
>>127539390

What is the justification for this idea of 'social degeneracy'?!

>inb4 homos and suffrage

I'd suggest any of you blue pilled faggots in here to read Carlyle and de Maistre's thoughts on the French Revolution.

>>127538165

I gave up trying to bring intelligence to this board a while ago. Now i just shitpost.

>>127534397
It was the first major victory for Jewish globalism. It is a little known fact that after the revolution pornography was introduced into french society (I'm not talking nude art... I'm talking crude drawings meant to be used for sexual gratification). There would be kiosks on street corners were you could pay a tiny amount of money to see the image of a naked woman. (((They))) used this as a means of both subduing and prolonging the revolutionary spirit. It wasn't in their best interest for the masses to continue revolting, but they also didn't want the fire to go out completely. So they introduced pornography and made it known that if the royal family would return chances are they'd ban the practice...

As with most revolutions, the fire slowly dwindled; however, this time it was never extinguished. It pornography, or rather, the threat of it being outlawed, that kept the embers smoldering.

>>127538165
>The French Revolution and Napoleon really are responsible for making Europe the way it is today.

I agree. It was a total disaster. But I think the downfall really went into overdrive after the kikes got Cromwell and William of Orange into England to gut it and pave the way for the Jewish takeover. The merchants, thick as theives in Holland after being kicked out of Spain, needed a strong Navy to provide protection for their merchant fleet. From there they gained control over the Bank of England and the rest is history as they say.

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>>127545164
Right, because people that embrace porn or more likely to reject God.

>I had motives for not wanting the world to have meaning; consequently, assumed it had none, and was able without any difficulty to find reasons for this assumption.... For myself, as no doubt for most of my contemporaries, the philosophy of meaninglessness was essentially an instrument of liberation. The liberation we desired was simultaneously liberation from a certain political and economic system and liberation from a certain system of morality. We objected to the morality because it interfered with our sexual freedom (1937, pp. 270, 273, emp. added). - Aldous Huxley

>Jewish globalism
I remember reading about how blondes in France were especially targeted for massacre. The idea is that pretty people have smart babies. In the same way they especially liked to target students in Russia. The students wouldn't wear their school caps after a while so the kikes started looking for the marks that the strap would leave in the the hair. They also killed many of the intelligentsia of Poland in Katyn. Kill the best gentiles!

>>127534397
successful destruction of the monarchist/fiefdom system which persisted for millenia

the US skipped all that shit and went straight to populist republic without the messy stains

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>>127534397
Liberté, égalité, fraternité is all virtue signaling in France. France is a authoritarian police state just like Putin's Russia. They throw people in jail for denying holocaust.

>>127534397
The French revolution was mostly like this.

>The Church and Monarchy had absolute control over the country
>Revolution happens
>The State and the top 1% have absolute control over the country.

Just a transfer of power from one entity to another.

>>127534397
The French suck at everything, at least ignore this failure. You might hurt their cuck feelings.