Stop being an atheist.

>>126637442
How does math prove a soul exists?

>>126637442
WE ARE ALL ONE

No.

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>>126637442
your god is too small

Can someone please tell me

1.) The benefit of joining a religion in 2017?

and

2.) The benefit of believing in God in 2017?

>>126640500
some bullshit about "degeneracy" and "tradition"

>>126637442

Nah.

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>>126637442

I've defeated every atheist in debate and made them into stammering idiots, some of them have even broken down into tears.
For the past 12 years I've engaged in hundreds of discussions and debates, I have achieved a monopoly over victory -- I always win.


It's got to the point where I don't even give a shit now, anytime you annihilate the atheist and they run out of arguments and can't counter your points, they just crawl away like bitches and go into denial and try to ignore the experience.

Debating atheists is entirely fruitless, they're more incredulous than die hard religious people. Even if you answer all their questions they just go quiet or freak out and slap their keyboards while screaming the equivalent of "nuh uh!"... pointless.

>>126640500
If you want a white wife it's the only way.

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>>126644534

If your god exists then explain THIS

>>126644534

What are some of your points that have stumped Atheists?

>>126644534
is this copypasta?

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>>126646697

What have you done?

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>>126637442
Never.

Sacrifice your comfort for the truth.

I'm an atheist and I am pro-life, hate homosexuals, want traditional family values, am conservative, etc etc etc.

kys

also sage

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>>126644534
Low quality lies and b8

>>126648342
You think a universe with a God is more comforting than one without one? Damn, you're stupid.

t. a guy who understands theology

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>>126648901

>>126637442
>Stop being an atheist.
Stop being a dick-sucker

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>>126644973
Darn-Tootin.

>>126637442
IQ is not correlated with bravery. The man is a coward who is scared of death. He'll do whatever mental gymnastics necessary to maintain his faith.

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>>126648901
>t. a guy who understands theology
>t. a guy with a big fishhook in his mouth

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>>126650356
where do i find a qt like this?

First Person is one of the best TV shows ever but Chris Langan comes off like a delusional idiot. The Who Wants To Be A Millionaire guy is way better.

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>>126652039

>>126644534
>being this new
You know its really really pathetic when you have to lie to gain internet points on /pol/ right?

>>126648342
>>126648901

>You think a universe with a God is more comforting than one without one?

Most people won't understand it but you're right. Atheist and nihilist point of view are way more comfortable : nothing exists, nothing matters so why bother ?
On the other side believing that a supperior moral exists, that everything matters and that all your acts and all of your choices have an impact on the rest of the universe is pretty hard to handle.

>>126637442
The bible (and any other "holy book") is a lie. Everyone knows that. So if you want to believe in your imaginary god, its your problem.

>>126644534
In your dreams?

>>126654911
>having a god means your actions matter
On the contrary, what you do doesnt matter fuckshit because youre just a puppet to a genocidal maniacial deity's masterplan.

>>126637442
Christopher Langan is an atheist,dumbass.

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>>126654911
Thinking that you'll go to heaven after you die and live in paradise eternally is less comfortable than thinking once you die there is nothing (just like before you were born)???

wat

>>126655082
>The bible (and any other "holy book") is a lie.

People have been trying to answer the deepest questions about life for thousands of years and some managed to gather all the wisdom their people acquired into a handful of books and you reject all of it ?

>>126654911
>nothing exists, nothing matters so why bother ?
That's not nihilism
-->Men make morals<--
Ubermensch recognize that men write the moral codes and so create the best morals they can for themselves and others.

Untermensch - the worst men, who fabricate gods to enforce their arbitrary morals to exploit the weak - are people like you who pretend their "morals" were inspired by gods despite the fact they are also written by mere men.

Welcome to the mind of Nietszsche.

>>126655849
>Christopher Langan is an atheist dumbass.

Then why do you watch his videos?

>>126655924
>implying heaven
>not reincarnation

Why do athiest think all people who believe in God believe in heaven?

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>>126637442

Fuck that, join Varg's pagan yoga-class.

>>126655406
>youre just a puppet to a genocidal maniacial deity's masterplan

That's just the closed-minded way you think of God.
Most people believe that God gave us free will and that it's people who choose to lead a good or an evil life.

>>126658318
>God has a plan
>we have free will
pick one

>>126657874
So you reincarnate for a couple of thousand years or until there's an event that destroys pretty much all complex life forms in the Earth, then what?

>>126657874
Even reincarnation is far more comforting than an eternity of nothingness

>>126655924
The people who believe in heaven also often believe in hell, but personally I don't buy any of this.

>once you die there is nothing
Once again : why bother if it doesn't matter ?

>>126637442
>It's year 3148 and you have the ability to create as many different
tiny worlds as you want by just pressing one button on your computer.
>You create a new species and watch it evolve. >You speed up the process and observe the species evolve
>Take a shit, come back and see something similar to 2017 Earth

If there was a creator, would he really care about us? Why would he care about us worshiping and recognizing him?

>>126644534
You must not know any smart atheists. I don't think you understand how logic works.

>>126659059
As things are going, we don't even have 200 years before there's massive death in this world.

>>126659037
So basically... why try to live a good life and be a good person if there is nothing after you die?

Just because a person doesn't believe in life after death or reincarnation of some kind doesn't mean that they'll have an attitude that nothing matters rofl. Are you on psychiatric medication?

>>126658706
We have free will there's no doubt.
The "God has a plan" thing doesn't mean he imposes it on you

>>126658706
I would rather than "everything works according to God's plan"

>>126660219
>why try to live a good life and be a good person if there is nothing after you die?

It's rather "why be a good person if there's no supperior moral?"
Why even bother being good to others if you can only act for your own good whether it helps or hurts people ?

>>126660437
Allow me to elaborate.
>god knows everything im about to do
>i have free will
Pick one.

>>126661313
Only dullards or emotionally compromised losers need a religion or promise of something after death to desire to be a good person.

You don't have to be religious or believe in a God or afterlife to know it's wrong to murder people or rape someone...

Seriously... are you on psychiatric medication? Serious question.

>>126661313
Because being a good person helps make society and life for my family better instead of being a greedy fuck who only does it because they want to go to heaven.

>>126637442
Yes daddy

>>126661742
I don't see why both can't go together. God knows what you're about to do but you're still the one choosing what you're doing

>>126661742
>Langan told Muscle Magazine that "you cannot describe the universe completely with any accuracy unless you're willing to admit that it's both physical and mental in nature".
The mustache should be enough to convince you. You can look up the interview in your copy of the December 2001 issue of Muscle magazine.

>>126660437
>doesn't mean he imposes it on you
It means exactly that by definition. Words have meaning. You can change the definition of words, but that won't refute the argument, which still uses the original meaning of the words.

>>126662565
That's not about religion or promise, that's about recognizing there's a higher moral/being inside of yourself that's shared with the rest of the universe

>it's wrong to murder people or rape someone
Yeah it's "wrong" but why bother if it benefits you ? If I kill you to steal your money it's a good thing for me, maybe not for you but definitly for me. So why shouldn't I do it ?

And no I'm not on psychiatric medication

>>126664411
Doubles of Truth

>>126662565
The thing is that you can't justify any moral obligations or standard without God. You can't say that rape is wrong or evil if you dont have an anchor in wich you set upon to say it's wrong. You can say: its wrong because she suffers, but who says that suffering is wrong? You are borrowing concepts from a theistic world view to fit in your atheistic world view.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8RqYK9972s0

Theists are simple-minded folk that believe in the same Bronze Age superstitions that illiterate Palestinians did 2000 years ago.

BRB Zeus gonna smite me down LOL

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>>126637442
but im not

>>126640500
Heaven

also there isn't any downside

>>126666106
I wrote it wrong, it's rather "everything works according to God's plan".

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>>126644534
I realize this is a copy pasta but they actually never have an actual arguement for
>>125637346

>>126637442
Don't tell me what to do faggot

>>126652066
i think the IQ test got fucked up or something when they were doing it

i saw a show on this guy and he just whines about how bad his life is and how mean his daddy was to him and how he got jacked and then he tried to write a paper that was 'theory of everything in the universe' and it was just postmodern garbage at that bonkers reed college

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>>126637442

>Stop being an atheist.

Yes mom, but first tell your churches to stop fucking our kids.

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You only get to atheism by taking god literally and not seriously. Atheists are unironically mediocrity-signaling.

>>126637854
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6del%27s_ontological_proof

Stop having a sandnigger as your messiah

>>126659059
like how a parent loves their kid

so OP wants us to conform and join the brainwashed religious masses? nah, i don't think so.

>>126659557
>smart
>atheist
Pick one and only one.

>>126660219
Because our prime directive is to survive, which extends to our family and the rest of the human race. Being a nihilist runs counter to this. Why do you think we're compelled to build robots? When we die off, they'll carry our legacy. It's the ultimate form of survival.

>>126668520
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Ontological_argument

>>126668979
Respond to wrong post. I suck cock.

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>>126668134
not all Christians are Cuckolicks, Anon

>>126669017
That isn't the argument.

>>126666122
The example of murder needs to be without consequence, simple murder for money is obviously not beneficial to you. You can extract much more money by not murdering even if you are a complete sociopath.

The question needs to be: would you murder someone for a million dollars if there was absolutely no way to trace it back to you? Some atheists will correctly say no because of the mental effects it has on themselves but by doing so they enter the realm of the subjective psychological world that is ruled by mythology. What is the force that demands you suffer for your misdeeds even if no one else knows? It's your nature, the nature of reality, the rules that have always been in place, God demanding that you obey.

i read his universal theory high on mushrooms and i lost my fucking mind

however even if he is not completely correct, i have spent the past year picking the brains of enlightened minds and have come to the following profound and irrefutable conclusions:


>there is a god/universe consciousness and we are are all aspects of it
>tesla was right about pretty much everything
>we don't live in a simulation
>quantum mechanics is complete bullshit and anything from the quantum cult is just using it to control human behavior (become god without actually doing anything), and a hundred years from now it will be regarded to be even more retarded than geocentric theories of the middle ages
>big ass head and big ass forehead=smart

>>126668962
>smart
>Christian
pick two and only two

>>126637442
>stop being correct
No.

>>126669150
Explain it then oh wise one

>>126637442
Yeah I really don't want to be part of a cult who wastes there Sundays singing to the invisible man. with some shill telling me how much I need to give to the church so some ass hole can install a few more golden toilets in there 50 bedroom mansion

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>>126669529
no he said "stop being retarded"

>>126668962
>dedicating your life to something you just have "faith" is real
>being smart

pick one. It shouldn't be hard

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>>126669692
>doesn't realize you have faith in every single thing you believe in that you haven't tested your self

also
>>125637346

neck your self faggot

>>126669666
sure is nice to see you spreading the faith of love based entirely upon a book and man with no solid supporting evidence.

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>>126670109
>hasn't read rhe thread

also I don't lose anything by believing in God

>>126668023
>everything works according to God's plan
That doesn't change anything. If God has a plan, then your life is predetermined according to that plan, therefore you have no free will. You must follow his plan or it isn't a plan.

>>126669949
have you tested your god? You have a fundemental misunderstanding of what the word "faith" means.

>>126668084
Other than the parting oms the sea, all this does is confirm historical accuracy, not the accuracy regarding the supernatural.

>>126670684
The rules of the universe are predetermined, not what's happening into it

>>126668439
Elaborate.

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if you are able to gain religious views it's because you never actually lacked them in the first place.

people don't understand concepts like phenomenology or non-cognitivism and then decide to say fuck it and disregard them in favor of make-believe.

that being said, most self-ascribed atheists have no philosophical education whatsoever and hold moral realist/deductionist values.

>>126670394
>I don't lose anything by believing in God
You lose lifetime spamming your dumb video links on /pol/.

>>126669127
Just like not all Muslims are terrorists. The peaceful majority will just un-diddle those kids , right?

>>126670684
the best analogy i heard was

if you rewatch a movie you know what all the characters are going to do. But did you make rhem do it?

also in the bible does it even say God can see the future?

>>126670964
Noah's ark and Sodom couldn't have just happened normally. And scroll down in the thread

>>126669666
Only I'm correct and not retarded.

>>126671207

>>125637346

deal with it fag

>>126671556
no u r

>>126671544
Indeed, however I doubt they are proven to happen exactly as the bible describes.

>>126671055
>not what's happening into it
If this is not predetermined, then God cannot know in advance what will be happening in it, which means he is not all-knowing.

>if you rewatch a movie you know what all the characters are going to do. But did you make rhem do it?

really fucking dumb argument because god is the director and editor of the "movie", so he retains full control no matter what

>also in the bible does it even say God can see the future?

yes, thats the basis of prophecy in the bible you illiterate bitches

>>126671803
:^(

>>126671361
IF God created the universe, then he is not bound by time. It's not said in the bible but one of the vatican meetings made it teaching.

>>126637442
Stop being a Mexican.

>>126671845
>didn't watch the videos

>>126672131
Can't right now.

>videos

Come on...

>>126655849

No he's not. He believes in heaven, and God.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--Nbz6flw5A

>>126637442
"I believe in the theory of evolution, but I believe as well in the allegorical truth of creation theory. In other words, I believe that evolution, including the principle of natural selection, is one of the tools used by God to create mankind. Mankind is then a participant in the creation of the universe itself, so that we have a closed loop. I believe that there is a level on which science and religious metaphor are mutually compatible."

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>>126644534
nice bait dude

>>126671846
does itvsay he is all/knowing any where in the bible? im not saying it doesn't but I don't remeber it saying that.

also if someone says "I am all knowing on the atom" it doesn't mean they know future stuff just past and present

>>126671868
he can just make rhe prophecy happen

>>126671846
God IS everything and that's how he knows eveything. God has no will to control anything, he just is.

>>126671361
>But did you make rhem do it?
No, because I didn't create the movie. That's a bad analogy.
>in the bible does it even say God can see the future?
People usually assume that God is all-knowing, so he should know the future.

>>126644534
I'm a Christian but that's a blatant ad hominem

>>126637442
I'm a Carl Sagan sort of atheist. It'd be great if there's a God/all that jazz but we should appreciate what we know we have, too.

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>Sure, what can you possibly lose by believing in god?

Dignity.

>>126672446

>does itvsay he is all/knowing any where in the bible?

yes goddamn

>>126672588

that doesn't refute my point

>>126672605

>God IS everything and that's how he knows eveything. God has no will to control anything, he just is.


so all of those floods and plagues in the bible weren't based on punishment, they were just some shit that was going to happen anyway regardless of how people acted?

the metaphysical and religion threads here really expose how retarded and illiterate the average person on this board is. at least make an honest effort to read the most important fucking book in the western canon before bullshitting

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>>126672341

>>126672446
Hoping this will clear up some questions in this thread. Christians believe that their god is not bound by time since he created it, just like how he is not bound by physical dimensions.

Also I'm not sure if the bible says it, but the vatican (pope=succession of jesus, AKA voice of god) says that god is all knowing.

>>126672618
does ut say that though?

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this

>>126672334
Very well said

>>126672909
how?

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>>126644973
>>126650356

Christian conservatives are turning the world dark. They love black and mexican babies.

>>126673115
not understanding science isn't an excuse for a false belief. Educate yourself

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>>126658978
>>126658977
Nothing eventually turns back into something you dipshits. This will never end ever. Athiest are the weak ones thinking theres an escape into eternal nothingness

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>>126673121
>trusting the pope

>>126669017
>mistaking Goedels proof of God for the ontological proof
I would really like to see who write those rational wiki and wiki pages. It's like they have a 2 year phil course but then talk down to people who have constructed proofs from 8 year phil courses.
The grand irony is they are the shitting pigeons.
insufferable cunts
I'm not even a hard theist, but god fucking dammit do I absolutely hate atheists, they are the worst fucking people one earth.

>>126673358
>implying pic is wrong

>>126672446
>does itvsay he is all/knowing any where in the bible?
If he is not all-knowing, why call him God? You could also say that he wouldn't be all-powerful either. Being all-powerful means being able to know everything.

>>126673100
>so all of those floods and plagues in the bible weren't based on punishment, they were just some shit that was going to happen anyway regardless of how people acted?

Those are metaphorical stories, the Bible isn't about History

>>126673121
Don't mix up the Church and the Bible

>>126673878
>If he is not all-knowing, why call him God?
He knows more than any other thing

> Being all-powerful means being able to know everything.
no it doesn't

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>>126637442
You can believe what ever you want. Just don't judge me for not having one.

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>>126673268
You devote your life into obvious bullshit written by backward people, all for nothing but to make yourself feel safe. If you believe in what the bible says you automatically agree with the analogy that all the overwhelming ugliness and pain in this world are made by the god whom you choose to worship. All the illness and misfortune which humans are yet to suffer.
That is not the sign of having any individual dignity. Too sad the entire western culture is based on this ridiculous cowardice.

>>126673578
lmao thats funny af. I'm just as atheist as the next guy but 12 years of catholic education means I only really know how catholics think

>>126672605
>he knows eveything
If he knows everything, then he knows the future, which means my life is predetermined, which means I must follow my predetermined life, which means I have no free will.

>>126669017
"Most perfect Island" is a refutation I do not buy. The "most perfect uniform", neither. The unicorn is NOT a necessary being, and seems completely limited to being a horse.

If the unicorn had qualities like omniscience, omnipresence, and omnipotence, then I would say the unicorn works there, but all that really happens is the unicorn becomes God, and we have to worship it now.

>>126673634
Why are we bad? Is atheism irrational?

>>126674333
>You devote your life into obvious bullshit written by backward people,
WRONG

> If you believe in what the bible says you automatically agree with the analogy that all the overwhelming ugliness and pain in this world are made by the god whom you choose to worship
>Doesn't know what freewill is

Is there anyone who's really smart lurking this thread? I have a hypothetical question regarding thought.

>>126673115
>there was nothing
stopped reading there. it's a straw man.

>>126673358
Where does science and religion oppose themselves ? What science taught us is that there's a natural order in the universe, that the rules it's made by are really clever and that it might be beyond our comprehension.

>>126674746
What was there then? Something had to create the first bit of matter.

>>126637442
Stop not believing in gods? Wouldn't that be fake belief?

Yea nope. Still don't believe in gods or deities.

>>126674721
I'm not a genious but I've read some Hegel. I might be able to help.

>>126674885
alright, so if god made the universe, then who made god? Something had to create it

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>>126674678
Free will does not magically create moral evil, my childish friend. Don't they teach you basic human psychology in US schools?
For example, where does the urge for violence come from? Evolution explains this perfectly; humans need to kill to survive.
All the selfishness, jealousy and hatred cannot be made a god. They're all products of natural selection.
Well if god did create the capacity for all the ugly evil Man has, then he surely isn't a good person, is he.

>>126675029
Is it possible for the human subconscious to perform algorithmic functions?

>>126669369
No, you commit a crime whenever the benefit value of commission sufficiently outweighs the risk of being caught multiplied by the cost of being caught.

What else is there?

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>>126675312
Things only need creators when they have matter.
Things only need origin when they exist in time.
Things only need energy when they are bound by rules.
God is none of those.

Also that didn't answer the question you just asked another one

>>126673121
>not bound by time since he created it
How do you create time? Words have meaning. The word "create" makes only sense if you presuppose a concept of time, because the process of creation brings something into existence that hasn't exist before, and "before" doesn't make sense without time. So "creating time" is a meaningless combination of words.

>>126675442
>For example, where does the urge for violence come from? Evolution explains this perfectly; humans need to kill to survive.

Exactly. The reason humans have a sense of right and wrong is because it is hardwired in us to do what we belief is best for the continuation of the species.

>>126675535
Well shit. This is more psychology then philosophy. I know that the brain can ibsyantly recognise groups of three, and sometimes four. While needing to count onward, so maybe?

As it turns out I can't answer your question :(

>>126673884

jesus

even if that was true and the bible had 0 real historical basis, the mythological stories show a god that is VERY involved with the people of the earth

>>126675442
>Free will does not magically create moral evil
it allows it

>For example, where does the urge for violence come from? Evolution explains this perfectly; humans need to kill to survive.
maybe self defense but not murder

>>126674333
China substitutes religion with Communism. Not much better for individual freedoms if you ask me. They destroyed their ancient culture.

You want to know what China represents just ask the Tibetans and Uyghurs

>>126640500
1) group approval
2) lies that make you feal warm
.. thats about it, shall i start to list the million cons?

>>126674885
>What was there then?
That's like asking "what happened before time?" or "What number is blue?"

It's meaningless.

>>126675823
What about people not like that? are they wrong? But they believe it's right so why should they go by what you say?

>>126637442
Stop blowing up abortion clinics/concerts/stock markets you christcuck/mudslime/kike fucking faggot

>>126675785
the reason I didn't answer the question was to point out the fallacy of it. There are actually serveral different theories of how our universe began. Modern science is just too young to have explored all these theories

>>126676170
It's Trimurti. We can 't apply any logic to a state of being that as far as we know exists without time. Creation itself is paradoxical.

>>126673634
>mistaking Goedels proof of God for the ontological proof
What are you talking about. It is referred to as ontological proof in the academic literature.

>>126674427
Once again God IS everything.
He knows everything you will ever do because you are the way you are so you act in a way that suits yourself so your choices are determined by who you are but you still have to make those choices.

Prove the creator exists and i'll follow you like a brainwashed sheep.

M'LaDY

>>126675878
It's alright, I appreciate the gesture.

>>126676108
>China substitutes religion with Communism.
Not for long
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/10776023/China-on-course-to-become-worlds-most-Christian-nation-within-15-years.html

>>126676211
Sorry but I'm not understanding the question. Are you asking about people without a sense of right and wrong? Because everyone has a sense but that doesn't mean it will be the same.

>>126644534
dont say every atheist, you havnt debated me yet. i find the rest of your comment ironic because thats what i experience the majority of times i debate theists

>>126676140
>cons
ha

>>126640500
You don't do it because of how it benefits you. You live to serve God.

>>126676255
If the prevailing hypothesis about the Big Bang is correct, then we can't really test for what happened before. If it's cyclical instead of having one point of genesis, then we 'd still be lost as to why the cycle is in motion.

>>126676170
>That's like asking "what happened before time?" or "What number is blue?"
No it really isn't

>>126650909
Religion is about facing and preparing for death.

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>>126676396
>claiming to understand God

>>126676237
Only when you stop killing 80+ million people in only a few decades(if even that)

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guys...
>right before you kys, recite the echelon code and you will be unplugged and wake up in the omniverse

>>126676714
And you follow god because of either the consequences or because of it's spiritual benefits. Pure altruism doesn't actually exist.

>>126676734
there is no such thing as before time because time just references change within objects. so what happened before the first object moved? there answer is nothing. its not a meaningless question but the answer is simple. the real question is whether or not the objects in question popped into existence before the first movement or if that arrangement of objects was just the natural state of the universe.

>>126676540
>http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/china/10776023/China-on-course-to-become-worlds-most-Christian-nation-within-15-years.html
You can be the most religious country all you want but in China you have to be Atheist to hold political office. No representation. No peace.

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>>126676053
>it allows it
So what? The good people know what's the right thing to do, same goes with your god. Most humans are mentally flawed, however. People are born selfish and violent, because nature made them this way.
Nevermind, this conversation serves no purpose.
>>126676540
If that is true there sure isn't gonna be too much hope for Mankind.

>>126637442
stop being a theist, start putting facts over fantacy

>>126676542
Why is your sense of right and wrong correct but Bill's who has a different set is wrong?

>>126676375
>Trimurti
Stick to analytical philosophical terms, please, not mystical mush. We need to be able to agree on a conclusion if we accept the logic of its premises. Otherwise we have to agree to disagree and move along with our lives.

>>126677162
>objective morality
Abandon this

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>>126676550
you fell for it

>>126674123
>He knows more than any other thing
And yet he doesn't know everything. Can a being limited in knowledge be called God?
>no it doesn't
Solid argument, bro. Being all-powerful means being able to do anything, which means being able to answer any question, which means to know everything.

>>126675898
God is everything and you find God within yourself. So yeah, God is pretty often involved with the people on earth

>>126677265
It was autocorrect dude. I can't remember what I meam't to say but it wasn't complex

>>126675535
Of course. Why wouldn't it be able to ?

>>126656938
im sorry, you must be talking about science books

>>126676998
Yeah I'm saying how did the first bit of matter get here

>>126677106
I was saying freewill lets you do what ever you want

>>126677396
God is indeed within you, however people decided that externalising him was a good way to lend an air of objectivity to what is inherently personal and subjective.

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>>126676864
Not an atheist, you absolute faggot. Just pointing out why I don't blame them when religious people are such absolute faggots.
>don't bother responding with goyboy bullshit
>go obey your masters
>turn the other cheek
>and give 10% to the church

>>126676998
>there is no such thing as before time because time just references change within objects
Spacetime, dear boy. There is no such thing as time "before" spacetime. The concept of "before" the Big Bang is vacuous.

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>>126637442
I would but there's no goddamn Christian denomination worth joining


Catholics let their religious governing body get away with hurting kids

The Eastern Orthodoxy hate their own fucking members

The Protestants are so cucked by the Christian Memorabilia Industry that they never stop to think "Do I really need 100 tiny little figurines with the Cross embroidered onto them?"

The Evangelists have gotten to the point that they all desire megachurchs with a fucking Starbucks in it.

and the LDS area is way too far out of left field for me to accept.

And I'm not delusional to start my own Church, because at most, the lord has told me "Don't be a fucktard" and that's it.

>>126677309
no

>>126676728
There actually is research and several theories being done about the cause of the big bang. And before you say that they're just theories and aren't proven, neither is your god.

>>126637442
I saw God at a grocery store in Heaven yesterday. I told him how cool it was to meet him in person, but I didn’t want to be a douche and bother him and ask him for photos or anything.
He said, “Oh, like you’re doing now?”
I was taken aback, and all I could say was “Huh?” but he kept cutting me off and going “huh? huh? huh?” and closing his hand shut in front of my face. I walked away and continued with my shopping, and I heard him chuckle as I walked off. When I came to pay for my stuff up front I saw him trying to walk out the doors with like fifteen Milky Ways in his hands without paying.
The girl at the counter was very nice about it and professional, and was like “Sir, you need to pay for those first.” At first he kept pretending to be tired and not hear her, but eventually turned back around and brought them to the counter.
When she took one of the bars and started scanning it multiple times, he stopped her and told her to scan them each individually “to prevent any electrical infetterence,” and then turned around and winked at me. I don’t even think that’s a word. After she scanned each bar and put them in a bag and started to say the price, he kept interrupting her by yawning really loudly.

>>126677374
>And yet he doesn't know everything. Can a being limited in knowledge be called God?
knows more than you. Also gods from different religions didn't know every thing

>>126677769
>t. jew

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Does god like hot wings?
https://youtu.be/Da8-QfGemgo

>>126677824
Go baptist

>>126677687
that is not a question that can probably be answered for hundreds of years, possibly ever

anyone who tells you they know is just setting the problem back one step.

Why is matter here?

>an equation

why is an equation able to bring objects into existence? who created the equation?

>God

where did God come from? how can a complete mind simply exist?

there is no reason why any explanation for the universe could exist uncreated but the universe couldn't

>>126674885
>What was there then?
Being an atheist doesn't mean having an answer to that question. It just means not believing that "God did it" is the answer to that question.
>Something had to create the first bit of matter.
Why? Theists don't believe that God was created. Why are atheists required to believe that the universe was created?

>>126637442
I tried but I can't. I'm not saying it's a fact but I personally don't believe God exists. I never really argue about these stuff though and there's nothing really to argue about. We don't know if God exists and we will never know. It's funny how these threads always get a lot of replies, there's not much to argue about.

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>>126640500
Believing a worldview for utilitarian purposes is generally in poor practice and guarantees a shallow support of the view as it doesn't shape your values but rather you attempt to shape it to fit your own.


You follow a religion because you think it is true. A religion is an established way of life based on a metaphysical worldview. The goal, structure, and amount of detail, and defining elements are unique to individual religions besides this.


You're asking the wrong questions.

>>126638205
>/pol/ is one person

>>126648342
You are a minority

>>126678231
>Why? Theists don't believe that God was created. Why are atheists required to believe that the universe was created?
because it completely breaks physics

>>126678398
Also why would it choose to expand then? why not 40 billion years ago?

>>126674333
Spend 15 minutes in Beijing and see if you still feel this way. Meme applies to Japan though.

>>126678204
Ah yes, the "Don't Drink" protestant sect where every member drinks themselves piss drunk all week until Sunday Morning, only to realize "Shit, I have a hangover and need to get to Church in an hour", only to repeat the cycle again for the next week.

But don't worry, you don't need accountability because the J-man gives you a free pass.

>>126678538
then don't drink

>>126676396
>your choices are determined
Oxymoron. Words have meaning. If it is predetermined by forces outside of my control, then it wasn't my choice.

>>126676854
>claiming to understand God
Where did you see me write it ?

Everyone can understand God but noone can explain it.

>>126677162
So lets say my sense of right and wrong tells me that it is wrong to steal (harms the species), while Bill's doesn't.

Let's also say that me and Bill both live in a society where the majority of people feel that stealing is wrong (hurts the species as well as the whole society).

Since the majority of the society Bill and I are living in agree with my sense of right and wrong, I therefore am "correct" and Bill is not.

>>126637442
Why?

>>126678699
Fucking dead bidies doesn't hurt anyone us that okay?

>>126668520

Schopenhauer and Kant destroyed this argument a long time ago.

Faggot.

>>126678914
bodies* is*

>>126640500
The benefit of being on /pol/ in 2017?

A lot of suffering and anger/misery for the paucity of happenings and true redpills.

>>126675535
You do any shit enough, you start dreaming about it. Does that answer the question?

>>126678398
>because it completely breaks physics
That's just nonsense. Physics doesn't say anything about the origin of the universe. Physics starts at a point where the universe already exists in a dense and hot state.

>>126675620
When the benefits outweigh the negative consequences including being caught. Like when you defend yourself or fight a "just" war. In the hypothetical murder for money case you may think you have all the consequences formally modeled/articulated but you don't, try actually committing the murder and see if you feel the same way. That intuitive moral sense that would punish you models the problem in its entirety better than any logical justification you can come up with. It's evolved to suit this purpose, both the physical roots of it in our brains and the cultural parts including the surrounding mythology. Evolution adapts to reality, the evolved moral compass and mythology represents the nature of reality, the universal law of God.

>>126677824
>I'm not delusional to start my own Church, because at most, the lord has told me "Don't be a fucktard" and that's it.
Other faiths have started with less.

>>126666422
I think you can still have a moral code if you don't believe in god. We could all agree that there are things that we personally not enjoy. Being stabbed, stolen from,....etc. Without the belief in eternal punishment you could easily say that you won't do things that you wouldn't want done to you. That being said I consider myself a deist and my moral code has Christian roots. You don't need god to be good but it doesn't hurt

>>126679612
If physics didn't exist back then than how come God couldn't have been created?

>>126678674
>your choices are determined BY WHO YOU ARE
So no it's not predetermined by forces outside of your control

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>>126679655
>mfw this is true

>>126644534

>Implying someone can be this retarded

>>126678674
Not necessarily. It just means "choice" and "free will" may not mean what you think it means.

Consider Kane's definition of "free will" -- to act entirely according to reason. Sound ultimately predictable, doesn't it?

>>126680340
>implying you didn't fall for the b8

>>126679892
Checkmate, Atheists

>>126678914
wat

>>126676992
its not about doing good things >>126676714
hit the nail on the head your only purpose is to serve him

>>126680642
it doesn't hurt society at all so what's wrong with it then according to you?

>>126637442

Organized religion is a corral for the fearful and the willfully ignorant. It is the world's oldest spoon, feeding the mental babies afraid to think like independent, intelligent men. Does God exist? Maybe, I don't know. Maybe I will never know. But I do know that any religion that requires specific rules was put there, by other men, for the gains of the few at the cost of the many. God needs no command structure. And religious "leaders" are pompous to claim that he does.

Organized religion is the problem, not God.

>>126680405
Darn autocorrect. Not Kane, fucking Kant.

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>>126680505
Do you have a real answer or are you saying it is possible?

>>126680008
>your choices are determined BY WHO YOU ARE
... and who I am is predetermined by my creator, because he knows who I am and what choices I will make the moment he creates me. My whole life is predetermined in that moment and it is outside of my control because I don't control my creation.

>>126680880
Humans are animals, and just like all other animals there is a drive to protect and grow the species. Humans are a social species and when a member of the society is killed we are weakened. I'm not explaining it the best but there are tons of resources about human sociology if you want to know more

>>126681051
>Blushing
>Cross Cookies
Honest question, what's Christ-Chan's denomination?

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>>126640915
You get two more answers

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>>126681476
obviously KJV only fundamental baptist

>>126680505
>>126681051
If you're saying it's possible then atleast you're on the right path anon

>>126681470
but no one gets hurt. you said if it hurts society it's bad. shagging a dead girl doesn't hurt anyone.

>>126680880
Necrophilia does hurt society in two ways. First, it shocks the shit out of the dead guy's relatives (there's all sorts of unique laws dealing with the treatment of corpses.) Second, many societies have a belief that certain acts are "unclean" in and of themselves, and porking a cadaver is way up there.

>>126680405
>"free will" -- to act entirely according to reason
That doesn't seem to make sense. People with free will can act unreasonable.

>>126680880
Here's a better example:
Anon goes and buys a whole chicken at the grocery store. He takes it home and uses it as an onshore. Not bothering to clean it, he cooks and eats it.

Anon hasn't bother society at all. Or has he?

>>126682146
If you don't get caught no one gets hurt

Why is that societies view correct?

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>>126682146
Are you telling me that sticking my penis into a corpse where millions of viruses and bacteria are slowly reclaiming the body, festering and spewing forth, making the cavity highly infectious to even be within breathing proximity of it.... is a bad idea?

Oh and to compound the fact, if I happen to catch a brand new STD from humping a dead body, and proceed to have intercourse with a living one, I could be the patient zero for a entirely new STD?

>>126681180
WHAT you are is predetermined but you choose to be WHO you are

>>126682604
i wasn't implying eating the dead girl

>>126682758
Wear a condom. she could also be fresh

doubt thats even possible

>>126637442
not an argument

>>126637442
This mufucka is a joke
t. Reedie

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/co/ popping in to share some Beta Ray Bill

ignore the fact that he's a talking horse alien

>>126682366
Not so, says Kant. Someone acting unreasonable is acting under the influence of external causes. Free will is when you act entirely free of external causes, which means you act according to pure reason.

Being red pilled means accepting the truth no matter how difficult it is to swallow. Religion is a blue pill.

>>126683408
Am I allowed to Worship it?

>>126637442
Which invisible sky wizard should I worship, anon?

>>126683533
I'm confused, are you asking my permission

>>126683491
((((((((((truth))))))))))

>>126681051
I replied with a meme because your post didn't make sense. I said that physics doesn't describe the origin of the universe and you asked why then God couldn't have been created. No atheist claims that this would follow. At no point I claimed to disprove the existence of God. The point was the refute the straw man that atheists have to explain the origin of the universe.

>>126683533
No, or the hammer will deem him unworthy because Gorr was right.

>>126683491
But that's wrong.

True Catholicism is the ultimate red pill.

>>126683679
...maybe?

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>>126683752
well the physics was different then sccording to you so why couldn't God have been created?
And if it wasn't different then how did it get there.

seems like it was a miricle then anon

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>>126637442

big bang theory has gaping holes in it. Theres a number of things they cannot quantify about the CMB, and they arbitrarily fudged things like the universal constant to make the theory work. It'll soon go the way of flat earth theory once enough of the old academics die.

>>126681765
Possible is a lot. I choose not to believe if there is no evidence. In case of religion there is some good evidence that it is wrong.

>>126683491
Atheists who claim to know the truth while criticizing religions because they claim to know the truth.
Congratulation, you're just a hypocrite

>>126668439
Well said

>>126682972
Now you're just being silly. "What I am" and "who I am" have the same meaning.

>>126684105
Thomas Aquinas, chump:
The first and more manifest way is the argument from motion. It is certain, and evident to our senses, that in the world some things are in motion. Now whatever is in motion is put in motion by another, for nothing can be in motion except it is in potentiality to that towards which it is in motion; whereas a thing moves inasmuch as it is in act. For motion is nothing else than the reduction of something from potentiality to actuality. But nothing can be reduced from potentiality to actuality, except by something in a state of actuality. Thus that which is actually hot, as fire, makes wood, which is potentially hot, to be actually hot, and thereby moves and changes it. Now it is not possible that the same thing should be at once in actuality and potentiality in the same respect, but only in different respects. For what is actually hot cannot simultaneously be potentially hot; but it is simultaneously potentially cold. It is therefore impossible that in the same respect and in the same way a thing should be both mover and moved, i.e. that it should move itself. Therefore, whatever is in motion must be put in motion by another. If that by which it is put in motion be itself put in motion, then this also must needs be put in motion by another, and that by another again. But this cannot go on to infinity, because then there would be no first mover, and, consequently, no other mover; seeing that subsequent movers move only inasmuch as they are put in motion by the first mover; as the staff moves only because it is put in motion by the hand. Therefore it is necessary to arrive at a first mover, put in motion by no other; and this everyone understands to be God.

>>126683478
>you act entirely free of external causes, which means you act according to pure reason
Seems a silly to consider. No action is without external causes.

>>126637442
No, O.P.

It's we who have to stop them, or remove them.

>>126684437
>no evidence
>>125637346

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>>126685706

Your evidence is half baked at best, and the theories you adhere to are often incomplete and full of inconsistencies.

>>126685072
just post the pic in this >>126675785

>>126686013
Any more on big bang lies?

>>126684105
>why couldn't God have been created?
I already said that nobody claims that no God could have been created. If you have a consistent definition of God, which doesn't contradict physics, then you can put your God into the unknown. It is called God of the gaps. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_of_the_gaps
Here is what I think about such gods: >>126684437

>>126669666
>666
i'll go to church on sunday

>>126686358
I fill God in for creation of the universe and origin of life because those are explained in the bible and not very well in science. but for other stuff we don't know about than no

>>126685706
Stop spamming your nonsense videos. There are thousands of videos and internet sites that "prove" God, and it's always baloney. If you want to contribute, answer to the arguments that are posted in the thread. Right now you are just an annoyance and nobody likes you.

>>126637442
>Stop being an atheist.

Agreed. Atheism became obsolete the day God was memed into existence.

It's lusting after the stone age. Absolutely disgusting.

>>126686332
You'll believe anything as long as it's written in a conspiratorial voice, won't you?

>>126674620
It is if you actually spend more than 2 seconds thinking about it instead of trying to be cool like the cool YouTube guy Hitch.

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>>126669666

>>126686966
Yep, text book God of the gaps. The problem with that is that God has to give way when science fills some gaps. Maybe there will always be enough gaps for you version of God, but again, if there is no evidence, then I don't see a reason to believe in it.

>>126687006
>didn't watch the videos

also what arguements? I wasn't debating the freewill one anymore that's with the frenchie

>>126686332

The evershed effect casts serious doubt on the redshift theory. Its a verified occurrence but as of yet is unexplained, and can more then account for the redshift big bang proponents base their entire theory upon. The rates of expansion and direction also dont add up to the singularity theory. If you study the axis of evil a bit it'll explore this in more detail. Theres also some weird effects being presented between the two hemispheres, but it doesnt really relate to the big bang. Either way, BB theorists dont hold up to scrutiny.

>>126687139
You will believe anything as long as it's written a text book, won't you

>>126687782
Nope. Texas has fucked with too many textbooks.

>>126687561
>doesn't look at the thread I linked

for little shit that we don't know of then I don't believe it's just God for it.

>>126687627
won't watch the videos because you are a spammer. spammers are always wrong.
>also what arguements?
any argument brought forward on this board. you were just randomly spamming like a bot because you saw the key word "evidence" in one of my posts.

>>126688206
>>125637346

what if everyone on 4chan is a bot except you?

>>125637346

also you asked for evidence so I provided. Don't ask for evidence then not even look at the evidence.

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>>126637442

fuck off, I am an atheist prayer.

>>126687978
>for little shit that we don't know of then I don't believe it's just God for it.
Checkmate, Atheists

>>126673562

> what is entropy

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>>126688451

>>126689051
ERROR:unable to read:/Users/Desktop//Christianity/proof/fedorascantrefute.txt

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>>126689051
>>126689503
jk kill yourself faggot

don't go crying to God when you wake up in hell