>Not using an axe to chop wood

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>>970554
Hola Dumbo

>>970554
Maybe it's because I was born in the 60s but I never did understand this meme. Do people really try to chop wood with knives? I guess if you can believe Bruce Jenner is a woman then nothing is too dumb

Tästä on jo lanka vitun pelle :D

>>970571
no one on this board batons or argues for batonning, no one.

yet these turbo spergs feel the need to force memes so they can stroke their epeen about how fucking funny they are

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>>970596
I baton

>>970601
quit posting bait stallone

>>970554
>opinel in the picture
It's not even broken, i guess whoever took this pic thought he was funny and also a massive faggot for trying to baton with a folded knife.

I always got the feeling the reason that people keep mentionning batoning is because it's the easiest shit you can do outdoor instead of making a campfire or a shelter with natural ressources,
like that one guy that say he play video games and all he do is playing mobile games during transit or "i read books" but only look at the cover and the summary page.

>>970604
look at every baton vid posted
nothing but mid life crisis manchildren trying to immerse themselves in their hobbies through other midlife crisis manchildren on jewtube.
they just want to feel special, end up doing retarded things due to lack of knowledge and horribly sourced information

people here mention it here because they want to be super epic memesters, that's it.

>>970571
It's not a meme, it's a technique just like making a mooring hitch. Useful for many although maybe not exactly you if you don't sail.

Batoning is the same. If you don't have your axe but need to cut wood for example for fire or whatever, then you have two options: baton it with knife or live without the fire. Sometimes without fire is not an option.

If it's a survival situation you want to be extra careful about your knife. You need to know the batoning technique and find proper sized wood and be sensible about it. Also it helps if your knife is of good quality to begin with.

You can of course destroy any knife if you really want to, they are not indestructible. Shit-tier knifes take basically no effort at all to destroy.

Claiming "batonny[sic]ing is a meme" just illustrates how clueless and inexperienced that person is.

>>970618
dude you're a god damn moron, kys

no shit sometimes you need to break down wood, anyone with any common sense can do this without breaking the knife. no one needs to fucking train you in the proper technique you god damned faggot. fuck you, quit propagating this bullshit so we don't have multiple batoning threads shitting up the board more than necessary

i hate you

>>970579
ei toi patonkifägäri tajua sitä, kunhan vain paskapostaa jotain paskaveitsien hautuumaakuvia koko ajan...

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>>970620
I hit a spot didn't I Sir Mr. Batonny[sic] von Spellingbee!

>>970640
hit a spot? oh im sorry, did i use big mean words at you? fucking shitbird, kys my man

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>>970554
I'll just leave this here.

>>970647

Someone got triggered.

kys familam

>>970675
>Someone got triggered
yes, you did

>kys familam
no u

>>970668
But...he had a hatchet?

I still don't get the batoning meme. I get not wanting to carry a hatchet in your pack (even though they are often lightweight and made for this exact purpose), but why not just gather small sticks? There is no valid reason to slice small logs apart with a knife, just break-off/pick-up smaller wood to start with.

>>970693
>muh survival situation

>>970688
That's the joke. Are you German?

>>970694
You can't gather small wood in a survival situation? You need to dull and risk the integrity of your knife, something you definitely want in top shape for a survival situation? Do you also pound in tent stakes with your head and snare rabbits with your tampon string?

>>970637
Tän langan tekemisestä saa muuten bannit jormassa koska peppukipuinen patonkimode.

>>970697
the joke

your head

>not carrying a sledgehammer and a 5lb splitting wedge in your $900 hand crafted leather rucksack
*tips overpriced flannel shirt*

>>970697
You'd be fucked if you didn't have an axe, while driving a load of logs through a barren desert on a winters night and break down in the middle of no where. You'd freeze because you wouldn't know how to batonny chop chop.

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>>970704

>>970705
I hadn't considered this. I'm going to start practising my batoning. You may have just saved a life anon

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>>970618
>Batoning is the same.
'no'

Batoning is completely useless.

Fire, even in very wet conditions, is trivially easy to make with found material, and even in the absurd hypothetical in which the only source of dry combustibles in the center of a 3" branch, batoning is STILL useless as to baton such a branch requires a fucking saw, and with a saw you could quarter the branch in a fraction of the time it would take to batony choppy choppy it.

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>carrying more than one tool who can do every job

>>970739
Batoning requires a fucking saw now? Christ you're stupid.

>>970756
>foot-long rounds of wood naturally fall off trees
yes it requires a fucking saw you faggot, or were you planning to buck that 10' branch by bantony choppy choppy?

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>>970571
I'm with ya there, Gramps.

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>>970668
>Breaking blade while battonny with a
Wait
For
It
>with a hatchet.

This irony is delicious.

>>970761
snap off pieces using the crotch of a tree
have you ever made a fire in your life?

>>970781
If the pieces are so small that you can do that, you don't need to baton them further. they are already small enough.

>>970781
>snap 3" diameter branches by hand
if you can break them apart by hand, you don't need to bantony choppy choppy, now do you?

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>>970668
>I'm literally shaking now.

Lost my shit.
Scared my dog.
Spit soda on the keyboard.

>>970739
Why do you assume it is summer or at most some kind of rainy day and you can just find burnable sticks anywhere?

When it's winter for example in Northern Europe or Alaska or Canada, the trees can be frozen and they don't burn. You have to split them to get to drier material. If you got a hatchet/axe, use it, if not, you can use your knife.

Anyway. Since you brought up Paul Kirtney in one of your pictures, let's see what does Paul Kirtney say?

http://paulkirtley.co.uk/2015/northern-forest-fire-lighting-fundamentals/

And

http://paulkirtley.co.uk/2014/lighting-a-fire-with-feathersticks/

"Furthermore, as well as the fire platform and feathersticks, by applying the batoning technique with your knife, you can produce a range of fuel sizes, from small splints to finger-thickness and thumb-thickness fuel, right up to larger fuel – all from the same dead-standing timber."

> "batoning technique with your knife"

So try going out sometime you batonny[sic] spelling bee.

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>>970668
>-This shouldn't have happened!
>-It'll be okay, hun.

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>>970788
>>970739
I can start a fire with wet frozen wood without tools. I've done it on a number of occasions. All this "its for survival situations" it a load of numale bunkum.

>>970571
>>970772
It's meant to be done on small pieces of wood in emergency situations where an axe isn't available. If you're using it to split a large round of wood as your primary splitter you're doing it wrong.

>>970805
>emergency situations

Explain one of those situations please.

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>>970618
ooooooorrr, leave the commercial firewood behind, collect small wood with your hands and cut medium branches with your feet.

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>>970554

After years of knife enthusiasm and collecting, and using knives outdoors in the wild, I've had to by a meme ESEE knife to understand the batonny trend.

It's not because of what you may imagine.

It's to show wear and use on the knives.

Fudds like coated chisel-like knives for batonny because normal knife use does not wear out a knife, much less if it isnt coated.

They have to feel their tool has been used so they can imagine they have lived tons of adventures and been through a lot. That's literally it. That's why everyone demands 1/4 '' thick knives and that's why the market is filled with sharpened prybars marketed as survival and outdoors knives.

>>970813
all purpose knives were born in military

>>970834

Yes but the military knife branch is mainly a civilian market fueled by YT

Most soldiers dont care what they're given or make do, and most special squirrel soldiers always try to adapt as best as they can and use specialised gear when possible

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>>970668

>hitting steel with steel instead of using a small log
>the club being used is literally a tool designed for chopping wood

>>970806
You fall in through the ice and lose your backpack when getting out. You have your knife and BIC. You need fire, fast.

>>970668
I'm glad it broke, BG knives are crap, I'm surprised it did not break when he set it on the long before hitting it.

>>970668
anyone have link to the sauce?

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>>970867
BZZZZZZZZZZ WRONG

Error 1: walking on bad ice because you don't know how to read ice

No other errors need to be addressed, the first error is bad enough. Ergo, you put yourself into a retarded situation because your lack of knowledge.

http://www.wikihow.com/Know-When-Ice-is-Safe

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>>970878
>BG knives are crap

Very true, but it really isn't just the metal. It is how they are designed that makes them really bad. Take this one. See the rivet near the top of the handle? That is where the blade snaps. That's the area of the largest amount of stress and it happens to be the area that has the least amount of metal. When they break it will break on either side of the rivet. Why? Because this type of knife is intended to be used like a machete.

>>970904
it's a parang dude, you are using it wrong if you put strain on the handle. just let the blades momentum do the work and hold it lightly on impact.

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>>970904
Those were recalled for that very reason, fyi.

>>970908
Of course, but that is still the area of maximum stress on the blade. They were recalled for a reason.

>>970909
yeah a lot of them failed. i have a gerber machete same design mostly minimal amount of steel inside the handle. have it for like 3 years now occasionally use it. it's still in one piece. my only complaint about the gerber machete aside from the horrendous steel quality and bad construction is the "gator" handle it's fucking shit the machete is not supposed to stick to your skin whoever decided it was a good idea was a fucking moron who never worked in his life.

>>970904
>>970909
>>970911
>>970912
>tfw the company officially recalled it TWO TIMES

https://www.cpsc.gov/Recalls/2012/gerber-recalls-machetes-due-to-laceration-hazard

https://www.cpsc.gov/Recalls/2013/gerber-recalls-machetes-with-stitched-sheaths

>>970901
From the link: "Recognize that ice will never be completely safe" (even if you "read it").

So, your argument is that one should never go over ice?

Also, you can't "read ice" when there's a layer of snow over it, you don't see the ice. Unless you bring a broom and remove the snow.

Even when the ice looks just fine, you've ice fished there, everything is good, and then you start moving about to another place and the ice can cave in. It just is like that.

Falling in is a possibility always.

Look, this discussion is pointless. You obviously don't live in northern latitudes 60+ N (I do) and have never probably even been out in a winter when conditions are comparable to a rough winter in the northern latitudes.

>>970909

Is the blade just connected to the plastic handle at the grip? Or is it a full tang but the rivet hole creates a weak spot?

>>970693
Small sticks don't burn when they are frozen.

>>970918
gerber machetes generally have about an inch of a tang and even that is just two prongs.

>>970917
>So, your argument is that one should never go over ice?

Of course.

>You obviously don't...

kek Why you so angry?

>>970918
The rivet hole is the weak spot.

>>970919
Tell that to my rocket stove.

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>>970924

>>970790
I'm willing to bet real money that you have never ever started a fire in your life, let alone wet and frozen wood, without tools.

>>970930
i can light any wood on fire in a minute with my lighter. dripping wet or frozen doesn't matter. jet lighters don't give two fucks.

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>>970929
>>970924
>>970918

I have batoned wood hundreds of times, because

1) it's easy
2) tools required for it fit in my pocket

At home I even baton with an axe when I can't be bothered to aim. Anon who is butthurt because of people having fun on youtube needs to chill out

>>970930
>>970917
>le ad hominems

Sure thing, kid.

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>>970940
>admits to tool abuse
>admits he can't use an axe properly (because lazy)

So, you are so lazy that you can't use an axe but you batonny chop chop?

Uhhhh....

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>>970940
>At home I even baton with an axe when I can't be bothered to aim.

How do you hit the axe, with the baton, if you can't be bothered to aim?

>>970946
NO!

He said, "At home I even baton with an axe when I can't be bothered to aim." meaning he literally does this: >>970668

Batonning with the axe.

>>970927
> Tell that to my rocket stove.
Yeah, no. How do you start the fire in the rocket stove using frozen small sticks? Of course they will burn in a bigger fire or a working stove, but we were discussing starting the fire with frozen small sticks.

Dakota fire pit is not a great idea with permafrost. Digging the hole will be lot of work.

When I was armyfag we used small charges of TNT to make a starter hole for potholes. Once you got through the frozen layer it was OK.

OK, I'm done.

>>970949
No man, I hit the back of the axe with another piece of wood.

When I swing the axe the usual way sometimes I don't hit the piece down the middle so I get a small part and a big part. When I place an axehead where I want it to hit and smack it with another piece of wood I get nice equal parts.

You guys seriously never done this?

>>970959
>How do you start the fire in the rocket stove using frozen small sticks?

Tinder.

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>>970963
No. I do this instead.

>>970972
wow that's cool thanks bro

>>970979
Full vid.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5W6r5U7yBE

>>970834
Point proven

>>970867
>Carrying heavy steel battonny choppy across ice.
>Breaking through ice
Darwin tries so hard...

>>970919
>the inside of wood is warmer than the outside
jesus christ you're an idiot

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>>970991
This reminds me.

All these knife testing vids end up with the "best survival knife" being some massive hunk of metal. Which is getting to the range of a camp axe or hatchet anyway (14oz-24oz). Which defeats the purpose of all those "axes are heavy". Why not carry the axe plus a small knife? The combined weight would be less than the winners of all those baton tests. then you'd never need to baton.

Stop being so autistic and trying to force your shitty meme, shit you're almost making batoning look good compared to you now.

>>971004
Go out sometime and try it for yourself Mr. Butthurt

>>970991
Where would you have the blade then, if not carrying it - should it be hovering over you like some sort of sword of Damocles?

Is that your new meme? No knives along when going out? Can I take my skates when rolli g over lake ice or is it forbidden too by Mr. Spastowank von Spellingbee?

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>>971044
Seems we've angered a batonny chop chop babby bushkekker here, guise.

I can't help myself.

Baton thread = Shitposting time

>>971048
>Where would you have the blade

On the shore, with me and my backpack while watching you almost drown in the lake.

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>>971050
Welcome to /out/, bushkekker.

>>971052
You do realize that to get to all the small islands in this lake in the winter you have to cross the ice. Or take a helicopter. Since this is /out I prefer the former.

Maybe your idea of a good /out time is to stand on the shore. To each their own. No go back to Sobibor and batonnize yourself to sleep.

>>970939

Wow that looks like garbage, why such a flimsy tang on a striking tool?

I got bad vibes when I looked at the knife from this lineup, My shitty senses still work

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>>971061
>meanwhile

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>>971048
My knife in pocket or belt clip. What about your choppy chop iron? Is it on a lanyard around your neck, bruising your kneecaps with every step, or do you have a sherpa?

>>971061
>Delusionary island filled lake
>Delusionary bushkek skillz

>>971086
There exists axe belt clips in a plethora of stylish designs.

>>971086
It's not an either or deal. Right tool for the job deal. Look at the brightside. Kitchen knives alone outnumber all axes, and even cleavers. You're a winner, Beaver!

OKOKOKOK. Enough with the shitposts. Serious question here. Let's say i'm out in the bush and i got some logs aboot 3-4" in diameter. Then let's say i've managed to chop em into quarters. Now that they're not as thick, what's wrong with taking a knife with a 2-3mm thick spine and a much sharper edge than my axe and batoning the now much thinner pieces of wood to even thinner pieces. All these webms i see posted are assholes chopping through a 4" log with a shitty stick tang blade and no wonder they break.

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>>970668
>but mom
i know its fake, but my god if i didn't lose my shit at that

>>971111
Nice quads. There's nothing wrong with it. It's not a moral dilemma. It's common sense.

>>971111
>much sharper edge than my axe

There's part of the clue.

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>>971103
>Right tool for the job
Knife=cutting
Hatchet=Splitting wood
Your hypocrisy is bothersome, but I cannot stop. You make it so easy.

>>971147
I find your lack of reading comprehension disturbing.

>>971091
Butthurt again! Did I clip your wings Mr. Spellingbee?

Guess what, geography and nature are different in different parts of the world. This is a hard concept to grasp if you never go out or never travel.

Your absolute insistence on single tool single job makes it clear that you have no clue because you have no experience.

>>971111
That is the thing, there is nothing wrong with that.

You are completely right.

The idiot who thinks he can axe really thin sticks has never tried it. He is just being anal retentive and cannot think outside of the box. Both qualities contributing to a sad end of the story, were he to ever actually seriously go out.

>>971049
>we

No it's just you being autistic.

>>970935
Which model do you have? I'm interested in one that works well in subzero C temperatures. Do you use it upside down when it is very cold?

How long time does it take to light up frozen sticks with the jet lighter? How will the fire keep on burning, when the tree piece, being a tiny stick with a small radius, is impregnated with ice crystals?

>>970935
Tinder doesn't give two fucks either.

>>971015
what the fuck am i looking at

>>971438
An Elite Survivalist

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>>971297
>How long time does it take to light up frozen sticks with the jet lighter?
when i tried it with literally dripping wet the wood dried out in seconds and began to char and lit up. it being frozen probably adds a second or two.

>>971541
>>971344
Yeah, I literally don't see what the problem is, if you have a fire starter and some tinder. If you don't have that, batonning isn't going to help.

>>970554
chopping wood

>>970989
wtf, i love axes now

>>971541
well that's great until you don't have it

>>972997
see
>>972244

>>970809
I was thinking of this stupid picture the other night. I just realized it's fucking stupid and it's the usual ""infographic"" that spergs in 4chan use to push their idiotic memes.
I'm not syaing that a rocket stove is a meme, I've never used it but for what some anons are saying, it seems useful.
However, it still seems like an unessential applicance, and taking with you extra stuff for every aspect, eventually it all adds up and you end up with a huge backpack, and that rocket stove thing looks unwieldy as well; it's fucking huge.
Then there is the alternative: the Dakota hole. However, I know from experience that digging a hole in the ground is not an easy task, it takes a while and to have such a nice whole it'll take a spade, and then what happens to the tunnel between the two holes? If you're not careful it might just collapse on you. The Dakota hole seems inconvenient unless you have a lot of free time you want to spend digging holes.

It's hilarious, they make a campfire look like this thing where you need industrial technology and even chopping down trees. Anyone who has been out knows how easy it is to make a campfire and you end up with the added benefit of keeping yourself warm in the evening.

tl;dr that pic is stupid and it's just a way to make a meme out of the rocket stove

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>>973137
It is a troll image. You got trolled pretty hard. Rocket stoves are for LNT and places you can't have a normal campfire. Like all tools, there's a proper place to use them and proper methods of use. You may as well complain about dutch ovens for all it matters.

>>973137
>added benefit of keeping yourself warm in the evening.

You need to prepare for proper weather. Never rely solely on a fire to keep you warm. Always warm yourself before you warm your environment. Eat right and wear warm layered clothing. Anyone who has been winter camping knows this from experience, if they didn't have their father teach them.

Stop using shit knives

>>973221
All knives will eventually be destroyed by batonny chop chop. It is tool abuse, kid.

>>970554
What knives to baton:
Knives made out of spring steel and cheap steel.
Put my Skrama and AISI 420 chopping knife through hell without a problem.
You can baton (or break open a door) with a kukri for eternity but it will dull half the way through a piece of paper.

If you have a knife with a steel, grind (hollow) or a grade of hardening that optimizes it for cutting and slicing use it for that.
Axes normally also are softer with ~56HRC this doesn't apply to Gransförs memes of cause.

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>>970784
>>970783
>not tearing whole oaks apart by hand before reducing them to 1000 perfect chopsticks by hammering the back of your knife

>>971015
yeah I arrived at that conclusion after looking to Scandi + Finno Urgic people who live in fat forests and seeing that they often use a hatchet and a puukko. The one tool option is similar to why multi tools often suck from my experience- best to get dedicated ones that do their job well.

>>973282
but why bang on ur knife if you dont have to?

>>973235
that's not how steel fatigue works

>>973429
That's exactly how it works due to cyclic stresses. I told you before you don't know shit about metallurgy, bushkekker.

>>973437
>what is the fatigue limit

>>973479
Something you can't control while a batoning. you may hit the knife 1,000s of time then one day the wood is a bit harder or the grain is twisted or you are tired and it goes over the limit.

>>973482
So you go over once, and put a single loading cycle worth of fatigue on the knife. At that rate, it will be decades before a fatigue fracture happens. I don't know if you've noticed, but chisels and gouges do not regularly disintegrate on the job from fatigue. If you try to do something stupid, sure, they'll break, but that's not fatigue, that's strength.

>>973490
A knife isn't a chisel or a gouge.

Did you not read the posts you are replying to?

>If you try to do something stupid, sure, they'll break, but that's not fatigue, that's strength.

What do you think batoning with a knife is, kid?

>>973437
Now that you've learnt to google, look up the Wöhler curves for various steels, see how much kPa you can excert how many hundreds of thousands of times before a fatigue failure.

>>971541
Why don't you try it on some pencil-thick sticks which have been at -5C or colder continuously for a few months.

Report back with your findings pls.

>>970790
I can do that too, I just make feathersticks with my knife by batoning a bit thicker piece of wood to reach the dry unfrozen insides, then make feathersticks and so on.

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>>973833
I think the videos of bushkekkers breaking their "bad steel" knives while batonny chop chop is more than enough evidence.

>>973835
Why would he do that? You need to light the tinder first. It will dry out and light the kindling. Even if you sourced wet tinder from outside that lighter would dry it and light it.

>>973837
Don't you have tinder on you when you go into the outdoors when you intend to make a fire? Also, you can feather wet frozen sticks and light them up when you are using tinder like a normal person.

Wait, don't any of you know what "tinder" is and how to use it? Do you people even know how to start a fire?

>>973883
Yes, you can and should take tinder with you. Egg cartons with candle wax and egg carton mix, or the petroleum jelly cotton pads, you can even use litchen or birch bark or pine/spruce resin, acorns, mushrooms, whatever.

Frozen wet leaves, frozen tiny twigs or feathersticks of frozen wood won't work so well in my experience.

Feathersticks of dry unfrozen wood work fine, to get this you split the wood one way or the other. The center is usually dry for a wrist-thick piece and burns nice.

Generally thoroughly frozen wood sticks of kindling size won't burn without a bigger fire. Using them at the start of the fire just makes a lot of smoke but maybe my skills are shit and I did not say the magic word.

I'd use an axe for the rough work and knife to baton tinier sticks since it's more accurate with a knife. If the only thing I took was a knife, I'd use that and not attempt to baton thicker than wrist size.

Conversely, if the only thing I brought was an axe or I lose my knife, I could do feathersticks with an axe if it were small enough and sharp enough. I don't recommend this though since a knife is easier.

In my experience attempting to "dry" frozen wood while starting a fire is just theory speaking and not going to really dry the wood at all, but then again I'm a bushkekker with a good steel knife.

well i learned this old damp moldy stuff won't burn no matter what you do. And you need a lot of tiny very dry stuff to start.

>>974089
I couldn't imagine the horror of starting a fire in wet/snow forest.

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>>973998
Leave wet or dry are never a very good tinder. Most everything else is better than leaves. Feathersticks are the second worst option for tinder. I'm of course talking about sparking and lighting it directly. It is better to have the fine tinder in the center that takes the spark/flame with leaves or feather stick under./around it. I suppose you can call leaves and feathersticks a secondary tinder while tinder fungus, cotton, etc are the primary tinder. Which is how the wet secondary featherstick can be dried.

I've never once batoned with a knife in over 40 years of being an outdoorsmen and making 1,000s of fires in rain, snow, etc.

>>974089
>using wet rotted wood to start a fire

lol wut? Why is that even an option?

>>974095
I thought it might burn, it won't burn at all. I guess I learned something. I swear fires were easy as a kid.

>>974097
only super dry shit from now on. tehe

>>973429
>but why bang on ur knife if you dont have to?

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>>973835
>auto-ignition temp of wood is ~500K
>thinks wood at 260K instead of 280K is going to matter

>>974115
Lay off the google, you are too stupid to be good at this. You forgot to factor in the energy requirements of heating all that ice away. Ice is frozen water. It isn't just the temperature.

You can try to burn a paper bag filled with water and it will not burn until the water is gone.

>>974094
You're all right anon. Sorry if I called you names.

Anyway, IMO way easier to start with dry non-frozen wood from inside a piece of wood and grow the fire. Once the fire is big enough it will eat "anything"

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>>974123
What ice, candyass? You claimed you can't burn wood that's cold, not that you can't burn wood that's wet.

Not to mention that it's far easier to find dry wood in the snow than the wet, anyway, as snow doesn't permeate.

>>974139
What the fuck... All that moisture and water inside fresh wood will freeze at prolonged subzero temperatures. Finally the wood will be icy and cold and, when burning it, wet.

Except the very inside won't be frozen solid if the wood is thick enough.

What the fuck, did you think the wood will just be -5 C and stay absolutely dry, that's it, nothing else happens to it??

Have you seen forest fires in a Canadian/North European winter a lot?

>>970554
>Not using your knife to carve a wedge to split wood.

Even mountain gorillas can make tools.

>>974146
makes no difference trust me. anything that can dry out dripping wet wood and burn it will deal with ice just as fast. it's about 2600F

>>974279
to put it in a different perspective it can melt most common metals.

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>muh icy sticks!!!

Just use green fresh twigs off a tree. They will have less water in them than deadfall that has been rained on for days and frozen. Fresh live green wood is water proof from rain. It is the dead stuff that soaks up all the water. Otherwise, all the living trees would rot inside of a month. In winter they have less moisture since their sap has gone to the roots for protection.

>>974146
>Have you seen forest fires in a Canadian/North European winter a lot?

Pic.

There's more in non-winter months, but some still happen in winter.

>>974450
everyone knows you collect dead branches from standing trees for easy fire. on the ground it can be more wet, and living branches burn with a lot of smoke and hard to ignite (also an asshole thing to cut/break them down).

>>975491
We are talking about sticks that are already wet from rain then frozen. Like 100% soggy dead sticks, regardless of their location. Please, try to keep up.

>>975496
yeah that can happen sometimes but dead branches on trees are usually dry even when everything else is damp.

>>975716
That's true, but the batonny chop chop advocate is making up the scenario here.

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>>971101
I offer no objections to the proper use of an axe or hatchet. The point of debate is the mindless justification of obsessive hammering of knives through logs in the name of choppy choppy.

>>974146
holy shit you're a retard

the moisture content doesn't change when it gets cold, you stupid fucking candyass

>bought expensive "army" knife
>tried chopping wood by batting it
>actually works
Just buy something that isn't made of stainless steel and you will be able to cut wood alright.

>>977695
Or, use a proper axe. Is your knife full tang?

>>971049
Hey, that's Giddy from /arg/!

>>971049
Indeed we have. LOL! XD XD XD

>>970927
"kek why you so angry?"
didn't seem angry to me, it just seemed like he was telling someone who doesn't know anything about the topic their pretending to know about to stfu

>>975960
The sap drops in the winter. Anybody who's cut firewood with a chainsaw knows this.

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People get way too concerned about others fucking their knives. In normal boreal forest, axe is technically ideal for most purposes you need it for, but if someone wants to be tacticool wood ninja, just let them be. At least people go out and fuck around with some rotten twigs with their pseudo swords, so it's all for good health.

>>979790
1: If you allow people to do things incorrectly and simply look the other way, you and your loved ones can be seriously harmed by their actions.

Example: your child loses an eye from a chip shooting out of a knife blade when it was struck by a baton; because he was with a friend who watched too many youtube vids on elite survivalists

2: If something degenerate gains public praise, you yourself may be forced to go along with it when you are outnumbered.

Example: your child loses an eye from a chip shooting out of a knife blade when it was struck by a baton; because he's in the Boy Scouts and they now teach batoning as the correct method for chopping wood.

>but he has another spare eye

Only until the next camping trip.

>>979790
Also to elaborate. It's funny to think that in "survival situation" you might "have to" do baton chop chop meme maneuvers, nobody stopped to think for a moment and realize that it's absolutely ludicrous to hazard your primary tool to survive by using it a way it was never designed to be used as? You can have the sturdiest baton 2000 knife on you and if it's still on some level a knife in a form it's supposed to be.... It's not gonna last long if you beat it with a log especially when it's stuck in another log.

it's weird to think someone is surprised their tools break when used incorrectly. It's not physically possible to make a proper functional knife that can take power strikes from a hammer.

>>979808
I think it's more like someone is fucking their car exhaustion pipe or ball fondling a hatchet handle. it doesn't harm anyone really, it's only idiots losing money and you have to go into really specific super unlikely situation to matter in any way and you know it faggot.

I'm already outnumbered by manic depressive trans gender tolerating special snowflakes, few more in outdoors community doesn't phase me anymore. It doesn't help beating sense into people if they can't figure out basic things themselves (flawed argument, spare me).

But if hitting your knife with a log makes someones dick hard, who are you or me to judge them for doing it? It's not like outdoor as a hobby is productive to anyone in any way.

>>979823
You sounds a lot like the crew boss who told everyone that we didn't need the bucking spikes on our chainsaws and that we should take them off. He said, "I've never had a saw buck on me so there shouldn't be any problems."

>>979831
Uh, ok? Now that you mention it, I haven't really seen any bucking spikes in any chainsaws in use here. I suppose they are for safety, but yeah. Being a crew boss on people who are supposed to take safety precautions is completely different thing. I consider axe as a must outdoor item for splitting wood, but it's in no way safer than fuck around with hand knife. Like powertools are a lot more dangerous than traditional tools because they can chop your arm off in nanosecond comparing to sticking your knife blade into artery.

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>>971015

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Got this kit shipping to me right now, if the mesh is a pocket i plan to put my tinderkit in it and make it a general campkit

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>tfw you own a stove.

>>979845
>I haven't really seen any bucking spikes in any chainsaws in use here. I suppose they are for safety

You suppose? They keep the chainsaw from eating your face or shoulder if it bucks really bad. Though, your face guard might help you a little.

Use a bread knife. They're surprisingly versatile. Me and a few mates survived a whole camping trip with one as our only knife.

>>980784
I don't even take a knife camping with me. There's literally no need for one. You don't even need to make a fire.

>>980788
This

You literally don't need to do anything, just lie down and let the elements take care of you

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>>980882
1: Bring food you don't need to cook.
2: Wear clothing that is appropriate for your climate for extended outings.

People tend to completely fail that latter one which is why they build a fire, they are cold and/or wet. The only time you should need a fire is if you are hunting and plan to eat what you hunt and you don't have a easily portable solar cooker and/or no sun to use.

>>980889
>1: Bring food you don't need to cook.
Easier said than done for extended trips, ready made meals take more space and spoils real quick. I also need to be able to cook the fish I forage
>2: Wear clothing that is appropriate for your climate for extended outings.
D'uh

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>>971289
>The idiot who thinks he can axe really thin sticks has never tried it.

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>>980905
>ready made meals take more space and spoils real quick

Dried food lasts for years and only need a container/bag of some sort to hold them.

>>980919
>using a tool incorrectly results in personal injury

That's what this entire thread is about. View: >>970972 for a proper axe kindling technique.

>>971111
What is feathering
What is tinder, kindling, firewood

>>980926
I bring pemmican. Still need to cook my catch though

>>980930
>>980905
>The only time you should need a fire is if you are hunting and plan to eat what you hunt

>>980947
Where did I imply that? Retard

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>>981068
see
>>980889

>doesn't know about ready to eat, shelf stable foods
>doesn't read all of a post which completely negates the need to post what he posted

>>970571
Why do you fuckers always have to make everything political? We get it, you're retarded. Keep your retardation to yourself.

>>970790
Nah, you've never done that, son. Go back under your bridge where you belong.

>>982339
That's pretty easy actually.

>>982334
Fuck off reddit this board is pro trump

Been processing logs with a buck knife for 10 years.

It's still sharp.

Perhaps this isn't a tool issue, but more of an issue regarding middle school physics.

>>982419
However you feel about the guy personally, he's patently anti-/out/.

>>982440
>he thinks /out/ is for enviromental extremists


Laughinggirls.jpeg

>>982439
>pretending ten years of use and the knife is still sharp without needing to sharpen it

Fucking liar. You'd have to use it 1 time a year to keep it from dulling in that amount of time.

>>970596
I baton and I don't care about breaking my knives because I'm not a poorfag. These faggots should burn

>>982514
If you chop wood at the correct angle it sharpens your knife for you, you dirty city person.

>>970901
as a child we used to play on frozen rivers. i can't even cont how many times i got wet.
i don't remember a single occurrence when when we had to make fire tho. i don't know how but the clothes just dried on us.

>>980889
>People tend to completely fail that latter one which is why they build a fire, they are cold and/or wet.
no i build fire because it's fucking cozy man.

>>980926
that pic looks fucking awesome.
i'm drooling now.

>>982887
they won't last long. they're a touch too fatty and they'll go rancid in a matter of days.

until then though they look freaking d'lishes

>>982550
>If you chop wood at the correct angle it sharpens your knife

Someone took away your man card didn't they?

>>982894
That would take two weeks in open air. If they are in an air tight container it will be much slower, about a month. The properly lean stuff will last indefinitely.

>>982886
Being out is cozy enough.

>>970554
Why not use a knife to sharpen a peg or to carve a wedge and then use those to split wood? They can use the same wood they were going to beat their knife with to beat another piece of wood.

>>983196
could you provide a video example of this? I've never thought of using wood pegs or wedges to split wood, I'm kinda skeptical.

>>983210
https://www.google.com/search?q=wood+wedge+split+wood&tbm=vid

>>983210
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijpECbdCYQE

where is the original batonny chop chop guy from that thread?
show yourself

>>983232
takes a while to make a hardwood wedge with a knife alone. and if you fire harden it and grind it sharp on a stone it's even better. takes at least a day tho to make it proper.

>>970554
am i the only one who does this but with a big floppy machete so it doesnt break?

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>>983323
>a day

You mean 2 hours at the longest with a sharp knife and lazy disposition.

>>983330
Only if the machete has rather ductile steel in comparison to other machete and knives. Otherwise, the results can be the same.

>>983210
https://youtu.be/U7AxOHzBNck

>>970618
>a survival situation

Why everybody seems to been obsessed with "survival situations"?

>>983360
>You mean 2 hours at the longest with a sharp knife and lazy disposition.
not from hard wood you have to cut to size with the knife no. hell i would probably rather use fire to make it than a knife.

>>983640
They read Hatchet as a kid and think there's a high chance their Cessna will crash while flying over the Yukon.

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>>983691
I've done it on several occasions. If you can't do that within 2 hours you need to go home and sharpen your knife.

>>983640
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4341126/Woman-survives-5-days-desert-near-Grand-Canyon.html
http://www.citizen-times.com/story/news/local/2017/01/14/lost-hiker-says-hes-happy-alive-tell-tale/96542778/
http://www.wfsb.com/story/35021176/police-body-of-missing-hiker-found-wednesday
http://abcnews.go.com/US/60-year-hiker-rescued-surviving-24-hours-snowy/story?id=44469287
http://katu.com/news/local/crews-searching-for-lost-hiker-above-horsetail-falls
http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/Hiker-lost-since-Thursday-found-alive-near-10995217.php

As you can see the American wilderness is an extremely harsh place. Sometimes you can drive upwards of 30 minutes between 2 McDonald's.

>>983728
>"Amber VanHecke, 24, set off in her Ford Edge on March 10 near the Canyon's South Rim in Arizona. After following her GPS down a road which didn't exist, she ran out of gas and became stranded on March 12."

>"The incredible survival story of woman who ran out of gas near the Grand Canyon and used her wits to stay alive while she was stranded for FIVE DAYS"

Iesu Kristi
>muh strong independynt womyn

>>983728
>I've done it on several occasions.
what diameter and what wood are we talking about here?

>>984076
3.5"-4"

>>984079
try it on 5" hardwood without a saw to cut it to size once. there is no way you can do it in 2 hours.

i guess you can always make small wedges i hadn't thought about that.

>>985313
My splitting maul isn't even 5 inches wide. 3.5-4" is just fine. 5" wide will just cause problems when you are using it that are not present when using a smaller wedge.

But, yeah that extra inch of diameter will cut it damn close to make one under 2 hours without batonning and only using a knife.

Keep in mind that you must have a way to sharpen your knife as you do this or you'll run into problems. Like 1/5-1/4 of your time as a woodcarver is spent sharping the tools as you work. Especially if it is a hardwood.

>>985319
hmm i guess i really don't keen a wedge that big especially for starters or in the quick.

i still think i would rather use fire and stones rather than the knife for the heavy lifting if i can. but that would take a while.

>>982522
If you aren't a poorfag why can't you afford an axe?

>>982887

IKR? I'd be so tempted to eat that ALL in one sitting.

>>985523
I only use an axe for such thing, but carving with a knife is that simple. With an axe, making a wedge is a 10min job at most and only if you having a conversation with someone and need to stop and gesticulate.

>>983728
http://siberiantimes.com/other/others/news/four-year-old-miracle-girl-found-alive-after-11-days-in-siberian-taiga-thanks-to-her-puppy/

Don't forget this cute loli senpai.

>>985552
if you have an axe why make a wedge? now i'm confused.

>>985566
>-thanks-to-her-puppy

Did she eat it or something?

>>985588
We were talking about how easy it is to make a wedge even if you only have an axe.

>>985631
nigger if you have an axe you won't need a wedge to split wood. this makes absolutely no sense. on the other hand if you have a knife you can make a wedge to split wood with only you lose several hours and tons of energy compared to just batoning your knife but sure long term it's safer.

>>985920
>>985920
>even if you only have an knife.

fixed

Clerical error. Sorry for your spaz out. lol

However, using a wedge with an axe is a thing for splitting lots of rounds of wood.

>several hours

Not even 2 hours and you don't need a big knife. You can use a small folding pocket knife to make a wedge. It is just whittling/woodcarving. How are you so inept? "He's a batonner" oh right.

>>985935
i'm gonna try this shit but from my experience with 4" locust-tree that i tried to chop up with a hatchet it sounds like you are making shit up. these fucking hard woods are very hard to cut down or work even with an axe.

>>985935
>You can use a small folding pocket knife to make a wedge. It is just whittling/woodcarving.
yeah sure after someone cut the tree for you to size you can fuck around with your pocket knife why not.

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>>985993
>>985992
Didn't your father teach you how to use a knife?

What the fuck is wrong with you millennials? You better be millennials too otherwise, you need your man card revoked. Millennials were never issued man cards.

>>985997
sure sure you can cut down trees with pocket knife. i get it. it only takes a day not a big worry when you need firewood. ok.

>>986004
here this guy (maybe not the best axeman on the world) uses a hatchet to cut down a locus tree and almost puking his guts out. you wouldn't even debark a side with a pocket knife in that time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIBB7wIk3OA

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>>986006
>>986004
>have actually cut a wedge from a locus tree using a knife to make a 3" wide wedge without batonning the knife

Took like 45 mins. Learn how to use a knife and keep it sharp.

The trick isn't to chop at it. The trick is to use a narrow blade that you can shave off pieces in a scouping motion. If the tree is recently dead and dry then holy fucking hell it will take fucking forever. If the tree is still green it won't take a fraction of that time to fell.

>video
>out of shape guy
>terrible Fiskars camp axe
>incorrect site prepping, incorrect chopping form, incorrect grip
>pushed tree over onto his camera

Where is this kid's handler?

>all those recommended vids or people using tiny short axes with hollow plastic handles chopping trees down

I fucking hate youtube.

>>985997
MAaaaan
Shut the fuck up. I'll find you, rape you, rape your dog, film it, edit it into a dubstep compilation, then post it on pornhub under the title "spongebob FINNALY had enough".

>>986034
>The trick isn't to chop at it. The trick is to use a narrow blade that you can shave off pieces in a scouping motion.
so like a beaver huh?

>>986044
Pretty much.

PROTIP: shape the bottom of the wedge first as you are felling/cutting the tree/limb off. The top of the wedge doesn't need to look pretty since you'll be bashing it flat anyway.

>>986041
>t. millennial

>>970554

Batoning is fine.

An axe will weigh a lot more than a decent size knife. If you're going to be dealing with harsh cold weather then yes, get an axe. If you're going out for a few days and it isn't going to snow then a knife will do you just fine.

>>986077
>improper use of tools
>fine
pick one

>>986057
>shape the bottom of the wedge first
that's what i though to save time with, i will try it out this spring but i don't yet have a sharpening stone which sounds like something i should have for this.

i want to know if my backup folder is up for wedge making.

>>970901
BZZZZZZZZZZ WRONG
>Going outside ever

>>970972
Ray Mears never fails to brighten my day.

Truly a man's man. A human's human.

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what basic gear will I need to process small game and fish I kill? Also are fishing sinkers good slingshot ammunition? Thanks

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>>986233
>i don't yet have a sharpening stone which sounds like something i should have for this.

If you have your knife on you, you should also have a sharpening stone or at the very least some sandpaper. Woodcarving is extremely hard on blades and you need to keep them sharp the entire time. A dull blade is a dangerous blade.

You will also need to learn general woodcarving techniques. If you don't know those, you'll have a bear of a time doing pretty much anything like this. The biggest mistake beginners make is to try removing too much wood with each carve. Instead, you carve small shallow chips. The harder the wood the smaller the chips.

Remember whittling technique videos are a little bit different from woodcarving techniques because people who whittle may not know proper woodcarving techniques. Take the guy in this webm. This is the wrong technique. The strokes are too long and too much wood is being removed at once. There's too much room for mistakes both with the work piece and safety.

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>>986652
Here's some examples of proper techniques, though this person is using a proper woodcarving tool which helps a lot. Most knives you see survivalists and bushcrafters use are too big for proper woodcarving techniques. Which is all kinds of ironic.

>>986109

>improper use

According to who?

>>986655
Anyone who had a proper father to teach them how to use tools correctly.

>>970668
Those subs are so fake.

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>>987795
Thanks captain obvious

>>985527
cant afford to carry a fuckin 10 lb axe everywhere

>>987841
I know its obvious but its so obvious that it annoys me.

>>970904
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9y71IQ34b40

These videos are so funny

>>987855
try a 1lb hatchet then

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>>987855
>>987938
Funny thing. Those big thick survival knives used for batonning are actually heavier than the small plastic handled camp knives.

>>987859
I really think that is the point.

if you dont buy a shit knife it's not a problem to baton with it.

>>988841
i have batoned no-name kitchen knives with no problems and seen $300 knives broken in half from the same abuse. you never know if it will handle it until it doesn't.

>>980724
that all looks like shit m8

I guess you had to learn the hard way

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I got this Fiskars hatchet like 5 years ago. I keep it by the stove to split kindling mostly but Ive pretty much beat it to hell for the past three years. Ive taken it backpacking, used it in a bathroom remodel, and I often will knock a half round in to smaller bits with it. When I had a rocket mass heater it saw tons of use.

Pretty impressed honestly. Its held up remarkably well. I expected the plastic to be done years ago but its in fine shape. If I took a bastard file to it it would be just like new. I should slap it on my work pack again for fun.

>>970571

Batoning has been around since before you were born. The Book of Camp-Lore and Woodcraft written in 1920, talked about batoning wood. So it's nothing new, just autistic people these days get upset when people dont do things their way.

>>989529
that's perfectly fine for a car kit. it will do the job in a pinch. they are not exactly crap tools actually designed for daily gardening use.

>>970571
Thanks for the support, dad.

>>989529
>>989604
Taking it out in the bottom of my backpack for 7day+ trips

Fite me

>>989664
like i said they are fine, a bit expensive for what they can do imo, but fine. and i don't like the big knob on the side of fiskars saws.

Anyone got a link to that vid where some older guy is teaching a bushcraft class to younger dudes, and splits a log with a wooden wedge he carved?

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>>989533
>some old book

Books are like blogs before the internet existed, with the same amount of retardation, senpai.

>>990877
It's been a long time since I've seen something like that pic. My grandpa was a hardcore backwoods Appalachia preacher and every Christmas he and my grandmother gave all the grandkids books like that. Thank holy Kek that my dad and his siblings got out of that town as fast as they could.

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>>990877
>turns out there were retards doing retarded things in every fucking century ever

I highly recommend reading, "Stupid Ancient History (Stupid History)" by Leland Gregory

I wonder what our blogs and 4chan threads will be like when filtered through a few 100 years of history.

>>986593
A sharp knife is all you need for gutting small game and fish. Some small game (rabbits and birds) you don't even need a knife.

Fishing sinkers make fine slingshot ammo, but you can get 6mm BB's for much cheaper.

>>970813
I really like that blade

Link? Or custom? Google search doesn't bring anything back but viagra