Pemmican

>>622693
Just get some cliff bars you raging faggot.

>>622697
Fuck you nigger. I'm not spending fucking over $100 and taking up a bunch of weight in my bag for some nut and granola bars. I want meat and fat. and for around $50 to make 8 pounds of this stuff, it makes it a very viable solution.

>>622697
>Just get some cliff bars
*tips Starbucks latte*

>>622706
>$50 to make 8 pounds
>$6.25 a pound
>320 calories per dollar
>very viable
That's not any better than most energy bars, especially when purchased in bulk.

>>622693
>it will make the meat unsuitable


Wat?

>>622718
Energy bars are just sugar , you should never eat them.

>>622718
That's twice as much as cliff bars, going at calories and costing about $2.99. And it's actual meat and fat so a lot of good protein and calories.
>>622721
>Wat?
Yeah I'm not sure if it's just his preference or if there is a real reason for it. He definitely doesn't mean it will increase the chance of spoilage, but if he's learned it tastes much better at a lower temp that's one thing. I'm not going for the tastiest product, just something to scarf down and keep me going during the day.

>>622722
>Energy bars are just sugar , you should never eat them
I wouldn't go quite that far, but there is a ton of excess sugar and unnecessary shit in them.

>>622731
180 Calories a bar*

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Has anyone tried pic related? I can get a case of 12 for less than $24. 400 Calories and 18 grams protein for each 4oz bar.

>>622697

How's that camper doing for you? Watching your nice satellite television stations from the comfort of a couch whilst parked into a campground? Making some mores over a fire you made in the designated zone? Really roughing it!

>>622746
If you like them go for them. I saw those trying to scavange whatever information I could get and decided against it, still because of the cost.

>>622718
I decided to go back over that math for this, this still comes comes out to 480 cal/$ by this guide that says 3000 calories a pound. It would be reasonable to assume that perhaps it falls somewhere in the range of 320-480 cal/$

This still comes out cheaper than $2 for a 400 calorie bar or 200 cal/$

>>622756
>>622746
And also no meat at all, but whatever suits your tastes/budget.

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>>622693
>>622746
I've tried pic related.

>>622706
This is a bit expensive for poorfags, though. I recommend hunting the meat yourself and most butchers give fat away for a very low price.

I use pemmican for me and my dogs when /out/ and try to hunt the next trips' meat (and fat if possible) when /out/ing. saves a lot of money in the long run since my dogs hoover the stuff up faster than ninjas.

I have never dried mine, just use the fat to keep it together, but I live in cold country so nothing goes rancid. But it would be a good idea for me to try it to save some weight on liquids. will try this next time.

Chili works very well, along with most asian spices. Just don't give chili pemmican to dogs, as this will result in diarea disaster.

>>622693
Just leave the oven door partially open and get an oven thermometer, shouldn't be too hard to get the temperature down and that will improve your airflow

>>622961
Well, how was it?

>for men and dogs
love it
where can i buy?

>>625028
Thank you anon. I just finished getting the meat dry and I got 5 and a half pounds of fat for free from the butcher. Gave me about 1lb 7 ounces of rendered fat.

Hunting isn't an option though since it's almost impossible to bag a deer where I'm at. Tags are only $30 for residents, but I'd have to take a 4-5 hour trip up north to find a decent hunting area, and that's assuming I get tags from the lottery. Much more worth it in my position to just get free fat and lean meat.

I'll definitely try adding some peppers in it next time I make a batch.

>>625154
>Well, how was it?

That's some art project, it's not a real product.

>>622693
I just made some yesterday. It was kind of bitch, trimming all the fat off the meat, trimming all the meat off the fat, drying, rendering, and unbeknownst to me, you have to wait a while for the meat to soak up the tallow so it's not greasy as fuck.

My oven also doesn't go below 170, but supposedly it's a nutrient issue, not a flavor issue. I haven't eaten any yet, but the beef chips (after drying before blending) tasted pretty decent. I don't know if I can handle six straight months of it yet (PCT), but at 6.6 cal/gram, I don't want to have to carry anything anything else.

Also, fuck the naysayers.

>>625791
Oh yeah... and its pretty cheap if you use heart instead of steak cuts. You shouldn't be able taste the difference, I can't.

1 lb suet @ .51/lb and 2 lb heart @ 1.68/lb makes 1 lb pemmican @ 2.19/lb (winco prices, because my city doesn't have any real butchers).

>>622722
Your moms pussy is all sugar and I eat it all the time.

>>625794
And now look at your teeth. Is that pussy really worth it, anon?

>>625792
>and its pretty cheap if you use heart instead of steak cuts
This.
The heart is just another muscle, both in texture and flavour, and a lot cheaper than the rest.
Most organs tend to go bad quickly though. How long does your pemmican keep?

>>625800
First time making it, yesterday, so no idea. But leaner meats make for better preserved jerky, and heart is as lean as beef gets, so it should hold longer than usual, or rather it will when I get the tallow right. I dry rendered and it came out pretty soft, I'm trying wet rendering next.

Another thing to consider is that it's supposed to be made by pouring very hot (sterilized) tallow over the meat in leather, sealing the meat in and preventing both air and light which both contribute to fat decay, which can't be done in Ziploc bags. So any plastic-contained pemmican won't hold as long as hide-contained pemmican.

>>625812
> leaner meats make for better preserved jerky, and heart is as lean as beef gets.
Yeah, but liver and kidneys are lean too and they go bad quick. It's an organ thing. But like I said, no idea about heart. Never kept a heart around long enough for it to go bad. Research is needed.

Will try the hot tallow thing though. Never used proper hot tallow for pemmican before. This is also how you make pottet meat, so as a preservation method it has been tested and approved. You are basically preserving those hearts by technique alone. Nice work.

>>625830
I can't be sure of this, but heart cuts (as opposed to whole heart) may not really be an "organ meat". Liver and kidneys both process toxins, right? The heart is just muscle.

I do want to make sure I get it right, I'm going to be on trail for six months, so I need it to last as long as possible.

>>625839
>I'm going to be on trail for six months, so I need it to last as long as possible.
If you're going to be out that long I recommend testing the pemmican before you leave if you have the time. Put it out in various temperatures, humidities and store in different containers. Study the different developments.

Six months is impressive. When are you leaving, and where are you going?

>>625848
Northbound PCT. I'm not leaving until spring, and will be going on a pemmican only diet for two weeks prior to leaving, to "acclimate". I'll take your advice, and test storage methods.

So I just tried it for the first time, fried and raw... It's tolerable, but not great, either way. A lot of that may be that I had to dry it at 170, and that I didn't completely powder it so it was a little crunchy and tasted slightly burnt, but I noticed the slightly burnt flavor in the heart steak, too. I'm definitely going to try a cool-dry method and powdering it next, in addition to wet rendering the tallow to see if that makes it stiffer (its still pretty soft and greasy). That said, I'll still probably eat the rest anyway. It's not so bad that I want to throw it out.

I though pemmican was powdered jerky mixed with tallow 50/50 and then add dried berries?

I bought a bunch of pemmican sticks from U.S. Wellness. It's not exactly cheap but it's grass fed and I'm weird so I think cows shouldn't eat too much corn.

The only thing is, it's so fucking greasy, like they come in little tubes, they're an outer casing and then an inner inedible casing, but even when I hold onto the outer casing it's really hard to avoid getting fat all over my hands.

This is right out of the fridge too so it's not like they're super soft yet. I bought them specifically to take on long trips (most are in the freezer), but I don't want literal tallow all over my hands.

>>626027
It's dried meat, jerky is cooked and flavored, but you've got the right idea, yeah.

>>626061
Good to know. I'll stick to trying to make my own, because at their price it seems stupid to pay extra for a recipe that only has two ingredients. Especially if I can get the tallow candle-hard. What about the flavor and texture?

>>626063
Taste and texture are fine, even kind of good after a while, but sometimes oddly gag inducing. This is coming from someone with an iron stomach who will eat almost anything. But do you know what I mean where even something you might kind of enjoy hits you weird sometimes?

If you're a manly dude you won't give a fuck and it should be good calories.

>>626068
I'm down to put up with tolerable tasting lightweight calories for six months. Mine were definitely too gritty, though. I'll have to blend them better next time. The tallow was like flavorless butter. Actually, I've still got some... I'm going to make some toast and compare.

Tallow on toast is pretty fucking good. It doesn't taste much like butter, but still good. I also just remembered an excerpt from a very old survival manual that said if you have nothing else, you can eat your candle. That was before paraffin, though, obviously.

>>626090
Yeah, I'd stay away from candle eating now. Back in the day, maybe but not now.

>>626358
I did some research on candle-making late last night, and it seems like candles were never made from pure beef tallow. Beef tallow is an unsaturated fat, so it stays liquid at room temperature. You have to add alum (which may or may not contribute to Alzheimer's), sheep tallow (which is a saturated fat) or bees wax (which doesn't get absorbed by the body, and may actually be the safest bet). So if I want to make a firmer pemmican that won't drip and turn me into a walking bear attractant, I need to add something. What does out think?

Also, does anyone know what additives are in the store bought stuff? E901 is beeswax, btw.

>>626367
>Beef tallow is an unsaturated fat, so it stays liquid at room temperature

You can not honestly believe this? have you never eaten beef in your life? You know those hard pieces of white stuff on the leftovers? this is called fat, rendered fat, also known as beef tallow.

>>626371
You mean the tallow I used to make pemmican, that I had to put in my garage because it was liquid at room temperature? The tallow that I rendered myself, from leaf fat? Yes, I do in fact really believe that.

>>626651
Do you live in the tropics, anon?
How long did you wait for it to harden?

>>626085

IIRC 50/50 pemmican with dried berries is a complete nutrition diet, which is a pretty interesting summary of human nutrition requirement in a survival situation. Eat that fat and get enough fruit vitamin c.

>>626651
Me thinks you are confusing tap water or olive oil with beef tallow. Please stay off the internet you fucking retard

>>626726
>50/50 pemmican with dried berries is a complete nutrition diet.

Please remove yourself from the gene pool, sir.

>>625854
I'm sure you already know but your not going to want to carry your whole supply with you... So even if your only getting a month of stability out of it you can have someone at home make it for you and send it to post offices along trail towns a couple weeks in advance ... Instead of you just A. Carrying it all in or B. you sending it to post offices 6 months up the trail and it posably going bad. That is assuming you have someone to make it for you. Eather way GL ... I did the Appalachian about 4 years ago and that's what I did and I am doing the Mason Dixon Trail in the spring... Hope you have a Blast!!! By the way I did the JMT about a year ago and you do a section of that on the PCT ... You will love MT Whitney it is Amazing.

>>626682
Inland northwest, it resoftens when I bring it in, I keep my house about 75F.

>>626726
Supposedly grass fed beef and probably bison has enough vitC to prevent scurvy, and pine was a native American staple anyway. Most historians seem to be under the impression that because berries in pemmican reduce shelf life, that it was only made that way for ceremonial purposes and trade.

>>626783
>>626812
I really feel sorry for people who're so convinced that they're right, that they refuse to learn anything new.

>>626814
I don't know which locations I'll send to yet, but yes, my understanding is that there really isn't a stretch more than a week long between towns, and I want to keep as light as possible.

I'm excited, there's a few places I'm looking forward to seeing, and fishing. Crater lake doesn't require a fishing license, and I'll have one (resident) for Washington. Does anyone know if there's a PCT fishing license or other lakes that don't require it along the trail?

>>626857
>I really feel sorry for people who're so convinced that they're right, that they refuse to learn anything new.
A mature and respectable reflection on a often limited 4chan-world.

>>Beef tallow is an unsaturated fat, so it stays liquid at room temperature.
I too have problems with this though. Wikipedia is not always the best source for facts but this summary is good:
>"Tallow is a rendered form of beef or mutton fat, processed from suet. It is solid at room temperature. Unlike suet, tallow can be stored for extended periods without the need for refrigeration to prevent decomposition, provided it is kept in an airtight container to prevent oxidation."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tallow
This is my exact experience with beef tallow. Where did you find a source that said beef tallow was unsaturated fat?

>>626812
The only thing worse than an asshole is a misinformed asshole.

First of all, traditional pemmican included liver and probably kidney as part of the meat, as well as marrow as part of the fat, so it would have had a lot more nutrition to it. Secondly, grass fed, free-range animals absorb and store higher concentrations of vitamins than corn fed, factory farmed, human bred animals. And lastly, traditional pemmican is made from bison, not beef, which is naturally going to have a different nutritional profile. Not to mention the fact that several cultures around the world, plains Indians and Inuit come to mind, lived near exclusively off of animal protein and fat, and were healthier than their defendants today, who eat a western diet. So before you go shooting your mouth off like a fucking idiot, get your facts straight first.

>>626866
The world is filled with armchair academics like you. This makes me sad.

This is what you said:
>50/50 pemmican with dried berries is a complete nutrition diet.
This is what it isn't:
>Complete picture of 'indigenous' groups diet which will reflect on their health and lifestyle.
To live on this type of pemmican alone would lead to severe deficiencies in the long run, some which can be repaired, others which will impair you for the rest of your life.
But please do try to live off the stuff. This will result in executing the request I made in my last comment.

>>626863
It wasn't a source stating that tallow was an unsaturated fat so much as it was a combination of (multiple) sources stating that unsaturated fats, due to the double carbon bond, have a bent molecular structure, resulting in a lower crystallization temperature, whereas hydrogenated oils break the double bond and saturate the chain with hydrogen resulting in a straight chain that stacks and crystalizes at higher temperatures. So it was really more based on logic, than being explicitly stated anywhere.

So, let's say I'm wrong, or even partially wrong. Maybe I didn't render it long enough and there was still water in it or maybe this particular batch of leaf fat came from a fat with a slightly higher concentration of unsaturated fat to saturated fat, which causes it to be liquidy at 75F, which is probably warmer than most people's houses anyway. What do? Mix with sheep tallow, alum or beeswax? Try rerendering and getting every last drop of water out of my tallow? I'm just trying to make a batch of pemmican that'll hold up in my pack which I cross a desert. At this point, I'm not even too worried about the level of hydrocarbon saturation in the oil.

>>626872
>This is what you said:
Nope, wasn't me. I'm a completely different person who also thinks you're an idiot.

>Would lead to severe deficiencies
So those inuits who never saw a vegetable in their lives... many of whom lived well into their seventies, that's just a myth, huh?

>>626857
Don't worry about fishing licenses, they are a money grubbing scam and chances are you won't fish anyway

>>626873
well, beef tallow, or any tallow or lard, will still be 'soft' in room temperature, just not liquid. it is hardened to a solid but will still give at 75 f, the same way butter will. The butter will be hard in the fridge but soft outside.
There is no way to make your tallow a 'complete solid' in room temperature, if this is what you seek. You'll have to combine it with other stuff for this.

On another note, do whatever you can to remove any remnant of water in the tallow.The presence of water will promote oxidation and therefore decomposition.

found this on tallow:
The composition of the fatty acids is typically as follows:[10]

Saturated fatty acids:
Palmitic acid (C16:0): 26%
Stearic acid (C18:0): 14%
Myristic acid (C14:0): 3%
Monounsaturated fatty acids:
Oleic acid (C18-1, ω-9): 47%
Palmitoleic acid (C16:1)]: 3%
Polyunsaturated fatty acids:
Linoleic acid: 3%
Linolenic acid: 1%

>>626881
>So those inuits who never saw a vegetable in their lives... many of whom lived well into their seventies, that's just a myth, huh?


Not the guy you're replying to, but yeah....that is just a myth.

While they never cultivated crops, the traditional inuit diet included plenty of vegetables including root tubers, seaweed, berries and various perennial herbaceous plants.

While the traditional inuit diet does rely heavily on meat, it is nowhere near absent of vegetable nutrition.

So yeah, you're talking /out/ of your ass.

>>626812
He is. A few weeks on the PCT eating that and he will hurl himself off a cliff

>>626881

This is what the other idiot said:
>50/50 pemmican with dried berries is a complete nutrition diet.
This is what it isn't:
>Complete picture of 'indigenous' groups diet which will reflect on their health and lifestyle.

>So those inuits who never saw a vegetable in their lives... many of whom lived well into their seventies, that's just a myth, huh?

What I am trying to say, in as simple english as possible for your limited brainpower, is that they did not, and could not, survive on that type of pemmican alone.

How is this difficult to understand?
I believe there is no hope for you, sir.
Can you please take my original advice?: >>626812

>>626891
In fact, one of the more successful dietary strategies for inland tribes was to wait to kill a caribou or moose who had recently grazed and eat the plant matter in its stomach since it was already broken down and easier for them to digest.

>>626891
This.
Also the different inuit groups practiced very varied diets as a result of their geographical locations, so to say 'those inuits' as if they all lived the same lifestyle is pretty racist. Some relied heavily on whale and seal, others chased salmon and caribou; but they all included plants in their diets.

>>626889
Well, I was trying for just under candle hardness, though admittedly, I've never seen a real tallow candle in person, so I don't know how hard it would be. Presumably, these were mixed with something, but I don't know what.

I thought I had removed all the water. It stopped boiling and the temperature started rising sharply, which should have indicated that it was devoid of moisture, but I'm not running the through a mass spectrometer, I'm just guessing based on what I remember from high-school chemistry.

What are you saying, here, with the chart there?

>>626882
I'm not trying to rush trough the trail. If I find a lake that I can fish at, I'm planning on staying a few days. I'm not the hard-core badass type doing this for bragging rights, I just want to enjoy the time alone, the nature, the lack of consumerist bullshit. But I don't want to get any fines out of state, and paying a couple hundred bucks for a licence when I don't know if I'd do any fishing anyway seems stupid. So I was thinking just crater lake, anything in Washington, and any other free ones where I don't need a license.

>>626912
>What are you saying, here, with the chart there?
It is an argument against the haters. Beef tallow contains 50 % monounsaturated fatty acids, 4 percent polyunsaturated fatty acids, and 43 % saturated fatty acids according to the chart. This means that you were not uncorrect with the unsaturated content, because this is the main substance in tallow, a total for 54 %. I think this is news to most people, as I myself thought the number to be much lower. Very interesting.

>>626891
>>626895
>>626897
Vilhjalmur Stefansson lived on 15% protein and 85% fat for a year. I'm only planning on doing it for six months.

Its obvious that you're going to believe what you want to believe, and I'm going to believe what I want to believe. You know what's different about me and you guys, though? I'm actually willing to test out my theory and prove it one way or the other, you guys are just going to hide behind your desks blindly assuming you know what you're talking about.

>>626931
Umm...I didn't say it was impossible to live for a year on just meat and fat. i was just dispelling the myth that the Inuits "never saw vegetables in their lives" because it is, in fact, a myth.

You can eat whatever the fuck you want, dude. That's your prerogative.

>>626931
Actually Stefansson claimed that Inuits could go 6-9 months on a pure meat and fish diet. Meat and fish both.
And when he himself attempted to live on a meat-diet He developed glycosuria, and needed to be treated for this.

Another one of my favorite Inuit foraging strategies was mousefood. They would dig up the dens of voles and take the small roots and seeds that the voles had collected.

>>626903
>>626941
This. Interesting. What is your source, anon?

>>626928
Ah, gotcha. Yeah, I would have made the same assumption, myself, just a couple of weeks ago. But knowing that beef tallow is about 50/50 would certainly explain why it's pretty slushy/liquidy at room temperature. I'm still expecting, though that my black backpack in the desert while crossing California is going to be too warm for pemmican to hold its shape. Which is the biggest issue right now.

I'm not going to go back and quote every single post, but I never said that pemmican was the only thing I was eating. I plan on stopping in towns that I pass, as well as fishing, and happen to be a fairly skilled, though admittedly not an expert, forager. So while I'm planning on only packing pemmican so as to keep my pack weight low and hike speed up, I'll also be supplementing. It honestly just sounds like you guys are so insecure about not being capable of doing it yourselves, that you don't want to believe anyone can. Seriously, guys... this is /out/. Grow a pair.

>>626941
Enjoy getting the plague

>>626945
I also fear for the temperature thing. All my experience with pemmican is from cold climates. Continue the experiments.

On a side note: ignore the haters and idiots. It is a part of 4chan culture but see it as background noise and just ignore it. Any comment might feed and fuel the trolls to continue to bother people.

>>626943
http://www.ankn.uaf.edu/NPE/CulturalAtlases/Yupiaq/Marshall/edibleplants/UGNARATNEQAIT.html

This link is from a Yupik tribal college website, but the Inuit employed similar techniques. I'm gonna have to dig a little more for anything about the caribou cud but I'll see what I can come up with.

>>626938

> Stefansson claimed that Inuits could go 6-9 months on a pure meat and fish diet

While the specific techniques may have varied, the overall strategies for people like the Inuit and Yupik were pretty similar. Pack in as many carbohydrates as you can when they're available and then ride the rest of the year out on fat and meat

>>626947
Too far North for the plague, brah. Definitely wouldn't employ that foraging strategy in the lower 48, though.

>>626949
I was planning on doing some winter camping since part of the PCT actually goes through the pass, which has snow on it in August.

Since there doesn't seem to be any information out there, I'm just going to have to experiment and see what works. I think alum may be the best. Despite the aluminum, content, the potassium is usually the hardest thing for athletes to get enough of, so candle-hard pemmican and potassium may outweigh the unproven "aluminum may contribute to Alzheimer's thing". Beeswax I think would require quite a bit, increasing volume and not providing anything, plus is still pretty soft. Sheep tallow is noticeably harder, but that's probably indicative of highly saturated fat, and I don't know if saturated fats are still bad for you if you're burning energy as fast as you're consuming it.

>>626956
Cud. That's the word... historically, probably an awesome way to break out nutrients that humans can't absorb naturally, but I'd be concerned about what, how and where the animals were eating. Several animals eat plans that are poisonous to humans, and in our modern era, we also have to be concerned about if they're eating plants near an industrial, chemical or farming runoff. I'm sure it worked at the time, but I'd be careful about trying it today.

>>626956
Agreed. Pemmican and similar foods were used primarily in the winter months when food was harder to find, and while on hunting and traveling expeditions so as to limit the time needed to stop an acquire food.

While pemmican has been used exclusively for long periods of time by European explorers in north America and even more recently as both human and dog food for dogsledding, it's original use was as a supplemented primary food, not as a sole source of nutrition. So while some people have lived only off pemmican for long durations, a mere six months, while incorporating other foods shouldn't be a problem. Maybe monotonous, at worst.

>>626963
>potassium
Dried sweet potato is a great way up your potassium game. You can also try sunflower or pumpkin seeds.

>>626971
When you've been following an animal for a couple of days, you'll have a pretty good idea of what it's been eating, so I imagine they developed a good idea of when and where to kill certain animals for that technique to work.

I really wouldn't try any of these techniques these days anyway, unless I were in a dire survival situation. They just impress me because it shows the ingenuity involved in human survival over so many broad environmental conditions.

>>626973
Certainly appreciated. I'll take some, sweet potato is also a great bait for nutria!

>>626976
Generally, the people who know about this sort of thing are smart enough to know better, but I just expect someone to go "I read on 4Chan, you can eat this stuff!" And then start mowing down on deer cud that's been munching on poison ivy. Btw, deer eat poison ivy.

>>622731
>cliff bars $2.99
They're $1 each at my local grocery. people can shit on them all they want but the PB cliff bars are awesome for an on trail snack/lunch.

>>626991
I'm a fan of the Sierra ones, in the green wrappers, myself. But they're not really a food, as much as they are a snack. You'd have to eat about 8/day to get enough calories, and trust me... if you do that, they aren't as pleasant on the way out.

>>626986
Isn't that about the same with almost any herbivores? Elk, deer, goats, sheep, cattle and so forth all can and typically will it those kinds of things I thought. I wouldn't eat cud, I'd dig for earth worms before that happened.

>>626991
>They're $1 each at my local grocery.
Same here they have them at 10 for $10. Just don't get them at a place like REI and they are cheap and very filling.

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>>622693
>not going to grocery store, filling up with whatever you need in the self serve dried snack section, putting the SKU for their cheapest item and using self checkout
>not knowing that a handful of nuts or 2 tbsp of nut butter has the fat and protein your looking for for less weight, less money, and no unnecessary effort
>not knowing how to make jerky out of any meat with just an oven
>not knowing how to identify and forage for edible plant life when /out/
>not getting some fucking energy bars

Get the fuck out of here with your faggot hipster /out/ meal. Its impractical, overpriced, lacks nutritional value, and basically exposes you for the gigantic fucking faggot that you are. I think you want to make this pemmica bullshit and make a thread about it more for a dick-waving "look at me and my hipster tactics" effect, rather than genuine advice. Because genuine advice that would help you would be to throw all of that bullshit out, buy some fucking nuts, buy some clif bars, grind them and fill two giant condoms with them, freeze them, fuck yourself in the ass with one and have someone bludgeon you with the other one simultaneously. Because your idea is shit, your thought process behind your idea is shit, and you yourself are a piece of worthless shit coming out of a dead cows ass.

>>628522
This

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>>628522
Dude... that was probably one of the meanest things I've read on /out/ in a while.

No response from OP about my post
>>628522

Looks like we put this faggot in his place real good. Good work guys.

>>628527
>OP's first rebuttal in the thread begins with "fuck you nigger"
>I simply provide facts that point out why he is wrong, expose his emotionally unintelligent thought process leading up to his decision, and im the mean one

You're almost as much of a faggot as OP

>>628531
>You're almost as much of a faggot as OP
You're an over sensitive little bitch. Don't get bent up because someone called you a nigger and another called you mean. Get off 4chan if you can't handle a little banter. And before you point out me saying something back remember the fact that you could have let my comment slide and didn't. Which goes right back to my opening sentence. Bitch.

>>628531
>emotionally unintelligent
What does this even mean faggot?
I hope you are aware that you aren't going to meet calorie requirements while backing foraging for edible plants just so you are aware. Nor is it very appropriate to swap the UPC at the grocery story for a lower priced item. You know only niggers do that right?

Also I didn't say this was the only thing I planned on eating while backpacking. Just a cheap (and legal) way of having a bunch of calories. You offer no real suggestion or solution. Your only offered "solution" is shoplifting and fucking myself in the ass with condoms filled with cliff bars? Now that seems like more effort than making some jerky and mixing it with some tallow.

Please, for the sake of all of mankind, kill yourself.

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>>628568
>Your only offered "solution" is shoplifting and fucking myself in the ass with condoms filled with cliff bars?

>>628527
4chan isn't a hugbox, if you don't like it go back to leddit.

>>628514
I agree. Earthworms aren't bad, so long as you purge them first. Deer was the only thing I'm sure eats poison ivy, others probably do as well.

I haven't had a chance to make it back across town to get more heart, but there's supposed to he a sale on heart and tongue tomorrow, so I'll be making another couple batches soon. Hopfully I'll be able to pick up some sheep tallow as well, if not I'll try alum as a stiffener.

If the thread stays active, I'll keep updating. I've got to figure it out anyway, I may as well share.

>>628600
Yeah man I appreciate your input on here. I ended up doing the oven method and it didn't come out so great. I have all the stuff I need to throw a good dehydrator together and will have another go at it.

The one thing that sucked was even though I got free fat, most of it was skin which is why I yielded so little tallow. Hopefully I can get a hold of some kidney/heart fat next batch I throw together.

>>625626
Oh that's silly, I would purchase some artisinal hipster pemmican.

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>>628522

>>628605
Oh, you got back fat. Leaf fat tastes better, and is better for you. What's even better is marrow, very sweet and loaded with calcium and other vitamins.

Oven doesn't seem to be the way to go. I was just talking with my brother about building a dehydrator. He's been making jerky, and there isn't enough oven to go around anyway. And if I can get the recipe right, I need to dehydrate about 500 lbs to make enough pemmican for the trip.

>>626991
>>627017
Sierra trail, green tea with mint, pomegranate, peanut butter, chocolate, they're all fucking delicious. Just about the one I've tried I've outright disliked is the macadamia white chocolate one because it has so much fucking coconut in it. The builder bars are also pretty decent.
Alton Brown did an episode of Good Eats on making your own energy/protein bars that is worth a watch.

>>628633
>And if I can get the recipe right, I need to dehydrate about 500 lbs to make enough pemmican for the trip.
That's so hilariously impractical and retarded for the labor and cost involved to pretend you're an old timey trapper.

>>628633
I probably wouldn't want to go with a straight up 100% pemmican diet though man. Just my 2 cents. If you think you can do it, then go for it, but you might want to at least throw something in to change things up a bit besides different flavored pemmican.

The oven was just a pain in the ass. You can build a dehydrator for cheap. The guy I linked in the OP has instructions for a $!0 dehydrator. You can follow the same principles for a larger version I'm sure, but it doesn't cost much. You can also dry it out on clothesline, but that won't be an option until the summer, and it looks like that won't come up for you in time.

http://www.traditionaltx.us/images/JerkyDrierInstructions.pdf

>>628638
Don't be an idiot. It has nothing to do with LARPing. If I wanted a candy bar, I'd pack a candy bar. I'm doing this because 6.6 calories/gram is as practical as practical gets.

>>628639
Thanks for the link, I'll check that out. It won't be an entirely pemmican diet. I'll be stopping in towns, as well as a little bit of fishing and foraging along the way. It'll still be boring, but lighter bag weight just means that I can get to the next town faster.

>>628647
I wouldn't rely on fishing or foraging as a reliable food source, but there are some cool spots to at least fish and relax if you take a zero day. Just make sure you take a multivitamin with you at least.

>>628650
I'm not counting on fishing and foraging but I will take advantage of every opportunity that presents itself, nonetheless! I am curious about the multivitamin, though. From what I've read, real pemmican contains all necessary vitamins and minerals for a highly active individual to survive for six months, easily. Is this purely a precautionary statement, or do you know something about vitamins and pemmican that I've missed? I know a lot of people who make it used cooked meat, which degrades the vitamin content, and corn-fed beef fat has almost no lipid soluble vitamins compared to grass-fed/free range beef fat, but unless there's a vitamin available in bison that isn't available in steer, I don't see why it would need to be supplemented.

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>>628562
>>628568
lmao you faggots are so fucking dumb

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>>628694
Great rebuttal. Give us more of your unrivaled witty comebacks.

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>>628694
since your 3 point rectum is festooned with STD sores, laughing it off is a step in the right direction

Most pemmican I've had is made incorrectly. Industrial grinding processes can't get all the moisture out which makes it unstable for storage and they usually used cooked meat like ignorant people.

The real way to do it is to shred and dehydrate the meat by laying it out in the sun like Indians would do or what-have-you. Best to keep the lean meat (venison) raw for superior nutrition and enzyme function. Then add whatever beef or similar tallow and make it 50/50 with added ingredients if preferred. So simple but talked proper dedication.

>>630326
Wouldn't industrial grinding still be okay, so long as it was dried again after? There's simply no way I could make 120 lbs of pemmican by rock smash method.

>>630451
Use a tobacco grinder. Should save you some time. Get a big one like this:
http://ezvaporizers.com/grinders/space-case-2-piece-aluminum-grinder-large/prod_173.html

>>626857
Not sure if you consider it cheating or not but you really should get a diner breakfast and some fruit or something whenever you are in town for variety if nothing else.

>>630496
I think you mean "Tobacco" grinder. No, I don't think 90mm is enough to get me through that amount.

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>>622746
I Have tried these and I did not like it. If you don't care about taste or texture and all you want is calories it was edible just not very good. Slightly off topic, but a few days ago a gentle anon from k who worked for mountain house fielded questions. I offered an idea for a high nutrition survival ration his response was lukewarm at best. I suggested roughly hockey puck shaped rations that would fit in a 18 oz cup like very many of us use. Making sure to fortify it with textured vegetable protein or a mix of other high protein and mineral & vitamin sources as well as fiber. Then pack the Mylar wrapped individual rations in a cross between their No 10 can and a Pringles or Pillsbury dough roll. The total calorie count should be between 650 and 800 per puck. The Idea was a compact sustainable long storage food source that would keep you going for a month or more without significant performance loss. Or it could be used to supplement a diet during times of scarcity for a fairly long time. Double wrapping it would just increase its shelf life. If you guys have and idea to improve or a criticism feel please be brutal I wan't to try and DIY a prototype this winter. This is the closest thing I can find conceptually and It seems Kinda shit.

>>630931
Make sure you can get some fiber in their otherwise it'll cause MRE brick shits. Otherwise it's a pretty solid idea.

>>628522
/thread

>>630931
Like a protein puck? That's already a thing. They aren't super dense, but not bad. The taste is... almost good.

>>631215
That's actually a myth. You don't need fibre on a fat & protein-only diet. Fibre is only necessary for pushing hardened carbohydrates through a system that isn't designed for it.

>>628522
salty

Just a bump to let everybody know that I've been too lazy to make another batch lately, but I'll get on it soon and give updates.

>>633671
>fibre is only necessary for pushing carbs thru blah blah
Microbiologist here, you're actually full of shit. Eating fibre increases the bacterial diversity of your gut, which can help prevent type 2 diabeetus, depression, and a punch of other stuff you don't want. You should always include fibre in your diet.

>>635144
oops, *bunch

>>635144
I hate being "that guy", but could you source? I haven't been able to find any data that would suggest that, that isn't decades old and well... someone claiming to be a professional on 4Chan is at best, worthy of scepticism.

The connection is not as clear cut as suggested above, however the basic idea that fiber is beneficial in multiple ways appears to be true, based upon the best evidence currently available.
This article is from 2010
hhttp://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22254008
Other, corroborating articles can be easily found w/google scholar.
As far as bacteria in the gut is concerned, many of the resident bacteria survive on fiber; so... the removal of normal, non-pathogenic bacteria would create an available niche for other bacteria to move in, any of which may be pathogenic. So... fiber for the purposes of maintaining normal, healthy bacterial flora is also reasonable.

Remember, the digestive tract is NOT STERILE. It is NOT possible to eliminate bacteria from it, and if you did it would not function properly. (all feces would be diarrhea, for example).

>>635460
I appreciate the reply. I believe that was that same article I received a link for when I inquired with the college (I don't recall which one) that employs several professionals in the field. The following is what I sent them.

I was hoping to find someone who could provide me with some information regarding microflora. Specifically, whether it could possibly be more healthful to have a more restricted diet lending to a stable microbiome rather than the typically advised diverse diet which logic would indicate would result in a constantly fluctuating and unstable environment for microflora. I ask because it seems as though native cultures who had very restricted diets such as the Inuit, maintained far better health than many modern cultures following the general rule of dietary diversity.

I would appreciate any information you could provide, as I'm planning a thru-hike during which I'm currently intending on using primarily pemmican (dried meat and fat) as sustenance, and am very curious as to whether pre-conditioning my microbiome to a stable point prior to leaving would increase the bioavailability of nutrients or if I may be better off getting as much diversity in diet as possible before I restrict myself to a single food which may have lower concentrations of necessary nutrients. (End quote)

I, for instance eat large salads all summer long, but in winter I tend to eat mostly soups consisting of largely root vegetables. If I eat either during a period that I'm not accustomed, it results in... stress.