Modify Electric Cars

>>16678928
Hack the firmware and enable free autopilot & ludicrous mode.

It'll be akin to unlocking videogame consoles.

>>16678928
more current to motors I'd assume?

Idk much about electricity

>>16678933
>Free autopilot
>Ludicrous mode
What does that even mean?

reverse engineer the code controlling the motors
or take the hardware out and use some kind of open source motor controlling/battery management system

i feel like it'll get easier with time since as software gets more complex, its hard to make proprietary and closed

>>16678928
Add gearing?

>>16678993
>Add gearing?

t. retard

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>>16678928
HOLY FUCKING SHIT. I JUST BOUGHT MY FIRST BONG.


BWAHAHHAHAHAHAA

>>16679004
Formula E uses a 5-speed gearbox even though it's a fully electric car.

>>16679013
Formula car is basis for regular car now?

>>16679020
Yes, a 5-speed gearbox has better power delivery than what is on current electric cars, which is nothing.

You don't.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxe_b2GRwok
Car will break before you can reach anything.
Because if you can be a greedy cunt thanks to proprietary technology, then history proves that corporations will.

>>16679010
DUDE

>>16679010
>>16679051
idgi

>>16679051
WEED

>I'm sorry anon that violates the end user agreement you signed when you ""bought"" your vehicle also since your car is our intellectual property we are also suing you press ok to be served.

>>16678959

Autopilot and ludicrous mode are options which the Model S may be equipped with. They are expensive. Autopilot is Tesla's semi-autonomous driving technology, and ludicrous mode enables the P100D Model S to accelerate from 0-60 in 2.5 seconds.

>>16679109
Are they not something you need to pay to download the software? If you want to hack the car, that must mean you would program both hose options yourself.

>>16679027
>Yes, a 5-speed gearbox has better power delivery than what is on current electric cars, which is nothing.

>not realizing adding a gearbox introduces mechanical loss
>not realising electric motor power != ICE power

>>16679132
Go do some research on torque curves won't ya? Electric cars have instant torque, but it starts to decline after a couple of seconds. That point of the gearbox is to maintain that peak torque for an extended period of time. They use it in racing ffs, do you think they're stupid to not use an auto?

>>16679064
LMAO

>>16679149

>not to use an auto

Not to use a trans at all you mean?

Though you're not wrong on the torque curves part, it all comes down to how beneficial a gearbox is to an electric motor. Many times (almost all road cars) it's not worth the added weight/complexity and efficiency loss.

>>16678928

Forget about modifying a Tesla. You might be able to tweak the controller parameters but all the other parts are too proprietary.

If you build something like a Zombie 222 you put in the beefiest controller and motors and start to find a battery that can supply the needed power. The motor is just converting energy, The batteries are doing all the work. Upgrading the batteries would be the first place to start.

tldr: Electric cars are basically lifesized RC cars.

>>16679149
The torque declines at a certain point at a rate that keeps the actual power the same.
The problem is that the batterys usually can´t deliver more power.
A gearbox won´t change that, a lithium polymer pack will.

>>16679112
I'm assuming it's all already there; you're just not allowed to access it. Much like when video games get DLC you still have to download and install it even if you don't buy it. You just can't use it.

>>16679189
Formula E is currently putting a lot of money towards developing a CVT that can maintain peak torque, which will be passed down to Formula 1 when in the future ICE is banned.

>>16679200
This is not about giving it more power, but rather maintaining that power for more than a few seconds.

>>16678928
Usually you can modify on non properitory cars:
Controller (they limit amps and volts)
Motor (they can only take a certain amount of amps)
Battery (can only deliver certain amps/volts)
Final drive ratio (limits top speed)


The power of the engine is basicly:
Volts*Amps*engine efficiency=Power output
The engine torque is proporrtional to the input Apms:
Engine constant*Amps=torque
The maximum RPM is proportional to the voltage:
RPM/V*V=RPM

>>16679212
Ludicrous has different bus bars and pyrofuse, not every vehicle has all the autopilot hardware

If you're talking about Tesla specifically, even if you could modify it you would just end up shearing the splines in the drive unit. Tesla doesn't leave much if anything on the table, anything beyond the factory spec on a P90D or P100D would just be damaging the pack and drivetrain

>>16679229
If you look at the power curve you will notice, that the engine power won´t drop untill you hit maximum rpm.

The limiting factor usually is the factor, to not draw to many amps from the battery, the controller reduces the power of the engine to the maximum of the battery.
And since power is the product of torque and rpm, you stay at constant power untill you hit maximum rpm.
A transmission won´t change the power drawn from the battery.

>>16679276
Why are you bringing up the battery? It has absolutely nothing to do with power delivery. Power production, yes, but not power delivery.

>>16679229
In drag racing some people actualy go crazy and direcly conect the battery to the motor, wich is insanely bad for both if you do this for more than a few seconds under top speed.

Plasmaboy racing started that shit with the white zombie in ´94 with trashed airplane batterys, a forklift engine and a relay.
That little Datsun ran pretty good times with that shit, but killed the electrical components extremely fast.

>>16678933
>Hack the firmware and enable free autopilot & ludicrous mode.

So much for the warranty.

>>16679293
Instead of putting a gearbox in a electric car, manufacturers puta beefed up controller and motor in them to cut down cost and complexity.

The problem is, the batterys can only feed this drivetrain a certain amount of power, so you only have full torque untill you hit a certain rpm, then it stays at the same power, eliminating the need of a gearbox.

If you would add one in a electric car, you wouldn´t gain any power, since the battery limits it.

>>16679324
Huh? You START at full torque and then DECREASE. The point of the gearbox is to continue maintaining that full power. Formula E is a massive motorsport, they spend millions just to gain a second advantage. They CLEARLY saw it beneficial to keep a 5-speed gearbox. They know a lot more than you about all this. Also, why do you keep saying "gain". THEY ARE NOT TRYING TO GAIN MORE TORQUE AND I NEVER SAID THAT ANYWHERE. THEY ARE MAINTAINING.

>>16679324

Modern motors and controllers aren't remotely close to being pushed to the limit. They're being held back by the battery pack big time.

You're not really going to get away with stupid amounts of torque and a high gear in a 5000lb car. Transmissions exist for a reason.

>>16679293
For example, a hypotetical electric motor has 1000Nm of torque with 1000Amps.
The motor doesn´t care at wich rpm, it can deliver 1000Nm from 0-20.000rpm.

But your battery can only deliver lets say 1000kW of power, your controller mus limit the Amps to:
1. Not exceed the 1000Amps
2.Not exceed 1000kW

1. limits your maximum torque, usually you get wheelspin anyway, so a gearbox wouldn´t change that.
2.limits you engine power, your gearbox can´t increase your engine power at any given rpm untill rev limit.

>>16679367
See, >>16679355

>>16679355
You stay at full power, but since power is rpm multiplied by torque, they need to reduce the torque at higher rpm to not kill the battery.

A transmission can only convert a certain power at one rpm to the same power at another rpm, but since you are already at maximum power they can´t change anything.

>>16679363
>Modern motors and controllers aren't remotely close to being pushed to the limit. They're being held back by the battery pack big time.
Indeed.

>You're not really going to get away with stupid amounts of torque and a high gear in a 5000lb car. Transmissions exist for a reason.
Electric motors don´r just have insane torque at 0 rpm, they have a insane rev range as well, a Tesla Model s for example revs up to about 18-20.000 rpm and doesn´t need a short gear to start due to its torque at 0 rpm, so it basicly starts in what would be like 3rd gear for a conventional car.
But it also revs to the moon and back, about 2 times as high as a ICE normaly does, so it can drive verry fast with a relative ly short gear.
The olny thing holding them back from accelerating as fast from 100-200km/h as from 0-100km/h is the battery, wich limits their power at a certain point.
If you get to this point, the controller reduces the torque of the engine slowly, to keep it at the same power and basicly does what a transmission could do.
Reducing output torque to increase output rpm while keeping the power output constant.

>>16679377
see
>>16679382
>>16679436

>>16679355
You have no idea what you're talking about. There's two teams in Formula E that use twin motors with single speed transmissions and only two that still use five speed transmissions because they're too fucking cheap to upgrade from the spec motor and gearbox they all had to use originally. Three use a four speed, Audi uses a three speed, and Renault uses a two speed.

>>16679453
A two speed may make sense if you would get to the rev limit with a final drive ratio short enough to allow whellspinn, anything more won´t increase your performance at Formule E speeds.

>>16679315
>warranty

get out

>>16678933
>autopilot
Maybe, all Teslas produced after a certain date have the complete hardware.

>ludicrous mode
You need a different fuse for that, as far as I know the standard one is 1300Amps and the ludicrous one is 1700Amps.
I honestly don´t know any supplyer for fuses that big wich are not made for at leat 120.000V and too bich for a car.
They are like 1m long or so.

>>16678928
Wait a second here.

If a lot of the Model S is controlled by software not limited to something like an ECU, doesn't that mean it's possible to modify or even write your own software? Could /g/ install gentoo on it?

>>16679696
99% of modern cars have firmware controlling most of the car via can communication, not just electric ones, the Model S is no different.

>>16679696
Tesla does most of its stuff in house, /g/ would have a hard time to get gentoo running on it, but if they could hackt it should work.

>>16679720
The Model S is different since it has a centralised controll system, it has only 2 computers, 1 for driving, 1 for the infotainment system.

>>16679747
>only two computers
As opposed to what, 30? Do you think every CAN module on a Mercedes is a computer, but not on a Tesla? I'll say it again, the Model S is no different than any other modern car in regards to what you are talking about.

>>16679791
You don´t have a ECU, a ESP, a ASR and everything seperate, that is all in one computer.

If tesla is so great how come they don't have a forumla e team? Even their chinese knockoff Faraday Future has one

>>16679696
>Could /g/ install gentoo on it?
The firmware will not let you.

Besides Tesla, the other car companies have created their own car app standard. It is proprietary and will collect the car and driving data in order to sell it. Apps can be purchased and then subscribed. It will be another revenue stream that allows car companies to keep on collecting revenue from even the used cars.

This way, they will avoid the apple and android apps which don't generate a revenue stream nor yield protected data.

>>16679817
Wrong

>>16680482
Do you have any proof for your claim?

>>16680542
I have no claim, I am telling the truth because I actually know what I am talking about. Prove me wrong.

>>16680545
That is not how it works.

>>16680545
You really are the most worthless poster on this board.

>>16680572
>>16680575
>you're stupid because you said I was wrong when I was talking out my ass about something I don't understand!

asdcvasdfvadfgasl.dkvnmahsdfgvqadsfg

Physicsfag here.

Risen from the grave of the 50:50 weight distributio thread. Fuck, where's hakuna miata when you need him.

Have some knowledge of electric motors and power systems. Not as good as the classical physics, but enough to fuck with things to a degree of success.

Myth - Electric motors can only produce max torque at 0 rpm. In theory, this is true. The output is inversely proportional to the rpm of the motor. This isn't WAT, this is a result of how electric motors work. Unless you ACTUALLY do this, THEN, WAT. Consider a motor that produces 1000Nm at 1rpm. It would produce 2000Nm at 0.5rpm. And at 0.2 rpm it would do 5000Nm and at 0.1rpm it would blow permanent magnets and copper wiring throughout the suburb because nobody builds a small electric motor rated to 10kNm+.

The other way you can generate power is to load up the motor. This'll seem a bit backwards compared to an ICE car, but whereas you think power is forced from the engine through the gearbox to the wheel, in an electric system the current is drawn by the motor through the ESC (speed controller, like a sort of tap) from the battery. As long as the ESC can open up to that sort of power and the battery is OK, easy power. Remove the load and rpm increases while output (in watts) decreases

Pro mode - this is how Red Bull F1 team was getting a ghetto form of traction control with their KERS system back in 2013. Ever wonder why Vettel was on the KERS as soon as he hit the apex in Singapore/etc while everyone else was only using it on the straights? Now you know.

(cont)

It's already running on it's physical limit.

>>16682159
(cont)

Expanding on the first point - this is why you see output curves that stay flat for the first few thousand rpm. Because some part of the motor is limited in strength and rather than have a grossly over-reenforced motor 1% of the time they release a motor that's electronically limited 40% of the time.

As for ricing the Tesla, there's probably fairly reasonable gains to be found, but at significant cost.

Batteries like these aren't enthusiast grade. We all know how retarded the average Tesla owner is, and batteries live and die based on usage. What's in there now is a reasonable amount of juice, in something designed to be mostly retard resillient, if not retard-resistent.

Replace those with something significantly more powerful, and you'll have to add more cooling and power management, INCLUDING DEDICATED STORAGE CHARGING, no leaving it fully charged overnight, etc, and you could cut a couple of hundred kg while improving range and output. Failure however, means the batteries balloon up, and release the coveted magic smoke becure burning the car to the ground.

As for controllers, there's not much to do here. Just maybe up the max Amp rating and it'll be fine. Relatively straightforward

The motors still follow classical physics in many aspects. For example, a large pancake-shaped motor will generate more torque simply because of the geometry - the force is being generated near the periphery and if you move that away from the axis of rotation, you could see gains. One solution to this is in-wheel electric motors (see Mitsubishi MIEV). Unless you could have one giant motor flat on the floor and somehow connect it to the wheels, that's probably the limit.

>>16678928
Chuck a twin turbo in there

>>16678928
500$ LS Swap.

>>16680545
are you fucking retarded

>>16679132
>>not realizing adding a gearbox introduces mechanical loss

That is more than made up for in the increased efficiency of the electric motor. Why do you think they do it in Formula E? Shits and gigs? If you put a constant 100w into an electric motor through it's working range you will get vastly different amounts of power out at 10% of maximum speed compared to 90%.

>>16682287
Electric motors don´t get inefficient at high rpm, actualy it is quite the opposite.

Upgrade the batteries to allow for more current flow, get a larger electric motor, get more efficient wiring/computers. It's really easy its just mechanic doesn't translate very easily to electrical engineering.

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>>16682159
Actualy the torque curve of a electric car looks more like a hyperbel limited in the Y-axis at the maximum torque and in the X-axis by the engine rpm.(red)

If you are able to give te motor enough power, it stays at maximum torque the whole time.(blue)

Pic related.

>>16682376
Yep, check the start of the second post. That's a behaviour designed into the system by using the ESC to 'strangle' the current, otherwise it would tear itself to pieces (pint itself to bits?).

You could probably find online where some dude has loaded up a small baby RC motor with a massive prop, and let an over-specc'd esc and battery just wipe it out.

Cooling systems, capacitors, liquid nitrogen injection to both cool the motors and induce super-conducting properties.

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add alternators

>>16678928

More turns in the motor coil = more torque, less turns = higher top speed/rpm.

Take factory motor apart, unwind some of the coil wire, less magnetic resistance, higher top speed.

Or unwind entire coil, rewind with more wraps, more torque, faster acceleration but requires more amperage to push.

>>16682273
You'll have to elaborate, because everything I posted is 100% correct and there is no conceivable way you will disprove it. Please be my guest.