why do german cars break down so much

>>16411016
They don't. It's just poor people financing expensive cars and then being butthurt when they can't afford maintenance.

And yes a high tuned car will break more than your 91 crx.

German cars don't really ever" break down", the maintenance is just expensive on them.

>>16411016
They don't, they are constantly at the top of reliability studies.

>>16411083
The japanese are

>>16411083
maybe if you leave the japs out

>>16411016
They don't

American cars are much worse

>>16411016
>why do Audi cars break down so much
>ftfy

>>16411166
Not at all the top spots are normaly shared between Lexux.Audi,Subaru,VW,Toyota,BMW and Porsche quite evenly.

>>16411023
>they don't but they do & it's part of the design

>>16411208
>im fucking stupid
ok

>>16411218
but that's literally what you said.
"they don't"
followed up with
"yes a high tuned car will break more"

that's exactly what you said you bumble fuck.

>>16411267
they dont in comparison to other high end cars

theyre not unreliable theyre just ultra high maintenance so people cant afford to do preventative maintenance, or don't like spending $600 for a cv boot control arm every time they bring it in for an oil change, so they become unreliable. thats the annoying thing about owning a german car: you do all the cheduled maintenance and parts still constantly need to be replaced. and german parts are expensive. ive had to do like 1/10th the amount of repair on my lexus so it leaves me more money to get stuff replaced that i would have never had the budget to in my previous audis.

>>16411293
its easy to build a car that will never break. stick an understressed high liter n/a engine in it with no engineering compromises other than reliability.

>>16411307
but americans are the only ones to use high liter unstressed engines in their cars
why are american cars shit at reliability then

>>16411286
So in comparison to other European brands while ignoring high end Japanese and American brands okay got it

Teutonic engineering isn't about long term time-of-life reliability of the entire appliance, but more about engineering for maximum performance over a defined life cycle. They expect you to bring the car in on a regular, proscribed basis and have PM and inspections performed. They also expect you to drive the car as a performance car, so wear items can be inspected and replaced before catastrophic failure. The fact that these appointments bring in money isn't forgotten either.

I used to be field service and engineering support for a Swiss instrument company. They are very similar to the Germans in their mindset: "If you can afford a car, you can afford the maintenance and service." The poor reliability sold us a lot of PM and service contracts. That peace of mind, at a higher performance level, is worth a lot to their customers.

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>>16411560
>American
>high end

laughing_anime_whore.jpg

>>16411569

>I used to be field service and engineering support for a Swiss instrument company. They are very similar to the Germans in their mindset: "If you can afford a car, you can afford the maintenance and service." The poor reliability sold us a lot of PM and service contracts. That peace of mind, at a higher performance level, is worth a lot to their customers.

Do you think they specifically engineer that poor reliability into their products though? The Germans built their manufacturing reputation with exceptionally reliable cars, not this bullshit of building an unreliable product and the buyer hocking it off after a 3 year lease. Eventually it must bite them in the ass.

Dollar for dollar the gooks are not that far behind anymore.

>>16411016
because they're designed by independent teams in a vacuum and their engineers are over specialised. (aka making same shit for the rest of their lives).
which brigs us to efficiency thought only as a "non-wasted material"

>>16411173
i can't comment on this because they don't sell american cars in europe

>>16411569
>They also expect you to drive the car as a performance car, so wear items can be inspected and replaced before catastrophic failure.

. That may be true with a Porsche but a Jetta or diesel 3 Series is not a performance car.

Any car, from any manufacturer, needs regular maintenance for maximum reliability.

You have to replace shit on a German car that you didnt even know a car had, or needed.

>but its not broken, it is just a "maintenance" item.

No, shits broken, yo

>>16411560
Where did I say that?

Do you think an rx7 is as reliable as a civic dx?

>>16411016
German cars are pretty reliable senpai but when they break? they break real good.
Spare OEM parts are also hard to find which adds to the cost of fixing them plus the time it takes to fix them

>>16411369
>why are american cars shit at reliability then
They're not? My Ford and my Chevy have been as reliable as my Toyota

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>>16411016
Because the people that buy German cars new from the dealer never take them past 100k miles anyway. That's why they always get hit hard in resale. But since manufacturers don't directly profit from resale of old vehicles, the Germans don't care.

>>16411807
This. They don't break any more often then other cars, but when they do break, it's something critical, and really, really expensive. People only notice the larger costs for the repairs, and claim the vehicle is unreliable

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>they fell for reliability meme

My 2006 Mercedes C class has 310k km and runs perfectly fine. Apart from suspension parts and brakes I never had to change anything.
This is my anecdotal evidence, it's as good as yours.

>>16411962
I forgot the timing chain, but that was expected.

>>16411962
>Apart from suspension parts and brakes I never had to change anything.
No fluids or spark plugs?

>>16411837
>but when they do break, it's something critical, and really, really expensive
>People only notice the larger costs for the repairs, and claim the vehicle is unreliable

That is the very definition of unreliable. You don't want critical components to be the first things to go. You don't want your engine to detonate when the timing slips one tooth. A car can be a total piece of shit where bits and pieces are breaking and falling off constantly, but as long as the drivetrain lasts, it's reliable, because it will still transport you. Transportation is what cars are made to do. You don't NEED creature comforts and electrical bullshit, you just need a functional engine, drivetrain, steering, and brakes. If you get to 100k and something in the engine snaps and you require $5,000 in repairs, that car is UNRELIABLE. There's people driving around crown vics and toyota camrys with 500,000 miles who have never had engine work. THAT is a reliable car. German shit is not "just as good as any other car."

>>16411974
Sometimes I even had to put in fuel. Fucking Germans.

>>16411016
they don't. they are just engineered around having a professional with 9000 specialty tools do all your maintenance. they are also intended for rich fucks who don't blink an eye at spending 500$ on an alternator or 200$ on specialty fluids that are REQUIRED or else you risk a catastrophic failure.

german cars are reliable, yes. when you do absolutely everything you are supposed to do. but the germans crutch on bloated systems with a gorillion specialty parts, sensors, and configurations to attain that kind of reliability.

>>16411654
>i can't comment on this because they don't sell american cars in europe

wut? all the best Ford vehicles were sold outside the US.

>>16411016
German cars i owned were like a woman in her period. Unpredictable. Moody. Sometimes on cold days, my 3 year old BMW did not like to start. You wonder everytime what is wrong and when is it going to strand me on the road. Spark plugs, valve gasket, headlight swiveling mechanism, mirror motor, ignition coil, sun roof opening electronics, alternator, belts, ---I had enough in 2 years. Good car (not as much as the hype, but still good machine). But not reliable.

>>16412062
And they're called eurofords for a reason

>>16412062
>made in germany

Reports I've read is that they are better than 'muricans but worse than japs at not breaking.
That said, there's this thing:
>'murican breaks
>cheap repairs

>german breaks
>warranty is from bumper to bumper so services and shit is free the first years of ownership

>jap breaks once in a lifetime
>the part is cheap

Which also aligns with my experience with them.
Nissan we had never broke, but the plastic interior was shit.
Chryslers and Ferds we had were shit but repairs were a penny usually. Interior is shit too.
Mercs, audis, vws, besides suspension getting beat up in the first two, either everything runs smooth or is covered. The VW is probably the best bang for the money we ever had though, and it's my sis' car.

Personally I wouldn't buy any german premium car, after the free service period runs out, they are expensive to own and not actually miles better than the competition imo.

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>>16411307
Mercedes used to do this.
These fuckers got to 500.000 km with oil changes only. Then they were sold to some 3rd world shithole and racked up another 500.000.

Oh how the mighty have fallen.

>>16411600
>Do you think they specifically engineer that poor reliability into their products though?

Maybe not specifically, but that whole debacle about VW's timing chains was about VW wanting to save 0.02 cents on those chains.
The manufacturer of the chains made them offers for different MTBFs and they went the cheap way.

I'm German and i'm done with German cars.

>>16412134
fuuuuck. don't remind me about the glory of old school mercedes diesels.

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>german cars
>unreliable

American car breaks: hit with hammer to fix.

German car breaks: step 1, remove engine

>>16411962
my 2004 BMW 5 series is nearing 500k km
so far I had to change oil, filters, a couple of suspension bushings.

>>16412173
ikr XD

>>16412171
>always posting old german cars
you fucking tryhards lmao

>>16412009
A toyota camry of a crown vic is not luxurious and has shit performance.
If you want to cruise comfortably or go fast prepare your wallet.
But there are old german base model Benz E class and base model BMWs that are still being daily driven with 600k+ miles.
My mate owns an E46 diesel with 930k km and there are tons of old Mercedes taxis that are nearing a million kilometers.
If they were unreliable cars they would have never hit such high mileage but they would have been scrapped.

if they are so shit why is there barely any japanes or american car on european roads?

>>16411083
They are literally on top of none of the reliability studies

>>16412194
>comparing camry and crown vic to a E class
fuck. off.

>>16411962
>>16412134

Mercedes-Benz used to be the Rolls Royce of automobiles.

>>16412278
Maybach used to be the Volkswagen of Mercedes.

>>16412185
>always posting new german cars
you fucking tryhards lmao

>>16412270
Merc E class are the most popular taxis in Europe.
Crown vic is (or used to be) the most popular taxis in the US.
Europe has different standards

>>16412270
true though, the crown vic is shit compared to an E class

>>16412175
>>16411962
>previous owner probably swapped a tranny, or two

yeah, good on you, m8

>>16412212

Because its cheaper to maintain european cars is europe. Simple as that. Also germoney cars have some kind of meme status that everyone has to buy one.

>>16411293
>not unreliable

You literally just defined an unreliable car.

>>16411016
stick to your jap pieces of shit poorfag

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this changes wildly every year.

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>>16413297
Because JD Power is fucking garbage.

They put "my infotainment was hard to use" in the same level as "transmission failure"

>>16411016
Too many electronics

>>16411083
Lol when will this meme die already , german cars aren't more reliable than any other eurobrand

>>16414559

jeez ford is such a crapshoot

>well this brand new car could either be a great piece of engineering or it could fall apart just sitting in the garage

meanwhile, cadillac just sinks to the bottom because they can't pay for the reviewers to keep them afloat LOL

>>16413297
>J.D. Power is bullshit
call the cops

>>16414559
>VW above Porsche
>VW, Chevrolet, Ford, fucking MINI have a higher top end than Mercedes
seems legit

>>16411654
They do sell Cadillacs here. The previous Chevy generation was here as well. Buick is basically Opel and Ford is Ford, there are like one or two cars exclusive to the US for each.

>>16414559
>They put "my infotainment was hard to use" in the same level as "transmission failure"
>implying CR is any different whatsoever

>>16416706
They are different, you dumb fuck.

Consumer Reports has much more credibility. From CR FAQ

>Are all problems considered equally serious?

>Problems with the engine-major, cooling system, transmission-major, and driveline are more likely to take a car out of service and to be more expensive to repair than the other problem areas. Consequently, we weigh these areas more heavily in our calculations of Used Car Verdicts and Predicted Reliability. Problems such as broken trim and in-car electronics have a much smaller weight. Problems in any area can be an expense and a bother, though, so we report them all in the Reliability History charts.

Meanwhile in JD Power land

>If an owner can't get his or her phone to connect via Bluetooth to the audio system, that's a problem. If an owner's audible command isn't properly deciphered by that annoying synthesized voice all infotainment systems seem plagued by, that's a problem. But are either of those problems as serious as a transmission that won't shift, or an engine that won't start? Not by my standards. But by J.D. Power's, the answer is yes.

>>16414559

>Audi at top of list, above several jap cars

This list is bullshit lmao,

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>>16411188
>audi
>bmw
>vw
>reliable

The shit I read on /o/ continues to get crazier and crazier with each passing day.

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>>16417044
>>16413297
JD Power and Memers in 2017

>>16417021
They are reliable, but when something breaks is a complete disaster that will fuck up your wallet.

Unlike Japanese cars that are also reliable but cheap to repair too.

>>16411016
so there is people who dont like german cars?

>>16418590
I love german cars, I just wouldn't buy one because of the poor reliability and costly repairs.

>>16411083
>they are constantly at the top of a junk pile in the junkyard

Fix'd

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>>16411016
Mine has never "broke down" but a lot of moving and serious parts have suddenly broke for no apparent reason.

This >>16411685

Expect to pay minimum $250 for minor parts, $400 as the median. Might not sound like a lot on the internet, but shit starts to add up and happens frequently. I don't know what kind of car I'm getting next because I love this thing even though it is such a flimsy built piece of plastic.

>>16418957
And the worst thing, the interior is seriously built cheap. And to top off the terrible build quality, OEM interior parts are ridiculously expensive. My center console piece broke a few months ago and I have been trying to find a wrecked model to take the part from since it would cost $400 for just the part alone from Mercedes-Benz. Not including the hour or more labor to install it. There have been a few other interior pieces that have broke too. Just an all around money pit but you don't want to let the car look/turn into a "backup vehicle" because the exterior looks so nice. Seriously don't recommend Mercedes-Benz. And the newer ones, in my experience, look worst and the interiors on the new C-Class models are pretty shit, perhaps even worst than my mid 2000s c-class if you compared them equally.