Why did we even invent this

WHATS THAT A WATER NOSE

Why dont they just put electric waterpumps on these days?

>>16347748
if the pump is going to be placed near a belt location, but not have it driven off it? it's not like you ever need the pump turned off

>>16347770
i dont know variable pump speeds set automatically by the ECU would be pretty neat.

>Can spin right up to 8k rpm+ when the car is getting hot sitting at stop go traffic or only midway through the rev range or something

>>16347777
heat control is what solenoids are for.

>>16347789
i meant controlling the pump speed

>>16347791
why do you want to vary the pump speed? it's a closed loop and variable speed pumps are less efficient than constant speed ones. plus they don't have as long of a life.

>>16347796
idk brainfart

>>16347798
lol ok.
to be fair, electric water pumps are nice for systems that don't need to pass near the belts.

>>16347712
That's what you get for buying an overengineered german piece of shit lol

>Germans
>In charge of water pumps

I still don't know how BMW manages to make water pumps consistently a failure point on all of their cars from the early 1980s to date. Meanwhile my Honda went 150k miles/20 years on the original water pump. No play, had a metal impeller, didn't even leak. Just changed it because I was 60k miles overdue on a timing belt job.

>>16347964
i pulled a orginal waterpump out of a 4.0 xj that was 20 years old with 300k km on it and it was perfectly fine.

Germany reliability is a fucking meme

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>>16347964
>>16347971
>Buy shitty 1992 Corolla with 200,000 miles as first car
>Original 20 year old water pump started leaking at 220,000
>I ain't even mad

>>16347971
OP here, It lasted 130,000mi, and only died when I was getting it nice and hot while flushing the coolant.

Really, I hate the gasket more than the pump. Pump off and on was ~2hr, getting the gasket surface cleaned of all the gunk on it took much longer.

>>16347712

I did mine on a transverse I5 with like a 2.5" gap between it and the block. Its really not that bad. Ive done it twice even.

>>16348534

the bay and the block, derp

>>16347777
>let invent something that can break

>>16347791
KISS: keep it simple, stupid.

>>16347748
Because electric is more expensive and less reliable than that 100-year-old single moving part water pump in OPs pic.

You can buy aftermarket electric water pumps if you really want one. I'm a mechanic and laugh at that shit.

>1978 Celica water pump goes bad
>at 7 AM
>spitting fucking vaporized coolant out of the bearing seal, fan flopping around enough to STRIKE RADIATOR
>on the way home from a 12 hour shift
>wait for oreilly's to open, order water pump to be delivered to store at 11:30
>sleep in car in stall at self-service carwash
>retrieve replacement pump
>install in fucking car wash, alone
>drive home, sleep for 2 hours, return to wage slaving

git fucking gud kid

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>>16347712
At least you dont have to replace your water cooled tensioner pulley.

>>16349737
>Because electric is . . . less reliable than that 100-year-old single moving part water pump in OPs pic.
Take your pills and sit down grandpa

>>16347789
>>16347791
>>16347796

None of you know anything.

>>16347964
>>16348014

Yet on BMW motorcycles the water pump is a consistent, predictable failure point to the point that people carry replacement kits. JUST like fucking final drives.

>>16349777
>coolant pipe straight through the belt tensioner

My sides.

>>16349777
Which GM shitbox has this? I'm guessing GMC Acadia, those things are fucking abortions.

>>16348014
oh shit. my '98 tacoma has 222k on the original water pump, wonder how much longer it has left.

>>16349755

You are lucky to get it done in the same day.

I have the most popular vehicle in my country and none of the parts places have water pumps because when they bring in 200 they all disappear in a week and you have to wait 4 months for the next shipment.

First worlders have it so easy yet they play like they can rough it.

>>16350242
If the automotive industry was up to them we never would have had pressurized oil systems.
Just let the con rods slosh around in the crank oil!! No system to break and it's worked all this time!!

>>16347777
Daily reminder that flow rate does not affect cooling capacity past a minimum flow.

>>16351829
That doesn't sound right.
Q= MV(T'-T") would indicate that a higher mass flowrate would provide greater heat Transfer.

>>16351918
>past a minimum flow
If the flow isn't fast enough, yes it will lower cooling capacity. But after that point, more flow doesn't add anything because the radiator is already working at it's max capacity which is limited by its surface area.

>>16351971
well why not just put one a second water pump?

>>16352006
Not that guy, but it takes a man and a woman 9 months to make a baby. Using two men and two women won't make a baby in 4.5 months. That's why adding a second water pump won't help you cool a radiator better.

>>16352006
you'd be better off with a bigger radiator

>>16347748
They fucking do, use Google next time

https://m.summitracing.com/search/part-type/water-pumps-electrical

Even OEMs use them, look at Mercedes Benz's new I6

>>16349737
>less reliable
But takes less than 5 minutes to replace, and can weigh less since it doesn't need all that reinforcement to be attached to the block and the belt. Doesn't need to take as much heat, either.

Tons of benefits. And really, electric motors have been getting cheap as fuck.

>>16347712
Isn't that M102 engine waterpump (W124 or W201 mercedes)? That's like 2-3 hours to replace at max and doesnt require any special tools.

>>16352195
No BUT they WILL make 2 babies in the time it took for the single couple to produce 1. That means the radiator will be cooled twice as much in the same time

>>16354618
That's not how a radiator works.

>>16354715
This, you're not making two babies, your impregnating your wife then fucking her again to try to make her 'more pregnant'. You want to do as you describe, you either get better/two fans, or a whole extra radiator.

Even then, why? If you need that much extra cooling, there's a problem with the engine/you are GM.

>>16351971

Okay Linus we are talking about cars not custom water loops.

>>16354750
They're literally the same thing, a car's is just bigger.

>water block=cooling jackets on cylinders
>tubing is tubing
>water pump
>radiator
>fan to move air across the radiator
Once the flow is fast enough to saturate the radiator fins with heat, it doesn't matter if the flow is 10gpm or 1000gpm, it won't change a single fucking thing if the radiator is the same size. If you want more cooling you either need better fans or a bigger/more radiators.

I remember how easy replacing the water pump on my ex's old '93 Century was.

>>16356558
this. flow doesn't matter you can only remove so much heat and thats dependent on the efficiency of the radiator.

You won't change the temperature of the water with more flow.

>>16350242
How many spare BMW water pumps you keep in your trunk?
Enough to get home id hope

>>16356596
the bmws with water pump issues dont use electric water pumps.

>>16356633
>Be euro car technician
>Have replaced over 100 electric water pumps in 2 years
>Have done maybe half as many mechanical pumps and only due to leakage
You're full of shit.

>>16354275
>Takes less than 5 minutes to replace
You've never replaced a factory electric water pump. On any car. Ever.
Let's use the BMW 3 Series as an example. The E46 uses a conventional water pump on the front of the engine. Even on a car with an auto tranny, the water pump (and thermostat) can be replaced in less than an hour by anybody with a good idea of what they're doing. It's even quicker for manual cars.
The E90 water pump is situated on the lower right side of the engine amidst a rat's nest of hoses and the standalone thermostat. Even an experienced technician has difficulty getting the pump and t-stat out in less than an hour because they're bulky and can usually only be removed from the engine bay in one specific position. The addition of a convertible top or turbos make this even more difficult by placing more and more shit in the way of the water pump. In you have a 335i convertible, you're pretty much fucked. IIRC those call for something like 5 hours.
>Can weigh less
Not in my experience. BMW's electric pumps weigh nearly twice as much as their largest mechanical pump. The auxiliary pumps they use on some models are small but they're not meant to produce the entirety of the coolant flow.
>Doesn't need to take as much heat
BMW mounts their electric water pumps on the exhaust side of the engine.
>electric motors have been getting cheap as fuck
From Amazon
>Price of an OEM (Hepu) water pump for M54 engine: $58
>Price of an OEM (Continental) water pump for N52 engine: $385

>>16347777
Cooling comes from air moving across the radiator, not the water pump speed.
Waste of quads

>>16357113
It's not 1999

The point of electric water pumps is for power. Not weight, or easy of replacement, or cost.
There's nothing about an electric water pump that makes in inherently less reliable than a mechanical one.

ELECTRIC WATER PUMPS ARE ONLY GOOD FOR COMPETITION CARS THAT PROBABLY GET REPLACED EVERY COUPLE OF RACES IF NOT EVERY RACE.

>>16357149
they don't have thermostats. the pump acts like a thermostat.

>>16357159
Modern BMW's don't have coolant temp gauges.

My old shop foreman owns an E90 335i, one day randomly the coolant light turned on yellow, 20 seconds later it turns on red. Luckily the car was 300 feet from the shop. Car only has an oil temp gauge. He said after replacing the water pump, the car warmed up faster but its a gradual thing, so you'd never really notice.

Replace the belt if the waterpump is in good shape and not leaking. Can't say the same for an electric water pump.

At least you have a neat "residual heat" that cycles the water pump on to keep heat in the cabin without the engine running. Also the bleeding procedure after replacing a water pump is mighty neat, sounds like a washing machine.

>>16350580
>Toyota

Probably until the earth crashes into the sun, when that happens then you can consider replacing it.

>>16357219
Modern cars don't have temp gauges, not just BMWs. My Fiesta doesn't either.

It's fucking stupid, but what can you do.

>>16357159
>There's nothing about an electric water pump that makes in inherently less reliable than a mechanical one.
Except for the part where you have coolant and electricity separated by a tiny seal that is very sensitive to coolant chemistry. If your mixture is off by about 5% or more or you use the wrong coolant the seal will shit itself and the pump motor will seize faster than you can say "Holy fuck, my unnecessarily-complex engine is overheating".
Also, the impeller and pump housing are made of plastic and plastic doesn't like being exposed to extreme temperature change, especially German plastic. I've had more plastic cooling components crumble in my hands than I can count.

>>16357520
This is wrong..
The seals are the same. There's no reason for them to be different.
I don't understand why you think an electric motor turning a pump is somehow different than a mechanical lever. Both have seals, and sealed brushless motors aren't very sensitive to water.

Also bearing failures that eventually bust the impellers are the result of BMWs poor design. Not an inherent fault of electric pumps.

>>16357573
Not him, but you can actualy use wet running brushless motors in a waterpump, so you won´t need any seal and avoid leaks.

>>16357676
Not trying to argue just curious, would you have to worry about electrolysis with this

>>16357706
Nope, you would put a magnetic runner in the water and the coils on the outer case.

>>16357706
Only if the case cracks.

>>16350456
T. Vato zone employee

>>16357159
Holy shit you are dumb.

Yeah because clearly in 20 years a plastic, electronic water pump won't give out due to constant heating and cooling or become fragile anyway.

I work at a shitbox euro garage and see this all the god damn time. BMW X series SUV's are the worst offenders because BMW became trash 1990 and onward. For being a typical boomer, Scotty Kilmer is right about electric water pumps. They're meant to fail, they will never be as reliable as a metal belt driven pump, you have to be a dumbfuck to buy a euro car for reliability.

>>16357229
What a stupid meme. I had to change the water pump in my Camry at 180k bc the bearing sounded like marbles