When is it EVER a necessity to take your car to the stealership

Certain parts are literally impossible to find without certain channels of supply.

Also, some procedures are so ass fucking backwards that only the dealership techs actually know how to do them correctly.

>literally just fluid changes
>can't even into green text properly

What's the point of this thread, all I'm sensing is negativity.

Is the picture yours op? If so why would we care?

No one here who respects themselves go to any shop ever except for major stuff like engine swapping. Everyone else and their buddies are swapping transmissions like the garage faggots we are

>>15419448
when you own any eurotrash car with fancy computers in it that go wrong or electric/hybrid car

>>15419448
>for service?
When you even a remote chance of your car being serviced properly instead of by monkeys without the proper tools and no factory service manuals.

i got a notice in the mail that my car needs to go to the dealer for some recall seat repair

it's an 07 yaris i bought used, i'm not going to bother

>>15419484
Recalls are free. Just do it

>>15419448
I take my car to the dealership all the time to get service.
Because I work there.
And I do the maintenance myself.
For free.
Poor fags stay to your autoparts stores.

>>15419573
i literally don't care though
the car's creeping on a decade old and i've had no problems with the seat thus far

>>15419467
>dealership techs actually know how to do them correctly

>dealership techs
>doing things correctly
Pick one

very rarely are there cars that cannot be serviced by indie shops. i guess electrics for now but indies are getting the equipment and expertise to deal with those too

>>15419477
Once fully electric cars enter the mid-price sedan market (which they will very soon), it will probably be easier to do self-repairs on them.

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>>15419448
I guess on topic

>Bought used Subaru Legacy
>Being a dumbass I also bought the warranty
>Would hear a crunching noise whenever my foot was on the brake and I turned the steering wheel left
>Was most likely the tierod ends
>Checked, boots were shot
>Alright. So I can take it in to the dealer and have them fix it for free or I can pay for the parts.
>Took it into the dealer
>They kept the car for a month and a half
>Refused to give it back
>Gave me a loaner 2012 ford fusion ecoboost
>Only after I threw the biggest shitfit 2weeks into the 'servicing'
>Get my Subaru back
>"Yeah so we replaced the power steering system"
>"We also broke _____ but you wanted the car back soon so"
>I asked why the power steering system
>"Well there was metal in the filter"
>"So the total is going to be $2600"
>No fucking way, fuck you. I have a warranty that specifically states POWER STEERING SYSTEM FULL COVERAGE
>"O-oh well then it's going to be $100 for the deductable"
>Okay fuck you just give me my fucking car back

Pieces of shit. First and last time I've ever taken a car to the dealership to get serviced. Bob Penkhus is the biggest pile of shit, I really hope other dealerships aren't like this.

>>15419579
Are you retarded? Recalls are usually for shit that will kill you if they're not fixed. If it was an obvious flaw the manufacturer/the previous owner/you would've already fixed it.

Go get it fixed and stop playing games with your life.

>>15419823
>Recalls are usually for shit that will kill you
Definitely not usually. Majority of recalls are for quality control things.

>>15419448
>losing coolant, don't know why
>bmw, so free diagnostics at stealership
>found out that one of the main hoses has frayed to hell
>they want $500 for replacement
>for a $70 fix
>buy the hose from a website
>arrives in a few days
>me and dad open up hood, replace hose within an hour
>good as new, no more coolant loss
How much fucking training do you even need to replace a fucking coolant hose? Do you need to be BMW certified to pull out tabs and shit? They even tried upsell me, said that it's a """good""" idea to replace every other hose anyway, for $2000. what the fuck

For absolute bitchwork that you don't want to put a mechanic through, dealerships are great for. For example, the diesel Fords that require you to literally remove the cab from the frame to service the turbo. IF you could find an aftermarket shop to do that, you'll be out of a vehicle for a bit. The dealership, however, will probably charge a bit more, and should have it back to you lots quicker if they do them enough.

Also warranty and recall work. That shits free, you might as well do it.

>>15419448
>for service?
Anything to do with the computer in the car

Only the big computer with proprietary software in a dealership can fix some issues

The computer in my moms Cadi stopped "seeing" the catalytic converter and O2 sensors, would throw a bitch fit and not go over 40MPH

After determining that the cat and sensors were fine... 15 minutes hooked up to the computer, a software tweet... and $200... and good as "new".

sigh

>>15419888

>People should do labor for free!!!!111
Also
>Bought a BMW
>Expects dealership service to be cheap

Also
>Bought a BMW

>>15419448

kek, I bet your ATF recombitator is worn out too.

If I can't fix it I just take it to my dealership.

I can afford it so why not. Yeah, probably losing a few dollars or a hundred but whatever. Very rarely do this.

>>15419448
>for service?

My local chevrolet dealership is always trying to find reasons to invalidate my warranty. Improper maintenance is one of those reasons. Just because maintenance was performed does not mean it was correctly performed. They also invalidate warranty based upon incorrect maintenance procedures or faulty equipment being used. They are pretty vicious about warranty disqualification at Good Chevrolet in Renton Washington on new cars. For good reason. They make far more profit on doing the same work on non-warranty cars.

Good Chevrolet really ruins for me the magic feeling of owning a new car with their greed. Their car repair service shop is pretty large and they get a lot of service business. It's always packed full. So I can understand there is a financial reason to prefer non-warranty work because in-warranty work means GM pays the repair costs and it is not possible to fool or defraud GM as to how much it costs or to fraudulently overcharge GM on the fees and amount of service time needed to perform the repairs.

>>15419591
>>dealership techs actually know how to do them correctly
>dealership techs
>doing things correctly

The problem is that if they do things incorrectly, they still charge you for their learning experience. That's because the total time in the shop is still charged to you. That's how it works at my local GM dealership

>>15419771
>Bob Penkhus is the biggest pile of shit, I really hope other dealerships aren't like this.

Good Chevrolet of Renton, Washington seems to be similar. That's why buying extended warranty coverage on new cars is a risky thing. What good is buying it when they find sneaky ways to cancel it on you? It's a very unfair feeling.

Because your dealer has plenty of business, it can afford to let warranty service jobs wait. So that may be why your car took over a month for servicing. It was probably waiting for an open slot when they had no out-of-warranty work left to do.

Your attorney general should have some rules for auto servicing to be done in a timely fashion. Taking a month is too long. You should look up the law and have the attorney general go to bat for you on that Subaru.

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>>15421485
Try Titus will ford in Tacoma. Wouldn't honor the warranty on the brand new engine my dad payed 6k to have installed for my birthday. I wanted to throw acid in that faggots face.

>>15421485
Hi there,

Just so our good name isn't dragged through the mud, Good Chevrolet HONORED your warranty despite you having rounded off the oil drain screw and run the engine with low oil when you brought it in for service. You have been spreading your lies over the Internet and we are sick of seeing them!

>>15421503
I'm not that guy with the rounded oil drain screw. There's plenty of people you silence with lawyers and you can keep getting forum articles removed with lawyer threats though.

It does ruin the magic of buying my new car from Good Chevrolet just to have the warranty disqualification threat.

>>15421503
>Warranties
>Sorry Sir, the tech can't feel that vibration.
>Sorry Sir, the water pump is not part of the drivetrain.
>Sorry Sir, burning one quart of oil every 500 miles is within fatory spec.
>Sorry Sir, we don't accept store recepits as evidence of an oil change.
>Sorry Sir, the ECU shows that the car has exceeded 90 MPH.
>Sorry Sir, all of these transmissions shift hard.
>Sorry Sir, I know it's been a week, but we can't get to it until next Thursday.
>Sorry Sir, the tech found an un-approved modification.

>>15419484
How many miles?
Got one too, bought it with 36k.
Now have around 100k trouble free.

>>15419758
The majority of people don't even know what type of batteries are in their vibrators, and your expecting them to fuck around with high voltage DC? I've seen horrific repairs on USB charge cables, people are going to die if they fuck around with 400+ volts DC.

>>15419758
you think a average normie would know not to touch the orange wires?

>>15421771
This 100%. The only people that are going to be able to do repairs on electric cars are people who aren't retarded and able to repair cars currently.

>>15419448
Some dealerships are awful - like the Acura dealership in Salem, Oregon. All they want is your money.

You're better off finding a trust worthy mechanic through word of mouth. It is hard to do some servicing your self tho - like rotor resurfacing? How you gon do that huh? You need a mechanic.

>>15421820
>rotor resurfacing
I can get new rotors from RA for $18 ea. Why bother?

>>15421771
The dangerous aspects are ignored when People are desperate to try to get something to work. It's just like people using milk jugs to store transport or store gasoline. Need trumps safety. <-- Or need trumps hillary.

Anyways, desperate people will ignore that a meltdown of one LiON cell can cause a neighboring cell to also meltdown. This can continue in a chain reaction until the whole battery pack is an explosive burst of power. There is so much energy stored in that small space that is is similar to a bomb if immediately released, a super hot fire if normally released, or a smoldering meltdown if the cells are isolated somewhat from each other.

I don't want to live in the same apartment building or next door to someone's house if they are going to mod or repair their own LiON battery packs. They are going to do a cut-rate job using fake scam chinese batteries and end up with a battery fire.

Chinese sources are unreliable as parts quality goes due to their bait and switch tactics of substituting inferior parts or processes once they think you are no longer inspecting them. For example, check the following:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?400136-Disassembly-of-some-UltraFire-batteries

>>15419857

>quality control

>yaris seat recall is for slider lock that could break in an accident, let seat slide freely
>Sienna rubber oil cooler pipe that can burst, recall replaces with metal
>SC430/Tundra airbag replacement
>Tacoma frame/leaf spring replacement because shit was rusting out/puncture gas tank

This shit can kill you, and this is Toyota alone. There is minor QC things like switches and trim, but if it's free, just fucking do it and decline if they try to sell you on service.

>>15422048
What is the point of your post?

>>15422372
>just fucking do it
FAGGOT

I need to take my car to a dealership that has a digital laser alignment rack if i ever mess with the suspension


Any tuning needs to be done by a shop with an awd dyno

>>15422048
Don't forget that for most car manufacturers, the mere presence of a recall indicates that by their own estimation, carrying out the recall will cost less than the litigation that would ensue from not fixing the issue (even with an army of elite lawyers).

>>15422379
Who said not to do it? I said that the majority of recalls aren't for safety critical fixes. They're for shit going wrong that shouldn't and that if they don't fix, they'll be sued for.

>>15421990

Nice link.

I work with QC and inspection of mechanical parts from china and can confirm they are unreliable as fuck.

>>15421820
>Business
>they want my money

No shit. That's what businesses do.

Resale value which you're really going to damage around here if you don't have a full service record even on everyman cars because nobody wants to buy a shiny turd with hidden faults. Of course this only goes for a certain age range which increases with higher original value.

>>15422482
>a full service record
Why is a dealership required for that?

>>15421990
>>15422457
There's an interesting website called China Law Blog that discusses many legal issues involved with doing business in China. Obviously, product manufacturing is a frequent topic.

Reading a few of those posts confirms the basic suspicion that it's normal for Chinese firms to try and screw anyone who comes their way. Hell, the PRC government practically encourages it.

>>15422493
>Why is a dealership required for that?
Because some dealerships try to find ways to disqualify you from parts of the warranty. Once they record that into the GM system, then further in-warranty repair on that is no longer available. For example, if you mod the power train, then can use that as a way to cancel warranty coverage of all powertrain coverage even if you bought the extended warranty.

Some dealers may do that because they still want to repair your car, but not in-warranty where GM pays them a smaller amount. They want it out of warranty where you have to pay them a much bigger amount. They can also upsell you on other related problems such as your oil plug stripped the threads, so now you need a new oil pan. They refuse to repair it by rethreading the hole and giving you a bigger screw for that hole. Thus the dealer makes more money AND also sells you several new expensive parts because you have to buy both the oil pan and a new expensive oil pan gasket AND the labor for installing an oil pan gasket and the new oil pan. And of course you get charged for the oil change since you needed new replacement oil.

Makes you wonder if they take your used oil pan and sell it to the body shop repair market as used parts after rethreading it.

>>15422528
>it's normal for Chinese firms to try and screw anyone who comes their way. Hell, the PRC government practically encourages it.
I don't think the PRC really has to do anything to encourage that since it's a Chinese societal view. In most of the world if you become known as a cheat you tend to be shamed, even ostracized to a degree, but not with the Chinese. There a cheat is considered a smart businessman and a role model. Now what the PRC does do is completely fail to curb any but the worst abuses (usually where foreign nationals died resulting in a diplomatic incident) which I suppose you could view as a form of encouragement.

>>15422465
there's a difference between preforming a service and ripping people off. Do you understand that?

>>15422549
>dealerships find ways to disqualify you from the warranty
No doubt about that, but I was responding to the post that was discussing selling a used car with a full service records, not about maintaining the shit factory warranty.

>>15422549
The manufacturer is the one that pays for warranty repairs not the dealership. The dealer will abide by the manufacturers policies but they still want to repair the car even if it's under warranty - because the manufacturer generally pays for more labor time than needed.

>>15419467
how is babby formed? how is babby formed? how girl use alldata?

>>15421471
they do not abide by booktime?

>>15422528
>>15421990
>>15422457
>>15422681
>There a cheat is considered a smart businessman and a role model.

From another thread at >>15418860 with graph of differences between identical battery model Eneloop AA NiMH made in japan and made in china. Quite a big difference in quality.

{quote}
USA or japan made results in more reliable batteries. Got to beware of chinese parts as even the new LiON cells they sell may have recycled LiON battery parts inside of them. They know you arent' going to send the cell back to them for replacement, and if you did, they would simply not respond.

See this thread article for examples of chinese LiON batteries taken apart showing how they are actually recycled used batteries or are missing required safety features.

LiON from China has scam or illegal (in usa) parts inside:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?400136-Disassembly-of-some-UltraFire-batteries

Other chinese batteries also have variances, so it is not just those few brands proven in that thread. For example, the same model/size of ENELOOP NiMH batteries can be made in either japan or china. But the chinese ones have half the life of the japanese ones even though they are supposed to be the exact same battery model and catalog number.
{/quote}

>>15422681
Oh, there's absolutely a cultural aspect to it, but the Chinese legal system also really limits recourse for foreign firms that are wronged.

Additionally, the Chinese consumer market is effectively closed to foreign companies. Selling to Chinese consumers means setting up a Chinese majority owned partnership to sell (and typically manufacture) the goods. This system then allows the Chinese half of the partnership to steal the foreign company's intellectual property and/or just force them out of China and take over the business.

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tesla's door handles are so complex and full of innovative technology, literally NO ONE is allowed to remove them except for telsa techs. If the body shop needs to remove the handle to paint the car, they have to fly in a tech from tesla.

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>needed a cheap but hard to find part
>went to VW dealership because I didn't want to wait for it to ship
>while waiting in line this women starts yelling
>she had brought in her car for some simple service
>the dealership recommended some additional more extensive service
>she declined
>dealership did it anyway
>they wouldn't give her car back unless she payed the $1200 for the additional service
>got my part and was leaving
>she was still yelling

>>15422849
>tesla's door handles are so complex and full of innovative technology, literally NO ONE is allowed to remove them except for telsa techs. If the body shop needs to remove the handle to paint the car, they have to fly in a tech from tesla.

That sounds like how manufacturer's were like before the Magnuson-Moss Act was passed. Only Tesla has found a way around it to limit bodywork or the ability to take apart certain parts of the car.

I can see it now: Tesla's engines are so complex and full of innovative technology that literally no one is allowed to supply repair parts for the car other than Tesla.

Anyways, Magnuson-Moss made it so that if the manufacturer required consumables or certain other things to ONLY come from that manufacturer, then the company had to provide those items for free. So if Tesla required that only tesla tires can be used on the car, then those tires must be furnished free of charge.

It's a fine point for the batteries since they are only furnished as a patented assembly in a special container package with proprietary software in the processors overseeing the batteries. But the cells are commodity cells in the earlier models of battery packs. So they technically could be replaced one at a time by some other company than tesla.

>>15422867
In my state, we had for a time a democrat attorney general that was big on consumer rights. In my state, if she didn't sign the form, then it is furnished free of charge. The shop cannot take it back either without her permission as it is her car. The shop must also obtain signed permission to perform repairs and prior to signing, the cost estimate is provided. Exceeding the estimate can be done only with approval.

PCM flashes.

Because no mechanic around me will pay the massive amount of money it costs to release specific software.

>>15419448
>When is it EVER a necessity to take your car to the stealership

When I need to document the scheduled maintenance. I dread those because every time I visit the dealer for each of my cars, they are so expensive. It's always some terrible price like $400 for spark plugs, plus the basic fee for the inspection and diagnosis of what is wrong with the car.

You need blinker fluid replacement. The gasket is leaky so that's $1600. A few times with past cars, the scheduled maint ended up $800 or more. The worst was your A/C compressor has a leak and needs to be replaced. Stealership scores +$2000.for that scheduled maint. Do I really know if it needed it or not? The dealer doesn't really repair anything. They love to replace. So if you were like that stripped oil plug guy, they wouldn't rethread it (a repair). They'd sell a new oil pan and drain screw. That's how my dealer is.

At least other places don't charge me for the basic inspection but I hope the dealership is more thorough since they are charging me a big fee to inspect to see what is wrong with the car that they can then charge me to have proper maintenance to maintain my warranty.

Time for sched maint soon for my blinker fluid and to replace the plugs with new iridium ones. The car doesn't seem to need new plugs, but every time without fail they always push new iridium plugs. Just like JiffyLube urges you to get a new air filter because it's time you get a new one. and another flush too.

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>>15421498
Fuck those guys. Lakehood fag here, went to those guys once to check out the lot. They're all insufferable cunts.

>>15423792
>stealership
>JiffyLube
I can't decide which is worse!

>>15422729
> manufacturer generally pays for more labor time than needed.

kek
you know nothing about how factory warranty pays. it pays shit and every tech hates it.

>>15423792
At our dealership you get free inspection with your oil change, that inspection is only for regular maintenance items. We will show you air filters and present you an estimate. It's up to you to get it done, but if shit fails and you haven't done the service you may have to pay a lot more for a repair.
If you have a specific problem you want us to diagnose, that's $110 fee.

>>15421990
We have one electric car we sell. We literally have ONE technician that is certified to work on those. Every time we have to replace a battery on an electric car, it arrives on a pallet along with a special jack, tools and a fucking pair of rubber gloves and boots that will fucking ground you, because if you fuck up - you done goofed.

>>15422407
I know this because Tyler knows this.

>>15422681
>... with the Chinese. There a cheat is considered a smart businessman and a role model.

Chinese tire manufacturers imported substandard unsafe tires to the USA. Some Chinese manufacturers had forced recalls. Some are:
. . . Westlake Tires
. . . AKS Tires
. . . Telluride tires
. . . Compass Tires

These brands with recall tires are all actually made by one company Hangzhou Zhongce Rubber Company. Among the recall complaint is alleged the tires even lack basic safety features such as gum strips which are a rubber feature that helps prevent steel belts inside the tire from separating or damaging the rubber.

While other Chinese-made tires not under recall can be considered better, if you buy, make sure your Chinese-imported tires have safety and performance features such as belt stiffeners, bead wedges and nylon cap plies that are considered to be industry standards these days. Don't believe what they tell you, you need to have verified real marketplace examples. After all, one chinese "all season" tire is claimed to be better than Michelin Pilot.

>>15421990
It's Li-Ion, not LiON.

>>15424187

and people wonder why no one likes the chinese...

>>15419448

My exhaust cracked right before the cat, go to dealership, talk it up with the supervisor about old cars while it gets a free check to see what's up, mechanic comes back with a parts-sheet and tells me they need to order an entire new exhaust and circles area with crack the highlighter, walks away. Supervisor tells me $2000 for parts who knows for labor, tells me to just walk out and find a small shop that does custom exhausts that will weld it shut.

Not all stealerships are bad...
But then again at a different one they changed a solenoid in my fuel system and in the end it was a $15 gas cap that had a crack and caused the leak error on the computer.

In general if you can't feel comfortable with the guy's at the stealership, bail on them.

>>15424671
>My exhaust cracked right before the cat, go to dealership, talk it up with the supervisor about old cars while it gets a free check to see what's up

You have a Dealership whereas mine is a Stealership. Over here, for new car warranty work, they put your car into an exam process and write down the cost of the exam. If they find something wrong that is in warranty, then they do not charge you for the examination of the warranty problem. If they could not find anything wrong, then you have the exam fee to pay. Or if they find something else wrong, you have the exam fee to pay.

At this Stealership, there is occasionally courtesy towards exams and charges, but it is more by serendipity than by deliberate constant effort to please the customer. The service writers clearly have the profitability of the stealership in mind when they write up the contract. Don't get me wrong here, all employees of every business should have the welfare of the company in mind. But in this situation, that is all there is; there is not much welfare of the customer in mind. The young woman service writer there is more into trying to satisfy some sort of quota or goal in avoiding in-warranty work if it can be steered to out of warranty work.

There must be some reward program going on for them to do such things. It's too "obvious" with attitudes like that.

I bought a new car with a warranty for a reason

>>15419484
I'd get the car worked if you ever plan on selling it.

>>15419448
I take it to the dealer so I don't have to pay anything.

Lets say a new car with warranty will cost you 50k. If instead you buy a five year old model for 35k is there literally anything that extra 15k wont fix? You can likely even buy a beater as a temporary while your car is being serviced.

I genuinely think the whole "new car" thing is an absolute hoax.

>Going in for the 4th recall on my car

Thanks for finally fixing the headgasket issue, GM. It's only been 12 years.

>>15425679
>I bought a new car with a warranty for a reason

And now your dealer has found ways to disqualify parts of your 3 year bomper to bumper warranty. That info is now entered into the GM network..

>>15426085
If new cars were bought with cash then you might've had a point but since they are financed for the most part that $15k doesn't exist and any repairs would be paid out of monies intended for other things. Like rent or house payment.

What a new car gives is stability and predictability. You may be spending $400/mo but you know it's coming and can plan for it. That $2000 trans rebuild the used car without a warranty suddenly needed was a surprise and set back your financial planning by months at the least.

>>15426134
Why would they do that? They WANT to make money. You fuckers think auto warranties are trickery. Only 3rd party warranties are.

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>>15426211
>>15422708
>>15421485
>They WANT to make money.
The Stealership makes more money if it is out of warranty repair. As others have said, in-warranty repairs are paid by GM and the profit for the dealership is less. Even a service writer said so but in different words.

The car owner still needs the repair. By removing the repair from warranty coverage, the Stealership makes more money doing that repair out of warranty. It's ruthlessness by the dealer. Same ruthless approach in how they get rid of posts in moderated forum sites by threatening lawyer action for negative posts.

>>15426332
You're paranoid. This pretty much never happens.

>>15426347
>>15426332
>>15421485
>>15421695
You're the shill for the dealer. Dealerships do deny warranty coverage if they find something they don't like. It is one of the traditional irate complaints about "stealerships".

>>15426134
>And now your dealer has found ways to disqualify parts of your 3 year bomper to bumper warranty.

Not legally possible.

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>>15426378
Like I said, you're paranoid.

>>15419857
Only time i went in for a recall was when my honda needed its airbag replaced since it could burst and send shrapnel into my face.

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>>15419448
>Change auto fluid
>$220.95usd

>>15426190
>not budgeting for repairs
It's almost like your average person is an idiot

>>15426378
>You're the shill for the dealer

Seriously?
>Shilling on the Japanese pedophile financial escrow database

>>15426426
Ok?

>>15422390
you are so fucking pretentious, your post was not necessary

>>15427202
>you are so fucking pretentious, your post was not necessary
That guy sounds just like the dealer's service writer line for line. If you mention that other shops also have digital alignment, the service writer would then twist things around like their gear is not calibrated and depend on you not defending them because you don't know the gear. But that gear has its own calibration for each usage (but the dealer's service writer depended on you not knowing that).

Nevertheless, there are dealerships and there are stealerships. Using examples of dealerships to defend stealerships is sophistry and just plain wrong. Stealers are stealers. You have stealership supporters or staff saying that dealers never find ways to deny warranty coverage that it is impossible to do so. That is very wrong.

>>15422390
>I need to take my car to a dealership that has a digital laser alignment rack if i ever mess with the suspension

There's plenty of places with digital laser alignment tools. In fact, quite a few independent auto maint shops in my area have digital laser alignment. No need to go to the more expensive Stealership.

If you do too much messing with your suspension, the dealer might even say you have damaged it.

>>15419448
Body repair

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>>15430268
>Body repair
All the dealers I know of have NO Body Repair shop on the premises. They simply refer users to other body shops. And if you have insurance, the insurance will take over the whole process since it is their money. They have their own pre-contracted body shops.

If you don't ask which shop, they might even choose one for you without you choosing. That's the case for undrivable cars since they tell the tow truck where to go. But if it's driveable, then they will tell you where to drive to so in those cases you will get to choose. So always be involved in the process to always be able to make choices.

Remember, the car goes somewhere to get estimates. Some body shops have higher estimates because they do "top quality" work. That almost always means swapping out all damaged gear or replacing with new parts. That results in a high estimate and the insurance company will say your car is totaled and pay you a small used car price (LOW BALL). Some people have negotiated a higher payment so don't accept it without research.

If the estimate is high, you may look over the insurance company's list of pre-approved body shops and pick a LOW Quality one. WHY the fuck you do that? A lesser quality repair has a lower estimate and that might mean the insurance company allows the repair and doesn't total the car. There are times where that is the better choice if the engine and power train are unaffected and remain in good shape. So, "more quality" is not always the better choice. Remain flexible in your thinking.

>>15431626
>All the dealers I know of have NO Body Repair shop on the premises.

It would be a huge image problem to have junker cars constantly being towed in seen by the new car buyers. And it also uses a lot of space the dealer doesn't have. I've never seen any dealer not totally pack every square inch with cars or service department.

>>15433259
>I bring my car to the dealership for everything it needs, they're the only ones I let touch my baby.
Face reality, you go there because they give you a complimentary penis massage each time you go for servicing.

>>15432451

Actually a lot of dealerships are refusing to open body shops simply because its too much of a pain to deal with anymore. Insurance companies have a very firm grip on the auto body repair business. If they don't like your rates, they wont deal with you anymore, and will try to talk their own customers out of using them.

Then you have the fact that new cars can be written off by looking at them wrong. Today's "hyper safe" cars can experience damage to the unibody in most accident types. A head on collision above 20mph is a good way to ensure your car wont ever be fixed simply because of how the body is designed to deal with the impact.

Basically, between having to fuck around with insurance companies all the time, and having customers demand their junk vehicle to be towed to the dealership, where it will sit, often for free, until another tow truck shows up to take it away, makes auto body repair a good business for a dealership to burn money with.

>>15434440
>Today's "hyper safe" cars can experience damage to the unibody in most accident types. A head on collision above 20mph is a good way to ensure your car wont ever be fixed simply because of how the body is designed to deal with the impact.

It just feels like the car companies want cars to be easily totaled. It's not like the old (but less safe) cars that had repairable bodies that lasted forever. Those cars keep hanging around as used cars. If only all used cars totally failed at the age of 12 years, then the companies would sell a lot more new cars.

It seems like the new super safe cars will do that. By the time it reaches 10 years, it statistically had a good chance of getting just enough collision damage to be totaled. As to what percentage chance, I cannot accurately say, but I bet it is a lot larger than for cars made in the 1990's and 1980's.

>>15419578
Words of wisdom brother.

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Why do we go to dealers? Because we paid for the new car warranty as part of the purchase price of the car. But dealers make less from warranty jobs than if they did the same job out of warranty. That is where the greed trap occurs.

>>15421466
>>15421485
>>15421737
>Warranties
>YOU MUST PAY THE EXAMINATION FEE IF THE REPORTED PROBLEM DOESN"T EXIST OR IS NOT COVERED BY WARRANTY
>Sorry Sir, the tech can't feel that vibration.
>Sorry Sir, the water pump is not part of the drivetrain..
>Sorry Sir, we don't accept store recepits as evidence of an oil change.
>Sorry Sir, the ECU shows that the car has exceeded 90 MPH.(violation of the law and warranty doesn't support legal violations)
>Sorry Sir, the tech found an un-approved modification.

That example about Good Chevrolet sounds lime my stealership too. Having items refused to be covered under the new car warranty is nothing new. Lots of people experience that problem during the typical 3 year/36K warranty period. A real problem is the large fee the dealer charges for the examination where he rejects your problem as being covered under warranty.

If the dealer says the problem was done by the owner or other people it is not covered and the warranty for that category could be voided. If the problem occurred as a result of not enough maintenance or not-on-time maintenance, then it is not covered and the warranty for that category could be voided. If the problem exists as a result of incorrect repair or incorrect maintenance, the warranty for that is voided. If the problem exists as a result of user-supplied parts, then the problem is not covered. If user-supplied parts caused damage to other subsystems, then the warranty for those subsystems is voided. That is how the stealership approach to warranties works.

What adds salt to the wound is that - -
YOU MUST PAY THE EXAMINATION FEE IF THE STEALERSHIP CLAIMS THE REPORTED PROBLEM DOESN"T EXIST OR IS NOT COVERED BY WARRANTY.

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>>15435835
>Warranties
>YOU MUST PAY THE EXAMINATION FEE IF THE REPORTED PROBLEM DOESN"T EXIST OR IS NOT COVERED BY WARRANTY
>Sorry Sir, the tech can't feel that vibration.
>Sorry Sir, the water pump is not part of the drivetrain..
>Sorry Sir, we don't accept store recepits as evidence of an oil change.
>Sorry Sir, the ECU shows that the car has exceeded 90 MPH.(violation of the law and warranty doesn't support legal violations)
>Sorry Sir, the tech found an un-approved modification.

OK. I'll take it to (mechanic down the road), and have him send you the bill.

Then actually do it. And then report them to corporate. If you have a certified local mechanic write up stuff for you to pass onto the higher up, your dealership will come crawling back to you for settlement offers. Most of the time you don't even have to go to court.

Even if you do, small claims is like 50 bucks to file in most states, and most judges fucking hate car dealerships trying to pull shit. Buddy of mine got stonewalled by a local dealership and showed up with the warden after they refused to pay a judgement. Took 12 grand in cash out of their safe in the back, in front of the manager, and there was nothing they could do about it. I'm of the opinion that he should have walked off with all their tool chests and auctioned them off, but he just wanted it over with.

The problem is that most people are too timid to stand up for themselves, and those that are are frequently loud mouthed fuckwits. Both are problems that are cheaper to ignore. You have no reason to play the game on the same level as the dealership. If they give you the runaround, go for the nuclear options available to you, and let them hang themselves in front of a judge when they try to explain why they violated their contractual obligations to you. Don't threaten to do something when they tell you to do something, just document it, then actually do it.

>>15422743
Alldata is useless outside of the US

I had to go back to a dealership to get the instrument cluster reprogrammed because for some reason it lost its programming and triggered the immobilizer.

My fucking airbag light on the panel comes on every night after I drive for like 4 min. I never see it on during the day, it only comes on at night. Is this a reason to bring it into the dealer?

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>>15437590
>My fucking airbag light on the panel comes on every night after I drive for like 4 min. I never see it on during the day, it only comes on at night. Is this a reason to bring it into the dealer?

>Warranties
>YOU MUST PAY THE EXAMINATION FEE IF THE REPORTED PROBLEM DOESN"T EXIST OR IS NOT COVERED BY WARRANTY
>Sorry Sir, the tech can't see a problem with the airbag light..
>Sorry Sir, the ECU shows that the car has exceeded 90 MPH.(violation of the law and warranty doesn't support legal violations)
>Sorry Sir, the tech found an un-approved modification (3rd party radio)

Okay, if they give you problems, they need to test it in a dark spot OR cover up the light sensor with tape. That way the car thinks it is dark and will then reproduce the error.

In a recent thread on /o/, someone mentioned that disconnecting the factory radio or connecting their 3rd party radio did something that caused the airbag light to be one. I forgot where I read that though.

>>15437611

Alright, cool. Ill do the light sensor thing at home to see if I can trigger it. Appreciate it.

>>15437619
Duplicating the problem for the dealer is probably the main problem. The dealer is too used to saying there isn't a problem (because of all the people who mistakenly come in with non-problems).

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>>15438843
Yeah. My dealer seems to feign ignorance, blindness, and deafness for some problems in order to deny their existence.

To avoid the trick of being forced to pay for an examination to see if there is a problem, try to get the service writer to come out to your car to see the problem so that they can write up the description. That sometimes works. But the service writer can refuse to do anything until after the examination which requires a fee if the problem is not accepted by the dealer as being under warranty coverage. If they find nothing wrong, you pay the fee too.

So try to get the service writer out to your car and avoid the exam fee.

>>15440080
See >>15437249

Don't play their games. Get their report on your receipt, and then take it elsewhere. Get two other opinions, and have them write up and then sign off on what they think is wrong. File a complaint directly with regional management, or go even higher to national corporate citing your independent proof. Send it certified mail so you can prove they got it. Don't be rude. Just say that you expect this to be resolved in a timely and satisfactory fashion. Usually regional management lights a fire under their asses, and some companies even levy fines against dealerships that 'tarnish the brand name'. If they do not respond satisfactorily, or you need it fixed right away, get it fixed locally, and sue the dealership.

I've done this. The instant a process server serves them, they shit their pants. They try to settle, but at that point you've racked up additional expenses that they will need to pay for. You've flipped the tables around. If they don't settle for everything, you can waste enormous amounts of their money, and still get everything, and depending on the state, get interest on that as well.

If you can't afford to absorb the costs of repairs in the short term, you are a little limited in your options, but if you are that tight on money, why the fuck did you buy a new car in the first place?

>>15426426
>call ferd
>tell them i want airbag replaced
>"uh we have half the parts, youll get a letter when we are ready"

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>>15440282
>why the fuck did you buy a new car in the first place?
Because I was weak and the Chevrolet dealership's salesman convinced me that was the financially better approach when moving up from my motorcycle.

>>15419476
>going to a shop to swap an engine
Lol

>>15422048
>gm minivans
>the glove box latch recall
So dangerang

>>15419448
Sealed transmission service?

>>15441178
>Sealed transmission service?
JiffyLube would still say you need a transmission flush.

>>15440878
>Buying American instead of Japanese econo shitbox when worried about money.

Negro what action do you perform?

>>15426378
I work for a dealership that deals with long haul trucks. semis and the sort. cant speak for consumer car stealershits. as long as ive been there never canceled warranty coverage on a semi unless an owner operator decides to go out and take emissions components and gets them "deleted". thus making his semi EPA uncompliant. and becoming a legal issue. we dont report the truck. and we will still work on it but at that point its all customer pay. and you think cars are expensive.

>>15442328
That's because semis have huge corporate customer bases. You don't get to fuck around too much because a company could lose contracts worth half a billion in revenue if even one of their dealerships tries to jerk clients around.

>>15442328
>>15442868
My new Chevy consumer car's dealer is Good Chevrolet in Renton and my opinion is that it is a Stealership. Other opinions may vary of course due to service writer experience and what attitude the inspecting mechanic has.

There are five dealers for my make/model in my metro area of which 3 are Stealerships, and 2 are Dealerships based on consumers I have talked to.

As an example, Good Chevrolet wanted $170 for alignment on top of an Examination fee. My Stealership's service writer creates the initial contract for the customer which is the examination, the customer initials it, and the exam is on. After the exam, the discovered items are identified and added to the contract form. If the customer doesn't want it, it is initialed as declined so that the dealer uses that as evidence of deliberate non-maint. The stealership knows the next time the car comes in with a necessary must-have-it-fixed-now repair, that it is more profitable to fix it out of warranty than in warranty. So it finds sneaky ways to disqualify coverage under warranty.

My new car has non-protective tires where the rim touches the curb instead of the tire in that situation. Thus with parallel parking the rim can get scrape marks. My stealership disqualifies new car alignment coverage (free in first 6 months of life) if it sees scratches on any rim since that could affect alignment. It also discourages use of the free 2 oil changes in the first 2 years of life. Its 2 oil change bays are always full of non-warranty oil changes that are more profitable.

In comparison, the far away chevy Dealership gives free alignment checks (my stealership charges $120 for alignment exam). That Dealership gives $69 four wheel alignment while my Stealership charges $170 for the alignment after the exam.

Even for consumable items, the Dealership charges $39.99 for full synth everyday price while my Stealership charges a lot more for full synth oil changes.

>>15444287
>the Dealership charges $39.99 for full synth everyday price

*continued followup*
Sorry, I meant to say, that is the price I get when I talk to that service writer. The $39 full synth rate is a courtesy to me since I bought my car from that Lee Johnson chevy dealership. When I talk to that service writer, he gives me that courtesy price. I turned my nose down on the two free oil changes since those are the synthblend. I will only go full synth.

Apparently, service writers are allowed to have some latittude as to how to do writeups. A stealership will have greedy service writers aiming for their financial bonuses. Those stealership mechanics and stealership service writers and stealership service managers deliberately sacrifice the customer.

At least the stealership has some redeeming qualities. It doesn't rub oily rags across the air filter and then say "Hey, your air filter is dirty and you need a new one". That's for one of those oil change shops known for doing that trick.

I wasn't able to find anyone but mazda who could clear the DPF light on my mazda 3 diesel

>>15419467
>Certain parts are literally impossible to find without certain channels of supply.
Kek its called wholesalers and internet

Fuck dealerships outside of stuff i cant get anywhere else i just use the local performance shop and his connections

>>15444638
>I will only go full synth.
"Synthetic" is just a marketing term. In the US, even group 3 lubes are allowed to be called "synthetic."

>>15445032
There's no worry about misuse of the term "synthetic" or "full synthetic" when you go with the brand name synthetic oils from Castrol Edge, Mobile1, Pennzoil Platinum, Quaker State, or Valvoline.

It's not like you're buying "full synthetic" oil from a chinese supplier. A lot of chinese motor oils exist with SAE logos printed on the labels, but that doesn't mean the companies actually licensed the SAE logo, and tested the oil acording to SAE standards. The chinese companies simply treated the SAE logo as something more to print on the label to make the oils sell better.

>>15446464
>brand name
Group 3 lubes are marketed by brand name suppliers as full synthetics.

>>15444739
>Fuck dealerships outside of stuff i cant get anywhere else

I have tried looking up an alternate supplier of my AGM car battery in my GM car, and there is no one yet other than chinese sources. But I don't trust chinese products since they will cram a 350CCA battery inside a larger 600CCA battery case and sell it at 2 times the price if they think they can get away with it. It's common practice there to take better condition used parts and repackage them in new cases and sell it as a new unit. So no made in china batteries for me.

>>15426378
>Dealerships do deny warranty coverage if they find something they don't like. It is one of the traditional irate complaints about "stealerships".

That's because the manufacture can and will deny warranty claims that the dealer submitted, often for retarded reasons. When that happens the dealer has to eat the cost of that warranty repair. I'm not saying dealers aren't slimy, but having worked as a dealer tech for a few years seeing things from the other side, there are reasons that dealers are so stingy and bitchy about warranty repairs. Hell at the dealer I worked at they got audited by corporate 3 times in 5 years for "excessive warranty claims" compared to other dealers in the area. Bullshit because that dealer is top 10 in the whole country for volume of cars sold and serviced so of course we were submitting more claims that other much less busy dealers.

>>15447896
While that happens, the dealer is in the game for the big profits and rewards. It is unfair for him to blame the occasional loss on the customer who doesn't receive all those riches. If anything, it is customers that give the dealers all that wealth.

>>15419448
They are willing to do a manual swap for 1800$ instead of 2600$ like every transmission replacement place wants.

>>15449575
>They are willing to do a manual swap for 1800$ instead of 2600$ like every transmission replacement place wants.

There's no way my Stealership would ever be that cheap. A swap of a mere A/C compressor is $1800 to replace the A/C with a new one (I have gotten that estimate before so I know for sure) at my stealership. So there is no way a much more complex transmission swap of my bad transmission to a used transmission from somewhere else is a mere $1800 from them unless your dealership is one of those kindly places with a big heart. My area had a dealership like that but then the founder (non college, just HS degree) died and his 2 sons were college educated and were all about dollars per square foot per hour earnings from service departments.

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>>15450142

Dealerships have customers who are in desperate need of repair help.

Stealerships have victims to be taken advantage of because they are in desperate need of repair help.

>>15447844
>But I don't trust chinese products since they will cram a 350CCA battery inside a larger 600CCA battery case and sell it at 2 times the price if they think they can get away with it.

Taking apart consumer li-ion batteries shows that's the case. It probably occurs for car batteries too. Some chinese car tire sellers retread tires and sell them as new. As for devices lacking required safety features, the URL below shows batteries that are missing required features even though some claim to have them in their marketing literature or on the battery packaging. The federal government required recalls on some chinese tires sold in the usa because those tires were missing required basic tire construction items or required safety features.

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?400136-Disassembly-of-some-UltraFire-batteries

>>15447844

What Chinese manufacturers will do sometimes, especially when dealing with building things for foreign resellers, is they'll produce some really super high quality items using high quality material. They'll do this so long as they suspect the reseller is preforming their own quality checks, and as soon as they think its stopped, oooooohhhh boy. The quality drops instantly, and they start nickel and diming every fucking thing they can. Cheap steel, cheap plastic, whatever cuts costs down. They'll keep that shit up until they get caught, and suddenly quality jumps back up for a bit. They'll play that game as long as they can until the reseller drops them, because they've normally saved enough money that it wont matter.

The Chinese are some scummy fucks when it comes to manufacturing.

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>>15452519
>>15452480
I remember going to get brakes done at a Discount Tire shop due to their per axle special. The rotors were made in China and of course each arrived in some barely recognizable smushed recycled-content low-grade cardboard wrapping. The steel was somewhat covered with a fine patina of rust already since there was no oil coating them.

Those chinese-made rotors must have been made from trash scrap metal or something. They lasted one turning and then could not be turned anymore. In fact, I was told the rotor would be close to the limit after the turning. I wonder of those metal smelters in China are used to dispose of any scrap metal they don't want.

Oh sure, just toss that bed frame pot metal in there. We're making rotors for those Gweilo (americans).

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>>15452519
>The Chinese are some scummy fucks when it comes to manufacturing.

The substandard parts makes stealerships more possible because those parts go to the independent repair shops. Thus, the stealership will usually be able to have a superior part whose quality was probably checked. The small shops will just keep on selling the part even if it was defective when received. They're too small to throw the part away or force the seller to accept a return.

And it's not just manufacturing. Well, in a way it is. They are creating islands out in the ocean and then claiming 200 mile radiuses around them. Even if those islands are close to other countries. So, they even have claims 10 miles off the coast of the Philippine Islands. One would think the Philippines get to have their own 200 mile exclusion zone, but evidently not if China builds islands off their coast.

From cheap substandard auto parts to low-grade islands. GTA has changed to be GTI (grand theft island).

>>15419448
>When is it EVER a necessity to take your car to the stealership

Outside of the 3 year bumper to bumper warranty, it's because of the parts availability situation. Sometimes, I just don't want some generic NAPA (made in china) parts. The independent shops may also source from autozone, o'reilly, or AAP which usually means chinese parts again. At least with the dealer, most of the time it is not wholly chinese made.

Like all the other people, my stealership likes to try to disqualify me for warranty coverage. Someone mentioned that takes the magic out of having a new car. YES, that hit the nail on the head. It really does ruin the mood of having a new car. I hate that. I paid a huge amount of depreciation in return for that magic feeling and the greedy dealership tries to be a stealership because its service writers are super greedy about making their bonus targets - just like Jiffylube techs trying to sell you air filters and flushes to boost their monthly earnings.

My stealership is also in the pacific northwest. It's a chevrolet dealer and large.

>>15422048
>Mitsubishi Lancer: recall of the airbag's impact sensors which could corrode too fast and not work in case of a crash

Just felt like contributing. Got into a crash a year later.

>>15419448
>When is it EVER a necessity to take your car to the stealership

If the stealership offered a GM-approved mod to have each rear seat sense passengers and choose to not fire the airbags, I would quite possibly purchase that mod. I intend to keep the car for a long time unlike people who simply lease and run. So buying such mods that have long term presence is useful to me. Having all the airbags shoot off is just too expensive to replace and is usually the final straw totals a used car out of insurance coverage.

>>15457803
if the airbags go off chances are the car will be wrecked

>>15419448
When its complimentary/free.

Oil Change, you just use the OEM oil and you can easily do it yourself or at a local shop. But always demand it to be OEM, don't trust these after-market retards who only drives a shitbox.

For tire rotations, wheel alignment, etc... you can bring it to your shop.

The only time you absolutely need to go to the dealership is that they literally require you to or its cheaper than elsewhere somehow.

>Lexus

>>15440921
>he's never been in a head-on collision going 60 mph and had his glovebox fly off its hinges and hit him in the skull, causing permanent and severe brain damage

>>15458500
That's why bass boom boxes and even those bazooka tubes should be mounted inside the trunk and not in the passenger cabin (back seat). In an accident, they will bump upwards and then fly forward (as has occurred).

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>>15459812
People still buy those huge carpeted wooden bass speaker boxes because they are cheap and movable from shitbox to shitbox. A custom built-subwoofer system can't be removed from the car, so that means all that money is lost if the car is broken.

>>15447896
>reasons that dealers are so stingy and bitchy about warranty repairs
A good dealership keeps these issues between them and the manufacturer, and does not subject their customers to this bullshit. A stealership looks for any reason to deny a claim.

>>15419448
>When is it EVER a necessity to take your car to the stealership

For those planned maintenance items listed in the owner's manual. They all cost $500 or so. What a Steal errrr "bargain"

>>15463276
>maintenance items listed in the owner's manual
You don't have to go to the dealer for those.

>>15461682
>A stealership looks for any reason to deny a claim.
If the dealership is always packed, it makes sense to them (on their spreadsheet analysis) to prioritize having more profitable jobs. That would be expressed in terms of Revenue per uarter-Hour. My local stealership seems to measure bay assignments for each mechanic in terms of quarter hours. I had always thought it would be by the minute, but someone ELSE posted in a local forum that their dealer (the same as mine) charged customers bay time (in the calculations) on a quarter hour basis.

So that means if a mechanic uses 16 minutes of bay time for your job, you get charged for a half hour of bay time. That implies if the mechanic finished three 16 minute tasks in one hour, he could make 1.5 hours worth of bay charge profit to the customer without violating the law. I have no confirmation other than what that guy posted in our local forum. That was years ago too. But people sharing small unrelated facts can sometimes result in the picture puzzle being mostly filled in by those small random facts. Unless those facts change or are wrong.

>>15453721
No oil coating your rotors?

>>15465707
Kek i thought the same thing anon

>>15465707
>No oil coating your rotors?
They looked dry when delivered. Probably why the were rusted. Chinese quality reflecting their attention to detail.

>tfw car is too old to bother taking to a dealership
>tfw I can get everything done on it at home
feels good

>>15422465
a business should want your money more than once, so they have a incentive to not fuck up the first time

There's a franchise BMW dealership which is my nearest garage and they price match tyres, and with every set of tyres purchased for fitting, they do a health check on the car, as well as a wash and vac

>>15440921
>have old cavalier
>glove box latch has broken repeatedly
>order new one, replace, breaks again
>glove box is metal and rests against the passengers shins
If I had gotten into an accident with a passenger while driving that piece of shit I could picture it taking their kneecaps off.

But it could just be my imagination.

>>15466989
>glove box
Just take it out and discard it.

>>15466899
>a business should want your money more than once, so they have a incentive to not fuck up the first time

Not if there is a captive audience. Stealerships have a somewhat captive audience

Another case exists when there is a short term employee who plans to be gone with a year. Those employees don't care about repeat business because they know they won't be around long enough for the repeat customer to return. Opportunity knocks, and mechanics listen. Thus, milking customers for commissions is the most profitable thing to do before moving on. It's almost the perfect crime too because it leaves the shop holding the blame.

>>15466899
>a business should want your money more than once, so they have a incentive to not fuck up the first time
The business is not itself a living being, so it has no opinion. It's the individual employees who decide to reward themselves with monthly bonuses and commissions on each repair completed. They want to make the most money per hour, so that means non-warranty work is preferred over warranty work.

>>15468724
>non-warranty work is preferred over warranty work
That seems reasonable. But the dealerships are aggressively trying to void warranties, and that's fucked up.

>>15419448
>>15419467
>that only the dealership techs actually know how to do them correctly.
> the dealership techs actually know how to do them correctly.
> know how to do them correctly.
> dealership
> knowing

KEK i cant believe that people actually think that dealerships know shit. They dont know a god damn thing, they are kids fresh out of community college that have no fucking idea what they are doing or what you need done.

How do i know this? im a mechanic, and half of my friends all work at dealerships, hell im sitting across from a friend that works at chevy and hes keking along with me.

If you cant change your own oil, or figure out when your pads are metal to metal your going to get reamed no matter who you go to but thinking a dealership is the "correct" place to go is hillarious.

>>15469380
>i cant believe that people actually think that dealerships know shit.

My Chevy stealership has a whole standard bag of things to toss at customers. If you defeat one, they pull out another and toss it at you. Sooner or later they find one that you cannot explain because there is simply no way you can know everything about other shops.

The other shops don't use digital lasers. They aren't factory trained. Their equipment is not calibrated as accurately as ours. <-- you can see with those kinds of excuses, you are trapped into their asshole logic.

I can't say what I'd like to because then the dealer will identify me and punish me by using the maximum number of excuses to void warranty or do a botched job.

They have great reviews on yelp because their lawyers slap down the rest despite yelp's claim that they don't delete negative reviews. They have before and that was part of the scandal of reviews as consumer reports pointed out.

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>>15471132
>>15469380
>How do i know this? im a mechanic, and half of my friends all work at dealerships, hell im sitting across from a friend that works at chevy and hes keking along with me.
>If you cant change your own oil, or figure out when your pads are metal to metal your going to get reamed

That's why we call them Stealerships. They LOVE to avoid repairing anything because replacing old parts with new gives them the most profit. They get to not only sell you a repair job, but they also sell you new parts at their MSRP. Frequently, replacing a part also means selling you the gasket and gasket job which is added profit.

But there are still dealers out there that are Dealerships without being Stealerships. As an example in my area, one chevy Stealership charges $120 to examine your car which includes their bragged about calibrated digital laser alignment exam and then $170 for a rear axle alignment. At the same time, a different chevy Dealership gives free align exam (because digital laser align is easy & superfast) and their all axle alignment is $69 (not just rear axle).

The Stealership from the customer description knows it's alignment but the service writer wants to sell "car examinations" for $120 even for in-warranty jobs. If 100% of all the problems are in-warranty, then there is no exam fee, but if even one item is out-of-warranty (e.g. they claim it is not covered due to lack of maint or improper maint) then the exam fee applies. You see the ripoff danger here. It also depends on which service writer you get. There is a young female there that just jams on the fees. I avoid her now because she's just too jammin' with meeting her bonus reward sales goals. Her bonus rewards are more important to her than conserving the customers' wallets.

>>15466899
>a business should want your money more than once, so they have a incentive to not fuck up the first time

That's idealistic thinking.

Many sales staff who want your money think in the short term. What can you do for them now. Distant future sales are too unpredictable.

When a stealership says they look forward to your future business, it is mostly empty platitude. It is said for form's sake.

I'm not sure its ever really been necessary, I go to dealership because they always provide me with a loaner at no charge if I want one, or if I choose to wait they will set me up in a sales office so that I have a quiet place to do some work.

Basically their prices are reasonable and their customer service is fantastic so I continue to give them business.

>>15467502
>Stealerships have a somewhat captive audience

It seems no matter what, all the dealers have plenty of service business. Since being a stealership doesn't seem to reduce the customers, why not keep on making bigger profits by being a stealership?

It makes sense to be a stealership. Besides, people have no where to post those kinds of customer comments to make sure a stealership loses customers. The stealership monitors the web and tells their lawyers to give the forum site a big lawyer letter that the writing is incorrect and damaging as there no court conviction proving that what the customer said was true. So the forum site basically deletes any negative posts mentioning dealers by name from then on. For all dealers.

Thus the stealerships get away with it due to no real bad publicity that is read by the common people. Only a few 4channers who don't even use any particular dealer. And even on 4chan, people hardly mention a specific dealer name. The fear factor of being sued. Or is that called the "chilling effect"?

>>15426379
>Not legally possible.
That's because you're Alphonse the troll or one of those other trolls that regularly goes into threads to post a short one liner (of the type you're wrong, impossible, you're paranoid, not legally possible, etc) followed by some laughing or smiling picture.

Having items refused to be covered under the new car warranty is nothing new. Lots of people experience that problem during the typical 3 year/36K warranty period.

I took my 2000 intrigue to a dealership because it got recalled due to bad ignition. That was 1 months ago. Didn't think they did recalls on 16 year old cars

>>15479108
>Didn't think they did recalls on 16 year old cars
Some cases drag out for 5 years or more. The longer it takes, the fewer the cars there will be at the time the recall is ordered. Thus cost savings.

>>15476257
>It seems no matter what, all the dealers have plenty of service business. Since being a stealership doesn't seem to reduce the customers, why not keep on making bigger profits by being a stealership?

Much of the problem is that there's not enough negative stories about the stealerships because their lawyers get almost all the stories censored or deleted. It's at the point where all the forums and news commentary sites for autos don't allow negative commentary about a dealer since they don't want the headache and expense of lawyers bothering them.

>>15434440
>>15435333
different anon here, desu, i feel like older cars withstand impacts better(if not the drivers) from personnel experiance. Crashed my 96 accord at 25mph into an old lady at a red light(she was fine, but her car was deemed a loss, 2013 camry) but only thing that got messed up on my car was hood, front motor mount, radiator and partial bending of the front. car survived another 5 years and two more front end crahsed by my sister, until the ignition system crapped out at 280k, sold it to a junker for 1k, which was a steal in my opinion, since i had bought the car for 2.5k at 180k miles. Meanwhile my sisters new RAV4 got rear ended by a neighbors high schooler(what goes around comes around) and was deemed a loss, despite the kid hitting it at about the same speed i did in my old accord.
i am literally not contributing anything to thsi thread, i just wanted to share my story.

>>15481728
The new cars have so many airbags that if it is older than 5 years, it's the end for all the cheaper "affordable" cars.

>>15481728
Unibodies are designed to warp and collapse on impact. They are much safer than body on frame designs. The drawback is that they warp slightly during minor accidents. The proliferation of airbags is another thing that gets consumed/destroyed in a crash. 20 mph crashes used to involve bolting a new bumper onto the car. The driver took all of the impact and lived. These days, the car takes the impact, and it's often not worth salvaging. 50 mph crashes used to total the car. The driver again took all the impact but died. These days the car takes most of the impact, and the driver can walk away.

Yeah, old cars don't break during fender benders. After walking away from getting tboned by semis running red lights and doing 40+ on two separate occasions, I will never buy a body on frame car. Classic cars are cool, but they are deathtraps, and the continuously decreasing traffic fatality and serious injury rates per capita back that up. Cars are faster than they have ever been, and yet they are safer.

>>15483459
>The proliferation of airbags is another thing that gets consumed/destroyed in a crash
The problem is that all the airbags in a car can go off even if everything above one foot is okay. My neighbor hit a ground obstacle and all his airbags went off. The inner side of the rim hit the obstacle crunching it and then the suspension arm hit the rest of the obstacle. He came to a stop of course but all the airbags went off. No damage to the car except that lower part. It was an older used car. So when all the airbags went off, the front passenger airbag broke the windshield and of course tore open the dash on top as it burst out like an alien chestburster (only faster). The computer is shot since the design back then was to force the car owner to go back to the dealer and replace the airbags instead of continuing to drive the car around.

The odometer display continued to work which he said annoyed him. If nothing else worked, he said it was deliberately designed to increase costs to total a used car beyond a certain number of years. He had to get another car since the insurance company refused to repair it due to airbag, computer, airbag controller, windshield, dash replacement, seats had to be reupholstered since side airbags tear the seats open as they come out, pillar, headliner for airbags, and more. Ignoring suspension and wheel (all the collision damage), just the airbag related damage repair cost from the dealer is 5900 dollars due to computer and controller adding costs along with dash replacement.

Looking at what happened, the airbag solution was much worse than the problem.