Weak V8s

Why do you think the meme is a young 18-24 wrenching on his Mustang camaro challenger charger ?
They were all working on th e car to get more power by getting rid of emissions and tuning carbs

>gross ratings are a lot higher than SAE Net hp rating
>higher octane leaded fuel
>factory over-rating
>higher compression
>more lift and duration from camshafts (terrible emissions)

because american engineering is le superior!!1!

>>15414249
Lower compression, unleaded gas and catalytic converters, along with a demand for more MPG and insurance raping the fuck out of performance cars. It was a perfect storm to kill speed, and it's kind of amazing that we've since bounced back to building 400+ hp cars in regular production.

>>15414263
also
>EGR
>smog pump/air injection
>catalytic converters
>lean factory carburetor tuning

emissions regulations got really strict around that time period

in the 90's they started to recover

Not OP but on a related note, how hard would it be to take a smog era V8 and build it for performance? Is it as simple as new cams, carb, exhaust and emissions delete?

>>15414297
not very, but depends on how much power you want to make

most smog era V8's have like 7.9-8.8:1 compression, low flow heads and restrictive manifolds

also
>cams

>>15414297
OP here, this is pretty much what I wanted to figure out

>>15414307
you can make hp for cheap if you're willing to get your hands dirty

http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/engines-drivetrain/sucp-0609-chevy-small-block-engine-build/

>>15414323
Cool thanks, thats pretty much what I'm looking to do

>>15414369
you can look them up for every manufacturer and engine, there's been tons of them all over the internet

>>15414281
Imagine if none of that shit ever happened,
Current gen Mustang GTs would have like 650 hp.

>>15414304
>Tfw my 85 diesel v8 has 21.5:1 compression
I know it's different cause diesel, but still. Holy shit.

>>15414441
diesels are compression ignition, if it was 10:1 it just wouldn't work

>>15414304
Turns out theres a lot more to performance than the number of cylinders and displacement.

Which is why "could have had a V8" is a meme.

>>15414447
yes and no. the average i6 from the era was neutered as well. if you thought the V8 was fukt, the 4 and 6 cylinders were slow as shit as well.

>>15414297
I have a 79 camaro that I bought from a dude who rebuilt it with a mild cam, racing heads and pistons, edelbrock carb, corvette intake and I deleted all the EGR and smog shit. The difference is literally night and day from a stock 5.7L with 150hp. However I still have the 350 turbo hydro behind it so I'm not able to make much use of all the power. I want the 700r4

>playing with a '67 Corvette Stingray 427 convertible in my LS1 Trans Am

>my car is 32 years newer and was defiantly slower


i didn't even want to try to race him because i was scared to drive next to it

>>15414379
Since you seem pretty knowledgeable on this stuff, what would be the absolute cheapest way to put together a solid dd muscle car with some decent power? I don't care about the body or interior condition, just performance and attitude

>>15414467
>>15414467
you will blow the 700r4, they're shit.

th350 is a good trans m8 what are you talking about?

>>15414475
>427 stingray convertible
aroused
>tfw no 7.0l FE

>>15414477
what's your budget? and I only know what I know, not too much but I do a lot of bullshitting with hot rodders and I am starting to collect parts to build a 351w for my ferd.

>cheapest
hands down finding a 2WD longbed chevy C10 pickup or ford F100. parts are everywhere, you can build a 302 or 351w on a very cheap budget and they are super easy to work on. if you want a car, there are some easy options.

none of the muscle cars made good numbers

racing muscle in shitbox Hondas that can smoke them has ruined any respect I had for them

theyre good for nothing more than getting boomer boners

>>15414485
Maybe I need to just re do my rear end then? The 3 speed and this much power means I can fly from 0-60 like it's fucking nothing and then also pickup super quick again from 65 to 100 on the highway but I top out at like 105mph and then I'm just redlining my engine because lol no 4th gear lol no OD. My 150hp firebird hits 135 with the 700r4

>>15414496
>racing muscle in shitbox Hondas that can smoke them has ruined any respect I had for them


>drive ls1 t/a

>see hondas try to """"Race"""" me

i don't even attempt to acknowledge them

>>15414496
>none of the muscle cars made good numbers
this is incorrect. a 428 cobra jet made like 440 hp in a 3600 lb car with 4.30 gears and a stout 4 speed manual. with good tires that is still a seriously quick vehicle

>>15414475
>defiantly

kys

>>15414501
you need a stall and gears

>>15414496
Back in the day they were hot shit. That's like saying "wow john cena beat up muhammad ali's corpse, he sucks"

>>15414505
your Firebird isnt a muscle car

Im talking about real carbed muscle here

>>15414507
wat

a 428 made more like 330hp with a 7.0L engine

that isnt good

>>15414510
Stall?

>>15414501
if you really want overdrive, 4l80 or built 4l60 mang. 700r4 is weaker, and first gear is super short. that being said, you probably have super short gears. I have 4.11s on my 65 and those are great for drag racing (if I didn't have a turd of a motor) but suck for DD duty with no overdrive. I will be swapping an AOD at some point, and maybe a manual but I would rather not

>>15414513
yes

but now theyre not anything more than a pretty face

same with all old cars

only difference is people pretend muscle is fast

>>15414523
torque converter stall

just google

>>15414518
"no"

while most of that shit was overated, the serious performance engines made some serious power.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jQJLKWlbQI

>>15414518
>your Firebird isnt a muscle car

our old '79 firebird had a 400 ci pontiac and made 400 HP+


>hondas
>competing with a muscle car

i drive an EF hatch but you're a retard

>>15414531
>but now theyre not anything more than a pretty face
true. but for boomers it's like looking at an old picture of their now overweight and sagging wife. good to jerk off to while pretending time hasn't marched forward.

>>15414494
Lol I'm honestly looking at old c-10s right now, that might be the route I'm going. Budget would ideally be around 5000 grand starting, but my plan is to add to it as I go, paycheck to paycheck. I just want simple; a carburated, manual v8 that I can romp on and have fun with. Also why longbed?

>>15414542
longbed is usually cheaper, but find whatever you'd like. for 5k you have a lot of breathing room. what's your local cl? also post in the CCG, it's slow but guys there have a lot more knowledge than I do.

>>15414524
Don't get me wrong I love flying off lines and burning tires but I'm a poorfag and I DD it 26 miles each way 5 days a week plus 50 miles each way to my in laws on the weekends it would be nice to not have to be at 3500 rpm to stay at 80mph. Also id like to get more top speed out of it. I was talking to a dude who builds and races trucks and he mentioned a tranny swap plus driveshaft plus regear to absolutely maximize top speed but I don't remember any specifics

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>>15414538
>not wanting to drive an interesting looking classic car that makes a nice sound and still competes with modern performance cars

eat shit faggot

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>>15414533
but thats not stock

>>15414536
modified means fuck all

you can get some random B18B and throw an ebay kit on for an easy 300+hp

and its going to weigh a lot less than any muscle car

I dont dislike muscle either Im just saying

>>15414456
Indeed.

But if you mention a V6 mustang here you will get laughed at, even if the technology/gearing make the car faster than many older V8s.

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>>15414557
That's a fucking thing of beauty mate what year is it?

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>>15414555
yeah that's a good option. depending on your power output and what diff you have, you can get to around 3.83 or 3.54 for decent acceleration, but an overdrive transmission will make the most difference at increasing fuel econ and operating rpms. I sit at like 3k at 60 mph, which is a shitload considering the truck hits valve float around 4.5k rpm. still, tested it today and I am getting like 14mpg! that's way better than I thought the old girl could do

>>15414542
Holy shit bro your budget is 5,000,0000? Must be nice being a billionaire

>>15414563
not mine


but its like a '79-81 or some shit

>>15414550
Cool thanks, im in Phoenix btw

>>15414559
>but that's not stock
it has a barely more aggressive camshaft than stock, with stock heads, manifolds, pistons, ignition, carb, intake, crank and rods.

if you think just a cam would make it go from 330 to 450+ then m8 you are mistaken

>>15414561
I have driven the new v6, great engine just a shit auto trans, and the 5.0 is an absolute peach of a motor

>>15414559
>y80 trans and axles
>holding
>power

>>15414573
Lol that's about what is costs to buy a 69 charger quarter panel of a boomer these days

>>15414570
The dude who sold it to claimed power was 420ish at the crank but who knows for sure until I get it dyno'd. The racetruck mechanic who checked it out for me basically confirmed those numbers just on the parts list and sound but meh who knows man. I get like 12mpg also but it's dam fun to drive and has brand new leather interior, headliner and carpet. I'm trying to sell my 3rd gen firebird to afford a paint job for this one but I haven't decided if I wanna keep the matte black or go for like a hot rod color with stripes. It's literally fucking spray paint right now

>>15414557
This

>>15414559
>modified means fuck all

a 1967 Pontiac 400 cubic inch V8 made 360BHP stock.

S T O C K

>>15414584
a stock CJ might make close to 400 but it has more done to it than a cam to reach 450

>>15414602
>tfw a 455 HO pontiac made 370 HP/ 500 LB-FT

>>15414602
nope

using modern standards thats more like 270-300hp

its irrelevant but the one in that pic was in a dark green Judge GTO

>>15414593
I got my Camaro for 5k from an old retired marine. I got pretty lucky guess he saw something in me maybe a younger him since I'm also a devil dog. He was pretty much done with the build and just needed a body panel alignment and paint to finish and sell as classic but then he found a 55 chevy pickup with a big block across the country and need money fast to secure it. I made and offer and he accepted plus threw in factory build manual and bins full of spare parts like bolts and shit plus trim pieces and stuff he collected like door handles and shit to keep it 100 percent restored. Guy loves his old school cars I guess

>>15414606
multiple sources claim that the cobra jet was under rated, looks like they make a bit over 400ish.

and if you think your civic can beat a 400hp 3600lb car with 4.30 gears then you might have a few simple mods on your 97 eg hatch

>>15414583
phoenix has cool shit

https://phoenix.craigslist.org/wvl/cto/5644667575.html
https://phoenix.craigslist.org/evl/cto/5663565171.html
https://phoenix.craigslist.org/evl/cto/5656232850.html
https://phoenix.craigslist.org/cph/cto/5596318395.html
https://phoenix.craigslist.org/evl/cto/5633418471.html

all are projects but wouldn't take /that/ much work

>>15414596
>paint
don't do it until you're really done with setting up the car mang.

and I really want to do a hunter green paint job or a pastel on my truck when I get to that point.

what car is yours?

>>15414614
>"modified means nothing"
>comparing gross/SAE Net HP figures

a cam and headwork and that "300hp" BHP V8 is making well over what the gross figures would be.

ours was over 400 hp and could go like mid 12s all day N/A

>>15414630
>tfw bringing my truck to bandimere speedway at some point for a baseline
>anticipated 26 second quarter mile
hype

>>15414626
>and if you think your civic can beat a 400hp 3600lb car with 4.30 gears then you might have a few simple mods on your 97 eg hatch

I know youre not a Honda guy but 97 is EK

and yeah Id be willing to bet money on a ebay turbo Honda since itd be a thousand pounds lighter and could easily be making similar power

>>15414630
yes

if you put a grand or so in it you gain a few hp

we get it

stock hp is still laughable

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>>15414626
I'm the matte black 79 z28 with the 3 speed

>>15414501
The 700r4 is not a bad transmission at all, however they will eat 30% of your horsepower. 4l80/4l60 can be quite expensive. But if you want a cheap od, go with a 200r4. They are lighter and Have less parasitic loss. Also if your going to go od your gunna have to go at least 3.42 gears. With 3 speed you can still stick to lower gears.

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>>15414639
muh dick

and paint it pastel yellow with black stripes
>cletus

>>15414637
>bench racing
but putting tires and an exhaust on a 3.25 geared cobra jet will net you an 11.7

you would need to do a high boost build and completely modify the trans and suspension to do that with a honda.

drag hondas are cool but 555-come-on-now

>>15414624
Noice man what year is the camaro?

>>15414642
The only reason I was leaning toward the 700r4 is because I have one in my bird that I can cannibalize. So if I stuck to the 350turbohydro and just regeared it what can I expect in terms of speed?

>>15414658
depends on the gears you have now and your tires, but you can use calculators to figure that out.

if you ahve a 700r4 tho, I would just use it.

If I get a car with a 350/th350 combo, what mpg should I expect? What are the best rear end gears for mpg?

>>15414648
>you would need to do a high boost build and completely modify the trans and suspension to do that with a honda.

and?

you can build a sub-10 second Honda for less than it would cost to buy a 428 CJ

people get into 10s with open diffs slicks and ebay turbos

muscle isnt good for the price anymore

>>15414668
>what mpg should I expect
no more than 20 on a ultra conservative tune with 2.73 gears

>>15414648
Go full bumblebee?

>>15414650
It's a 79. My buddies call it the 79 Frankenstein since it's made out of like 5 dead camaro bodys and parts that were rust free all put onto a rust free frame with a newly souped up 350. Surprisingly it's still a clean title somehow lol.

>>15414664
The only issue is then I would be parting out my turd firebird which would probably net a lot less than if I sell an all original with less than 91k miles on the clock

>>15414678

homie I got 18 with a 3-speed and 2.91s

>>15414677
>you can build a sub-10 second Honda for less than it would cost to buy a 428 CJ
>you can change everything about the car to be faster than a car that is stock

m8 the whole premise of the argument was that a honda would wipe the floor with a muscle car.

turns out, the muscle car is still faster than any stock honda but a new NSX.

and have you ever noticed how at drag week there's only 1 fwd car and that's a dodge omni? this is what a 9 second honda looks like, yet a 10k built 9 second LS camaro is still fairly streetable. go back to your anime and come back with a valid argument,

>>15414678
>>15414668
This it really all depends on the rear gears. Cuz if they're 3.73s you'll never see more than 12

>>15414668
I get like 12 dude but I'm nowhere near stock anymore engine wise, and idk what gears I have

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>>15414689
do it.

>>15414692
sounds about right. th350 or 3 speed stick?

>>15414703
>tfw 14 mpg with an anchor of an engine and 4.11
FERD STRONK

>>15414700
a stock CJ is a 14 second car lol you keep going on about modded ones

it runs about the same as a S2000

a V6 accord an smoke 90% of muscle

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>>15414700
forgot pic my bad. this is not an ebay turbo, open diff and slicks

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>>15414712
>posted time slips
>keeps arguing about turbocharged, purpose built drag cars that can't compete
>but muh S2000 godmusheen
get rekt

>>15414658
Honestly it depends what you want. Keep the 3 speed, it will eat less hp and higher gears will get you much better acceleration but will destroy your mpg ultimately. Or, you can build the 700r4 to handle the hp you have, lose a little horsepower, but get a couple more mpg out of the deal and have a much longer life on your engine because of the lower rpms. It's really up to preference and how much you drive on the freeway

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>>15414715
Stock GSR head and cams
Stock B16 bottom end, block, pistons, and rods
Cometic Head Gasket(.074") and ARP headstuds
1000cc Precision Injectors
"60-1" style Ebay turbocharger
One Fab style exhaust manifold
Edelbrock intake manifold
Stock Transmission and axles with open differential
ACT heavy duty pressure plate w/ 4-puck unsprung clutch

10.7@131

mods and car cost less than a 428 CJ engine lol

>>15414721
>gets rekt
>goes full memefag

you turned so cringeworthy

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>>15414710
Part the Night Rider out to swap the 700r4?
I still have the stupid ass stock cast iron exhaust manifold with the AIR ports. I'm dropping in downswept headers soon and then after that I'll be solid.

>>15414710
>4.11 gears and 14 mpg
With da 300?

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>K20 CRX
>intake
>header
>tune

wew

>>15414723

psi?

in what body?

>>15414794
EG Hatch @ 2350 lbs
M&H 24.5x8.5x15" slicks on Si wheels
10.9 @ 18psi
10.7 @ couple more clicks on the boost controller

>>15414304
Used to talking about DOHC cars haha. Thanks for the info

>>15414806

where are you located?

interested in a race for gas money?

>>15414823
>implying thats my car

nigga my car runs high-mid 14s

>>15414831

oh i wasnt sure, havent been keeping up with the thread

I just saw you post and figured it was yours. Carry on

>>15414584
If you think just a cam would make a stock '79 Pontiac 400 go from 200 to 400 then m8 _you_ are mistaken

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>>15414658
Just get a gear vendors m8

>>15414386

Thats not how things work.