#TrumpSacrifices

>>64149
Hillary is responsible for Humayun Khan's death she voted for the Iraq war where he died. Trump was against the war from the start.

>>64149
It stems from trump making comments ridiculing military POW's and not liking them for being losers.

"You've sacrificed nothing."

>i don't get it
>i'm a republican
there's your problem right there

>>64154

Do we have evidence that he was against the war or this isn't yet another opportunistic lie out of this guy?

Let's see what he said in a Howard Stern interview in 2002:
Stern: “Are you for invading Iraq?”
Trump: “Yeah, I guess so. You know, I wish the first time it was done correctly.”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77P6fxa2KOs

“Lying is second nature to him,” Tony Schwartz, Trump’s ghostwriter for “The Art of the Deal”

>The NFL sent me a letter
whoops, no letter
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/07/31/trump-retreats-from-claim-that-nfl-sent-letter-regarding-debates/

>Today: I don't know Bloomberg
whoops,January, "I know him very well"

>Today, “I have no relationship with Putin" “I never met him” and “I have never spoken to him on the phone.”
>whoops, 2014: “I spoke indirectly and directly with President Putin, who could not have been nicer.”

Donald Trump LITERALLY doesn't know what the word sacrifice means and he's digging out the parents of a fallen vet?
A formerly Trump supporting vet I work with says he won't vote at all after seeing this as he just came across like a bully.
TBH I think a lot will do the same as he keeps pushing things too far.

>>64173
Yep, he's just being wise after the event and hoping no one realises he was as wrong as Hillary at this point.
The fact that she's not 20 points ahead of already says how awful she is.
The Dems only had to pick a half decent candidate and they'd have had this in the bag already.

>>64175
What did your friend think when McCain was insulted by Trump?

I swear, he could call the found fathers a bunch of idiots tomorrow, and people would crawl out of the woodworking to defend him.

>>64154
People have dug up quotes of Trump supporting the Iraq war. You can dig up quotes of Trump supporting just about any position; he doesn't have any actual convictions, nor any compunctions about lying publicly.

>>64149
>I've created thousands and thousands of jobs, tens of thousands of jobs,
What other presidential candidate can say that?

>>64154
>against the war from the start
already disproven

Hillary voting for the war is a good point. Maybe Trump should have made that point instead of just going off on the parents like a raving madman.

>>64149
its pretty much just #notallmuslims. muslims kill a muslim US soldier therefore all islamic terrorism has nothing to do with islam

& trump is to blame not the suicide bomber because he's never served, just like every other presidential candidate

>>64149
>Khan family's son died serving this country
>Trump calls all Muslims terrorists anyway
>Khan family calls out Trump for not having known what it's like to endure similar sacrifices

>"Guys, I don't get it!"

No, you're just being willfully ignorant.

Go back to your conservative hugbox.

>>64253
Pretty much everyone in congress voted for the wars though. It's unfair to dump the blame all on her.

>>64180
Trumps problem is that he's addicted to looking for opportunities to be triggered into defense against attacks on him; like when mom says, "I'm the only one that does anything, why doesn't anyone help me" to guilt me into work, I ready to defend with a resume of what I've done.
I find it helpful to ask "what are my priorities", and determine where they fit. Being disrespectful does not add value. Trump however wants feedback on ideas, which is why his RNC speech was very detailed based on feedback; but anything new is un-filtered to get feedback.
Trump listens to feedback, and uses it to improve, but if he's afraid to fail then he would never try to succeed. Trump sacrifices himself (career, reputation, lose of business opportunities,etc).

>>64266
>Trump sacrifices himself (career, reputation, lose of business opportunities,etc).
>in a thread talking about parents who lost a son in war, and a politician who broke three of his limbs in a crash, one of which was permanently crippled during his time as a POW
>these are somehow comparable

Making a sacrifice implies you had something to lose. Trump's lifestyle or health were never in danger, during any of his ventures. The guy could have lost all of his dad's original money and he would still be living the life of a millionaire that draft dodged.

>>64279
>politician who broke three of his limbs in a crash due to his sheer incompetence on the job, a factor touched on my several people who served with him and subsequently hate his guts

Plus, real American heroes get photographed going on PR field trips to build bridges with ISIS.

>>64263
Bernie didn't. "Other people were idiots" is not an excuse. Especially when plenty of people outside of Congress were saying it would be a bad idea

I am not even american to vote on anyone but why would anyone see this guy's lack of sacrifices as a flaw? This dude have been succesfull. He did not fail - he multiplied the million of dollars he borrowed. Lets say any of us gets a hundred bucks - how many of us would spend it in blink of an eye on booze or some shit instead of actually investing it? Hell - trump has no fucking idea how to "make america great again" because he lacks knowledge of what is fucked - contrary to Hillary this guy has no political history, but his economical one is fucking impressive.

>>64313
The problem with Hillary is that she has spent her entire political career enriching herself while making America less safe with her insane policies as Secretary of State.

I hate everything about Trump. From his orange skin to the small mammal on his scalp.

BUT, I don't get this whole Khan situation. In all honesty, his comments weren't THAT bad. They were still stupid, but it didn't warrant this much attention from the media. He's definitely said much much MUCH worse things before.

Ironically, tho, polls are starting to show that this Khan situation is the first scandal to affect him negatively. Whatever works, I guess.

>>64313
He's gone bankrupt 4 times. His billionaire peers consider him a fraud and a failure. He's scammed thousands of small business owners on deals. He hires immigrants to work his hotels in the coastal cities.

His business success comes at the expense of the little man. If he becomes President, who'll be the little man in that situation?

>>64311
Yeah but Congress as a whole were okay with it. The fact that people outside of congress thought it was a bad idea should make it worse, and a lot of those congressmen are still being elected. Mitch Mcconell, John Merry, Ted Stevens, Tim Hutchinson... Oh.

Oh I see why no one wants to blame congress. GOP had 215y/6n votes in the House and was near unanimous, Democrats had 82y/126n. Senate was R 48y/1n, D 29y/21n. So a Republican majority voted for the Iraq war, on top of a Republican presidency and cabinet who supported it, and Hillary is the somehow the cause for all of it?

I don't even like Hillary, but holy shit can you be less partisan for once in your pathetic life? I'd like to get some shit done in the next few years.

>>64290
>sheer incompetence
Crashing maybe. But his arm never recovered from his time as a POW. Which camp were you imprisoned in? Are you old enough to know what a pow camp is?

You trumpbabbies will seriously gobble his cock no matter what he does.

>>64322
She still voted for the war.

>>64325
I didn't say she didn't you fucking daft cunt. You're the one that doesn't seem to realize that 90% of the signers are still in office.

>>64327
But we are talking about Hillary the others should be held accountable as well.

>>64333
I was the only person in this thread who said anything about holding everyone accountable. Hillary is still the only one being named.

>>64333
>the others should be held accountable

Just remember that they were presented with intentionally trumped-up intelligence that was internally recognized as bad but never revealed as such to outside officials. The Executive Branch blatantly exaggerated both their cause for war and their preparedness.

I was still a HS student when this shit was going down but I listened to the news daily and had read foreign policy books. I supported the need for sabre-rattling (and thus criticized in editorials those students who were protesting the lead-up to war), but was completely against invasion. Was that good judgement? Given that I hadn't seen any of the actual intel that was being carefully guarded, exhibited exclusively to Congress, maybe it wasn't. After all, if all the generals are saying that the invasion plan is secure, then why should Congress doubt it except for ideological reasons (which Sanders claims not to have has -- "I am not a pacifist.")?

Did Western Europe have better judgement? Maybe, but the UK certainly had much more extensive independent intel on the ground in Iraq than any other Euro nation and they supported the US. It may have been simply that Blair was Bush's lapdog, or it may have been simply that the less-militaristic Continent fundamentally hated Bush.

This is all shit that's forgotten in the judgement argument. I guess you can start by asking yourself simply, if you were in HS or older in 2002 and were following the news, what was your judgement?

>>64290

this has already been debunked. Just because you repeat the lie doesn't mean its true.

http://www.snopes.com/john-mccain-meets-isis-leader/

>go goes to war for his country
>plane hit by ground to air missile
>pow
>refuses early release from POW camp, says will only go when everyone else goes.
today this is a history that conservatives will bad mouth? Do you have no ideological grounding at all? Support our troops, unless they say something inconvenient to my hero worship of a draft dodger who was fucking around playing sports even though he was "unfit" for military service.

>>64325

wow. this is an interesting argument you two dipshits are having. If only someone would have found out Trump's view on the invasion. Fuck, too bad we don't have that information.

>>64173
>Let's see what he said in a Howard Stern interview in 2002:
>Stern: “Are you for invading Iraq?”
>Trump: “Yeah, I guess so. You know, I wish the first time it was done correctly.”

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77P6fxa2KOs [Embed]

If only there was some record of Trump's view on the war in 2002 we could look at. If there was only some way to see if he would have supported it or not. I guess we will never know. But you two go on and argue about it.

>>64359
"I guess so" isn't really a convincing 'yes'. It's more of a 'yes' than 'no', but not by much.

>>64361

So, you're telling me an in an interview he did in 2002 where he agrees that we should go to war, doesn't mean he supported going to war? Alright. Let's try again,

March 2003 - Fox News Interview
"it [the war] looks like a tremendous success from a military standpoint and I think this is really nothing compared to what you’re gonna see after the war is over. … I think Wall Street’s just gonna go up like a rocket, even beyond, and it’s gonna continue and, you know, we have a strong and powerful country and let’s hope it all works out.”

https://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczynski/trump-one-day-into-iraq-invasion-it-looks-like-a-tremendous?utm_term=.dq1mJgVKVy#.mfnAZB202b

He was for the war. It was only after the war affected his real estate that have gave a shit.

>>64363
Still does not change the fact that Hillary also supported the war. She was more powerful of the two considering she was in the senate then.

>>64365
At no point did anyone say Hillary did not support the war. We get it, you don't like her.

Be less partisan or fuck off.
>all of congress (including hillary) did this
>YEAH BUT HILLARY
>trump also said this
>YEAH BUT HILLARY

>>64251
I'm from New Jersey, and Trump basically ruined the economy for us!

>>64365

>Trump is better because he didn't support the war like she did.
>Oh? He supported the war?
>He wasn't very powerful, so his support of the war doesn't count, anyway. Only her support was is wrong, because she voted for it. He just went on the news talking about how it was good for Wall Street.

It seems pretty simple that they were both wrong to follow the republican president into war.

>>64251

umm, probably every politician that has ever held an even remotely powerful position.

>we need more police
police jobs

>we need a new high school
teachers, it, security, janitors, maintenance jobs

>we need some new roads so people can get to work and the store
construction workers,

>we need to develop a solid irrigation system to support farmers

>we need to send people to space
NASA and tons of contractors

And lets not forget, The US Dept of Defense has more employees than any other institution in the world. In the world.

>>64180
The founding fathers were idiots. They didnt even include the right to walk down the street without being catcalled. Germany has it right, screw charging rapists from other countries, prosecute someone who pays a compliment to a woman who is dressed like a whore!

Trump 2016!!!!

>>64322
Bernie voted against it. Jim Webb wrote an article explaining why it would be a shitty idea. So that's two of her primary opponents
I'm voting for Gary Johnson. He wasn't in Congress then but presumably he was against it. He's also against destabilizing the middle East in general, something Hillary and her husband both think is totally cool.

>>64408

Johnson says he was against the war. (Does anyone have evidence of this one way or the other?) This is plausible, but there has to be a record of the former governor making a statement on this. I don't see it possible that he dodged saying anything at all about the war.

However, he was also for pulling the troops out in in 2011 "“I would get out of Afghanistan tomorrow,” Johnson said Saturday. “I want to bring our troops home.” (i.e. the same idea that Obama put forward, which Cheney and Panetta now blame for the creation is ISIS).

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2012/05/05/gary-johnson-wins-libertarian-party-presidential-nomination/

>>64376
No need to be caps lock screaming jerk.

I didn't look up the quote so you two could continue to scream at each other. I looked it up so you two would both stop.

The reality is the people at the top were lied to by Bush and Cheney, Rice, and Rummsfeld to get us into a war we shouldn't have been in. And the American people were out for blood.

Then after being led into a stupid war that we had no business being in the American public was weary of war coupled with the economic crisis brought on by the banks pulled out. The country wasn't stable and the leaders weren't honest enough to keep things together without us watching over them. So a dick leader who favored his own version of islam and had no problem pissing off sections of the population, fucked over those who followed a different version of Islam and shit fell apart.

Unless someone is going to bring Cheney, Rice, and Rummsfeld up on charges there is no point in playing the blame game. Cheney had a boner for oil (as an owner of huge amounts of Haliburton stock) and he fucked us all over.

>>64416
Why has Obama not prosecuted them? Unless maybe he agrees with them?

>>64419
>nice way to frame that question.

Why doesn't the republican controlled congress investigate them and press charges? Why haven't the tea-party congress members taken it upon themselves to investigate a huge waste of tax dollars? Unless they agreed and continue to agree with them?

I don't know. Why don't you read about it and come back and tell us.

http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/news/a35397/bush-cheney-war-crimes/

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2012/aug/31/obama-justice-department-immunity-bush-cia-torturer

>>64261
>pew statistics on radicalization are clearly a planned out islamophobic lie to fuel hatred of muslims in america, muslims are the true victim
>pew is a racist organization secretly run by the fbi

furthermore, do you support human rights?
do you support womens rights?

then why would you support muslims in any way when almost half of the muslims on the planet are at the point of radicalization?

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2016/07/22/muslims-and-islam-key-findings-in-the-u-s-and-around-the-world/

>>64261
show me one instance of trump calling ALL muslims terrorist?

>>64416
The rise of ISIS (and Al Queda) is the result of decades of US meddling in the Middle East. Gary Johnson wouldn't have done that shit to begin with.

Here's Ron Paul warning that Hillary's husband would provoke a terrorist attack if he kept up his foreign policy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzbEWYi_CI8
Libertarians have been against this shit for ages, while both the Republicans and Democrats (including both Clintons) have supported it. And that's why the M.E. is so fucked up today.

>>64149
>claims to be for the constitution in front of millions as a democrat speaker...
>supports Sharia Law as the only law, in book reviews of friend authors connected to the Muslim brotherhood...

"All other juridical works which have been written during more than thirteen centuries are very rich and indispensable, but they must always be subordinated to the Shari'ah and open to reconsideration by all Muslims."
http://icj.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/1982/01/human-rights-in-Islam-seminar-report-1980-eng.pdf

Yeah, No. Perfect allegory for what's happening now in the West.

>>64469

Anon, you seem really angry at a post that was really neutral. The post stated that Gary Johnson's opposition to the war is very plausible. However, plausible or not, the word of a random person posting on 4chan isn't the most credible source. So the post asked if anyone had proof of this, because...
>"Hey, did you know Gary Johnson was against the war before it was fashionable?"
>"Oh, yeah? Where did you hear that he was against the war?"
>"4chan"
>crickets.wav

>Rise of ISIS from decades of meddling
way to narrow it down anon. You seem to have a solid understanding of the situation.

ISIS gained traction after we left al-Maliki a Shiite leader in power who was a complete dick to the Sunni community who got pissed off and took advantage of the chaos in the region.

If al-Maliki wasn't a total cock and didn't treat a segment of the population like shit cause they weren't the same religion as he is, things would probably be significantly different today.

>>64319
t. faggot who doesn't know how business works

Atlantic City went bankrupt, that's his 4 bankruptcies. He never went personally bankrupt.

He was the symbol of successful real estate for decades until he ran as a Republican.

His billionaire "peers" are globalists.

He scammed so many people by bringing in tourism for small businesses to exploit.

He is not against legal immigration. The illegal immigrant thing was him hiring a contracting a union to work and that union had illegal immigrants working in it. He doesn't personally pick out his employees for his 100s of businesses.

Meanwhile Hillary hasn't created an honest job or a successful business in her entire life. She can only get a pop when she promises to tax people and kill mining jobs and manufacturing.

Go refine your etsy account Mr. Businessman.

anon, you seem to have zero idea of what you are talking about.

trump's company going broke
1 Taj Mahal atlantic city 1991 - things were going well for others in town at the time
2 trump plaza hotel 1992 NYC - nyc is not in atlantic city (which was still doing well at the time)

>symbol of success
nothing says success like shilling steaks in infomercials and conning people to attend fake universities

>globalist
so the man who built a golf course in scotland, ran the miss universe contest in moscow, has his name on buildings across the world only does business in america?

>scammed so may people by bringing in tourism
didn't you just say that atlantic city folded because it couldnt bring in tourists so his business failures there weren't his fault?

He scammed the contractors he hired to take a fraction of what they were owed because he owned tons of lawyers that could drag the legal battle out. I can't think of a better way for a rich person to rig the system against the working man,

>the unions fault
evidence?
also why did he hire non-scottish (and of course not american) workers in when he built the golf course there? because "unions" again?

>pollution, blue collar jobs and taxes
I wish i lived in a polluted shithole like china. fuck regulations.
trump decides to manufacture clothin in asia and sells it for obscene prices to make huuuge profit.
trump wants to reduce taxes for the wealthy (down to 25 percent). The wealthy will pay a lower percent than workers, dumbass.

blue collar union's aren officially supporting trump cause they know he doesn't give a fuck about workers.

you have no clue what you are talking about.

>>64507
>The illegal immigrant thing was him hiring a contracting a union to work and that union had illegal immigrants working in it. He doesn't personally pick out his employees for his 100s of businesses.

Except there is ample evidence and testimony that he knew that illegals were working for the contractor -- in fact one of them said that he came to Trump in person asking for wages (which Trump said he paid to the contractor). And Trump's own legal advisor at the time told him that if he had any brains he would fire the contractor once he knew it was using illegals.

>>64255
I don't think the idea is that Trump is "to blame", it's more that he sounds like creating jobs is a sacrifice anywhere near the level of losing your son in war.

>>64599

Hey, draft dodging takes a lot of sacrifice. Finding a doctor that would declare him unfit for service, while he continued to play sports with his friends at university probably took some serious sacrifice.

>>64149
He's just being a dick, like he always is. This isn't difficult to understand.