Trump creates voter-fraud panel that critics label a ‘sham’

>“He fired the person investigating a real threat to election integrity and set up a probe of an imaginary threat,” Waldman said.

>League of Women Voters President Chris Carson said, “The real purpose of this effort is to justify President Trump’s false claims of widespread voter fraud in the 2016 elections.” She said the commission was being filled with “political ideologues with dangerous agendas.”

>In a statement before Trump signed his order, New York Attorney General Eric T. Schneiderman (D) said that “no matter how many times President Trump claims otherwise, voter fraud is an imaginary problem.” Schneiderman said his office found no substantiated claims of voter fraud in New York last year.

>Numerous studies have shown that instances of in-person voter fraud are rare, and the National Association of Secretaries of State, which represents many of the country’s state elections officials, said in January that it is “not aware of any evidence that supports the voter fraud claims made by President Trump.”

>Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach, who has aggressively pursued allegations of voter fraud in his state, will serve as vice chairman of the commission, the White House announced, further fueling the controversy over its formation.

>Kobach (R) is the only secretary of state in the country with the authority to prosecute voter fraud, and he has helped create some of the nation’s strictest voter-ID requirements.

>In a Fox News interview in February, Kobach said there were 115 cases in Kansas of noncitizens on the voter rolls or trying to get on the voter rolls, which he said could be the “tip of the iceberg.” More than 1.7 million people are registered to vote in Kansas.
...

>Kobach first entered the national spotlight when he advised GOP presidential nominee Mitt Romney on the idea of “self-deportation” for illegal immigrants during the 2012 presidential campaign. Before that, he had written Arizona’s strict 2010 “show-me-your-papers” immigration law and Alabama’s tough immigration enforcement laws.

>It was also Kobach who helped design President George W. Bush’s registration system for “higher risk” immigrants, which required fingerprinting and interrogations upon arrival. He later helped lead the fight against President Barack Obama’s executive actions on immigration.

>Along with immigration issues, Kobach has also became a major figure in the national conservative movement to add more requirements for Americans to vote or register to vote. Since the Supreme Court struck down in 2013 a key part of the Voting Rights Act, Kobach has been at the center of many legal skirmishes over voting requirements nationwide.

>The White House said that the Presidential Advisory Commission on Election Integrity — which is slated to deliver a report to Trump next year — would include perhaps another dozen members.

>Those already on board include Indiana Secretary of State Connie Lawson (R); New Hampshire Secretary of State Bill Gardner (D); Maine Secretary of State Matthew Dunlap (D); Christy McCormick, commissioner with the U.S. Election Assistance Commission; and former Ohio secretary of state Ken Blackwell (R).
...

>The genesis of the commission came during Trump’s first days in office. During a private Jan. 23 meeting with top congressional leaders, the president claimed that between 3 million and 5 million undocumented immigrants illegally voted in November’s election.

>He later reiterated the claim. “They all voted for Hillary. They didn’t vote for me,” Trump said in an interview with ABC News that aired Jan. 25. “I don’t believe I got one.”

>In defending his claim, for which the White House has yet to provide documentation, Trump announced he would issue an executive order related to voter fraud, and Pence told Republicans that the administration would “initiate a full evaluation of voting rolls.”

>Since then, there has been more ammunition for critics who say the exercise is aimed at a problem that isn’t widespread.

>A recent investigation in North Carolina by the State Board of Elections found that of the 4.8 million voters who participated in last year’s election, 508 were not eligible to vote.

>The investigation concluded that “no races — statewide or local — would have had a different outcome than the one already certified” if the improper votes were removed.

>Most of those who should not have voted — 441, according to a report on the investigation — were convicted felons, many on probation. In North Carolina, felons can vote only after serving their sentences, including probation.

>The investigation also found 41 noncitizens had voted, 24 people had voted twice and two people falsely voted using the name of a recently deceased family member.
...

>The North Carolina board said not every instance noted in the report was necessarily voter fraud because in many cases there was no intent to do anything wrong. In one case, local prosecutors have already decided not to bring charges.

>That involved a woman who impersonated her dead mother — who she told investigators was a “tremendous Donald Trump fan” — at the polls.

>In an email, the daughter told investigators that her 89-year-old mother had told her “if anything happens, you have my power of attorney, and you be sure to vote for Donald Trump for me.”

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C5MuLp2XUAASB23.jpg

>3. Distract
>If you're accused of something, accuse someone else of the same thing.

Well yea, of course it's going to be hung as fuck, Trump won the electoral college by a few thousands votes in the right places. Any sane person would tell you voluntarily placing further scrutiny upon that is just putting yourself in danger of jeopardizing those votes, unless the people investigating are as corrupt/delusional as he is.

>>139115
Trump won way bigger than official numbers. Deep state without a doubt manipulated votesbto the extreme, but Trump still managed to win.

You've been living in the fourth reich for decades and here comes Donald Trump of all people and saves your country. You have no idea how much gratitude you should have towards this man. But the war is not over yet.

>>139128
What does the TrumpCo kool-aid taste like?

>>139128
>Trump won way bigger than official numbers.

I dunno about “way bigger” but there was all kinda voting fraud going on in predominantly Democratic (i.e. Black) districts in Michigan such as Detroit and Flint, which is why the courts shut-down Jill Stein’s recount campaign before the shit hit the fan and why the Michigan legislature is now working on passing a voter I.D. law.

In the city of Detroit for example, there were voting machines showing 300-some votes being cast (and of course, virtually all were for Hillary) but when they opened up the locked box underneath, there were only 50-odd ballots inside…

>>139142
A source would be nice.

>>139142
That's a nice story anon, it would be a lot more interesting if I actually believed it. Source your shit idiot, this is /news/ not /pol/.

>>139167
he doesn't have any. Election fraud is the biggest non issue this country has next to 'welfare abuse". any form of election fraud is not only minimal but gets vetted out when accounted. its just a reason for fag lords to make a voter i.d to suppress voters

>>139172
Exactly. The idea is to turn voting into a formality rather than a civil decision making process.

>>139128
Oh hey it's this guy again. I'm surprised you weren't in the first post.

>>139172
>voter i.d to suppress voters
tha fuck? Americans are a special sort of retarded

That's like saying the government shouldn't regulate vehicle licenses just in case it discourages people from driving.

>>139115
I don't get it; Obama didn't try to do anything like this against conservatives. Why do conservatives think it's OK for them to game our system? We're part of the same society and should strive to play fair so that all our perspectives ultimately receive proportional concern.

>>139724
Voter fraud is so rare in the US it might as well not even exist. If you pooled together all of the votes that MIGHT have been fraudulent over the last decade then MAYBE you would have enough to sway a single city council election.

Voter ID laws prevent thousands of times more legitimate votes than fake votes. In the US voter ID laws aren't about keeping elections honest. They're strategically done to suppress the opposing party's voting base.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/10/us/federal-judge-strikes-down-texas-voter-id-law.html

>>139724
Yeah, it's funny isn't it? You need an ID to see an R-rated movie or to buy alcohol, but to vote? Nah, that's "suppressing voters".

I also find it interesting how these people immediately say "well we shouldn't have voter ID laws at all" rather than "make it easier to get an ID" if it really is that hard to get one, which it's not but whatever. Don't expect to be able to reason with people like >>139763 though.

>>139769
>Nah, that's "suppressing voters".
You still need at least a voter registration card to vote in every state. Otherwise you file a provisional ballot which isn't the same. Illegal aliens can't get voter registration cards. They are weeded out at the county level. That would be voting registration fraud if they did get a card, a slightly different crime than voter fraud.

I need an ID to rent a LIBRARY BOOK hahaha

But to vote for president (in the same location) i literally just say "hi I'm anon"

You can even see their list of anons. All you have to do is take a peek and say "im THAT anon."

Why are democrats so comfortable with a voting system like this? Aren't they afraid of racust misogyny or some shit?

>>139772
>But to vote for president (in the same location) i literally just say "hi I'm anon"
Confirmed for never having voted before.

>>139775
That's exactly what I did when I voted for Donald J Trump.

You can pretend to have an argument but everyone who has ACTUALLY VOTED knows how open the system is to voter fraud.

>>139777
What state are you in so I can prove you're lying?

>>139777

You say "hi I'm anon" and they scratch "anon" off the list.

But how did they know you were really the anon you said you were?

They never checked! It's just some retired people helping out.

>>139778
Nevada, bitch.

>>139772
>>139777
>>139779
If they are going to need you to give an ID, they should issue one themselves. ID requirements mainly hinder poor inner city people who can't afford a car so they don't get a drivers license, and they can't afford to travel so they don't have a passport. If the government issued a photo ID when you registered to vote all problems would be solved and both parties would be happy

>>139778
not him, but this is actually how it works in my area which is in minnesota. you walk into the building, theres somebody with a list of names of people registered to vote in the area, you walk in and tell them who you are and they cross it off the list.

i'm not arguing one side or the other here, just providing information to validate anon's claim.

>>139781
http://nvsos.gov/sos/sos-information/office-facts/faqs-all-division/elections#113

>If a person’s name appears in the election board register or if the person provides an affirmation pursuant to statute, the person is entitled to vote and must sign his or her name in the election board register when he or she appears at the polling place to vote. The signature must be compared by an election board officer with the signature or a facsimile on the person’s original application to register to vote or one of the following forms of identification:

(a) The card issued to the voter at the time he or she registered to vote;

(b) A driver’s license;

(c) An identification card issued by the Department of Motor Vehicles;

(d) A military identification card; or

(e) Any other form of identification issued by a governmental agency

You don't get any of these things if you're an illegal alien.

>>139784
But you're missing the point that an illegal alien wouldn't be on the "list of names". If they were then that would be voter registration fraud, a different crime than voter fraud.

>>139786
i'm not even addressing that, i'm addressing the specifics of a post which was called a lie.

>>139788
That's the point, jackass, illegal aliens can't just go and say "Here I am!" like you were alleging.

>>139789
you can see at least one page from the list of names while you're there, all you have to do is say you're one of the names that has no signature next to it. if i was an illegal alien i had probably 8 names to choose from that i could see clearly enough to have used.

>>>>139785
So someone needs to compare my signature with the signature on my driver's license. That's as good as showing an ID? No of course not.

Funny thing about this, is I haven't actually signed my name in years. At a certain point, i realized nobody was checking that shit. I draw a line through iy, its faster.

If somebody is comparing my signature, I should have been flagged for voter fraud. Besides, none of this is voter ID. You were wrong, and are just giving the illusion of having a meaningful point.

>>139789
Yes they can. According to you, if they can right cursive, they can syeal someones vote with ease.

>>139791
That's literally a crime, and not only that but one in which you're 100% certain to get caught within a few weeks. Not only is each vote vetted at the county level, but then after that they are certified by each state's equivalent of Secretary of State. There are multiple checks and balances in place to make sure those who aren't eligible aren't able to vote. That's one of the reasons why there have been less than 100 confirmed illegal alien voting cases in the last 30 years.

>>139785
>You don't get any of these things if you're an illegal alien.
Also, yes you do.

Illegals can get ID in many forms, even driver's licenses. I'm not posting a source because it's common knowledge and you don't care.

>>139792
I don't think you understand that those votes would be thrown out, if not at the county level then at the state level. And not only that but he person who did it would have a warrant issued for their arrest for voting fraud and possibly identity theft as well.

>>139793
like i said, i am not arguing any side of this argument but providing information to validate the claim of an anon which was called a lie.

>>139793
>you're 100% certain to get caught within a few weeks
How would they know who committed voter fraud WHEN YOU AREN'T REQUIRED TO SHOW IDENTIFICATION? Lol

>>139794
That doesn't mean they are automatically eligible to vote because they have a drivers license. Again, each county is responsible for checking, and they do.

>>139797
There are typically two places where those votes would be stricken from the rolls: The county voters regustrar, and the state SoS office.

Only landowners should be able to vote anyhow.

>>139724
Yea, every rational person in any country think americans are completely fucking retarded to fight having to show an ID to vote. Calling it racist just goes to show how stupid niggers really are.

>>139801
Maybe taxpayers only.

It's absurd that the person on welfare has the same voting power as the person paying for other's welfare.

Obviously the person on welfare is going to vote for more, no offense. The taxpayer is already getting raped, let them decide in what hole.

>>139808
If you aren't registered then you can't vote.

>>139809
Why is it so absurd to you? Do you think we should go back to only having white male property owners able to vote too?

>>139808
Even India has voter id
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_ID_(India)

>>139812
"I vote that those guys have yo give me money"

Something about that is not right. Our welfare system has gotten out of hand.

>>139812
>you racist!!!!!!

Is it even possible for a liberal to debate without doing this

>>139817
Funny considering
>muh slippery slope
is a /pol/ meme.

>>139810
You can give a false name. Considering how many burgers vote you could literally pick a name from the telephone book.

>>139822
No you can't, that's a separate crime.

>>139823
Explain how that isn't a extremely easy thing to do?

>>139824
Did you even read the OP article? Even the lady who tried to vote as her dead mother got caught.

>>139128

>trump won by way bigger than official numbers

Stopped reading there. Fucking kill yourself kool aid faggot.

>>139825
Are you retarded? The people getting caught arent the issue, we have people who were fucking dead voting in the last election. Voter turn out is not even half of country, if you wanted to cast a bunch of fake votes you could literally just pick from the phone book and not get caught.

>>139827
>we have people who were fucking dead voting in the last election
According to whom? Breitbart?

>>139820
How about we all stop making absurd assumptions about anon.

It's ridicuous how many times my black ass has been called a white supremacist.

>>139831
How about first we all stop making assumptions about how much voting fraud there is based on hyperbolic clickbait?

>>139823
>you can't break the law it's a crime

XD

>>139835
You will get caught quicker than a modern day bank robber, Anon. You're silly.

>>139836
How

>some signature doesn't look like it's supposed to
>throw out the vote and GET THAT GUY!

>>139833
You're like a child.

>>139079
This just in. Trump's critics claim everything he does is a sham. And they are full of crap.

>>139846
Even if you don't show any ID at all, a record is made of you showing up there at that date and time that could be corroborated in the event of an investigation. Also, yes, signatures play a role.

Voting fraud used to be a serious problem as recently as 60 or 70 years ago, but since then both municipal and state governments have done quite a bit to set up systems of checks to make sure that can't happen today without corruption at the highest levels of government. Not saying it isn't possible, only that it's extremely improbable someone could get away with it in this day and age, thus the bank robber comparison.

>>139854
>implying everything he does isn't actually a sham

>>139856
>a record is made
What record? You give no ID at any time.

Shut up already. The only reason you have an issue with Voter ID is that you leftists love to pretend republicans are racist.

>>139861
You have to check in when you vote. You can't just walk up to a machine and start voting. The only place with total mail in ballots is Oregon. Have you ever voted?

>>139871
We've been over this. At this point it's apparent you're blatantly lying.

Fuck you. Eat shit.

>>139873
More like you refuse to accept reality but whatever, enjoy your voting fraud conspiracy theory for all I care.

>>139874
Fuck you asshole. People like you are the reason partisanship is at an all time high.

>>139769
>Don't expect to reason with federal courts

>>139772
>I need an ID to rent a LIBRARY BOOK hahaha

Borrowing a library book or going to an R rated movie or buying alcohol all have more lenient ID requirements than a lot of these voter ID laws. Especially since with the latter two once you're past a certain age clerks will just stop carding you because you look old enough. Also

>States exclude forms of ID in a discriminatory manner. Texas allows concealed weapons permits for voting, but does not accept student ID cards. Until its voter ID law was struck down, North Carolina prohibited public assistance IDs and state employee ID cards, which are disproportionately held by Black voters. And until recently, Wisconsin permitted active duty military ID cards, but prohibited Veterans Affairs ID cards for voting.

>I also find it interesting how these people immediately say "well we shouldn't have voter ID laws at all" rather than "make it easier to get an ID"
Access to government documents is an issue but voter ID laws make it worse. Some of the laws even close down the places where you can get ID.

>if it really is that hard to get one, which it's not

>Underlying documents required to obtain ID cost money, a significant expense for lower-income Americans. The combined cost of document fees, travel expenses and waiting time are estimated to range from $75 to $175.

>The travel required is often a major burden on people with disabilities, the elderly, or those in rural areas without access to a car or public transportation. In Texas, some people in rural areas must travel approximately 170 miles to reach the nearest ID office.

https://www.aclu.org/other/oppose-voter-id-legislation-fact-sheet

>>139876
Oh sure like you have nothing to do with it. Look in a fucking mirror sometime, pal.

>>139879
No. A conservative has no issue accepting the reality of life. How else can we solve problems?

But a liberal! He will not dare acknowledge reality. It might more suit his argument perfectly!

So voting fraud does not happen, AND it's impossible to do! Literally you must be a racist to think someone could illegally vote in America!

The liberal! Who worships foreign countrys ideas, except voter ID law. Americans don't need that, it's for Indians.

Once again, fuck you you stupid asshole.

>>139854
You do know Trump's entire basis for this is that some random fuck with a shitty app on Twitter said so, right?

>>139880
I'm sorry you have such a hateboner for state, county, and local government that you can't accept that they actually do what they're supposed to do as far as voting goes in plucking out the people who shouldn't be voting. All the evidence points to this, but of course you're free to deny, deflect, distract, etc...

>>139882
>All the evidence points to this
What evidence? Democrats do everything in their power to keep us from finding out the truth about voter fraud.

But that shit is over. We're going to investigate and uncover exactly what's been going on.

You really think it's possible that some cities have ZERO republican votes cast? LOL

>>139886
>Democrats do everything in their power to keep us from finding out the truth about voter fraud.
You really are delusional. But hey, ignorance is bliss, right? Enjoy it. Meanwhile, the adults will take care of elections.

>>139889
You are literally arguing against investigating voter fraud right now, dumbass

That's what this thread is about.

>>139891
Actually it's about Trump's sham panel for investigating false charges of voting fraud, as reported by the investigative journalists who actually looked into the claims you think happened and found out the real story was nothing like Trump and the rest of the anti-immigrant wackos say it is. But you'd know that if you actually read the OP story, of course you didn't.

>voter ID laws are racusus! Lol fucking LIBS
You fags might want to look up gerrymandering before you make yourself look completely retarded.
>>139783
But that would cost money and we can't have spending this presidency

>>139892
>Trump's sham panel
Yes, this is the part where democrats argue against investigating voter fraud.

>>139895
Because the guy who came up with the Arizona 'papers please' law combined with the former Ohio SoS who gave his state to Bush in 2004 are both effective members of the team. Who do you think you are fooling?

>>139893
What? Gerrymandering is a liberal conspiracy. If you want the truth you should listen to known con-men and also some random guy on Twitter.

>>139896
>Who do you think you are fooling?
I'm not "fooling" anybody because I'm not misleading anyone, ya projecting liberal fuck.

>>139914
How are you not misleading again? Last I checked you were trying to say voting fraud was rampant when it isn't.

>>139916
I state that voter fraud can be committed and we ought to investigate to understand the phenomenon fully.

As of right now, we know very little.

You're the one acting like we know what's going on here, AND DON'T WORRY VOTER FRAUD NEVER HAPPENS AND ONLY RACISTS CARE ABOUT THIS, and shit.

Fuck you.

>>139918
>As of right now, we know very little.
This simply isn't true. There has been a presidential commission investigating it every 4 years since the debacle in 2000. Add to that several congressional committees over the decades. All of which found nothing. But don't let that get in the way of the clickbait narrative about millions of fraudulent votes Trump and his sham panel is going with.

>>139730
republicans are driven by fear and hate, and are simply more motivated.

They tried to stop Montanan from doing cheaper mail ins for their special elections even though it would have cost them a million dollars, all for one seat. They dont care about democracy, they want power, and they believe in their cause. Democrats are boring intellectuals, there's nothing to put the fire to them until the right wing becomes too right wing.

>>139921
you have your parties backwards, stupid commie.

>>139893
>Yet the problems facing voters of color in Georgia are not confined to Fulton County. When neighboring DeKalb County, another stronghold of African American Democrats, opened an early voting location in a popular mall, Georgia State Senator Fran Millar (R) publicly lamented that “this location is dominated by African American shoppers and it is near several large African American mega churches.” He later added, “I would prefer more educated voters than a greater increase in the number of voters.”

The level of open disdain that Republican legislators across red states display for democracy is flooring.. Our democracy isn't at risk of being compromised, it is compromised.

>>139763
I'm from California.
You are wrong.
Illegals vote all the time.
Here all you have to do is steal a ballot from a mailbox, fill it out and file it.
They don't check id because that's "racist."

>>139922
Oh, Hi Cletus.

>>139785
In California, illegals can get drivers licenses. Arnold got ripped for being racist for trying to make which ones were for illegals as opposed to citizens.

Fail.

>>139925
People have an impossible time believing this, but it's obviously true.

People are very political these days, even thieves.
>>139927
Hi commie. Aren't you leaving soon? :(

>>139772
>You can even see their list of anons. All you have to do is take a peek and say "im THAT anon."
And when the real person shows up to vote?
Sure, you'll be long gone, but critics would have a documented case of voter fraud to point to.
Let's say 3 million did vote illegally.
If only 1% of them were discovered, you'd have 30,000 such cases to show.
If only 1% of 1% were caught, you'd still have hundreds of such cases.
But you don't have hundreds, or even dozens.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/12/01/0-000002-percent-of-all-the-ballots-cast-in-the-2016-election-were-fraudulent/?utm_term=.f0ba37e71fa4
http://www.factcheck.org/2016/10/trumps-bogus-voter-fraud-claims/
http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/counting-the-documented-cases-voter-fraud-2016
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2016/dec/17/fact-checking-claims-voter-fraud-2016/
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2016/dec/17/fact-checking-claims-voter-fraud-2016/

>>139930
>And when the real person shows up to vote?
They probably just let them vote anyway.

My mother is on the list twice. She had to request that they remove her several times and they STILL DIDN'T remove the extra vote. Even on voting day, she had to make sure they crossed both names out.

Don't you understand that the people running the voting booths don't give a shit?
>But you don't have hundreds, or even dozens.
See above. Nobody has bothered to check what's going on.

But we're gonna find out, and you're obviously nervous about it otherwise you'd cheer it on.

>>139928
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhqeV1-SckA

This is how you vote in California. The video shows the check in station in the first clip. When you get there you have to give your name and they record the time. When they do this you are esssentially legally certifying you are the person you say you are. These records can be checked by later investigation at any level: state, county, local, or federal. The first three each do their own independent checks every time there is an election. No matter if you give your ID or not, agencies of any of these governmental entities can go back and check the record of that person being there, which can also be corroborated by law enforcement in the event of fraud being suspected. That's how they caught the few scant cases they could come up with in the OP article.

>>139932
You don't seem to get that if your mother tried to vote twice they would have seen that at the county level and she would have done jail time or paid a fine for that. Also her vote wouldn't count.

>>139932
>using anecdotal evidence rather than sourcing news articles and studies like a proper human being

Go back to /pol/. Nothing supports your claims, your shitposting is not proof of voter fraud no matter how much you shitpost. Come up with a source or fuck off. And that goes for your friendo Donald too.

>>139937
>>139938
>>139940
What are you so afraid of? Are you one of the illegal voters?

>>139922
>Democrats: the corporate cocksuckers
>commies

When will this meme end?

>>139948
There really isn't a lot of nuance among the marxists

they all want to fuck America and take all it's shit. it doesn't matter how exactly or why they want to do that. these ideologies are merely a means to an end.

>>139937
Not if you use a mail in ballot. Then you just have to drop it off you fucking retard.

>>139951
Those are provisional ballots. Those don't even count until their certified. Good try though.

>>139730
>He's too young to remember ACORN or the Tea Party Targeting scandals.

Both sides game the system and to imply otherwise is disingenuous. You should be frustrated, but direct it at actual reform and away from the partisan scapegoat

>>139963
What's disingenuous is drawing false equivalence.

It is primarily democrats that abuse the system like this.

You think that with two political parties, honor would be equally divided among them? This is foolish, lazy thinking.

Of course, there are great differences among people. Some people like fairness, and other don't. Some people like self-reliance, and others like stealing shit. Naturally we divide ourselves among these lines.

>>139966
>It is primarily democrats that abuse the system like this.
Where do you people get this shit from? No seriously, what's the source?

>>139973
It's a generalization about leftists based on their inclination toward: deceit, terrorism, assassination, and general animal savagery.

Sorry but it's true. I get it primarily from history. Just look up any bad thing ever there's like an 85% chance it was a leftist of their time haha.

>>139975
was cain a leftist?

>>139977
Duh. He was the first revolutionary.

>>139978
wait, eve was the first leftist. then cain. I'm not big on the bible. Eve was basically an anarchist, like they had one rule and she just says "fuck it." Honestly does that sound like a democrat or a republican?

>>139978
so basically lefits are satanists, since satan was the first pre-human revolutionary.

>>139980
It's all starting to make sense, isn't it?

>>139981
yeah, it's a lot like 1984 how people are brainwashed into hating eachother and thinking of them as some kind of sub-human demonic creatures due to propaganda.

it's very disheartening.

>>139983
I don't hate anybody.

This world is full of lies. Some of the greatest lies come in the form of political ideology. And people suffer because of them.

Communism takes control of a country and strangles it's spirit until it starves. That's the truth, and it's still happening today (Venezuela). All they gotta do is call it something else and people fall for it.

Just like you fell for their bullshit, and they have you disheartened by the wrong shit.

>>139984
Oh Cletus, you silly wingnut.

>>139985
You know who could use some wing nuts?

Venezuela. They could use a lot of things. Like a less communist government.

>>139985
>anyone I disagree with is an red neck white trash
The argument leftists use when they can't provide any other. Well done.

>>139994
This would be fine if the other side wasn't proven wrong repeatedly throughout the thread.

>>139816
>>139816
>"I vote that those guys have yo give me money"
>Our welfare system has gotten out of hand.
>Welfare
Isn't tax return the same thing for rich people?

Also "Millions of illegal voters voted in the last election, and they all voted for Hillary" is actually correct, if voting democrat is illegal.
I hope it's not what Trump meant.

>>139994
"Cletus" is a proud Roman name you ignorant ingrate.

>>139783
You got my vote for Congress anon

>>139817
Until we have even suggestion of voter fraud broader than a hundred or so people we won't even need to argue. The conservative arguments in this thread are "it could happen," "Trump said so," and "black people should just get an id." Absent any genuine sense of a problem with voter fraud, the whole Republican argument does smell like voter suppression; not necessarily bound to race, but definetly bound to party lines

As is I think it's ironic that Trump with all his rhetoric about Dems making excuses for the election loss is making a ridiculous for losing the popular vote. Let Trump have his panel, we have nothing to suggest he's going to find anything and it's not like it's going to do any more harm than his expensive Mars a Lago trips.

Which totals to a much more substantial argument than what you footed. Here's a hint; saying liberals only call people racist is as much a cop out as calling people racist.

>>140011
>voter suppression; not necessarily bound to race, but definetly bound to party lines
This isn't technically illegal though. That's what gerrymandering is too. Doing it by race is illegal, doing it by party is not.

>>139975
>Citation needed
Dividing history into a right v left narrative is dumb, the party identities are not some timeless divide separating us. Even in America the political alignments are completely different than a generation or two ago, considering the Democratic alignment of the South. But I can't prove you wrong since your point is too broad to convey anything other than "liberals are bad."

But just because I want to argue, here's an anecdote. The meritocracy that the liberal French revolution implanted allowed Napoleon to rise to power. And within a few years, France, despite being decimated by years of anarchy and war, was able to crush every conservative power on the continent (except Russia), because of the genius of French generals that rose due to the liberalisation of society.

>>140012
True, but it's not always the strongest argument
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/03/11/federal-judges-find-texas-gerrymandered-maps-on-racial-lines.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/21/us/democrats-gerrymander-supreme-court.html

I think something both parties can agree on is that our representatives on both sides of the aisle have gamed the system so that getting reelected is a cakewalk. And I think we'd all like to make a lot more of our representatives unemployed

Critics call it a sham

Supporters are fucking thrilled

Thanks WashPost

>>140007
>Isn't tax return the same thing for rich people?
Oh no no no, they EARNED those tax cuts. They're ENTITLED to them. You know what NOT giving away extra tax cuts to the rich is called?

Punishing success.

>>140016
There are supporters left? Amazing.

>>140008
Shhh, according to him it's only ever been used in reference to the reddest of necks.

>>140031

If you are unable to understand the different context of names in modern and past societies then it's probably best you just off yourself right now and get it over with.

>>140007
>Isn't keeping your money the same thing as taking other people's money?

No

>>140008
>hey in another country 500 years ago it wasn't a broad term slander name for the uneducated white people of USA
>why you gotta be offended?

>hey, in another country 500 years ago, fag meant a bundle of sticks and wasn't a blanket insult for gay people.
>why are you offended?

Yeah, you sure showed me a wonderful argument that truly holds up in other examples as a good argument. Definitely defended you using it as a insult instead of providing any kind of refutation to the points mentioned by others.

kys.

>>140031
>hahaha, so they are so uneducated because I used it in the modern sense as an insult but when I was called on it I backtracked and used old original meaning to make them look stupid.
>I am so smart
>more upvotes please
You should probably kys too.

>>140030
>OMG, you mean other people who don't have my views exist?
That is a whole new level of narcissism.

>>140037
>he thinks it's just my own views and not those of 4 out of 5 people in the country
Have fun going down with the ship.

>>140037
That's why they lost the election

>>140036
The pathetic thing is that's not the first time that guy did that

There's something deeply fucked about the mind of a commie. It's something like deliberate stupidity, but for equality or some shit.

>>140048
They didn't lose the election, they lost the electoral college. Learn the difference.

>>140050
You're just elaborating on your confusion about American elections.

Whether a leftist is disparaging a patriot or preaching to his choir, it is a necessity that the listener be ignorant.

This would seem an easy fix, but they control the education system. Truly, it is a conspiracy. Thankfully, I am not ignorant, and know well that light always finds the darkness with its natural wisdom.

(Suck my dick)

>>140050
>Didn't lose the election
>lost the one thing which decides the winner of the election

I bet you think that if you get second place in a race you didn't lose, you just failed to cross first.

>>140054
t. George W. Bush in 2000

>>140053
I don't have any confusion. There are leftists who are patriots and Americans as much as rightists.
You dick is nasty and not worth sucking. Take a fucking shower already!

>>140056
Failure to play a game optimally in order to satisfy the win conditions does not mean you can complain when someone else comes along and beats you.

>>140060
It isn't a game, idiot, it's democracy. Listen to the people.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/president_trump_job_approval-6179.html

>>140063
All of life is a game.

>>140056
>There are leftists who are patriots and Americans as much as rightists.
No there arent.

Right wing means valuing tradition. What's americas tradition? Liberalism. The modern conservative is the classical conservatives.

There are a great number of "Classic liberals" who consider themselves leftist, but that's a simple misunderstanding.

Leftist advocate changing the status quo
This includes communists, progressives, "liberals," anarchists, and anyone who wants to fuck this country's shit up.

There is nothing patriotic about the left. They only claim to be patriotic, but they actually mean "im ethical."

>>140063
>it's democracy
No its not

You want to live in a country where popular vote decides shit?

LOL OK
gay marraige is now illegal!!!! (See prop 8) Of course, you don't like this kind of democracy.

>>140063
>using one of the most corrupt nations on the planet to justify national voter i.d
Maybe we can copy their shitty old caste system while we're at it
>>140063
>a democracy
But we aren't. The majority doesn't pick the president. The electoral college does

>>140068
Prop 8 was a long time ago, my rhetoric parroting friend. Attitudes have become more """"progressive"""".

>>140071
Why the fuck do you think Trump is so unpopular you dunce? Do you honestly think it's all just "libtards"? lol you might be more deluded than I thought.

>>140067
> advocate changing the status quo is "unpatriotic"
ah yes, I totally forgot that this country was found on the idea of eating the smegma off of british cocks and not rising to fight the status qou fucked them. This country was found on the idea of civil disobedience not on the idea of conservative cuckolding that says "take the throbbing corporate cock or else you're un patriotic ! ". Maybe Canada would be to your own liking?They played bitch with daddy status qou and only just got independence in the last century or so
>The modern conservative is the classical conservatives.
is this bait?looks like bait

>>140073
If we swapped out leaders every time one became unpopular then we wouldn't have a president for more then 2 years. Surely you can see how the idea you are proposing is flawed. Not to mention the polling methods typically consider "no opinion" to be a data point and decreasing the prevalence of supporters.

>>140075
Fuck the conserva cucks
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/05/15/trumps-extreme-hubris-just-made-his-russia-problem-much-worse/

>>140078
He leaked highly classified information to the russians he is a traitor who deserves the full punishment of the law.

>>140072
>Prop 8 was a long time ago
That's not an argument you pseudo-intellectual wind bag.

The point is: if this was a democracy gay marraige would be illegal.

But you don't like democracy. Fucking lying faggot.

>>140079
The article itself even mentions that he has the right to declassified information at will, so technically he did nothing wrong. Also the information was in relation to the fight against Isis and while it was foolish to share it is not like he gave away the launch codes.

>>140075
>country was found on the idea of civil disobedience
Hahahaha

Perfect illustration of the leftist mentality. You honestly think this country is founded on "fuck the power!!!!" Bullshit.

The brits were corrupt. NO TAXATION WITHOUT REPRESENTATION that kind of shit, not "fuck white people."

We have representation now. Our constitution preserves liberty. Anyone who supports this is right wing.

>>140082
No it wouldn't, it still would have been thrown out at the court level or at SCOTUS. Even Ancient Greece had courts of elders which overturned edicts of the people. learn2democracy.

>>140083
Wow what a good apologist you are, Anon, you should seek employment in the administration. They could use a good little bootlicker like you.

>>140084
The constitution is a living document meant to be amended by successive generations you nincompoop, not a static document written in 1789.

>>140085
>No it wouldn't,
Yes it would. Because IF this were a democracy that would be laws are made.

Fucking dumbass can't even follow the convo

>>140087
>living document
Die

>>140086
I clarified what he did, condemned his poor judgement and commented on the legal status of his actions. Which aspect of that makes me a boot licker you liberal lapdog?

>>139941
I don't smoke weed but want it to be legalized. You don't have too be personally involved in a subject to give a shit about said subject. It's like what >>139172 said. The whole voter fraud debate is just a excuse to make it more difficult to vote
>>140084
>You honestly think this country is founded on "fuck the power!!!!" Bullshit
>".whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government," -Thomas Jefferson
most of the founding father advocated for civil disobeince for times when the government overstepped its boundaries and were the 1700s American "fuck the system" activist . The boston tea party was one big "fuck the power" protest , its only /pol/acks like you that think this system isn't corrupt because /your guy/ is in power now. If Hilary was in power. You would be screeching on /pol/ advocating for another revolt. I'm also confused why you think this kinda activism is a liberal problem when right wing militias are litteraly a thing because of conservatism

>>140088
Yeah okay Anon, how's that 18th amendment working for America?

>>140094
>The boston tea party was one big "fuck the power" protest
No it wasnt.

Because you have rejected your ability to discriminate good from the bad, as is required of the leftist, you cannot differentiate mindless anarchists from our founding fathers.

They were not saying "fuck the power" they were saying "fuck these globalist tyrants trying to govern us from Europe"

So they took to power to represent themselves. Exactly as the maga movement.

You leftists, protesting against MAGA, you're the globalist brits trying to control the world all over again.

Leave my liberty be, or else I'll have to use it.

>>140097
You mean that time progressives made a huge mess trying to control people, and freedom loving conservatives had to clean it up?

Yes. History repeats itself. The progressives are working on messing up the first ammensment as we speak.

Don't worry, conservatives will fix it again. And again and again and again...

>>140101
>teetotalers were progressives
>not conservative SJWs
You're quite the revisionist, Anon.

>>140108
Social justice warriors are social justice warriors

Progressives are progressives

You think people are so stupid you can just say "no those are right wing SJW" and we'll just forget what those term mean.

>>140118
You did forget what they mean. The prohibitionists were the very definition of social justice warriors.

>>140101
>conservatives
>fixing the first amendment
Oh boy, don't ya guys remember when conservatives boldy stood together to keep that asshat bush from passing the patriot act that destroyed the idea of privacy and limited free speech? or the time when the Dixie chicks opposed the war on Iraq and got their careers ruined .can't forget the part where conservatives opposed the evil liberals from trying to get shows canceled because they spoke out against trump . conservatives truly are the defenders of justice and free speech

>>140120
>The prohibitionists were the very definition of social justice warriors.
That's what i said. And they were basically left wing radicals of the time BECAUSE

>the Prohibition Party became the first to accept women as party members

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prohibition_Party

"But wikipedia calls them right wing" wikipedia is leftist shit we all know that.

What matters when defining ancient political parties is whi they'd agree with in 2015.

Would the prohibitionists agree with Trumps america first policy, or would they be protesting Trump's hate speech with feminists?

The answer is clear.

>>140122
>family and temperance were the core social values
So "progressive"! Maybe if you're using Glenn Beck's definition of "progressive" at least.

>>140121
>patriot act
You mean that time when 3000 Americans got killed in a terrorist attack?

Sorry, we were scared. It was a mistake.

>>140123
>family and temperance were the core social values
>temperance

Remember how the leftist medua kept mentioning Trumps TEMPERAMENT haha.

Nothing has changed. "Temperment" is just early stage political correctness. A leftist tool to silence patriots.

>>139941
I think people are afraid that republicans are going to try and restrict minorities from voting because they mostly vote for democrats. All evidence shows that voter ID laws end up making it harder for minorities to vote, which directly benefits republicans. This especially looks to be the case considering that the guy heading this was sued by the ACLU 4 times (and lost every case). Can you really not see why some people might think that those on this panel have ulterior motives for wanting voter ID laws? People who are more skeptical about the motives of our politicians aren't so quick to accept whatever line of reasoning they present if it isn't backed by solid evidence (which no one in this thread can seem to provide).

>>139950
>they all want to fuck America and take all it's shit

Sounds like capitalism tbh

>>140084
Man why does it always come down to white insecurity with you people? Are you all that bothered about your race being made fun of?

>>140125
Your stupid is showing. Temperance and temperament are two different words with two different definitions. How is anyone supposed to take you seriously when you can't even get something this simple correct?

>>140328
>Man why does it always come down to white insecurity with you people? Are you all that bothered about your race being made fun of?

Not so much that we need a special month devoted to our history, but you know.

>>140326
>all evidence
What evidence? I look at countries like India, which has over 1 billion citizens and many living in 3rd world squalor and yet everyone has an id for voting.

You need ID in this country to:
>get benefits
>buy alcohol
>see a rated r movie
>get a job
>drive a car
>start a bank account

Why is none of those things considered racist? I think it's racist to assume that for some people (poc) they are less capable of getting a form of identification.

And the idea it affects those in cities the most is doubly insulting as it is the big cities that have the best public transit in this country. There is free internet use on computers at almost any public library.

If you're below a certain level of income they don't even charge you for a new id.

I think people like you are the worst because your reasoning is literally poc are incapable. And then you call others racist.

Dumbest shit ever.

>>140397
I think the real reason people are against "voter ID" laws is that such rules have in the past been used to selectively discourage black people from trying to vote during Jim Crow.

That being said, I would be fine with voter ID laws that involve the IDs being given out for free and without any bureaucratic hurdles that would discourage poor/homeless etc people. Everyone must get their vote.

>>140331
They are clearly related

Tgis says a lot about your opinion of other's intelligence

Liberals always do this

>racism is defined as power plus privilledge okay? Havent you been to college DEGREE? LOL

>>140328
You're retarded as fuck cause I'm not even white. Im an American, pal.(just an expression we aint pals)

>>140399
Part of the issue is limiting access to licensing places in poor or minority areas. So long as it is implemented properly then it is fine, but the odds of it not be rigged for one side or the other are pretty slim.

>>140327
Crony capitalism

We need to ban usury. Communism is worse even that the most [redacted] forms of capitalism.

>>140399
>the real reason people are against "voter ID" laws
Is that it's an opportunity to call republicans racist.

Democrats are in an endless struggle to mask their guilt for the jim crow days.


>>140406
Driver's Licenses are harder for black people (minority what the fuck does that even mean anymore)

Are driver's licenses racist?

No. This argument us bullshit.

>>140409
Driving is not a right guaranteed by the constitution whereas voting is. A better example would be laws restricting firearms sales and such.

And minority means that they are not a part of the majority group of the population. When you start sectioning the term by ethnicity, gender, sexual orientation, etc. it does become a meaningless term as everyone is in a minority/majority of some kind though.

>>139167
>gonna need a source on that
>oh it doesnt exist, too bad
>why would you want to look into it
Both the illegal voting and russian interference should be investigated, solely because they are very prevalent issues.

The thing is Obama and Trump both don't have the right to claim that everyone should ignore it because they are simply president. The vote count issue probably still won't do enough to change the final vote but it will likely give Trump and Clinton a closer margin. That alone should have been a red flag. The russian interference probably still won't give the democrats enough to impeach Trump, even though they think anything is enough and they could get to a trial even like Slick Willy, have proof of being guilty, and nothing would result from it other than a slap on the wrist.

>>140399
>>140406
Still waiting on that "evidence".
Literally, first line in my post was "What evidence?"

If you have no evidence to support your claims that that is the true ulterior motive to suppress poc, then it's just you fear mongering.

Furthermore, fresh from the DMV website
>Reduced-fee ID card
>You may pay a reduced application fee for an original or renewal identification card if you meet income requirements from a public assistance program.
>$8
>https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/detail/dl/fees/idcard_fees

Literally 8 dollars if you are below the poverty line. Free if you're a senior citizen over 62.

If your right to vote isn't worth $8 and the time in one day to go down to the dmv and get it, in a 4 year period, then you really don't care about voting one way or the other, do you?

Again, your argument so far has boiled down to PoC are less capable of getting an i.d. That in and of itself is racist.

>>140420
>$8
Every dollar you have to PAY TO VOTE is a dollar too many.
That should be fairly obvious.

>>140420
In some areas it is not that easy to get access to a DMV. I don't even really disagree with you, just pointing out that there are factors beyond cost to consider

>>140410
>A better example would be laws restricting firearms sales and such.
Oh yes that is better.

>>140422
Everythimg costs money. I had to drive somewhere to vote.

Is that racist now?

obviously voter id will be free for poor people(like everything) so stop bitching and enjoy the welfare state.

>>140424
Voting is harder in some situations

What if my car broke down on voting day?

Did you ever think of that, Nazi? How am I supposed to vote when it takes money????

>>140422
literally this>>140427
those fees pay for dmv services.

>>140424
I mean, okay. Let's say that's true.
Even still, in worst case scenarios, you have to go out of town 1 day in the 4 years before the next presidential vote.

I lived in a desert town with no neighboring towns within a 70 mile radius and even then it was only an hour drive one way to a city with multiple dmvs.

And even still, that would be a class issue not a racism issue.

It really feels like the major complaints against voter id are from the laziest people who refuse to be adults and take the steps necessary to receive the things they want.

It is a right, so it should be free and I shouldn't have to go get it, it should be just given to me.

Nevermind the fees go to help fund the agencies that provide the ID's.

I agree. Voting is a right. For citizens only. I fail to see how requiring a form of legal ID that you need for half of the other things in life, is somehow only racist in this instance only.

>>140433
Well, the legal ID isn't universal and the best most people can do is a state issued drivers license. Hell, if a High school or College issued card with a picture and name on it, I'm in New York, can be considered a legal ID then what is the point? We don't have a universal system for keeping track of any and all citizens and the shit we do have in place is for tracking foreigners or illegals.

SS cards aren't universally given, tax returns apply to anyone who works legal or not, birth certificates are a name and date but no picture, state issued Drivers licenses vary wildly, Paying a state college for couple of courses gives you a 'state issued' ID, passports are optional and require the aforementioned and money, firearms permits are hobby centered. Please let me know if I'm missing something here but a legal ID is kind of against the American Ideal of privacy from the government. And using it to vote?

So what I'm asking here is whether we should have a free universal Legal ID for all citizens or not for our right to vote. I mean we already have the NSA spying on us and Facebook and Google have huge profiles detailing individuals for marketing purposes, do we go that next step and give the government a, constitutional, go ahead to track us?

>>140439
I also just want to add, a Drivers license is a privilege. If voting requires an ID like a Drivers license and voting is a right but driving isn't, then voting isn't a right. That's assuming that all forms of ID have a barrier to entry for all citizens.

ITT people who don't know what a poll tax is, the historical context of poll taxes in American history, and how the supreme court ruled having to spend money on an voting ID is one.

>>140492
Anyone legitimately arguing for IDs claims they will be free for people who apply making your entire point about poll taxes meaningless.

>>140507
How much did you pay for your ID, Anon?

>>140511
R E P U B L I C A N S B T F O

He probably doesn't even know howuch it costs! Privileged cus scum!

Racist! Take a hike! We're never gonna have a border or real elections!!!!!! (It was her turn)

>>140511
Which one? The drivers license, passport or birth certificate?

A voter ID would be different though since it would legally need to be free for all.

>>140526
What if voter ID activates my PTSD :<

>>139079

>Trump does anything
>Media attacks him ruthlessly and relentlessly with their narratives.

WHY ISN'T HE GETTING ANYTHING DONE?????

>>140492

ITP a second year humanities student who actually believes the shit coming out of their marxist professor's mouth.

>>140574
Oh hey Cletus. How's your night going? Have you turned any commies into the FBI lately?

>>140575
*in to

>>140573
So what when we have Trump supporters in charge of news everyone holds hands and sings kumbaya?

Who cares what the narrative is, is there evidence that it's likely true? It's concievable that Trump isn't a good president.

>>140573
His feelings are just so darn hurt that all he can do is go for a round of golf at a resort he owns.

>>140442

Study after study totally debunks this idea that voter fraud is anything but extremely rare, and when it does happen, it's usually due to clerical error.

Attorneys have dedicated years to hunting down incidents of voter fraud and we don't hear much about them because almost none of these cases bare fruit.

But that isn't even the true problem. The real issue is that voter fraud prevention measures, which many republicans don't even bother to pretend are anything but gerrymandering at the polling booth, disenfranchise tens of thousands of voters in single states in the name of a handful of cases of voter fraud.

Even if we grant republicans their wildest conspiracies to date regarding voter fraud, the measures they would have in place nation wide if unchecked would do more to produce less representative elections than if we let all the voter fraud happen unchecked.

thousands of citizens that would otherwise vote in an election will no longer have the ability in order to prevent like 2 cases of voter fraud in that state.

>>140872
>which many republicans don't even bother to pretend are anything but gerrymandering at the polling booth,
So true.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/04/07/republicans-should-really-stop-admitting-that-voter-id-helps-them-win/

>>139771
>voting with an illegally acquired voter registration isnt vote fraud

>>139794
But then they wouldn't be able to register retard. You match the ID in hand to the book, address to address. Are you that dumb?

>>139724
Problem is that voting is a constitutional right, driving is not.

>>139824
Go try to do it next election and post results.

>>139172
Millions of illegals are on welfare, how is that a non issue?

>>141993
Illegals are ineligible for welfare and the people telling you they are have an agenda in lying to you.

>>142027
>Illegals are ineligible for welfare
Yet they still collect, because the welfare system is bloated and corrupt.

People aren't supposed to sell, buy and re-sell food stamps either. Guess what.

>>139783
Even if that was true, million people of welfare is still a lot less than the hundred of million from your tax that is given to companies as "incentive" and to"help" them when they fuck up even though they shove their profit offshore to avoid paying taxes

>>142027
They're also not supposed to go to public school and get deported too

>>142043
No they don't. You can't even resell foodstamps anymore. There are no more food stamps, they're on a debit card now and have been for 15 years. Stop reading clickbait.

>>142092
Let me guess, Breitbart or FoxNews or someone had some """"expert"""" on who told you it happened and you were the gullible faggot who took their word for it.

>>142110
>debit cards are non-transferable
>illegal immigrants don't go to school

OH u

>>142139
They aren't transferable. That isn't how the card works. The people on food stamps don't control the account, the government does. They can't even buy premade food with it or anything else but produce and groceries. Illegal immigrants are not eligible in any state.

>>142158
They are transferable.

If I have a food stamp cars with 60$ on it. I'll sell it to someone for $50 cash. Easy peasy.

Also read this you ignoramous.
http://thelawdictionary.org/article/why-is-it-that-illegal-aliens-get-free-food-stamps-health-insurance-and-pay-no-taxes/

>>142170
No you can't, if you did you wouldn't be on food stamps for another month.

I'm not the ignoramus, I'm actually on food stamps you dick. That's how I know you're lying.

>>142203
>That's how I know you're lying.
Lol hpw am I lying? You just don't understand this simple ass junk and I'm tired.

You better be eating normal food mofo. I don't want to pay for your diabetes too.

>>142217
None of the things you have said about food stamps is true. It's like you are basing what you know from what some pundit with an anti-immigration thinktank said on TV.

>>142231
can you get b12 and fish oil supplements with your food stamps? These are important for your brain function.

>>142237
No. I blame republicans.

>>142246
Good. Actually, you should only be allowed to buy whole food products. NO pre made hot pocket frozen pizza shit.

>>142261
They set up that rule under Reagan.

>>142275
I'm not sure I'm reading the work of a troll, two trolls, or if America is somehow cut in half, each having one single TV channel like in the 60's ; both having cold war style news shows, with points of view as opposed and biased as URRS and USA propaganda, but talking about the same country and events.

This two-party thing went way too far.

>>142295
The two party "Big Tent" political system is much more streamlined than european style parliamentary democracy where multiple parties have to align in order to get anything accomplished.

>>142170
They won't sell you another card.

At best, you go to the grocery store and buy them something and someone else buys you booze I'm return.

>>139142
Still looking for anywhere that you posted a source for any of this.

>>142303
From what we can see, it's like adding grease to the wheels of a car that's careening off of a cliff.

>>142400
A better comparison is a teeter totter. You don't go anywhere really but one side goes up as the other goes down

>>142342
>They won't sell you another card.
Lol ok

>hey government i lost my free food card :(

So ez. You lie like fuck.