The Bike Industry Is Shit

>>974878

>implying you've ever serviced your bearings

the move to sealed cartridge bearings was good for absolutely everyone.

Same goes for the move away from rim brakes.

Friction shifting is fine, but indexed has very tangible benefits. If you want non-disposable shifters, buy Campagnolo (end-user rebuildable) and a Jtek Shiftmate so you can run Shimano cogs/freehub body.

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>>974878

Chill out anon. Just ride what you like.

>>974878
If you want to toodle along at 12mph and/or carry cargo and/or don't really care then ride whatever ultra-conservative-design bike you want, and I sincerely hope you enjoy it, but don't bother posting pointless threads like this one because the overall theme of it amounts to "Why do people like things I don't like?".

o Ride what you like to ride
o Never you mind what anyone else likes to ride
o Everybody gets to stay happy that way

Make sense? Thanks for listening.

Give an example. High racing bikes are the only bikes that fit your description. There are hundreds of manufacturers of steel frames, and just as many hub and rim combos you can build and maintain to your exact preference.

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>>974878
>Why aren't you riding a steel friction-shifted 8 speed with rim brakes and loose bearing hubs/headset/bb?


because I ride a steel, friction-shifted, 2x7 speed with rim brakes and loose bearing hubs/headset/bb. pic related.

Because friction and loose bearings are fucking awful

>>975033
Miyata master race,

>>975037

Modern barcons in friction mode on 10-speed cogs are fuckin' buttery. Much nicer than 80% of indexed system on the market.

What do you have against cone & cup? They're extremely efficient and super easy to work on. I prefer sealed bearings overall, but calling loose ball "awful" seems silly.

>>975046
I guess my hate for both is the fact that I'm kinda clumsy so I have a hard time shifting precisely with friction, and I always drop and lose bearings when cleaning/overhauling, and can never get the tightness right

>>975046
Do you mean friction shifters on 10 speed cassette or old ten speed?

>>975046
I remember early indexed shifting wasn't all that great. 20 years ago, I was a bike tech, and had a customer complain because the chain clicked after selecting a midrange gear. They only got upset when I told them all that could be done is play with the shifter till the clicking stops. The two screws on the derailleur only controls the chain at the top and bottom of the shifting, not in between. They were really pissed they were buying the best the store had to offer, and it was no better. At least indexed systems have gotten better. My current bike indexes nicely, but after all these years of friction shifting, I still count gears. Which isn't a bad habit to be into, since it saves time looking down.

I haven't dealt with sealed bearings yet, but wouldn't bother me one bit. Disc brakes just don't grab me as a feature I look for.

>>975053

10 speed cassette, mate

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>>975045
yep

>>975055
>Disc brakes just don't grab me as a feature I look for.

I was up in the mountains for a week recently. I brought my hardtail and some friends were on old rigid steel. We were just fucking around on fire roads. I had hydro discs and they had cantis. By the end of the trip, they were both sold on discs and I'll never buy anything without them again.

Now, I have no problem with cantis - they're nice brakes. I grew up on stamped single-pivots ffs. But it was like night & day the whole damn time. Things got dusty, the cantis got loud and lost braking power - the discs started with better power & modulation and performance did not degrade at all.

The difference in function between discs and rim brakes is at least as pronounced as the difference between the ancient shitty stamped single pivots and modern, high-end dual pivots. They are just plain better in every way.

>>974878
>Why aren't you riding a steel friction-shifted 8 speed with rim brakes and loose bearing hubs/headset/bb?

because i ride a steel friction-shifted 12 speed with rim brakes and loose bearing hubs/headset/bb :^)

>>974878
What's wrong with aluminum? It's way lighter than steel, the only advantages steel has is comfort on bumps

>>975050
When running down the cone, don't use a tool. Just finger tight to get the no slop feel it needs, then use a wrench hold the cone and tighten the nut onto the cone. The cone and nut are to be tightened against each other, not the bearings. Finger tight keeps the wheel moving freely, and locking the nut against the cone keeps if from loosening up.

>>975033
w0t pizza is th4t???

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>>974994
I think OP's fag-tastic hyperbole misses the point that can be made. Which is that there is a noticeable trend away from easily-serviced parts. Things like cartridge BBs are fine because they're stocked everywhere and are not expensive but shifters that you cannot (easily) service, frames that you'd be scared to buy used and wheels that disregard longevity for a 1% stiffness improvement are all to the detriment to the vast majority of cyclists.

The ones that actually race for a living do benefit from this but they are a tiny, tiny majority and everyone else is left worse off.

>>975033
> allowing your pizza toppings to fall off
Absolute disgrace.

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>>975114
pic related

>>975121
the pizza is in a vac-sealed bag inside the box

>>975149
>thicc
my man

>>975033
I love playing the "can't tell if homeless junkie or eccentric genius professor" game

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>>975149
1860 calories in one pizza

>>974885
Why the fuck do they have to dress like fucking retards? Dress like a normal person and you won't make the cause look dumb

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>>975195
you're not supposed to eat the entire pizza by yourself, fatty

>>975120
No there isn't. You can still buy cheap, heavy, sturdy components. People who buy components optimised for racing then complain about longevity have only themselves to blame.

>>975113
Somehow the cone always manages to overtighten itself later on

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>>975158
>thicc
word is bond. just like my women.

>>975163
pretty much what I was going for! looks like I'm doinitrite.

>>975195
it don't stick to me. I'm 6'3", weigh a buck-fifty. enjoy your calorie-counting, loser. or should I say, "gainer"?

>>975222
agreed. you've gotta fight the man Malcolm X style, looking clean and mean.

>>975046
>Modern barcons in friction mode on 10-speed cogs are fuckin' buttery. Much nicer than 80% of indexed system on the market.

This is interesting. Right now I'm using a modern 8-speed barcon on a 9 speed cassette. I tried running it friction on an 8 speed cassette and hated it... too much space between the gears... nasty shifting. But all the bikeforums plebs swear that 8 speed is the comfy limit for a friction shifter

I've got three bikes and they're all great. I bought a Surly crosscheck ten years ago because I wanted to upgrade my OTS to a bike with cartridge BB and threadless headset. That bike is great and never missed a beat over some pretty rough riding.

I've also got a Brompton and it is what it is. They're great bikes a weird mix of old and new but ride fantastic, I'd be happy with that as an only bike.

But my favourite bike is my 29+ ECR. I just love sitting up on those goofy Jones bars, those balloon wagonwheels rolling over everything, and dick breaks really are great. That bike is a sled and it trundles up any slope and screams back down again, corners like it's on rails.

There are plenty of cool bikes around, just look at Jones bikes man everyone loves those.

>>975195
That's an absurd amount, the pizzas I get from the supermarket are about 600 calories per pizza.

>>975033
>all that weight in the front
To what end?!

>>976567
It's probably for the american market, soaked in HFCS and with twice the fat content.

>>974878
Stop being a jobless whiny cunt.

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>>976573
keeping the front load down low height-wise helps, and I have a wheel stabilizer, too.

I don't like loading the back up heavy because in urban riding I'm stopped or off the bike a lot and the load in back leverages against the whole length of the frame and makes the headset want to jack-knife. with the load in front, I can just easily hold it there with my body right over the wheel.

plus, I reserve the back for 15-20 lb bag of dogfood and then crushable items stacked on that. so there's often some weight back there but less than up front and it seems to balance out better. whatever, it works for me. if I was touring I'd concentrate the weight more rearward but for how I use this bike, my way has been working better than when I had only rear panniers.

>>976567
>>976578
>>975195

I don't have a pepperoni one right now, but the box for the bacon-and-Canadian-bacon one I have says 6 servings @ 310 calories per serving making it 1860 total calories, so the first guy was right. and yes, this is in the USA. and no, I've never looked any of this stuff up before, because as I said, I'm built like a twig and always have been. so there's absolutely no incentive for me to care about any of that stuff. I do eat a lot of fresh fruit, trail mix, whole grains, and salads though, just because I like it

>>975564

>all the bikeforums plebs swear that 8 speed is the comfy limit for a friction shifter
>bikeforums

lol

The difference in cog pitch for cassettes of various manufacture and type are usually measured in tenths of a millimeter.

So
>too much space between the gears... nasty shifting.

was not your problem and the bikeforums plebs are just idiots.

The nasty shifting you experienced was likely the result of three things:

1. Poor rider technique. You were trying to shift a fully loaded drivetrain. Don't do that.

2. A pleb cassette. One of most important things in determining how "smooth" a shift is, is the size difference between the two cogs. Three tooth jumps always feel awful. Two tooth jumps are annoying. One tooth jumps are comfy. This leads some people to custom build "corncob cassettes" for time trials and certain other sorts of racing.

3. A poorly tuned derailleur. There are some non-obvious factors that can impact shift quality. The distance between the top flywheel and the cogs needs to be as small as possible while allowing normal shifting, and the cable run needs to be as straight and incompressible as possible. Things like Nokons and cable guide pulleys can help with this. You mentioned that you were using barcons - if you have them mounted to drop bars, what are your cable runs like? The typical reverse-bend is pbad for shifting performance.

>>976611
Forgot your trip sieg

>>976611
>The nasty shifting you experienced was likely the result of three things:

Well, I'm doing all three except the poorly tuned derailleur. :^)

Still, 9 speed felt pfine with the same setup.

>>976612

uwutm8?

>>974878
>The prevailing business model prefers components that require regular replacement to those that can be maintained.

You think this is limited to the bike industry? It's pretty much the manufacturing standard for everything now. Cars, electronics, power tools, you name it. Things aren't built to last, they're just built to outlive their warranty.

>>974878
Because I ride a steel fixed gear with no mechanical brakes that I can repair from my local bike co-op for <20.

Based on al of this. If I went out to my LBS and bought a Tiagra level road bike (carbon fork and aluminium frame with caliper rim brakes), how long would I be able to ride it before planned obsolescence would remove it from my stable?

>>976905

Man I've got a 9sp Tiagra derailleur that's done over 30000km and still shifts like brand new. If you ride in the rain, you'll probably get 25000km from the rims, change your chain ever 5000 and you'll get 40000 out of the rest.

>>976955

brifters will die within 10 years if daily riding

carbon fiber fork will be "dangerous" after your first crash or scraped fork

aluminum will last for long time

wheels probably die before anything else

> upgrade wheels to hand-built, high spoke count after they die
> downgrade shifters to bar-ends
> sell crabon fork immediately and replace with steel

bike will last rest of your life with only tire, chain, occassional chainring/cassette replacement

>>976996

I wouldn't bother downgrading the brifters. I have gone through a set of dura-ace bar ends and also trashed a set of brake levers within five years. i agree with losing that fork. Modern alloy frames are pretty much immortal and wheels are a consumable.

>>976573
The front end obviously.

>>977232
>and wheels are a consumable.

maybe your decrepit shit wheels are

>>976596
>Sriracha
Good boi

>>979050
All rim brake wheels are consumables you retard. They're not magically except from brake track wear because they're expensive.

>>979063
>All rim brake wheels are consumables

Ceramic rim brake wheels don't wear out significantly.

>>979063
>rim brakes
lmoa

>>979072
Yes, they do. Mavics ceramic coating is well known for falling of in big flakes. Other "ceramic" rims is just a microns thick layer of porous sapphire - aka aluminium oxide. That anodizing wears of pretty quickly with some road grit embedded in the pads.
>>979230
>brifters
>tiagra
>consumable wheels
Dude, do you even road bike? Oh, I get it. You were just pretending, right?

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>friction shifters

C'mon, that modern crap doesn't last. I'm actually riding one of these right now.

>>974878
>Why aren't you riding a steel friction-shifted 8 speed with rim brakes and loose bearing hubs/headset/bb?
Because I'm riding a steel friction-shifter 10 speed with rim brakes and loose bearing hubs/headset/bb.
>>975037
An hero.

>>976996
>>>976955
>brifters will die within 10 years if daily riding


That's not too bad, actually. But I do wish there were other options that lasted fucking forever.

>>976611
>This leads some people to custom build "corncob cassettes" for time trials and certain other sorts of racing.
Also half-step gearing setups. It makes life more interesting when you're shifting the front as much as the rear.

>>974878
>Why aren't you riding a steel friction-shifted 8 speed with rim brakes and loose bearing hubs/headset/bb?
because my friction shifter gets pulled out of gears if I stomp on it, no matter how hard I tighten it

>>976996
Bar-ends have a habit of eating shit, too. Fucking Shimano 7700s particularly. The only shifters that will last 10+ years of constant use are pure friction downtube shifters.

>>976573
loading weight low in the front is better for handling than high in the back.

>>979918
guy with the bike in question here:

finally, someone who understands.