Variable pricing for public transportation

You mean like first, second third class? We have those in real countries.

>>1098385
>first, second third class?
Yes.

>We have those in real countries.
For city public transportation? Care to provide examples? London? NY?

>>1098383
>encouraging 'segregation' of 'haves' and 'have nots'
No, fuck you.

Besides which your idea duplicates effort and is pointless and stupid. Rich people that don't have a car call a cab or Uber/Lyft/rideshare service, they don't take a goddamned BUS anywhere. Also people have CARS not because they're anything as stupid as 'status symbols', it's because things as stupid as a BUS or a TRAIN only go to specific places and you can't carry a shitload of cargo with you. When Soccer Mom needs to take a minivan full of Soccer Kids to a Soccer Game she isn't corraling them onto a BUS and then making them walk several miles to from a bus stop. That's stupid.

Then you go on about 'lowlife'; you yourself obviously don't think that public transportation is for anyone BUT 'lowlifes'. You're an obvious BIGOT and probably RACIST to boot; please kill yourself.

People LIKE personal transportation. They have ALWAYS liked personal transportation, for TENS OF THOUSANDS OF YEARS OF HUMAN HISTORY. That's not going to change either, EVER. Public transportation is FOR THE POOR and always will be; it's DESIGNED for the 'lowest common denominator' on purpose and that's it's role in society.

ENJOY your public transit, especially if that's all you can afford. Be HAPPY you have it, that your government gives enough of a fuck about you to PROVIDE it. Otherwise you'd be walking everywhere, and only ALLOWED to have a job that's within reasonable walking distance. How would you like to make half or less of what you make right now because you can't get there fast enough on foot every day? Or better yet, be glad you don't HAVE to ride a bike everywhere -- especially when it's freezing out, or pouring down rain, or SNOWING, or MONSOONING, or whatever happens in your shithole country in the wintertime.

Oh, and without personal transportation? Your 'roads' would all be GRAVEL at best, not nice smooth pavement, because there wouldn't be any MONEY in taxes to pay for them.`

>>1098394
It's not really NECESSARY to use CAPITALS all the FUCKING TIME

>>1098395
Not only it's not NECESSARY, it's fucking RETARDED

>>1098394
>People LIKE personal transportation.
Like i am arguing this. Things is it is expensive. And even in rich countries where people formally could afford car in dense megalopolises they could not afford infrastructure for that car. Average speeds drop to nearly pedestrian level and parking is problem up to effectively ban of parking in some areas, which defeats purpose of the car. Solution is public transit that uses road infrastructure more efficiently (and BTW it will increase quality of life and for renaming personal car users as it clears traffic). But mass transit has aforementioned problem with sharp service qualities drop that creates self-perpetuating run away from PT (no rich customers, no revenues, no service quality, no rich customers).

I am not suggesting to take away your car.

>>1098394
This. We already have no problem having variable prices when it comes to giving old fuckers deep discounts. We just never question it because Boomers have such a stranglehold on our media.

No reason we cant just do this for economic levels in general, since that's supposed tonbe the reason we give seniors discounts in the first place.

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>>1098383
Woah that sure sounds like a nice way for the poor to revolt and hang you and the rest of your kind on the lamppost. Boy segregation is fun.

The things you need for public transportation to cater to people who simply can't drive a cage is you bump the quality of the service for everyone instead of focusing on specific customers.
Public transportation to become viable for people needs to be reliable and frequent enough to not make me get up 1.5h earlier so I can get to work on time.
AC is every vehicle is a must.
Also ticket controls. Freeloaders suck and end up in the dilemma "why should I pay for this guy to ride the tram/bus".

>>1098416
>Boy segregation is fun.
But this soft forced segregation. Any can enter first class it is just more money would be taken from their transport card account. No much different then from goods in the supermarket that people can't really afford.

>you bump the quality of the service for everyone instead of focusing on specific customers.
One fits all solution doesn't fit anyone. Imagine only one type of car for one price was sold, one type of clothes or one type of aircraft tickets no more classes. These industries would be struggling and consumers would be unhappy. This is the case of city public transportation, it has very primitive product portfolio and pricing that puts it down. No any other industry works using such principle.

>>1098423
>One fits all solution doesn't fit anyone.
Except it does on the entire planet where public city transport exist save for Murga. Fault of corporate conspiracies and cager culture, not the fault of public transport itself.

>Imagine only one type of car for one price was sold, one type of clothes or one type of aircraft tickets no more classes.
>These industries would be struggling and consumers would be unhappy.
Those industries would be struggling because everyone would buy just one and beyond that there would be no customers for their products.
It's a problem inherent to consumerist society where the existence of companies depends on people continuing to buying their products hence planned obsolescence.

Besides even in industries where you can freely pay premium for a better service short-distance travels is dominated by the cheapest garbage possible because people are fine with slight inconvenience as long as it isn't long. And that's what city public transport is supposed to be.

>This is the case of city public transportation, it has very primitive product portfolio and pricing that puts it down.
The logistics necessary to introduce your (silly at best) ideas would greatly outweigh the benefits because for the same amount of people you would need double the amount of vehicles (since every vehicle is halved to accomodate the rich and the poor'n'sorry people), double the amount of drivers and probably more than double the amount of ticket controllers/officers since someone has to stand there and be ready to baton your poor ass to unconsciousness for trying to ride the first class without proper payment.

>>1098383
So a taxi? Kek.

>>1098431
Taxi cost twice as much as personal car (car cost PLUS driver cost).
Taxi's efficiency of road's space use is close to personal car. It doesn't really helps unfuck dense city traffic.

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>>1098383
>/pol/cucks considers himself to good to share public transportation with other people
You're too poor shut the fuck up. You're even worse than the people you want to avoid. So walk then.

>>1098428
>Except it does on the entire planet where public city transport exist save for Murga
You would be right if public transit was only option. But it is not and people leave (aka don't fit) this "One fits all solution" for the personal car everywhere on the planet as soon as they get possibility.


>The logistics necessary
Minimally it is wall between bus/wagon compartments. It will cost a little.

>you would need double the amount of vehicles
Nope. Typical city bus already has about half of the area dedicated to seats and half to the standing area. Area are simply rearranged. Total capacity remains the same.

Introduction of min bus are for lanes that could prove enough customers. Bear in mind they would be paying high tariffs making much high level of expenditure possible for extra service.

>probably more than double the amount of ticket controllers/officers
If you can't enforce usage payment you have entirely different economy of operation, this is separate question. If you have fool proof working enforcing system there are no reasons it would not work in any pricing system.

>>1098460
How about we don't have a fucking caste system like it's Victorian London?

>>1098460
>Typical city bus already has about half of the area dedicated to seats and half to the standing area. Area are simply rearranged. Total capacity remains the same.
So the sitting area has seats crammed with 1mm of space for each?
Your solution halves the amount of seats in a vehicle because the "premium" area with seats still needs an alley in the middle for people to be able to take and take off a seat.

>If you can't enforce usage payment you have entirely different economy of operation, this is separate question.
Honest question are you retarded? Do you really think everyone would just accept a system of segregation between wealthy and the poor "just so" without any actual enforcement? Like I can't afford a sitting place so I'm just going to stand crammed like a sardine for an hour?

Damn.

Say your system is introduced in the way you just described. What if everyone is willing to pay the premium because they can afford the comfort? So you end up with the "premium" area filled with people wanting a seat while the "non-premium" area is almost empty effectively negating the benefits of a premium place. Do you just bump the price until it becomes prohitbive enough so the "premium" area regains it's "premium" benefits as in no crowd and everyone gets a seat? What do you think will be people's response for a massive increase in ticket price without any improvement to the quality of service?

>>1098383
So basically you want to implant the first and second class system from your average train system to local public transit? That's... genius.

>>1098467
>What do you think will be people's response for a massive increase in ticket price without any improvement to the quality of service?
How it is different from your usual rising of public transit fees which only go up but quality of service aims at level that is defined by formula 4 occupants per 1 sq m? Do you see public unrest about this? Do you see unrest about rising parking fees when amount of parking places in city stays the same for years and it is basically another tax for the middle class and up not service?

>>1098465
I think you are confused here. Caste is not something you can overcome with $5 fee.

>>1098383

I wonder how young the dumb kid who made this thread was? Probably if this was Reddit I could even see their only life experience is vidya gaming...

OP: for the most part the wealhy partake in the most wasteful form of transit possible, end of story. Now there are some exceptions, in Northern NJ where I live alot of wealthy people making several hundred thousand dollars a year commute to Manhattan via train. Why? Because during rush hour taking a car would double their trip time. But for the most part rich people would rather take private limos, their own personal car and so it is wasteful to try to cater public transit to their tiny demographic. Anyway that capacity and the resources it takes to provide said capacity, would be better served just adding more bus, subway trail service for everyone at a price almost everyone could afford.

>>1098383
SWEET I CANT STAND ON THE BUS BECAUSE THE SEATS ARE FULL NOW IM LATE TO MY JOB BECAUSE HOW LONG IT TAKES ME TO GET THERE IS UNPREDICTABLE AND I CANT AFFORD THE RIDE THE MORE EXPENSIVE NICER BUS BECAUSE I CANT GET TO WORK ON TIME ON THE NORMAL BUS I CAN AFFORD

completely shitty idea

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Public concerns can be a problem of course. Like everything new it should introduced gradually and preferably stealthily..

In this case thorough minibuses. Identify most desired lanes with most rich customers put minibuses with extra fees in-between lane buses. Call them different for distraction "express shuttles", "green lighting" , best smug name you can invent. Gradually expand reach. This how you make public transit customers accustomed with and idea of extra service for extra fee. Then one day you can put walls in buses.

>>1098383
Are you home-schooled?

>>1098383
SOME CITIES HAVE TAXI LANES YOU KNOW YOU DENSE FAGGOT.

>>1098496
You could enter rear standing part and ride standing for less price.

>>1098495
>in Northern NJ where I live alot of wealthy people making several hundred thousand dollars a year commute to Manhattan via train.
How do they travel in Manhattan if they left car behind?

>>1098436
TAXIS SHARE BUS LANES/HAVE THEIR OWN LIKE THE GENTLEMAN ABOVE ME SAID

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>>1098499
Well somewhat similar concept but recourse wastefully
>>1098436

And again should point out that i am not against personal car. PT and car should work together providing many different tiers of service. PT helps car clearing roads and accelerating traffic as result.

>>1098501
taxi, walk, subway.

Manhattan is only 22 square miles, the train station is pretty centrally located not requiring a ton of travel

>>1098504
i don't want to be near people when im commuting, I want to be alone, in my own car. I can afford to do it, so I happily will. The only time i will ride a bus is if i go broke, or all cars are banned.

>>1098506
No problem. Then you will appreciate when group of another people will switch car for PT because PT changes met their price/quality level expectations and clear road space for your car.

>>1098487
>How it is different from your usual rising of public transit fees which only go up but quality of service aims at level that is defined by formula 4 occupants per 1 sq m? Do you see public unrest about this?
Absolutely. But those fees are raised because the employees of the company that operates city's public transit need to eat too.

>Do you see unrest about rising parking fees when amount of parking places in city stays the same for years and it is basically another tax for the middle class and up not service?
I doo see unrest. Drivers are protesting and I'm glad cities don't stop raising parking fees because the end goal is to take cages off the street.

They tried to do that here. But instead of splitting every bus in half they wanted to introduce "special" premium trams on the most attended routes.

The public was against so they ditched the idea.

>>1098511
The end goal is to provide most possible quality of service using limited resources city has. (same end goal as capitalism has)

>>1098514
I'm sure that 80% of your customers would be delighted to learn that their role was reduced to a cattle and they can now buy back their human being status for a mere $5 USD extra on every ticket.

>>1098506
Humans are social beings fyi.

>>1098487
This isn't the fucking Titanic

>>1098495
Not to mention the money it's gonna cost to repair the vandalism I'll cause to first class

>>1098518
This

>>1098501
>How do they travel in Manhattan if they left car behind?
On foot? Is the concept of "walking" truly foreign to Americans?

Why not this

>regular ticket price for the seated area stays the same
>ticket price just to stand is halved

that would probably encourage people to take the bus more because it'd be hella fuckin cheap, but a lot of people who use public transit because they're unfit to walk or whatever can still hop on and get a seat, the only reason they'd have to go to the back and stand is if the seats are full anyway.

>>1098518
Think positive! Not extra fee but super discount! You can save 80% by going with slight inconvenience! Mega deal only for you!

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>>1098529

>>1098529
what about operating costs? How are you going to run a company if 80% of your customers pay 20% of the what the ticket price was previously?

And that's all assuming your company won't go fucking bankrupt day one from civil unrest from trying to introduce a wealth caste system in your company.

All public transport should be free and it should be paid for by taxing the living fuck out of drivers.

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>>1098541
I fear you would have no drivers to tax in you city.

>>1098541
Public transport should be affordable and the infrastructure used to run it should be paid off by cager stamps.

>>1098542
There are plenty of white flighters in the state who can pay for the cities they left to fall into ruin. It's their fault anyway.