Why do people call him an asshole, an egomaniac, etc?

on 9/11:
>Well, what happened there is, of course—now all of you must adjust your brains—the biggest work of art there has ever been. The fact that spirits achieve with one act something which we in music could never dream of, that people practise ten years madly, fanatically for a concert. And then die. [Hesitantly.] And that is the greatest work of art that exists for the whole Cosmos. Just imagine what happened there. There are people who are so concentrated on this single performance, and then five thousand people are driven to Resurrection. In one moment. I couldn't do that. Compared to that, we are nothing, as composers. [...] It is a crime, you know of course, because the people did not agree to it. They did not come to the "concert". That is obvious. And nobody had told them: "You could be killed in the process."

>>74734904
because he was an asshole egomaniac.

excellent composer too.

>>74734918
I can't even imagine someone sincerely saying such a thing. How many levels of autism was this man on?

>>74734904
Well, he was. The difference between him and Beethoven is we have a lot of video, we can see him in person. His work can be difficult, although I think most people on /mu/ could get into something like Oktophonie with few problems, but we also can see first hand that he was a difficult and even unpleasant person, it's a different thing than encountering even Schoenberg's music. We can't see Schoenberg the man all that clearly, we only have accounts, we can't see for ourselves; Stockhausen loved the limelight, however, he was drawn to the camera, this to his detriment.

>>74734918
Worth mentioning that he said this was a misquote, and he was in fact answering a question about Lucifer, a character from his Licht operas. He claimed it was Lucifer's greatest work of art. I don't know one way or the other which is the true version of the story, I think he left himself open to attack on this sort of thing because he came out with some pretty nutty stuff like being born on Sirius and whatnot. He was a child during World War II, both his parents died between 1941 and 1945, and this likely had affected him profoundly psychologically, including influencing his attitude towards mass murder and other acts of extreme violence.

What would you say are the best recordings of his music available? I always find it hard to get into composers since there are many different interpretations and recordings of their work. I've heard the Elektronische Musik comp that gets posted around sometimes, but that's it.

>>74735178
Luckily Stockhausen recorded all or most of his music himself, and put it out on his own label, Stockhausen Verlag. They're some of the best sounding recordings I've ever heard, if he hadn't become a composer he would have been a phenomenal producer/recording engineer for sure.

>>74735178
His music should be experienced live. He makes use of the spatial element of music (which direction a sound is coming from), often the audience are in the middle of many performers or speakers (or both).

Often he will make use of the difference in sound of an instrument pointing directly at you or at the floor or at the upper left of the hall or the upper right - these things are best experienced when you are in the same acoustic space as the performer.

For example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Hhe2aWKxXU

Notice where the performer is pointing the end of the instrument:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7LvFlK54zs
And how the sound isn't that different depening on where he points it. If you were in the same acoustic space, you would notice all sorts of subtleties and changes depending on where the end of the instrument was pointed.

>>74735280
I wish he produced for Slint.....

>>74734918
Source?

>>74735094
>He was a child during World War II, both his parents died between 1941 and 1945
Even if that quote was accurate, it drives me to the conclusion that those are snarky remarks about religion, devil and the spirits. Being a child in the WWII and losing your parents at that age is bound to leave any sensible person laughing at any notions of religion or supernatural entities.

>>74735778
Is it? Some very sensible people turn to religion in their darkest hour. I'm not religious, but to suggest atheism is a "sensible" response to loss is ridiculous. It's a human response, but so is conversion, or seeking some kind of spiritual conception of the universe. I don't think Stockhausen was drawn to Christianity, he merely used the characters of Eve, Lucifer, and the Archangel Michael to get at something else. Licht seems to draw on all the mythologies of the world, both from active religions and from dead traditions.

>>74735929
>I don't think Stockhausen was drawn to Christianity, he merely used the characters of Eve, Lucifer, and the Archangel Michael to get at something else
Me neither, hence the:
>it drives me to the conclusion that those are snarky remarks about religion, devil and the spirits
I could see both atheism and religiosity as in some situations adequate responses to horrors. On the one hand, it's all too comfortable to live a lie, expect eternal salvation and forgiveness. On the other hand, being reasonable, divorcing yourself from as much lies as possible and trying your best to live the best life you possibly can without imaginary help is another option.

>>74735984
Stockhausen doesn't seem to have been much for sarcasm, in general he was very blunt and direct when making disparaging comments. In any case I don't think his belief or lack of belief in Lucifer as an actual being is relevant to what he claims to have actually said about 9/11. If he is using those Christian characters as metaphors in Licht, then he is also being metaphorical when he talks about Lucifer's greatest work of art.

>>74735720
http://www.stockhausen.org/hamburg.pdf

>>74736353
Do you know German? And by the way:
>Worth mentioning that he said this was a misquote, and he was in fact answering a question about Lucifer, a character from his Licht operas

>>74736366
>>74735094
I like how you two post this as if there's really that much of a difference. There may be a semantic difference but the remarks are still gross.

>>74736449
Great, so translate that interview or provide an English version of it. And what's gross? I wasn't in conflict with the person I've replied to.

>>74734918
It is pretty much true though. It wasn't just a terrorist attack to kill a bunch of people. It was a deliberately high profile spectacle and, like it or not, the visual imagery of the attack will live longer than most artist's music

>>74736468
>And what's gross?
His remarks regarding the 9/11 attacks and those who died are disgusting.

>>74736495
>the visual imagery of the attack will live longer than most artist's music
okay but that's historical, not artistic.

his language on and attitude towards the attacks is quite perverted and morbid. as the other anon said, it's most likely due to the events in his life but that doesn't change anything.

>>74736545
>okay but that's historical, not artistic.
There is no difference, art is historical, history can be artistic. Some of the most important historical things are prized as much for their artistry as their function. It is a myth that there is a separation between art and everything else in the world, particularly in the media saturated present we understand the important events of the day by images: Kennedy shot, man on the moon, Berlin wall falling. They all invoke images, images that may not have been created as art but becomes the art of our day. Certainly more persuasive than the painters of the day who are almost forgotten.

>>74734904
Pretty sure he was on the autism spectrum

>>74735094 here

I just thought it was worth bringing his own side of the story to people's attention. I think it's commendable on some level that he didn't try to deny he had said anything about 9/11, but certainly it was ill advised to answer that question the way he did. Whether it's sick or not, I can't really say. My own feelings are somewhat muted because I'm not an American, modern Britain hasn't seen anything like it—the 7/7 bus attack was certainly dressed up by certain eminent political and media figures as "our 9/11", but the two are not comparable in their devastation. We do have our own problems with Islamic antagonism, however, and if he was alive today making similar comments about the Pakistani rape gangs in my country I might not be so neutral.

>>74736693
>Pakistani rape gangs
Absolutely 100% confirmed brit. Every brown person is a "fucking paki innit"

>>74736756
As far as I'm aware the documented cases all happen to involve predominantly Pakistani Muslim men. I grew up in a white working class area, during the peak of the chav phenomenon in Yorkshire, and I always found it distasteful the way the other kids would group all those people together as "pakis" regardless of their actual heritage.

>>74736545
>His remarks regarding the 9/11 attacks and those who died are disgusting.
Again, implying this is anything to go by:
>Worth mentioning that he said this was a misquote, and he was in fact answering a question about Lucifer, a character from his Licht operas

>>74734904
he was very friendly and sweet

>>74736545
>His remarks regarding the 9/11 attacks and those who died are disgusting.
Not really, you don't really need more than one "oh it's a tragedy, my heart goes out to the victims and their families." There are more interesting things to be said about it.

>>74737047
>There are more interesting things to be said about it
The "send prayers and love" comes to mind. Prayers...