whats the difference between avant garde and experimental?

Avante-garde means that it is at the "forefront" thus there's an implication that this is the "right direction" for that style to be heading in and it is "the future" thus its meaning requires the context of the point of time in which it came out. "Experimental" music is doing odd new things in odd new ways but there's no sense that it is the "correct way" or anything

>>73633876
I avant-garde a clue

Avant-garde: Trying to extract what is going to be hip musically in the future instead of conforming to what is selling now. (ex: An artist before his time.)

Experimental: Dissecting musical trends and replacing it with new and exciting elements. This can go to a point where it is unrecognizable from any popular trend. (ex: Noise)

I have no fucking clue what I'm saying btw

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>>73633963

>>73633977
wow

>>73633876
Avant-garde isn't always experimental and experimental isn't always avant-garde.

>>73634002
So does that mean Clouddead 2001 can be considered Avant-garde?

>>73633977
what's the clue?

Experimental: it's unconventional for it's field. For example, a pop artist does something most pop artists don't do. It's all based on context, too

Avant-garde: pushes the meaning of a new idea. Truly innovating and out of the norm. It's usually reject at first.

>>73634027
I don't think their intent was to push a new genre forward. I see them as some kind of pioneers. If you want good examples of what I think is avant-garde I'd say David Bowie or Odd Future (not even baiting).

>>73633963
going by this, how the fuck do you label something as avant-garde around the time of it's release? and also how would you know where a genre is heading in the first place?

>>73633876
Experimental seems like a descriptor more focused in the origin of whatever genre of music is being played, while avant-garde describes something that purposefully subverts genre and convention altogether, or at the least more so than something that can be called "experimental"
I would call King Crimson experimental rock and Captain Beefheart avant-garde rock
>>73633977
t. George Harrison

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>>73633977

So can something be one without being the other?

>>73635489
because music reviewers are really far up their own ass.

They actually think they have any relevant influence over music.

>>73633977
reddit tear pun post, but still really fucking clever

>>73635728
Get off of 4chan me