Hip-Hop cannot be held to the same standards as other music.

>Prove me wrong
You're right.

>>72960229
nice pasta from the other thread my man quality posting

From Filthy Tongue of Gods and Griots
Spiral Walls Containing Autumns of Light
Illmatic

>>72960229
By what standards are you referring to? Is it one of those objective measures of "good"

In which case here is your "you"

:^) great thread faggot

>>72960229
Youre mostly right but I think focus tested pop is just as bad if not worse as a whole.

Why do people praise rappers like Kendrick Lamar for sampling jazz and soul when he literally didn't play anything? You could just listen to the jazz or soul music that he's stealing from, without the annoying vocals.

>>72960293
Sampling it makes it more palatable for plebs.

there's always pop punk and metal

>>72960244
It's true. Any time somebody tells me that they enjoy hip-hop, I automatically assume that they're a raging normie who listens to the radio, can't play an instrument, and hasn't explored any other genres of music.

>>72960229
This is accurate. The obvious explanation is that blacks have a lower IQ on average and this is manifest in their music.

Why is it that rap fans rarely listen to anything outside of rap?
Even the cringiest metalfags usually enjoy ambient music or classical or something.

>>72960327
I can't enjoy Peruvian folk llama-fucking symphonies and some hip hop at the same time?

>>72960229

>Hip-Hop pales in comparison to literally any other genre. It has the lowest standards of any genre.

wrong

ska music exists

>>72960319
Even the worst buttmetal and pop punk is better than most hip-hop. At least they can play instruments.

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>>72960293
>he still thinks sampling is stealing
have you been asleep for 30 years? do you know about 9/11 yet?

>>72960319
>metal
I know I'm going to sound like a fedora-wearing edgelord, but metal is seriously one of the most diverse genres out there.
People who hate metal usually think all metal is nu-metal or buttrock garbage like Disturbed and System Of A Down.

>>72960364

wrong

tumblr radfem punk exists

>>72960229
Not an argument

>>72960293
>>72960327
>>72960364
>instrumental mastery = quality
this rockist mold only really belongs on reddit

>>72960363
>he doesn't appreciate first wave ska.
Good luck having taste being that closed minded.

>>72960410
>instrumental mastery = quality
Nobody said that you fucking idiot.

>>72960410

>tfw born in wrong generation
>upvote to all ma narwhals out there that agree

>>72960446
>these genres of music are better than hip hop because they can play instruments
huh

>>72960444

my taste is da shit

the purview you're talking about within that is incredibly small, just like your lil weenus

hey guys listen to my beat is it good??

https://clyp.it/fc5vebw5

>>72960410
>an artist writes and plays music
>this is bad
>on a music board
If you can't play an instrument, can't sing without autotune, don't write your own lyrics, and you don't even produce your own beats, you don't belong in music.

>>72960364
being able to play an instrument means nothing if you right shit music with it. doesn't make you better or worse than shitty trap artists on lean.

>>72960464
>these genres of music are better than hip hop because they can play instruments
is not the same as
>instrumental mastery = quality
Are you really this stupid?

>>72960482
>if you right shit music
>if you right
>right
Hip-Hop fans, ladies and gentlemen.

>>72960490
seems horribly close but whatever
what else makes them better?

>>72960478
This. If your favorite rapper reads lyrics that somebody else wrote over a beat that somebody else made, he's not an artist. They could have hired any other random black guy to do the same thing. He contributed nothing of creative value.

>>72960504
mechanical semantics are even weaker talking points than food metaphors s m h

>>72960364
call it an instrument or not, I dont care, but the production and instrumental side of hip hop requires skill and understanding in the same way playing an instrument does

>>72960504

>passively aggressively corects grammer like a queef

reddit faggets, lads

>>72960478
>music can't be a group effort to idolize an iconic individual or group

literally what is wrong with this, it's the same thing as a band playing behind a shitty singer like in Slint

>>72960517
They are competent at their instruments and write their own music.

Hip-hop is a type of performance poetry that someone accidentally got confused with music.

Mumblefucks like Yachty and Uzi who rap purely for the sound and don't give a shit about the lyrics are closer to musicians than rappers who try.

They're still shitty musicians, but they're closer to the point.

>>72960504
you no i'm write tho fag

>>72960467
I'd be very concerned if my weenuses were large. Just dangling flaps of skin on my elbows. Nasty.

>>72960534
This. Producers are musicians moreso than rappers are.

>>72960555

you are wasting good trips on soggy bants you cut that out now

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>>72960478
This. This is the exact reason Rap and Hip Hop are by and large the shittiest genres. At least Dubstep and Techno "artists" can create a beat, and at least country "artists" can sing and write lyrics.

The music's qualities mirror the people that make it. Lazy, paid for by someone else, and should've never left Africa.

>>72960538
>Slint
Their singer was also their guitarist. Try again.

>>72960573
I'mma keep at it just so you can't enjoy muh digits.

>>72960531
>nobody can dispute this

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>>72960595

sweet justice

>>72960608
there would be something of value to dispute if rappers didn't write their own lyrics
sure there was the drake ghostwriting controversy but people see lots of co writing credits on rap albums for producers and just assume they co wrote the lyrics

>>72960608
>>72960531
I would argue if their voice/delivery is in some way notable and exceptional, they at least have talent in that capacity. Not musical talent, but I guess the talent of a good orator/actor.

>>72960568
You cant be more of a musician than someone else. If a singer is a musician then I dont see why a rapper isnt.

>>72960659
Someone who knows how to strum a few chords on guitar is definitely less of a musician than someone who has studied and mastered their instrument. You don't even have to be formally educated or know theory, but there are definite cases of people who dabble in music versus those who are actually talented and knowledgeable musicians.

>>72960659
>singing
>tones
>notes
>harmonies
>vibratto

>rapping
>talking

>>72960393
System of a Down is the only good metal band.

>>72960534
/Thread

>>72960692
did you conveniently forget that rhythm is an element of music?
personally I think of poetry as music too but that's a belief that requires some explaining

>inb4 meter and rhyme
>it's poetry!!
Go read Elegy In A Country Churchyard and compare it to literally any rap song, and then fuck off.

>>72960728
>Well of course art I find bad isnt REAL art

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>>72960698
>nu-metal Guitar Hero trash
>the only good metal

>>72960722
Different anon, I'd say poetry is definitely a related art form, but distinct from music.

Also, this is a decent enough place to bring up the idea: Why is there so little rap that's actually experimental with rhythm? It feels like most flows, even ones I enjoy, are pretty typical and simple. I'd be interested to hear some math rap, something complicated and fun like that.

>>72960577
okay so the producers are the true musicians in hiphop. i can agree in that point but a lot of these beats are enhanced by the MC, sure the MC is very replaceable in the case of lil boat but Danny Brown for example adds a lot.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LgCU3rC6tqU

>>72960252
>all these posts later and no one can disprove these against OP
hmmm

>>72960229
i enjoy rap but it's essentially novelty music

boy named sue/transfusion/they're coming to takw me away

all have 'spoken' lyrics against a rhythm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0rgeQ0QD-o

>>72960748
probably because speech already has rhythms that make understanding clearer, so writing math rap would break things up in a way we would find unnatural and jarring
to be fair though, people already find rhythmically complicated music jarring so it could be a matter of getting used to it

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>>72960738
Here's Elegy compared to the current most popular rap song on Billboard.

>>72960800
Yeah, it would definitely be difficult and probably would require reading the lyrics along with it, but I think that would be super interesting.

>>72960748
because nobody who likes rap likes complex music

>>72960811
non sequitur

>>72960825
>>72960800
I hope Kanye's next album is super challenging, totally non-commercial technical math rap

>>72960728
>>72960811
goes on /lit/ once

>>72960842
I don't think that means what you think it means.

Rap is shit. It's mainly lyrical music, but the lyrics always terrible. Bad grammar, constant nigger slang, no interesting subject matter and cliches that no rapper wants to shake off for whatever reason.

>>72960865
no

>>72960860
>/lit/
Elegy Written In A Country Churchyard is literally the most entry-level poetry. The teach that shit in high school. My point was that even the most basic, entry-level poetry shits all over rap lyrics.

Hip hop has the potential to be a good, interesting genre but needs to be experimented with and broken down at a fundamental level.

>nobody has been able to prove OP wrong

Shit thread

Check these dubs, tho

>>72960979
because it's like stating "2 and 2 is 4"

prove me wrong

>>72961069
You got those sexual singles

People who think you need to play an instrument to be considered "real music" should go back to r/music. I thought you guys ridiculed the rage comic mentality

>>72960229
Hip hop is just as much a meme as any genre.
You can't make it go away ever.

>>72960229
Yeah fuck the avalanches and endtroducing. all hip hop is shit.
not like rap
or any genre like trip hop

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Rap seems pretty disposable, it worships youth.
You dont see hip hop fans honoring old rappers like ll cool j, or the beastie boys, or public enemy, or run dmc.
Man, they dont even give a shit about 50 cent or emenim anymore.

I think rock is the only genre were if you get old or die on top you become like a mythological figure

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>>72960229
This is probably correct in some ways. Hip Hop is a culture and only people who are born into it or live the culture can truly understand it.

Hip hop is harder to get into than most other genres since you have to research references and slang from the culture. Take Texas Hip Hop for example. The slang is so different and if you are a person that have only listened to East Coast Hip Hop, it's like a whole new language. Who knows what syrup, plex or slab means?

Yhen we have the whole sport and sneaker references. I guess it's easier for americans but most europeans don't know any basketball players aside from Jordan and Shaq. Also how are you gonna relate to a pair of sneakers if you have never seen them?

>>72960353
>>72960353
I think it's because hip-hop is the new pop, manufactured music meant to be catchy and accessible, which makes it difficult for these people to enjoy anything else.

>>72960577
Lived in Nashville most my life. Dad been in the business all his life. 90% of country is written by someone else. A good songwriter can make a very comfortable living in Nashvegas.

>>72960229
That is the most redundant fucking paragraph I have ever seen written. You are just saying the same thing over and over again in different ways. It's so goddamn repetitive. You could have just written the first sentence and it would have had the same effect.

Go fuck yourself.

>>72961907
>sports
>syrup
>sneakers
Literally who cares?

>>72960229
cLOUDDEAD is the exception. It's close to ambient than hip hop.

>>72961999
t. butthurt (c)rap fan

>>72961327
>You dont see hip hop fans honoring old rappers like ll cool j, or the beastie boys, or public enemy, or run dmc.
Do you live under a fucking rock?
>Man, they dont even give a shit about 50 cent or emenim anymore
Because both of them sucked and were overplayed flavors of the month that somehow stretched out to multi-album deals.
>I think rock is the only genre were if you get old or die on top you become like a mythological figure
I don't see anyone getting in line to suck Gene Simmons' cock, do you?

>>72960229
hip hop can't obviously can't be held to the same standards as other music. hip hop is about different things than "music". hip hop is about personality and storytelling. hip hop is about who the artist is and what they have to say. with every other type of music lyrics are the least important aspect but in hip hop it is the only aspect.

>>72960229
are you posting the same thread twice because you want us to validate your stupid opinion?

>>72962237
>hip hop is about personality and storytelling. hip hop is about who the artist is and what they have to say.
Almost all hip-hop miserably fails at conveying any of that.

I feel like yatchy would agree with you OP

>>72962237
>with every other type of music lyrics are the least important aspect but in hip hop it is the only aspect.
are you serious or just trying to get (you)s?

>>72962245
you sound like you don't listen to hip hop

>>72962259
Yeah, the millionth nigger rapping about drugs and bitches is really about his personality. Of course I don't listen to hip-hop, I've already decided it's shit.

>>72960698
System of a Down arent metal and I honestly wish that the Turks killed their ancestors to spare me from their shit

>>72962273
i mean we all know that the reason everyone in this thread doesn't like hip hop is because they don't like black people. thx 4 confirmation tho

>>72962312
I don't like niggers because hip-hop exists.

>>72962324
i dont like u :P

>>72962339
You have to go back.

>>72962220
>I don't see anyone getting in line to suck Gene Simmons' cock, do you?
Quit playing dumb. You know he's referring to bands like Sabbath, Floyd, Zeppelin, the Beatles, all those bands that people worship to no end.

>>72960229
I wonder how bad grills like those fuck up your teeth if you use them all the time

summer is here
and all the anti rap fags sound like 70's rock cunts that can't control their gdamn bladdar

>>72960229
You've never even listened to Gravediggaz.

>>72960293
>stealing
???

You okay there buddy?

>>72960353
Im a rap fan. Im also a fan of rock, classical, electronic, jazz, and soul. Do you think every hip hop fan is a retard?

>>72960229
When you grow up you'll get it anon, dont worry

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wen a nigga looking like balrog

>>72960229
> t. singing words isnt the same as rhythmically speaking words and I cant compare the two so it must mean my preferred style is better
pure cognitive bias

>>72962273
its just harder to get a band together to croon about basic political opinions or how depressed they are
>lets pretend exceptional music isnt rare across all genres

>>72964328
Those bands actually have musical substance to fall back on so it isn't that big of a deal.

>>72960577
Then what about Kanye? He wrote and produced his debut himself.

"I really hate to break it to you
But your life's being played with
You have not witnessed the world
'Cause you're stuck in the Matrix
Everything we have been taught was all a lie
Open your eyes, open your mind, and fly!"

Literally the most woke and intelligent lyrics of all time, and that comes from hip hop (real hip hop, not that Young Thug/Little Yachty/XXXtenacion shit).

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>>72960229
Penitentiary chances, the devil dances
And eventually answers to the call of Autumn
All of them fallin’ for the love of ballin’
Got caught with 30 rocks, the cop look like Alec Baldwin
Inter century anthems based off inner city tantrums
Based off the way we was branded
Face it, Jerome get more time than Brandon
And at the airport they check all through my bag
And tell me that it’s random
But we stay winning, this week has been a bad massage
I need a happy ending and a new beginning
And a new fitted, and some job opportunities that's lucrative
This the real world, homie, school finished
They done stole your dreams, you dunno who did it
I treat the cash the way the government treats AIDS
I won’t be satisfied til all my niggas get it, get it?


Checkmate

>>72960234
Fpbp

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>Prove me wrong.

>111 replies and 8 images omitted. Click here to view.

ara ara... such innocence

>>72960577
>Dubstep and Techno
i love it when people reference these two genres
in tandem like this, confirms that they have no idea what theyre talking about and are probably underage. Lets me easily discard the post, hide it, report it to the moderating team, ignore the user, and filter the tripcode if that happens to be present. :)

>>72960327
That's pretty close minded Anon, plenty of musicians have wide spanning tastes which happen to include hip hop and all it's influences

>>72960353
80% of my music is rap, but I still have music from bands like Thee Oh Sees, Miles Davis, Coltrane, Brain Tentacles, Led Zepp, Joy Division, Funkadelic, Herbie Hancock, Gorillaz, SBTRKT, Porter Robinson and a bit more.

>>72960577
Ahhhhh, I get it. OP and his cohorts have come from /pol/. Makes sense.

>>72960353
a lot of people in the hip hop scene in my country ended up listening to a lot of soul/funk/r&b music since hip hop comes from there but back then it wasn't mainstream
then hip hop became the normie genre

>>72960229
I can prove you wrong with 1 single rap artist

>b-but instruments! wheres my guitars?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cziv-WGRLcE

Sure, he doesn't play the insturments himself but neither do most singers in bands. Many rap artist produce their own beats though.

>lyrics are shit
Guilt trippin' and feelin' resentment
I never met a transient that demanded attention
They got me frustrated, indecisive and power trippin'
Sour emotions got me lookin' at the universe different
I should distance myself, I should keep it relentless
My selfishness is what got me here, who the fuck I'm kiddin'?
So I'mma tell you like I told the last bum
Crumbs and pennies, I need all of mines
And I recognize this type of panhandlin' all the time

Better than another rock song talking about muh love. Rapper like Aespo Rock have a wider vocabulary than most of your average rockists.

>>72960293
who's praising kendrick for sampling jazz and soul? kendrick never once sampled jazz OR soul. his PRODUCERS did, and they're the one who get the praise for the instrumental aspects of the music.

kendrick chose these beats and bought them from the producer and put his name and his performance on them and put them on his albums so the producers could make royalties because he felt a connection to the music.

now let's me and you try to figure out why a black man who raps about black culture would ever feel a connection to fucking jazz and soul? really difficult i know, but i'm sure both of us together can crack this one.

>>72960364
what about the rap artists who do play instruments? like ty dolla $ign, who plays bass, guitar, piano, and drums. does that make his autotuned rnb style rap any better?

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great thread

>>72965558
> if you don't like hiphop you must be racist

why do rapfags always do this? Is it just because they only listen to rap because it's "le black music" that they think anyone who doesn't does the same?

>>72965974
read what he's replying to

>>72965974
if you actually read the comment he was responding to it was blatantly racist

>>72964029
thats bison tho

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90% of rap is shit but theres quite a few great rap albums.
pic related

>>72964469
>literally taking the plot of a movie and converting it to lyrics that rhyme
>mfw the movie wasn't even original

>>72964504
>the same song posted in EVERY rap thread
So you guys think there was only one good rap song?

>>72965650
>single artist
>video is Kendrick Lamar on stage, in front of a backing band
His band sounded great. If you wanted to make an argument for a SINGLE artist, it would be Kendrick on stage by himself, and it would be bad.

Nobody can dispute it because rap is so obviously shit.

>>72965974
Are you retarded?
That guy was spouting all kinds of racist shit, fucking new fags I swear

>>72960229
This but with irony toned all the way down to 0%

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>>72960229
Uuuumm

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How can people say rap is shit when SUC exists?

>>72966682
yes, because REAL music always consists of a single artist on stage, alone

>>72965994
>>72967060
give me one (1) reason why racism is wrong

>>72968089
It's not good

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rap is a shitstain on the panties of musical history

>>72968089
I know you just want to talk about how much you hate niggers, there already is a board for that. This one os for music

Can nigger just get filtered to"my wife's son" to get upset /pol/?

>>72960346
every genre of music in the US was created by black people and co-opted by whites after that.

>>72960811
This song doesnt have great lyrics, but Kendrick has put out some incredibly well written songs. Sing about me im dyin of thirst, and a lot of GKMC was really well written.

>>72960825
Eminem is perhaps the best lyricists in rap and can do more in a 16 bar verse than anyone from any other genre

>>72960534
No, not really. A producer is not a musician. People who play instruments create new sounds as they play the instrument. The beat maker is more like a mix between a producer, a composer and a listener. Sometimes he is also a kind of drummer and half-assed keyboard player.

>>72964028
Get what? That tough guy poetry is lame as fuck and 14 year olds are their #1 fans?

>>72968914
Jesus, how fucking thick are you.
>People who play instruments create new sounds as they play the instrument

A producer can actually create new sounds because a computer is a way less limited instrument than, say, a guitar. A guitarist can only innovate so far as tonality, texture or melody the guitar with or without pedals or some shit like that can take him.

Chief Keef is the most creative (especially his 2013-2014 work), and arguably best, trap rapper of all time, prove me wrong.

>>72962220
actually despite everything the grunge kids liked KISS ironically


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6-iBz7vvbI

Can anyone eloquently explain to me the appeal of rap?

>>72960229
This is probably bait but I'm gonna sperg out anyway

>>72960312
Classical composers 'sampled' each other all the time. The idea of sampling being bad has only existed since modern copyright laws were enacted.

>>72960293
>>72960353
Because it's a very different sound than what was and is popular now. He was rapping about black culture so he chose beats that he felt had the 'blackest' identity in them to connect with what he was rapping about thematically.

>>72960327
I've played piano for close to two decades and guitar for over one. I'm also pretty decent with Logic as far as software goes, and that's taught me about synthesizers in general. I love hip-hop but also listen to sludge/stoner/doom/black metal, dance punk, alternative country, neo-psychedlia, ambient techno, etc, etc.

>>72960364
See also: Steve Vai and John Cage. Vai is a technical god who has yet to write a good song in his entire career. Cage, on the other hand, was able to make thought-provoking experimental music without using any conventional instruments at all.

>>72960478
Most people misunderstand Auto Tune. It can't make you a good singer, just an on-pitch one, and it's very noticeable when a terrible singer has been pitch corrected. The stereotype of absolutely talentless pop stars is a false one.

>>72960531
Just like how Ella Fitzgerald isn't an artist because all she did was sing, right?

>>72960577
Listen to the instrumental for Lupe Fiasco's Superstar, then listen to the actual track. Lupe's presence is the only thing that makes the song work at all. Then listen to Deltron 3030 and focus on Del's flow. Del's vocals are as musically important as Dan the Automator's beats and Kid Koala's scratches are.

>>72960692
Have you somehow never heard of flows?

>>72960776
Listen to Kendrick's "The Blacker the Berry." You can hear how passionate he is about what he's rapping in his performance, especially in the second verse. Novelty music doesn't have passion like that.

>>72960531
Most rappers write their own shit, it's just the mega commercialized ones like drake that have writers. It's the same thing pop artists do.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMRkxidQO-M

/thread

>>72960811
Humble comes after Pride on the album which gives it an entirely different context than looking at the lyrics alone– just like Backseat Freestyle, he's essentially rapping in character. Beyond that, comparing a hip-hop song to a poem is as pointless as comparing the David to a Jackson Pollock piece and arguing about which one is better.

>>72960867
It's a common misconception that rap is a particularly lyrical genre. Others may not agree with me there, but it's entirely possible to be a great rapper without telling great stories or having spectacular insights. Rappers aren't trying to be Leonard Cohen, they're playing with language. The meanings of the words they rap don't matter nearly as much as the sounds and rhythms of the words, which also typically do fit together into something cohesive. It may not be deep, but things don't have to be deep to be good.

>>72960910
It has been almost constantly since its inception. Listen to clipping., Afrika Bambaataa, Dalek, cLOUDDEAD, Shabazz Palaces, Public Enemy, Danny Brown's Atrocity Exhibition just to start.

>>72961327
People still revere Tupac, Biggie, Nas, A Tribe Called Quest, Rakim, NWA, Scarface, the Wu-Tang Clan, and far more. The idea of releasing a classic album is central to hip-hop culture. Also, the Beastie Boys, Public Enemy and Run-DMC are still talked about all the time.

>>72961959
Did you not listen to To Pimp A Butterfly or did you just conveniently leave that platinum-selling release out?

>>72962046
Obviously the artist and their fanbase does because it's part of their culture. Who cares about the umpteenth progressive rock song about unicorns and fairies or transcendence or whatever? The artist and fans do.

>>72962273
Those are themes because that's what rappers typically grow up in. Listen to Future's DS2 and read the lyrics because while on the surface they're literally all about drugs, sex, and money, the subtext is how none of it actually makes his life any better.

I really really can't think of any form of music more creative than hip-hop.

With Rock and its myriad of genres - Any Rock album today will sound like one made 40 years ago. An emo album in 2017 will sound exactly like an emo album made in 2007.

A trap album made today will sound nothing like one made ten years ago.

Rock is just so fucking stagnant man.

>>72969492
>he's essentially rapping in character.

I don't think he's rapping as a character there. I think he's rapping as his true self. Pride is completely about how he himself cannot be humble, it's just not in him and his own pride is part of that.

So instead of himself being humble because other people are insecure about his talent, he tells them to be humble because they cannot possibly ever hope to match him. He's always been like that, in his heart of hearts, he truly believes he is the best person doing this right now. When you think that about yourself, how can you possibly be humble?

Using Lil Yatchy as your image doesn't help the argument

>>72964469
Those are reaaaaaaally corny lyrics

>>72966682
This is the worst argument I have ever read. By extension, drummers and bassists are all bad because by and large they're unable to make interesting music all on their own while electronic artists make the most complex art ever dreamed of.

>>72968914
How do you think beats are created if not by a MIDI keyboard? Beyond that, an instrument is something that can make sound. Do the drums stop being an instrument if they're played on an electronic kit instead of an acoustic one? Are guitars that are sent through software amps no longer instruments because they've been stained by computers even though they're just simulating actual amps?

>>72969643
Close, but Pride is about how he worries about his pride:

>See, in the perfect world, I would be perfect, world
>I don't trust people enough beyond they surface, world
>I don't love people enough to put my faith in men
>I put my faith in these lyrics, hoping I make amend
>I understand I ain't perfect
>I probably won't come around
>This time, I might put you down
>Last time, I ain't give a fuck, I still feel the same now
>My feelings might go numb, you're dealing with cold thumb
>I’m willing to give up a leg and arm and show empathy from
>Pity parties and functions and you and yours
>A perfect world, you probably live another 24
>I can’t fake humble just 'cause your ass is insecure

People thought Humble was taking shots at Big Sean in the hook when it was released as a single, but in the context of the album he's telling himself to be humble. It's not Kendrick Lamar, the person, rapping, it's a character judging him.

>>72968810
WE

I like rap, I just don't like how anti-white most of it is. Kendrick hates white people, Chuck D hates white people, Jay-Z hates white people, Def hates white people, DOOM hates white people.

Who does that leave?

>>72969906
Now I don't give a fuck if you
Black, White, Asian, Hispanic, goddammit
That don't mean shit to me
Fuck your ethnicity, nigga - Kendrick Lamar

>>72960229
i agree. from a musical perspective hip hop is embarrassingly simple shit. people say it's all about the lyrics but most rap today has terrible lyrics anyways. mumble rappers just say the same banal shit over and over with lots of ad libs.

>>72969832
I really can't see your point. Pride to me yes is him worrying about his pride as you said, but to me it's just him saying I can worry about it, but it's not going to change, because I can't change that. He readily admits that he's full of contradictions.

Look that those lines.
>See, in the perfect world, I would be perfect, world
But then he goes on to state
>Sick venom in men and women overcome with pride
>A perfect world is never perfect, only filled with lies

He does talk about what he'd be like if the world was perfect, but it's not and he doesn't believe anything is, except God. He worries about his pride, and how it may ruin him, but he's resigned to it because of the way the world is and how he himself cannot change what he feels or believes just because of how it might make you feel. I think that's why he repeats the "I can’t fake humble just 'cause your ass is insecure" line. He is instating his belief that being humble is something he cannot be.

That's why Pride pairs so wonderfully with Humble to me. When Kendrick does his usual braggadocios rap, it usually was in character like in Backseat Freestyle, and what I assumed he was doing when I first heard the single without the context of the album. Hearing it after Pride though, (and DNA and Element to a certain extent where he repeatedly states how much he is the best at doing this) it makes me think Humble is him being himself, no characters necessary. He's not telling himself to be humble, he's telling every one of his challengers to.

>>72960698

lol

>>72960722

every rap song is 4/4

>>72970074
>embarrassingly simple shit

Somebody call Earth and tell them that Earth 2 is no longer good because it's so simple

>>72970159
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCvTk1iA2RI&ab_channel=KanyeWest-Topic

And do you realize that you're saying that every single song in 4/4 has the same rhythm? Do triplets, rests, and half, eighth, and sixteenth notes not exist to you?

>>72970125
I still think that Humble is him telling himself to be humble, but you've got some good points.

>>72969189
I listen for flows

Big Pun or Big L for example, very old school rappers but demonstrate the highest form of rhythm if you rap along you can understand the art more, for example Big L's 98 freestyle and Big Pun Hot 97 freestyle.

>>72970159
even if that were true it would be irrelevant you tool listening child

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>>72970537
Maybe these guys are from Atlanta where they never speak of Pun

>>72960577
>and at least country "artists" can sing and write lyrics.
DIRT ROAD TRACTOR ICE COLD BEER AND A PAIR OF JEANS AND BOOTS TO KICK YO ASS

>>72970159
My ear is terrible when it comes to this but i'm pretty sure the entirety of MBDTF and also kendrick's DAMN have irregular time sigs throughout and natural melodic flow

Both albums i would recommend for rockist or metalhead

As for the OP's statement obviously is an exaggeration/generalization and etc. Whatever you may call it. And music doesnt need extreme complexity to sound good you can make something simple sound nice to the ears but each one to each one.

>>72960229
Hip hop is the only genre right now that's attempting to innovate or be fresh in any regard if anything it's the other way around.

>>72970815
>recommending DAMN to a rockist

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>>72960842

>>72969864
WUZ

Great rapping is as difficult a physical musical & artistic skill as singing or any instrument.

If you disagree, I dare you to record yourself rapping and post a link.

The best rappers balance their voices with rhythm in a way equal to and better than any artist of any genre.

The bar is lower because it's extremely popular and popular music has a low fucking bar. The doesn't discredit the genre- mass consumption edm, pop music and rock at their peak popularity were some of the worst pieces of shit in western music history.

How to make trap music


pick a name that sounds completely fucking stupid. How about Lil Schmopz?

pick a beat. preferably a sick beat bruh.

AYH BRUH AYH AYH AYH GOT THE GANJA ON THE ROCKA BLAM BLAM NIGGA DEAD SIPPIN DRANK IN DA STREETZ GANG GANG GANG NIGGAH AYYYYYY YO YO AYYYYY
GIRL ACTIN MESS GOTTA SMACK
HOME ACTIN MESS GOTTA SMACK
DRANK ACTIN MESS GOTTA SMACK
AYAYAAYAYAOOYOYOYO

congrats, you're popular with 15 year olds everywhe

>>72971488
Why not do that and make millions then?

>>72969238
( Y o u )

>>72971488
Except there are thousands of kids who've done basically that and only get like 1000 views on worldstar, people can tell when something is done differently and when it is done well. If you don't listen to a genre it will all sound the same to you, people who don't listen to jazz could say that you just pick up a trumpet and play random notes for 8 minutes, they would be wrong in exactly the same way that you are wrong.

>>72960229
Hip-hop has pretty low standards, but it's not fair to say it has the lowest standards of every genre considering some of the shit in pop and country.

Kanye West is the best rapper because he transcends the genre.

>>72972012
kek

>not listening to sick beats

guitar is dead senpai gb21980

>>72971488
kek

>>72970254
>Somebody call Earth and tell them that Earth 2 is no longer good because it's so simple
earth 2 is cool in a novel way. but it's obscure and drone is only popular among a small cult following. it hasn't been done to death like the 4/4 boom bap of hip hop has. hip hop is like the most popular genre currently and the industry has been shilling it for years.

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>>72960383
>do you know about 9/11 yet?
kek

>>72972630
This

>>72972630
All you have to do is look at clipping. to see that there's plenty more room to explore in that space.

>>72960811
lol and that's supposed to be a conscious artist to

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>>72960897
>My point was that even the most basic, entry-level poetry shits all over rap lyrics.
This is accurate, I'm a fan of hip hop but it annoys me when people equate rapping to poetry... even though essentially they are very similar

>>72964026
Yes.

Signed, a rap fan

>>72960698
I honestly dont know why /mu/ hates soad

>>72973718
>there's plenty more room to explore in that space.
one artist blending hip hop with harsh noise doesn't mean that there's lots more room to explore. hip hop has already been fused with practically every other genre. plus even if there is more room to explore, most hip hop artists sure as hell aren't acting like it. 99% of modern hip hop is generic mumble trap shit.

the hip hop scene is always trying to front that it's progressive but they've been stuck in the same place for like 5 years. plebs are still eating it up though

>>72974428
Almost every subgenre can be boiled down to fusing genres or elements of music that already exist, and the assumption that this is all there is to creating music with a new sound shows a superficial listening

>>72960229
1. The vast majority of people on this planet don't speak English, what rappers say on the track is completely irrelevant to most people on this planet.

2. The lack of standards is why hip hop is thriving. It allows people to be truly creative. Look at Death Grips and Saul Williams for proof.

3. Hip Hop listeners allow rappers like Lil Yachty or the Migos to thrive because they are aware that none of it will stand the test of time. Its fun dumb shit that we currently need in a world were the media is taking itself to seriously.

>>72974493
anon, whether you like it or not, most hip hop is musically inferior to most other genres. playing a 4/4 kick-snare beat for 3-5 minutes with an 8 bar melodic loop or sample is just lazy and uncreative. compare that to like any rock, folk, jazz, or classical.

it's a small, incredibly simple idea that people have been copying and pasting for years. just because people use slightly different sounds doesn't mean that the general structure is any different. people use the same exact structure nearly invariably.

if anything, the fact that you can get so much enjoyment from listening to several minutes of 4/4 "boom bap" over and over again, that shows superficial listening on your part.

>>72974786
make me a 5 second long beat with a sampled melody right now

>>72974786
And furthermore, regarding the general structure of hip hop, it has an extreme resemblance to standard Bebop structure in which a melodic phrase or 'head' is used as the musical bases for improvised solos that the musicians will perform, which can be extended for as long as the musicians still think they have more to 'say' by inserting another instance of the head to break up soloists. Hip hop has a hook instead of a head and the solos have been replaced by verses. Keep in mind that many folk traditions have genre qualifications that are so specific that to the uninitiated causes all music in the genre sound the same.

>>72974916
I made some mistakes in the last sentence there but you can probably still get what I meant

>>72974805
this is a mix of several rough beats i made a couple years ago. none of them took more than a day or two to make.
https://clyp.it/pidsmtt0

but effort isn't the point here. a painter can paint the most beautifully realistic or stylistically interesting painting but if the subject matter and the composition are shit then the painting is still going to be shit.

Ask any educated black and they will tell you the disowned hip hop after the nineties

>>72974964
*they

>>72960327
Neck yourself.

>>72960353
Hip hop fan here. I listen to almost every genre out there.

>>72969238
>>72969492
Why do the best answers always have 1 reply?
Always nit-picking retarded comments over smart ones to respond.

>>72974916
comparing hip hop to bebop is some pretty convoluted mental gymnastics. i guess that structurally they're similar, but bebop is infinitely more complex and creative than hip hop. if you actually try to say otherwise, than our fundamental views of hip hop are way too different to justify continuing this argument

>>72968810
This is an absolute mythology. Jazz is about half white in it's origins. Rock after 1965 (after which whites utterly dominated and completely transformed it) is as informed by the shitty nigger boogy woogy of the 50s as it is by folk music, co-opting of eastern music, white chamber pop, jazz music (which is about 50/50), blues (which IS black), minimalism, electronic music, European cabaret and the dissonance/indeterminacy of classical musicians like Cage, Ives, and Schoenberg. Tracing rock after 1965 entirely through Chuck Berry, Bo Diddley, Little Richard to the sped up shitty boogy-woogy of Louis B. Jordan is one of the most bald-faced lies there ever was.

>>72960393
SOAD are metal gods though.

>>72975063
name a single popular rock song which doesn't use a black rhythm.
Get your shit together, jazz is black and has always been. Of course the first records aren't black, considering they couldn't use the same restrooms, let alone same studios.
Folk on the other hand is a very vague term as there is white folk and black folk.
I agree music isn't black, but don't tell me popular genres aren't rhythmically informed mostly by black people

>>72960698
>>72975112
>t. nostalgiafags
soad are really bad. and i love metal

>>72975060
The point is that you cant blame a hook verse structure for any shortcomings you see in the genre, and that if you believe that shortcomings are inherent to the genre then you should leave criticism to people who actually want to hear the music.
>bebop is infinitely more complex and creative than hip hop
In my opinion the greatest 'outlet' of sorts for hip hop's creativity is lyrical and comparing melodic skill directly to lyrical skill won't produce anything constructive.

>>72975159
>In my opinion the greatest 'outlet' of sorts for hip hop's creativity is lyrical
ffs anon you should have just said this from the beginning. I made a point to clarify that i was only talking about "the musical aspects of hip hop" from the get go.

the lyrics are something completely different (also primarily shit)

>>72975159
also i wasn't blaming a hook verse structure. i was critiquing the fact that the beat that doesn't change for the entire song and the non-percussive elements of the music are almost invariably a 4-16 bar loop that is repeated throughout the entire song

>>72975125
>which doesn't use a black rhythm
You missed the point, which was that blacks don't get sole credit for originating modern rock music. Thus, not every facet of modern rock was "co-opted" by whites, and many facets were outrightly invented by whites, ESPECIALLY any technology-based sounds or implementations. Also, define precisely what a "black rhythm" is.
>jazz is black and has always been
You are utterly ignorant of the earliest white syncopated bands of New Orleans, or the fact that jazz largely derives from ragtime, which (in spite of Scott Joplin having composed in ragtime) is largely an evolution of coon songs that were literally used to make fun of niggers. The instrumentation and the dance based thematics of the songs are entirely white and based on the white brass bands of the 1880-1910s period.
>folk on the other hand is a very vague term
Black folk is largely blues based, so I am talking about white folk music.

Nor am I claiming that African contributions have nothing to do with rock music.

>>72960531
Nigger even Drake is talented as fuck and he has ghostwriters. He's still gotta rap. His flow is on point.

>>72975361
>someone else makes his beats
>someone else writes his lyrics
>someone else autotunes his voice
lmao drake is a hack anon

>>72961327
Hip hop head here. I love the old school and the new school. KRS One, BDP, Mob Deep etc.

>>72960648
>tfw rappers who don't self-produce or write their own lyrics are nothing more than voice actors

>>72962245
Listen to any of the greats. Outkast, Slick Rick, Jigga, GZA, Wu-Tang.

>>72962237
i don't like hip hop and i've been arguing against itt, but this anon hit the nail on the head. this should have been /thread

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>>72960229
>implying The Chronic isnt better than a common folk or generic rock album
b8 harder op

Gonna post a thread of amazing hip hop verses. Anyone in?

>>72967538
this

NIGGA NIGGA NIGGA NIGGA NIGGA I'M 100% NIGGA!

Classic music is better than any other gender.

>>72975572
>Classic music is better than any other gender.
>Classic music
>Classic
(You)

Hip Hop is for people with low iq

>>72975572
true

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>>72975572
>classic
>gender

>>72975572
I'm sorry. You're joke just landed. This is a good post.

I can't take every genre seriously. My mind isn't wide open like a whore's vagina for me to be able to enjoy everything that other people call ''''''''''''''music'''''''''''''''

>literally this easy to bait out kekdrick worshipping white bois
Lmfao

why people haven't realized these are /pol/ bait threads and effectively slid is because OP is objectively wrong & a faggot

>>72975666
op's argument has been proved right over and over itt. even by ppl who like hip hop. see >>72962237

>>72960293
It sucks because people like you are so busy flinging invalid non-criticisms towards TPAB that the real criticisms get lost in the shuffle.

The jazz/funk wasn't bad because it utilized sampling, it was bad because it was cheesy nu-revivalism that didn't really serve any purpose in the grand scheme of things besides "this is black music and I'm also black."

>>72960229
Listen to Be by Common (the album, not the song)

>>72975656
kekdrick sucks ass anyway

>>72975712
>op's been proven right over and over
anon pls...

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Rap offers nothing of cultural or spiritual value.

Honestly I have no freaking idea why is Kendrick Lamar praised so much.... I mean, sure, he's doesn't write shallow lyrics but cmon. There's a bunch of ''not so obvious meaning lyrics'' out there mostly written by try hard depressive bands and I don't see people calling them the ''best artist of the century''.

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>>72960393
>Not liking System Of A Down

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>>72966099
What other great rap albums are you referring too?

>>72975819
is something that any uncultured fuck would say

Its crazy how you can make a pol thread about Kendrick Lamar and the worst posts in the whole thread are still somehow from metalfags.

>>72975872
I didn't say it didn't have an impact on culture. Merely that the impact is a net negative in every sense of the word.

>>72975872
he's right and you know it. Rap is easy to make and easy to listen to. It has absolutely no musical value at all.

>ITT rockfags still salty cause nobody gives a shit about their genre anymore


kek stay cucked

>>72975881
listen to this and tell me it's bad. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLKWB5rofsg&t=38s

>hip hop defender gets btfo
>goes into a samefagging rampage

>>72969238
God bless you anon

>>72975892
>>72975911
are you guys thinking of that mumble rap bullshit? if not, oldschool rap (1985-95) was fucking huge even if you personally arent aware of it

>>72969238

>3 replies
>none of them are from the people he replied to

really activates my almonds

>>72975995
Again. Cultural impact. Not cultural value.

>>72975996
>really activates my almonds
kekd and spit ma juice fucking everywhere
well done anon

>>72960229

Hip-Hop music is just too producer focused.

Nobody gives a shit about the endless stream of rappers put on a project because 90% of them all sound the same. Only performers with distinct voices/personalities like Future and 2 Chainz have actual followings that listen to their music outside of a club/pre-game setting. Otherwise, hip-hop singles are just vehicles for producers to flex on.

Pop music would go down this path too if it weren't for the fact that pop stars are expected to have a prominent, unique, marketable image. No such standard exists for hip-hop so every motherfucker looks and acts the same.

>>72975881
>crine about /pol/ boogeymen
>I got btfo (blown the fuck out), better invoke a c.2012 stereotype
At least p4k will write thinkpieces about how progressive you are

>>72976031
2005-2017 accurate
what a fucking shame
thanks obama

>>72976031
very accurate post

>>72960229
Madvillian challenges that, but for most of hip hop yeah you're right. Instrumentally it doesn't compete

>>72975819
And this automatically is a negative how?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l2yjpYz3Uc8

>>72976141
Degeneration of society from one of tradition and hierarchy to one of material degeneracy.

>>72976031
>90% of them all sound the same
>shills Future and 2 Chainz
Hoo boy, this is like the Badpost Olympics up in here

>>72960229
DJ Shadow's Entroducing

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Noise cannot be held to the same standards as other music. It cannot compete with music as a whole. noise pales in comparison to literally any other genre. It has the lowest standards of any genre. An album can be good by noise standards, but it cannot be considered good compared to the rest of the music world.

Prove me wrong.

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>>72976161
kek are you seriously blaming hip hop for that?
im guessing KISS is the Devil's music too?

>>72976195
I never said that rap was the reason society is filth. It is one of many. Do not put words in my mouth.

>>72976166

I'm not shilling them. They both put out the same flavor of shit as every other hip-hop artist, it's just that they have styles of delivering lyrics that actually stand out among a sea of Chris Brown/Kendrick Lamar soundalikes.

It's telling that DJ Khalid was memed into pop culture while people could probably only name a fraction of the people who put lyrics to his beats.

>>72976166
dis

>>72976161
you sound a lot like an islamic extremist. which is weird since you're probably a christian

>>72976166
>interpreting that as him shilling future and 2 chains
learn how to read. he's explaining why they're popular. not saying that they're good

>>72976228
I am not Christian. Nor Musselman. Both have value, however.

>>72976167
that's an example of an album that is good (imo more than just "good" but that's not the point) by the standards of other music, but extraordinary by the standards of hip hop.
basically >>72960229 is right as shit

>>72976232
You learn how to read retard, if you don't think those two rappers are a part of this strawman generic 90% then you're just a sad fanboy.

>>72976193
It's not music

>>72976268
not only did this post make no sense, but it shows a complete ignorance and disregard for anything that has been previously said in this discussion.

nobody said anything about those two rappers being in the 90% or being out of the 90%. those two concepts have been completely unrelated since that anon made his first post.

>>72976215
what are some of the others?

>>72976336
That's because you can't read. We've established this, you would know that if you could read.

>>72976465
Modernity. Egalitarianism. Capitalism. Socialism. Democracy. Republicanism. Totalitarianism. Communism. Fascism. National -Socialism. Salafism. Zionism. Statism. Secularism. Atheism.

>>72976239
https://youtu.be/1zMf_8hkCdc

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>>72976471

>>72976503
so are you just an anarkitty?

>>72976532
Anarchism is also part of the problem. The state is divine.

>>72976513
?

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>>72976503
>Capitalism
>Socialism
>Communism
>Fascism

tfw you believe in nothing

>>72976593
Monarchism.

>>72970815
>MBDTF has irregular time sigs
>Damn has irregular time sigs
nope

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>>72960327
This is a bad bait what whatever.

You can listen to rap and other genres of music. It's not exclusive. Why don't people get that?

>>72960252
>>72960775
Illmatic isn't good.

>>72976583
watch it bud

>>72970815
>the entirety of MBDTF and also kendrick's DAMN have irregular time sigs throughout
You're just throwing around terms you don't know the meaning of in an attempt to justify listening to rap