how do we make classical popular again?

>>72119219

sponsoring PoC as composers

Bring back monarchies and make high art the realm of the bourgeois again, only way it would work

>>72119219
Its popular enough as it is. Plenty of performances and new albums being released, plenty of new pieces being written, performed and recorded, plenty of young people getting into classical and plenty of youth orchestras getting younger players involved.

You just have to recognize its an older demographic than most of 4chan that appreciates classical. in ages 18 - 25 its less common, but ages 30+ its more common, and seems to increase as people age and mature

>>72119272
>plenty of new pieces being written, performed and recorded
link me some good examples of recently written classical

rap over it

>>72119276
http://www.classicfm.com/store/cds/anthony-hopkins-composer/

>>72119272
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-umHvslii_o

this is a fucking mess

what else you got

>>72119293
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-umHvslii_o

>>72119293
>>72119309
No memes, please.

>>72119328
>proves me wrong
>MEME xD

>>72119272
>classical recording sales in the gutter
>live classical music is less commercially viable than ever, symphonies & halls to heavily schedule game and movie music to stay afloat
>literally nobody is composing anything that could be considered traditional classical

wew lad, c'mon now

>>72119231
they're already trying to infuse "classical composers" with "girl power" and "correct the wrongs of history", so that's not the problem

>>72119276
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_in_classical_music#New_works
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_in_classical_music#New_works
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_in_classical_music#New_works
etc.

>>72119355
yeah thanks for the useless link, I've checked some of those pieces out and they're pretty terrible

it's a niche market, and that's the problem-- it's novelty is it's selling point but the music sucks dick

granted i haven't listened to everything new, every time i try to find some good recent work i quickly lose motivation

>>72119346
>literally nobody is composing anything that could be considered traditional classical
You simply don't know what you're talking about.
There are many many musicians and ensembles who make their livings purely from playing classical music. No one is going to get rich from playing classical music, its about the art and sharing beautiful music rather than trying to make money. If you focus too much on making money you end up with really boring popular music.

>>72119355
>>72119368

Who is more retarded?

The one assuming everything is good or the one thinking everything is bad?

>>72119381
the link me a recent composition that isn't garbo
>you can't
k

>lets just leave classical as a niche and not think of ways to possibly revive the genre
leave the fucking thread, you are literally retarded

>>72119368
Thankfully classical doesn't care if you like it or not. It exists in its own world. You can join or not - no one will care. Meanwhile classical performers continue to play new and old music all over the world, and composers continue to write new works every day.

>>72119386
i'll eventually get through that list of new compositions, but i've yet to find anything good, i have listen to nothing even -remotely- memorable

please provide if you can, but i don't think you can... so please stop shitposting and fucking kill yourself idiot

>>72119394
unfortunately the classical genre is in the gutter and it's this kind of "backwards" thinking that's pushing it further to irrelevancy

you're dumb as fuck

>>72119401
>I'm just going to keep calling everything posted shit to win the argument

you kys, retard

>>72119413
Yet every single piece is still better than all popular music.

>>72119392
>the link me a recent composition that isn't garbo
not sure what you're trying to ask or imply there, but I assume you want me to link you a recent classical composition that isn't garbage?
I could link you pieces I enjoy, but determining whether something is "garbage" or not is up to the individual. If you don't like classical music to start with, odds are you won't like contemporary classical music.

Modern classical music is incredibly varied, and can be even more difficult to digest than the classical of 200 - 300 years ago. You need a good basis in traditional classical music and what happened in the early 20th century in order to fully appreciate what composers are doing today.

Here's one piece I think is pretty cool from the last 30 years (starts around 0.50):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gG0j-35Mgk

>>72119417
thread purpose: make classical great again
>nah bro, classical is f-fine
no it's not, it's a niche genre falling further behind every year, and composers are composing for the sake of nolevty rather than passion

you don't see the problem?

this thread isn't "feel good" bullfuckery, contribute to the discussion of revival or fuck off, how hard is this to understand?

>>72119436
>I'm just going to keep calling everything posted shit to win the argument

*yawn*

>>72119433
i'll check it out in a bit

>>72119443
lmao, keep shitposting faggot

>>72119436
>composers are composing for the sake of nolevty rather than passion
This isn't in any way true.

>it's a niche genre falling further behind every year
Also untrue. If anything its doing better than it was 30 years ago. You're just not part of it so you assume its not there.

>>72119455
>keep shitposting faggot

Multiple links have been provided showing its neither dead or shit nor a niche genre of irrelevancy but your refusal to be open to this is the only shitposting.

I posted these in the /classical/ thread when someone asked for some recent compositions that were more symphonic and "tonal". Might as well repost them here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzSlmWQuHFw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHQfid7zecE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAh4cBW389k
Rautavaara
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPYGRfzfBew
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFIGoB7rK70
Lera Auerbach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rpRr-tTEpfw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWLRwg9-Cqw
John Psathas
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gG0j-35Mgk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHI2xyyH-CU
Anthony Ritchie
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXAwEWKV6F8

>>72119467
>This isn't in any way true.
perhaps not the best way to phrase it, but that's the impression i get, because the pieces are devoid of any emotion and lack any real voice, hence the reason they're forgettable and you can't provide any compositions for example because you know this is true

>Also untrue. If anything its doing better than it was 30 years ago. You're just not part of it so you assume its not there.
lmao where are you getting this infomation? chopin nocturne youtube statistics?

sales are in the GUTTER, symphonies are playing more vidya shit and movie scores, classically trained and gifted pianist are resorting to playing video game tributes to make any kind of career for themselves

classical is dead as fuck right now, trying to deny this fact only hurts any possible progress we can make

>>72119474
haven't shown me shit, there's a link i havn't checked out with the thumbnail of a drummer so i'm not hopeful in that but yeah, give me something substantial my man

>>72119490
thx i'll check em out an report

>>72119516
>>I'm just going to keep calling everything posted shit to win the argument

>>72119523
how fucking stupid are you

>>72119433
this is jazz lmao, what the fuck are you smoking

>>72119516
>classical is dead as fuck right now
Only if you have no idea that the classical world exists. Which seems to be your case.

>sales are in the GUTTER
check your facts - compare classical sales today to classical sales in the 80s or 90s and report back on the trend.

>classically trained and gifted pianist are resorting to playing video game tributes to make any kind of career for themselves
Not true for the most part.

Try researching a subject before commenting on it. at this stage you're just baiting with blatant falsities. People are going to get sick of replying to you, and likely already assume you have no idea what you're talking about.

>>72119566
>this is jazz
Modern composers have a variety of influences, from jazz to traditional music. Just because something has a saxophone and honking doesn't mean its purely jazz. It has jazz influences, but it also has traditional Greek and middle eastern influences, and framed in the sensibilities of a contemporary concerto.

>>72119588
>Only if you have no idea that the classical world exists. Which seems to be your case.
yeah, it's a niche genre... this thread's starting topic wasn't "is classical close to 0 participants) it's how to make it popular again

>check your facts - compare classical sales today to classical sales in the 80s or 90s and report back on the trend.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/67270545/2014%20twim/Jan%208/Nielsen%20Entertainment%202013%20U%20S%20%20Year-End_FINAL.pdf?utm_source=getresponse&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=know&utm_content=This+Week+In+Music+-+January+8,+2014

>CLASSICAL 7,041 5,945 -15.60% 0.50% 0.50%
this is 2012-2014

https://slippedisc.com/2016/06/worst-ever-us-classical-sales-chart/
>For the first time, no release sold as many as 100 copies in the entire USA – that’s CD sales and downloads combined.
last year NOT A FUCKING SINGLE

SINGLE

SINGLE

classical album sold over 100 copies! L M A O

I don't have the charts from 1980s, care to link? I fucking guarantee you you're talking out of your ass, I recall reading a classical release selling over 700k albums in the 1980s

i'm just going to stop replying to you at this point, you're a waste of time and you have no idea what you're talking about

you're a pseudo-intellectual who has no fucking idea what you're talking about

t. >>72119599

>>72119651
huh, you actually did some research. good work. Good thing classical doesn't rely on sales to exist. With purely concerts it can exist fine, as it has for hundreds of years without recordings. Recordings are more of an added bonus.

Is the trend of lower sales the same across all genres? Seems with streaming and torrents, no one really needs to buy music any more.

>>72119702
okay mother fuck i don't think anyone would say classical music is going to cease to exist at any point in the future, i never said that

HOW

DO

WE

POPULARIZE

IT

THAT'S THE POINT OF THIS THREAD

>>72119728
man you really are mad about something
you can't it's been overtaken by more fun genres that have the intellectual qualities of classical without relying on 4-century old instrumentation

face it jazz is better

I wish I know. I was learning how to compose classical but I kinda gave that up when I realized I would never be as good as the greats, and that no one buys classical anymore. I can count on one hand how many times I've seen or heard of a classical concert that features newly written material.

>>72119219
Defund all art departments in universities.

>>72119433
>it's all apples vs oranges bro
Undiscriminating imbeciles like this guy is why contemporary classical sucks. No one cares about quality.

To fix classical music you have to kill egalitarianism.

>>72119702
>classical sales aren't in the gutter
>yes they are
>sales are irrelevant anyway
This is called moving the goalposts.

>>72119757
video game/film orchestration and arrangements are continuing to rise in sales, participation and popularity it has nothing to do with the instrumentation

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/how-video-games-are-saving-symphony-orchestras-and-filling-concert-halls/

>intellectual qualities
mozart effect is a dumb meme, classical music is an emotional experience, it's a auditory story, an adventure even... it's the only music genre i can experience catharsis

perhaps we can start to improve interest if people stop acting like it's "brain food" and have people approach the genre with a different mindset, would certainly help.

>>72119883
agreed, another huge issue is the lack of new material, that actually has a voice and expresses an emotion, it's good technical work but it seems it's written for the sake of writing something new within the genre

The genre will need the next great composer to breath new life into the genre... but I'd reckon at this point anyone talented enough to make such a thing happen is going to go into the hollywood/game industry instead to make a real living instead of living on a dream, and then they're going to get consumed with their wealth and work less and less.

that music is good, but it ultimately serves another purpose, and it's made not from their heart and passion but to serve as a backdrop for someone else's creation. It's all about creating something catchy and fitting.

>>72119883
That's because classical listeners are 90% fogies who think nothing can top 200 year compositions. They revolt by refusing to buy tickets if it isn't a warhorse composition. Brahms' contemporary? No thanks, can't be good. Produced in the last 100 years? No thanks must be garbage.

And classical breeds a whole lot of new fogies, wrong generationists that might only be 20 but still demand people be composing Beethoven's 11th, 12th, 13th etc.

Classical thrives on being niche and backwards looking, it's never going to be popular like it was, and it only was because there was little else around except tavern folk songs.

>>72119921
/thread

>>72119990
>it's the only music genre i can experience catharsis
i think i'll stick to brainbombs

>>72120002
>Brahms' contemporary? No thanks, can't be good.
The fogeys happen to be right on this one. Contemporary classical is in the same creative rut Classical was in the 1700s before Haydn. It's incredibly same-y and uninspired, with the added handicap that it also sounds grating to virtually all ears.

>>72119219
>again
it was never popular

>>72120041
The one thing it isn't is samey, it is more varied than it has ever been, taking influence from the proceeding centuries and contemporary popular music. Just most of that never sees the light of day or gets heard. And the fogies are correct because what does get heard is either the worst they can find to prove it is really going to shit or uninspired Tchaikovsky pastiche film soundtracks.

>>72120052
It was never popular with the rabble yes. It was once popular with the upper echelons of society. The aristocrats, the intelligentsia, and the moneyed. Now it's only popular with the intelligentsia that focuses on music specifically. Classical is kept alive by music students mostly. The solution was already presented
>>72119921
shut off the life-support system and something new will rise from the ashes.
>>72120077
It is extremely same-y. You're missing the forest for the trees.

>>72119988
If you look carefully you'll see I never said classical sales weren't in the gutter - I don't actually know. I don't follow sales reports as it's not important to enjoy the music. I'm not a classical marketing guy so it means very little to me. I knew all along that sales didn't matter. I'm not trying to "win" any argument. You did the research, turns out sales are down, but perhaps its like that with all genres?

>>72120002
>nothing can top 200 year compositions
Show me a better fugue than a Bach fugue.
Show me a better vocal mass than a Palestrina mass.

Then these days we have composers looking very carefully at traditional music and ethnomusicology, as well as having jazz and modern influences (like popular music, quantum physics, tv shows, current events etc.) in 200 years people won't be able to write the music we're writing today - we will be the authentic article of our period, as Bach was of his. In 200 years they will be the authentic article of their period, and it will be something different.

There's a good reason the music has survived and been cherished for 200 - 500 years - it is of a very high quality. The music will easily last another 200 - 500 years. Classical has always been about the big picture - write a beautiful timeless piece of music for future generations to enjoy. Its less about profits and more about making art.

>>72120077
fuck off poly
and take your poptimism with you

>>72120143
poly would never imply contemporary composers take influence from popular music. That's the one thing they don't take influence from, and try to avoid like the plague.

t. poly

>>72120126
Your argument is shit because you're incapable of nuanced thinking. The great classical figures are not evenly distributed in time. This is not the first time art music has been in a creative rut. Baroque music also got incredibly stale eventually. Modern music badly needs its inflection point.

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The problem isn't the music, it's the general population...

I remember watching the O.C. as a young teen and they were making fun of classical music in a scene, saying those who are into it are weird... something like this.

Be real, if somebody is raving about rachmaninoff, the average person is going to think they're really an aspiring serial killer.

Gotta stick to the social norms, goy.

>>72120178
Art music wasn't exactly popular in the baroque times either - it was either reserved for the very wealthy, or forced on church-goes.

If you think art music is in a creative rut, I suggest you learn more about contemporary composers. There's plenty of fun things going on. Don't expect us to spoon feed you either. Learn about the subject at hand, educate yourself, then reevaluate your position. You'll find art music is incredibly varied and vibrant today.

>>72120222

it's like impossible to find good websites about contemporary classical

I don't know where you can even go to learn about this shit

and a massive list of works without any actual description on wikipedia isn't super helpful

it's easy to find good websites with reviews and articles about contemporary jazz and any other popular music but contemporary classical/art music sites seem almost like they don't exist

>>72120222
>"us"
there is no us you dumb fucking faggot, you're the same nigger who's been shitting posting since the start of this thread and you've yet to provide examples of decent "art music" being made today

you speak vaguely because you know it's fucking shit, you're probably an aspiring composer yourself and you don't want to admit your shit, and those contemporary composers you admire are shit

literally fuck off dude, you club is garbage and there's a reason classical is taking a nose dive, it's people like you who live within the fantasy that you're not nearly as good as bach because you're of a different era

ffs, kys

>>72120222
I don't remember claiming anything other than that. I'm this guy
>>72120124
and I'm very familiar with contemporary classical. I attend recitals regularly. I'm talking from experience. This pastiche is boring as sin. Post-modernism has run its course.

>>72120211
that bird is fucking piff who is she?

>>72120248
>I don't know where you can even go to learn about this shit
Try university / College

>>72120249
>you dumb fucking faggot, you're the same nigger who's been shitting posting
kek, who shat in your cereal?
I have provided pretty much all of the examples ITT so far

>your shit
Insults are so much more effective when they're correctly written. They lose their impact when you come across as an uneducated person who doesn't know the difference between your and you're.

There's no reason to get emotional about this. some people like classical, some people don't you can't force people to like something, they have to mature and discover it themselves.

>>72120322
i'm not emtional, idgaf, i'm roasting you and the best you can do to defend yourself is point out my bad grammar lmao

so fucking bad

also
>I have provided pretty much all of the examples ITT so far
you're dumb as fuck, you have been speaking in circles and typing complete nonsense since your first post

>>72120322
>Try university
Don't. You'd be contributing to the problem.

>>72120322
The thing with faggots like you is that you have the mistaken belief that people are only shitting on contemporary classical because you're projecting onto them what you do and assume they're only interested in it as a fashion statement.

Sure, composers like Thomas Adès exist you think, these faggots who like music in the old "style" only need to find them.
This stuff is derivative as shit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYw5hfzH1KM
Thomas Adès sucks dick.

>>72120339
>i'm roasting you
You're only roasting your own nuts and not convincing anyone who doesn't already agree with you.

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More Adès:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2B4KOGyTTk
Perfectly tonal.
And derivative as shit

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More contemporary classical for plebs. Namah, Peter Machajdík --
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olgtUzUhSuU

Perfectly tonal.
Utterly derivative.
Absolute dog shit.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAI3N61zY9k

is this classical?

Fugitive Summer, Per Norgård --
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKibJKrD5b0

>music is more varied than it has ever been
>>music is more varied than it has ever been
>>>music is more varied than it has ever been
>>>>>music is more varied than it has ever been
>>>>>>music is more varied than it has ever been
I'm glad this derivative shit ain't selling OP.

>>72120517
>>72120453
>>72120415
lmao

>i-it's just a different era of music bro! these will be remembered 200 years from now

fucking can't make this shit up

>>72119219
By keeping it alive, but to keep it alive you must have a living classical tradition, which is impossible without high aristocratic society and its culture, the last remnants of which died out in the mid 20th century, finally disappearing with Stravinsky in 1971. Anyone who claims to be the classicist today is almost certainly a charlatan. It's like claiming that remaining noble European families have any real political power and are not just tourist attractions.

Textures Liminales, Ana-Maria Avram --
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBg1DhkvdcQ
^this is derivative as fuck.
>music is more varied than it has ever been

>>72120494
Derivative incidental music? Yes m8, it's classical. A great, a totally """original""" composition from the era of
>music is more varied than it has ever been

>>72120552
Incidentally, contemporary classical got worse and worse starting with the 1980s. The 1980s is also the decade when HIPsterism (=fogeyism on steroids) started to get serious traction. What else happened in the 1980s? Baby Boomers entered their consuming years. Coincidence? I think not.

Baby boomers have ruined everything they've touched.

>>72119219
>Make each song 3-4 minutes long
>Add a popular female vocalist (doesn't really matter which one)
>Add a rapper (must be Drake or Kendrick)
>Add Chainsmokers electronic noises

Maybe it just isn't good or savvy enough to survive the contemporary world.

>>72120222
>art music is incredibly varied and vibrant today.
>educate yourself
Yaah. Just check this violin concerto by Somei Satoh out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOecmVS8Bg0

Or maybe you're racist and want no music written slant eyed creatures. You can try György Kurtág's music instead: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Tksayf09-c

It's totally not derivative, isn't it?
The classical music scene is so vibrant.
So varied. Indeed.
It's hasn't been recycling the same shit
these last 40 to 50 years at all.
Not at all. No way.

/s

>educate yourself

>>72119219
By making classically popular pop music.

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Check out Krzysztof Penderecki:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fj8GJ0LsTL8

Totally original. Not at all analogous to the zillion no names in the late 1600s or virtually any gallant style composer in the 1700s or the early Romantic hacks. No sir. Contemporary classical is endlessly creative.

You think otherwise?
>educate yourself

I think if anything will make it more popular and introduce more young people to it, it would be film scoring! The music of john williams is loved by so many. Also I think from one of my threads I found people think that whoever is into classical music is a massive snob when actually they don't know what they're missing out on. That needs to change really

>>72120965
The best part about Penderecki is, faggots like OP would think he's great.

You guys won't like this but I know a couple of people who went deep into classical music after hearing it in an anime.

>>72119272
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLjXgV-Mhp0
Listen through it it's so nice

>>72121021
It's also extremely derivative.

>>72120965 #
>Contemporary classical
... is a contradiction in terms. It's called Neo-classical, and the only determining factor in whether it truly gets to be called classical is how history views it.

>>72120815
b8

>>72121006
no he's shit

i've made my stance on contemporary classical composers clear you stupid fuck, they're part of the problem by large

>>72121193
>they're part of the problem by large
100% this. And I'm saying that as a professional neo-classical composer (because see >>72121056 )
People who think that music being written for acoustic instruments automatically makes it "classical" are total ignoramuses.

Music can only be called classical if it's deemed good enough by the majority of some population to be constantly reproduced and emulated by others.

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We need new music which is complex, and accessible. Today we have talented musicians writing complex music which is not accessible to us – because it is not tonal, melodic, harmonic. We also have musicians composing accessible orchestral music which is for popular use, for movies, but not complex enough.

Bloody Marxist.

>>72121056
Stop being anal about semantics.

>>72119277
underrated post

>>72119219
>download classical song
>delete audio from file
>replace with ______
>overwrite original file
>post

>>72122268
"Absolutely stunning, you can really hear the emotion of the era in each note."

>>72121491
Start learning about what it is you're actually talking about.

>>72119219
Trap beats and catcy melodies.

>>72122563
>t. mad pseud
U mad ferneywhore.

>>72122647
>what did he mean by this
Anon, I spend my professional life counting measures in major choral/orchestral works - I don't get mad in a normal sense.

>>72123043
Good for you. You're still being anal retentive about the meaning of small-c "classical music".

>>72123235
God is in the details.

>implying classical was ever popular in the first place
it was music for rich wankers and now that rich wankers are losing control of what music to preserve it's getting kicked to gutter like it would have if the general population had any say in it in the past.

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>>72119219
With this!!