>I hate Lana del Rey and Taylor Swift

i also hate beyonce, rihanna

>>71467271
that is justifiable

>>71467253
>you hate created pop stars with no artistic credibility
>wow what a fedora
Sure

>>71467253
name one (1) good taylor swift song
this is your chance to convert me

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>I hate Taylor Swift, but enjoy Lana del Rey

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>>71467297
>created pop stars
>muh evil music industry
Are you even listening to yourself

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>>71467297
>artistic credibility

>>71467365
t. triggered poptimists

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>>71467297
>There are autists in this VERY THREAD that actually believe this

>>71467297
this post literally screams reddit

>>71467420
Which LDR song did she write/produce herself?
>>71467433
Out of arguments I see

>>71467456
>Which LDR song did she write/produce herself?
Doesn't matter.

>>71467465
Oh did you forget we were talking about artistic credibility?

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>>71467456
>caring if an artist did all the work by herself rather than the actual music

>>71467479
All that matters is the end result that goes into your ears. You sound like a fucking idiot.

>>71467488
>>71467492
But actual work creates the music. Ergo the creation is equally as important as the end result, which is literally defined by it's process and context.

>>71467526
Yeah you're definitely a virgin.

>>71467479
no we aren't faggot, we're talking about how pathetic faggots like you are for thinking that that makes the end product (the music) better because only one person did it. Caring about artistic credibility is the most reddit thing ever and a shitty "" argument"" as to why your favorite artist is supposed to be better

>>71467533
>no we aren't faggot
Oh you weren't replying to the chain initiated by >>71467297 ? Please read the thread before posting
>>71467533
>how pathetic faggots like you are for thinking that that makes the end product (the music) better because only one person did it
Strawman.
>as to why your favorite artist is supposed to be better
Quote me where I mentioned my favorite artist

>>71467566
Your favorite artist is Grimes who is shit.

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>Phil Collins ruined Genesis

>>71467578
Nope.

>>71467566
I can already tell that making any valid counter argument is useless as you'll just use some shitty excuse as to why it's not valid, I'm not even going to waste my time trying to prove you wrong as you don't want to accept it.

>>71467587
His solo stuff besides the first two albums is awful though

>>71467627
>I have no more valid arguments
>but that's your fault!!
Sure

>>71467650
Yes, because writing a valid argument off as grasping at straws sure is a valid counter argument. Like I said I'm not going to waste my time arguing with a stubborn autist.

>>71467700
>Like I said I'm not going to waste my time arguing with a stubborn autist.
Good it's established you don't talk to yourself

Let me know if you want an actual musical discussion (what poptimists like yourself are not able to do anyways)

Oh wait! That's right! I wouldn't want to waste your time... on 4chan!

>>71467526
>i listen to music for the work the artists put into it
autism confirmed

>>71467803
Every time you listen to music, you are literally hearing the work the artists put into it. Or do you think music just magically happens for you to enjoy like air or magnetism?

>>71467297
The whole comment thread that followed this comment made me deeply depressed. This board is beyond saving.
>people denying that pop stars are manufactured corporate products
>people not caring if an artist writes their own music
>people claiming that creativity in music is irrelevant

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>>71468029
>Huurrrr if an artist doesn't write and perform 100% of their music it is inferior

Go listen to Beck faget

>>71468225
>it is inferior
Quote us where we said it was inferior
>Go listen to Beck faget
What's wrong with Beck? he's fine.

Please purge everyone in this thread.
Except for patrician >>71468029

>>71467420
>>71468225
The fact that you post pictures of her with every post about her makes it really clear why you actually like her.

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>I am indifferent to these artists as I don't listen to their music.

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>>71467587
>Phil Collins saved Genesis

>>71467307
all too well

>>71468394
oh snap

>>71468225
Nice retort, you mong. Beck's entire persona has been crafted by the cult of Scientology.

>actual fucking unironic poptimists

I thought this was just a meme. Fucking disgusting.

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>>71468394
I like her music because it's good. I like her because she's a qt.

>>71468755
Nah.

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>>71468605
>Genesis saved Phil Collins

>>71468805
>her music
It's not really *her* music, is it?

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>this thread

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>>71468939
>Being this pedantic.
Yes, it is her music. In the same way that you would say you love an actor's movies. If they didn't write the script and direct every shot is that movie not counted as part of their body of work? Think before you speak.

>>71469054
>In the same way that you would say you love an actor's movies
The problem is you give the credit to the director of the movie, not the actor you like.

>>71467456
She wrote everything on From the End, Young Like ME, the No Kung Fu EP, and most of AKA Lizzy Grant. She has a production credit on "Guns & Roses".

Not to mention hours and hours of Garageband/Myspace demos floating around there with just her and a guitar (or do you want to suggest someone else wrote and produced So Legit?)

>>71467526
Romanticized fantasy. And Lana does write all of her lyrics and melodies, unlike, say, Elvis or Ronnie Spector.

>>71468029
It's not that we don't care, it's that you couldn't tell the difference. Go read Scaruffi's David Bowie writeup again.

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>I hate harsh noise wall

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>>71469145

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>>71467587
>Duke is not the best Genesis album

>>71468225
>Huurrrr if an artist doesn't write and perform 100% of their music it is inferior
Are you actually serious? If you go to a concert to a see a peson whose job is it to perform live music, wouldn't you expect them to actually do so? Or will you settle down and listen to them just moving their lips? Not that you would be cheated of the experience of a proper live concert, you would also be cheated out of your money that you've spent for a ticket, possibly a hotel room and travelling to the location.

>>71469164
>She wrote everything on From the End, Young Like ME, the No Kung Fu EP, and most of AKA Lizzy Grant.
Aren't these just demo, not finished recordings that are cherished by millions?
>Not to mention hours and hours of Garageband/Myspace demos
Wow amazing.
>Romanticized fantasy
The correct way to evaluate art is romanticized?
>And Lana does write all of her lyrics and melodies,
[citations needed]
>it's that you couldn't tell the difference
When you examine context it's always apparent. Denial must be a bitch.
>Go read Scaruffi's
What instrument does he play again?

>>71469164
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1iu4gqxWeYE
Here's what your favorite pop star actually sounds like. Pretty awful, isn't it? It's only passable with auto-tune and modern audio engineering practices.

>>71467307
Style

>>71469054
>In the same way that you would say you love an actor's movies.
I love Rufus Sewell's ACTING - not his movies, because he isn't a film director.

>>71468939
It is

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>i dont like certain music

I cant even tell whose shitposting or not anymore. This is too much.

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>I would fuck Taylor Swift and Lana del Rey

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>>71469294
[citation]

Are you also going to claim that Interscope told her to write and star in a 27 minute meditation on the Garden of Eden and the nature of sin and redemption?

>>71469328
You don't know what autotune sounds like

>>71469485
See: Dan Auerbach, Paul Epworth, Lee Foster, Daniel Heath, Greg Kurstin, Rick Nowels, Blake Stranathan, Kieron Menzies, DK, Emile Haynie, Dan Heath, Tim Larcombe,Rick Rubin, Patrik Berger, Jeff Bhasker, Chris Braide, Justin Parker, Robopop, Al Shux, Jim Irvin, The Nexus, Mike Daly, Jessie Mae Robinson
>>71469581
Inside sources say this is wrong.

>>71469566
>when you wear shit ironically but you will never be able to have body ironically

>>71469581
>You don't know what autotune sounds like
You've surely proven that Lana Del Rey is an amazing live singer now. Good job!

>>71468029
it's just the waifufags man calm down

>>71467881
Yeah but why does it matter whose or how much work goes into it if I like the song?

I can like "Carly Rae Jepsen" as a project for different reasons, some she is responsible for (her voice, stylistic direction, probably some compositions) and some she isn't directly (recording, engineering, drum playing, etc.)

Where do we draw the line? Most bands don't engineer their records and have outside ears from their labels guide some or most of the stylistic choices. When does something stop being "manufactured" and more importantly why the fuck do you care if the song's good?

>>71469294
Not the guy you're responding to but why does playing an instrument matter?

>>71467456
The entirety of sirens and most of aka Lizzy grant. Like the whole albums.

>>71469839
>Not the guy you're responding to but why does playing an instrument matter?
Again, not the guy you're expecting a reply from, but given that she clearly isn't a good vocalist, maybe that would be something worth praising her for?
>>71469328

>>71469771
>Yeah but why does it matter whose or how much work goes into it if I like the song?
If you like the song, do you feel like you should examine the context and creation of it? Or do you just mindlessly take it for granted?
>>71469771
>Most bands don't engineer their records and have outside ears from their labels guide some or most of the stylistic choices.
That is no longer true due to the abundance of DIY and home studios and internet mediums of releasing music.
>>71469839
Why does having knowledge about what one is talking about matter?
>>71469892
Never heard of these albums, and are not listed on her discography

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>>71467253
Here's a pic of OP

>>71469634
Show me one released track where Autotune is used, then

Realtalk: There are 2006 shows where she sounds fine and there are 2013 shows where she sounds heavenly. In 2012 she was deliberately trying to sing in a lower register way outside of her normal range and it sounded godawful until, I presume, her manager told her to cut that shit out

>>71469294
>they're not cherished by millions therefore they don't count.
Dude just go back to plebbit, if you want to hate popstars because that girl in your class didn't think your prog metal tastes were appealing then go ahead but do so in silence, nobody needs your cancer.

>>71469938
Sirens is listed under may jailer, and you're straight up retarded if you haven't heard of Lana del Rey aka Lizzy grant since she's getting spammed on moo every day now

>>71469951
Autotune or modern audio engineering practices, that's what I said. Pitch correction exists too. As well as time aligned guitars, drums, etc.
>>71469328

>>71469910
He was talking about Scaruffi though.. Totally irrelevant

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>>71467297
>mfw every response to this post is pure ad hominem
Top kek, poptimists are pathetic. They can't come up with any real arguments.

>>71470011
>Totally irrelevant
A musician not being able to perform her own songs live without the aid of modern audio engineering pracitces is totally irrelevant?

>>71469957
>Dude just go back to plebbit
Not an argument. Try again.
>if you want to hate popstars because that girl in your class didn't think your prog metal tastes
When did I mention prog metal?
>>71469987
Again, I don't see either of those two albums. Not sure what to tell you, if the best you can do is two "albums" that no one has heard of.

>>71470038
Practices*

>>71467253
What /mu/ says -
>"You should form your own opinions about music and come to your own conclusions"

What /mu/ actually means -
>"If you don't like my shitty generic pleb taste then u must b a manchild nekbeard frum redit"

Man if we keep this kind of intellectual discourse up, this board might actually turn into a place where people discuss music.

>>71470043
Dude, I'm not making an argument, I'm stating my opinion and making fun of you. I should make fun of you even more since you clearly don't know how to use Google. Get fucking good lol

>>71470060
>What /mu/ actually means -
>"If you don't like my shitty generic pleb taste then u must b a manchild nekbeard frum redit"
Shitposters exist, wow.

>>71469938
I do check out who recorded and played on my favourite albums but it won't change if I like them or not. The music speaks for itself.

If it's recorded well or I like the drums for example I'll go check out other albums featuring these people.

You're kinda right with the DIY studio bit but it still holds true for most "big" bands. I'd actually argue that doing everything yourself often creates worst music as it's very easy to forget/not hear some flaws if you've worked on your music a lot.

It takes really exceptional artists to pull it off and even then they might have been better served collaborating with others.

>>71470038
Wait what? This is not what I'm saying at all. The guy I was responding to was saying that the Scruff's criticism was invalid because he's not a musician, which is preposterous.

>>71470061
>Dude, I'm not making an argument,
Been nice taking to ya
>>71470086
>I do check out who recorded and played on my favourite albums but it won't change if I like them or not.
>The music speaks for itself.
That's fine, but then you need to admit you are not actually liking Lana Del Rey, but Dan Auerbach, Paul Epworth, Lee Foster, Daniel Heath, Greg Kurstin, Rick Nowels, Blake Stranathan, Kieron Menzies, DK, Emile Haynie, Dan Heath, Tim Larcombe,Rick Rubin, Patrik Berger, Jeff Bhasker, Chris Braide, Justin Parker, Robopop, Al Shux, Jim Irvin, The Nexus, Mike Daly, Jessie Mae Robinson. Will you admit that? I feel like you won't.
>but it still holds true for most "big" bands
Like who?
>It takes really exceptional artists to pull it off
Maybe we should be talking/listening to them instead of created popstars with daddy's money and a team of producers?
>>71470107
Why not? Would you see a surgeon who has never gone to med school?

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>>71467630
>No Jacket Required
>awful

What is this board?

>>71470194
>Liking Lana Del Rey
What is this board?

>>71470086
>even then they might have been better served collaborating with others.
Pardon me for butting in, but this is one of my pet peeves: The key word here is MIGHT - you'd be just as right to say that someone who does regularly collaborate might have been better served NOT collaborating with others. It's a hypothetical point - it means nothing unless backed up with evidence.

>>71470140
>but then you need to admit you are not actually liking Lana Del Rey
Not that anon, but you've got a false equivalency going in your argument here. Liking an entire record made by a group of people just means that your taste for the musical content contained therein goes back to everyone (INCLUDING the person whose name is officially on the cover) to at least some degree.

>>71470140
>Would you see a surgeon who has never gone to med school?
Music comprehension is a skill of the brain, not the hand.

>>71470328
>but you've got a false equivalency going in your argument here

Not really.

Do you see a Lana Del Rey thread poster here everyday, or a Lana Del Rey, Dan Auerbach, Paul Epworth, Lee Foster, Daniel Heath, Greg Kurstin, Rick Nowels, Blake Stranathan, Kieron Menzies, DK, Emile Haynie, Tim Larcombe, Rick Rubin, Patrik Berger, Jeff Bhasker, Chris Braide, Justin Parker, Robopop, Al Shux, Jim Irvin, The Nexus, Mike Daly, Jessie Mae Robinson thread posted everyday?

Think hard before you answer. And also remember that Max martin was originally a well-kept secret in the music industry.

>>71470377
Yes because doctors tend to be idiots?

>>71467307
Dear John
is the worst-written (text and score)
but it's also the most interesting because it's about John Mayer and not any boy band idiot who really like loved her

>>71470214
>liking music
What is this board?

>>71470417
You could just filter Lana threads if she makes you this buttblasted instead of sperging in a thread about "muh artistic credibility and integrity" that literally no one in this cares about since we're talking about pop music.

>>71468029
The reddit and liberal invasion ruined /mu/

>>71470702
>You could just filter Lana threads if she makes you this buttblasted
Ooops you meant to reply to >>71467365 >>71467370 >>71467420 >>71467433
Sorry about that!
>Instead of sperging in a thread about "muh artistic credibility and integrity" that literally no one in this cares about since we're talking about pop music.
Didn't read OP? That's what this thread is about. Maybe you and your ilk should respect others' opinions about music without resorting to
>fedora
>reddit
>rockist

What has this board become?

I still remember the time when I discovered /mu/ and how I was intimidated by all the "obscure" music being discussed and how I thought I will never reach that level of patrician.

Now we have these waifufags that are no better than basic bitches liking boybands that basing their preferences based on the looks of the member.

waifufags purge when?

>>71470140
>implying Daniel Heath would be anything without LDR http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2552305/?ref_=nv_sr_1

She uses people to get the sound she wants and her lyrical and stylistic themes have been consistent for a decade; these are just continually-moving goalposts

>>71469990
>goalposts moved
okay we're done here, exit music for your way out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BP6qdC9IkEM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WjDdqAWsLEk

>>71470796
>She uses people to get the sound she wants and her lyrical and stylistic themes have been consistent for a decade; these are just continually-moving goalposts
Evidence shows otherwise.

>>71470795
Lana has been the queen of /mu/ since 2012, you could always use filters.

>>71467253
Nice psyop CIA

>>71470796
>>goalposts moved
So, auto tune and pitch correction aren't used, right? I know what it is, I was so bold as to dare criticize your favorite pop star. Here's how it's done by the way, and with a cold by the way:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJXLqAutql4

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>>71470852
>Thinking anyone believes this
Bjork is eternal queen, Grimes is queen of waifu newfags.

>>71470417
>Do you see a Lana Del Rey thread poster here everyday, or a Lana Del Rey, Dan Auerbach, Paul Epworth, Lee Foster, Daniel Heath, Greg Kurstin, Rick Nowels, Blake Stranathan, Kieron Menzies, DK, Emile Haynie, Tim Larcombe, Rick Rubin, Patrik Berger, Jeff Bhasker, Chris Braide, Justin Parker, Robopop, Al Shux, Jim Irvin, The Nexus, Mike Daly, Jessie Mae Robinson thread posted everyday?
The latter, because anyone with a brain knows that the performance art construct known as Lana Del Rey is a result of the combined artistic efforts of every single person you just mentioned in addition to Lizzy Grant - in exactly the same way that the performance art construct known as Grimes is a result of the combined artistic efforts of Claire Boucher.

Something having been made by a group of people doesn't automatically make it any less likable than something that was made by a single person. It just dilutes the degree to which that likability can be directly projected upon any one of its creators. It's the difference between liking a single person a whole lot and liking each member of an entire group of people a little bit - it's still a greater than zero-sum game.

>>71470961
Grimes has been the most controversial female artist here since 2012, there's proof in the archive.

>>71467253
ive never listened to lana del rey but she cant be as bad as taylor swift

>>71470987
> anyone with a brain knows that the performance art construct known as Lana Del Rey is a result of the combined artistic efforts of every single person you just mentioned in addition to Lizzy Grant
[citation needed]
>Something having been made by a group of people doesn't automatically make it any less likable
Show me where I said otherwise.

>>71470795
I think we've reached oldfag saturation, any post-2014 newfags get trapped in waifuness.
>No more mu-core discussion outside pure meme threads
>Can't bring up anything too obscure without getting ad-hom'ed or ignored
I think a good role for /mu/ is to offer the basics needed to explore "obscure music" which is what /mu/core helped with.

Now I suspect labels are running advertisement campaigns here.

>>71471004
After AA if you didn't drop Grimes I feel bad for ya son.

>>71471044
>[citation needed]
You, ITT.

>Show me where I said otherwise.
>>71470140
>That's fine, but then you need to admit you are not actually liking Lana Del Rey, but
If you had said "you need to admit you are not actually liking JUST Lana Del Rey, but LIZZY GRANT, Dan Auerbach,..." etc. then there wouldn't be a problem. But that is NOT what you said.

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>>71470812
What evidence is this, besides your friend's dad who works at Intertendo? http://www.billboard.com/biz/articles/news/record-labels/5672722/rick-nowels-lana-del-rey-co-writer-talks-summertime-sadness

Dan Heath: "Hey Lana, I totally had this song about Axl Rose symbolizing my eternal lover Adam with whom I will ascend to heaven with at the end of time, but I don't really have the voice for it, can you please give this one a go? I'm not actually asking, of course, because you are my MKUltra slave, lol. This is gonna put one over on the sheep! Let's put Yayo before it, the song that you wrote all by yourself about an important epiphany in your life, but not really, we both know it was the Illuminati who have been grooming you with your handler Rob 'Belial' Grant since 2005."

>>71471190
>You, ITT.
No, I've never started a thread about LDR and spoken kindly about her.

Show me a Lanafag who admits your claim above.
>f you had said "you need to admit you are not actually liking JUST Lana Del Rey, but LIZZY GRANT, Dan Auerbach,..." etc. then there wouldn't be a problem. But that is NOT what you said.
Strawman. I was saying not that she (or created pop music) was unlikable *because* of the People Behind The Curtain phenomenon, but that fans are actually liking the People Behind The Curtain instead of just the star. Nice try though
>>71471208
>A few months ago my manager called me with an idea: He was in contact with a, mostly unknown, female vocalist who was looking to sharpen her sound. Up to that point, she had been signed to a small indie label and made music that was an interesting mix between old torch songs and something kinda of Portisheadish. That’s actually a terrible description but, regardless, it was actually pretty good.
>Basically, the idea of bringing her and I together was for her to get a different type of production that may help her get wider appeal and give her “An Edge”. This idea struck me kind of funny because it’s not like I’m a particularly mass appeal kinda guy, I make sample heavy underground hip hop. A sub-genre that never has equated to ‘wider appeal’ but upon, checking her music out, I figured why not.

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i though that /mu/ being filled with underaged kids was a meme. unless someone is samefag defending pop.

>>71471292
>citing this guy as a bad thing https://phatfriend.com/2012/01/25/before-lana-del-ray/

>Now, I can only base this on my brief experience with her, but there is no doubt in my mind that that girl is talented. I’ve worked with all sorts of people over the years and she was one who stepped into the studio with a game plan and the ability to knock it all out in one take.... The thing is, I’ve read a ton of shit about people saying this character was manufactured but that’s bullshit. Sure, it’s not her real name but the idea behind that person was in Lizzy before I even met her. Hell, just how she was dressed coming into the studio was enough for me to know that. She looked like a pinup model straight out of the trailer park. She always seemed to have to idea of this throwback Nancy Sinatra meets “Madmen” meets current white trash thing as her entire theme. She was obsessed with images of swimming pools, drinking tab soda and just a certian low brow elegance that wasn’t common in music. Even on the song we did (That I’ll be getting to briefly), her lyrics were trying to paint a picture of something very similar to where she eventually went with her new music. So, to be clear, all the detractors saying she’s some made up by the machine pop star are full of shit. While it’s impossible to keep the businesses hands out the pop when creating a pop star, the roots of where this all comes from are firmly inside of Lizzy Grant.

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>I like pop stars and mainstream music

>>71471292
>No, I've never started a thread about LDR and spoken kindly about her.
Which would explain why I never said that you did.

> I was saying not that she (or created pop music) was unlikable
That is EXACTLY how what you originally said reads. Learn how to be more precise with your language next time if you wish to avoid being called out on it.

Speaking of which,
>Using the meme term "lanafag" unironically
Do us all a favor and make it clear whether or not you are trying to have a serious conversation ITT.

>>71472040
>Which would explain why I never said that you did.
Then you misspoke
>That is EXACTLY how what you originally said reads.
Blaming your lack of reading comprehension skills on me?

>>71471292
see
>>71468733

>>71472098
>I've run out of any actual arguments to make ITT

>>71472431
Ooops you meant to quote >>71472040
Sorry about that!

>>71472482
there are only 2 o's in oops

>>71471306
It's the underaged faggots that were born in le wrong generation that can't accept that people can like genre that they don't like. like you.

>>71472505
There's three o's because I'm saying it longer than a regular oops.

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> I like them
>Why?
>Because i believe feminism in all forms should be supported

>>71472482
No. Unlike some, I usually manage to write what I actually mean on the first try.

>>71472561
>It's the underaged faggots that can't accept that people can not like genre that they like.
Like OP?

>>71472600
Then why are you out of arguments but still replying?

>>71472606
Fedora hipster posts are always ironic bait made to get faggots like you to go on 5 hour long spergfest, and it clearly worked as evidenced by this thread.

>>71472745
>I was only pretending!
>but if it's something that might hurt my feelings, they are serious
Stop

>>71472769
No one in this thread that actually likes Lana and Taylor cares about their artistic credibility, how many people worked on their albums and how "created" they are. Pop music is meant to be fun to listen to and just that, if you expect anything more from pop music than an accessible fun genre you're retarded.

>>71472843
>No one in this thread that actually likes Lana and Taylor cares about their artistic credibility
That sounds like the problem
>how many people worked on their albums and how "created" they are
That sounds like the problem
>Pop music is meant to be fun to listen to and just that, if you expect anything more from pop music than an accessible fun genre you're retarded.
Maybe you shouldn't be posting on a music board then if you don't want to discuss art?

>>71467307
New Romantics

>>71472843
Great pop music informs at the same time it entertains (just like any other kind of great music.) That doesn't mean that pop music which is completely devoid of anything other than simple entertainment is bad. Just that it's probably gonna have a shorter shelf life.

>>71472843
>Pop music is meant to be fun to listen to and just that, if you expect anything more from pop music than an accessible fun genre you're retarded.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eab_beh07HU