Does rock need a rock star in order to be mainstream again?

rock will never be mainstream again

Rock is mainstream

>>70642239
your average person couldn't name a rock band that debuted in the last 10 years.

>>70642298
The Arctic Monk-
>It's 2017
Jesus Christ

Normies still listen to plenty of shit like The Foo Fighters and Arctic Monkeys though

>>70642226
this. how would you have felt about swing music in the 50s/60s? you'd remember the good days but realize they'll never return. it's just the logical progression of things.

>>70642402
right, but both of those bands debuted over 10 years ago.

>>70642435
I feel like rock won't disappear as much as swing music has since it is so intertwined with youth culture. Perhaps after all the boomers die out will rock start declining more than it is already.

>>70642442
if you want to count them as rock Fun formed in 2008

>>70642477
swing music was youth culture bro. it was seen as extremely degenerate when it came about, like all music that the kids are listening to at the time.

>>70642170
If it mean another Kurt Cobain then I hope rock dies. Kurt single handily ruined the music industry and an entire generation.

I know it sounds like a joke and you may not like it but metal is how rock will survive
its a bit of an abomination granted but its the only way for so called "guitar music" to carry on

>>70642170

EDM is the new swinging dick with the kids these days, but I predict it will crash hard in a few more years and will essentially be the disco of the 10s. I just think its ONLY for this specific group of 18-30 at the latest, middle class kids, and once you go outside either side of that range, its over.

>>70642442
That's kind of irrelevant though, the genre is still very popular even if very few newer bands are popping up. Most huge pop stars have been at it for quite a while as well

>>70642506
The internet will keep Led Zeppelin and Queen and the like alive for eons to come.

>>70642506
Well I mean more so with the youth culture explosion on the 60's. It's a time when youth became a viable market and audience. Music was a big part of the cultures that emerged at that time. Swing music pretty much went out of favor as that generation grew up, but rock has remained popular across generations. Perhaps when all the people from that time die, then the music will stop being popular. Rock has had a longer popular life then most, so we'll have to see. Probably a matter of time. I apologize for the rambling.

>>70642622
this
we're in a time where literally everything can be recorded
rock will not just fade into obscurity like swing or big band
It may never be as big and influential as it once was but it won't just disappear
people will continue to make it and people will continue to play it

>>70642644
>>70642667
I thought the topic of discussion was rock as a mainstream, pop genre ?
Whether kids are listening to Queen on youtube in 20 years has no bearing on that.

>>70642539
explain

>>70642703
I literally just said that no it will probably never be as big and influential as it used to be but people will still make and consume it

>>70642435
Right, but swing is just a direct subgenre of jazz that never saw true development. There's still jazz made today, and some of my favorite albums of the last year are jazz. Rock, as a massive general genre that has progressed in thousands of different directions and become an entirely separate entity from its roots, couldn't possibly go too far off of the radar when we have something like the internet now allowing for incredibly easy access to new and old music.
>>70642546
I think the two have gone in completely different directions now. Though they have completely different fans, both are thriving and won't be going anywhere anytime soon.
>>70642549
This, even though trap rap seems to be more popular with most kids anymore, as EDM's fadeout has already begun. Of course, it will follow with another bastardization of electronic music, per usual.

>>70642546
it doesn't sound like a joke, just baseless speculation

>>70642730
>but people will still make and consume it
People still make and consume jazz

people aren't gonna stop playing music with guitars. i imagine at some point in the near future what we know as 'rock' will have a similar status to what jazz and classical have now. niche, but with an air of superiority b/c of it.

>>70642749
Yeah....I know
nobody said that jazz was dead

kurt every fucking day. WHY??

Not even kidding we need a cultural revolution in the style of guitar hero. That fucking video game made so many kids pick up and learn to play guitar/drums/whatever.
>>70642759
It's dead in terms of cultural and pop relevance, which I'm arguing is inevitable for rock.

>>70642774
nothing on this board is original

I think rock will be mainstream in the 20's

>>70642776
as long as guitars are available to consumers rock will have some kind of relevance

>>70642776
>Not even kidding we need a cultural revolution in the style of guitar hero. That fucking video game made so many kids pick up and learn to play guitar/drums/whatever.
inb4 guitar hero midi controller replaces guitars
just embrace that you're playing a 'dead' art form. nothing you make will become canonical anyway.
>>70642776
>It's dead in terms of cultural and pop relevance, which I'm arguing is inevitable for rock.
Id argue it already is for rock. p4k-core has a /semblance/ of social status but listening to /exclusively rock/ is considered uncool by most yung ppl I know

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Rock is pretty mainstream, lots of people do like it. The thing is that the current pop/radio mainstream is completely stagnant due to the internet. Also pop music has become very homogenized in general.

>>70642861
what do u expect? it's a commodity and people are homogenized

>>70642822
Sure but trumpets are also available and jazz has "some kind of relevance". 1% representation is relevance compared to 0%, but it's not pop or even close. I'm thinking 50+ years in the future here. For what possible reason would rock not go the way of jazz and classical? Just look at musical trends today. I wouldn't be surprised if even the number of people learning instruments was less and less every year.

>>70642921
These things are not quantifiable
Of course jazz isn't pop, its a lot harder to sell jazz to a bunch of adhd milenials who don't really care about technical ability or artistic merit, they want something catchy and danceable

>>70642170
I think what's more important is innovation in rock music. Would we see another Captain Beefheart, another Frank Zappa, another Brian Eno, another Allan Holdsworth? I understand that neither of those musicians could be classified as strictly rock musicians, but they contributed a great deal to music for years to come. Would the genre progress forward? I don't think that a genre becoming commercially successful and acceptable is beneficial really.

>>70642979
But jazz WAS pop. And then time went on and it became a niche genre. Why would rock be immune? We are already living through its waning influence.

>>70642991
implying there is musical innovation besides what arbitrary objects fit like a puzzle piece into the zeitgeist of the art world

>>70642868
The thing I'm hinting at is that in previous decades people would become fed up with the 'manufatured' pop, then rock and similair 'authentic' music would come out on top. This is the Zapoleon cycle. However, nowadays this doesn't happen anymore, for several reasons including the internet, and rock may permanently stay relagated to the undercurrent of music.

>>70643047
ya it's 2 bad authenticity was voided by postmodernism

>>70642992
some jazz was pop
there's always been niche genres of these things
no different from bleeps or rock or metal etc
it will survive through the subgenres and influence things here and there
Look at new wave, people said it was going to kill rock and roll through the use of synthesized instruments
now we would say new wave is a form of rock
It isn't just going to go away and it'll continue to evolve

>>70643085
fun fact u can approach any music as pop or ambient or experimental its all in yr head

>>70643012
We're not talking about painting and sculptures. Innovation in those fields is shunned by the art establishment and "bold" and "provocative" pieces of "art" are celebrated, because of the connections an artist has. Music I referred to remains separated from than.

>>70643047
The real thing and nobody seems to be touching on is that it's really hard to make rock music.

Just to begin, you need to be very good at an instrument, that takes years of practice. But you need the conditions to practice, can't practice the drums in an apartment. None of this is cheap either. Next you need 2-4 likeminded individuals who have also passed the first conditions.

To make hip-hop or an electronic song, you really just need a laptop. Consider how many bedroom DJs exist in 2017 vs how many garage bands exist.

It becomes an issue of practicality and making music with instruments in the eyes of some had become highly impractical. Technology is to blame for trends in almost every aspect of life.

>>70643106
From that*
And to add to my previous post, most truly innovative musicians understood they wouldn't be commercially successful and did what they did for the right reasons.

>>70643106
music is sound objects
reread what i said with 'music world' instead

>>70643141
artist innovation exists only in relation to the individual and is identical to and as vague as 'improvement'. there are no better or worse art/ music objects. the cultural climate brings things up and down in perceived value but good craft is timeless and subjective.

>>70643104
You can but other people (say family riding in the same car as you) would consider you crazy and cause a shitfit and quickly turn the radio to the nearest hits station. One thing no one mentions is how modern pop is engineered to appeal to normies. It's like glutamate in food, these people can't listen to anything that requires some attention span and isn't chock full of hooks. This is why pop in it's current form has survived so long.

>>70643261
sure, it's fair to think about most modern pop as mild mind control/propaganda.

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>>70643327

What is pop anyways? Wasn't there a point when rock and pop were the same? Like The Beatles? Is pop just R+B? And when did modern R+B become so different from the 50s/60s R+B? What exactly is the lineage of this stuff? Was it all invented by Michael Jackson?

>>70643397
There's 2 meanings and that's why it gets confusing. Pop can mean the genre, pop music, and it can mean simply popular music.

I'm pretty sure people usually mean the second one, as in what is topping billboard charts.

Trap is the popular music right now, but probably because you don't really need real instruments to produce trap music when you have a computer.

>>70642479
Fun is really good electropop. They're soul if anything.

>>70643981
Fun is like, the closest thing to true old school pop as you'll find.

>>70643981
>really good

>>70643981
fun is the song happy by pharrell as a band

>>70643136
Some of the biggest pop acts now can't sing to save their lives. Kanye for example sings on a lot of his music and has openly admitted that he can't hold a tune to save his life. Same with most rappers. But autotune can make anyone sound good.

It's funny Jay-Z had a song called "The Death of Autotune" in 2007, but since then it's gotten even more popular to the point that plenty of mainstream singers, and just about every rapper in the industry uses it.

Rock needs a government that dislikes rock.

Rock died, because it stopped advancing and everyone just wanted to recycle the same shit again and again. Musical evolution, is just that, evolution, if you don't evolve, you die.

>>70644444
producer kanye >>>> singer/rapper kanye though

>>70644699
This.
a lot of modern "rock" oriented music i hear just feels like a pale imitation of the greats from days gone by (to me anyway)

If i wanted to hear someone trying to sound like pink floyd id just listen to pink floyd

if i wanted to hear something with a "sabbath vibe" id just listen to sabbath

if i want to hear quirky indie rock i will just listen to pavement

most people who play rock are simply trying re-make music that was done better 20+ years ago

>>70642539
>I'm a contrarian

Nirvana is over rated as fuck, bro. They're not even really good. But they ruined the music industry? Really?