/jazz/ general

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Good to see /jazz/ back on /mu/.

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>>69738192
good to see you too anon!

You should also include these resources that jtg shared last week

>All Blue Note liner notes
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/dqefQD87/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/nwDqg0eV/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/8e1MizRP/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/z7n1Qubn/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/dVWQ2QXZ/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/fZJ6DHjg/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/w6IiBWuE/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/uViD8PIh/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/LWvqU0j3/file.html

>1960s Downbeat magazine collection
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/YLB3lu7A/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/hx17OPVN/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/XsfruYEI/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/PC5BlbF6/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/8kqxYz3F/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/4TjwApL8/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/PBYlK9xi/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/2Jo0lpj6/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/wSkqAk6M/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/zODHSsVT/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/XV0loHqf/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/qmDkrEg5/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/MWMOBBBY/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/OFs6P2Hg/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/fyNK1TNi/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/Oveuavcz/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/N0iQXL9V/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/EWwg5jOe/file.html
http://www120.zippyshare.com/v/kJWSQJtr/file.html

These are better than any book for learning more about the history of the music

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>>69738247
oh damn i'll put that on a pastebin as a future resource.
thank you anon!

>>69738146
>reminder: smooth jazz =/= jazz
is city lights jazz?

I'm looking for good piano driven jazz. Any recommendations?

>>69738302
Bill Evans
David Kikoski
Ahmad Jamal

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>>69738302
bill evans is a must, also check out thelonious monk and ryo fukui

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>>69738302
Art Tatum
Bill Evans
Mal Waldron
Cedar Walton

>>69738146
can we never make a /jazz/ thread with an anime image ever again please. Have some god damn respect for yourself.

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>>69738480
thanks for your opinion anon!

How do I become a jazz pianist?

>>69738555
Block chords

>>69738302
Chick Corea

>>69738555
First you have to tell your parents you're gay.

>>69738748
OK, done. Now what do I do?

Asked last thread but most people just commented on my choice rather than tell me their own so I'll ask again: what jazz albums did you enjoy this year?

>>69739639
The only albums from this year I've had much exposure to are Together As One, by Dinosaur, and Speak Low, by Lucia Cadotsch. Both are excellent though.

>>69738480

>implying this isn't an anime imageboard

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What do you think of Scaruffi's jazz list for this year? Which ones do you think he actually listened to?

>>69739759
/mu/ is a music image board, Anonymous.

>>69739775
Vijay Iyer is a tumblr princess

>>69738302
You should DEFINITELY try out Herbie Hancock.

I'll post my guide when I switch to mobile.

>>69739775
Why doesn't he review any of these?

>>69740129
Because he's dumb and doesn't actually know anything about music.

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GUIDE TO HERBIE HANCOCK (Minor Update):

>If you like standard/straightforward Jazz
Takin Off' (1962)
Inventions and Dimensions (1963) [uses lots of Samba percussion]
Empyrean Isles (1964)
Maiden Voyage (1965)
Quartet (1982)

>If you like Experimental Jazz
The Mwandishi Trilogy (Mwandishi, Crossings, and Sextant) [1971-1973]

>If you like Funk-Jazz
Fat Albert Rotunda (1969)
Headhunters (1973)
Thrust (1974)
Man Child (1975)
Directstep (1979)
Mr. Hands (1980)

>If you like Disco & Electronic music
Sunlight (1978)
Feets Don't Fail Me Now (1979)
Future Shock (1983)
Sound System (1984)

>Other Greats, unclassified
The Prisoner (1969)
Secrets (1976)
The Piano (1979)
Dis Is Da Drum (1993)
Gershwin's World (1998)

>>69738480
Fuck off pretentious wank

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What's some good flute Jazz?

>>69740129

This >>69740317 plus he probably didn't even listen to most of them

>dubtrack
Please don't turn this into another circlejerk.

>>69738146
nice to see this back again, but I'd personally don't do use anime in the OP
We've had a hell of a time getting these threads going again in the first place

>>69740651
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxiUqqFCRcQ

>>69740803
Shut up loser

>>69738302
Vijay Iyer trio

Any recs for good trio albums? Specifically, I'm looking for albums that are less piano-driven and possibly with great drumming. Both essentials and personal favorites are fine

>>69740959
sonny rollins - way out west

>>69738247
Anybody have more of the downbeats???

>>69738555
First make sure you're very comfortable with basic piano skills and theory:
>all 7th chords and inversions
>all major and minor scales
>basic Roman numeral analysis of chord progressions

If you're competent in all those areas, then find a lead sheet for an easy tune and start memorizing it. Melody + Left Hand chords and then a walking bassline + Right Hand chords. Then work on trying to improvise with left hand chords. Mark Levine's jazz piano book will be helpful with getting deeper into chord voicings, substitutions, and approaches for improvising.

>>69739639
https://rateyourmusic.com/collection/jazzthreadguy/strm_relyear,ss.rd/2016

>>69739775
I haven't heard a lot of these actually.

>>69741137
No more scans unfortunately. I just got the complete year of 1943 Down Beats though and there's some interesting stuff in those.

>>69738146
How does one into jazz, what album

>>69738208
>yusef lateef
no thanks i'll pass that

>>69742179
Kind of Blue

>>69742179
Miles Davis - Kind of Blue
Thelonious Monk - Monk's Dream
Art Blakey - Moanin'
Grant Green - Idle Moments

probably try these or just follow the charts in the OP

>>69742163
Why don't you trip?

>>69738555
Oh and one other thing- whatever standard you pick to start learning, listen to as many versions of it as you can find and think hard about what you like or don't like about the versions. Transcribe the solos you like, or at least a few of the licks from the solo that really knock you out.

>>69742257
People hate you when you trip, people hate you when you don't trip. Can't win.

Davis or Coltrane?

>>69742347
I don't hate it I just asked

>>69742371
Anyone who says Davis is a pleb

what does /mu/ think of Herbie Hancock

>>69738579
>>69742163
>>69742289
thanks guys, /mu/ can really be a nice place sometimes

>>69742252
i second monk's dream

>>69742403
Herbie Hancock? I didn't know anybody on /mu/ knew about him. I don't think I've ever seen anybody post about him before.

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>>69739783
a music board on an anime imageboard, desu

>>69742371
>most influential vs most talented

How do you even pick

>>69742435
>sellout hack who made literal smooth jazz later in his career
or
>literal god who had a chance to get money and sell out but stayed true to his craft to his death

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>>69742403
An amazing jazz god who died for your sins.

Also see. >>69740471


>>69742423
....You fuckin with me?

>>69742428
Anime is only one of the image boards, newfriend.

How should I approach chords on piano in jazz lead sheets? I've been practicing just playing the melody and the root note since I'm confused on the harmony

>>69742507
imageboard refers to the site, like a forum but with images. board refers to just one board on the imageboard

>>69742486
Herbie Hancock is extremely obscure and indie, you see.

>>69742527
learn chord structure.

>>69742528
You sure about that, friend?

>>69742474
you can't fuck with his psych funky era you bastard. that being sad I like Coltrane music more

>>69742527
That is not correct, newfriend.

>>69742474
>sellout hack

C'mon. Experimented and developed numerous techniques for decades, pushing the most intricate music as far as he could, calling him a hack is absurd.

I'd pick Coltrane too btw, a step above even other virtuosos.

Any tips on learning jazz guitar?

>>69742527
First make sure you can play the chords in basic root position voicing to make sure you understand the actual chord.

Then start with two note voicings. Go through the tune and play just 3rd's and 7th's. Then try roots and 7th's. Then start working on three note voicings- 3rd and 7th plus either a 9th or a 5th and start figuring out how to alter those to sound good in the tune.

>>69742640
thanks anons

>>69742640
i just play the chords and the lead desu

>>69742163
>>69742640
how important are 6th/13th chords as well as basic suspension chords? I'm writing some locrian bullshit (not necessarily that jazz oriented) but I'm curious what other pianists in general would recommend utilizing. I haven't played (I'm very amateurish anyway) in a while but I've recently become interested in at least trying to write strange things.

>>69742776
Not really sure what you're asking... It's good to know what they are I guess. If you like the sound then use them, if not, then don't.

>>69742928
sorry i was kinda clusterfuck asking because I don't usually mess around with modes, and I didn't know how chord progressions would act differently (if at all) in different modes. Well, since I like strange sounding things i guess so I'll do whatever and figure it out. Thanks for replying to my social ineptitude.

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>tfw it finally clicked

am I a patrician now? where do I go from here?

>>69743192
suicide

>>69743231
correct

>>69743231
>>69743278

fuck you

>>69743447
;)

>>69741008
Thanks anon, this is great

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Here's the link for this week's /blindfold/.
The theme is Christmas jazz.

http://www97.zippyshare.com/v/7dqICrqf/file.html

>>69743192
Nope. You're a degenerate contemporary improv major now.

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Big bands are stupid

>>69744860
Why is Kagami embarrassed about reading yaoi when alone by herself in her room?

>>69744860
No you're stupid

>>69740651
Dolphy

It's been a long time since I've seen a jazz general.
Perhaps we should make some anime meme like with emo so people would post more.

>>69740651
Yusef Lateef plays flute among various other instruments.

How to into guitar jazz.

Also, would this be considered funk jazz?
https://youtu.be/DtW4t50wISE
>Skip to 1 min for the song to start

>>69743838
>degenerate
I bet you can't even play the first piece.

>>69745004
No thanks.

>>69745120
>not liking anime
Why don't go to r/music at that point.

>>69745041
sounds neither jazz or funk 2bh

as for how to play jazz guitar, my research suggests just play chords with the most awkward voicings possible

Why do people say smooth jazz isn't jazz?

>>69745254
I be tthey like anime.

>>69745301
Because it's elevator shit, bland and uninteresting..
Oh and fuck Kenny G.

>>69745301
because smooth jazz is bad and jazz is good

>>69743192
Solo instrument albums are my favourite. Just been listening to Wesleyan Solos, its mint

>>69745301
it's jazz. it's just a bad jazz. a terrible one i'd say
only fags in denial would tell you otherwise

>>69738302
You Must Believe in Spring, and Scenery 1976

>>69745301
Jazz is a music of the soul. No ones soul sounds like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVILQIdagP8

>>69738555
Go play some tunes. The point of everything you learn is supposed to funnel towards your ability to play tunes and I think sometimes people forget that.

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>>69745423
>jazz is music of the soul

>>69740471
So has Herbie not put out anything good in the last 15 years?

>>69745254
Anime and jazz simply don't go well together, apart from certain soundtracks (whose contents are NOT consistently good).

>>69745469
Cowboy Bebop is theo nly anime

>>69742371
Davis is the better composer and band leader, but I like Coltrane's music more.

Any jazz reccs that use Combo Organs?
Alice Coltrane and Sun Ra are the only ones that come to mind

>>69745447
I think every single jazz musician would say the same

lucikly they already own fedoras

>>69738480
this

at least choose a good anime thats not meant to turn on pedophiles

>>69745469
I don't agree, cute girls go well with anything.

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>>69742371
Anyone who chooses Miles "Suck myself off" Davis is a contrarian, nothing else to it.

>>69745513
Not 2D, child-like ones, at that.

>>69745041
>actually jazz
Django Reinhardt - Djangology
Wes Montgomery - The Incredible Jazz Guitar Of Wes Montgomery
Grant Green - Idle Moments
Brothers Sandole - Modern Music From Philadelphia
John Abercrombie - The Third Quartet

>fusion stuff
John McLaughlin - Extrapolation
Al Di Meola - Elegant Gypsy
Allan Holdsworth - Metal Fatigue
Pat Metheny - Bright Size Life
Guthrie Govan - Erotic Cakes

>>69744860
>calling big bands stupid
>posting degenerate weeb trash
Disgusting.

For real though maybe check out some of the more interesting takes on the genre if the usual stuff isn't cutting it?

Duke Ellington - Far East Suite
Charles Mingus - Let My Children hear Music
Stan Kenton - City of Glass: Stan Kenton Plays Bob Graettinger

>>69742776
Chords that have 13ths are less common because a 13 chord implies all of the tensions below it are possible and that's a pretty full chord. Flat 13 chords are cool but not super common, with the exception of Monk's music.

6th chords are super common and used all the time. Minor chords with a 6th can work better than minor 7th chords for making something sound like tonic.

>>69742474
What a retarded opinion.
As shit as Tutu is and all the albums he did on that style, other than an innovator he had a great style improvising and leading.
He wasn't just a jack that jumped on the cool and rock bandwagons.

>>69745458
Hi. Herbie guy here.

To answer your question: he's only put out 4 albums since and 3 of them aren't that widely available.

Future2Future isn't that good.
Can't find Possibilities anywhere
River is a good album
Gonna listen to the Imagine Project soon.

Hope that helps.

Thoughts on Shabaka Hutchings? I think he's dope

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uk1WXfZMmfU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lkq_CZhLrII

Probably released one of the strongest jazz albums this year

>>69738146
>jazz general,
bye rddit

>>69745590
Wisdom of Elders is my second favorite jazz album of the year, he's great

How do the top jazz musicians compose their works? Jamming? Slowly writing alone? Old school theorycraft with just a pen and paper?

Particularly with the more famous and recognisable melody driven pieces, I wonder how they get created.

Final newfag question: how much improv happens in studio? seems to be way too much instrumentation to all be transcribed to sheet music

Where can I listen to Ryo Fukuis music? I know they're on Apple Music, but that isnt an option tbqh

>>69745423
That is arguably not even jazz.
It's just instrumental pop with a sax as the main instrument

>>69745570
It does. Thank you I wasn't aware of his lack of activity lately.

>>69745558
Also I forgot to mention that sus chords are failry common in music post 1960. A lot of McCoy Tyner's stuff uses it with 4th voicings. There's also tunes written with only sus chords and sus blues.

>>69743042
There's a big misunderstanding about modes. When people talk about major and minor scales they are also talking about chords and key centers and functional harmony in addition to the scales/pitch collections themselves.

Modes don't really carry the same baggage of tonality and chords with them. For something to be modal it really means that the pitch collection is gonna supersede any harmony there. That's why most modal tunes don't have many chords.

Also Locrain is hard to write in. I don't know if it's impossible, but I don't know if anyone has ever done it well, because locrain rests in a diminished tonality. While modal tunes don't have many chords, they generally have some and for Locrian it's diminished. Diminished chords are unstable and want to go somewhere else. You can sit on a major, minor or even a dominant 7th chord all day (if it's a blues) and it sounds fine, but diminished chords need resolution. Obviously it's music and you can do whatever the fuck you want, but you're gonna be dealing with that fact the entire time.

>>69745778
Rachmaninov and Debussy wrote some themes and passages with locrian modes but no complete pieces as far as I know.

>>69745540
>far east suite
>let my children hear music
f a m

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supremely underrated. a modal masterpiece. out of this world is aptly named. easily in trane's top 5 impulse releases

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Post good records I guess.

I need to listen to more new music.

>>69745725
>How do the top jazz musicians compose their works?

Depends on the person. Coltrane would play stuff on piano until he had an idea he liked, then he would take it to sax and try to develop it more. Some people will write it all down, it just depends on the person.

>Particularly with the more famous and recognisable melody driven pieces, I wonder how they get created.

Again it depends. Duke wrote I believe it was (I could be thinking of the wrong tune) In a Sentimental Mood at a party to impress two women on the spot. Do some digging on famous tunes a lot of them have their stories known and out there.

>Final newfag question: how much improv happens in studio?

All of it. A lot of sessions people are sight reading. It would be very disgraceful if people found out you pre-composed something that was supposed to be improvised. Although a lot of times people will go record tunes they've been playing live for a while so those times most player generally have a strong idea of what the general form of their solo might be, but it's not like they write anything down.

>>69745778
>I wasn't aware of his lack of activity lately.
Yeah it sucks but he's ALLEGEDLY making another album for next year..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTXDnPoyYSU

>>69745935
Thanks, I guess jazz music is even more crazy than I thought then.

No wonder discographies are so big if artists can pump a record out in a day.

I just got an EWI and I don't have any experience with wind instruments. I play the cello and piano. Would it be helpful to set the fingering mode to saxophone to learn or should I just leave it on the EWI fingering. I want to play things like this, for reference.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRRmA1I3UNY

>>69739563
Learn how to play the piano without petty distractions like family or non-gay relationships.

>>69746031
Ya it can be really crazy. Even the mixing and mastering on a lot of jazz albums, particularly acoustic ones is very minimal.

>>69745879
Out of this World is spectacular, really stands out on that album. Ole is another great (maybe a little underrated) album

Do you guys like Jaon Moran? I really like his artist in residence stuff.

>>69746556
hes by far one of the most interesting and open minded mainstream players today.

I agree, some of his stuff be a little hard to get into though. He has lots of personality.
I really like: breaking glass/refraction

Thank you soon much for this thread

>>69745565
>cool
>bandwagon
kill yourself my man

>>69745433
but what about drums, where most tunes are basic ride and hat beats? are there any jazz drums standard tunes?

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>>69742507
theres no rules against posting cute anime girls on moo, newfriend

>>69748424
>basic

oh boy

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>>69742632
listen to a lot of jazz guitars, use pic related for guide.
beyond that, you'd have to ask another jazz guitarists, but most would tell you to play some standards, learn chords commonly used in jazz, listen to more jazz, etc

>>69748492
eh less basic and more repetitive t b h

>>69748463
"Cute"

>>69745447
>le fedora meme
the meme is only applicable if the fedora wearer is a pretentious wank who doesnt know what hes talking about, anon. "jazz is from the soul" is a statement almost every jazz musician know and says.

>>69748517
time signatures in jazz are incredibly awkward, especially when you're switching between them. what may sound like simple ride tapping and the odd snare is actually the most complex and technical drumming in all music

>>69748600
correct me if im wrong, but is all rhythm in jazz counted as triplets? like in other types of music, theres usually 4 eighth notes in between each beats, but for jazz its always triplets?

so who /plays/
trumpet man working on putting together a fusion band a la robert glasper/RH minus here

>>69745004
I'll make some Blue Note anime girl parodies eventually.

>>69745523
davis is actually a lot more normie and un-contrarian, anon.

>>69748625
not really
you're somewhat correct in thinking that swing rhythms are "felt" in triplets, but i think most people visualize it as swung eighths rather than a series of triplet subdivisions (even if that's essentially what they are). it's really more of a rhythmic feel induced through the accenting of the first and third notes of triplet figures built on the beat, and sixteenths can make an appearance as well even though the underlying feel still remains- although on occasion musicians switch between straight and swung notes

tl;dr it's less concrete than you think, but you have the right idea

>>69748625
true triplets are your rhythm foundation, but where do you go from there? you've got to relearn your kick/stomp habits and accentuate strong counts on offbeats, fills that don't end synced with your patterns and most importantly match your dynamics with your constantly changing bandmates. mix in tempo changes, solos and generally keeping an interesting groove and you start to see why jazz drummers are so godlike.

of course you can simplify playing yourself, but you said most tunes are basic. I urge you to stick on a record and focus on the drummer for just a few minutes. you'll notice the nuances that show that simply isn't the case

>>69748907
>>69749171
i see, thank you anons

i don't play or listen to jazz but open-minded jazz musicians are the best to play with. jazz nerds are the worst though.

learning to play sheet-music currently

how would i begin to learn a song?

should i start with just a single clef then learn the bass?

ok since we're on the topic of swing, i want to learn swing rhythm guitar, currently looking at freddie greene style since he's one of the well known rhythm guitarists.

anywho, do i have to have a full understanding/learn jazz in order to play swing? i know swing came from jazz and all but swing is it's own thing.

>>69748424
A lot of art Blakey tunes are one that have some degree of drum feature like One by One. Other tunes that have feel changes a lot are usually fun for drummers like a night in Tunisia or Green Dolphins St. Some drummers will also call fast tunes a lot especially ones with hard changes to give the rest of the band a hard time, so maybe something like Giant Steps or Donna Lee. It's kinda a dick move though.

>>69748715
I'm a trombone player.

>>69749305
Are you talking about 20's style stuff? If so not really, but it wont hurt. That stuff predates what we think of as modern jazz. Bebop is the first thing that really resembled what most jazz today looks like and it got started in the 40's

>>69748715

bass, guitar and piano. Should be practising more, but I know my basic shit

Why is most Jazz today so be-bop resembling?
I'm talking about the jazz mostly played in jazz clubs and that kinda shit.

>>69751259
Most jazz after the 40's is bebop resembling.

>>69751381
But the 60's were the peak popularity for modal, post-bop and free jazz, and the 70's and 80's the peak of fusion.
In my country everyone plays funky fusion or be bop.

>>69751588
Guess what. Even in the 60's the jazz "mostly played in clubs" resembled bebop because that was what was popular. Only some specialized clubs would hire modal, post-bop, or free jazz acts.

Even more so in the 70's and 80's. Fusion was for stadiums.

>>69751645
Not so sure about the 60's bit.
Anyway, I think jazz, which became quite a exploratory thing in the 50's, stopped being so.

>>69751259
that doesn't sound right

>>69751645
this also doesn't sound right

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>>69751762
>>69751792
Just take a look at one of the venue listings from any of the 1960's Downbeats posted earlier in the thread. The majority of the clubs were doing hard bop and bebop stuff, unless it was a band that was very well known like Coltrane, Mingus, or Ornette Coleman.

>>69749497
no not 20's style. in those times the bands were smaller and didn't think a guitar fit in for some reason. they used banjos and ukuleles i think, or a mandolin.
i'm talking about actual swing from the mid 30's to the 40's.

but thanks for the input, it leads me into a more confident direction

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Mingus Mingus Mingus Mingus Mingus

>>69754959
Just bought the Mingus bio "Myself When I Am Real" at a thrift store. Apparently it has mixed reviews, but what the hell...

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>>69756058
woah

>>69748424
hi, drums are not simple and basic beats
it's improvisation just like another instrument, almost all of the greatest drummers in the world play off of the melody, and the ability to communicate with the ensemble between the drums (snare, toms, kick) while maintaining the driving ride cymbal is far more complex than you're even aware and the amount of difficulty behind it is something you don't understand, yet.

some drummers take the melody to the extreme

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rr-d3tO-sXM

some take more liberties and improvise in the moment for the moment. really listen to what tony is playing, the intricacy is unreal and he was only 22 i believe during this taping.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jFL1KuvSyo

>>69756058
>>69756572
yeah i bet that's the first time an extremely famous painting has been used on multiple album covers

>>69738208
Fuck these are a bunch of savage albums

>>69738302
ERROL GARNER, CONCERT BY THE SEA

>>69740651
Dolphy

>>69740959
Bill Evans live at the vanguard
Money Jungle, it's mingus, Ellington and Max Roach
Anything by Ahmad Jamal Trio

>>69742486
I met that nigga
At a festival backstage and he was walking by I was like "fly coat herbie" and he said
"Good lookin"
I got a contact cool

>>69742371
100% Trane man he has more raw power in his pinky finger than miles does in his whole body, man

>>69745301
Because jazz used to be a really powerful music, it was some shit that you really had to play with your balls
Good jazz is fucking intense, and great jazz musicians like trane for instance can make a ballad have great intensity

What's some essential Benny Goodman, /jazz/?

>>69759787
You could spend many hours looking into a good compilation of his earlier pre-album stuff and that's probably something worth doing but I haven't properly bothered yet.
Otherwise, the Carnegie Hall concert and Charlie Christian Sextet are both great.

>>69759886
RCA have a pretty definitive looking collection of his small-group stuff from 1931-35. I haven't delved into Goodman's work yet, but if I was going to that's where I'd start.

>>69759787
my favorite
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_X8sz_wgrSc

Stop shilling for a different dubtrack, drumcuck

>>69760011
I can deffinitely see the appeal of getting big sets like that. You're unlikely to miss anything important but personally I'd rather just get a double album with all the best stuff when it comes to singles based artists like Goodman. Saves me having to sift through and weed out the more mediocre tracks.
Getting compilations with the aim of getting a more comprehensive overview is definitely a valid and probably better approach if you've got the patience.

>>69760011
>>69759886
Picking up the RCA comp, a comp with Peggy Lee singing and the Sextet stuff. Thanks guys!

>>69738208
>Andrew Hill - Point of No Return
this album is too amazing!

So...what's been actually new in the world of jazz in the past few years? Too many artists just regurgitating essentially bebop/cool/modal/free/fusion stuff. There's Matana's first Coin Coin album that had some weird vocal stuff to go with the free sounding jazz but idk if that's entirely new and it's not something she chose to pursue in her following albums. Ten Freedom Summers has a chamber music kinda feel to it, but still kinda within the realm of free jazz. Electric Masada's 2005 release is a massive work of jazz fusion/jewish klezmer stuff, but Zorn was already doing that in the 90s, too.

>>69760386
>Too many artists just regurgitating essentially bebop/cool/modal/free/fusion stuff
>still kinda within the realm of free jazz
If your yardstick for innovation is "created a new subgenre", you're probably going to find more "innovation" in electronic and rock music more. They're more inclined to slap a new label on any remotely new distinct musical idea or sound.
>Matana's first Coin Coin album that had some weird vocal stuff to go with the free sounding jazz
Listen to Max Roach's Freedom Suite.

>>69760499
Nah I am looking for the less gimmicky ideas based on sound and more on approach. It's why i gave my Zorn example as his klezmer stuff because that came with its own separate style of approach towards the music and not Naked City because despite the nifty sounds on NC it's not all that interesting neither from a jazzy perspective nor from an abrasive music one.

Also giving We Insist! a listen right now and I am already falling in love. Any other works from Roach that are worth checking out where he's band leader? I have only heard him appear on other people's work.

>>69760055
t. kierkegaardian

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>>69742371
Fuck Miles Davis. He was a really bitter, hateful, narcissistic person. I honestly don't understand why he gets so much credit out of all the jazz musicians out there. He failed to keep up with the true innovators of bebop, and spent most of his career copying white musicians who played cool jazz like Lee Konitz, Gerry Mulligan, and most specifically Chet Baker. What's even worse is that Miles actually believed he invented/innovated every single style after Charlie Parker and we all should be thankful. Sorry, Miles, but the most important thing you ever did was make cheesy electronic music that only rock/pop fans like, and you didn't even do that first or best.

>>69760386
You're oversimplifying the idea of innovation. Even the "great innovators" of classic jazz all built their ideas on what came before them. Nothing came from a vacuum, as much as people like to romanticize it that way.

In a genre that's so centered around improvisation, artists "innovate" by developing a personal sound and using that sound to do something new with ideas that have already been explored. The closest you're going to get at this point is just people mixing existing genres together in new ways anyway.

If you're looking for giant, sweeping innovations, you'll be disappointed because you're only listening at surface level. Instead of just asking WHAT they're playing, ask HOW they're playing it.

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Not sure if Y'all be interested but that Herbie playlist I've been working on for months is finally ready.

https://play.spotify.com/user/1232993342/playlist/32BhYzTCafTMl61vrxn2B8

Hope you all enjoy it :)

>>69760557
I mean, there's certainly people pursuing unusual musical ideas and approaches that haven't been looked into much before. I haven't listened to much from this year but there was a 2016 blindfold with some pretty incredible tracks on it.
Tigran Hamasyan/Arve Henriksen/Eivind Aarset/Jan Bang - Atmosphères
was probs the standout for me cause of the live sampling.

For the most part though, what makes modern jazz appealing to most jazz fans is still the same thing that always made jazz appealing in the 60s. There are still new and emerging performers who have really compelling individual styles, composing really enjoyable music. Like, really renowned innovative players like Ornette Coleman are well renowned because they were able to give really incredible performances that moved and inspired a lot of people, more so than because they "invented" free jazz or something. That's why comparably few people give a fuck about people like Lenny Tristano. He basically invented free jazz but it didn't catch on at the time cause he never played or composed anything near as beautiful as Lonely Woman.

>>69738146

Gonna share a playing I did a month ago, this one isn't a standard but rather a jazz rendition of a pop song.

https://clyp.it/as5q0440

>>69738579
>>69738555

One tip I can give to you about chords, think of the notes in your chords as inner voicing, and always try to move them as smoothly as possible, resolving them to the most rightful place they want to go.

>>69760557
>>69760859
Oh, and as for Max Roach:
It's Time, Percussion Bitter Sweet, the Clifford Brown collabs, Money Jungle, etc. are all good records with him as leader or co. leader but he's also done some great stuff as a sideman:
Birth of the Cool, The stuff with Mingus at the Bohema, early Charlie Parker stuff, Saxophone Colossus, etc.
People didn't really get Max on their records to have him keep time, there's some class drumming on all those.

>>69760146
The issue with Best Of compilations is that they're usually shoddy masters of shoddy originals. The bonus with the RCA set is that it's mastered from the original metal parts (mostly) and thus will sound a lot less muddy, echoy and flat than 99% of other versions of the same material on CD.

>>69760386
Modern jazz is kinda decentralized in terms of ideas. Everyone is kinda taking jazz in a slightly different direction right now. Some of them are fusing it with different styles. A lot are trying to change up their song forms and I'd say most are working with a different sense of rhythm then you would have encountered 20/30 years ago.

That being said I don't know if jazz right now is in the best shape it could be. I think it's in a bit of a lull and people are still trying to find a style that fits the time. I don't know if it'll ever be like it was where one or a few styles would heavily dominate, but I think there's still plenty of new ground to break.

>>69739775
What's wrong with this list exactly?

>>69760859
I think it helps though that finding new approaches to looking at jazz helps add something new to its vocabulary of performance. The Klezmer influence in a lot of Zorn's stuff for example has allowed him to essentially create a new kind of modal jazz because klezmer music's approach to modes is pretty different from modal jazz while still having some small similarities. Or him adding Ikue Mori to his Electric Masada group, and her instrument (her dicking around on a laptop basically) allows her to approach jazz's emphasis on performance in a way traditional instruments can't.

>>69760938
Thanks, Imma check those out. Already heard his stuff with Davis/Mingus/Parker. Money Jungle honestly sounds less like a jazz record and more like idk...Slint but decades before Slint because of how weirdly off the performances from Max and Mingus feel on that record.

>>69761111
I always used to wonder why there are so many compilations of literally the same music in jazz. Turns out a good bunch of the compilations are indeed shoddy masters, but that doesn't mean there isn't one or two that is great.

>>69761206
I always felt personally that the free improvisation scene had a lot of potential in that regard, but focus became more on the technical sounds/being experimental than on the setting/mood.

>>69761111
Is that generally true of the sort of "every Billie Holiday song ever released on verve" type compilations or are you just aware that the Goodman RCA is better quality audio?

>>69748715
Learning Trombone, I come from brass band euphonium and tenor horn, life is hell. Also learning more theory with piano

>>69761328
>I always felt personally that the free improvisation scene had a lot of potential in that regard, but focus became more on the technical sounds/being experimental than on the setting/mood.


Maybe, but free jazz is so niche even within people who play it. It seems that free jazz is more popular with people who like things like noise and drone than jazz fans. A biography about Coltrane I read actually had some pretty insightful and thoughtful comments on why this happens.

>>69758657
it's kind of interesting because both came out in 1967

I looked into it one time, apparently the painter Jean-Auguste-Dominique Ingres died in 1867 and there was a centennial exhibition in the US which probably explains why two jazz albums ended up using the same painting on the cover in the same year

>>69739775
much better than the average Scruffy-list, I think

Affirmative action the genre, the thread.

>>69761687
rock music was invented by blacks too u know

>>69761724
>we wuz rokz and shiet
Wow, you truly have no shame. Happily, I don't listen to inferior music so you will get off scot-free.

>>69761782
wot kind of music do u listen2?

>>69761789
Classical, of course.

>>69761815
mozart was black

>>69739639
Aki Rissanen Trio - Amorandom
Shabaka & the Ancestors - Wisdom of Elders
Jeff Parker - The New Breed
Lucia Cadotsch - Speak Low
Logan Richardson - Shift
Michael Formanek & Ensemble Kolossus - The Distance
Aruan Ortiz Trio - Hidden Voices
Phronesis - Parallax
Dinosaur - Together, As One
Marius Neset - Snowmelt
Peter Evans - Lifeblood
Yussef Kamaal - Black Focus
Virta - Hurmos
Ethan Iverson - The Purity of the Turf

>>69761858
How's the Iverson record compare to The Bad Plus. I follow him on twitter so I saw him promote it, but I haven't checked him out.

>>69761853
Not surprised considering how overrated he is. A meme compositor, famous because muh prodigy just like every black """"genre"""" and """"artists"""" relies on the race card.

>>69761996
he is the best composer (along with haydn) of the late 18th century IE the classical period. you said you only listen to classical music, right? who else is there? boccherini? lol

>>69761891

it's much closer to jazz tradition, there's a good chance you wouldn't think it's the same pianist of you just heard the two albums - I wasn't overly fond of the new Bad Plus myself, the novelty of doing jazz versions of pop hits is long gone and I don't think the new album did anything special

>>69762067
>of the late 18th century IE the classical period
I said classical as a broad term because I thought you're completely clueless, and was right
>best composer (along with haydn)
Did you post the only 2 composers you know?

>>69762196
>I said classical as a broad term
only plebs do that
>Did you post the only 2 composers you know?
i posted the only two from that period who anyone cares about

>>69762069
Ya TBP is really hit or miss for me. I like some of their stuff a lot, but sometimes they just get a little self indulgent and do a little too much with the sorta "out" playing.

>>69761996
>overrated
>Mozart
Further proof that Mozart is underrated.

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>>69742403
>>69742423
>>69742486
>>69742528

>>69762234
>only plebs do that
I'm talking with you, so I'm not trying to overwhelm your small brain but that seems impossible, as you can only respond to whatever you can see.
>anyone cares about
Yeah, your pri-mates might only care about them as they are as simple as the composers but it ends there.

Ciao

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>>69738146
>jazz "music"

>>69762371
goodbye but this post is unintelligible

>>69762324
I love that my image is making rounds.

Hope you like the playlist I made. >>69760830

>>69738146
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8rnMc22AG8

What kind of music is this? Big band jazz?

>inb4 OST

imagine being so stupid that you think jazz is good
it's even worse when you realize most of you are white

jazz is fucking gay

Any online sources for jazz transcriptions?

>>69762760
google "artist name + transcription"

>>69761356
It depends on a bunch of things, unfortunately. The only way to be sure is to do your research in each individual case. The good news is that once you hit the 40's the quality of all versions of the material will probably be reasonable, so I imagine the Holiday Verve boxset is fine as she didn't start recording for them until the LP era anyway.

On the other hand, if you're looking for early Billie, I'd recommend the Teddy Wilson discs on Hep records.

>>69761328
>I always used to wonder why there are so many compilations of literally the same music in jazz.
It's because a lot of it has fallen out of copyright in Europe, so anyone can release it for relatively cheap and make a buck off the fact that people don't know what to shop for.

>>69745734
Sharethreads

>>69745590

Thanks for exposing me to this shit, I've listened through a few of their tracks and it's top notch stuff.

>>69762700
Big band swing. It's written in the same vein as something like Sing Sing Sing. That's for a musical so it's hammed up and pretty cheesy. You're not gonna find too much music like that, that wasn't written for a soundtrack.

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>>69760861
>jazz rendition of a pop song.
kill yourself

>>69764366
jazz musicians covering pop songs has been a tradition since the 30's

>>69764408
and its been a pretty shit tradition to be quite honest desu

>>69764722
There are people in the world who really believe this...

What are your favorite standards /jazz/?
https://youtu.be/ReOms_FY7EU
https://youtu.be/pOZ9BQ2ehzU

>>69760020
more like this please

>>69738302
Errol Garner
Red Garland
Monk
Art Tatum
Marian McPartland

>>69740651
Roland Kirk. he's kind of a goof but he's good.

Get a copy of Bobbi Humphrey's Blacks and Blues album, you won't be sorry. Jasper Country Man is my jam.

Best books about jazz?

>>69741008
listened to it last fucking night. One of the first jazz records I got, and still one of the best.

>>69766527
There was a thread last week where jtg posted like 50 books about jazz

>>69765106
whats wrong with bills neck

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Rec me an album similar to this one, please.

>>69766613
Archive is down right now but:
>>69609247

>>69752183
>tfw you will never have to chose between Basie, Kenny Dorham, Trane, Horace Silver, Bill Evans, Peggy Lee, Mingus, or Nina Simone when planning a night out.

"hmm, well Evans is at the Hickory House indefinitely, so I guess I should see Mingus before his gig is up."

fuck.

>>69764366
>>69764722
shitting on pop standards
just kill (you)rself

>>69762403
whitties hating on jazz. no surprises here.
he was just a delusional pleb

>>69767083
was looking for more biography type stuff but thanks

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is it okay if i practice with an electronic kit? thinking of buying pic related soon, is it worth it?

>>69765106
Night in Tunisia
Sonny is pretty comfy but maybe a little pleb


>>69738302
Horace Silver
Herbie Nichols

>>69762750
n-no u

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>>69761440
Eupho?

My university was celebrating Eddie Palmieri's 80th birthday with a show and I got to see "Noble Cruise" live it was amazing. I'm on my phone and can't describe it too well but all you need to know is that at 80, Palmieri is still teaching a masterclass and playing like a legend.

>>69768626
fuck off faggot

>>69764366

You can't be serious man. Jazz was born out of covering pop songs.

>>69745342
thx for dis

>>69760800
dubs dropping truth bombs

>>69768772
>Eddie Palmieri
wow really surprised to see that he's still alive. He is a bit younger than I pegged him to be but it's still cool to see hes alive and performing

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chick corea>herbie hancock desu

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>>69771111
HOW DARE YOU

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>>69771406
he just does what Herbie does, but better, plus more

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>>69772314
>better than Herbie 'Died for your sins' Hancock

Any proof?

>>69771111
>not chick corea=herbie hancock
saw them play a piano duo live last year, it was excellent

>>69772416
>saw them play a piano duo live last year
You lucky son of a gun...

>reminder: smooth jazz =/= jazz

If you want to see in the history of jazz a series of steps taken by African American musicians to move their music away from continual colonisation by white hipsters - & what miles and bird etc were saying about bebop is only the most overt example – then sure smooth jazz is the final term of that. In fact it is the most successful transformation, because to date the forces of white chinstroking hipsterdom, from jazz fans to record nerds, have not really been able to deal with smooth jazz. It is jazz music's final victory over cool &/or political white dudes who want either to cool out with some cool jazz, or empathise with black struggle, and overall it short circuits entirely the whole hip-by-association-with-black-folks thing which white hipster audiences have been on since the 20s. It has also won out over retrospective acceptance by record dudes and reissuers. It remains a island of brutal, inpenetrable smoothness, where hipsters fear to tread, and where a terrifying series of smoothed out chord changes make hipsters turn the records off.

>>69767061
joe mcphee - nation time
steve reid - nova
sam rivers - crystals

that should start you off

Just wanna plug my Herbie spotify playlist again. Want as many people to see it as I can.

>>69760830

>>69772506
it was at cal, packed their theater
they just fucked around on piano for two hours and it was great
wish they'd played with synths more though

>>69773079
What were some of the songs they played? Do you remember?

>>69773104
I remember they did Maiden Voyage, i think All Blues, and they ended with Spain with Chick leading the audience like this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wD92FS1Y7c4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jcSxVH6kE3k&list=PL509643C85B53BA16&index=1

>>69773257
God damn this is good.

What do y'all think of free jazz and avant-garde jazz?

>>69773986
tis' tje best

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Why don't you listen to any jazz before the 50s?

>>69774186
i do though

>>69773986
free jazz is wank and avant-garde jazz is great.

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>>69774186
I do. Not as much as I'd like anyway but I don't find that many recordings and I'm not a singles guy.

>>69767506
Yea as long as you also play on an acoustic kit imo. Electric kits are good for working out the mechanics of what you're playing.. but in a band setting they are pure poo ahah

>>69773986
painful to listen to, but that's just me

>>69772506
I saw them last year as well, live at Montreux. Great stuff

Afro-jazz recommendations?

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Le page 10 save Dave

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>>69772601
You broke it.

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>>69738146
>reminder: smooth jazz =/= jazz
How much of this is a shitpost, and how much of it is true? Smooth jazz just doesn't do it the same way, but whenever you bring up even the notion that smooth jazz might not be 'real' jazz, then plebians (that want to seem at least a little sophisticated) go denial mode or accuse you of being an elitist.

>>69779785
Smooth jazz is an inoffensive, sweet, radio friendly genre of jazz. That's why people have a problem with it. Not OP by the way.

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/jazz/'s opinion on Animals as Leaders - The Madness of Many ?
I'm coming from the metal side but there are elements of Jazz fusion in it so I guess you guys on /jazz/ could enjoy it too

https://youtu.be/LEYt2GtfQJk?list=PLH22-xSMERQolPbs7jGqjLm-5Yl7QhQiT

>>69779811

>>69781452
What?

>>69779785
try to name one important thing smooth jazz and jazz have in common

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>>69779922
>metal
>Jazz fusion

>>69772998
Great stuff, thanks for replying.

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>>69783023

This photograph.

>>69772601
what the fuck are you talking about? hipsters and white black-wannabes fucking love smooth jazz. doesnt help that the genre is dominated by white middle aged hipster men too.