/comp/ - Composition General

Had a piece of mine played at a new music concert yesterday, funnily enough featuring a Feldman piece. He was the only dead composer on the programme which was cool.
My piece was a viola partita that I think I had posted a recording of here a while ago.

Here's the score (staves are missing lines in the preview...):
https://www.scribd.com/document/326921161/Viola-Partita

>>69264748
So in NaNoWriMo (National Novel Writing Month) writers challenge themselves to write a 50,000-word-long novel over the course of November.

I'm thinking the musical equivalent of this would be something as long as a classical symphony, ~27 minutes or so.
(I know measuring it by minutes is a lot more fuzzy than by measures, but since you can virtually double the length of your piece in measures by writing 2/4 instead of 4/4, minutes seems slightly more accurate.)
So if that's 27 minutes in a month, that would be 54 seconds of music per day.

It's a bit different with music, though, isn't it? There's no harmonies or contrapuntal motion between two simultaneous lines of text, after all. So I dunno how you'd work out the difference between a piano sonata that long and a piano concerto that long, but then it's probably not really in the spirit of the thing to do so. I mean writers don't think "Yes, I've written my daily 1,667 words, time to stop mid-sentence and resume tomorrow". The point is the increase in productivity, not the specifics of it.

Anyways, I wonder if anyone's ever tried something like this.

>>69265051
Seems cool, have a more recent recording? This is the one I found: https://clyp.it/lukrbezx

I hope he cut down on the vibrato somewhat, too much/too wide vibrato can get kind of obnoxious-sounding.

>>69265872
we're going to re record it next week. The recording of the concert failed, but he didn't nail it, so its alright

https://clyp.it/tbruvs0n

Trying out a fugue for this retro soundtrack

She's cute. What do you fags do here anyways?

File: Bach St Matthew Passion Choro part.png (146KB, 731x994px) Image search: [Google]

146KB, 731x994px

>>69266609
discuss music we're working on. share scores. critique scores. talk music theory.

So, I've recently learned all five species of counterpoint through Fux's Counterpoint, but I already had some knowledge on chord inversions, progressions and a lot of basic stuff.

Since I finished the species of counterpoint, I've been analyzing some Bach chorales, but I want to learn more.

Where should I go next?

Since I know very little about theory, you guys seem to be the best place to ask. What's the most dissonant, eerie, melancholic scale you can think of?

>>69266760
just listen to debussy

https://clyp.it/ipcdjgy4

Here's a jazz piano improvisation on Polka Dots and Moonbeams, and I Remember Clifford..

Don't be mean pls ;_;

>>69266793
Lovely, but that doesn't really answer my question. Something in minor is preferable.

>>69266819
Alright, so Phrygian #7

>>69266809
Yeah it's pretty jolly, well done

>>69266847
thank you, this is perfect

Where can i get sheets of /mu/core bands?
I know it sounds pleb as fuck, but it may be easier to learn if i read music from more conventional ((artists))

>>69266760
Well, there's a whole world of them outside of 12TET
http://xenharmonic.wikispaces.com/

Here's a Charles Ives piece using quarter-tones (essentially baby's first non-12TET):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZExi38G9AE

In 12TET, well, the chromatic scale I guess. Really I just leave the question of scale to "what notes do I care to use right now?" But there's some really eerie shit you can do with only the white keys.

>>69265051
>those score notes
>that gay kagel-ish le performer is part of the music shit
How does one become as gay as you poly?

Also, I hope you get cancer and die.

>>69267085
if the best criticism of the score is the performance notes, I'm doing pretty well.

>>69267085
imagine being the guy who gets this upset over music

>>69267118
That's because it's pretty much the most bland and uninteresting post-minimalist crap I've ever seen, there is nothing to say about it.

>>69267136
No just poly, who happens to be one of the worst posters of all time.

>>69267085
Oh, so that's Poly. I was wondering why his soundcloud was covered in fugues.

>>that gay kagel-ish le performer is part of the music shit
I don't really see what you mean. What are you taking offense from, "with emotion"?

>>69267355
The fact that he notated breathing noises and shit like that, I should have rephrased it as "le perfomer is the instrument xD", very reminiscent of Kagel.

Also, how could you not see that was poly just from looking at the score? The smugness and homosexuality was palpable.

>>69267393
if you ever become a composer, you will understand performance notes and extra musical elements.

It was for an experimental / new music concert, so I felt obliged to do some non-traditional stuff, even if my piece was still the most traditional in the programme. At least it had melodies and baroque-esque harmonies.

>>69267393
Perhaps he needed to know when he'd run out of breath

>>69267475
>if you ever become a composer, you will understand performance notes and extra musical elements.
I already compose, I do not do any of these things, as I am neither a homosexual nor a kike.
>>69267490
I'm not sure if this is a good joke or not.

>>69267627
it is

>>69267666
I mean, I chuckled. But it feels a bit reddit.

File: 20161104_160249.jpg (209KB, 1680x1260px) Image search: [Google]

209KB, 1680x1260px

it's time

>>69267627
you must be pretty out of the loop if you think extramusical notes are unusual, or that Kagel is the only guy who does them. I take more from Lachenmann or Ferneyhough or Kurtag than Kagel.

Music is an art form whose medium is sound and silence. Anything goes provided you have an imagination.

>>69267858
god damn this is a gay post

>>69267858
I know everyone does them now, I just think it's bullshit for kikes and homosexuals, hence I picked a homosexual kike to represent it.

You're right in that I've been out of the "scene" for a while now, but I can't imagine it's actually managed to move on from the ugly circle jerk it was stuck in back then.

>>69267393
To be fair the unnecessary Latin did add a degree of smugness to it

I know absolutely nothing about Kagel, so this is from Wikipedia.
>Many of his later pieces give specific theatrical instructions to the performers, such as to adopt certain facial expressions while playing, to make their stage entrances in a particular way, to physically interact with other performers and so on
None of these make sound, or at least necessarily make sound, whereas
>flick instrument with fingernail
>vocalise: exhale
both of these do.

I mean, I haven't heard it so I can't say whether it's a meme or actually has a good reason to be there (and yeah, I'd probably be more compelled to say it did if it happened anywhere other than that isolated moment). But it's not something outright amusical like facial expression.

>>69268050
This is a vapid, smug and extremely homosexual piece with extramusical homosexual tropes thrown in just to fit in. In other words; classic poly.

>>69268189
They're not extramusical, though, that's the point.

>>69267904
>>69267932
>>69268189
were you raped by a gay jewish man or something? what's with all the hate for jews and homos?

religion and sexuality aren't exactly high tier music analysis

>>69268335
maybe not to you

>>69268331
That's debatable, it is definitely theatrical.
>>69268335
I see you clearly did not post in /classical/ during the golden age.

>>69268432
>/classical/ during the golden age.
no such thing. /classical/ has always been teenagers spouting memes

>>69268653
>teenagers spouting memes
so..../mu/?

>>69268653
Incorrect, now its full of fags that unironically think Tchaikovsky or Mahler are worth listening to.

This is also poly's fault, as he was an early champion of shitty homosexual music and kikes.

>>69268725
pretty sure those people have always been there. The firetruck meme relies on late romantic posting to work

>>69266920

Thanks man, I have been meaning to set up a proper way to mic up my piano but it's not a grand and uh.. it's hard to get the standard jazz piano sound out of my upright.

What form are second movements usually in? How should I approach writing one?

I'm continuing my sonatina from before. It's kind of a long sonatina (but would be a short sonata), and much more traditional than I'm used to writing. So of the three movements of course it's fast-slow-fast.

Most pertinently, should I write an intro section to it? I was thinking of having it start as if it were in C minor, and then have it turn out to be in Eb Major. But now I'm thinking there might not be room for such a thing when the movement as a whole should only be 5 minutes at most.

46 posts in and no one's posted "bump" yet.

>>69272313
Bump

When writing a piece for orchestra is it better to start from scratch with an empty orchestral score or should most of it be written on a smaller scale and then orchestrated?

What's the basis behind the "descending tritones" that Jazz pianists always use in a dominant context?

For example listen to this one played by Monk right after the first chord changes to the V.

>>69266668
Can anybody help?

>>69274079
Well, first off, it doesn't have to be descending; tritones are the half-way point of the octave, and an inverted tritone is just another tritone.

As for why they work, well: the functional strength of a V7 chord comes from the tritone formed between it's third and seventh degrees (eg: the B and F of a G7 chord) resolving to a third or sixth it's relative I or i chord (eg: the C and E of a Cmaj chord).

When you replace a V7 chord with the chord a tritone away (eg: replacing G7 with Db7), the new chord still contains the same tritone (Db7 also contains a B and F, spelled enharmonically as Cb and F), and thus, it can have the same harmonic function.

We call this replacement of the V7 chord with the bII7 chord a 'Tritone Substitution', and the resultant bII7 chord is usually labelled as SubV7.

>>69264748
>she holds the flute wrong

triggered

BUMP

just got accepted into a composition program lads, feels good desu

bump

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YTxYykhQZbI

Well I did a thing.

https://musescore.com/user/5649331/scores/2967601

give feedback, call it shit, doesn't matter to me

>>69277182
why that F in measure 19?

>>69276219
Congrats anon!

File: Untitled.png (37KB, 378x235px) Image search: [Google]

37KB, 378x235px

>>69275129

Ehh I'm not talking about tritone subs, I think I worded it wrongly, I'm talking about moving in 'tritones' as in, think of a diminished chord without the middle note so it almost functions like a V7 chord, with the 3rd and the 5th.

I notice that a lot of Jazz pianist like to do those descending movements across a V7 chord with that diminished chord that I mentioned, for example pic related, the chord is on a A7, but Art is playing 'descending' chords on this one.. I'm not sure what to call this.

>>69277182
It'd be very hard to sustain the lower voice in the piano's right-hand part on bars 49-53. Some of your textures transition really suddenly too, and it's a bit jarring; you might want to consider dovetailing some of the sections a little more. The ending is similarly awkward and abrupt, and it also might pay to limit your doubling to moments when it's actually serving the music, rather than just doing it because it's easier that more interesting voice-leading.

>>69277446
Well, assuming I'm reading that correctly, that just looks to me like a passing secondary dominant: D, F#, A, C, and E makes D9, the V of the following G.

I'm not sure I see the tritone you're talking about. In fact, I'm not seeing any melodic tritones in that snippet.

>>69277657

The Db on the right hand and the G on the left hand is quickly followed by a C on the right hand and F# on the left hand, yeah that's the descending tritone thing I'm talking about.

So passing dominants? I was reading the Mark LeVine book and on the Upper Structures chapter, I think it mentioned some descending upper structures which sounded really jazzy in my opinion.. So I wanted to know more about this device.

>>69277732
Oh, well if that's what you're talking about, having strings of consecutive harmonic tritones is going to be a natural result of having strings of consecutive dominant chords.

Since jazzers love their dominant chords (they open up a lot of room for alteration), they tend to stick as many into a song as they can - think only of how often you hear a ii - V - I leading to every structural chord, and how often that ii is replaced by a V/V).

You take a normal progression like I - IV - bVI - bVII, and you lead into some of those chords with their relative dominants or a ii - V - I:

||: Cmaj7 - - - | Gm7 C7 Fmaj7 - | Eb7 - Abmaj7 - | Cmin7 F7 Bb7 - :||

Then you can turn those relative ii chords into their relative V/V chords, or otherwise continue V - I sequences:

||: Cmaj7 - A7 D7 | G7 C7 Fmaj7 - | Eb7 - Abmaj7 - | G7 C7 F7 Bb7 :||

Hey presto! Tritones fucking everywhere! Whether you choose to voice those in a particular ascending or descending pattern is up to you.

If you're really obsessed with tritones, you can stick in even more using diminished subs: Every time you go to play a V7 chord, add the b9 and remove the root. That gives you a dim7 chord, and the fun thing about those is that they're invertible into other dim7 chords, so from a simple progression like I - vi - ii - V, you could get:

||: Cmaj7 - - - | Am7 - - - | Dm7 - - - | Bdim7 Ddim7 Fdim7 Abdim7 :||

Combine that with the previous techniques, and you can make a progression using almost nothing but tritones:

|: C7 Edim7 Gdim7 Bbdim7 | D#dim7 Edim7 Gdim7 Bbdim7 | F#dim7 Adim7 Cdim7 Ebdim7 | Bdim7 Ddim7 Fdim7 Abdim7 :||

Obviously, that's way over-the-top, and nobody abuses dim subs so heavily, especially since they're so striking and really stand out, but yeah, those are all the common ways to get that sound.

>>69278066

Thanks for this huge write up man, it's really helpful and is gonna take a while to read in.

Another cliche I often hear in jazz is this particular device whereby they would do a ii-V-I, and afterwards straight away turn that I into a ii of a new key, and using that original I as a ii of the new key, do a ii-V-I again. For example, the chord progression could be

Dm7 - - G7 - - Cmaj7 - - - - Cmin7 - - F7 - - Bbmaj7

Are there any other cliché devices in jazz?

>>69278256
Yup that's a pretty common one. They do the same thing with keys that are a semitone, a tone, a fourth, and a fifth away as well fairly often.

Other jazz tropes? God, there's hundreds.

Uhh, line-cliche's are pretty common. That's where you have static harmony, but have a single note of the chord ascend or descend either chromatically or diatonically over the top. A common example is to have a minor chord like Amin, and have the root doubled up the top [A C E A], then you descend it chromatically to make:

Am [A C E A] - AmM7 [A C E G#] - Am7 [A C E G] - Am6 [A C E F#], and then sometimes people will take it even further to get Fmaj7/A [A C E F] and back to Am [A C E].

What else do you see a lot of? You'll often see pieces with fairly conventional harmony end unconventionally (often with a mM7 chord on a minor tonic, or a Maj7#5 chord on a major tonic).

Eg: ||: I - - - | vi - - - | ii - - - | V7 - - - :|| Imaj7#5

What else? Uhhh, you'll often see the iii (or bIII in minor) chord being used as a tonic substitute without implying a change in key centre.

Eg: || Cmaj7 - - - | Am7 - - - | Dm7 - - - | G7 - - - | Em7 - - - | Am7 - - - | Dm7 - - - | G7 - - - :||

Uhhh... You'll see a lot of chordal planning or side-slipping which is basically just moving a single chord shape around to different roots (often the roots outline a particular scale or mode, even though the resultant chords won't all be diatonic to that scale or mode).

Eg: often over simple harmony like ||: F7 - | - - | - - | - - | Bb7... you might see something like | F7 - | Gb7 - | F7 - | E7 B7 | Bb7...

>>69278256
>>69278689

There are also a whole bunch of voicings that are really iconic to jazz musicians. The 'So What' chord comes immediately to mind: That's a way of weakening the function of a minor chord (often the tonic) to more of a decorative one by playing it quartally - because of it's destabilising effect, it's often used in modal tunes, or to instil a modal sound to otherwise tonal tunes.

The 'So What voicing goes: [1, 4, b7, b3, 5]

Other popular voicings include rootless voicings (where you leave the root of the chord out, so that it can be filled in by the bassist; eg: a rootless Am6/9 chord would be spelled the same as a Cmaj7b5), the Kenny Barron voicing [1, 5, 9, b3, b7, 11], the Thelonious Monk voicing (playing [7, 1, 3] on the tonic, and [3, 4, 6] of the scale for every other chord in the key), and upper-structure dominants (voicing altered V7 chords as a triad over the tritone formed by the chordal 3rd and 7th).

>>69277271
thanks senpai

feels good, i needed that spark desu

>>69266658
Where the fuck is the tempo mark?

bump

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQbxsGtyc2g

>>69280295
And """"people"""" try to imply that Mozart isn't underrated....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leW64IxIf5w
this guy's videos are pretty interesting

I'm going to enroll on a piano performance and composition major 9 months from now.

So far I've only played baroque, classical, romantic and serialist music.
i've tried to listen to some famous modern composers and now I'm somewhat unsure about enrolling.
Do I have to do complex, unlistenable music to win academia's favour? Is tonality really dead?

>>69281874
I don't think so. I think a lot of academic music tends to challenging on some level, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's gonna sound bad. It's also gonna really depend on your school and the environment there. The type of music you might feel encouraged or pressured to write will depend on your professors, the types of musicians at your school and the culture of your school.

At the very least academic institutions do need new music to play and many of the classical musicians do enjoy more tonal music. There's still plenty of new music that is tonal.

>>69278256
The more you look at tunes the more you'll see cliches appear. Bebop harmony especially uses a lot of the same kind of "tricks" to create as much harmonic motion as they can.

Blues tunes and bebop tunes tend to have a lot of cliches in them.

Some I can think of off the top of my head. Are the descending turn around so maybe something like this

Gm7 Gb7 Fm7 E7 Am7b5 D7 Gm7

it's a series of ii V i's with the the V being tritone subbed. You can really keep going down with it. This one happens to resolve back to the ii of the actual key and then end on the key's ii V i

>>69281874
> i've tried to listen to some famous modern composers and now I'm somewhat unsure about enrolling.
Like who?
Some great neoromantics are Penderecki
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4w3uKwGRWhY
and Rautavaara
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JFIGoB7rK70

I mean, if you're fine with serialism, I can only assume you were listening to some New Complexity stuff

File: 1479188877364.gif (2MB, 235x150px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 235x150px

>>69282640
>Rautavaara

>tfw poor and have to use freeware vstis
I've found a list of high quality ones on a japanese website but they take so long to download because the files are huge :(

I should really post this to /classical/ instead, but isn't this just the best recording of the Moonlight Sonata you've ever heard? It's just the first movement in this video but all of them are great.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O6txOvK-mAk

>>69278689
>>69278790

Thanks for the write up man.

And also one more thing, I find that the choice of notes that I use when improvising, is based on the give chord at that time, like I would shape a scale entirely based on the current chord. And overtime, especially with dominant chords I kinda realised that I'm almost using every single note in the chromatic scale except the maj7.. the way I look at it is the 3 alterations, b5 and #5 all form a scale and I would play from this scale, of course taking into account that the alterations don't clash..

Is this an okay way to approach?

>>69284561
>tfw torrented all the high quality sample packs and DAWs for $0
get gud. use rutracker.
and of course the files are huge. Thats what makes them so good, millions of different dynamics and techniques for a single note, all in high quality, multiply that by all the different notes on an instrument, and then multiply that by all the various instruments in the library, and 20GB is about standard.

File: 1.png (50KB, 649x646px) Image search: [Google]

50KB, 649x646px

I'm so glad /comp/ is back, I really enjoyed lurking here and learning stuff. Sadly I started composing after /comp/ died, so I wasn't able to get much critique. Anyway, after writing a load of shit tier minuets and learning more about composition, I've been writing a waltz, there are a few things I need to fix up like adding in more instruments in the first part. It's certainly not yet completed, but I would love it if you guys could give any kind of feedback.

It's in F# minor
The chord progression for the main theme is:
i / VI / iv / VII / III / VI / dim. ii / V / Repeat.

https://clyp.it/ooktyazw

Can't post pdf so will post page by page

File: 2.png (38KB, 657x560px) Image search: [Google]

38KB, 657x560px

>>69286538

File: 3.png (40KB, 649x575px) Image search: [Google]

40KB, 649x575px

>>69286555

File: 4.png (39KB, 658x586px) Image search: [Google]

39KB, 658x586px

>>69286598

File: 5.png (38KB, 657x558px) Image search: [Google]

38KB, 657x558px

>>69286623

File: 6.png (52KB, 659x586px) Image search: [Google]

52KB, 659x586px

>>69286646

File: 7.png (48KB, 659x589px) Image search: [Google]

48KB, 659x589px

>>69286659

File: 8.png (51KB, 660x622px) Image search: [Google]

51KB, 660x622px

>>69286681

File: to be continued.png (36KB, 424x580px) Image search: [Google]

36KB, 424x580px

>>69286696
Last one, sorry for spam friends.
Also, are there any good resources on writing waltzes?

>>69286715
Don't know many resources off the top of my head, but try simply score reading your favorite waltzi and doing analysis on them to learn.

Also, you have a lot of empty lines and instruments kind of doing nothing. Try maybe spicing it up a bit?

>>69287038
Yeah I know there are empty lines, I'm working on having more, just difficulty deciding what to put there.

>start my piece with a motif of straight sixteenth notes
>it's impossible to get it to pause for a second
This is what happens with every single one of my piano compositions.

>>69286109
Playing chord tones is always a good way to approach. You don't want to exclusively use chord tones, because it limits your note choice, but you can get a ton a ton of mileage off of just chord tones.

As for dominant chords it's tricky. I can't tell from without hearing you, but yes V7 chords have a lot of available tensions you can use on them and sound good. What you don't want to do is get too chromatic on them, because then it will sound like you don't know what you're doing and you're playing chromatic stuff to cover it up.

Like most things this just boils down to use good taste and think about what people you enjoy listening to would do.

>>69288380
I posted my playing here..
>>69266809

Obviously I'm still kind of new to this but at the moment I'm still kind of trying to figure the whole voicings thing out.

>>69266809
You again! Haven't you been doing classical mostly until now?

>>69290707

>Me again

D-do you know me anon..

>>69290961
Yeah dude I've seen this clyp three times already I'm pretty sure.

>>69291880

But that was the first time I posted that specific clyps.. even though I have posted my clyps plenty of times in /comp/ threads

>>69264748
Got any good resources for learning music theory? I need to learn to walk before I can run. Want to try learning the piano or something.

File: 1455209529291.jpg (168KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

168KB, 1920x1080px

Can anybody analyze the first 2 measures?

>>69266658
Baroque music often didn't have tempo markings. The composer would be present, and would know what tempo to set.

>>69273529
The latter. You want to write the melody, harmony, counterpoint etc first, then determine which instruments will play what.

Otherwise, you end up with something like Schubert's Symphonic Sketch in E major, 80% of which is a melody line and nothing else.

>>69284411

>>69293059
They're all right there.

Teoria's particularly good.

File: tmp_32732-20161126_113052-1957880119.jpg (2MB, 3264x1836px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 3264x1836px

Sorry if this isn't the appropriate place to ask, but what does pic related mean?
B is double flat, but the key signature is already flat, does that mean I play it 1-1/2 steps down, so A flat?
And does C flat mean B?

>>69297260
Just fuck me up, mobile made it upside down.

>>69293846
Eb:
I
V vi iii (accented passing tones) V43/IV
IV IV? (the tenor kind of implies the dominant here, it's kind of a fuzzy distinction) I

I'd tell you to do it yourself but I needed to bump the thread

>>69297260
>B is double flat, but the key signature is already flat, does that mean I play it 1-1/2 steps down, so A flat?
No, it's double flat because if you wrote a single flat it would just look as though you were indicating Bb. You'd play what's indicated as A.
>And does C flat mean B?
Yes, on the piano at least

File: pffft.png (44KB, 954x503px) Image search: [Google]

44KB, 954x503px

>>69297260
>>69297273

Sorry for shitting up thread, here it is right side up.

>>69297364
Thanks

File: 1450146363724.jpg (941KB, 1128x3465px) Image search: [Google]

941KB, 1128x3465px

>/comp/ is back
Fucking finally. I've been working on something, though progress has been slow and I get stuck at seemingly simple shit because it's my first composition that actually seems to be going somewhere.

https://musescore.com/user/12540031/scores/2982136

Any feedback is appreciated. I tried to not use D, just because. I did end up slipping one in 1 measure, but that's it.

>>69264748
Who is this cunny bunny?

>>69298103
This is really good anon

Working on a piano sonata, you guys wanna see it? I'm having problems with transitions between the tonic and leading up to that

>>69298773
Thanks anon, it's good to know that it's not only my head that likes it. I've been wrecking my head with the small details of the piece but I think I got that first part right. Now I'm trying to think of the next part, got some ideas written down for the climax, but not much beyond that.

I later realized that some parts (mainly the cello, which I added last) hint towards E despite the whole piece being in f#. That was unintended but I ended up liking it.

>>69298785
Post it. I fucking love Sonatas.

File: 1.png (97KB, 731x787px) Image search: [Google]

97KB, 731x787px

>>69299174
Only done with the first movement, and it certainly needs some polish

File: 2.png (104KB, 745x890px) Image search: [Google]

104KB, 745x890px

>>69299444

File: 3.png (96KB, 767x845px) Image search: [Google]

96KB, 767x845px

>>69299459

File: 4.png (111KB, 736x876px) Image search: [Google]

111KB, 736x876px

>>69299478

File: 5.png (101KB, 712x888px) Image search: [Google]

101KB, 712x888px

>>69299500
any lurkers who might wanna comment on my piece? Any criticism would be appreciated

File: 6.png (95KB, 717x878px) Image search: [Google]

95KB, 717x878px

>>69299516

File: 7.png (99KB, 746x881px) Image search: [Google]

99KB, 746x881px

>>69299536

File: 8.png (86KB, 750x862px) Image search: [Google]

86KB, 750x862px

>>69299556

File: 9.png (21KB, 770x514px) Image search: [Google]

21KB, 770x514px

>>69299578

>>69299599
Post a clyp of what it sounds like.

>>69300065
How do i do that?

>>69300119
You're using musescore to notate this right?
If so, export the audio file as an ogg vorbis and go to https://clyp.it/ and upload it to there, then share the link with us.
You can probably do this with Sibelius as well I'm assuming.

>>69300297
>https://clyp.it/
Alright, wait a sec

>>69300297
>You can probably do this with Sibelius as well I'm assuming.
Not him, but that means I've been exporting from Sibelius into Musescore for no reason then. It always fucks up my measures.

What's the difference between using clyp.it and uploading the file to musescore? Does clyp.it has less shitty sounds?

>>69300480
No clyp.it is just an audio file sharing site, I mean of course you could use a musescore link, stupidly I didn't think of that.

I think using clyps are just generally easier.

Link to the first movement of the sonata

https://clyp.it/lmuapzox

>thinking I'd be able to show /comp/ a full piece once it's back
>have only written loose fragments and barely studied since it died
You could've waited until next year, I'm sure I'd have something done by then.

File: 2dwdj3oih34r78ydsiufh.jpg (60KB, 446x454px) Image search: [Google]

60KB, 446x454px

>>69300437
>>69299599
God damn, I really liked it anon. It sounds complicated as fuck to play though.

I mean, the progression of notes are easy to solve, and the bass seems to be in the classical style so it's not exactly hard to figure out, but god dammit that speed. My pleb technique has enough trouble with the speedier parts of Für Elise sometimes, where my fingers trip over themselves, or shit like Mozart's Rondo alla Turca (again, the fast parts). And it doesn't even have any other notations yet.

Second movement when?

>>69300718
sounds cool.
did we ever modulate? it's a bit tiring to spend so long in A minor.
careful of enharmonics.
I'm by no means a pianist but it seems like it'd be somewhat difficult, what with those occasional chords in the middle of runs in a single hand

Sorry I can't say more, I'm a bit busy

>>69302075
Thanks anon, currently working on the second movement. I thought about bringing the speed down. I do like the bass myself.

>>69302153
Thanks. Well, thought about modulating. Second movement will be in major though, as i'm trying to follow the classical sonataform.
Yeah, enharmonics are littered about the score. Going to fix that when i have time. It's pretty challenging, equals one of the easier Mozart sonatas i figure.

I'm getting a keyboard and going to try to learn music composition/playing.
Is there anything directed for this sort of intent/skill? I can play guitar to a novice level but beyond a crude understanding, I can't read sheet music, recognise notes nor follow timing.

>>69302350
Get a couple of beginner piano books. Alfred's Adult piano books are popular, though I can't say much about them because I had a teacher teach me with Bastien's children books years ago. If you can, try to get a teacher at least for your first year, though I guess it's not REQUIRED if you are very critical about what you do and read.

Make sure the keyboard you get has decent weighted keys.

I have a Clavinova CLP 535 and it's great, but I've had to use a P115 for a while because reasons. The P115 does its job surprisingly well for the $600 it costs, and makes me not miss the 535 thaaat much.

The really hard part about piano (for me anyway) is the technique that most good pieces demand. Sure, not all of them, but it quickly became a limitation for me. My teacher recommend me Hanon's exercises to git gud at technique. It's easily the most boring thing I've done in music, but given the troubles I've had with some pieces I think that I don't have a choice other than grinding Hanon.

For composition I can't say much without talking out of my ass, I'm just starting out. Check out the books in the OP I guess. Personally I've liked The Compelete Musician and William Russo's Composing book. Haven't finished either of them, but I'm about halfway through Russo's, and about 1/5 of the Complete Musician. Both taught me a lot and I'm far from done with them.

>>69300718
Fuck me this is cool

Should we make a discord server for /comp/?
Might be a good idea, since we won't have threads dying constantly.

>>69302661
>discord server
Explain.

>>69302661
Not having a discord server means people bump the thread to communicate.

>>69302697
Personalised chat room.

>>69302350
A lot of the techniques I come here to discuss arguably need an ability to read sheet music, if not some music theory.

You can learn the basics of music theory just googling stuff or Wikipedia, research chords, intervals and anything you might see on some sheet music. After that, I explain to you interesting things like how harmonic thirds are always safe and how in sheet music the two notes are so close to each other without touching. You learn to identify fifths and sixths the same way, then counterpoint is easier.

>>69299444
>>69299459
>>69299478
>>69299500
>>69299516
Looks well composed, studied a few random bars and seems correct. I haven't heard it though.

Care to list some of the techniques you're definitely using? I noticed vocal interchange but that might have been an accident.

>>69302153
>somewhat difficult
This actually could be an issue, it's an objective measure of a composition, it's why there are so many rules on writing vocal melodies. I wouldn't have picked it up because I'm horrible at piano.

Yeah

File: 2ei209di3409dk230dk2d.jpg (27KB, 360x339px) Image search: [Google]

27KB, 360x339px

Don't die. I'm still working on my piece.

Don't lie, how many of you are copying music from classical composers? Maybe a figuring style or cadence?

>>69300718
I've been thinking about this more.

It's awkward.

No offence, but it has strange, partially resolved dissonances. The chords within bars is actually a nice effect, but you've misspelled (not vocal interchange or enharmonics) some doubled notes.

>>69307531
How fast is /mu/ these days?

>>69289529
Sorry for that and for the long wait for the response, but your chords and voicings sound solid, they're very nice actually. Your phrasing could use work though. It's kinda rough and jerky right now. You tend to stop both of your hands in the same place and come back aggressively after the rest which creates a very unsmooth feeling. Something like Polka Dots and Moon Beams should have a more delicate touch. Your articulations could be lighter as well. Again it's all very aggressive, see if you can be more delicate with it. I hear you doing it during some parts, but you tend to heavily articulate all of the embellished and improvised lines.

I'm sorry if this is rude or blunt, but I feel like it's more help the more honest I can be.

>>69308510

Hey thanks for the feedback.

By aggressive, do you mean in terms of dynamics whereby I'm hitting the piano too hard? And by phrasing, you are talking about stuff like more 'movements' between the chords? Like, not just play chords but, movements.

I do agree about the aggressive part, I tend to play quite hard sometimes without realising it, but the shitty audio added some compression to it so it might sound harder than its suppose to be.

Any examples whereby the articulation is particularly hard?

Thanks for the feedback once again man.

>>69308303
>Don't lie, how many of you are copying music from classical composers? Maybe a figuring style or cadence?
I always have a feeling, in the back of my head, that I am inadvertently copying a bunch of pieces I know, and stitching different parts together.

Feels horrible, but I learned to live with it and not give a shit. Otherwise I'll end up never writing anything.

>>69308303
>Don't lie, how many of you are copying music from classical composers?
You know that's literally how composition students were taught back in the day? Have them reproduce, by hand, the complete scores of great composers. That way they'd be intimately familiar with the workings of those pieces, as though they'd written it themselves.

I know that's not what you meant but it was an interesting and vaguely relevant thing

Dude: hey whatchu doin there pal
Pal: just expanding boundaries of music

https://clyp.it/55vecsdl

>>69309335
Patreon when?

>>69309335
>the high octave stuff all of a sudden
I thought my computer was warning me of a virus.

Yeah, I wish I could get my midi controller to work right so I could fool around with other tuning systems. Seems like a blast

>a beat out of nowhere
what even

>>69309196
Inadvertently is nothing unless your entire composition centres around a melody that happens to be the main focus of another composition.

I mean out right enter the notes of Bach's cadences into your note scorers.

>>69309229
>I know that's not what you meant
Well..

I'm concerned that our relative interest in the past might make us unrelatable to the present. I'm big on Schenkerian stuff and it's very easy for me to see some simple counterpoint and instinctively prolong it into some pattern I'd commonly see from classical.

It's kind of nice that 4chan has the last community of knowledgeable composers who are probably under 30, kind of like how /pol/ had the last community of right wingers under 30. That being said, I'd like it if you guys tried to apply older techniques to more contemporary styles. If this little renaissance (literally the right usage) of ours spreads, it'd be nice to see it track back here. What if /comp/ raised music standards?

Just my $0.02. It does mean you have to stop copying classical, as nice as some pieces here sound.

>>69309377
Honest question, do internet musicians make money?

>>69309772
>I mean out right enter the notes of Bach's cadences into your note scorers.
Then no. What would even be the point of doing that? Why take something made by a great master, and shit on it?

What I have done, is see how some accompaniments are done when I want to try a specific style, like Alberti Bass when going for classical style. But the melodies are something that I always try to come up with on my own.

>Honest question, do internet musicians make money?
I'm assuming this is about as common as a band making it big. So yeah, sure. But it's probably extremely rare and takes a lot of dedication. The only example I can come up with right now is Adrian von Ziegler, but I don't really know how much he makes, or if it's even enough. I think the core of his music income is from selling digital albums in Bandcamp and similar sites, as I remember a comment stating the amount he gets from Youtube (fucking nothing, basically).

>>69309772
>Do internet musicians make money

Well I have made like 10 dollars from my Bandcamp sales back when I did post-rock so... No.

I think most of the money these days comes from preforming. Heck I'm in a school club and they are gonna pay us a 50 or so to play some shitty Christmas songs.

>>69309928
>they are gonna pay us a 50 or so to play some shitty Christmas songs.
Well, you already got more money there!

>tfw I made about 200 USD total while playing for a catholic chorus years ago
>Didn't even try to charge them, they insisted on paying me
>That's probably higher than the amount of money my own compositions will have made by the time I die
It's good that I don't depend on it nor expect to actually live from music. I would kill myself out of depression otherwise, if I don't starve first.

>>69309986

I think of playing/creating my own stuff now as just a sort of expression, and a sort of personal sense of achievement, much like beating my own hi score I guess. And I guess developing an artistic sense even though that sounds pretentious.

If we were going to play music to earn money, then we gotta look at it in a buisness point of view and that is basically to appeal to the mass market, write/cover pop songs and viral market the hell out of it.

>>69308948
I'm talking about your articulations. A lot of them are heavily accented where I think a lighter touch would be better. Think like a singer. Where would they place emphasis in a line and where would they sing it more gently, not necessarily a softer dynamic, but just more gently. I had a recording professor who would call those micro dynamics.

Your phrasing tends to be the worst during certain big chord movement. I think those are where you have those big pauses I was talking about. It's not just that however all of your phrases tend to be really short. Think about it in a classical sense with phrases having sub-phrases. When you play the melody especially try to phrase to the bigger phrase. So instead of phrasing something to a measure try making an entire 4 bars sound like one complete phrase. It won't be appropriate all the time, especially when you're freely improvising, but when embellishing a melody it works well.

I don't think I could pick out any one time that was really over articulated, sorry I did try. I also understand about the recording. I know it's not the best and I was trying to hear past it.

>>69310031
>a sort of expression, and a sort of personal sense of achievement, much like beating my own hi score I guess. And I guess developing an artistic sense even though that sounds pretentious.
Me too, anon. And truly, not expecting money out of it makes it much more enjoyable for me. Otherwise I would feel forced into it.

I don't know how actual professionals do it, I fear I would come to hate it just like how my current job took my love for programming, and crushed it.

>>69310053

Okay I think I know what you mean now. I gotta admit articulation/dynamics/tempo or even the sense of swing is not something I have been working on because lately I have been concentrating very hard on harmony which to me is the hardest thing to grasp.. and those big pauses, are kind of the result of me having to think about what's the next thing to play, when muscle memory fails me.. I'm still thinking of how to counter that.

>>69310221
Ya i figured. I think it'll smooth itself out in time, as long as you're trying to work it. Your chord voicings sound nice, very Bill Evans like. I think if you're happy with your harmony you can start to move to other areas, because it does sound very good.

Also here's a vid of Bill Evans playing Polka Dots https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NTxWQfMSsA

Obviously it's not fair to compare any person to Bill Evans, but just listen for how he phrases the antecedent consequent phrases to sound like they belong together.

>>69310302

>Bill Evans voicing
Woah man Evans is my biggest influence so far, he's actually the reason I picked up jazz piano actually.. I have been listening to a shit ton of Evans lately, i wanted to listen to someone else too but people like Art, Powell, Peterson.. they all don't have the sweet touch that Evans have, I find that their stuff are kinda almost like shred guitar. The only similar pianist i could find was Barry Harris.

I'm probably going to work a bit more on my harmony, until I have build up a sizeable vocabulary, then work on phrasing. That seems very important and somehow I forgot about it.

How do I quartal/quintal harmony?
Any books or compositions?