What was the first rock album that proved rock can be high art?

TVUAN or TMR

Pet Sounds.

>>68899116
wew
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these threads always devolve into the same cookie cutter mix of /mu/core and Scaruffi picks

Pet Sounds.

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>>68899055
Johnny Cash was high in every album he ever made, son.

>>68899055
None of them

highway 61 revisited

>>68899153
We'll show us your answer.

>>68899153
Like every thread then.

Blonde on Blonde

source:
http://www.scaruffi.com/vol1/dylan.html#blon

>>68899225
Lol.

Bob Dylan isn't rock.

>>68899153
doesn't make the answers wrong you predictable hipster

>>68899753
He's more rock than folk.

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Jon Lord's Concerto.

Freak out

>>68899055
Still waiting.

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>>68900057

>>68899055
Experimental =/= art

What do you even mean by high art? I'd say every album where the songs have been legitimately written by the artists, are in every regard, an art piece.

Bringing it all back home/highway 61 revisited

>>68899753
his electric era is more like 60s counterculture rock music than folk, but there is undeniable overlap into folk, yes.

>>68899055
That I've found? Highway 61 Revisited.

No Pussyfooting

>>68899055
Freak Out

>>68899814
Whi

>>68901231
You're very Down syndrome.

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>>68899753

>>68899753
folk is rock music, you know.

>>68903033
wrong

>>68903182
damn you told him

>>68903267
right

>>68899179
you will show us his answer?

>>68899055
rock will never be high art, and that doesn't matter

>>68899153
And Scaruffi is correct. His 1-4 and 9-11 are all legit music masterpieces.

>>68904351
except for rock bottom i agree

also the doors is a great album no matter what contrarians say

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There's really no reason to be contrarian you guys

>>68904377
>Not liking rock bottom
Probably my favorite off his list

To be fair, critics loved The Beatles Hard Days Night so that can be a guess. The safest answer would probably be Bring it All Back Home (that's largely inspired by The Byrds) or Pet Sounds

>>68904377
>doors is a great album
Yeah, but it ain't no high-art.

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>>68904637
or this. Say what you want about the pretense behind it and the tedious bits, it's damn near perfect, and when it came out NOTHING sounded like it.

Freak Out would have been an example had Zappa not gone for his amateur/sleazy aesthetic.
>>68900047
Mentions it because well.. the album still has its moments. It's honestly on the tier of VO&N, if you can get past the aesthetic.
It has this effect you miss when listening to it digitally where every side gets more and more out there until the last track.

>>68899055
applying a class system to music really doesn't make any sense desu

>>68902911
Great answer, excellent discussion.

Why are you so confident when you have zero input and no opinion?

>>68899153
So what would you pick? What a fucking asinine post, embarrassing.

>>68908763
Lol not rock

>>68899161
underrated
>>68907183
itcock and 70s kc crosses "the threshold" but stuff like tvun, pet sounds, freak out and the doors were like primer because they were still written like pop musi and a lot of the groundbreaking stuff was in performance and the studio

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If you think Johnny B. Goode isn't of equal artistic merit to a Beethoven composition, then you are a massive pleb blinded by class hegemony.

>>68907183
>Freak Out would have been an example had Zappa not gone for his amateur/sleazy aesthetic.
>Zappa
>Amateur
What exactly do you mean?

what a lame question LMAO

>>68905924
>Bring it All Back Home (that's largely inspired by The Byrds)
Are you actually fucking retarded or did you mean, largely inspired The Byrds

>>68899055
Eh what is high art anyway

>>68910397
I assume he means Zappa isn't high art because he purposely went for a childish satirical angle on his music

>>68910461
He's never made an album for the sole purpose of making money out of it and I think that his music can be considered art. He's disgusted by commercial success and was very disappointed when Valley Girl became a hit and appealed to the kind of people he was making fun of. And what about his instrumental work? Hot Rats? The Grand Wazoo? Waka/Jawaka? And I understand what you're saying completely. My cavorting album of his is Burnt Weeny Sandwich and he decided to mess with it with the last track (Valarie), which was definitely a letdown.

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>>68899055

>>68910583
My favorite*

>>68910600
I'm surprised this wasn't posted earlier.

>>68900047
This especially

>>68912164
maybe because it was released in 1975, long after the greats of krautrock, beefheart or velvet underground

Days of Future Past

>>68910583
Valerie is such a perfect comedown after The Little House. Sublime, goofy doo-wop, I don't understand how you don't like it.

>>68902278
Besides Desolation Row there's nothing folk on Highway 61 Revisited.

Most of Dylan's electric period is more blues rock than folk rock, really. The only reason he's called folk rock is because he was so associated with the folk scene of the time.

>>68915327
I know why Zappa did what he did, but that song was in my opinion slightly out of place as a closing track on the album.

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These are my early milestones of pop and rock. Am I missing anything? Anything not belong?

>>68916133
no, great list honestly

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Rock can neva be high art. Its was invented by the nigger man and it was consumed by the white masses. Now it's hip hop. Trap is the rock n roll. Just look how crazy these kids go over Lil Yachty and Future. Dumbass nigger apes.

>>68916133
If you're not planning on doing it properly, you're better off not including any jazz records and pretending it's not part of pop music.

>>68916243
Bitches Brew and some of Miles other more production heavy and "fusion-y" records might be considered rock/pop, maybe. All together though, I'm considering Jazz an entirely different tradition from rock and pop. There were certain production and instrumental innovations and trends during the late 50s early 60s that define pop music as we know it today, and Jazz never took part in those trends.

>>68916133
>Shaggs
>TMR
Meme list

>>68916321
Then why is Nina Simone on that list?

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>krautrock
lol

>>68916243
>Jazz
>Pop
That was true, but only in the 40's.

>>68916332
>Implying Western Culture and the philosophical principles we use to determine aesthetic value aren't memes

Seriously though, Trout Mask Replica is a serious piece of work, conveying it's anarchic, anti-societal, and disturbed themes through all sorts of instrumental and lyrical elements. Only a close minded idiot would think of it as just noise.

I might have had my tongue in my cheek when I posted the Shaggs, but it's legitimately and unique music, even if it was made that way by accident. Still better than all the twee and Indie pop bands who have ripped their style.

>>68916366
I'd file her under RnB, which while pretty parallel to pop music, I don't think is different enough to warrant a distinction.

>>68916133
>shaggs


are you fucking retarded how is a bunch of kids who don't know how to play their instruments a milestone

>>68916557
You could say the same about the everyone from the Velvet Underground to The Sex Pistols to Nirvana and beyond.

>>68916599
you can't even compare a shitty band like nirvana to parents forcing their kids to play bargain bin Beatles songs

they're literally all tone deaf

>>68916658
As I said earlier, I had my tongue pretty firmly in my cheek on that one. But that doesn't mean they aren't great, and unique, and kinda scarily cubist, and anticipators of "indie" music, and really really fun.

>>68916437
>>68916321
Jazz is academically considered pop but like some rock music, it's a little hard to pidgeonhole https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Popular_music
You can get into the trenches trying to untangle what jazz isn't pop music but that's a really futile effort and only serves to make the termanology meaningless so it's best to just pretend that it's all pop music.
>>68916480
She's pretty universally considered part of the jazz tradition though. You may as well consider Billie Holiday an R&B singer too while you're at it.
Nina blended other styles of popular and art music but plenty of other jazz musicians did that too as you mentioned yourself with Miles.
I just think having her on there either misclassifies her or unfairly treats the significance of jazz in popular music.
Also, picking Pastel Blues as a milestone recording is a bit strange when she had more innovative, influential and complex albums before and after Pastel Blues.

>>68916736
you can just say that you like bad music

>>68906904
when did i imply it was? none of the music on scaruffi's rock list is high art anyway

>>68916758
>It's hard to pidgeonhole so we shouldn't make the distinction at all.

So let's ignore the fact that like electronic music, Jazz can be considered both pop and art music (defining art music as based on the composition, where pop music is based on the commercial recording.)

Going by the widest umbrella possible, I'm specifically referring to the tradition of pop/rock. RnB took part in a lot of the same trends as pop, and made the same single to album, and song to concept album transition rock did, so I consider them close cousins with some overlap. Whether Jazz is pop or not, I'm not considering it pop proper.

Pastel Blues has jazz elements on it, but you can't deny the equal amount of Soul elements on it, as well as various pop flourishes. Be My Man almost sounds like a Spector production, Sinnerman features rock instrumentation.

>Also, picking Pastel Blues as a milestone recording is a bit strange when she had more innovative, influential and complex albums before and after Pastel Blues.

Fair enough, besides Pastel I'm only familiar with Little Girl Blue, I Put a Spell, and Sings the Blues.

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>>68916927
You take music so seriously if you can't enjoy a sloppy, noisy take on the party rock album alongside more serious and influential compositions.

But fine, I took out the Shaggs, I hope you like the new version better.

>>68917321
might be an idea to include some more tropicalia, caetano velso and gilberto gil etc

>>68917626
Will have to check further, thanks.

>>68904317
took way too long for this to get posted. i guess it was stupid to expect more from this place

rocket 88

>>68916758
How many people who listen to Top 40 listen to jazz too?

>>68917321
tfw this thread got derailed by this pleb and his shitty RYM-core chart

Bo Diddley Bo Diddley Bo Diddley

>>68918304
The thread was quite literally last in the catalogue before I bumped it. It was dying before I got here.

If you have any better music to hi jack this thread with be my guest.

>>68918355
Shut up

>>68918640
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