What are Earth ponies good for?

>>30607689
Breeding

>>30607689
farming

>>30607709
>>30607727
Unicorns and Pegasi can do both of those easier than mudponies

>>30607689
butt stuff

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>>30607709
Damn, you beat me to it.

>>30607689
She seems like she's doing well enough in this picture. At least better than my dexterous digits can do.

>>30607736
Then why are there so many Earth ponies?

>>30607736

how does one breed "easier" than someone else?

>>30607736
>implying the scrawny races are better than THICC

>>30607736
Earth Ponies are built for sex though. I heard that some of them can last an entire minute before orgasm.

>>30607808
i don't think they would be better than the other races

>>30607786
>>30607808
My favorite memes. If that was true and important then everyone would waifu alicorns, the prime breeding stock. Earth ponies are the least popular in porn

>>30607781
Because they don't believe in birth control.
>>30607785
By being sexier
>>30607786
Degenerate

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>>30607961
>implying Unicorns don't lust over Earth ponies as fuck

Even Big Mac got himself a Unicorn.

>>30607903
>Earth Ponies aren't built for sex because the alicorns are even more built for sex, plus Earth Ponies don't have that much porn.

What kind of round-a-bout logic is this? This is like saying that every character is a lesbian, because they all have a higher amount of lesbian porn over straight porn. What the fandom does has no effect on the show.

Besides
>implying the princesses aren't waifued in canon
>getting mad at other people's head canon.
>getting mad at other people's explicit head canon

Just enjoy the thicc, friend. There's no wrong way to fantasize.

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Earth ponies suck but so do Pegasi. Who cares about flight? Unicorns can teleport and several of them have been shown using magic to float. Magic is OP, if you train in sorcery that's a thousand times better than having wings. And it's Unicorns that take up most of Celestia's honors courses along with being the aristocracy majority.

Unicorns are the master race. Bow down to your betters.

>>30608043
>Unicorns
Not every Unicorn can teleport and do magic. You are basically cherry picking.¨

It's like saying: "Wow! Look at these smart as fuck Chinese dudes!". But then ignore the billions of other useless dumb chinese.

>>30608043
Door stop foreheads are inferior in all ways.

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>>30608000
Nice trips. But Earth ponies breed like rabbits. This mare right here has had 9 foals! Some stallion canonically came inside that mare 9 times.

>>30608057
And most of the 'smart' ones cheat.

>>30608057
This.

Boast Busters explained that most unicorns only learn one or two spells related to their talents. In reality, pegasi are the true master race.

>Can fly
>Live in a place that no other race can live in
>Control the weather
>Create the weather
>Can move faster than sound
>Can bulk up to crazy levels
>Strong as Earth Ponies
>Make up Celestia's special forces, the Wonderbolts.
>Can beat any regular pony in a fight.

When did you take the red pill?

>>30607903
>If that was true and important then everyone would waifu alicorns
You mean the ones with sticc legs and no abdomen?

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>>30607709
FPBP

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>>30608057
>Not every Unicorn can teleport and do magic.
But a lot do, you just need to hit the books and train and your potential is near limitless. But even if you only have the basic spells like light and telekinesis you're still objectively superior to Earth ponies and Pegasi. Unicorns have potential to become not just powerful wizards, but immortal Alicorns if they train hard enough. You know who doesn't have any of that potential? Earth ponies and Pegasi.

Admit it. Unicorns are clearly the superior race. I'm sorry if that makes you mad but it's just the truth.

>>30608101
>Can move faster than sound
>Can bulk up to crazy levels
>Strong as Earth Ponies
>Make up Celestia's special forces, the Wonderbolts.
Cherry picking. Rainbow Dash is an athlete and has a job for the military, naturally she can compete with Earth ponies because all she does is train and do EXTREME everyday.
The average Pegasi would be weaker than the average Earth pony.

Alicorns > Top tier Unicorns > Top tier Pegasi > Top tier Earth ponies > avg. Earth ponies = avg. Pegasi > avg. Unicorn.

>>30608117
>if they train hard enough

So can Earth Ponies and Pegasi. Remember Zecora? Alchemy is just as powerful as any unicorn magic.

Also
>Being able to make light makes you superior to the guy who can literally fly
>Implying that any race can't become an alicorn if they train hard enough

Twilight didn't become an Alicorn because she was a unicorn, she became one because of the magic of friendship or some shit, the book was just a test to see if she was ready to become one. Presumably, Celestia would have chosen a different test for a non-unicorn.

What are you drinking?

>>30608135
That's a good point. I'll concede everything except the Wonderbolts part. Pegasi are used as the elite agents for a reason.

>>30608117
I guess everyone has the potential to be an astronaut or a neurologist by that logic.

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>>30608043
>the strongest canon unicorn and an alicorn can use magic to float
>therefore any ordinary unicorn could do it

>>30608117
>But a lot do
Which fucking ones?

>even if you only have the basic spells like light and telekinesis you're still objectively superior to Earth ponies and Pegasi.
Light or Flight? Flight is not basic, and telekinesis is generic for every unicorn.

>Unicorns have potential to become not just powerful wizards, but immortal Alicorns if they train hard enough
Yeah, that's bullshit. Moondancer and Sunburst study every fucking day and they aren't implied to be super strong or anything. Trixie's entire career is based around magic and she was never anything special until she got possessed with ancient Alicorn magic.
Also, no matter how much fucking training you do, you aren't going to become an alicorn. That's a ritual/coming of enlightenment that only the most prestige ponies get. Starswirl was a unicorn and he's probably Celestia-tier when it comes to magic. Twilight only got princesshood because she fixed an ancient spell or some shit and her element of friendship was recognized by Celestia to be Alicorn worthy.

>>30608101
>Can fly
So can Unicorns with the right spell. Plus teleporting is superior to flight anyways.
>Live in a place that no other race can live in
With just a hot air balloon you can reach this oh so special place, that's primitive year 1700 tech. And the top tier Unicorns wouldn't want to visit that place anyways, they're spending time with royalty and just have better things to do with their time then play in the clouds.
>Control the weather/Create the weather
I'm sure a Unicorn could do the same with the right spell. But they don't want to. Why? Unicorns are the aristocrats who use the lowbrow peasant Pegasi as cheap laborers. You're proud of wage slaves? Oh, my.
>Can move faster than sound/Can bulk up to crazy levels
Teleporting is instant and objectively superior. Checkmate.
>Strong as Earth Ponies
I've never seen any evidence that Earth ponies are especially strong, they do the farming and other cheap labor because they're dumb, not because they're especially powerful. And magic is superior to brute force anyways, the season final villains are magic users, not a bulked up Mud Ponies.
>Make up Celestia's special forces, the Wonderbolts.
Incompetent jocks who need to be saved half the time they go on a mission. Who's the real power behind the kingdom? The ones with horns.

Unicorns are just better.

>>30608171
And the baby that Pinkie Pie babysat, plus others.

>>30608117
Who cares? There are magic items and creatures that can do more and better than Unicorns. Zecora is the prime example of this.

Earth ponies are the bulk of Equestria. They built Manehattan.

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>>30608242
I guess that means every Earth pony is super strong and able to lift houses.

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>>30608135
>Alicorns > Top tier Unicorns > Top tier Pegasi > Top tier Earth ponies > avg. Earth ponies = avg. Pegasi > avg. Unicorn.
Huh. Can't argue with this. I think this listing is perfect.

>>30608225
>So can Unicorns with the right spell.
And what about all those unicorn without that spell? You know, the other 99% of the population?
>With just a hot air balloon you can reach this oh so special place
Can't walk on it though.
>I'm sure a Unicorn could do the same with the right spell
Again, yes. Maybe 1% of all unicorns could. But 100% of all pegasi can do so from birth.
>Teleporting is instant and objectively superior.
And only two unicorns have been shown to be able to do it, compared to every pegasi in the Wonderbolts who fly quickly.
>The ones with horns
Right, that's why Celestia has a team of unicorns to help her fight threats instead of a team of pegasi.
Wait... Oh noooo.
>inb4 "lol, unicorns don't need to fight, they're superior and let the other races do it because they're so superior, but they could totally win any fight if they wanted to as well

Just take the red pill, it goes down easier.

>>30608265
She's such a cutie.

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>>30608295
Unicorn city has Unicorn guards. Shocker. Earth ponies are police in theirs. What are you so upset about? Earth ponies probably own shit town of wealth in Equestria considering most of the cities are built by them.

>>30608431
I'm not upset about anything.
Well, maybe I'm a little upset at another guy who thinks all unicorns are Twilight level wizards and rule the world, but by the by, I'm pretty chill right now.
Yea, some Earth Ponies probably are just as wealthy as unicorns. Hell, we saw proof of that with Gladmane. I'm just saying that pegasi are the coolest of the races, and that natural flight and cloudwalking is a huge advantage over the other races; so if we're going to have an argument over which race is better, Pegasi wins.

>>30608431
>considering most of the cities are built by them.
Construction workers and laborers aren't rich. They get paid a half decent wage if they're lucky and get chronic back pain for their efforts. The land owners and contractors, and the royalty and nobles above them, the're the real money and power.

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>>30608467
>and that natural flight
Sure, that's pretty cool.
>cloudwalking
Who cares? I've never once in my life wanted to Stand On A Cloud. But being a mage? Sign me up for that. You don't see Celestia and the real power houses and world rulers spending a lot of time in the clouds, they have better things to do than hangout in a place that's only used for racing episodes.

How is standing on a cloud helpful at all? Oh, fuck, here comes King Sombra! But don't worry, I got this. I can stand on a cloud.

>>30608520
Standing on a cloud is useful when your opponent can't stand on a cloud. It's helpful in staying safe. After all, if the pegasi had just sat in Cloudsdale, Tirek would never have been able to reach them, along with Sombra and many of the magical creatures on the ground.

>You don't see Celestia
That is true. Plus, this is incorrect, because it's canon that Celestia visits Cloudsdale regularly for the young fliers competition, along with other Pegasi specific events. She probably also has a hoof in the Wonderbolts.

>>30608470
Applejack's Aunt is a rich bitch in Manehattan.

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>>30608520
>you
>a mage
First, you have to be gifted and second you have to be genius.

That is if you wanna be a mage like Twilight Sparkle and Poochielight Garbage. Otherwise you're just gonna be like Trixe, making some small fireworks and illusions.

>>30608575
>Tirek would never have been able to reach them, along with Sombra
Airships(like in the upcoming movie), air balloons, magic, etc. All the villains had several ways to get up into the sky. But they didn't care to do so because no one cares about clouds, plus the heroines stop them before they really get started in conquering the entire world. Pegasi wouldn't be safe up in the sky forever, plus it's not like hiding from supervillains is a very impressive ability anyways. But I guess that's what the majority of cowardly Pegasi would do, hide, while the Unicorns and Alicorns, the horned master race, actually work to keep the world safe from evil invaders.

>>30608605
Trixie is learning real magic and doing so real quick. With a small lesson she mastered transformation magic with the teacups. If a Unicorn focuses on magic instead of some random job like making dresses and has a competent teacher their potential is unlimited. Master race!

>>30608817
Airships that would be completely susceptible to the pegasi's ability to create storms and tornados? There's no shame in building an impenetrable fortress, it's a lot more than any unicorns have, even with two Alicorns protecting them. All the magic in the world and unicorns still get their asses kicked by a couple of shapeshifters.

Plus, I mean, if the fortress can move as well, which it can, I don't see how anyone can realistically stop them.

>>30608817
Unicorn magic hasn't stopped a single major villain and you know it.
NMM: Elements
Discord: Elements
Chrysalis: True love debatably Alicorn magic
Sombra: Crystal Heart
Plundervines: Tree of Harmony
Tirek: Rainbow Power
Glimmer: Mob Rule
Glimmer again: Rational Discussion
The Crystalling: You got me here.
Chrysalis again: Love, once again

Celestia and Luna have also been more than useless on every one of these occasions save the Crystalling.

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>>30608857
>Airships that would be completely susceptible to the pegasi's ability to create storms and tornados?
Not if they're guarded by a powerful magic user, any season final villain wouldn't be trumped by weather, and a glorious master race unicorn would defeat them Easy As Pie. It's Twilight, the glorious horned one, that will lead her friends to victory, while the cowardly winged ponies stay away.

Honestly, I was kind of trolling in calling the Pegasi cowards, just trying to get a rise out of you. But when I think about it it's actually pretty rare for Cloudsdale to get involved in the semi-regular world saving that needs to be done. Maybe they really are cowards.

>>30608969
>But when I think about it it's actually pretty rare for Cloudsdale to get involved in the semi-regular world saving that needs to be done.

All of the cities are absent when the world needs saving, Cloudsdale is hardly unique in this. You never hear of Manehatten or Salt Lick City coming to the rescue either. Mostly because all the world saving takes place in one city, mostly.
The fact that Tirek took the pegasi's magic at all shows that the majority of them were at least willing to try and stop him.

Be honest with me, friend. Is there any point in refuting your other points, or is it all trolling at this point?

>>30608135
>Can bulk up to crazy levels

Bulk biceps doesn't appear to be any stronger than smaller ponies like rainbow dash or applejack.

>>30609017
>Is there any point in refuting your other points
Magic is objectively superior to flight. I'm sorry. But you can't refute this.

>>30609054
And the poor guy has to work several jobs to get by. So it's not like the extra big body is giving him any benefits.

Reminder that Rarity, a fucking bog standard Unicorn, was able to control the weather in magical mystery cure.


Also, compare the exceptional ponies of each race:
Applejack is the pinnacle of earth ponies that we've seen: is able to do jack shit.
Starlight glimmer is the pinnacle of Unicorns: literally a virtual god.

>>30609081
>Rarity
Unicorns have magic relating to their cutie marks. Giving her Rainbow's gave her the ability to control the weather.

>Applejack is the pinnacle of Earth Ponies
Nowhere is it ever stated that Applejack is a powerful Earth Pony. You're only using her as an example because she's a mane character.

Besides, we've already established that the pinnacle of unicorns are the best, but that doesn't change the fact that the average unicorn is inferior to the average pegasi, and possibly even the average Earth Pony.

You know what? Fuck it. I had this exact same argument two days ago, I'm probably going to have it again in the next two days, I'm going to sit this one out.

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>>30609081
BOW DOWN TO THE MASTER RACE

>>30609124
>average unicorn is inferior to the average pegasi
Your average pegasi is shitty as well.

If you're using Pegasi at the Wonderbolt academy or whatnot instead of the bog standard shitty pegasi, you'd need to use the unicorns at Celestia's school as well.

You seem to forget that there's entire UNIVERSITIES of magically trained unicorns out there: Trixie is one of the SHITTIER magic uses who actually train at it.

>>30609149
I really enjoy the Celestia issues from the comics where she's trying to help the teachers and students in her schools.

>>30609256
>comics explore random lore and plot elements from the story
>show is generic in comparison
I'm just being honest, the comics open up an entire new realm of pony stuff.

>>30609279
legends of magic is going to be the theme for the second half of the season and have some stuff about what happened 1000 years ago.

>>30608265
Hold up

How does that even happen?
How do you get a ball UNDER the house so you have to lift it?

>>30609149
Every pegasi has the ability to fly. Some can't do it well, but every single one can. Every single pegasi can also control the weather, as evidenced by Hurricane Fluttershy. Even Derpy can control the weather. I'm not saying that the Wonderbolts are the base pegasi, I'm just saying things that are inherent to every pegasi.

The average unicorn knows maybe two spells, max, related to their cutie mark, as well as telekinesis. They can learn more, in the same way that a pegasi can train to fly faster or create tornados or join the Wonderbolts, but most don't. Every unicorn we've seen besides Trixie, Twilight and Sunburst didn't go to magic university. Most of them just aren't in the same level as someone who can fly and make thunderbolts. A random pegasi off the street has more utility and magic than a random unicorn off the street.
I mean, remember that even Trixie, for all her training and education, was still stuck breaking rocks in the middle of nowhere after she couldn't use her talent.

Reminder that unicorns are limited by their cutie marks, just like other races. Trixie has an abstract cutie mark. That she learns new spells that quickly is proof that her cutie mark falls into the "talent is magic" category, which is considered a very rare talent among unicorns. As such, Trixie is not a good example of "the average unicorn" in terms of potential for unicorns in general.

>>30609314
by lifting the house and letting the ball roll underneath

>>30608225
Oh great.
A thinly veiled class war thread.

Let me guess. You don't care which side you are on and just want to see the thread burn.

SAGE

>>30607689
Farming, industrial work, craftsmanship, clerical work, service jobs, etc.
Literally any work that does not involve flying or spells.

>>30607689
ABSOLUTELY NOTHING
(say it again)

>>30607689
One Earth pony is completely useless. On personall level, they are simply inferior to both pegasi and unicorns. They just lack certain abilities and have nothing to compensate for it. They don't have super strength (even if on average they are a little stronger) and sure as hell they don't have any kind of better endurance.

But as a whole they are pretty important. They aren't only ones that can grow food, but they can grow it so much and so cheap that on whole nation level it's gigantic advantage. Equestria probably never had widespread starvation, quite common in early times of humanity. Big part of their economy comes from agriculture and selling their food to other nations. Even their peace comes probably from other nations being dependent on their food.

As a whole they are important, but it would really suck to be earth pony.
Frankly who would be want to be earth pony? Some kind of faggot?

>>30609055
nah flight is superior a priori

>>30607689
In the comics? Fuck knows.
In canon? They are the ones who make plants grow and ensures Equestria isn't a barren wasteland like Badlands, dragon lands, Griffonstone or the Frozen North. They also appear to be the most technologically inclined, from pedal-powered helicopters to advanced conveyor-belt systems built from household items.

>>30610315
Nope.

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Infinite patience for unemployed apes who try venting daily frustrations on them

If there were no Earth ponies then Equestria would starve. The other races CAN grow food, yes that is true. But Earth ponies are able to produce so much food that they can sustain 3 races and perhaps even more.

The real power of earth ponies is that they can live anywhere no matter the environment

Like pinkies family live in a quarry farming rocks. They eat the rocks

Ponyville was founded next to the everfree forest full of monsters and shit.

And there are the swamp ponies applejack makes delivery's to.

Earth pones don't care, they're like honey badgers to environmental dangers

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Thanks to Earth ponies there is need for technological advancement, and in the show we're shown Earth ponies doing this work.

Thanks to Earth ponies there Equestria is producing overwhelming amount of food with low energy input.

Thanks to Earth ponies Equestria has an large pool from which to draw both massive amounts of labour and recruits for warfare.

Earth ponies are the hardiest of all races, they are the pioneers you send to colonize an area — a think that is hinted throughout the show. Even Ponyville were founded by a family of Earth ponies.

Thanks to them lacking certain magic abilities, most likely all types of magical abilities, they've had to teach themselves other means to survive. Which seem to of been the main force behind why Equestria ever grew to an Empire under the guidance of the two eternal sisters.

>>30607689
Doing all the scut work and spending their money in shops to perpetuate the oppression of the consumer economy. In short, they exist to pay bills and die.

>>30610899
This. Basically you can look at Harry potter and compare. Where the Wizards are basically still living in the medieval ages and the muggles are creating all kinds of technological shit.

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>>30611036

They're trapped in the decadency of their own minds, their prison guard is their self-perception of their own worth bolstered by their magic abilities.

>>30611131
What do I search for to see pics like these?

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Made for breeding.

>>30611139

I search on pony name + drawing or + epic drawing or + fanart and then I venture through the wast vistas of the internet.

>>30610899
>>30611036
>>30611131

Not really. It looks like earth ponies are as stagnant as other ponies, or even more.

If there is something pushing ponies forward it's magic, not tech, they lack even basic technology in some fileds but use magic instead. Even if they are stagnant and slow to develop they still really on magic instead of tech.

Most of high-tech things in the show can't be really technology because ponies lack those kind of things, so they must be purelly magicall.
We saw technologicall inventions made by Flim and Flam (unicorns) and Pinkie (Pinkie, not really argument)


Also Earth Ponies look more traditionall than other races, they are even more stagnant than others. (Winter Wrap Up, or big traditionall families like Apples or Pinkie family).
Their aren't any more innovative than pegasi or unicorns.

>>30611237
Have you seen Manehattan?

>>30611237
>magicall
>technologicall
>traditionall
why the double L?

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It doesn't matter what race you are. Ponies don't think like us Humans and their culture is totally different. Besides, the real masterrace are Alicorns anyway.

>>30611294
Reminder that Clio is a mare
And is ready to be bred

>>30607689
The show suggests that they may have a greater degree of strength and stamina than other races, making them better suited for heavy labor and whatnot. They are responsible for the vast majority of agricultural/industrial output in Equestria after all.

>>30611237

I protest due to the numerous examples of technology manned, maintained, developed, and built by Earth ponies. You see it throughout the show, some examples you've mentioned.

The society is for sure stagnant, but the Earth ponies seems to be the least stagnant ones of all the races. Out of necessity they have to, they lack the cheat button of their world: magic.

Traditional != uncreative, unproductive, lacking in conscientiousness, mechanically inept, and etc..

>>30611237
>If there is something pushing ponies forward it's magic, not tech, they lack even basic technology in some fileds but use magic instead.
On the contrary, magic and technology are often inseparable from each other. Firefly-powered x-ray machines, hoof-powered advanced conveyor belt systems, magic-disabling devices you walk through to enter the Equestria games, etc.
Magic as we know is inherent to all races, and exists in numerous forms and shapes.

>Most of high-tech things in the show can't be really technology because ponies lack those kind of things, so they must be purelly magicall.
Unsubstantiated claim. Magic and technology can and often does coexist, and is what drives their industry forward.
Flim & Flam's machine is both magical and technological. why isn't Pinkie's machine an argument? What about Tank? What about the giant vehicles the CMC build for the race through Ponyville? The conveyor belt in Crystal War timeline? Construction cranes? Hydroelectric dams?

>Also Earth Ponies look more traditionall than other races
Explain. Earth ponies themselves, or?
Earth pony fashion is easily the most varied of the three races, and while pegasus fashion doesn't lack a real world equivalent, unicorn fashion trends towards late 1880's Victorian fashion.
Earth ponies in Manehattan wear attire more typical to early pre-war 1900's city slicker, Appleloosans are of course Wild West and late 1800's inspired, etc.
And how is any of that relateable to "tradition"?
What exactly is your argument here?

>Winter Wrap Up
Summer Sun Celebration, Hearts & Hooves, Running of the Leaves, Nightmare Night.
With the exception of Running of the Leaves, all are decidedly older non-earth pony traditions.
>or big traditionall families like Apples or Pinkie family
I'm sorry, what?

>Their aren't any more innovative than pegasi or unicorns.
Your conclusion doesn't match your presented case.
Are Earth ponies MORE stagnant than other races, or are they AS innovative as other races?

>>30611315
What episode is this suggested in?
Episodes like Fall Weather Friends suggest they have exactly the same degree of strength and stamina as other races.

>>30611247
Yeah, it's using modern architecure. But only thing that shows us is that Manehattan is younger city.
Canterlot couldn't be build using medieval technology, and it's old city, so ponies must have some magic that allows them to built that kind of structures. Again it isn't technology. Maybe they can use magic to fuse bricks together, so they have similar properities to concrete?
Aside form architecture we don't really see that much. They have street lights, but they also appear in other cities. They have some modern buildings, but than we have cities like Las Pegasus that are as modern as Manehattan.
Also only factory that we seen is located in Cloudsdale and manned by pegasi

>>30611268
I dunno

>>30611323
Really? What specifically?

>flim flam machine - unicorns
>weather factory - pegasi
>some weird computer machine - Twilight
>mixing table - vinyl

What tech is developed and manned by earth ponies? Trains? The most advanced things are almost purelly magicall, because they are century or two too advanced for ponies tech level, so they couldn't be constructed by earth ponies. And even if we talk about more utilitarian and widespread products earth ponies still aren't really more advanced than others.

>>30611351

Helicopters.

Central heating.

Plumbing.

I can go on.

Earth ponies still have access to hammer space, and some magic (pinkie, cheese Sandwich), they are super strong (Maud, that tiny filly). Also they have monopoly on growing things like food, or magical gems. And inborn sense about stuff. Like they have magical gut feeling that is so good that they fallow what they feel like they should do to a point of detrement.

I would not say that destroying a mountain with your bare hooves is useless ability. The extra durability and stamina are nice additions too.
>>30609055
Pegasus also control the weather. Being able to blast things with lightning , while hiding in the clouds is on par with what most unicorns can do. And even if you compere top tier spell casters vs top tier pagasi, going over the speed of sound can stand against most non-alicorn tier magic.

>>30611376
And those things are developed by earth ponies, right?

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>>30611351
>Really? What specifically?
pic related. Just the first thing that came to my mind.

>The most advanced things are almost purelly magicall
Wrong. The most advanced things are always a combination of both.

>because they are century or two too advanced for ponies tech level
Likewise, their devices are "a century or two" too advanced for what magic alone can accomplish. That's why Flim & Flam's machine is so revolutionary, not because it's "purelly magicall", but because it combines technological and magical elements to push the frontier of the possible one or two centuries forward.

>so they couldn't be constructed by earth ponies
Earth ponies as we've confirmed have access to magic in various forms, including their unique earth pony magic.

>And even if we talk about more utilitarian and widespread products earth ponies still aren't really more advanced than others.
What products? Products like grown food, or?
I'm curious to even know what metrics you're going to apply when you're making this comparison, so please be diligent when you line those out.

>>30611348
Well, I'll start by saying that Dash is clearly exceptional among the Pegasus caste. I do believe that their athletic capabilities, in terms of speed and agility, are probably much higher.
I didn't base that off of any particular episode, so I guess my claim is ill-supported... I just gathered that Earth ponies seemed to be better built for pulling laboring from any of the episodes that depicted them doing it, like Winter Wrap-Up.

Anyway, the root of my point was that Earth Ponies, whether it be due to their abilities or their upbringing, seem to generally be the largest population of physical laborers in Equestria, and they generally goo at what they do. Their biggest contribution among the races appears to be food production. Earth ponies make food, Pegasi plan the weather, Unicorns.. do pretty much everything in between.

>>30611399
My gosh, that was horribly written... I need to stop posting while drunk...

>>30611389

Most likely.

Lacking magic to fly or heat your floor, even to swiftly dispose huge amounts of sewage, deposit the nature of the solution in different mechanisations than magic.

Despite Earth ponies using magic as an component in some of their machines, in helicopters magic would be the power source (I'd guess), they're still responsible for the creation of such an invention.

>>30611388
They don't have super strength. We saw them do some shit, but those things were mostly related to their cutie marks.
Meanwhile Running of the Leaves or Iron Pony cometition show that they aren't really stronger or more durable then other ponies.

>>30611392
Maybe I worded my thoughts in wrong way. I advocate that earth ponies aren't more innovative or technologically focused than other ponies. Most advanced things that we seen, like Twilight's computer or mixing table, can't be pure tech because they simply lack tech to produce tech to produce those things. They don't have microprocessors or advanced electronics. So big parts of them must by constructed via magic, thus probably they're built by unicorns. Yes some parts of them are technology, but their tech can be used only to some extent, after that they need to use magic.
While both earth ponies and pegasi have magic, it's more passive than active so I don't think that they would be able to construct those things.

>What products? Products like grown food, or?
I thought more about things used by everyone, not some magitech, but things like lights, AGD, shit like that.

And again I think that Pinkie isn't valid argument because she simply lacks any kind of consistency and logic. So no matter what arguments you use and how they match rest of the show, they still can be destroyed by her because she's simply Pinkie.

>>30611409
So they may or may not be related to earth ponies. Heating would be bigger problem for pegasi unless they have some kind of cold resistance. They still don't have plumbing in less advanced cities, and in big places like Cantrelot or Manehattan it would be easier to use magic to resolve those problems. Also plumbing or heating aren't really that advanced, problems start when you try to apply them to bigger population, like let's say whole city.
>helicopters magic would be the power source
they used pedals in helicopter, maybe they have some magic in it so it's lighter or something?

>>30607689
They're willing to do the hard work that Unicorns think they're too good for. Pegasie are too preoccupied with their weather jobs, or being Wonder Bolts.

>>30611399
>Well, I'll start by saying that Dash is clearly exceptional among the Pegasus caste.
So is Applejack. When she competed in the rodeo tournament she won a LOT of second places. She's a real Applejack of all trades. According to Dash herself in Applebuck Season, Applejack is Ponyville's best athlete (because Dash herself is more of an aerobatic).

>I just gathered that Earth ponies seemed to be better built for pulling laboring from any of the episodes that depicted them doing it, like Winter Wrap-Up.
I'm not so sure that's very indicative. Obviously most earth ponies are going to be much better at pulling than Twilight, most ponies overall would beat a bookworm like her.
But keep in mind the two most muscular ponies we've seen in the show are pegasi. Bulk Biceps and his female counterpart. And that flying is very taxing, too.
If there was any sort of racial bias favoring earth ponies, why do the ones serving in the royal guard look indistinguishable from their unicorn and pegasus counterparts? Same amount of armor, same weaponry, identical body structure and muscle mass, etc. The only guards who stand out are night guards and a few pegasi guards who skimp out on the "saddle" and typically serve as messengers.

>my point was that Earth Ponies, whether it be due to their abilities or their upbringing
Innate abilities I don't buy. But upbringing, sure. But what happens if you average out across the entire population?
Ponyville has a lot of earth pony farmers, those are stronger and better exercised than the Canterlot elites clearly (who are an almost perfect 33.3% split between the three races, BTW), and ponies like Cherilee, Mr and Ms Cake, etc. bring down the average a bit. But then you have Manehattan, a primarily earth pony city that's already done away with most heavy labor in favor of producing (and consuming) luxury. Aunt Orange and her crew are obviously going to be less exercised than pegasus weather workers, or even their skilled unicorn servants.

>>30611448

True, the problem aggregates effects quicker in larger social environments such as cities.

Ah well, I'm going to use an cheap get away to explain why Earth ponies in less developed areas aren't installing heating or plumbing. They're rural and won't afford luxuries that will demand an massive overhead, pumping stations and waste water treatment plants. They'll happily dispose of their waste untreated in nature, or reuse it on the fields (Which is tremendously retarded due to the risk of spreading parasites and diseases via food distribution).

Maybe. You're pointing at the fact that Equestria is rather technological backwards, no micro-processors and the tools required to produce them, why magic explains computers. Certain computer components can be produced with rather simple technologically and chemical process, the actual processing power and storage is most plausibly facilitated through magically imbued gemstones containing sophisticated magical matrices perhaps interacting with mundane natural phenomenon such as magnetism. What is there to claim that Earth ponies doesn't deploy magic for other uses for helicopters?

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>>30611448
>So big parts of them must by constructed via magic, thus probably they're built by unicorns.
Why? Every race has magic. Are you suggesting the weather factory was built by unicorns rather than pegasi as well?

>Yes some parts of them are technology, but their tech can be used only to some extent, after that they need to use magic.
This goes both ways. Magic can only do so much, a few short teleports or a wing-spell and even a high-level unicorn has to go lie down for a while, while an airship can carry ponies and cargo back and forth all day.

>While both earth ponies and pegasi have magic, it's more passive than active so I don't think that they would be able to construct those things.
But we've seen many examples of them constructing such things.

>I thought more about things used by everyone, not some magitech
So... Like... Food, then. In the words of Twilight: "You eat hay! I eat hay! We ALL eat hay!"
>but things like lights
Mostly fireflies, often candles, occasionally oil.
I'm pretty sure no pony farts out fireflies, wax is organic and therefore farmed, oil can be excavated or produced organically through farming.
>AGD, shit like that.
What?

>And again I think that Pinkie isn't valid argument because she simply lacks any kind of consistency and logic.
She seems very consistent to me, except maybe in how she's written by new writers.
But whatever, as people have pointed out we have many other examples of Earth pony feats and technology.
This one, for example. For a 4-pony team the refinement and production rate on that machine is pretty damn impressive, especially considering how rickety and improvised it looks.

If I had to choose, I would go for a Earth Pony wife. Best body, best values and she could probably cook.

But if I would choose what race to be, Pegasus.

So in conclusion, Unicorns are low tier.

>>30611653
My point wasn't that earth ponies are completely technologicaly inept, but that they aren't really more advanced than other ponies. We also have many examples of technology used by pegasi or unicorns.

>This goes both ways. Magic can only do so much
Yeah but things like X-ray machines or twilight's computer are probably hoof made, not produced in some big factories. And I don't see the could be constructed by either pegasi or earth ponies. So it PROBABLY needs unicorn to add final magic to tech in it.
Weather factory uses weather magic so it could be very well constructed by pegasi.
I mean they maybe other races are also capable of constructing things that needs advanced magic? Who knows. But this still doesn't mean that earth ponies have some kind of technological affinity.

>What?
freezers, heaters, electric lights all that jazz. Those things could be made by anyone be it earth pony, pegasi or unicorn. Again no proof that earth ponies are more technological.

>She seems very consistent to me
Not really, I mean she breaks physic, and her behaviour often can't be really explained, so you can either left it as it is, or try to bring it into discussion where you try to explain something. Using Pinkie simply breaks whole point of discussing anything because you can't really discuss her.


>>30611576
Plumbing isn't only related o earth ponies, small unicorn communities (if they exist) probably don't have it too. But in big cities you can use magic to make process more efficent. So it's either lack of plumbing or plumbing with some kind of magic helping it.

And in case of helicopter it isn't really earth pony related. At least we have no proof. It's powered by pedals, so unless they have different physic, they need to put some magic to make it fly. Maybe some games imbued with pegasi magic to make it lighter, or something? We don't really know.

>>30611738

The point behind the existence of the helicopter is that it is technical in nature to provide an service that can be acquired with wings or magic. Why, if you have wings or magic would you need a helicopter (Assuming no ontological privation)? Earth Ponies.

Their very existence puts pressure to develop non-magical technology; which happened regardless of the state of the Equestrian society we're shown in the show due to the history of the three tribes as separate communities hardly interacting beyond necessity.

>>30611763

>Why, if you have wings or magic would you need a helicopter
transporting bigger cargo?
not every unicorn can fly?
ther was demand so someone ivented it? doesn't mean that earth pony did it


>Their very existence puts pressure to develop non-magical technology
yes and no, after unification they had acces to both pegasi and unicorn developments. Need for non magic technology was mostly in smaller hamlets and settlements because they still didn't have access to magic. But guess what, universities are in big cities, so in places where actually most of development happened there wasn't really pressure from earth ponies because they had easy access to magitech.


In terms of everyday utilities pegasi are in similar position as earth ponies, they can fly and manipulate weather and clouds, but they still have same need for non magic tech. And technology progress in Equestria same as magic. It's a lot slower than on earth but it happens regardless, even if pegasi and earth ponies didn't exist, unicorns still would develop their tech alongside magic. Maybe even faster than now, because there would be actual demand for it without other races providing some services.


There isn't any proof that earth ponies have some kind of stronger relation to tech than other ponies. It would be more likely for other races, like minotaurs or diamond dogs.

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>>30611840
Again, Manehattan.

>>30611911
>Las Pegasus
>Canterlot (Old architecture, but whole construction is really advanced)

again earth ponies no more advanced than others

>>30611840

Teleportation spells solves that.

Too small a number of handicapped pegasi and unicorns to of facilitated any major or lasting technological progress. Although this might explain the dearth of consistence technological progress in Equestria.

Magic solves the issue of transportation, and without the need to refine raw resources. It would be the endeavour of the unicorn with foresight to develop many mundane inventions of essential non-magical nature.

It is natural for the group who is experiencing the issue attempting to solve it. This is proof but this adds to my interpretation that Earth ponies did cause and/or lead the technological progression in Equestria.

I'm speaking exclusively before unification in the case of before any major technological exchange.

True, pegasi are in similar terms of Earth ponies but they come off as rather uninterested in producing much of the machines we've seen used by Earth ponies.

I suggest that we have three different technological trees of progression for each race, with crossovers.

I do not see such an spurt in technology without the two non-magic races (Non-magic as non-casters). Any technology is likely to be produced in low number of units, for specific personal reasons of the user, and any utility used for the endeavouring spell caster or student of magic would be mass produced using replication spells.

As an aside, to explain why I'm sure that unicorns wouldn't develop technology beyond intellectual pursuits. After playing endless high-magic D&D campaigns anything that can be solved with magic will be solved by magic. It is efficient, it is close to fool proof, it is low in overhead, and you have less hands involved. There are however major drawbacks to such a society. And any circumstance were magic would not be efficient one would see technology fill out its spot.

>>30607689

I know most people will say strength, and I'm sure they're capable of being stronger than unicorns or pegasi, but no one's mentioned yet that they can carry objects with their tail and basically use it as a fifth appendage. I remember reading this from the MLP Wiki but I might be wrong so if someone can confirm or deny my theory that'd be helpful.

>>30611937
I don't think you know much about city building.

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>>30611988
>earth ponies have the strongest tails
>ergo they have the biggest, meatiest docks
fetish assimilated

>>30611954
>Teleportation spells solves that.
How many unicorns we seen that can teleport?
And how many of them can teleport with cargo?
Not every unicorn is Twilight level. And even Twilight needs normal utilities, like heating, plumbing or freezer. And I don't think that she just uses spell every time she wants to take a dump. Unicorns have similar needs to others, and 99% of them can't just do magic, and resolve their problems. And without other races they would actually need to develop agriculture, magical or not. Each race have needs for non magical tech, unicorns not as much as others, but pegasi provide similar stimulant as earth ponies, so again earth ponies aren't speciall in this regard.


And about your D&D experince, we are speaking about whole society, not a sole caster, so it works dfferent.
My point again, while earth ponies probably developed quite a lot of things, pegasi and unicorns also developed a lot, not only magicaly but also technologicaly, earth ponies don't have any speciall affinity to tech.

And we don't really know about their societies before unification, but from what we know, earth ponies didn't have any speciall tech, simply because it looked like early medieval times, so most of population lived without basic necessities, they focused more on survival tha on developing marvles of technology, while unicorns and pegasi to some extent could avoid a lot of their problems. So before unfication I think earth weren't in position to develop their society.

>>30612033
Simply because their architecture looks more modern it doesn't mean that technology used to create it is more advanced. It means that city is younger. Canterlot couldn't be build without either advanced tech or magic. And Las Pegasus looks pretty modern to me.

>>30611954
>high-magic D&D campaigns
That's where you went wrong. MLP is nothing like D&D, and takes more cues from modern sci-fi influenced fantasy.

In MLP magic is:
rarely efficient (A high-level unicorn's flight spell is a poor, fragile and very straining copy of any pegasus' flight, Rarity's flight is even worse than Fluttershy's. A high level unicorn struggling to sprout a single flower while earth ponies grow entire rows without breaking sweat)
never fool-proof (see: Winter Wrap Up, Swarm of the Century, Lesson Zero, Hearts & Hooves Day, Twilight Time...)
not low in overhead (see: any time a unicorn gets exhausted after casting a spell)
Additionally, unicorn magic always comes with a limitation. Rarity's wings and the cloudwalk spell lasted a day, the transformed mice in Best Night Ever would return at dawn, the breezie transformation, etc.

You can see where this is going.
In order to for example allow one unicorn to fly almost on par with a poor pegasus (which, spread out over a day, is less taxing than extended teleportation) you need one high-level unicorn casting the spell every day (Twilight was so exhausted she couldn't cast it more than once, hence the cloudwalk), and one unicorn with a very good physique to actually flap the wings.
Or, a unicorn using unicorn magic to grow plants can't sustain himself, his daily yield is far too small.

In MLP, a high level unicorn mage wins out in versatility and adaptability. A well-studied unicorn will be able to recall a spell that gets the job done so-so in almost any scenario, but the unicorn will never be as efficient, fool-proof or low in overhead as a specialized solution. See for example the episode where Starlight befriends Trixie. In the beginning of the episode she tries hanging out with Dash, who wants to introduce her to Spitfire and the other wonderbolts.
Despite Starlight's great magical repertoire and knowledge of teleportation, she literally can't keep up when Dash speeds away at hypersonic speeds.

>>30607709
Only correct answer here.

>>30607689
Specialization.

In the past nobles and soldiers could've theoretically work the land but peasants were far more numerous and wouldn't tire after a lifetime being peasants while the nobles and soldiers would clearly have less time for their own activities, i.e. nobity and war stuff.

tl;dr - lifestyle.

>>30612197
So what do they specialize in now, when exactly one third of Canterlot's nobles are earth ponies, and exactly one third of Equestria's guards are earth ponies?

>>30612069

I do not see where I went wrong, you're specific cases and applying them to the state of magic and magic wielders in general.

Magic is portrayed highly inconsistent and so too is the casting of magic. Why I'd argue that your retort apply on specific cases and do not work as an general rebuttal of this transcription of mine from D&D to MLP.

Nothing in the spell used by Rarity is related to other suchlike spells. What we saw there either were a spell very mundane in terms of magic or highly difficult for reasons unspecified.

In several episodes the magic is so efficient that Pinkie Pie is able to copy herself with ease and no training. The fact that it's an magic pool does not in anyway matter, since it is magic and it does a specific thing.

Either magic is only as efficient as the mind that formed it could muster or magic is a fleeting thing.

Celestia and Luna does raise the moon and the sun consistently every day — no minor feat.

Twilight can teleport at will with no issues. She seem to mostly experience difficulties casting a spell for first time, after that its basically done by rote memory.

Discord enchant items and change reality snapping his fingers.

Again, I see no rebuttal in your argument but specific cases where it's shown to be part of their reality that magic is tricky.

This is why I maintain that without the non-casters there would be little or consistent technological progress that could, if it happened in the current state of their world, be called an golden era of technological invention.

This is why I dislike the writers behind MLP: they do not treat the world and its magic with care or consistency.

>>30610093
One
Two
(yeah)

>>30612235
There are no Earth pony guards. There are Earth pony police though.

>>30612248
>Magic is portrayed highly inconsistent and so too is the casting of magic.
Are you talking about unicorn magic, or magic in general?
I can see now where the confusion arises, I should have been clearer in my post. I took it from granted by the context we were discussing unicorn magic specifically, not magic in general.

Unicorn magic and the casting thereof is fairly consistent with other unicorn magic, pegasus magic is very consistent, alchemy is rather consistent, earth pony magic is a bit of a mystery.

>Nothing in the spell used by Rarity is related to other suchlike spells.
If I'm not mistaken, Rarity only uses two spells in addition to telekinesis. One for finding gems, one for mending branches (and, I suspect, torn cloth).
Which spell are you talking about, exactly?
>In several episodes the magic is so efficient that Pinkie Pie is able to copy herself with ease and no training.
Not unicorn magic. The pool is a natural phenomena. It's heavily specialized and copies Pinkie a LOT better than unicorn magic ever did.
>Either magic is only as efficient as the mind that formed it could muster or magic is a fleeting thing.
Unicorn magic is both, but not all types of magic is unicorn magic.
Pegasus magic by comparison seems to be much harder to control, with a tendency to spiral dramatically out of control when a pegasus fails to bend a storm to her will, judging by often tornadoes and magical singularity-storms and the like spiral out of control.
>Celestia and Luna does raise the moon and the sun consistently every day — no minor feat.
Not unicorns.
And that goes for the rest of the examples you listed.

>his is why I dislike the writers behind MLP: they do not treat the world and its magic with care or consistency.
It's not all just "Arcane magic, wizards get 9th level spells, bards get 6th level" in MLP, there are dozens of different types of magic, each one internally consistent with itself and magic of it's type, each one distinct from the rest.

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>>30612248
>Celestia and Luna does raise the moon and the sun consistently every day — no minor feat.
not our sun and moon, theirs are many, many times closer to planet (moves instantlly when they use magic), so they needs to be many times smaller, probably not even real star

Still rather hard, but it could be done by bunch of unicorns without special affinity towards it

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>>30612343
What have you been smoking? The official name for royal guards is E.U.P guard, the Earth, Unicorn and Pegasus guard.

>>30612350

So far they've only inferred there's one source of magic, the differences arise from the wielder and circumstance (Natural phenomenon or by a mind).

When I'm pointing at an inconsistency I'm referring to the power level of the many casters they've shown us, and effect.

This also one think I've seen little development on, the innate thumatic abilities of either race. Earth ponies comes off as very much lacking in any magic ability.

I'm speaking about data points to draw reliable inferences on regarding complexity of Rarity's spell of butterfly wings.

I don't even remember if it were a natural phenomenon or different from unicorn magic. My point is about inconsistency,if magic can coalesce, become persistent, then magic is not much a violate as one might assume. However, there are many examples when it is a force wilder than a dragon.

I do not see the difference you're making, I only see magic employed differently and races with innate magic abilities that varies.

Yeah, Pegasus magic seems to be harder to control.

Sure, they're Alicorns, beings attune to magic, but still they've been kicked about by other casters as if they're, the sisters, are weaker than one would assume from how the writers sold them both as powerful magic wielders. Again, the inconsistency.

Would not argue such an rigid interpretation, there's differences between both 'system', and there's little evidence for such a magical hierarchy. It's fluid and seem to be dependant on the wielder and innate abilities more than anything else. If so I fail to see why technology would be given a kick in its behind without pure non-casters.

>>30612385

Is this confirmed?

Magic can have no travel time or travel time (I'd guess); again I think this is the limitation applied by the mind of the caster and not much as an trait of magic itself.

We saw Twilight doing this and it took a toll on her.

>>30612529
>Magic can have no travel time or travel time

Even if (I doubt it), light still needs 8 minutes to travel from sun to earth, so even if sun moved instantly after spell, it would still take 8 miutes for ponies to see it. Thus their "sun" is a lot closer to planet and needs to be a lot smaller. (Like thousands times closer and smaller)

>>30612529
>So far they've only inferred there's one source of magic
Where and when? And what is that source?

>When I'm pointing at an inconsistency I'm referring to the power level of the many casters they've shown us, and effect.
There's no real inconsistency to speak of, because this isn't D&D. There's no "Contingency" you can cast to save the day forever and ever, and any magician, regardless of powerlevel, is still a mortal and can be ambushed, backstabbed or assassinated by any "lesser".

>Earth ponies comes off as very much lacking in any magic ability.
You need to pay more attention. Earth ponies have a near-constant and very widespread magical ability. Note for example how they managed to build Appleloosa and turn in one HELL of a harvest in literally less than a year. Also note how much of a barren wasteland the surrounding area is.

>Rarity's spell of butterfly wings.
That was Twilight's spell.

>if magic can coalesce, become persistent, then magic is not much a violate as one might assume.
SOME forms of magic can. Not ALL forms of magic. Alchemy can be bottled and kept on a shelf for weeks, months or years, while unicorn magic rarely if ever lasts more than a day or two.

>I do not see the difference you're making
Yes you do. You admit as much yourself. You just fail to see they're different forms of magic and believe it's an inconsistency when it's not.

>the writers sold them both as powerful magic wielders.
Luna has been sold as a VERY powerful mage indeed, and they were poweful while they still could utilize Friendship magic, but they can't do that any more. But no magic makes you immortal or invulnerable. Again, this isn't D&D, a mage doesn't have abstracts like a large HP pool or high Saves to fall back on, they are for all intents and purposes mortal, everyday ponies who can conjure high energies through concentration.

>>30612656

So, it's a cold star then that's close to their world.

Or light works differently in their reality than ours?

>>30612695

They've not delved into this any further, so my observation that there's only one source of magic seems to be closer to canon.

I do not argue this is D&D, I'm using D&D only as an template in an loser sense than you're attempting to ascribe to my intent.

Celestia is battling Chrysalis straight on, no ambush, just two magic casters doing their best to defeat the other. Celestia is beaten down within seconds, an immortal (Or close to) Alicorn who had a millennium (Possible more) to learn and practise magic, yet she is defeated. Sorry, this is either poor writing or the writers attempting to add subtlety to the art of magic wielding.

That's no magic, that's them being good farmers being blessed with two fucking demigods (At least) and an army of weather shapers (Pegasi) controlling weather and climate.

They're good builders?

I'm denoting it as Rarity's spell because I'm lazily avoiding to point at Twilight all the time as the spell caster.

There's one source of magic; many forms of it. Like, water magic or fire magic — still magic expressed differently.

When they lost the power of friendship they just sizzled down to second tier casters who, when the enemy stands before them, are unable to throw up one magical barrier of similar strength that Twilight and Starlight manage to throw at-will whilst sparing?

They had a boon (Friendship magic) to their already pre-existing capabilities. I do not for once believe, after the writers selling them as big shots, they've managed to flounder away at least one thousands years to learn and understand magic, the experience of ruling (At least Celestia), to protect themselves and others from hidden and known dangers.

my interpretation of the rigidity of their world's magic is influenced by D&D not overwritten by D&D as to fail these simple conceptions of not being impervious.

>>30612888
Or it isn't star at all?
I mean their "sun" could be moved by few unicorns, without special talents in moving it. Even if they were powerfull uniconrs, it still couldn't be anything too big and too far to be moved by them.

Or no one moves their sun and all this is just a scam.

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>>30612888
>They've not delved into this any further, so my observation that there's only one source of magic seems to be closer to canon.
They literally talk about different magic types throughout the show, and for example when Tirek absorbs the magic from the ponies (and Discord), we can clearly see that the various types of magic even LOOKS different in it's rawest form.
So not only is your observation a logical fallacy, it's demonstrably faulty and not canon.

>Celestia is battling Chrysalis straight on
>this is either poor writing or the writers attempting to add subtlety to the art of magic wielding.
The latter. Celestia isn't an amazing unicorn mage, no matter how much experience she has (she rarely even uses unicorn magic to begin with, so even her "training" is questionable). We see a similar thing happen with Sunburst. He's extremely well-learned and studied magically, but lacks the raw abilities necessary to excel like Starlight, Twilight or hell, even Trixie.

>That's no magic, that's them being good farmers
I'm getting real tired of your shit. If you intend to keep this up, you must stop spouting such blatant nonsense.
Also, please show me the pegasi responsible for the weather in Appleloosa and it's surrounding area.

>There's one source of magic
You keep spouting this meme, but so far you've done nothing to demonstrate this is actually, canonically the case.
If there's but one source, what is that source?

>when the enemy stands before them, are unable to throw up one magical barrier of similar strength that Twilight and Starlight manage to throw at-will whilst sparing?
They can and do. Celestia isn't very good at it but she still does in the Crystal War timeline.
Why is this relevant to anything?

>I do not for once believe, after the writers selling them as big shots
When and where have they been sold as big shots? Outside of your headcanon, that is.

>>30612888
>>30613030
>contd.
>They had a boon (Friendship magic) to their already pre-existing capabilities
Friendship magic, as in, another type of magic? Different from unicorn magic and pegasus magic? Do you admit such a thing exists now all of a sudden?

>protect themselves and others from hidden and known dangers.
You really, REALLY need to start paying more attention. They do, to the full extent that it's possible within the universe, with MLP magic, in all it's forms, but without access to D&D magic.

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>>30613030
>Celestia isn't an amazing unicorn mage
Adding as a tangent to this, it's interesting to note that when Celestia banishes Daybreaker, she doesn't use her horn to channel dream-magic like Luna or most unicorns would, or as most bronies high on their own headcanon would except.
Rather, she channels it using her wings.

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>>30613030

I still do not see this as qualitatively different magic (As in several sources of magic that differs in their natural origin), there's different expression of magic.

Like how two different colours can be seen reflected in different instances from the surface of the same mater by simply manipulating it differently.

This is not an logical fallacy, this is an difference in the observation of expressed magic and their underlying source. I claim there's only ONE source for all magic, but the wielders, for a lack of better words, colour them or shape them for difference expressions in their world. You however claim the opposite without much proof.

Why should I assume that the Pegasi is not controlling the weather across Equestria?

My shit? And you hold your opinions as to be beyond bullshit?

They are good farmers, right? Is this due to an magic ability or their understanding of agronomy and agriculture?

That meme (Picture) proves what? That they're using magic or that plants, in certain conditions, grow fast? Or is she using magic seeds? I don't know, neither do you.

You can't even disprove this as non-canonical. You can argue all you want, using muh memes for different sources of magic. My claim is about equally valid as yours.

My argument were that the show lacks consistency in explaining magic via the characters, I use Celestia as one example of this. And she clearly doesn't care enough to protect herself to learn how to cast magic protection. I'm pointing out an inconsistency in your argument that she have apparently failed to learn enough under one millennia of ruling an empire in a world of magic.

I'm only arguing that these are different expression of magic drawn from one source of magic energies.

Be personal if you wish, I see little worth in such low behaviour.

If your answer is containing any bullshit, personal attributions or putting words in my mouth, I will pretty much tell you to go fuck yourself from that point on.

>>30612980

Perhaps you're right, it isn't a star but so far they're representing it as one. Albeit a tiny one (?) that isn't that hot (?). It would be awesome to know it is something else entirely in nature than a basic star.

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>>30613224
>This is not an logical fallacy
The fallacy is that you take your lack of observation and immediately conclude it must be "closer to canon".

>Why should I assume that the Pegasi is not controlling the weather across Equestria?
There's no hint of useful weather like rain in Appleloosa, and aside from Dash and Fluttershy, we only ever see Earth ponies.
If you claim they have an "army of weather shapers" at their back in Appleloosa, you should be able to back up this claim. Just a scene with a few background pegasi in Appleloosa will do.

>They are good farmers, right? Is this due to an magic ability or their understanding of agronomy and agriculture?
Magic ability. Understanding of agronomy and agriculture can be taught, growing plants like Earth ponies do in Appleloosa, >>30613030, pic related, or a few other instances is magic ability. No amount of agricultural understanding can do that.

>That they're using magic or that plants, in certain conditions, grow fast?
Plants cannot grow this fast without magic. It is literally and physically impossible. Magic MUST be involved at some level.
Similarly, apple trees cannot physically grow and bear a huge harvest in a wasteland in LESS THAN A YEAR after being planted, magic must be involved.
Let me quote your initial statement back, the one that is blatantly and demonstrably bullshit:
>That's no magic
At this point, your argument is on the level of:
>b-b-but how d-do you actually know unicorns use magic? It could be a tiny swarm of fireflies that lives in their mane and carries stuff around and does stuff for them! You can't even disprove this as non-canonical! muh memes muh memes, My claim is about equally valid as yours!

>>30613224
>>30613551
>cont'd.

>My argument were that the show lacks consistency in explaining magic via the characters, I use Celestia as one example of this.
But your example, and therefore argument, is invalid. There is no lack of consistency here.
>And she clearly doesn't care enough to protect herself to learn how to cast magic protection.
Please. Just stop. She knows how to cast magic protection and does so to protect herself. But she's not very good at it, seemingly not at Twilight's level, definitely not at Shining Armor's. Because as the show directly states there are different kinds of magic. Celestia isn't very talented at unicorn magic, and as the show so clearly spells out as early as Boast Busters and set in stone by The Crystalling, talent accounts for a LOT.
That's why she uses every other means available to her to protect herself and those she cares for. Like carefully planning every little detail for Luna's return, like using her precognitive abilities to sense Tirek and sending Discord after him. Like orchestrating the events leading to the liberation of the Crystal Empire, overruling Luna's decision that would have Luna join the charge along the mane6. etc.

>I'm only arguing that these are different expression of magic drawn from one source of magic energies.
What source is this? What supporting evidence do you have for this argument?

>Be personal if you wish, I see little worth in such low behaviour.
When that is all your argument is, it's simply unavoidable. If you make arguments drawn from your own imagination rather than the show, in order to address those arguments I must address your imagination and therefore you.

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>>30607689

>>30612235
>earth pony nobles
Representation and/or military service. In the past, nobility was bestowed upon becoming an accomplished veteran.
>guards
I reckon earth ponies are physically more arduous and so have greater stamina in running than pegsi have in flying while also being able to shake of physical assaults easily.

Also, at least one of them can dig through rock when angered.

>>30613551

I simply work to find enough evidence to the claim that there is many different types (As in different natures) of magic. I haven't found anything conclusive, why I don't add different types of magic but assume (Which is valid even without undeniable proof) there's only one source of raw magic.

In the show we've seen nothing that supports that Pegasis doesn't or do control the weather in Appleloosa. But there is nothing that claims that there is no interference of pegasis. Again, I do not see the proof, regardless if I'm wrong here, that Earth ponies used magic, any innate abilities or borrowed ones.

Well, that's pure conjecture from your side. What is there to bar the existence of plants growing that fast? None. Why would this defeat my argument that Earth ponies haven't used any innate magical ability or been helped from parties previously mentioned? None.

You assume their plants grow as they do here in our reality and evolved as our apple trees; you assume their plants have evolved to mimic the growth rate of the flora in our reality and on our planet. You assume that I'm wrong straight off based on little evidence — no evidence in fact. I don't assume that Applejack is using any magical abilities without strong proof. At best your argument is neutral to very weak.

Your weak little argument against my use of Celestia as a point of reference to show instances of inconsistency is just incredible. Yes, Celestia might not be very good at magic, or anything for that matter. Which I doubt since she have had at least one millennia to learn to defend herself with magic and through non-magic conventional means. We're not told that Celestia is a slacker, we do know she teaches magic, we know she studies a lot, she worries a lot, we know she is refereed to, directly or indirectly, as an powerful spell caster. Defeated by love, was it? Naa bad writing.

For your last points:

Kettle calls pot black.

Love you guys. I havn't been active on /mlp/ before and thought that the joke about autism was just an exaggeration...

And I have to it to since I find you conversation intresting. Hahahha.

Also I am really impressed with the very reasonable arguments. You guys truly sees how logic works. I mean you see when someone is cherry picking, you contruct arguments from premises that ddo imply the conclusion and so on.

I guess I should not refer to you on this thread as a collective nor did I really asume that you would not have reasonable arguments. They were just impressive. I didn't see the logical fallaices before they were pointed out in some of these cases.

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>>30613551

>b-b-but how d-do you actually know unicorns use magic? It could be a tiny swarm of fireflies that lives in their mane and carries stuff around and does stuff for them! You can't even disprove this as non-canonical! muh memes muh memes, My claim is about equally valid as yours!

This strawman has to be addressed separately.

Not only did you build an strawman, using that ludicrous representation of my argument, but you infer that to be extent I'm willing to go being sceptic. Mocking me without justification but out of needless emotional reaction to swipe at me, being this verbal brute is clearly below you.

I wish to make you perfectly aware that so far you've presented evidence, not proof, you've presented supporting data.

What I've done is using what we're actually shown, like in the showreel of Applejack pouring flower stand or fertilizer or whatever, and Occam's razor among other ways of logic. I do not see the unquestionable proof of magic performed by dear Applejack, or Earth ponies in, in the specific case brought up, Appleloosa.

There's several fallacious arguments I wish to avoid, such as the affirming a disjunct fallacy.

Neither do I have any hots for the oh so tired old bullshit of the fallacy of composition.

Or the McNamara fallacy.

Or the Drunkard's search.

>>30608043
My headcanon is that even though Earth Ponies can't use magic or fly, they were always physically stronger and fit then all the other races (excluding Alicorns). I like to picture a Unicorn blasting a gigantic energy blast at an earth pony, and the earth pony just deflects the blast like in DBZ. I also picture them to be really fast and be able to jump super fucking high, so that they can match a pegasus' speed.

>>30608166
WBs aren't elite guards. The original members were from the E.U.P. but nowadays its members are not part of the armed forces.

>>30613820
It is odd to see a legit discussion about the show and not have it turn into a shit-flinging competition on /mlp/.

>>30607689
Making more

>>30611988
Well Fluttershy and Rarity could do it as well but I think earth ponies are a lot more developed at it.

What would happen if an Earth pony wore the alicorn amulet?

>>30607689
ABSOLUTELY
NOTHING

>>30613768
>What is there to bar the existence of plants growing that fast? None.
Conservation of energy, for one. If energy was conserved the growth is so rapid you'd be able to see the ground freeze and water vapor condense as heat is absorbed to create the cellulose (among other things) necessary for building the plant. Of course that by itself would also be impossible by conventional physics, but whatever.

>You assume their plants grow as they do here in our reality and evolved as our apple trees
Indeed. If they're shown to not act according to conventional physics and biology, and have a faster metabolism than is physically possible, the only conclusion we can make is that their world must have another, hidden element or force to work with.
Ponies refer to this as magic.

>>30613768
>Yes, Celestia might not be very good at magic, or anything for that matter. Which I doubt since she have had at least one millennia to learn to defend herself with magic
But most ponies can't. No matter the amount of training. For most ponies it's literally impossible to defend themselves meaningfully with magic.
>Spike: Twenty-five, Twilight. Twenty-five different kinds of tricks and counting. I thought unicorns were only supposed to have a little magic that matches their special talents!
>Twilight Sparkle: True, for ponies whose talents are for things like cooking or singing or math. But what if a unicorn's special talent is magic?
>Spike: Like you, Twilight, and you know a ton of magic.
>Twilight Sparkle: Oh, Spike, stop. I'm sure there are lots of ponies right here in Ponyville that know just as much magic as me.
>Spike: Are you kiddin'? I don't think there's another unicorn in all of Equestria with your kind of ability, Twilight.
Spike is obviously wrong, there are maybe a handful unicorns with Twilight's kind of ability, but Celestia is clearly shown to not be one of them. Celestia has been shown to have "a little [unicorn] magic that matches her special talent", and therefore she can only ever create "small shields" by using unicorn magic. Which is exactly what we've been shown in the crystal war timeline for example.

>Starlight Glimmer: Sunburst, I don't care if you're a wizard or not. I'm just surprised. You always knew so much about magic. I mean, look at all these books!
>Sunburst: Yeah, well, reading about magic is one thing, but you don't know what it was like at magic school! To know so much and not be able to do any of it!
No matter how much Celestia reads, studies, teaches or practices, unless she has the right talent and has a lot of unicorn magic, she's straight out of luck.

>we know she is refereed to, directly or indirectly, as an powerful spell caster.
Where and when? What episode is this directly or indirectly stated in?

>>30613991
>you infer that to be extent I'm willing to go being sceptic.
That's the extent you ARE going, right now.

>I do not see the unquestionable proof of magic performed by dear Applejack, or Earth ponies in, in the specific case brought up, Appleloosa.
Yet you claim to see the exact opposite and make statements in the absolute. Again.
>That's no magic

>>30607689
glue

>>30613138
That actually is pretty interesting.

>>30613820
Don't be confused, this argument is hardly a new one. People have been arguing for and against racial supremacy ever since we saw Twilight and Applejack stand next to each other. We've heard all the arguments before, and I don't think there are any people left to convince to either side.

>>30617277
Put Applejack next to Rarity. Twilight is superior to everyone

>>30617309
I'm not comparing them, I'm just using that as an example of how far back this argument spans. Which is a bit of an exaggeration. It wasn't until Season 4 that the whole 'unicorn stronk' thing really started. I personally think it's because that's when Twilight's magic really started to get off the rails.

>Mud Magic!
This shit again?

Twilight teaches Apple Bloom alchemy to grow plants and flowers. If "Earth pony magic" grants them to do the same, WHY? Zecora, this time a zebra, is shown multiple times to do her magic through herbs and powder gathered from Everfree forest. So far the only pony channeling mud magic is Applejack. Once during a play and again during a song. Theres also two more ponies shown doing "mud magic". Apple Bloom made flower bloom during Cutie Pox. And Grannysmith doing several crazy things to make Zapapplejam editable. On both cases, the plants were magical themselves.

SO, we know there are magical plants in Equestria and that Applejack is the sole master Mud Magic. WHAT IF? What if Applejack is not an exception to the rules?

>buh muh e/u/p magic
Cutiemarks. Earth ponies have magic, since all the ponies have magic. They all have symbol of their fate branded on their butt.

>>30617705
>Twilight teaches Apple Bloom alchemy to grow plants and flowers. If "Earth pony magic" grants them to do the same, WHY?
It's an excellent entry point into the varied world of alchemy. You don't jump head first into the deep end, you start with something you're innately familiar and apply new techniques to it. The same applies to almost all arts and crafts. From painting to programming. If you know pencil and can sketch a person, the next step is to learn to watercolor a person, not watercolor a landscape.

>Once during a play and again during a song.
And once again in Apples to the Core, I'm sure there could be others I'm not remembering. Alicorn-twi (with access to earth pony magic, obviously) also makes a small garden sprout.

>Zecora, this time a zebra, is shown multiple times to do her magic through herbs and powder gathered from Everfree forest.
Partially incorrect.
Zecora uses alchemy, same as Apple Bloom and the CMC does, and uses herbs and powders (but also common household ingredients) for that.
She also has zebra magic, which is a mystical art without a clear tell (like a glowing horn).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bs8XU0N6VT0&t=27s

>Apple Bloom made flower bloom during Cutie Pox. And Grannysmith doing several crazy things to make Zapapplejam editable. On both cases, the plants were magical themselves.
What plant isn't magical in Equestria? This is a world where literally every bird is magical, because they can all walk on clouds.

>we know there are magical plants in Equestria and that Applejack is the sole master Mud Magic.
Non sequitor. We know there are magical plants in Equestria, yes, but there is no indication Applejack is somehow special or unique, and you have to very careful when you cherrypick your examples to even come up with that interpretation.

>WHAT IF? What if Applejack is not an exception to the rules?
Indeed. Why would she be?

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>>30617773
The Hooffields also made plants grow quickly, as a point.

>>30607689
Peseants. They do the work the others don't want to or don't have the time for. They're still part of the nation so immigrants can stay the fuck out.

>>30618849
Please lurk more. This meme has been debunked several times already ITT.

>>30607689
we already know applejack can literally do anything, thats her thing.
Im surprised the hack writers cant come up with episode ideas for her here are some
>applejack discovers something she is really bad at
>someone is actually way better than applejack at applebucking
>applejack cant say no so someone takes advantage of her
>there is nothing for applejack to do and she cant deal with that

>>30607736
Coming back when they have the birthing hips of an earth pon.

>>30619769
Fuck off anthrofag, real ponies don't have pronounced hips

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>>30608470
>Construction workers and laborers aren't rich. They get paid a half decent wage if they're lucky and get chronic back pain for their efforts.
If you're talking bricklayers sure, but electricians / plumbers practically rake it in, unless thats what you're reffering to with "contractors".

>>30609124
>Giving her Rainbow's gave her the ability to control the weather.
DYEWTS?
The solution for that episode is that it gave them the new cutie mark WITHOUT giving them the special talant, and it was the application of said talant that helped restore them to normal.

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>>30612051
BIG.
MEATY.
DOCKS.

>>30619284
The last round up. Applejack got rekt so hard at a rodeo competition, she decided to move away to some backwater town and work somewhere else.

>>30607689
Earth Ponies, while getting the short end of the stick on many occasions, they have the advantage of having the best physical potential. Applejack for a mare is incredibly capable and is one of the couple ponies practically caring for thee whole Apple Farm. Big Mac doesn't need to be explained either. I would suppose in the end if there are pony Olympics, Earth ponies would make up most of a team of athletes.

>>30620928
Wut? Applejack won a fuckton of silvers in that competition. That was the entire point of the episode.

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>>30611988
>>30612051
>>30619973

Not a race-specific talent. See Party of One.

>>30623127
For the context of this thread, please try to stick to what's canon, or at least please explicitly state you're enforcing your own twisted regressive headcanon.

Much of what you say completely lacks evidence, has been debunked ITT, or is blatantly false to even a casual watcher of the show.
>Earth Ponies, while getting the short end of the stick on many occasions,
Which occasions?
>they have the advantage of having the best physical potential.
Nothing in the show hints at this.
>Applejack for a mare is incredibly capable
>for a mare
The genders are equally capable in MLP, and the society is highly egalitarian (as should be expected from a 3rd wave feminist show).
There is no gender segregation among top-level athletes, academics or military.
>I would suppose in the end if there are pony Olympics, Earth ponies would make up most of a team of athletes.
We literally had that episode. Equestria Games. Earth ponies did not make up most of the teams, much less most of the winning teams. Ponyville won by a single medal (thanks to a few ultra-high performers like Rainbow Dash compensating for the rest, as seen previously in Rainbow Falls), Cloudsdale came second (exclusively pegasus city), Griffonstone came 3rd (not even ponies).
Buckball from Buckball seasons, while not Olympic level, also demonstrates a clear lack of gender and racial segregation or favoritism.

>>30623822
WRONG

>>30624346
Explain.

>>30607689
Agriculture and gardening.

>>30609999
checkd

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>>30607709
Can't agree more

war

>>30626645
What are they good for?
Absolutely nothin'
Say it again, y'all

>>30608114
Why does it suck to be a Black Jew Pinkie?
Because you have to sit in the back of the oven.

Drama

>>30607689
Superior numbers, work morale, and stamina.