This is what the ideal mecha looks like. You may not like it

>ideal mecha
>can't even rocket punch
Yeah, no.

>>15754371

> peak performance
> almost every final Gundam upgrade in the franchise and a lot of starting ones out perform it in some or all ways

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>>15754371
Nah brah

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>>15754371
I disagree.

>>15754392
ikimasu

>>15754385
No need for raw strength, gimmicks or skill when you have Jesus Plot Armor

>>15754385

There are very few starting Gundam's that outperform it, there's like two, and Turn A is all I can think of. Final Upgrades...maybe 00 Raiser, and Perfect Pack, V2 Assault Buster?

>>15754406
FX AGE outperforms it, so does 00-Raiser.

>>15754406

Nu, F91, V, V2, Shining, God, Wing Zero, Double X, Turn A, 00, 00[Q], AGE-FX and G-Self at the very least all out perform it in multiple aspects. All the Strike Freedom has is speed and mult-vector attacks, but almost all Gundams are high speed units and a lot of them either have multi-vector attacks of their own or have a much higher firepower as well as more things besides. I'd be tempted to add the Wing, X and AGE-2 and AGE-3 to that list too honestly. Strike Freedom is a pretty low level unit really.

>>15754371
i tend to agree

>>15754371
It's just a shittier, busier Hi-Nu with a worse paint scheme, a worse gimmick, and a worse pilot.

>>15754440
>Nu
Strike Freedom is quicker, more agile, more heavily armed and it's defense is better. It's DRAGOON's can return to refuel and recharge so even their longevity is better. About the only advantage Nu has is it's barrier...and Strike Freedom has Beam Shields on it's arms so the advantage there is marginal.

>F91
Strike Freedom is again, quicker, more agile and more heavily armed then the F91. F91 is smaller and has the VSBR's, but SF is heavily favored in the firepower department and has the "All-Range" advantage too.

>Shining
Shining and God, and G Gundam is blatantly Super Robot territory. Even then I'd say it's debatable that Shining is better.

>God
Sure.

>Wing Zero
Strike Freedom is the better Mobile Suit, Wing Zero has the advantage of the TBR. But it's arguable which is better in a pitched battle. I'd give SF the win in a duel though.

>Double X

Not even a chance, DX's ONLY advantage is the TSC, which is a situational weapon at best.

>00
Is not even a full functioning Mobile Suit, to say nothing of it's less then 100% reliability.

>>15754440
But...But...Nu and V don't even have the firepower edge over the SF, let alone the speed advantage. And if you add the Wing and X, AGE-2 and 3 you're most certainly full of shit.

>>15754487
You're tremendously underselling the Nu, F91 and Wing Zero. Shit, the F91 is like a God-given hard counter to Strike Freedom with its kit being perfectly suited to screwing with range-dependant pilots' instincts

>>15754487

You do remember I said "some" areas, right? I used that word for a reason, which is why the Double X for instance is on that list. The Nu can use it's barriers around any object since they're not tied to the suit, so the advantage isn't as marginal as you're saying. There's also no way to say the Strike Freedom is faster than the F91, since there's no comparable speed metric between them. The F91 also has "after images with mass" and while it doesn't have the range or multitude of guns of the Strike Freedom, it does have more adaptability thanks to VSBR's and how they work. I see no reason to think Shining is worse either honestly. Also, the Wing Zero has not just the twin buster rifle but the zero system and much, much tougher armor. The twin buster rifle can be split and fired quickly in multiple directions or for a sustained fire in arcs, which more than makes up for any disadvantage. The 00 was only incomplete for it's debut episode and works fine after that, especially once it's hooked up to the Raiser.

As always /m/ is the only board that takes stock 4chan memes seriously.

>>15754506
Do tell, how is the Nu being undersold. Or the F91, or the Wing Zero. Obviously I think you're underselling the Strike Freedom, let me tell you why.

It's predecessor the Freedom, had a little over 7G maximum acceleration. That's so far past the Nu and F91 it could literally control every single facet of the engagement. The Strike Freedom is only quicker, it's only more agile. Firepower wise, the old Generation 1 Gundam's with Battery powered Beam Cannons could punch width wise through a battleship, and Busters old combined Beam Rifle punch through lengthwise...SF has a few generation newer versions powered by a Nuclear reactor.


>>15754516
>The Nu can use it's barriers around any object since they're not tied to the suit
I'd say the other metrics in which the SF overshadows the Nu are so drastic that this small boon to the Nu isn't nearly enough. Especially when you consider how using the barrier knocks down the Nu's firepower immensely.

>There's also no way to say the Strike Freedom is faster than the F91

Even the Freedom is quicker then the F91 actually. 7.3G of maximum acceleration for the former.

>the Wing Zero has not just the twin buster rifle but the zero system and much, much tougher armor.

The Zero System in a vacuum is just as bad as it is good. It could likely guide you to losing just like it could winning. Also, Phase Shift is better at physical impacts and the Beam Shields can't be chipped away at unlike the Wing Zero's armor.

>The 00 was only incomplete for it's debut episode and works fine after that

False, it goes kaput at least once after finding Graham.

>>15754371
Look, the SF is one of my favorites (despite all the shit I get from my friends for liking it) but even I can admit that there are some major flaws with its design. The chest mounted multi-phase beam cannon for one, lacking any form of traverse requires that the SF reorient itself completely towards the target to engage with the cannon. That's pretty major considering the mutli-phase beam cannon is probably its strongest armament outside of the DRAGOONs. The other flaw being incapable of using WOL at maximum output without having the DRAGOONs fully deployed.

>>15754593

Where are you pulling the acceleration numbers for the Freedom from? Because as far as I know, no CE suits has those kind of stats. Most AUs don't bother with them. Also, while using the barrier knocks the Nu's firepower down, being in atmosphere knocks the Strike Freedom's down, since it can't use it's DRAGOONs in atmosphere if I recall. Nor can it use both the WOL and DRAGOONs at once. Also, the Zero System might not be controllable by everyone, but we're not rating the units on any pilot using them here from what I gather, just the unit itself. And that presumes a pilot that can take advantage of them. You might as well say the Strike Freedom's DRAGOONs are as much a disadvantage as an advantage, since while any pilot can use them, only an ultimate coordinator can use them to their real potential and an average pilot would only be able to use some of the guns at once, or be overwhelmed by the data the unit needs to operate fully or something. You're right about the 00 though, it's system is over stressed once; which is why they develop the Raiser. So I should say the 00 Raiser is all around better, while the base 00 is better in some areas but not entirely reliable. The reliability only appears to be an issue if it uses trans-am though.

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>>15754707
He got it from the Mobile Suit Gundam SEED Cosmic Era Mechanic & World artbook.

>>15754593

has there been any gundam besides wing zero that destroys an entire asteroid/space colony with a single blast? any suit at all with a guaranteed one shot kill?

>>15754707
Hell, the Freedom's original propulsion and reactor output stats have since been retconned but we can figure something out from it's feats.

The PLANTS are in the Earth's Lagrange point 5, which puts them roughly at the same distance as the moon. Kira, when he got the Freedom, rushed off to save the day in Alaska. The official timeline states the trip took him around 3 days. In a vacuum, with the Earth's gravity helping it return to the planet, 3 days.

SUVAT puts this as an average acceleration of the Freedom during this feat at 0.011m/s2. Comparatively, the RX-78-2's 0.93G acceleration would allow it to make the same tip in 2.53 HOURS if it's propulsion fuel held up. If it's fuel only lasted for 30 mins of constant acceleration, it would still only take 6.65 hours to reach Earth. And in Unicorn, Riddhe in the Delta Plus flew from Lagrange 5 to Earth in roughly 2 days AFTER he used up all his propulsion fuel in a battle.

As for it's reactor output, you have to remember that the Freedom is also responsible for powering it's METEOR. That's when it's reactor is going 100%, not during normal combat.

>>15754722
Didn't one of these books state that Windam's have Phase Shift, while in the show itself they are shown being ripped apart by standard AA fire?

>>15754707
>Where are you pulling the acceleration numbers for the Freedom from?
The Gundam Seed Mechanics and World sourcebook has Maximum thruster outputs for both Freedom and Justice.

>being in atmosphere knocks the Strike Freedom's down
You are correct, but even without the DRAGOON's regardless of why, the SF's level of firepower is higher.

>Nor can it use both the WOL and DRAGOONs at once.
I'm not sure what you're saying here, in atmosphere the SF separates the DRAGOON's slightly from the wings to use the WoL. In Space...you just deploy them, of course it can use them both at once.

>just the unit itself
Exactly, I'm rating them like the pilots aren't even a factor. Just on the merits of the machine itself.

>ou might as well say the Strike Freedom's DRAGOONs are as much a disadvantage as an advantage
There's no evidence of that though. Even if you're not as good as Kira or someone else with High Spatial Awareness you can still use them, and as far as I know you can use all of them.

>>15754762
This is the first I've heard of this, have any actual proof? That aside, if you honestly think the Freedom is slower then the -2 you're outright crazy.

OP here, yall are some autistic dumb fucks aren't you? I was only meming.

Inb4 haha we were only pretending to be retarded.

Also godgundam is the best

>>15754855

The point isn't that being in atmosphere gives it less guns, it's that it can't use over half it's guns in atmosphere and the unit is much more limited on a planet than in space; which isn't the case with many other lead units. The Nu's funnels are also more adaptable given their form, and can be used without traditional sensor feedback since they're psychically controlled, rather than controlled by a computer based on sensors. It's not going to be a massive advantage most of the time, but it is notable. Also, if the Strike Freedom just slightly opens the DRAGOONs to use the Wings of Light, but still has the actual DRAGOONs equipped it should impede the actual Wings of Lights function since there's objects right there blocking most of their exhaust. The SF MG manual says only an ultimate coordinator can use the DRAGOON fully. I doubt the guy's point was that the SF was slower than the RX-78-2, but that the numbers don't actually mean much.

>>15754861

I doubt anyone gives a fuck OP. Just because you started the discussion as a joke doesn't mean people won't enjoy it.

>>15754855
>This is the first I've heard of this, have any actual proof? That aside, if you honestly think the Freedom is slower then the -2 you're outright crazy.

The official timeline that came out with the show listed the theft of the Freedom as taking place on May 5th. Mu, Natarle and Flay were reassigned from the Archangel on May 8th. Spitbreak happened sometime afterwards with no official date given. May 8th is the earliest Kira could have arrived, which is what was used for the SUVAT calculations.

>>15754937
On the other hand we also have the Freedom flying from the Zaft base to LEO while catching up to Lacus' shuttle in a couple minutes before finally pulling away.

>>15754919
The fact the DRAGOON's can't be used in atmosphere is a common fault you find with all remote weapons. Nu certainly can't use it's Fin's under gravity. I never said SF was "Perfect", so I can't understand how this makes it inferior to Nu. Anyway, DRAGOON's aren't controlled by a computer, if it was done by a computer Kira's ability to process huge amounts of data wouldn't matter at all. Like you said, it takes the "Ultimate Coordinator" to use the DRAGOON's fully...if a computer handled it all...

>>15754964

Lady Une gets out of bed, runs out of a military hospital, activates the Wing, reaches space and intercepts a beam from Libra all in the space of a couple of minutes. At most. Not Wing Zero by the way, Wing. And it has to be within that time rather than animated to flow together like that, because Lady Une only wakes up and leaves when she feels Trieze is in danger from Libra's cannon in the first place. Which means she's also probably a newtype.

>>15754964

Numbers ultimately mean nothing in the Cosmic Era. Remember, Mu blocked an anti-matter shot with an anti-beam shield, which is beyond ridiculous in and of itself before you take into consideration the retcon that he survived.

>>15754937
I'm talking about the retcon bit, I haven't done the math on your numbers. There could be any number of explanations for why it took the Freedom so long, he could have had to reroute multiple times to avoid patrols and fleets, etc, etc. Or maybe the timeline people just werent in sync with the animation people.

>>15754977
Truly the greatest pilot of them all, that Lady Une

>>15754967

A computer processes the information and he directs them based on that information. It takes an ultimate coordinator, because who else is going to be able to coordinate the movements of 8 guns or whatever at once while also moving a mobile suit through a fight and also using another 6 guns (or however many he has).

>>15754986
The Chaos technically uses the same updated DRAGOON system as the one in the SF and Sting handled it just fine. Granted the Chaos was working only with two pods instead of eight.

>>15754999
Though I just remembered, the Legend was originally intended for Athrun as well, and he had no enhanced spacial awareness. I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have given Athrun a unit with 10 DRAGOON units especially when they're basically its primary weapon if he couldn't handle the system.

>>15754999
>>15755008

The MG manual for the Strike Freedom says that only an ultimate coordinator can handle it, so if we're going to take fluff akin to that on it's word for it's acceleration I don't see why we'd doubt it for it's computer systems. And it should be no surprise that a unit was designed for someone who couldn't handle it, since the writers of CE generally didn't seem to put much thought in to the lore of the show and hew more to the rule of cool. I don't even say that as a knock, since many shows do the same. I'm aware the people who made the initial lore did pay attention, I just mean in general for the show.

>>15754986
Assuming that's correct, that's not the same as the computer controlling it. That being said, why would High Spatial awareness ever be required if the computer gave you all the position data and such anyway.

>>15755090

Because just knowing where something is doesn't mean you'll be able to control 14 such things perfectly while also piloting a vehicle through the middle of a battle? I never said the computer controlled them, I said a computer gave the pilot data on their position based on sensor readings. Which isn't control. Someone would need to have high spatial awareness to be able to use and direct all that data.

>>15755098

Oh wait, the word "control" is in the initial post, so let me rephrase that: a computer is necessary to act as an intermediary between the pilot and the DRAGOONs, to sense where the DRAGOONs are and to feed the DRAGOONs directions on where to go. UC units like the Nu do all that via pilot brainwaves, which is less prone to interference.

>>15755090
Because mentally coordinating a bunch of objects moving in 3d space to optimally make use of them is really hard, so hard that you would want a computer to at least handle the nitty gritty of getting to designated coordinates for you rather than having to punch in an x y z manually repeatedly?

Imagine playing 8 games of chess where both players make their moves simultaneously, while floating in microgravity. I'm pretty sure you'd want some amount of automation to reduce the mental load, right?


Honestly this sort of thing necessitating special snowflake skill makes far more sense than the whole THE OPERATING SYSTEM REQUIRES THAT YOU BE A COORDINATOR thing going on to handwave the early mobile suit disparity.

>>15755027
You've got it mistaken, I've the chinese translation of the MG SF manual and you've got that part mixed up with the Multi-lockon system

名爲超級龍騎兵的龍騎兵系統,是以ZAFT開發的“不依存使用者之空間認識能力的次世代系統”爲基礎,加以獨自改良。在開發階段就預定煌·大和擔任駕駛員而設計的結果,及多重目標鎖定系統使本機獲得了自由鋼彈之上的多重攻擊機能以及利用遙控操作的全方位攻擊的能力。一般來說,僅處理這樣的情報量就是常人如何也達不到的領域,除了超級調整者煌·大和以外,不可能有人能最大限度地活用這種兵器。

translation:
Named the Super Dragoon System, this uses the Zaft "Disconnected Disconnected Rapid Armament Group Overlook Operation Network" as a basis and further improves upon it. During development, it was decided that Kira Yamato would be the pilot and the design is a result of that, furthermore the multiple target lock on system was inherited from the Freedom Gundam's multiple targeting ability and adds remote controlled multiple attack function. Normally, processing this much information is impossible for any normal human being, except for Kira Yamato, its impossible for anyone to use this system with any competancy

>>15755119

What part is mistaken then, because as far as I can see only an ultimate coordinator can use it properly according to that.

>>15755129
The ultimate coordinator status is required to pull off the multi-target lockon + dragoon barrage, not the dragoons themselves.

>>15755133
In other words, the SF's multi-target lock on computer is also upgraded from the Freedoms because it takes into account the Dragoon's omni-directional attack. Its not the Dragoon themselves that are the issue, its the Dragoons + the multi-lock.

>>15755133

Unless you are suggesting that a normal human can use them by leaving them docked with the unit and just firing them off at the angle the wings are at I fail to see how that's different in practical terms.

>>15755150
No it means you can either use the Dragoons OR the Multi-lock (beam rifles, railguns, chest cannon), not both at the same time (SF's iconic taste the rainbow bitch pose with the Dragoons deployed all around it), unless you're Kira Yamato.

peak performance is literally the Qan(T) but okay

>>15755157

I don't see anything like that in there, only it saying that the DRAGOON system in the Strike Freedom is based upon and a refined version of the multi-lock system in the Freedom. Nowhere does it say a normal human can only use one or the other. I'm pretty sure the Freedom's manuals state that only a human with high spatial awareness can use the multi-lock system alone.

>>15754501
But the Nu Gundam isn't just for show.

>>15755174
What? Where in that passage does it say the Super Dragoons are based on the Freedom's multi-lock? It clearly says the Super Dragoons are based off of the old Dragoons and improves upon it. It then says the SF's multi-lock was inherited from the Freedom's and then adds Dragoon weapon integration to it. Or to put it in real world terms, it would be like integrating a new weapon into the FCS of a fighter jet. It then finally says that the SF's multi-lock system sends too much information (implied due to the new Dragoon integration) and can only be handled by Kira.

I don't see what's so difficult about interpreting that passage.

>>15755188

Where it says that remote attack functionality (i.e. the DRAGOON system) was added to the multi lock one. Even if they're two seperate systems, both the DRAGOON system and multi-lock system alone require a person with high spatial awareness, so the average pilot will have no use of either.

>>15755108
Actually no, a computer is required for the Psycommu system too. The waves transmitted to the Funnels or Bits are in machine code, as translated by the onboard Psycommu system. Anyway, no ones ever interfered with the QC ever before, I'm not even sure how you'd do it.

As for the other debate, I think the key point here is that the ridiculous notion that Kira somehow has his Mobile Suits doing everything automatically is at least finally dead.

>>15754761
Well obviously the X and DX. But it could legitimately be argued that they are way less efficient than the Wing Zero considering the recharge time.
The buster rifles and the satellite cannons aren't the same kind of plot devices though.

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>>15754371
No, not quite.
But that can be fixed.

>>15755274

The Testament Gundam and a few others could remotely hack quantum computers (which would include DRAGOONs) via a virus transmitted through mirage colloid.

I thought Chaos' weapon pods and SF and Legend's DRAGOONs were equipped with a new "quantum communication" feature that allows non-high spatial awareness people to use them well enough. That's why Sting could use the Chaos' weapon pods just fine, which happened to have a similar model number to SF's DRAGOONs. Sting is not stated to have spatial awareness, just the usual EA supersoldier enhancements. Also, there's the point that Legend was going to be assigned to Athrun.

>>15755466

Chaos only has, at most, 4 guns, only two of which are in the mobile pods using a DRAGOON system. Strike Freedom has 13, 8 of which are on the DRAGOONs. I imagine the number has a lot to do with it. The Wikia at the very least mentions that while normal pilots could use the second generation DRAGOON system, it took a person with high spatial awareness to use it to it's real/full potential. I don't even think Sting regularly fired off the 4 guns on the Chaos Gundam at one time while maneuvering, so he was presumably using it in a much more limited capacity than Kira does.

Fuck off, Flay. Get that Beamspam Mcnoskill outta here.

>>15755381
That's a pretty special case, and I'm not really sure if it would count as jamming?

>>15755576

It can take over units with a quantum computer, which counts as hacking as far as I'm aware.

>>15755466

Well enough yes, but high spatial awareness people can still use them better.

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>>15754371
COME ON

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What?

>>15754371
Peak performance? That's a cute joke anon.
Several other mechs even from the Gundam franchise alone outclass it. 00 Qan [T], Turn A, God Gundam, RX-0 series.. Hardly makes the top five considering those alone. Super robots laugh the Strike Freedom, but its respectable enough for a 'real' robot.

It looks like someone's shitty fanart idea for an upgrade of the Freedom Gundam, with a name perfect for that concept.

>>15755165
Shia Qan[T] > 00 Qan[T]
more agile

>>15757996
>model kit vs robot
Uh

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>>15754371
>Thinking the Nu Gundam is just for show!

>>15758022
both 63T + flight mode

>>15754371
Hold on buddy that’s not kimaris vidar. That’s a worse Nu gundam.

>>15758243
>Better Nu Gundam
Fixed it for you

How to stir shit : The thread

>>15754371
No, too much samurai. It looks gay as fuck.

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>>15754371
Nope, buddy, sorry ... to inform you,, but, actually, you are WRONG. Gandam is just ... bad mech ... in fact,, it is Goldrake also called as GRANDIZA,, who is the - best - most powerful super robot! Grandiza special attacks probably, are so, strong that ... gundam would be sliced open and pilot killled in ust a single hit! speaking of ideal, maybe only second to grandiza himself is the powerful JEEG, his little cousin and also an invention of illustrious italia robots!

Real talk tho, V2 is the ideal mecha with peak performance

>cant even deploy DRAGOONS on earth, or any place with similar gravity
>peak performance

>>15754385

What? No, Strike Freedom is OP as fuck.

>>15754392
FUNNUHLU!

>>15765556

Not really. Kira is, Strike Freedom isn't. The unit is pretty tame compared to the God, Turn-A, 00 Qan[t] or G-Self Perfect Pack and is still out done by multiple other units like V2, Wing Zero and AGE-FX. Beyond high speed and funnels it doesn't really have much going for it, and most Gundams are high speed units. Funnels have become pretty common lately too, with the Qan[t], AGE-FX and G-Self in the last decade alone.

>>15755359
Holy shit, this is perfect.

>>15754388

This. When you think about it NEXTs actually have a decent explanation for being humanoid.

>We invented a Kojima generator
>But if we try to put it in something and add QB/OB to it it'll splatter the pilot
>So we lock the pilot in effective paralysis and have their mind control it
>But because of input lag we need to make it humanoid to match their body directly
>Fitting a Kojima generator and a pilot into the same core requires it to be bigger
>Giant robot sized, of course!

>>15755119
All kira seems to do is just sit there while the thing targets shit for him, so I have no idea what the fuck the manual is talking about.

>>15766316
It's giving you context dumb dumb, he's not just watching the targeting screen because it's pretty.

>>15755119
>Normally, processing this much information is impossible for any normal human being, except for a Gary Stu, its impossible for anyone to use this system with any competancy
ftfy

Gundam hard stats have always been retarded because for space faring war machines the majority either vastly outperform their stated energy source and construction materials or are horrifically outdated and we be out performed by 80s era fighter jets.

If you step away from stats then only 00 could compete with UC due to what they claim to be their energy source and since GN particles are similar to Minovsky particles in function.

CE would literally be the weakest based purely on their energy source. There's a humongous world of difference between nuclear fission and nuclear fusion and everything nuclear in CE runs on fission reactors.

>>15766466
Fusion has a higher potential than fission, but that doesn't mean it's always better. It's possible that the UC fusion reactors are just not very efficient and CE fission reactors are very efficient.
Even if you ignore the silly stats they give, both are capable of powering beam weapons to similar levels. There is no discernible difference between the performance of the two.

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>>15766490

Wasn't the whole point of a fusion reactor not output, but rather minimizing the space the reactor takes?

I mean, fission reactors are enormous. Take a look at how much space the NR-1's reactor took on a vessel with 400 tons of displacement. And it only went 4.5 knots with it!

>>15766518
For UC at least, the fusion reactors are essential to everything.
They produce minovsky particles, which are used to shield the reactor thus allowing more compact designs. Those particles can also be used as ammunition/propellant by some designs. They are used for defenses and jamming.
Take out the minovsky particle and all that's left in UC is space magic.

>>15766542

Oh, I admittedly don't know much about Minovsky particles given I've never watched a single Gundam show (Save for Gundam SEED and Destiny, which my roommate watched all the time, but I never really followed any single episode because I was at work all day).

Do they have any similarity to Kojima Particles?

>>15766466
Oh Jeez, you just want another reason to circle jerk to UC it sounds like.

>>15766309
But there were robots around before the AMS and KP tech, so back to square one.

>>15766547
Not really. Kojima particles are pretty similar to GN particles though.

>>15766585
Not him, but he's entirely on point about stats for mecha shows, they're invariably really dumb and nonsensical no matter the series.

>>15766490
Considering Minovsky particles at a high enough density can create gravitational lift the reactors that produce minovsky particles would have to be incredibly efficient and far more advanced than even third gen theoretical fusion reactors.

Plus even high efficiency fission reactors would be shitting out enough radioactive waste to poison everyone that got near Freedom. Part of the problem with fission is the byproduct of splitting atoms and the waste it leaves behind. Not only that but all the nuclear units in CE should be tearing through fuel.

>>15766630
>all the nuclear units in CE should be tearing through fuel.
They probably do, it's just irrelevant when you consider that all their opposition is running on batteries with far, far shorter operational limits.

Although not that you mention it, I wonder where and how Lacus sourced a supply of military grade fissile material to top up the Freedom when she was restoring it. Because that's plenty shady right there.

>>15766630
>Considering Minovsky particles at a high enough density can create gravitational lift
Where is that from?

>>15766652
Victory 2, Penelope and Xi Gundam for instance?

>>15766674
Also pretty much every atmospheric ship since the White Base.

>>15766595
Yeah, but he basically just used it as an excuse for "Muh UC Is da best".

>>15766630
That's not how Minovsky Craft, or Drive works. They both just replace standard thrust with Minosvky particles. Other then that, they create a cushion of Minosvky particles for the thing to float on.

Secondly who knows what new fangled bullshit fuel the Fission Reactors in CE run on. Considering their small enough to fit in a MS to begin with I need you to throttle back your realism boner a bit.

>>15766647
>Because that's plenty shady right there
Isn't the canon explanation for how she got the Strike Freedom 'she set up a secret spy organisation to steal tech and Intel from both sides, while pretending to run the orphanage'?

>>15766937
Yeah, but for some reason 'stealing blueprints' doesn't sound anywhere near as dodgy as 'stealing uranium'.

>>15766937
>>15766943
If that's the case, then why are they surprised when Durandal attacks them first?

>>15766958
Because they din do nuffin wrong. It's only bad when everybody else does it.

>>15766958
It's not like Durandal knew about the information brokering anyway. Anway, I'd bet their surprised stemmed from the fact it didn't seem like ZAFT had any drive to go after them specifically. Plus they'd just cooperated fine against the Destroy sometime earlier.

>>15766647
>I wonder where and how Lacus sourced a supply of military grade fissile material
A reactor doesn't need weapons grade material, and since fission reactors were effectively giant paperweights I doubt they were manned or guarded.

>>15767234
Didn't the EA get N Jammer Canceller tech at the end of SEED? They should be able to reuse nuclear reactors now, unless they're retarded (which is a genuine concern, since this is the Cosmic Era we're talking about).

>>15767317
I think they used rare materials, so while they could and probably did restart ones near major population and industrial centers, I think they didn't have the materials to restart all of them.
They also appear to have already switched over to alternate power sources, so maybe they didn't care.
Or maybe she started hording it when she first found out about the n jammer canceller, before anyone realized it was worth anything again.
Who knows, if they ever do give an explanation I'm sure it will be none of these and 100x more retarded.

>>15767317
They can and were using NJCs to restore power plants. However, the treaty signed at the end of the first war banned the military usage of nuclear tech. This included the usage of N-Jammers and N-Jammer Cancellers.

In other words, the Freedom is technically an illegal weapon in Destiny.

>>15766647
>Although not that you mention it, I wonder where and how Lacus sourced a supply of military grade fissile material to top up the Freedom when she was restoring it. Because that's plenty shady right there.

Considering Eternal was built as a mobile base for Freedom and Justice and they had no problem keeping them fueled the whole time they were on the run from Zaft and EA in Seed it probably had a large stockpile of whatever they needed to fuel Freedom and they just used that.

>>15754593
Tallgeese has 15Gs of acceleration and Wing Zero is far faster than it. Wing Zero also exited the atmosphere under its own power. Gundanium doesn't get chipped away. That never happens. Wing Zero is blasted by a barrage of beams by the colony defense system without a single scratch. Wing Gundam crashed into the ocean from the atmosphere without a single scratch. Heavyarms is beaten by Tallgeese's beam saber without a single scratch. Gundanium is the most durable armor in the franchise.

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Damn Anon, did you accidentally upload the wrong picture? Dont worry, I've got you covered.

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>>15767645
>Gundanium doesn't get chipped away. That never happens.
What are the black chunks coming off of the Deathscythe after it receives several beam rifle shots in a row?

>Wing Zero is blasted by a barrage of beams by the colony defense system without a single scratch.
That's because few to none of them hit the Wing Zero. Wufei had his Gundam shot up by the same kind of beam cannon turrets mounted on the Libra, and the Altron was crippled.

>>15767719
>What are the black chunks coming off of the Deathscythe after it receives several beam rifle shots in a row?
Barely anything. Deathsycthe was hit by over 2 dozen beam rifle shots. The suit shows no signs of damage. It wasn't until the beam cannon that the suit was actually damaged.

>That's because few to none of them hit the Wing Zero. Wufei had his Gundam shot up by the same kind of beam cannon turrets mounted on the Libra, and the Altron was crippled.
Wing Zero was blasted by no less than 2 dozen beam rifle shots with no damage and multiple dober gun shots. The only time I recall Altron getting damaged was when it was beaten up by multiple Virgo II and Wufei even stopped fighting them and they still couldn't destroy him. Shenlong lost an arm to Barge.

Rewatching those scenes just made me remember that the Taurus has over 8gs of acceleration. Yet people here are bragging about the Freedom.

>>15766466
Considering the whole N-Jammer problem CE probably has some insane efficiency on their stuff.
If their fucking batteries can power quantum computers AND beam weapons for a good amount of time, it says a lot about their tech, even if its not as advanced.
Either the batteries are stupidly high capacity, or the computers and weapons are so fucking efficient that they could power them with batteries.

>>15766937
>>15766943
As far as I know, the latest explanation is that the Strike Freedom was built by ZAFT and then the only existing prototype was stolen by Terminal.

http://www.mechatalk.net/viewtopic.php?p=141967&sid=c1f4161afb09e1f63adbd309c7bef6c5#p141967

It would explain why it has a ZAFT OS and is powered by the latest "Hyper-Deuterion Engine" which is the same type of powerplant that powers the Destiny and Legend Gundams.

>>15767438
No, the Junius 7 peace treaty only banned the usage of NJCs. N-jammers are still around, there's still way too many to get rid of them all. Warships also carry N-jammers as a kind of ECM equipment anyway. It didn't stop both sides from using NJCs anyway.

>In other words, the Freedom is technically an illegal weapon in Destiny.
Supposedly so are Destiny, Legend, Infinite Justice, and Strike Freedom. All of them have nuclear reactors with NJCs equipped. Their powerplants are supposedly meant to skirt under the guidelines of the treaty by claiming the nuclear reactor doesn't directly power the MS, it recharges a battery that powers the MS.

>>15767789
Also note that one variant of the Astray Blue Frame had a Lohengrin launcher powered by a reactor.
It didn't have the NJC but supposedly when they did get into the range of the NJC of another machine it managed to fire the Lohengrin launcher.

Their reactors can fucking power an antimatter cannon

>>15767767
>Barely anything. Deathsycthe was hit by over 2 dozen beam rifle shots.
You're skirting the question, those chunks did come from the Deathscythe. You can't claim that gundanium never chips off, that's a reckless blanket statement.

>Wing Zero was blasted by no less than 2 dozen beam rifle shots with no damage and multiple dober gun shots.
No, none of the colony defense Leos landed a hit on it, and they didn't have doberguns either. I'm sure you're confusing it with the earlier scene where it soaks up Leo weapons fire while attacking an OZ resource base. In the actual colony defense scene where Quatre destroys the colony, none of the hundreds of beam cannon turrets hit him.

>The only time I recall Altron getting damaged was when it was beaten up by multiple Virgo II and Wufei even stopped fighting them and they still couldn't destroy him.
That's Wufei being retarded. In episode 40, he tries to charge at the Libra battlestation alone and gets wrecked by hundreds of beam cannons that focus down on him, leaving him drifting in space. Two episodes later he miraculously comes back after somehow getting his Gundam repaired, and gets fucked up again, also left drifting in space. Heero and Sally come by in a small cruiser and pick his dumb ass up.

>Rewatching those scenes just made me remember that the Taurus has over 8gs of acceleration. Yet people here are bragging about the Freedom.
In Destiny episode 26, two cast members steal a ZAFT transport intended space. They launch but are being chased. The Freedom appears and proceeds to knock out all of the base's interceptor MS in a dogfight, go to the ground to suppress the base's ground forces and destroy their radar system, buzz the control tower with a super close flyby, then fly back up to and pass the shuttle as it exits the atmosphere. The shuttle has been flying at top speed the entire time. From ground to space for the Freedom it took less than a minute, it was measured in seconds.

>>15767825
I'll admit I misremembered a few things. But, Deathscythe and Wing Zero still tanked dozens of beam shots. Altron was battered by the colony defense system and wasn't destroyed. Suits from nearly any other series would have been destroyed from that.

The Freedom and Justice needed to grab onto the Kusanagi in Seed to get to space. The Justice especially couldn't even catch the Kusanagi without the Freedom reaching out to it and the Justice has similar stats to the Freedom in that book, right?

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>>15767856
>Altron was battered by the colony defense system and wasn't destroyed.
The Altron was left crippled and the writers just had him come back fully repaired with no explanation.

>The Freedom and Justice needed to grab onto the Kusanagi in Seed to get to space. The Justice especially couldn't even catch the Kusanagi without the Freedom reaching out to it and the Justice has similar stats to the Freedom in that book, right?
Which book? I'll admit the feat in episode 26 is probably not consistent and is bullshit, but it wouldn't be the only time that the Freedom does bullshit, though.

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>>15754371
Not even close to Turn A.

>>15767869
>The Altron was left crippled and the writers just had him come back fully repaired with no explanation.
But it wasn't destroyed. You consume a suit from a different series in a beam and they're dead.

>>15767869
>Which book?
The one with Freedom's stats. It and Justice are sister suits so I'd expect Justice to get stats in the book too or at least have comparable ones to Freedom.

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>>15754371
>all the cock-a-hoops in this thread don't know PEAK PERFORMANCE when they see it

Remind me, are Destroy Gundams nuclear powered? If so, I imagine ZAFT just said 'fuck the treaty' after one nuke suit killed another nuke suit at Berlin.

>>15767986
Iron Man has really let himself go.

>>15767990
No official power source ever stated.

>>15767896
>The one with Freedom's stats. It and Justice are sister suits so I'd expect Justice to get stats in the book too or at least have comparable ones to Freedom.
I wouldn't know which book that is. CE never really gave their suits any proper performance stats as far as I know. Not even the neckbeards on mechatalk seem to know.

>>15767645
And what evidence do you have for Wing Zero being quicker then the Wing Zero? Also, when did WZ ever "Achieve Orbit" from the ground on its own?

Someone else already handled your Armor points.

>>15767856
The Kusanagi happened to be riding on a Linear Driver. Which the fluff from the old Gundam Official site stated applied a solid 6G of acceleration to a craft full of human's. Now it'd been riding that thing for quite a while, so...it had quite a bit of speed.

Anyway, the reason they needed to catch the ship was because if they didn't they'd have lost them. Not because they needed them to get to space outright.

>>15768000

See:

>>15754722

>>15767990

Probably but it's never said.

However since Destiny and Legend would have to have been in development well before then, they probably said fuck the treaty the instant EA ignored it and tried to nuke the Plants again.

Or when they used a ship with Mirage Colliod which was also illegal.

>>15767645
>Tallgeese has 15Gs of acceleration
It's long since been hypothesized that 15G is the maximum G it can pull maneuvering. To reconcile the various information it's the only way it works IIRC.

>>15765175
A for effort

>>15768025
To be fair, I don't think 'Providence with a slightly different backpack' would need that much development time.

>>15768119
As much as the Legend overlaps with the Providence in terms of usage and role, the main body is still completely different. Its basically a whole new suit from scratch, regardless of how much it resembles the original Providence at a cursory glance.

>>15767800
>Supposedly so are Destiny, Legend, Infinite Justice, and Strike Freedom
Yeah, but this was far past the point where the EA had whipped out the actual nuclear missiles. The point of contention is that Lacus instituted a treaty banning this kind of weapon and then turned right around and had it restored and ready to use.

>>15768032
>And what evidence do you have for Wing Zero being quicker then the Wing Zero? Also, when did WZ ever "Achieve Orbit" from the ground on its own?
Zechs said that about Wing Zero and Wing Zero entered the atmosphere in the last episode and was able to fly back into space.

>The Kusanagi happened to be riding on a Linear Driver. Which the fluff from the old Gundam Official site stated applied a solid 6G of acceleration to a craft full of human's. Now it'd been riding that thing for quite a while, so...it had quite a bit of speed.

That changes nothing.

>Anyway, the reason they needed to catch the ship was because if they didn't they'd have lost them. Not because they needed them to get to space outright.

BS. The Justice couldn't even catch the damn ship. Considering In Destiny Kira was able to catch and even surpass Lacus's shuttle the Freedom and Justice should have been able to catch the Kusanagi.

It doesn' matter wha you all hypothesized. It's flat out said to have 15G of acceleration. Even the MG reaffirms that.

>>15768317
>Zechs said that about Wing Zero
Snipped it a bit for brevity, but as I understand it Zech's gave a general statement about how the Wing Zero was "More Powerful" and could respond quicker. Not that it was faster. And Wing Zero at most entered the upper atmosphere to shoot down the piece of Libra.

>That changes nothing.
Of course it does numbskull, if the Linear Driver can accelerate ships at a steady 6G, and it's being going for a solid couple of seconds. This isn't a hard concept to understand, The ship had been accelerating an accumulating speed for quite a while compared to Justice and Freedom.

>BS.
They fucking say it, if they don't catch on to the Kusangi before it leaves. They lose track of them. I forgot you know better then the damned characters living the damned events.

>Considering In Destiny Kira was able to catch and even surpass Lacus's shuttle the Freedom and Justice should have been able to catch the Kusanagi.
Not. Even. Remotely. The. Same. Thing.

> It's flat out said to have 15G of acceleration. Even the MG reaffirms that.
No, it says it can pull 15G, that's not the same thing as 15G's of acceleration.

>>15768380

> Wing Zero at most entered the upper atmosphere to shoot down the piece of Libra

Wing goes from a standing start to space in the space of a minute or so. It also takes a full power blast from Libra's main cannon and it's upper half survives with minor damage (though it's lower half is entirely obliterated). If Wing can do it, Wing Zero almost certainly can too.

>>15768380
>Snipped it a bit for brevity, but as I understand it Zech's gave a general statement about how the Wing Zero was "More Powerful" and could respond quicker. Not that it was faster. And Wing Zero at most entered the upper atmosphere to shoot down the piece of Libra.

He said it right after boosting and boosting out of the atmosphere is boosting out of the atmosphere. Most things in Gundam get drawn into Earth just by being near it.

>Of course it does numbskull, if the Linear Driver can accelerate ships at a steady 6G, and it's being going for a solid couple of seconds. This isn't a hard concept to understand, The ship had been accelerating an accumulating speed for quite a while compared to Justice and Freedom.

The Freedom and Justice had a large head start on the Kusanagi. The Freedom caught it before it could fully boost past them. The Justice couldn't catch it and needed help. The Kusanagi wasn't even using the boosters they added yet either.

>They fucking say it, if they don't catch on to the Kusangi before it leaves. They lose track of them. I forgot you know better then the damned characters living the damned events.
Where? I don't see that in episode 40.

>Not. Even. Remotely. The. Same. Thing.
It's even worse since the Kusanagi wasn't using any boosters. Just the rail.

>No, it says it can pull 15G, that's not the same thing as 15G's of acceleration.
The model kit says it has 15Gs of acceleration. Nothing about pulling a 15G.

>>15768442
Anyone who believes that the Wing Gundam can go from standing on the Ground to not just orbit, but out and out space, in a minute. Is an imbecile, that's so far beyond anything we ever see the Wing capable of it's ridiculous.

We're explicitly told it's being fitted with booster rockets, and if the TG requires boosters just to reach out into space on it's own...how wouldn't the slower Wing?

Just because things happen on screen one after another, it doesn't mean they're literally happening that way.

>>15754487
I gotta ask, why do people jump to Strike Freedom's defense so quick? It has very few solid feats and it's performance and ability seems very generic and is only really measured by the surrounding mecha in the show, which rarely seem like anything special.
Doube X, Wing Zero and the 00 on the other hand have been shown to have overwhelming firepower (with feats to go with it) or absurd abilities like teleporting, on top of the generic high performance the Strike Freedom has.

>>15768479
On top of that, most of the feats Kira's suits DO have has to do with Kira's absurd programming/piloting and inability to die, not the suits themselves.

>>15768479
Because they make it really good in a lot of video games for some reason.

>>15768460
They were talking about the wings. The chief says there was no reason to leave the suit half done and we're shown that it has no wings. He doesn't even say rocket boosters nor do we ever see any rocket boosters.

Infinite justice always seemed objectively better. It has similarly advanced technology and high performance, but it's weapon systems are actually designed for close range/dueling, the thing that actually matters most when it comes down to the final moments in Gundam. Like Freedom, a lot of the Strike Freedom's long range weapons don't mean squat when shit gets serious, and this seems to apply even more so for the Dragoons. Meanwhile, we have seen the Inifnite Justice actively use things like it's shin beams when taking out Destiny.

>>15768460

I don't believe the Wing or Wing Zero is really that fast, I believe it's done as a matter of narrative convenience for the sake of drama. Same as a lot of the stuff you're trying to claim as proof the Freedom or Strike Freedom is super fast. As >>15768508 said the engineers are also obviously talking about the wings, given that they mention leaving the unit "half done" and then we see a shot of it partially complete with bits covered in tarp, parts pulled out and no wings. The boosters are the wings. Also, Une only wakes because Zechs orders Barge to fire on Trieze, so yes, it has to be a few minutes at most. Just because something is shown in one order doesn't mean it happens that way as a general rule, but it doesn't mean they're never in that order either.

>>15768534
I don't mean to interject, but I'm gonna take actual on screen feats as a bigger indicator of ability than supplementary stats and specifications.

>>15754371
>SEED Gundam

really, nigger? This is poor bait

>>15768615

Okay, then Wing is the fastest Gundam ever and can take a hell of a beating. God is super fast too, and can exit the atmosphere on it's own since it did so when bouncing off the ring to reach Hong Kong. Despite using a rocket to do the same thing in the last few episodes.

>>15768626
>Wing is the fastest Gundam ever and can take a hell of a beating. God is super fast too
Sounds about right

>>15768626
>God is super fast too
That's true though. Unlike the latter which may be an oversight for dramatic effect, the scene where Domon has to travel from the Gyanna Highlands to Hong Kong within a time limit seems to very deliberate showcase of the God's speed. Same with the God Gundam overpowering that gravity machine under the ring in the finals. I can't remember how powerful Master Asia said the gravity field was, but it was something absurd.

>>15768656

I don't doubt it's fast, but I don't think that's any more concrete an example than the Wing one personally, since God goes from Brazil to China in the space of a few minutes, and even using the curvature of the Earth as a short cut that's still a distance of a few thousand miles in minutes. The fact he needs a rocket to get him in to space quickly in the finale doesn't help either.

>>15767990
It's possible that the destroys were big enough to fit fusion reactors in. Or maybe they just had a boat load of batteries or something. Or they could be fission powered and nobody cared that they were using njc since mass murder was the more pressing issue.

>>15768297
> Lacus instituted a treaty banning this kind of weapon

Please, Lacus had no involment with government policy after the conclusion of the Bloody Valentine war.

>>15768656
>>15768710
Remember, God Gundam's Hyper Mode can use the decorative ring on its back as a propulsion source that allows it to move fucking bullshit fast.

God Field Dash, remember? I think God Shadow might count here too.

>>15768297
>>15769349
yeah, most of Destiny's plot could've been avoided if Lacus was actively involved in PLANT politics/leadership after the first war ended, instead of fucking off to the orphanage and starting a spy ring (>>15766937 >>15767800) instead.

>>15769349
Sure, still possess a nuclear Gundam in your basement is illegal, because a private citizen that owns something like this opens the doors of a lot of variables, some even potentially dangerous.

What if there was a competent villan in CE? What if the Freedom is stolen from Lacus and used in some destructive action that involves innocents?

The fact is that keeping Freedom that way was quite dangerous despite the double keys and everything.

>>15769565

I don't think there's any laws against civilian ownership of mobile suits, even one of a kind superpowerful ones, in any Gundam continuity actually.

Even in real life you can have decommisioned military vehicles for private ownership assuming you can afford them. You can't take them out, so they can't do much but sit there and maybe move around your property, but there's nothing stopping you from having them.

As a military vehicle no longer allowed to be in service, Freedom would be considered decommissioned, which means that there really wasn't any laws broken having it sit in her basement.

It's not even technically violating the treaty which was against deployment and development of NJC suits. It didn't demand all nuclear weapons already existing be destroyed and since Freedom was just stored away not fighting, and not even part of Orb's military at the time there's really nothing anyone could say even if they found it there.

It's certainly a shady thing to do,and kind of shows that they must not have been expecting peace to last, or at least were expecting someone somewhere to come after them at some point, but there's no real laws broken here.

>>15769603
Are there laws against civilian ownership of significant quantities of nuclear material or nuclear reactors though? Because I'm pretty sure anyone found with either in real life would find themselves answering some very pointed questions from stern faced G-men, and it's not like the potential for misuse is any less in CE.

>>15769603
>As a military vehicle no longer allowed to be in service, Freedom would be considered decommissioned

The Freedom and Justice were super weapons, not a "simple military vehicle". And It's not a question of laws, it is a matter of common sense.

>>15769603
>>15769630
Yeah, this isn't like owning a decommissioned Humvee or something, this is like having a fully operational nuclear powered attack submarine or aircraft carrier. Laws or not, nobody is going to let a private citizen own one no matter how rich and influential they are.

>>15769603
>you can have decommisioned military vehicles.

But the Freedom was full operational, armed and with a nuclear power source.

>>15769620

There actually aren't. There are regulations to comply with but many nuclear plants and reactors are civilain owned and run as is the transport of their fuel material.

Granted these are usually big companies that do this, but that's because a supercompact nuclear reactor like Freedom has that doesn't need a big support staff to maintain don't exist in real life yet.

Considering CE had mostly nuclear power on Earth until the N Jammers came in, private nuclear plants were probably both legal and common, and definitely wouldn't be illegal, especially since thanks to the N Jammers pretty much nobody could make them work anyway.

>>15769663
To be fair, Freedom was a trashed torso when it was originally recovered. Not exactly demil but who's going to stop her from taking it.

>>15769691
>many nuclear plants and reactors are civilain owned and run
Yeah, under contract with licenses and permits. You can't just fucking build a nuclear reactor on your property.

>>15769565

To be fair, you might need that kind of security if death squads come after you.

I mean if they didn't have Freedom they'd all be dead.

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>>15769763
Please ... do not remind me that. Assassins perfectly referable to their mandates. Among other things, mobil suits to kill a girls is totally unprofessional.

You do not send your military tanks to do such a thing. Once the presence of Lacus in the house is confirmed, you just need a single sniper waiting for the best time.
Gilbert, the faggot who thought to be so fucking smart while playing chess, alone.

>>15769854
Durandal is smart, except when he plots against Lacus. Then he's a complete idiot who makes unforced errors.

>>15769854
>You do not send your military tanks to do such a thing.
A missile from an aircraft or drone is much cheaper and more effective now.

A direct assault usually indicates time sensitivity. Seed is really bad with times and dates, but Meer's first broadcast may have been 1 or 2 days before the assassination attempt. It's entirely possible the attack on the plants forced Durandal's hand in revealing Meer, which made him order the assassination of Lacus asap, resulting in a messy assault.

>>15754371
>ideal mecha

There is no "ideal mecha"- people have different opinions and denying it is retarded to the highest degree.

>>15768456
>He said it right after boosting
He didn't, unless you're not talking about episode 34. Where he only comments on it's reaction time and combat capabilities.

>The Freedom caught it before it could fully boost past them.
It never fully accelerated past either of them actually. Justice is very slowly catching up, and that's the only reason it's able to grab Freedom's hand.

>The Kusanagi wasn't even using the boosters they added yet either.
I'm not sure what you're talking about, the Kusanagi didn't have a booster, just it's normal old Rocket Engines.

>Where? I don't see that in episode 40.
I must have miss remembered, I can't find it either.

>It's even worse since the Kusanagi wasn't using any boosters. Just the rail.
How is the Linear Driver worse, it'd be tons more efficient at constant acceleration compared to rocket boosters. There's a reason why it's used over them, so coveted.

>>15768479
Generally because Strike Freedom is shitted on more then most. It's honestly argued Nu is better when it's clearly an inferior unit. Double X is inferior in every since except its TSC which is situational at best, etc, etc.

>>15768508
Hm. Fair enough there, it's still utter retardation to say the Wing Gundam can cross 1000's of Kilometers in less then a minute.

>>15768534
I never used anything from the show itself to imply Freedom or Justice's acceleration. Not on it's own anyway, I used numbers from a Mechanics book.

>>15767825
Currently rewatching Wing
The first time the Wing Zero shows up, every Leo DOES land their shots and most DO have doberguns

>>15770108

> Double X is inferior in every since except its TSC which is situational at best

Can Strike Freedom blow up an entire island? No? Then it's not superior in every respect. Honestly, the regular Gundam X is actually probably even more situationally superior to it, since it can not only hit harder than the Strike Freedom, it can field more Bit Suits than the Strike Freedom has DRAGOONs and each of them can hit harder. It can also hit hard quite fast and precisely, if that scene of Garrod hitting an exact spot multiple times with the Double X is any indication.

> it's still utter retardation to say Wing Gundam can cross 1000's of kilometers in less than a minute

No one was seriously trying to claim that so saying they were is reductive.

If Wing Gundam was re-turned today with modern animation and direction, the Wing Zero would move as fast as an Unicorn in Destroy mode.

>>15772863
Outside of G and MSG, old Gundam shows don't really show suits moving really fast. Even ones like V2 aren't depicted as speedsters in the show. Later shows have mastered the art of turning units into beams of light and having them fly around at super speed. 00 started it and pretty much every series since has done that shit. Even BF has units like Zakus flying at super speed. It's just an an animation style that new shows benefit from.

The thing with Seed that I don't like is that the Freedom is fellated by everyone. It's feared by soldiers on both sides whenever it shows up for some strange reason and everyone always remarks on its speed. No other suit gets talked up as much in universe as the Freedom. Even when the Destiny flies literal circles around the Strike Freedom, no one is talking about how fast it is. It's favoritism by the writers to make the Freedom look good.

>>15772898

> Even when the Destiny flies literal circles around the Strike Freedom, no one is talking about how fast it is.

Don't suppose you remember when that happens? Never seen most of Destiny, so I'm interested in seeing that.

>>15772898
>Even when the Destiny flies literal circles around the Strike Freedom
The only time anything close to that happens is when Shinn first uses his wings during their fight and the burst of speed catches Kira off guard. After that they are fighting pretty evenly again. Kira even holds his own 1v2 for a while after that.

>>15773051
41
>>15773059
Kira fought evenly with Shinn after that because the show cuts away from their fight and when it comes back, Shinn is no longer using his wings. He's just chasing the Strike Freedom with his beam rifle. That's besides the point though, Destiny with its wings active is probably the fastest suit in that show and no one ever gasps out "h-hayai!". That's because Freedom is the only show that's supposed to be fellated.

2 on 1? It was mostly 1 on 1. Shinn and Kira exchange fire for a while. Rei finally decides to help after Shinn stops engaging Kira and shoots at Kira, Kira dodges a bunch of fire from Rei. Rei stops and Shinn charges straight at Kira, fires his beam rifle a few times and misses without Kira dodging, Shinn tries to use the stupid palm thing close up and gets kicked away. Kira aims at Shinn and Rei charges firing his beam rifle twice. Kira dodges and Rei uses the dragoons to knock Strike Freedom off balance allowing Shinn to line up a shot.

That's not even really a 2 v 1. That's two people taking turns fighting Kira. That

>>15773127
>Kira fought evenly with Shinn after that because the show cuts away from their fight and when it comes back, Shinn is no longer using his wings.
False. Shinn is using his wings during the 1v2 for example, and Kira has no problem keeping up.

>That's not even really a 2 v 1
Yes it is. One of them attacks Kira while the other gets behind him to try and get a hit while he's not paying attention. Every time Kira changes who he is fighting he is spinning around to deal with an attack from behind.
The animation style is really pose heavy, so they add lots of breaks in the action, but that doesn't mean they are just taking turns. For example you can see and hear Rei shooting at Kira while Shinn does his palm charge at Kira's back.

It's a result of the animation style. The same as when Kira does the burst, he's not actually floating there stationary for several seconds.

>>15773205
>False. Shinn is using his wings during the 1v2 for example, and Kira has no problem keeping up.
I wasn't talking about that fight. It was talking about the original fight between them. In the second fight, Shinn flies in a straight line using the WOL instead of using them like he did in the first where he used them to get behind Kira.

>Yes it is. One of them attacks Kira while the other gets behind him to try and get a hit while he's not paying attention. attacking. Nothing is stopping Shinn from shooting at Kira from the side when Rei is spamming his dragoons. Instead, Shinn waits until Rei is finished and then charges at Kira.

>For example you can see and hear Rei shooting at Kira while Shinn does his palm charge at Kira's back.
That was Shinn's beam rifle. The shots come from his side. If it was Rei they'd be behind Kira.

>>15772645
I believe I rather blatantly said the Double X has superior firepower, it's simply situational at best. It requires one of the most lengthy charge up sequences in all of Gundam. Not to mention a clear path to the moon.

>>15773242
>Shinn flies in a straight line using the WOL instead of using them like he did in the first where he used them to get behind Kira.

To be fair it didn't work the first time, so why try it again when Kira's had even more time to figure out ways around it?

>>15772898
Actually, I believe Murasame pilots comment on Destiny;s speed. Right before it starts chopping them up.

>>15773294
Shinn flying around spamming the WOL and his beam rifle would force Kira to focus on him. That would give Rei much better opportunities to take potshots at Kira. Shinn charging at Kira was retarded anyway. We saw him use the palm cannon long range in the episode before so trying to grab the Freedom and not just firing it was bad writing to allow Kira to look cool by kicking Destiny away.

>>15773305
>Actually, I believe Murasame pilots comment on Destiny;s speed. Right before it starts chopping them up.
We only see Cagalli shocked and then a Murasame pilot shocked before he gets chopped in half.

>>15773242
Since afaik they never use that sequence ever again, it can be assumed either A) Shinn's retarded and never tries to do something that gave him an edge ever again, or B) Kira/Athrun can keep track of him once they know how fast he can move.

>That was Shinn's beam rifle
You're right, since he was so close I thought it was Rei shooting from below but upon review it is definitely Shinn's.

>>15773340
I wouldn't put it past Kira or Athrun to be able to keep up with it but lets be honest, by that point in the show Shinn was retarded. He doesn't do things that make much sense. It makes far more sense for Shinn to use that technique over flying in a straight line even if they could perceive it. The biggest problem is that the Destiny Gundam is too inconsistent. Sometimes it cam spam the wings of light with no problem and others it runs out of juice. Sometimes the wings don't even give it afterimages.

>>15773334
>Shinn flying around spamming the WOL and his beam rifle would force Kira to focus on him.
How exactly do you know which tactics would work better against Kira then Shinn, a trained and experienced Mobile Suit pilot? It didn't profit in any solid hits against the SF the first time, obviously Shinn decided it wasn't worth it there.

>not just firing it was bad writing to allow Kira to look cool by kicking Destiny away.
So wait, shooting at Kira as he rushes in and having those shots avoided somehow inspired you to suggest shooting the palm Beam Cannons would work so much better?

>>15773422
>How exactly do you know which tactics would work better against Kira then Shinn, a trained and experienced Mobile Suit pilot? It didn't profit in any solid hits against the SF the first time, obviously Shinn decided it wasn't worth it there.
Because Shinn wasn't thinking straight. He was in full rage mode.

>So wait, shooting at Kira as he rushes in and having those shots avoided somehow inspired you to suggest shooting the palm Beam Cannons would work so much better?
The palm cannon isn't an obvious weapon. Kira kicked the arm away instead of dodging because it seemed like a melee weapon. If Shinn shot the beam it would have caught Kira by surprise.

I always thought it was overdesigned, even freedom was too much. Strike is the pure 'original'-like gundam with appropriate modernized design. Not the strongest ofc but most aesthetic

>>15754371
Can it beat Wing Zero Custom EW ver?

>>15775728
Bullets managed to half fuck that thing up.

>>15775728
Just counting final main Gundams, Strike Freedom can't beat
Unicorn
V2
God
Wing Zero
Turn A
00
AGE-FX
G-Self

>>15775751
That never happened.

SF is unironically the strongest suit in the series and can easily beat any MC suit.

>>15775728
Depends which unit is cooler according to the writer...
They are from different universe, there's no hard rues that prevent each of them to win or loose for certain.

>>15755165
kek no. Perfect pack G-self>>>>>00Q

>>15756329
>RX-0
>Peak performance
Is this a joke?

>>15775756
More like the strongest suit in the franchise.

>>15773294

> I believe I rather blatantly said the Double X has superior firepower, it's simply situational at best

It also has at the very least far superior range, and at least as much precision as the Strike Freedom. Garrod manages to hit a colony laser precisely 3 times out of 3 with shots that just miss the outer hull but destroy some mirrors, then heat score the outer hull before finally putting a shot dead centre, and he does it from what is at least presented as a hundred miles or more away (possibly far more).

> It requires one of the most lengthy charge up sequences in all of Gundam.

It probably does, but that's not saying much since it doesn't have much competition and in reality it probably only takes a couple of seconds. Most of the stock footage of it's charging is actually still panning shots showing the unit off while it poses and probably isn't indicative of passing time at all. In the above mentioned battle (viewable at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vhDEHllaz4) he fires it in a few seconds, most of which is posing or aiming.

File: gundam+wing+frozen+teardrop_0005_gundamkitscollectionSS034[1].jpg (168KB, 1600x868px) Image search: [Google]

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Can anyone overcome YOUR SIGHT MY DELIGHT?

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This is what the ideal mecha looks like.

You may not like it but this is peak performance at it highest pedigree.

>>15776510

Bandai's accounting division and their unwillingness to pay for designs.

>>15772898
>The thing with Seed that I don't like is that the Freedom is fellated by everyone. It's feared by soldiers on both sides whenever it shows up for some strange reason and everyone always remarks on its speed. No other suit gets talked up as much in universe as the Freedom. Even when the Destiny flies literal circles around the Strike Freedom, no one is talking about how fast it is. It's favoritism by the writers to make the Freedom look good.

I don't think Shinn fights anyone in Destiny that's shown inside the cockpit (even generic guys) other than Athrun and Kira. And Sting but he was too far gone to care at that point.

Nobody to really remark about Destiny's speed or power. Plus Destiny as a suit isn't famous like Freedom was. It was only introduced at the tail end of the war.

There's also the fact that thanks to Kira's disabling preference that means there's dozens if not hundreds of pilots that saw it in action and lived to tell about it. Very few pilots walked away from fighting Shinn other than Kira and Athrun.

>>15773469
>Because Shinn wasn't thinking straight. He was in full rage mode.
He was actually pretty angry when he first used the strategy you're talking about. I doubt he was any more angry when he didn't.

>If Shinn shot the beam it would have caught Kira by surprise.
You think, but you have no way of knowing how it would have played out. I defer to Shinn because he's an actual experienced combat pilot.

>>15776497
>It also has at the very least far superior range
When it comes to hitting very large targets, sure. Such as Colonies, ships, things that aren't moving. It doesn't have the optics itself to hit targets at extreme ranges.

>and at least as much precision as the Strike Freedom
Precision I think, is far more a function of the pilot. At least as presented in the various anime.

>he fires it in a few seconds
It takes a few seconds outright to deploy into an actual weapon, if you take it at face value. So all in all it's what, 8-10 seconds of being completely stationary?

This isn't taking into account again, the SC and TSC aren't weapons that can be deployed whenever you want. The moon MUST have a direct line of sight to the Mobile Suit.

>>15776876
>I don't think Shinn fights anyone in Destiny that's shown inside the cockpit (even generic guys) other than Athrun and Kira.
Cagalli and a generic Murasame pilot are both shown shocked when the Destiny is ripping the squad to pieces.

>Nobody to really remark about Destiny's speed or power. Plus Destiny as a suit isn't famous like Freedom was. It was only introduced at the tail end of the war.
The Freedom was only famous in Destiny. It wasn't famous in Seed. The Justice when it returned didn't get any type of reaction. Neither does the Archangel. The Strike was wiping out ZAFT suits all of Seed and no one reacted to it at any time during Destiny. The Freedom just gets special treatment.

>There's also the fact that thanks to Kira's disabling preference that means there's dozens if not hundreds of pilots that saw it in action and lived to tell about it. Very few pilots walked away from fighting Shinn other than Kira and Athrun.
I think killing people would give a suit a far worse reputation than disabling suits.

>He was actually pretty angry when he first used the strategy you're talking about. I doubt he was any more angry when he didn't.
He actually did something smart in that instance. Later on he's doing stupid shit because his character has lost semblance of intelligence to make Kira and co look better.

>You think, but you have no way of knowing how it would have played out. I defer to Shinn because he's an actual experienced combat pilot.
Yep. Shinn's the actual experienced pilot! The same guy who threw his boomerangs at Athrun only to have them kicked away multiple times! The same guy who kicked a suit that had beam sabers on its legs. He just saw those sabers kick away his boomerangs and slice off the Impulse's arm. But he's the experienced pilot, right? He knows best! Same guy who tried to catch beam sabers with his hands! Shinn is so amazing and smart in late Destiny!

>>15777025
> Later on he's doing stupid shit because
You, a random guy on the internet somehow understands Mobile Suit combat better then he does. Of course you have the advantage of hindsight and not having to react in mere moments. But eh, that doesn't matter.

>The same guy who threw his boomerangs at Athrun only to have them kicked away multiple times!
And people shoot their beam rifles and various other weapons at each other hundreds if not thousands of times throughout the franchise, only to have them evaded, blocked, knocked away. To you apply the same logic there, every decision you make in combat isn't going to be perfect, not for Amuro, not for Kira and certainly not for Shinn.

>The same guy who kicked a suit that had beam sabers on its legs.
What else could he do, besides shoot his Vulcan's? Which would have been even more trivial considering Phase Shift.

>Same guy who tried to catch beam sabers with his hands!
WAAAAH. WHY ISN'T SHINN PERFECT. If we listed every time a pilot made a bad decision in combat all of them would be shit.

Shinn happened to be going up against two pilots with quite a bit more experience then him under their belts. Sure, Shinn was compromised by emotion and shit, but you can't say other stuff would have worked better. You know exactly dick all about combat, let alone Mobile Suit combat.

>>15777025
>Same guy who tried to catch beam sabers with his hands!

If the palm cannons actually fired through the sabers and blew IJ up you'd all be saying it was the sickest move in Destiny.

Not Shinn's fault his plot armor wasn't as strong.

>>15776976

> It doesn't have the optics itself to hit targets at extreme ranges.

It does in that clip. It has the optics to sniper fire a cannon with precision so it's not like it'd even struggle to see/hit smaller targets going by that clip.

> Precision I think, is far more a function of the pilot. At least as presented in the various anime.

It's both. The pilot can have the steadiest hand and keenest eye but it won't make any difference if his suit can't zoom in far enough to show detail or has an imprecise rig with a large drift in fire that the pilot doesn't know to or can't account for.

> It takes a few seconds outright to deploy into an actual weapon, if you take it at face value. So all in all it's what, 8-10 seconds of being completely stationary?

Why would it need to be stationary for the duration? Garrod has deployed the cannons without activating the Satellite System before, intercepting the laser link some time after deploying them and moved around in the interim. He only needs to be still for the few seconds it takes to soak up the laser's energy, which is only 3 or 4 seconds. Once he's ready then he can and does move around again, and the satellite cannon itself can be swept around to hit a larger radius, sometimes depicted as lasting for more than half a minute.

> The Moon MUST have a direct line of sight to the mobile suit

Which it does almost anywhere in space and on half the Earth. Line of sight to the Moon is a requirement, but it's not a particularly difficult or egregious one. It's not like the Strike Freedom doesn't have a slight limit of it's own and need zero gravity to use half it's weapons and it's full thrusters effectively.

>>15777025
>I think killing people would give a suit a far worse reputation than disabling suits.
100 people talking about freedom trashing an entire fleet will spread a lot more than 5 dudes talking about impulse/destiny murdering an entire fleet

>>15777097
>It does in that clip.
You realize smaller targets are harder to see right? Just in the video you can obviously make out the Colony, but you certainly can't see the Mobile Suits or even really the ships surrounding it.

>so it's not like it'd even struggle to see/hit smaller targets going by that clip.
You're logic...is nonsensical, going by that clip he can hit gigantic targets at an exceptional range.That doesn't give you carte blanche to say he can target targets 100's of times smaller.

>Why would it need to be stationary for the duration?
True enough, but deploying it still counts against it. It's never going to surprise anyone, and 3-4 seconds is plenty of time to get a lot of damage in on it.

>It's not like the Strike Freedom doesn't have a slight limit of it's own
True, but taking into account both handicaps the Strike Freedom is the better machine.

Why the gold frame?
It's gaudy as fuck and brings the aesthetic appeal right down.

>>15777075
>You, a random guy on the internet somehow understands Mobile Suit combat better then he does. Of course you have the advantage of hindsight and not having to react in mere moments. But eh, that doesn't matter.
Considering who wrote Destiny, everyone knows more than the characters there.

>And people shoot their beam rifles and various other weapons at each other hundreds if not thousands of times throughout the franchise, only to have them evaded, blocked, knocked away. To you apply the same logic there, every decision you make in combat isn't going to be perfect, not for Amuro, not for Kira and certainly not for Shinn.
Shooting your rifle is different from throwing your melee weapons and having them deflected the exact same way by the exact same person. >What else could he do, besides shoot his Vulcan's? Which would have been even more trivial considering Phase Shift.
Fucking run away. What type of idiot kicks Infinite Justice? I can't believe you're trying to defend this.
>WAAAAH. WHY ISN'T SHINN PERFECT. If we listed every time a pilot made a bad decision in combat all of them would be shit.
WAAAAAH! Shinn tries to catch beam sabers! Show me another pilot doing that in any series. Shinn's performance at the end of Destiny was to make Infinite Justice look cool.
>Shinn happened to be going up against two pilots with quite a bit more experience then him under their belts. Sure, Shinn was compromised by emotion and shit, but you can't say other stuff would have worked better. You know exactly dick all about combat, let alone Mobile Suit combat.
Shinn was a trained soldier unlike Kira. He had 2 years of academy service under his belt while Kira had one war. Then Shinn was in battle far more often than Kira in Destiny. Shinn has more experience than Kira.

File: [Lunamaria] Mobile Suit Gundam SEED Destiny HD Remaster - 49 [BD][720p-AAC][10312014].mkv_snapshot_21.53_[2017.08.13_17.48.34].jpg (44KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

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>>15777088
>If the palm cannons actually fired through the sabers and blew IJ up you'd all be saying it was the sickest move in Destiny.
He didn't fire them. He grabbed with them. The hands even close around them. Even if they fired he would have missed Infinite Justice based on the angle.

>>15777139

> You realize smaller targets are harder to see right?

You realize you didn't specify "smaller" right? He might not be able to hit individual suits at that kind of range, but given that he can perfectly clip a colony at what is likely to be a few hundred miles he can probably clip a mobile suit from far further out than the Strike Freedom could.

> deploying it still counts against it

If it's capable of moving and acting while deploying the satellite cannons why would that count against it? And no, it's never going to get a surprise hit in on a protagonist, but it's certainly going to be capable of it on random mooks. Hell, it already got the drop on the main villains of X given that in the show's final battle it shows up with the satellite cannon's deployed and steals the satellite link from them when they assumed they had control of it.

> taking into account both handicaps the Strike Freedom is the better machine

No, it isn't. You find it a preferable machine, but taking the advantages and disadvantages of both in to account neither are clearly superior because both have opposing purposes and designs. You prefer the Strike Freedom; that doesn't make it better.

>>15777192
>Shinn was a trained soldier unlike Kira. He had 2 years of academy service under his belt while Kira had one war. Then Shinn was in battle far more often than Kira in Destiny. Shinn has more experience than Kira.
Zaft was a volunteer based militia, and 2 years at an academy during peacetime hardly compares to actual combat.
In actual combat Shinn didn't fight at such a severe disadvantage like Kira had to.
At best Shinn has more flight hours logged.

>>15777271
>In actual combat Shinn didn't fight at such a severe disadvantage like Kira had to.
He always fought at a higher disadvantage than Kira.
>B-but Kira always had to fight 4 Gundams!!!
Shinn always fought waves of enemies that could fly. Kira usually fought Yzak. The other Gundams barely engaged him. The other 3 attacked the Archangel with Dearka and Mwu frequently fighting. Kira's suit couldn't even be damaged by most enemies in Seed. By the time of Destiny, everything has beam weapons. Kira could afford to make far more mistakes than Shinn. Then when Kira got the Freedom it was literally point and click to win. Then he got Meteor which was even more point and click. Shinn never had such a severe advantage in combat.

>>15777192
>Considering who wrote Destiny, everyone knows more than the characters there.
Not even.

>Shooting your rifle is different from throwing your melee weapons
Except those Boomerangs aren't just melee weapons, they're medium range weapons too. He has three other close range armaments on top of that so it's not like he was wanting either way.

>Fucking run away.
Get chased, shot down, either way it comes to the same damn conclusion.

>Shinn tries to catch beam sabers! Show me another pilot doing that in any series.
Who the hell else could even try! Destiny and X-3 are the only machines I can think of that even have the ability to attempt it!

>He had 2 years of academy service under his belt while Kira had one war.
Real life experience damn near ALWAYS trumps academy learning.

>Then Shinn was in battle far more often than Kira in Destiny.
He really wasn't.

>he can probably clip a mobile suit from far further out than the Strike Freedom could.
Only by sheer chance, what you posted isn't some amazing feat of long range shooting.

>If it's capable of moving and acting while deploying the satellite cannons why would that count against it?
It can't act while it charges for starters, and having to deploy your cannons for a few seconds before you can fire is seriously bad in pitched combat.

>it already got the drop on the main villains of X
He didn't get the drop on them, not in the since of "Surprise TSC". There are very good reasons you don't oft see the DX pulling out the big gun in the middle of a battlefield.

>No, it isn't.
I disagree, but perhaps you're right.

>>15777338
>He always fought at a higher disadvantage than Kira.
Oh horse shit.

>Shinn always fought waves of enemies that could fly.
Moot point, Shinn could fly better then anything he fought. Kira couldn't fly and the other Gundam's could thanks to their Sub-Flight Lifters.

>The other Gundams barely engaged him.
He fought Athrun and Nicol on several occasions. He also fought underwater against purpose built machines.

>Kira's suit couldn't even be damaged by most enemies in Seed.
All the Gundam's could damage him, the LaGOWE, all the amphibious MS, HELL the GINN he fought in episode 2 could damage him.

>point and click to win
If by point and click, you mean master a system that takes high skill and spatial awareness to use fully...sure.

>>15777338
>He always fought at a higher disadvantage than Kira.
How?
Archangel had just the strike and the mobius/skygraspers until Alaska. Minerva had the impulse, 2 zakus with "elite" pilots, and Athrun's zaku/savior.

>Shinn always fought waves of enemies that could fly.
Oh no, the nameless pilots in mass produced suits, the bane of every gundam pilot, what ever will he do.

>Kira's suit couldn't even be damaged by most enemies in Seed
Because the other gundams he fought with regularly definitely didn't have beam weapons.

Kira fought more in situations he couldn't beat head to head. Shinn fought named enemies like 2 times before freedom showed back up, and spent the rest of the time playing dynasty warriors.

SFfags BTFO

>>15777423
>Oh horse shit.
Completely true,
>Moot point, Shinn could fly better then anything he fought. Kira couldn't fly and the other Gundam's could thanks to their Sub-Flight Lifters.
The Zaft suits used the lifters like 3 times. The time they chased the Archangel into Orb, the time Nichol got killed and the time after that. None of those had Kira fighting them all at once. Strike couldn't fly but its assisted jumps were better and it had the Archangel and Mwu.
>If by point and click, you mean master a system that takes high skill and spatial awareness to use fully...sure.
When he used the Freedom at Alaska he beam spammed immediately. Same with the first Meteor usage and the first Strike Freedom usage. He didn't master shit. It was point and click. We even see the computer pop up and lock onto everything each time he does it.

>>15778148
>He didn't master shit. It was point and click
It's point and click the same way a beam rifle is point and click, just like a half a dozen times at once

>>15778157
People are always show using scopes for beam rifles. Shinn has to pull his out all the time. Freedom literally has a computer pop up and target everything at once.

>>15778172
Only when they feel like it. Look at like every high speed fight where they are firing at each other in between monologuing, nobody has a scope over their face yet they are firing constantly. And it's not like they are off target. Even the scene where Rei knocks Kira off balance and they show Shinn's screen locking onto him Shinn doesn't have the scope in his face.

>>15778148
>The Zaft suits used the lifters like 3 times.
Which is three times the Strike had to deal with legitimate flying enemies when it couldn't stay aloft itself.

>None of those had Kira fighting them all at once.
I never once said it did, you made the asinine statement that Shinn fought under worst conditions, spouting nonsense about everyone being able to fly. Well Kira fought enemies that could fly when he couldn't.

>Strike couldn't fly but its assisted jumps were better
Somehow rocket jumps are better then outright stable flight? Yeah, good luck selling that to anyone.

>Archangel and Mwu.
The AA is not a substitute for another mobile suit, and the Skygrasper just barely is. Shinn still had on average, more and better backup.

>He didn't master shit.
Oh look, you're a better pilot then Shinn AND you know more about how the technology works then the people who write the various manuals.

>We even see the computer pop up and lock onto everything each time he does it.
OBVIOUSLY Kira's the one doing the locking on you dumb dumb. EVERY series has lock-on's, every pilot uses them. We always assume the pilot is doing it, and we have outright statements Kira's doing it there.

>People are always show using scopes for beam rifles.
The only difference is the interface dumb dumb.

>>15777393

> Only by sheer chance, what you posted isn't some amazing feat of long range shooting.

It is within the scope of the franchise, and there are very few other times someone has shot at that kind of distance within the entire franchise. There's one unit in Victory that can do it, one line of suits in 00 that can and that's about it. Garrod didn't just hit it either, he shot to scare twice, shooting just above it and then just along the outside to cause minor but repairable damage with a huge cannon. That is good shooting by any metric. There is no chance involved in that scene. You mentioned dismissiveness about the Strike Freedom earlier, but this is no better.

> It can't act while it charges for starters, and having to deploy your cannons for a few seconds before you can fire is seriously bad in pitched combat.

I didn't say it could act while charging (in fact, that was the one time I've repeatedly said it can't move) but it definitely can move while deploying and deployment isn't even difficult. We see Garrod go through the procedure (if you want to call it that) several times, and really all it involves is flicking a cap on the G-Controller to expose a button and pressing it. That's it. That's not something that's excessively strenuous in pitched combat. The delay between activation and charging is only a few seconds, during which he can move as he wishes too so I really think you're over stating things here.

> There are very good reasons you don't oft see the DX pulling out the big gun in the middle of a battlefield

Correct; the main one being that Garrod and most of the other pilots who have had one don't like using it and refrain from doing so as much as they can. The Frost Brothers were the only ones with lower restraint and they didn't have one or easy access to the laser system to charge it for the majority of the show.