War in the Pocket

General consensus on /m/ used to be that it was great, likely the best Gundam had to offer. It told a good "war is hell" story without really vilifying anyone much, and had some of the best designs the series had ever seen.
Although because it was considered good, now /m/ will do nothing but deride it in a childish attempt to appear insightful and independent by going against the grain.

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>>15735386
>and had some of the best designs the series had ever seen.
You had me until this point.

>>15735363
My biggest problem was that Christina sucked major dick, actually she didn't even suck, that's because she hardly had any screen time. They tried to make the end seem all tragic because it was two lovers fighting, but I didn't feel like they had that good of an anything.

>>15735400
>They tried to make the end seem all tragic because it was two lovers fighting, but I didn't feel like they had that good of an anything.
What? No, that's simply not true. They never built up to anything amounting to a relationship.

The end being tragic has to do with the fact that Bernie's going on a suicidal mission to save the colony when it turns out that the colony's no longer being threatened with destruction. It is not about two lovers fighting each other.

2nd best gundam entry.

>>15735363
>what's wrong, Al? I'm sure another war will start

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>>15735390
Not a fan of the chobam armor, I take it?

>>15735406
Some good points here, I'll add from a different angle.

>>15735400
>They tried to make the end seem all tragic because it was two lovers fighting
Yeah, no, I wouldn't go quite that far. The tragic irony here is that the Gundam is seen by Bernie and Al as this monstrous thing to defeat, as something to be scared of and, in the case of Bernie, to generally avoid. Chris, who pilots the Gundam, is seen as a warm and caring sisterly figure to Al, and a potential love interest for Bernie. It's not quite a romance, but there is a budding courtship. Either way, who Chris is to Al and Bernie are in complete opposition to what the Gundam means to them, and that revealed juxtaposition adds to the tragedy. Unwittingly, Bernie and Al did their best to kill Chris, something that they would never have willingly done.

There's also a distinct tragedy in the fact that everyone was just doing their jobs and everything still turns to shit. Aside from Commander Killing, there isn't really a bad guy.

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>>15735390
>The MS equivalent of pic related looks dumb

Just because Chobham Armor's a thing doesn't make the good shit like MP Guncannon or Hygogg irrelevant

It's good, I felt it could have been cut down in some places

>>15735422
>>15735406

To be honest before I watched it too many people would describe it as two lovers fighting, so I probably pushed that idea onto myself without realizing. Kinda my fault for listening to people who haven't watched any Gundam besides War in the Pocket.
I still stand by my point that she was completely irrelevant to the story though.

>>15735444
Well, she does serve a narrative purpose for Al. In the time since she's been away, Al's life has not worked out for him. His academics are shit, his parents are divorced or separated (the subtext suggests it was pretty acrimonious w/ "give this to your mother for me"), and he's just not developing properly relative to the other kids. His two friends are also fuck-ups, but they're somehow more responsible than him.

Chris serves to reconnect Al a bit to where he used to be, and the scenes in her home place Al in a family context that's idyllic compared to what he's living. Al's whole relationship with Bernie is a surrogate father/brother relationship to replace the one he has with his family. Then, when Al and Bernie have their fight and Bernie wants to run away, it's Chris who redirects Al back towards having a positive relationship with Bernie instead of Al burning bridges like he did with his parents, and like his parents did with each other. Bernie and Chris end up, in their own imperfect ways, direct Al's development by modelling the positive aspects of parental role models. Bernie plays the role of who Al wants to be, and Chris plays the role of someone Al can go back to when he needs help.

Now, I have to admit, I'm inferring and expanding quite a bit here, but the key elements are present in the show. The weak link, if anything, is not showing more of what Chris means to Al or, rather, what Chris meant to Al when they were younger.

>>15735363
Good show, but I strongly disagree that it's the best of Gundam. 0079 was much better, it told a better war story with all kinds of characters with unique motivations on both sides. 0080 seemed like it was trying too hard to be sad, like it was saying "look at all this suffering, doesn't it just make you want to cry? this is so dramatic and emotional".

Also, Al wasn't an interesting lead, and it's still odd to me that Bernie allowed a child to play along in dangerous military situations like that.

>>15735482
>Also, Al wasn't an interesting lead, and it's still odd to me that Bernie allowed a child to play along in dangerous military situations like that.
You know that, like, 50% of humanity died during opening parts of the OYW, right? It's not the kind of war that you could shield children from.

Besides, Al was never going to listen, and always involved himself without anyone else's help or instruction. Better the Cyclops team know where Al is than risk crushing him with shotgun shells from the Kampfer.

I wrote a post in my language for it, so I wrote everything I think about it there. But of course, it is pretty good.

>>15735390
It's been a while since I've seen 0080, was this actually in the show? If not, where does it come from?

>>15735509
When the Alex activates against the Kampfer, its wearing the chobham armor. The Kampfer then wraps a link of mines around the Alex, the mines detonate, and the Alex purges the armor.

>>15735509
Yes, for some reason while undergoing software calibrations and testing inside the hangar, the machine is already wearing the chobham armor.

>>15735422
>>15735444
>>15735472
The point of Bernie's and Chris's relationship is to emphasis the "war is hell" theme by showing how because of the war their potential relationship was squandered.

>>15735482
>it's still odd to me that Bernie allowed a child to play along in dangerous military situations like that.

They were both naive kids, that's the point. Bernie may be a soldier but he is still a green horn and the way he boast to Al is similar to how Al boast to his two friends. He might be old enough to kill but he still has a lot of maturing to do. It's to emphasis how the war has wasted everyone's youth.

capthca: kino

>>15735363
>>15735386
War in the Pocket is among the absolute very best the Mobile Suit Gundam franchise has to offer. What makes this work even more amazing is its uniqueness within the franchise. I think War in the Pocket is the Gundam Tomino wanted to make but never quite could due to executive meddling: It's a Gundam story that ignores scenes of mandatory gunpla advertisement combat and mysterious magic super powers in order to tell a very personal story about people caught in a senseless war. War in the Pocket explores the tragedy of war like no other entry in the franchise.

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Alex is my waifu.

>>15735363
My first Gundam so I understandably loved it. I've yet to re-visit it though since I'm afraid the magic will be gone.

>>15735386

> It told a good "war is hell" story without really vilifying anyone much

Commander Killing is an outright villain, so I can't really agree with that part. He could stand with the Zabis or any other series villain given his general attitude. 0080 generally villified the Cyclops team outside Bernie really.

>>15735444

> I still stand by my point that she was completely irrelevant to the story though

She was the antagonist and didn't really need any more relevence than that. She was the obstacle that Bernie needed to overcome, both physically and emotionally/mentally, since he had to overcome his fear of facing her to become the man both he and Al wanted him to be, and she did it while being a perfectly nice person to represent how the enemy in war is often just a regular person with human motives who wants to do the right thing, same as you and not some awful baby killer looking to burn you and your family in their beds or something. I don't know what more relevence you think she needed. She could have had more characterization or screen presence, but she didn't need it and doing so would have taken away from time the production could be focusing on other things.

>>15735597

I doubt it, both because 0080 told a personal story and Tomino seems to enjoy telling a wider story that takes in organizations and society as a whole, not just a tiny group of people and because I don't get the sense that the "mysterious magic super powers" are anything that was ever forced on him by sponsors as you are implying. Newtypism seems to be something he employs by his own discretion to represent human potential and not something that was pushed on him. I can't see Tomino ever turning out anything like 0080 personally.

>>15735736
>I can't see Tomino ever turning out anything like 0080 personally.
>what is Ideon

>>15735742

Ideon has a far wider scope than 0080 and has the kind of mysticism that post implied was pushed on him in the form of the Ide. If all he meant was a darker tone then Victory exists regardless.

>>15735744
>Tomino seems to enjoy telling a wider story that takes in organizations and society as a whole, not just a tiny group of people
>what is Ideon

>>15735749

Ideon tells a story about wider society and organizations alongside a group story just like 0079 and most every one of his story.

>>15735422
>Unwittingly, Bernie and Al did their best to kill Chris, something that they would never have willingly done.

Correct. This is why 0080's story telling is both delicate and poignant. It shows how War drives foreign thoughts/actions within "normal" people, the likes of which would never exist in polite day-to-day life without war.

The look on Al's face when he sees Chris is the pilot of Alex is just a kick in the nuts.

His friend just died, only to see that his other friend very nearly died, thanks to the both of them.

This is tragedy in it's purest form-- Chris, Al and Bernie are all in the wrong place at the wrong time and we see that slow burn take place. We're screaming at the television because we see the bigger picture-- the characters cannot until it is too late.

>>15735597
>>15735472
Great points-- Chris's character was instrumental to the short series.

Put another way, she is the Adrian Toomes at the front door, only we the viewers were privy to this long before whereas Bernie and Al aren't.

The fact that Bernie nor Chris never knew what each other meant to one another, in context of the War and final battle, literally takes your breath away.

I can't wait for the Blu-rays.

>>15735390
Look, The chobham armor may not have looked too great, but it only lasted a minute, and revealed one of the best Gundam designs ever underneath it. I'd hardly call that a strike against the shows design. The redesigns to Zaku II, Dom, Gelgoog, and Z'gok, along with the Hygogg, ALEX, and Kampfer, the designs were absolutely brilliant

>>15735444
She's just some girl. Just like Bernie isn't Char, he's not a fucking ace like he tells Al, he's just some kid who's been in a Zaku II three times. Al isn't even allowed the luxury of hating the person who killed Bernie because she's just the cute girl who lives next door to him. Really hammers home Bernie's point in his last message about them both being soldiers just doing their jo, and why he shouldn't hate them for that.

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Chris is my waifu.

>>15735363
It's the artistic high-point of Gundam in my opinion.

It's not the funnest show or the one I've re-watched the most but it's the most poignant.

I always tell people who don't care for the idea of Gundam or mecha to watch it because I think it transcends being "a good Gundam story" and is just a good story. It's also short and accessible, not really relying much on any backstory.

>>15735998
I read that as Eugene Tooms at first and was very confused.

Didn't GAINAX work on 0080?

>>15736751
Kinda-sorta. It wasn't Gainax yet.

>>15736751
It was written by one of the founders (and current president) of Gainax

>>15735597
>tell a very personal story about people caught in a senseless war. War in the Pocket explores the tragedy of war like no other entry in the franchise.
Literally Victory in a nutshell.
Uso loses his entire family. He loses his mother figures, his actual mother, his brother-figure, his father figures, his father etc.
Nothing gets more personal and tragic than Victory, which is why I would rank it as the utter best Gundam has.

>>15735363
Worst UC entry and total boredom.

>>15736815
Ok. That way to the egress.

>>15735472
holy shit; it's like you actually watched and comprehended the show instead of playing on your phone and spouting memes

>>15736775
Victory's problem was that aesthetically, it was a pile of shit. You can go on and on about the concepts, but all of the action, the designs, etc. do not survive the test of time. Helicopter MS, motorcycle battleships, bikini babe assault squads etc. pretty much doomed it to cult status.

>>15735363

Didn't really enjoy it personally. Al was an annoying, and I thought Chris got barely any screentime.

Good action though.

>>15736979
Victory actually has possible the best action in the entire franchise though?

>>15735736
The Cyclops team aren't vilified at all, just realistically shown to be as brutal as an undercover special forces team might have to be to maintain their cover and carry out their mission. Otherwise they're shown to have good qualities. Mikhail is gregarious, Steiner follows his duty as a soldier despite realizing that his situation is largely hopeless, Garcia is hostile to Bernie at first but later shows protectiveness for him. I mean Bernie doesn't feel guilty over their deaths for no reason.

>>15735736
>Commander Killing is an outright villain

Higher-ups in a fascist military organisation wo are that devoted to its leadership tend to be awful people, yes.

>>15737858
>complaints about Al annoying
>praises the action

The Point
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Yo' head

>>15735434
...it's 6 fucking episodes

>>15735736
>>15738499
>Commander Killing is an outright villain
>Killing
no one would have ever guessed

>>15736775
Problem was it did all that shit alongside bikini bazooka girls, robot hamster wheels, shotacon bathtup slapstick and a fucking moving fortress shaped like a motorbike.
Every time it's about to get harrowing it does something totally silly that ruins it.

>>15735736
>Its a Zeonfag post
Yeah they're the bad guys deal with it fedorafaggot edgelord

>>15738506
>the problem is it does that alongside all this cool stuff
You're not making any sense.

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It's a christmas tradition at my house.
I'm especially partial to it since it was my first Gundam show. Between this and Gundam 00 I was looking at Gundams as horrible cursed weapons that shouldn't exist, even though they were ultimately being used for good.

Ten years later I still can't bring myself to kill Bernie when I do the 0080 mission on Gundam Battle Survive, I just kind of wander around until my wingmen kill him. I have no problem killing the Alex, though, and whenever it shows up in free-for-all battles I often ignore everyone else and just kill the Alex over and over.

>>15735363
Old, tired, low energy, and full of fail.

>>15735363
Timeless, lively, high energy, and full of success.

>>15738240
It'll be the lack of shading he dislikes.
V Gundam is certainly one of my favourite series of all-time.

>>15740157
I want many bad things to happen to you.

Judging by that post, though, they already have.

>>15740157
>Old, tired, low energy, and full of fail.

Are you sure you're not talking about yourself...or me...?

>>15736713
I've made it a point to watch 0080 every Christmas Eve since it aired on Toonami.

Even got the fiance to make it a small family tradition. Its a really sobering few hours to reflect on the pointlessness of war and loss of life, given the joy and merriment around that time of year.

>>15742918
Thanks for the blog.