Can someone explain why people like the Federation? They are

>globalist government
>working

>>15292710
>They are just as bad as Zeon but have Gundams.
Oh fuck off Zeek. Cry me a river, build a bridge, and drop a colony on it, spaceman.

>>15292710
desu I can understand why spacenoids would be frustrated at being governed by people who aren't even on the same celestial body
But the feds aren't the ones gassing and dropping colonies, so obviously they're seen as the better of the two evils.

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The have the best captain.

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>>15292756

It's been a few years /m/ but feddie autists are still frustrated dorks about fictional organisations that have more cooler ms on average.

>>15292744
>implying that globalism isn't the natural result of our society's evolution

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>>15292784

More like the natural result of our society's moral and intellectual degeneration thanks to 200 years worth of post enlightenment thought.

Both are awful for different reasons

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>>15292790
>MUH DEGRADING SOCIETY

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>>15292806
>MUH MUHS
>MUH I CAN'T RESPOND

It's the uniforms.

>>15292784
Zeon is still shitter than the Federation. I agree that normally I'd hate 'em, but fuck Zeeks.

>>15292710
There is an archive here. You'll find all the answers you need.

>>15292710
I'll take asshole NATO over psychotic space nazis any day

>>15292818
Only retatds can deny the progress of humanity.

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>>15292835
>Only retatds can deny the progress of humanity.
>retatds

okay Char

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>>15292842

>>15292853
Can you really trust someone whose eyebrows look like rat poop?

They have Bright and best looking MS designs like GMs, Guncannons, Jegans, ReZELs, and Jestas.

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Zeon are a godawful organisation that gasses people and drops colonies on shitposters, potatoes and donut supplies. I just like the individuals and the suits, people who vigorously shit themselves over how you can like them are in the same caliber as shitposters from /k/.

That said, Tomino intentionally gives them more sympathy, it's supposed to contrast the faceless bureaucracy of the Federation. You're only supposed to feel sympathy for the Federation military and the immediate white base crew who they're forced to send into continuous battle.

Overall I think Tomino's intentions were to show the Federation's continued existence to be a part of why things never stop fucking up when you refuse to allow spacenoids to even live on Earth while you think it's a good idea to slovenly govern same said spacenoids on their sides, it's a never ending meat grinder. I'm not supporting zeeks either, it's just the corrupt EF send their soldiers into a meat grinder they made themselves.

im with zeon. they got better shit.

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>>15292853
>Zakus are really powerful
Not powerful enough.

>>15292973
Bernie would've won if the cowardly Federation pilot hadn't targeted the Zaku's cockpit like a vicious murderer, but I guess that's the best you can expect from an oldtype.

>>15292710
Well, they never murdered a third of the human species, so they're kind of the good guys by default. If one side has killed nearly four times as many people as every genocide and mass murder in human history put together, it's pretty easy to excuse anything the other guys do.

>>15292963
Only correct answer, desu. Most organizations have some justification for their existence and internal contradictions within them can determine whether they succeed or fail, and whether they are viewed as legitimate or create enemies. I think that any good Gundam with conflict between such organizations should be able to show this.

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>>15292710
The Federation isn't perfect, but they're the lesser of two evils. Through most of the UC series, the zeeks are portrayed as willing to commit mass genocide (sometimes successfully) because they got their panties in a twist and the Federation is unfortunately tasked which trying to put out the fire.

>>15292973
Fuck off, Bernie fucked Alex's shit up

>>15292981
>Bernie would've won if they person he was trying to kill didn't killed him first
That overhead would've gone though Christina's face if she didnt aint for the cockpit

>>15293061
Only because the pilot sucked balls

>>15293063
*aim for the cockpit

>>15292710
>They are just as bad as Zeon
I wonder who's behind this post?

>>15292853
>GMs suck
when will this meme die? GMs outclass Zaku IIs in every field that's why the Feddies won the One Year War

>gundams
>bright
"I don't see the appeal"

are you brain damaged?

>>15292710
The Federation is worse during peacetime, obviously, but wartime atrocities tend not to be forgotten or forgiven, in part because they tend to inflict heavy losses very suddenly. Shock and awe has a downside.

>>15292790
>Degeneration
The Enlightenment is the only reason we're still here, almost a century after gaining the power to wipe the surface of the planet clean in an instant. You'd better hope progressives win these culture wars; conservative ideologies in the face of a quickly advancing technology is a great way to get Matrix'd/Planet of the Apes'd.

Federation is a hollow shell of a government. The Earth Sphere is really run by powerful families, foundations, and companies.

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>>15292710
I took the titan pill, desu.

It was either them, space autists or earth jews.

>>15292710
>They're bad as Zeon
When Zeon seems like losing, Zeon drop bunch of colonies, gas a few million people and drop an Asteroid to force Earthnoids to leave Earth.

When Earth Federation get their collective ass handed to them by a Feminist Empire from space they man the fuck up pull out their shit together for a final last stand to protect Earth

>>15292710
Zeon are space nazis, killed numerous "fellow" spacenoids because of "muh freedom" and "muh ideals", got fucked in the ass in the end.

Federation is just corrupt and incompetent, they couldn't prevent the OYW, they let Delaz played them like a fiddle, they let the Titans reach power and kept fucking up till the end of time,

Still, there are some considerations
Zakus are way better and more memorable than GMs but the Gundam just tramples everything.
Zeon has better women. Cima, Lalah, Haman just to say a few
The Federation had Noa, Matilda and Revil, on the Zeon side everyone aside from Char is useless honorable mention to Ramba Ral tho

In the end I would rather be on side 6 and have a beautiful zeek wife than be a feddie or zeek

>>15293961
I was about to get mad before seeing that spoiler.
If only he was not that loyal to Zeon, he could probably join White Base acting to support Sayla.

But nah considering Feddies and Zeon's state at that point he'd probably be executed or even blew Artesia's disguise.

>gihren was a good boy! he dindu nuffin!

>>15293935
so is Victory Gundam still cannon?

>>15293370
They've already won the culture wars. No one in the younger generations cares if you're a minority unless they're in the vocal minorities of SJW or /pol/tard

>>15293935
>When Earth Federation get their collective ass handed to them by a Feminist Empire from space they man the fuck up pull out their shit together for a final last stand to protect Earth
I can only imagine who notRevil was. Perhaps a GM pilot during the OYW? Captain of a gunship? Where did he come from and how did he grow into the footsteps of the great man that proceeded him.

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>>15292710
1: They have GMs
2: They have Guncannons
3: They have GM Cannons

>>15292973
Powerful enough to cook a mean burger.

>>15294058
Maybe one the pilots during the Axis shock perhaps.

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>>15292710
WHY DO YOU LIKE ZEON!? I BET THE AEUG IS BEHIND THIS POST!

>>15293961
>Zakus are way better and more memorable than GMs
I'll agree on more memorable but in no way they are better than GMs. The standard GM is better than every single Zeon suit up to the Gelgoog.

>>15292710
I like the look of their uniforms, mobile suits, and ships.

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Japan rewriting history yet again with Zeon war crime denials and Federation war crimes popping out of nowhere.

>>15293217
But zeon had gitgud and Dom by then

>>15292710
>Can someone explain why people like the Federation?
People don't. Hell, the highest praise they've received in this very thread is that they're the lesser of two evils.

That's the point--you understood the message.

Omedetou.

>>15294136
>When the colony drop never happened but you want it to happen again

>>15292710
Western audiences completely miss the fucking point, as usual.

Both the Federation and Zeon are bad guys, the whole idea is that people who make war are bad and the people forced to fight in wars are victims along with the innocent civilians (that they often willingly slaughter, but that's for another rant).

This has basically been the way of Japanese media since WWII ended. Soldiers are heroes and brass are bad guys, no matter what side.

>>15292833
That one gets it. Zeon is space Hitler at worst and space Hoering at best, fuck em.

>>15292963
>Tomino intentionally gives them more sympathy, it's supposed to contrast the faceless bureaucracy of the Federation. You're only supposed to feel sympathy for the Federation military and the immediate white base crew who they're forced to send into continuous battle.
So, Fallout: New Vegas in space?

>>15294252
i thought the message was buy gundam models you mindless zombies

>>15294275
There can be more than one message.

Plus while the idea may be incredibly hard for amerifats to grasp, to Japanese people the trope is about as deep as "AMERICA FUCK YEAH" in a Micheal Bay movie. It's just a given that if the show has soldiers and military shit, that's how it's going to depict things.

Looks like fedfags think of Zeeks killing civilians as if it was their endgoal. But nobody thinks of reasons which are making zeeks act like this. And the reasons are not MUH IDEOLOGY N LIVERSHIP, but solely economical. Zabis are trying to take their cut of the space market for themselves and their financial supporters.
Also, some people are forgetting about feds waging space battles in the middle of colony bunches and making uneven deals between Earth companies and space companies
So, both Zabis and Feds are shit and the only good guys are Deikun family

>>15292790
Now,as a person who does think society is degrading I`ll tell you that the Earth Federation being formed would fix a good amount of this society`s issues,like instantly. Cry me a river,zeekfag.

>>15294328
>but solely economical.

Nah, if Zeon wanted to pursue economical goal they would have been similar to Side 6, instead they rammed up their military for world domination

>>15294328
>fedfags think of Zeeks killing civilians as if it was their endgoal.

Well if your superior have no problem gassing a million people and use their home to crash in on Earth and DO IT TWICE IN THE SAME FUCKING MONTH normal people like to think that killing people is a national sport for Zeon.

>>15294340
Sometimes you can't reach the goal in economical means and diplomatic ways. Especially if you and your billionaire friends want to dominate on all the markets
The independence of Side 6 was achieved with the support of Zeon troops only.

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>>15294328
>and the only good guys are Deikun family
>space commies
>good guys
You're from the A-YOOG aren't you?

>>15294348
There is a difference between a trade war and total genocide.
While side 6 manage to achieve its independence thanks to the help of Zeon, it still maintain a good diplomatic ties with the parent countries, allowing EF to dock there and have a military presence inside the colony which can led to economic treaties between the two.

While Zeon refuse any diplomatic ties with the Feds but still wanted the same slice of pies the fed share with Side 6. Any sane person would say Zeon is fucking crazy. If you wanted these pie then perhaps should follow the same rules like everyone else.

TL;DR Zeon is like fucking North Korea...keep whining to everyone how everyone hated North Korea by not allowing trade with them but at the same time ignore international treaties and threatens their neighbor with nuclear fire

>>15292710
You can't go wrong with space commies.
And AEUG is more of the reformist group, than revolutionary.

>>15294370
First thing is that you clearly don't know what genocide is. Genocide is killing some certain ethnic group on purpose. Zeeks have killed many civilians, but that's not genocide. That's a warcrime indeed.
Every war is waged over trading and gaining resources, since every state and government is supported by local owners of the means of production. Historical examples are easy to find.
About relations with Side 6: Side 6 is Space Switzerland, where all kinds of spy operations and shady deals are to be done. Both axis and allies had nice relations with Switzerland, and Switzerland was okay with this.

>>15292790

People have been complaining about the degeneration of society since about 15 minutes after society was a thing. Even back in ancient Greece people were complaining that reading was polluting society because having something written down meant you didn't have to remember it and memory wasn't as good as a result. And that's 2500 years ago, never mind 200. I'd almost guarantee that there was a grouch at the first campfire complaining that not having to endure cold was degrading society and making them less resistant to the elements, even if he had to do it in grunts. Or someone complaining that this walking on two legs malarky was destroying the species ability to climb trees.

Those things are all true by the way. Our memories are worse due to not having to recall everything, and we are worse at climbing than species like monkeys that use all 4 limbs or have prehensile tails, but the brainpower we free up by not doing that often goes to something different, so it balances in the end. Society isn't worse (or better really), just different.

>>15292963

I don't even think his intention was that specific to be honest. I'd say it's more likely he wanted to convey that people with power are generally kind of dicks and are loathe to surrender any of it, while those without power are often led by dicks who really just want that power for themselves but cloak it in good intentions to gain followers.

>>15293448

So like reality then.

>>15294136

Unicorn didn't deny a single Zeon war crime. It discussed them several times even really. It just made the Federation equally culpable. Which is really just in line with Tomino's probable intention.

>>15294252

That theme is hardly unique to Japanese media, and can be found in a lot of European media regarding war. It's not as prevalent currently in America, but I'm pretty sure a lot of post war American stuff in the 60s and 70s had it too.

>>15294328

> Looks like fedfags think of Zeeks killing civilians as if it was their endgoal

To be fair, Gihren literally did want to kill large numbers of civilians as an end goal.

>>15294383

Genocide isn't just killing an entire ethnic group on purpose though. It's the deliberate killing of large numbers of people based on nationality, ethnicity or any other social or cultural division. It includes but isn't limited to killing all of an ethnic group. You could call Gihren's attempt to cull society genocide because he wanted to decimate Earthnoids to make his Spacenoid regime easier to rule.

>>15292710
One side drops colonies.

The other side has Gundams.

How can anyone not side with the Federation?

>>15295495
this

ITT we talk about why every government that's ever existed is shit but there's no better alternative yet

>>15295489
You're oversimplifying. Gihren's goal is absolute political and economic domination over the rest of the galaxy. And killing people is a step.
About genocide - I don't remember any non-ethnic genocide.

>>15295505
Alternative can come only after full automatisation of production and successful development of uncontrolled AI.
The labor of people will become more intellectual (since all the low qualification work can be done by robots) and people would be interested in forming new kind of society.
And the society we live in can't give us a government, which won't be bad in the perspective.

>>15296130
Someone post it.

>>15296193

Gihren wanted to reduce the population to make control of the Earthsphere easier. Control was his motive, but killing people was a goal in and of itself for him. Also, the Khmer Rouge genocide of Cambodia wasn't ethnic for a start, it was Cambodians killing fellow Cambodians.

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>>15296130

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>>15292710
As some have said, the lesser of two evils.

>>15292767
>But the feds aren't the ones gassing and dropping colonies

That's right, they just nuke them instead.

Why does everyone forget that the Federation started massacring innocent civilians as revenge?

The Earth Federation caused half the deaths of the One Year War, they're just as bad, that's the point.

>>15296251
I mean seriously, this guy can't have believed for a second his plan would work, right?

For one thing only a single member of his family was appealing enough to other, saner human beings to reproduce. And their child was opposed to their methods. So their family line was as doomed as soon as it began.

Then there's the fact that he can't fucking possibly buy this much into his own hype.

>>15296289
>The Earth Federation caused half the deaths of the One Year War
Physically impossible when we know a third of all humanity was killed by Zeon before the Federation could even properly retaliate, and that all the way through Jaburo Zeon held a MASSIVE advantage in kill count due to winning every military engagement by a landslide.

>>15295488
But it's not. The Federation could have raped and murdered the entire of Side 3 in a blood orgy of Slaneeshian proportions. and they still would have been less awful than Zeon who, I remind you,literally murdered a third of mankind.

>>15296336
If they had managed to smash the Federation's main fleet, during A Boa Qu, they would have had free run of the Earth Sphere. Earth would be colony dropped into submission and the Earth Federation, now lacking Revil, would have capitulated. With Zeon in charge of the gravity well, they;'d have all the power.

>>15296364
For ten years, until they all start killing each other and dying of old age.

Then Mineva says "We're done here." and boom, no more Zeon.

Seriously, getting defeated in the first war is literally the only reason their ideology survived as long as it did.

>>15296336
Its one of the reasons of why I appreciate Degwin
He was able to snap back into reality and say "This needs to stop", he did take his sweet ass time to do it but I guess its better late than ever

>>15296371
The reason why Mineva grew up as she was was because Zeon was fucked and defeated and a few assholes on a rock.

Instead of being the victorious scion and heir to all of the Earth Sphere, educated probably by Uncle Gihren after the inevitable clash between Gihren and Kycilia.

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DOZLE WAS THE BEST ZABI

HE DIDN'T DESERVE TO DIE

FUCK

>>15296591
He was the only one that was a genuine good person in that family

>>15296604
Garma was ok.

>>15292710
Depends on which type of feddie fans you have a bone with. Normal fedfags hate zeon, love jims, but don't mind most of the OVA sidestories since they got legit moments of feddie pilots being awesome.

Then you got Titansfags who are like zeekfag insurgents from /pol/. Or edgelords. Take your pick.

>>15296289
"Half of both sides are dead" means the Federation killed half of Zeon's population and Zeon killed half of the Federation's population.

The Federation is the overwhelmingly vast majority of all human beings in existence.

Zeon is one singular group of space colonies.

Half of Earth is such a larger amount of deaths than half of Zeon that it's mind-boggling to try and grasp just how many people Zeon killed.

>>15292710
They didn't do anything wrong except have shitty leaders that keep enabling Zeon, and they have underdog status due to having to job to make the Gundams look better.

>>15296698
I always had the feeling that 70% of the stuff that happened throughout UC could've been avoided if Mirai was in charge of everything

>>15296336

Garma had a girlfriend and Degwin had had a wife, and also reproduced. Or is he not family? That aside, Mineva had no apparent opinion on their methods during 0079. Not surprising since she's only a baby at the time and didn't express anti-Zabi opinions for over a decade following a lot of experiences she wouldn't have had if her family had lived. We're not born with opinions anon, we form them through experience.

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>>15293961
>Zeon
>Better women

A laugh and a half, to be sure

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>>15297176
>boring slags
>better than Zeon gals

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>>15297176
Crowley was pretty cool.

>>15292710
>Can someone explain why people like the Federation?

They're the protagonists, that's pretty much it. Also you probably like Gundams and GMs, hence why they modeled all the Titans suits in Zeta after Zeon ones.

daily Reminder that Zeon are the SJW of U.C.
Space/Zeon Justice warrior

Zeon have incommon with sjws

>they both get trigger by facts
>they both attack there own supporters
>they both accused Whites/Earthnoids of being nazis and yet they are the ones acting like nazis
>Literally Tumblr
>both have contribute nothing to society
>the mobile suits weren't invented by zeon but by a Ukrainian Jew name Trenov Y. Minovsky which try to jew both zeon and EFF
>both of you guys are act like cucks
>both of youll always keep losing

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>>15294091

>>15296686
The 'both sides lost half their population' line is mistranslated. Side 3 is outright stated to have been untouched by the war. All of Zeon's losses are their frontline soldiers.

>>15296193
>I don't remember any non-ethnic genocide.

Well the Khmer Rouge purge millions of fellow countrymen who wear glasses or has a hint of western influence as it promotes intellectualism. Pol Pot reign basically kill off every educated person and left Cambodia with easy to control populace ie similar to Gihren.

>>15296289
>started massacring innocent civilians as revenge?
After the end of OYW Feds literally keep Side 3 Freedom and do nothing against the Spacenoids but Zeon cucks came out from fucking nowhere and nuke an entire Feds Space Fleets which led to the rise of TITANS.

>The Earth Federation caused half the deaths of the One Year War, they're just as bad, that's the point.
After 3 minutes declaring war Zeon decided to nuke Feds ship station at the colonies and ignoring fellow spacenoids itself and well within 1st week of the war 1/3rd humanity gone. mind you Feds use Nuke to attack Military targets while Zeon uses G3 Gas on civilians and hurled a massive colony at Earth potentially alter its temperature and could've kill more innocent civilians on Earth.

>>15297534
>3 minutes
It was 3 second derp. sorry bout that

>>15297534
I don't deny Khmer Rouge actions, but that glasses coolstory always bugs me. It's too cartoonish to be true.

>>15297545
Well at first I tought that too. Until My dad met one of the refugee who gained PR status at my country and tell him that wearing glasses is the sign of being an intellectual or academic or something even tho he is not/spoiler]

>>15297545
>>15297559
Propaganda 101, if you're going to create an enemy "other," emphasize easily identifiable physical traits.

>>15292710
They have Gundams

>>15293217
By the time they were fielded in the OYW the Zeons had better suit. Iirc they could have won the war if the Gelgoogs went into production line 2 weeks earlier. The thing with GMs is that they were fairly cheap and the feddies just straight up threw a shitload of them and won by outnumbering the zeons rather than by outperforming them

>>15297559

Ethnically I am Chinese, but both sides of my family are from Cambodia and experienced the reign of Pol Pot. My dad remembers the march from the city to the jungle. When my dad's side finally escaped, UN doctors were surprised that he was even alive still

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>>15292710
>>15293496

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>"dude, why can't we just, like, not ever fight and shit?"
>"okay how do you intend to make everyone stop fighting?"
>"uh..."
Gundam™

>>15297711
>"Can we stop fighting and get along?"
>"No."
>"Goddammit"
Gundam™

>>15297743
>and get along
And how do you propose e make everyone "get along"?

>>15297605
It wasn't even that. The desire was to remove all civilization and send the people back to primitive societies. Glasses were a sign of that.

Communism mang.

>>15298922
Get along and don't be violent or I'll kill you with my giant death machine of death.

The true lesson of Gundam is that you should always keep NBC gear and enough firepower to keep people away from you at easy access at all times.

>>15292710
> They are just as bad as Zeon but have Gundams.

I dunno. In some ways, the dumbest thing is the Feddies are not MORE oppressive and totalitarian against spacenoids.

By the end of UC, Spacenoids are 100% responsible for starting multiple wars, each of which usually ends up with them building insane superweapons of mass destruction which they use on their own people. Some spacenoid extremists have even tried to make the planet earth itself unable to support life to suit some batshit crazy ideology.

Its frankly a miracle that the feddies haven't just thrown all of the spacenoids out of their own airlocks, decontaminated the colonies, and restarted the entire space colonization program from scratch with less freedom this time.

If anything, the Feddies have been super accommodating and incredibly lax with a population that has committed unprovoked war crimes roughly every 5 years for the past three decades.

>>15299037
Some people throw tea overboard, some people drop colonies.

Wait people think that the Feds killed half of the population? Who did they target? Themselves? All the sides(apart from side 6 and Side 3) were pro EF. There is no reason for the EF to hurt themselves.

>>15299209
Federation military went around raping and killing their own civilians. see >>15296130

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>>15299220
This post reeks of AEUG

>>15299220
>Federation military went around raping and killing their own civilians.
>cites something that happened in a non-canon novelisation

Zeekfags are literally retarded.

>>15299220
>Federation soldier raping and killing maybe 100-1000 people during the duration of war

FEDERATION IS EVIL GUYS

>Zeon Leadership kill millions with G3 Gas dropping colonies on earth which resulted again in millions of death and the desturction of Earth Ecosystem and was responsible for 1/3rd of humanities lost during the one year war. Oh the Zeon general wipe out his father and his personal guards with a superweapon just because he wanted peace.

ZEON IS MISUNDERSTOOD GUYS

>>15294336
I agree that alot of our current day problems could be fixed by an Earth Federation, but it comes with its own problems as well, which we clearly see in the Universal Century. The biggest issue for the Earth Federation, tho, is that its organized so that the colonies are treated as essentially territories, and dont have proper control over their governance or economic policy, which is kinda fucked considering that most people live in space with many forced to emigrate from the Earth. Not to mention ours just as dominated by elites as most governments, if not more, and this creates problems as they don't want to let go of their control.

>>15297636
GMs also got the benefit of Amuro's combat data from the learning computer, which is pretty big considering he was facing nonstop combat against Zeon's aces and newest mobile suits.

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>>15299220
>>15296130

Not even canon.

>>15292710

For me, EFF mecha are styled to look like heroes. Zeon mecha are styled to look like space nazi trolls or ogres.

>>15292710
I thought one of the points that OG MSG and Zeta was trying to get across is that no side is really more righteous than the other, and it's the people between that suffer because of their actions.

>>15302459
The opening and show of MSG heavily imply Zeon was responsible for most of the atrocities

Zeta was about the Federation needing an anti-Zeon force considering what happened in stardust. Some one(Jamitov) takes advantage of this and uses it as his personal army. Hell Titan is basically evil Londo Bell.

>>15292835
Progress isn't a one way arrow and the world is not square!

>>15295488
If society is only different, not better, then what is the motive for "progress"

>>15299037
Oppressing all of space costs more than the EF is willing to spend

>>15292767
>desu I can understand why spacenoids would be frustrated at being governed by people who aren't even on the same celestial body
Here's the thing: that excuse doesn't fly. We can bitch about "distant rule" back in the day when it took months to get from one end of the empire to another in person and messages were only slightly faster, but we've got jetliners and satellite uplinks now. Shit in Gundam's even faster, with spaceship voyages from the Moon to Earth in like two goddamn days, and none of the Sides are much further than the Moon. (In)efficiency over distance is a function of communications and travel infrastructure, and the Minovsky fog never actually blocked Side-to-Side or Side-to-Earth communication.

It's fine to want self rule, but that just invites conflict and bullshit trade agreements and all of that other crap. You may as well argue that the US shouldn't be one country because all of the States would be better off on their own. Yeah, okay, California and Texas would be fine, but Minnesota and Mississippi and South Dakota would be fucking trashed. Why stop at the state level, though? Why shouldn't every city be independent? Why not chunks of blocks within a city? Why not houses on a block? It's because things work best and most efficiently on the largest scale.

So, a big union of all the Sides is obviously the best idea. Where should we put the central government? What one object is more or less equidistance to all of them?

THE
FUCKING
EAAAAAAAAARTH

>>15292710

The only thing they did wrong was not colony drop onto Zeon until it became a new Mars.

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>>15299037
Logic and even common sense dictates that, but remember that Zeon is Japmonkey fantasy wish fullfilment for a post-WW II Nippon that was never cucked and neutered into becoming the perfect little helpless bitch-slut client state. The Federation will never be portrayed as that competent.

>>15299037
90% of it is the LITERAL NAZI LOVERS and their FUCKING SPACE MONARCHY, though.

>>15302686
No doubt. And while Zeon can be seen responsible for things, Zeta shows you that the Federation (with the corruption of power and wanting to reject spacenoids through hostile means) aren't exactly the clear cut good guys.

>>15302828
Globalist jew pls go

>>15302802

Most progress isn't done by people looking to improve society, it's done by people looking to make something simpler and more efficient or to allow something that wasn't possible before. How that changes society is beyond their scope of foresight or control.

>>15302828
Small-scale federation nations are fine.

A one-world government is a bad idea. Humans are tribal by nature.

>>15303296
>smth is against human nature
Monogamous family is against human nature.
Human nature changes with centuries

>>15303296
>Humans are tribal by nature.
And the tribal structure the human brain is designed to accommodate? Roughly 150-ish people.

So yeah, if you're trying to argue from a biological standpoint I hope you like your nations really fucking small, because once you start hitting the thousands or millions it stops making a difference, as long as you have the infrastructure to support it.

>>15303359
Most European nations are pretty small; Japan is too.

>>15303388
Not small enough to matter for human 'tribal' considerations; the smallest (actually recognized) nation on Earth by population is the Vatican, and setting aside all the people who just visit the place they still have like, 3 times more people than your brain is wired to accept as a 'tribe'. Everyone else is 4+ digits.

>>15303402
Not really. Europe as a whole can fall under a "European tribe", which is further divided into the smaller tribes of the nations.

Why do you think there's a culture clash between Europeans and non-Europeans going on? The outsiders are not part of the tribe of Europe.

>>15303425
>the tribe of Europe
I see you've never lived or visited there in any meaningful capacity.

>>15303425
Shut up Gihren, you have no fucking idea how basic human biology works yet that biology is the cornerstone of your entire theory.

Europeans fucking HATE each other, and have hated each other for literally ever. The French hate the English, the English hate the Scots, the Scots hate the Norwegians, the Norwegians hate the Germans, the Germans hate the French AND the Italians, the Italians hate the English, the Sicilians, other Italians from different former city-states, and Greece, Greece hates Yugoslavia, and the slavs hate literally everyone. There is no "European tribe" you uneducated nigger.

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>>15292710
fedfags will defend this

>>15302828
Why not remove earth and but something that won;t weigh down peoples souls in its place?

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>>15292710
because they carry the best faction under their wing

>>15303632
>implying being weighed down by gravity is a bad thing

Stop drinking the Kool Aid of Char and his lunatic father. Remember that it's Spacenoids, the supposed 'enlightened', 'evolved' people 'unbound by gravity' who continually start wars. go around mass murdering their fellow Spacenoid neighbours with abandon and keep trying to genocide everyone on Earth. Meanwhile, the Earthnoids, the ones who are supposed to be unenlightened Oldtype barbarians bound by gravity are the ones who are relatively chill and don't hold grudges despite as >>15299037 pointed out, it being understandable if they'd want to bathe the colonies in the blood of Spacenoids after that fourth Spacenoid attempt to murder everyone on Earth.

>>15302996
> Federation (with the corruption of power and wanting to reject spacenoids through hostile means) aren't exactly the clear cut good guys.)

>The Feds are not the good guys
>They who have a choice between surrendering to another spacenoids aggressor or kick their sorry ass again
>Choose to kick their collective asses
>In a brink of total collapse but still holding on
>throw everything they have including an obsolete cruiser to the fray to protect Earth
>The Feminist Empire have numerous technological advance battleship and a WMD that can mind wipe everyone on Earth
>In a face of total annihilation the Feds prepare a one final last stand to protect Earth
>To protect Earth
>Not the good guys

>>15303867
The Feds can be incredibly incompetent and shady at times, but when the situation really warrants it shit gets done

>>15292710
The Federation has status-quo bias going for them. They don't have to start wars over control of the Earth Sphere like most of the antagonist factions in UC Gundam do because they already have it. Obviously without the consent of the governed because they keep starting those wars over it, but it doesn't really matter. To our (very modern in the scope of history) views of guy who initiates violence =always the bad guy, they end up looking pretty good.

>>15297534
And Pol Pot was weaponized and backed by the IRL Feds, USA :^)

>>15303912
>Obviously without the consent of the governed because they keep starting those wars over it
That's vastly overestimating how many people fight against the Federation. During the OYW it's a single side fighting the rest and Earth. For the remainder of early UC its REMNANTS of that faction fighting against Earth. Not even a single side any more; Side 3 citizens hated Haman coming back in and forcing them to work in the mines, and supporters of Char's Neo Zeon movement were really only concentrated in the Sweetwater space colony, with some elements spread out in other colonies.

After Zeon remnants stop instigating wars? Twenty years of peace, until a self-righteous side starts attacking OTHER SIDES first before they attack Earth. After their war ends? Peace until UC 153, when another side starts conquering OTHER SIDES before attacking earth (or a bit earlier when Jovians decide that, fuck it, they want Earth too).

In the Federations history, it's never a majority of, or even multiple, sides opposing the Federation at one time; it's always at most single side thinking that THEY should be the ones in control, and attacking everyone else. When Zeon-led Side 3 waged war, they were the only ones to do so; when the Cosmo Babylonia-led colonies at Side 4 attacked, they were the only ones to do so; when the Zanscare Empire-led Side 2 colonies attacked, they were the only ones to do so. Out of the SEVEN sides, only THREE (really only two and a subset of colonies of one side) ever decided to contest the Earth Federation's rule, with the majority of sides never starting anything. And they always contest the Federation's rule for the reason that THEY want to be the ones in charge; only Zeon ever uses claims of Spacenoid oppression as a casus belli, and dubiously so in their case.

>>15299014
The Khmer Rogue was barely even communist in name, I've read countless accounts and none of them had any idea what Marxism was, considering going back to primitive relations is the exact opposite of anything Marx ever would have desired, a community college humanities class teaches that much.

Pol Pot and his backers were just literally insane and co-opted workers movements for their gain. If they were Communist, they wouldn't have been the CIA puppets that they indeed were.

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>>15292710

>>15303968
You're ignoring the AEUG entirely, which despite having moderates that eventually reconciled with the Federation after the defeat of the Titans was still an anti-Federation group, and many of its members were the ones to join Char in Sweetwater.

Also by Victory the Federation had weakened severely and lost most of its control over the space colonies, not just the Zanscare controlled ones.

Spacenoids are never shown to be overtly pro-Federation in UC gundam. The Federation is only tolerated and sided with over groups seen as worse than it at best. Also a big part of ZZ Gundam was how Federation officials collaborated with Haman because she promised they would be able to keep their privileged stations under her rule and anti-Federation resistance groups were ironically the ones fighting to defend Earth from her.

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>>15304431
The AEUG are mostly ex-EFSF.

>and many of its members were the ones to join Char in Sweetwater.

Citation needed. Literally the only ex-AEUG we see are with Londo Bell, you know, the ones fighting against Char.

>>15302779
Don't forget, it was a setup by Cima and Bask to spark conflict and forcibly take control of the EFF forces.

I think The Origin turned me into a Zeek apologist. Char is just too cool.

>>15304431

Most of the pro EF space colonists were killed during the one week war.

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>>15302828
>California would be fine on its own
>a state they literally needs to borrow water would be fine
>Minnesota
>a state full of fucking farmland, fresh water, and mineral resources would not be fine
M8 are you havin a giggle

>>15304584
But Char doesn't give a crap about the Zeeks or their cause
He just wants to murder them while being a complete asshole about it

>>15304584
>I think The Origin turned me into a Zeek apologist. Char is just too cool.

You may need help on your comprehension skills.

Char didn't do jack shit for the Zeon cause. He's plotting his revenge

>>15304431
Most ex-AUEG members form the Londo Bell and AUEG itself is not anti-Federation but thinks it as some militarist lobby group who aim to wrestle control the Feds from the Titans.

By far for me Victory potrayal of the Feds were awesome.Here lies a dying and cripple federation manage to rise up again for one last showdown

Sides were a mistake.

Why bother making colonies that don't get resources or act as infrastructure hubs or research some shit. All the Sides do is fucking sit there, all droppable and such.