What the fuck IS 009 about

>>14695010
Cyborgs, come on man it's in the damn title.

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Read the manga and it'll be obvious from v1

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>>14695037
It's hardly subtle about its themes

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>>14695040
It builds upon it though, it entertains all sorts of ideas from "war is hell" to "being the victor in a fight is actually cool and fun"

There's also the usual cyborg stuff of what it means to be human

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>>14695044
Extremely woke baby

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>>14695050

>>14695010
As other posters have pointed out, there is a strong anti-war/anti-nuclear weapons theme throughout, in addition to a message of worldwide multiculturalism and cooperation to achieve a mutual goal. It is also about the limits of humanity, and how weapons, even when used for good, can begin to erode humanity.

That's my third grade English interpretation.

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>>14695052

>>14695037
>>14695040
>>14695044

Are you aware the series changed a lot over the years? 009 can be about literally anything. A lot of stories doesn't even involve action, team work, fighting Black Ghost or anything like that. Ishinomori just liked these characters well enough to build up any situation featuring them, being it going on adventures, exploring ancient mysteries or living their daily lives. From all the TV adaptations, only the 2001 series got all of these elements right. There's not quite anything else like it. Cyborg 009 is very unique in this regard. People like to compare it to the likes of Tetsuwan Atom or Tetsujin 28, but those series started and ended in the 60s and it was mostly about heroic feats of the main characters, even with some sort of social commentary thrown in the middle. 009 got new life through the 70s and 80s, to the point Ishinomori had freedom to do anything he felt like with those characters.

>>14695081

Just one correction, Atom and Tetsujin actually started in the 50s. I meant to say they had no life past the 60s. Other than a few one-shots produced at some point afterwards. But those are not considered as part of the "main" series like 009 was. There's one Atom follow-up story which works as a sequel to the end of the 60s TV show, but it was not well received so it got discontinued by Tezuka. It was about Atom being trapped in a alien world and even receiving an upgrade based on their own technology. It's so bizarre and different from original Tetsuwan Atom, most fans chose to ignore it.

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>>14695081
>>14695093
I posted all the manga scans here. I'm only familiar with what's up on Madokami and I see what you mean but overall it all still seems largely united by a bunch of common themes.

I've not read the Tetsujin manga (I want to) but I think you're kinda generalizing Atom a bit too much. It covers all kinds of stuff and even gets really specific, like when Atom worries about the effect that violent robot riots will have on human-robot relations.

I think Tezuka and Ishinomori are quite similar in some ways but different in others. They covered a bunch of the same themes but then I can't quite imagine a Tezuka work saying "maybe war is not all bad" and Ishinomori's stuff in general just feels... I dunno, more free. In terms of both plotting and art. Like Tezuka had "his thing" that he was good at and mostly stuck to it while Ishinomori would fuck around a bunch.

>>14695135
Oh and this uncertainty is also reflected like the characters, see 004 going back and forth between "we are monsters designed solely to kill" vs. "actually, these powers are pretty cool"

It's a good manga

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>>14695135
>but I think you're kinda generalizing Atom a bit too much. It covers all kinds of stuff and even gets really specific, like when Atom worries about the effect that violent robot riots will have on human-robot relations.

It's not quite the same. Usually, every Atom story involves him using his super-powers to solve some sort of problem. It's usually the main theme, Atom is a hero and he's gonna save the day. Sometimes things don't end so well for him, but usually the stories involve a certain amount of action. 009 literally have stories about Joe taking a walk in the city, Jet going to catch a rare butterfly, Pyunma dealing with superstition in African tribes or acting as a local freedom fighter, Albert taking piano lessons, Gilmore befriending a little boy while the cyborgs are away, Chang taking care of his restaurant, Geronimo going back to his homeland to see how much it changed, Great falling in love with a young girl in the local theater, Françoise working as a fashion model. It's very casual stuff, which never addresses the fact they're cyborgs or have super-powers. It's more about going deep into their psychology by exploring these characters doing very casual things. And these people sometimes reunite to go save the world, but that's usually in big story arcs taking several chapters. Sometimes Cyborg 009 is a action and adventure story, sometimes it's slice-of-life, sometimes it's human drama, etc...

>>14695135
>I think Tezuka and Ishinomori are quite similar in some ways but different in others. They covered a bunch of the same themes but then I can't quite imagine a Tezuka work saying "maybe war is not all bad" and Ishinomori's stuff in general just feels... I dunno, more free. In terms of both plotting and art. Like Tezuka had "his thing" that he was good at and mostly stuck to it while Ishinomori would fuck around a bunch.

I don't think many people really get what Ishinomori is about. I saw some guy call him a misanthrope and other call him preachy, and all sorts of things. But truth is, Ishinomori is not fond of easy answers, he knows there's no definitive trait in the human kind. He struggles for giving characters a happy ending because he knows there's too much wrong and rotten in the current world. He's never saying to his readers how they should act or what they should do, his characters are willing to make mistakes, they're all flawed human beings. 009 being too idealistic, 004 being too cynical, none of them truly being an ideal of what a person should behave. Something similar happens in The Way of Ryu with Ryu and GOD. Ishinomori's heroes does screw up a lot even when their intentions are good. I think Tezuka has a lot more well defined concept of moral and justice, while Ishinomori preferred to let things purposely ambiguous. Even his hero characters were never that simplistic and yelling the world "justice" around like their live action counterparts. And defeating the enemy is never a true victory.

Here's a very interesting interview with Hayase Masato and Yutaka Izubuchi talking about Ishinomori (well, mostly about Yamato, but when Ishinomori or 009 are referenced, they have always something interesting to say):

http://ourstarblazers.com/vault/748/

>>14695062
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=duATV3QHXYw