Can any other Gundam protagonist actually defeat Setsuna, or

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At the very least, Setsuna is certainly the cutest protag.

Sure. Amuro maybe if the Nu Gundam's specs match up, Usso for sure, Domon, maybe not Kira but it's possible, Bellri, and possibly Banagher and Kio all could take Setsuna in a fight.

Whether they would actually do that or not is a different question. Kio has the skills, but he's a pussy and wouldn't want to fight. Banagher has more than enough raw power as a god, but wouldn't really want to either. For all the rest it depends on the reasons the two are fighting to begin with. Most protagonists aren't assholes, if they're fighting Setsuna because of a misunderstanding then Trans-Am will clear it up. If they're fighting for legitimate reasons, Setsuna would just as gladly fight them as they would him. He's never shown hesitation to murder someone who insists on being an asshole even after they had the opportunity to stand down. Some people just need a stabbing.

I know this thread is a joke, but the 00R already outclasses most protag suits, and the Qan[T] is even more powerful than that.
He could probably school Amuro's Nu in a goddamn Union Flag though.

>>14553300
Does it? It has above-average speed, certainly, but 00R's weapons aren't anything to write home about as far as protag suits go. It has a pair of rifles that turn into beam sabers so it doesn't have to switch, which is nice, and some micromissiles it rarely uses for much. Its vulcans are better than average due to being beams. The Raiser Sword is powerful, but impractical against anything that's not stationary and requires both a lot of particles and a large setup time. It can teleport, sometimes, but we see in the show that all you need are good enough reflexes to counter that unless you overextend on the attack he teleports away from. Wing Zero has better firepower and predictive abilities, Strike Freedom has better saturation fire and more remote weapons, Turn-A and G-Self both have higher performance and better weapons, and God Gundam and Awakened Unicorn can both essentially do anything. I'd even say V2AB is both faster than 00R and enormously better armed.

That's not to say 00R or 00Q are weak suits by any means, but I don't think they're particularly strong outliers among protagonist suits.

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>>14553332
You speak as if Setsuna needs his S2 or AotT suits, much less his Exia, to fight against the other protagonists.

>>14553332
Gundam Wing doesn't have newtypes, so the Zero system doesn't help jack shit.
Not to mention it wouldn't help fight against a totally unknown suit.

>>14553332
The Qant isn't even Setsuna's final suit. The ELS Qan[T] is.

Though to be frank its purpose was to serve as a symbol of the understanding Setsuna and the ELS came to. So talking about combat capabilites is besides the point with that suit.

That said, give ELS Setsuna the same suit as his combatants, and he would most likely steamroll.

>>14553256
I'm imagining Setsuna's foe ready to fight, only to panic when Setsuna's Gundam morphs into a giant version of himself. Doing that same exact pose too.

When in doubt.
Uso and Tobia

AotT Setsuna basically merges a suit that is Turn A levels of bullshit with a Newtype God. He's practically the Max Jenius of Gundam powerlevels.

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>Google lightmaster and gundam SEED because someone in the other thread said you'll find the worst CE fanboy
>Stumble onto a forum
>find a Light Master
>Look at the posts he's made
>One is in a thread called Could Peak Kira and Amuro beat starting Setsuna and Heero
>People in the thread are saying that Setsuna shouldn't have Trans-Am, claiming that it's Deus ex machina.
>Meanwhile Kira is allowed to have all the programing hacks he wants
>Putting Amuro against beginning Setsuna
Are these people serious? No shit a close combat designed unit like the Exia would lose to beam spam: the gundam. How fucking far will you go to jack off your favorite character? And people were saying that Amuro would be riding on Kira's glory for christ's sake.

Ignoring Newtype stuff, ELS 00 Qan[t] could probably only be defeated by Turn A or maybe the G-Self Perfect Pack.

00 Qan[t] and 00 Raiser could be challenged by several of the other stronger protag suits though, we see Ribbons put up a strong fight with the Reborns after all. V2, F91, and Strike Freedom could probably equal it. Destiny, Nu, Freedom, Wing Zero might have a somewhat harder time. AGE-FX would likely win against either the Raiser or Qan[t]

>>14553332
>00R's weapons aren't anything to write home about as far as protag suits go.
You forget that it can shoot beams just as far, if not farther, than a Gadessa, a unit specifically designed for long range capabilities. And the beams aren't wimpy diluted particles either, that shit can one shot even from a huge distance.

>>14554928

> AGE-FX would likely win against either the Raiser or Qan[t]

Does it have some hidden feature I forgot about or something? The only impressive feature it has are some funnels, and even that's unimpressive when comparing it to some of the stuff final Gundams have had.

Setsuna is gundam.
But Domon is 10 gundams.

>>14553285
Anon, Setsuna just has to touch the enemy to win the fight and the only way for him to die is for him to be instnatly vaporized and that is a maybe since he might already be a part of the ELS overmind

>>14553358
Wouldn't Veda work like a Zero system on steroids and less likely to drive the pilot insane?

>>14555006
It has that burst mode thing.

>>14555496
No, Veda optimizes MS performance. Zero system shows the pilot the predicted future.

>>14555526
Veda is a quantum computer that was used predict how things would play out to make the whole CB plan for a century, as they showed in the second season they don't need veda to be good pilots.

Also that burst mode isn't it just having beam sabers coming out form every orifice?

How can you defeat a man who is a gundam even when he's not inside one?

>>14553332

The Qan[T] was designed to genocide an entire race through its ability to basically keep fighting until the pilot dies of exhaustion.

>>14554909
Honestky it's pretty funny. I consider myself a /m/anlet but have never heard of Lightmaster until recently.
At first I thought it was an alias for Wackymodder.

>>14553256
all of them will be UNDERSTANDING rather than fighting

>>14554909
If Setsuna has to use the Exia, Amuro has to use something equivalent like either the RX-78-2 or the agundam MK II.

>>14556544
The only reasonable answer in a vs Setsuna discussion.

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>>14553256
>>14553274
Setsuna a qt, would adopt.

>>14553332
>super fast
>can teleport
>can make mile+ long beam sabers casually to chop up huge as fuck asteroids with zero issue
>infinite power
>trans AM
>trans AM BURST
>GN fields

Nah dude. Its a pretty OP suit. Zero can't touch it, SF can't do shit to it, G-Self is just as likely to go down against it and Unicorn can be killed by it as easily. Only thing that goes without saying is Turn A at full power.

>>14554928
>>14555526
>AGE FX
Top kek lad.

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>>14553256
I UNDERSTAND completely but Soredemo. I believe in POSSIBILITY. A POSSIBILITY that Space Autism Time Magic can conquer AYY LMAO assimilation

>>14555539
>Also that burst mode isn't it just having beam sabers coming out form every orifice?
It's a hyper mode, trans-am on steroids.

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>>14556544
Then the true answer to this is simple. The one who can defeat Setsuna is the one that can only understand others through his fists. Setsuna may be an innovator and have all his quantum horse shit sure. But Domon fucking Kasshu is the god damn King of fucking Hearts.

Domon is used to fighting and defeating humans enhanced by DG cells. He is a man who has truly surpassed his human limits. He can kick a fucking falling sky scraper away. Without the Gundam. Like with his fucking foot. Remember when Chibodi used his Bursting Machine Gun Punch? Dat God Shadow shit?

Sure, Setsuna's got Trans-Am. Powerful stuff. But The King of Hearts has mastered tranquility of the mind and spirit, acquiring the ability to activate the God Gundam's Hyper Mode at will. Setsuna's mind link mombo jumbo shit won't work on him for that reason either, because Domon's mind is empty, focused solely on the joy of battle as his spirit as a martial artist rages within.

You might think that Setsuna's still too powerful, but you're not realizing one thing. The semi-metallic body, the fused cell structure? The ability to alter his form and regenerate?

This ability to self recover? There'd be no doubting it now, Domon would be positive! That guy has acquired abilities of the Devil Gundam! WITH THE HELP OF KYOJIIIIIIIIII!!!! He'll NEVER forgive him!

Setsuna's understanding will be forced to overcome with Domon's burning spirit, his love, his anger and all his sorrow! Domon's absolute rage and thirst for vengeance will draw out his true power! The ultimate potential of the King of Hearts!

If there's anything I've learned from /m/ and /m/ related content, it's that burning courage always trumps the inhibition of one's passions and emotions. A true martial artist would never let his spirit be extinguished so easily. He would never stop til he'd achieved victory, getting stronger and stronger the more the fights.

tl;dr
Domon fucking Kasshu bitches.

>>14556862
But full power Unicorn could just go beyond the time.

Amuro, Kamille, Judau, and Usso all proved that understanding is bullshit and Einstein had no fucking clue what he was talking about beyond being a filthy hippy.

Understanding is only a way to open a dialogue but it's ultimately meaningless because you can wholly understand the enemy and still have to fight them.

It's ironic that it's the AUs that go full UNDERSTANDING when UC constantly pulls it out only to prove it's bullshit.

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>>14558524
Addendum; clearly has a massive DG infection.

>>145585244
I approve 10,000%

>>14553285
>He's never shown hesitation to murder someone who insists on being an asshole
I've always liked this about Setsuna. He tries to give everyone the benefit of a doubt but will happily put them down if they're a threat to him or his friends. And he won't mope about it afterwards like a faggot either.

Pretty much the only protagonist (besides Loran) that's done UNDERSTANDING right.

>>14553358
Would any version of the Zero System even be able to factor in supernatural shit like Newtypes or AyyyLamos?

>>14556862
>Turn A at full power

So what is Turn A at full power capable of? Other than being able to spread nanomachines from the sun all the way out to Jupiter's orbit it doesn't really seem that impressive to me. Wasn't it overpowered by a Zaku I once?

>>14558599

No, though there's one guy who likes to say it was. Loran wrestled one once, but it only lasted a few seconds before Lily told them they were being stupid and Loran took off. Even during those few seconds it wasn't losing. The only thing that really happens is that Loran comments the unit is reacting slowly, which is presumably because it's head is still under repair at the time.

It's head was punched in by Harry's SUMO though. However later in the show it stands up to 50 or more beam shots from the Turn-X when Gym uses the Bloody Siege on it and comes out without a scratch. The same attack disables two SUMOs using two shots in the final, though the shots last a bit longer.

>>14558556
00 did understanding pretty well though. Setsuna's understanding also included understanding that he needs to kill you. Not everyone can be saved.

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>>14558597
AyyyLmaos would be easy, as long as the mobile suit using the Zero System survives long enough to gather enough data.

The Zero System may work against Newtype shenanigans IF (and this is a very big if) it has sensors to detect supernatural phenomenon. More likely, it will just detect weird energy readings, leading to pic related.

>>14558599
Full power Turn A is like God gundam on steroids
It's Actually scary how strong the thing is I mean the Full power Turn-A can telelport itself in less than a nano second and can TELEPORT BEAMS STRAIGHT INTO YOUR COCKPIT and so much more

>>14558930
Dunno if you'd need to rely on the ZS against the ELS because of their straightforward Zerg rush attack pattern.
Unless we're talking about fighting all of the ELS ala the final battle.
The ZS would probably kill someone with all the ayylmaos coming from every angle.

>>14558942
Does the Zero System understand 'victory' in any sense beyond 'blasting the crap out of your enemies'?

Say we replaced Hologram Tieria with the Zero System just before Setsuna launched in the 00 Qan[t]. Would the Zero System help him get to the ELS core to begin the dialogue, or would it just tell him to Raiser Sword the shit out of everything?

>>14558970
Tieria was integrated with the Qan[T] so he could take away some of the mental pressure Setsuna receives when attempting communication with the hivemind. The zero system would have been of incredibly little use.

>>14558532
Before or after being chopped in half? Also ELS Hybrid Innovator Setsuna is immortal.

>>14558930
>>14558597
Zero System is a cool concept and all but its literally just an ad-hoc system plot wise to demonstrate how Newtypes are seen by Oldtypes. The concept of it in AC is that it lets someone predict and plot a path in a battle by taking in all possible scenarios and variables which causes a sort of mental feedback loop on the pilot. Because its a computerized system it can't get tired or worn out like a normal Newtype who still has physical limitations but mental fatigue on the user is a thing.

I don't see how it'd make a difference against the 00 Raiser, 00 Raiser Reapir, or 00 Qan[t]a much less 00 Qan[t]a ELS. Setsuna at this point is a full on Innovator who has quantum brainwaves, psychic senses, a sixth sense for danger, and a mini-hologram of an androgynous boipussy acting like his personal R2D2 unit on top of of quantization, Trans-AM, Trans-AM Burst, Qan[t]a Burst, and other shit.

Its too ridiculous for the Zero System to deal with it. Its so far above the scale of anything in AC that its a literal NLF to imply otherwise.

>>14554909
But did you find the worst CE fan boy? They made him sound like some internet bogeyman that only appears in Kira's greatest time of need.

>>14556673
Setsuna could likely beat Nu with the Exia if it's him by the time of the movie. Exia's agility is otherworldly compared to anything in Nu's time.

>>14553256
>Can any other Gundam protagonist actually defeat Setsuna, or do you all just not UNDERSTAND?
Setsuna is really the closest that any Gundam protagonist has, in becoming an actual deity.

He didn't plan it that way, but that was what his path lead to. He wants to become Gundam, and in his mind Gundam is all powerful and all righteous. And he became what he was destined to be.

He isn't invincible, sure. But final form Setsuna is basically at the high end of sci-fi and beyond what most Gundam universes hope to achieve. This is sort of what happens when you introduce aliens, while in most other Gundam shows the tech is still human.

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So, who would win in a fight Strike Freedom or Zabanya?

>>14559090
Lyle can actually pilot and dealt with scarier and tougher shit then Kira ever did so Zanbaya. Rifle Bits alone shit on everything Strike Freedom and its gay ass DRAGOONs can do.

>>14554909
You haven't even seen 1/1000th of the stupid shit Lightmaster has said. He's claimed that Epyon couldn't touch even Gouf Ignited suits in Seed-Destiny even with Zechs as the pilot whose fully mastered the Zero System.

>>14559138
>Gouf Ignited
You mean the same Gouf Ignited, piloted by a named pilot, that got sliced in half because it was too busy looking at the Freedom shitting on everything?

>>14559090
You know the stock footage of Freedom's targetting computer that they show every time it's about to unleash its full burst? Zabanya's computer locks onto at least three times as many targets, and has the number of Rifle Bits to back it up. Strike Freedom is just out-teched here, and only stands a chance if it keeps the fight in melee range.

>>14559138
>google search lightmaster
>Narutoforums pops up in the results
You're an even bigger faggot for both giving a shit and for going to that website.

>>14559183
I'm not from that place you dumb faglord.

>>14559183
>he doesn't know Lightmaster and his faggot Wesley aren't all over any site with a forum and vs site when it comes to mecha
Newfag pls

>>14559192
>>14559187
Does it matter? That's equally just as bad as letting Wackymodder get on your nerves, when he's just some random chucklefuck individual in the vastness of the web.

Also pffft. So you don't go to narutoforums but you go to other equally shitty websites. Congratulations.

>>14559138
That's not what happened, I saw that thread in my googling. They said the GOUF Ignited was a better designed Mobile Suit.

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>>14556862
>Only thing that goes without saying is Turn A at full power.
Only if you read the novel and ignore the anime. In terms of on-screen performance (speed, maneuverability, etc) all of the post-2000 main Gundams shit all over the Turn A with only the possible exception of Barbatos.

>>14559456
Would the nanomachines even work on the alien matter that compose the ELS?

>>14559456

I don't think so personally, since the Turn demonstrates a good degree of maneuverability,, speed, toughness and so on in the last 6 or so episodes. It withstands a heavy barrage with no adverse effects, avoids wire attacks and multi vector assaults from bits handily and at one point flies through the screen so fast that even if you slow it down and go frame by frame the actual unit is never drawn, only the Moonlight Butterfly wings. It and the Turn-X fly up in to the sky and cover several miles in seconds during the end of the second to last episode too.

>>14559471

There's a good chance they wouldn't since they're alien matter and biological in nature as well as technological. With no proof either way it's up to personal interpretation though.

>>14559208
Who the fuck is Wackymodder

>>14559492
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IwOu_KBVeIs

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>>14559496
And now that this has been posted he will come here

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>>14559496
>1:00:26 hours
>For a recolor

>>14559496
Is that Lightmaster too?

>>14559471
>Would the nanomachines even work on the alien matter that compose the ELS?
The alien mass is nanomachines too, and would almost certainly able to fight it like it would a bacterial infection. And it is extremely unlikely that Moonlight Butterfly would adopt faster than an intelligent alien grey goo.

>>14559547
No.

>>14553256
THE POWER OF UNDERSTANDING

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Would you adopt a shota Setsuna?

>>14560123
You people never get tired of the same joke?

>>14560139
You sound like a huge no fun hating faggot to be honest here, senpai.

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>>14560156
>He doesn't laugh at a decade old meme!
>He must hate fun!

>>14560183
>old meme
Its not a meme if its canon, faggot.

>>14560183
What should we be doing anon? Going to /v/ to se the new hot meme so we can all laugh? Why don't you go first? And stay there

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>>14560302
>>14560276
>/m/ has been taken over by cancerous meme fucks

I want neo-/m/ to die.

>>14560327
Nigger, you're one who started screaming about memes when he posted a joke picture we used to laugh, just because you shoved a tree trunk up your cavernous ass doesn't make it so you are right by just acting like a faggot, again go back to /v/ you cunt

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>>14560335
Uneased mind angers
A haiku to ease butthurt
peace be upon you.

>>14560327
>>14560368
>Neo-/m/
Kill yourself.

>>14553256
Pretty much just Turn A, and even then it's an iffy situation.

>>14560368
So, you act like a jackass and then resort to U MAD when it doesn't pan out like you planned? You really are a /v/ermin

>>14558942
>Dunno if you'd need to rely on the ZS against the ELS because of their straightforward Zerg rush attack pattern.

You would if the battle lasted long enough for them to assimilate some weapons.

Though given their transformative abilities, I'd hesitate to stick anyone in the Zero System while fighting ELS. Fighting against conventional enemies is one thing, but how the hell is the computer supposed to predict an enemy that can literally transform into fucking anything at any point, with the only possible limitation being that they need to have assimilated that thing, which is something that can happen during the battle outside your reach?

>>14560814
Wing Zero would definitely be overwhelmed by the ELS much faster then any of the Movie Gundam's. Their dakka are on completely different levels.

>>14560814
The worst part is that the ELS can transform even into wepons as they are being used on them, like when some started assimilating the missiles shot at them mid flight

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>>14560682
I'm just asking you how can you find a decade old meme still funny, anon.

>>14559478
>cover several miles in seconds
And only a few seconds the Freedom goes from "mobile suit approaching" to "DAMN THAT'S FAST" to "It's already out of range" in open space in a show that doesn't have minovsky fucking with their sensor ranges.

That's a fair bit more than "several miles".

>>14560981
Not him but I still find it funny because I take breaks from browsing 4chan and haven't abused the joke to hell and back.
Same reason why you still use that reaction image despite it being older than most current 4chan users.

>>14560981
How can you find the meme you are using funny? Its old, you shouldn't use it

Faggot

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>>14561059
>why you still use that reaction image
He doesn't know how old it is. Look at his filename, it's 1469926277566.jpg, he saved it less than a year ago.

>>14561086
So it really was a /v/ user as it was pointed out earlier bitching about what we enjoy, at this point I honestly don't feel any surprise anymore

>>14561049

And this wasn't in open space, where there are no limits on acceleration and speed. Also, while CE doesn't have minovsky interference it also doesn't have great detection technology regardless, and ships normally only detect objects within a few miles going by how non stealth units got close to them with no alerts in both shows.

>>14561086
oops, no...wait...
that's the file name for the image appearing in this thread
his saved filename is only 149 billion not the current 11 trillion. so he saved it a long time ago.

that's what i get for drunkposting.

>>14561123
Doesn't matter, Freedom does it on Earth too. Also neutron hammers bro

>>14560981
Nice avatarfagging, faggot.

>>14561123
>where there are no limits on acceleration and speed
Bitch, please. The only time Gundam has ever acknowledged that was Stargazer.
You can't seriously be arguing that Turn A is faster than Freedom

>>14561157
>neutron jammers
Le only matters if plot remembers it device

>>14561175
Not him but I'm pretty sure Turn A shits on Strike Freedom.

>>14561157

You mean the neutron jammers that cover all of Earth and which all space ships use to prevent detection? And which prevent good detection in an area around them? Including say stopping one mobile suit from detecting another until it was relatively close?

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>>14561059
I find this to be a sensible enough response. Thank you, anon for being a real human bean, as well as helping me realize the hypocrisy of my ways.

>>14561065
>>14561117
For you two, however, pic related.

>>14561182
That'd be the reason why no one is detected until they're close, yes. Or you detect thier jammers influence.

>>14561238

Which would include the Strike Freedom.

>>14561245
Sure. But what's your point?

Also, I don't think the Strike Freedom is faster then the Turn A.

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Can we go back to talking about Setsuna?

>>14561262

My point was that anon initially positited there had to be great speed because it entered and left detection range in seconds which I don't think there had to be overwhelming speed for, because detection range in CE is still small despite his insistence there's no minovsky interference to hamper it.

>>14561182
>and which all space ships use to prevent detection? And which prevent good detection in an area around them?
nope.
N-Jammers only prevent fission and fusion reactions. Radar works for everything that doesn't have Mirage Colloid, and long-range communications are just fine. None of that usual mobile-suit-explaining interference bullshit applies in CE.

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>>14561172
Whoa okay, dude.

>>14561299
>N-Jammers only prevent fission and fusion reactions. Radar works for everything that doesn't have Mirage Colloid, and long-range communications are just fine. None of that usual mobile-suit-explaining interference bullshit applies in CE.
Actually, CE DOES use the N-Jammer to interfere with communications in a vage sense, it just doesn't get mentioned very much in-show. The goal was clearly to imitate UC as much as they could. But they didn't bother to go into details.

>>14561368
And really, that was the only reason why Archangel was on the run so long at the start of the show and not able to get in contact with allies. The same way that Archangel ended up having anti-gravity like Whitebase even though the tech wasn't used anywhere else in CE.

>>14561282
Setsunaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

>>14561368
N-Jammers interfere with Radio Waves, which means Radar and naturally standard radio communication. That's why Infrared is the standard detection method

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setsuna time

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>>14566938

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>>14566942

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Too tired to continue. Dumping will recommence tomorrow.