Is Char a well written character?

>>13628807
Yes
People who believe in Char as the Spacenoid hero who would never drop a rock on Earth and kill millions because he's a protagonist in Zeta have been memed out by a children's cartoon that says multiple times that he's a liar who wears a bunch of masks

I don't like the character though

>>13628807
Is Lalah like a mother to me?

Overall? yes.

In CCA itself? Not really. Movies are a horrible format for a guy like Tomino; hell, I'd say they're just bad in general.

>>13628837

agreed. i find it hard to sit and watch an hour of anime in one sitting.

>>13628807
>0079
Yes
>Zeta
Nope and he is also irrelevant
>CCA
Yes

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He has the benefit of having 2 series and a movie to showcase his character, while also being more complex and ambitious compared to his counterparts (Amuro, Hayato, Bright).

I'm personally not a fan of his mainly because he's a fucking psychopath

>>13628807
Let the purge begin.

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Yeah, that's why every series has a copy of his character

>>13628837
>CCA Char
>not incredibly well written

>>13628977
What the fuck is that

>>13629347
He's a retard, even moreso in CCA. This has been discussed to death and back and to death again. Please stop.

>>13629640
A vibrator.

>>13628807
like most Tomino characters he's a petty, short-sighted asshole

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>>13628958
please tell me there is more of this

i think what tomino was trying to convey with the amuro char conflict is weather its better to do something for now that may or may not work out later, or is it better to do something that doesn't benefit us now but will down the line

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Yes. He's one of my favourite characters in anything too.

>>13629673
>short-sighted asshole
He was smart enough to understand that EF politics are leading the universe into nowhere.

>>13628831
It's interesting they'd get memed by Zeta, seeing as the show actually peels back that mystique and reveals him to be kind of a fuckup.

>>13630716
But would Char's plan really benefit humanity down the line, or was that just more of Char's self-delusion?

>>13628807
how many times will we have this thread?

>>13630847
I suppose that Char's plan would turn out to be good.
After the Axis drop the EFSF would be decentralised and it would be easy to defeat.
After the establishment of Char's NZ government there would be no Zanscare-like movements since there would be no EF and the spacenoids would be able to govern their colonies safe and properly.
The first step would be creating new constitution with the general idea of building the world of newtypes.
Then the number of colony cylinders would be increased and there would be more mines at the asteroid belt.
Either the society of newtypes would be built, ot the life of spacenoids would be improved.

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>>13630847
He was a clown

>>13630951
Shut the fuck up, Papsmear Sriracha.

Char's whole thing was being anti Zabi. Then in CCA he goes full Gihren.

>>13631017
>Then in CCA he goes full Gihren.
But he doesn't. Being genocidal against earthnoids doesn't mean being racist

>>13631021
Yeah, Char just up and decides that all the Earthnoids need to get up and into space. So Oldtypes could die off leaving only newtypes.

>>13631042
It's about newtypes and oldtypes, not spacenoids and earthnoids.
Gihren was racist towards earthnoids as a whole.

>>13631052
Actually, it's about ethics in mobile suit warfare.

>>13631052
Except he wasn't. Gihren's goal was never to be racist towards Earthnoids. The reason they wiped out so many spacenoids is because those spacenoids were also undesirables. Gihren's plan was to reduce the population of humanity and take over both the colonies and the Earth.

>>13630841
Buddy, there are people who have watched Zeta and still think that Char actually came to laugh at anybody
It's not at all a surprise

>>13631085

That was actually confirmed to be a Char' habit since the OYW though.

>>13630944

Sure, I mean, G-Reco proved that after all. Oh, no, wait...it proved that Spacenoids are just as horrible when they're in control as when they're the oppressed, because they just become oppressors themselves when they gain any bit of control. And then as soon as any of the factions met they instantly came to conflict and nearly started a solar war over the rights to return to Earth because living in space was shitty.

Char's plan would never have done any good for any one. Even in the short term all it'd have likely done is create more conflict between the remnants of the Federation and Zeon and then between the eventual victors and everyone else over who was in power now that Earth was at least temporarily out of the game. And then those victors, whoever they were, would probably have oppressed everyone else and a couple of decades down the line, Side whatever would have risen up against the United Sides of Char and another war would have broken out. And so on down the line.

Even newtypes wouldn't have gotten anywhere more than likely, especially if things became peaceful, because everything in UC points to conflict being what gives rise to newtype awakening. If the One Year War only produced a handful though, any subsequent war was likely to only produce a handful too and not actually birth enough for them to become a post-human movement.

>>13631085

> translated documents explicitly reveal that Char's characterization in Zeta is supposed to be taken at face value and to continue in to the original plan for ZZ of him becoming an anti-hero
> People still insisting Char in Zeta was obviously lying to people all along and just using them for his own ends

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>>13631093
Yes but he doesn't do it in the meme screenshot.
He's self depreciating and mocking the 'Char Aznable' character, asking if Amuro wanted him to say he came there to laugh at him and play into the persona. Char is basically miserable during all of Zeta and that's just another example of it

I was going to post the admiral saying that Char game to laugh at him from 0079 TV, but I opted for Mirai's ass instead

>>13628807
He is a sad,sad man.

>>13631099
>they just become oppressors themselves when they gain any bit of control.
"The state is a tool of violence in the hands of a ruling class". If the ruling class wants to dominate other colonies - then, sure, it will bring only more problems. But, again, Char's Neo Zeon has the ideology, which affects it's actions. The idea is to unite colonies, not to dominate.
>then between the eventual victors and everyone else over who was in power now
And how's that bad? Every revolution ends up with the victor wiping out the last resistance. See nothing wrong here.
>would probably have oppressed everyone else
How? By giving the colonies representation in the Char's United Sides?
>Side whatever would have risen up against the United Sides of Char and another war would have broken out
If the Char's reforms would went wrong.
>Even newtypes wouldn't have gotten anywhere more than likely, especially if things became peaceful, because everything in UC points to conflict being what gives rise to newtype awakening.
And that's what the newtype studies are for.

i like his smooth dub voice

>>13631196

> But, again, Char's Neo Zeon has the ideology, which affects it's actions. The idea is to unite colonies, not to dominate.

As Amuro pointed out in the film all revolutions start out with good intentions and are then swallowed up the system and become as bad as what they replaced. Char doesn't even deny it. He speaks like someone who has no intention of sticking around once Axis is dropped as well throughout the film, so it's likely he wouldn't even be around to try and sway things from going that way. No one man can stop that happening anyways, not for long at least.

> See nothing wrong here

More conflict, more war, more death basically. Not much in the grand scheme of things, but certainly something upsetting for the people of the sides involved at the time.

> By giving the colonies representation in the Char's United Sides?

Except whatever Side happened to win is just as likely to impose their own doctrine and will on the other sides using some kind of authoritarian system going by the history of conflict in UC.

> If Char's reforms went wrong

Even in the film they talk about the high probability of it happening and every single system in UC goes wrong as a matter of course, because that was one of the major themes of UC: that governments end up failing the people they serve due to the nature of the humans in charge of them.

> And that's what newtype studies are for

Sure, except Char was already diverting his cyber newtype expert in to making weapons during the film and had only turned out one cyber newtype, who may not have even come from his direct involvement but been based on studies prior to his time in charge. Char didn't give a shit about them in the film and there's no guarantee that anyone who lead in his place afterwards would either.

>>13631218
Michael Kopsa (if I'm not mistaken) is good.

>>13631228
>no intention of sticking around
There are two reasons: first one is that Char actually doesn't like being a public person. He doesn't want to be a leader and to keep the image ("I feel like a total clown"). But he has to, since there's nobody else to go and fulfill his ideals.
The second reason is that he was already on the way to death - Sazabi was rekt and Nu was trying to push it away. Or I'm missing something?
>their own doctrine
Well, yes. But the thing is that there's no other war powers in the galaxy but NZ and EFSF. I suppose that Anaheim Electronics would be under heavy control to prevent them from supplying the EF remnants.
>cyber-newtypes
Their potential is lower than of a natural-born newtype. The thing is to ensure that new newtypes would be born, not made out of oldtypes with high possibility of incurable brain damage.
Beyond the Time manga (it's status of being canon is questionable, but since there's no other variants available, we'll use it) states that Gyunei Guss became a cyber-newtype by the Char's allowance.
The main focus of Nanai's job was the psychoframe and its combat abilities. The creation of cyber-newtype is very expensive and dangerous, and there was no guarantee that the methods of Nanai would work. Gyunei was a volunteer, so, I suppose, nobody has volunteered or have passed the health tests.

>>13631291

> Or I'm missing something.

Well for a start the Sazabi wasn't wrecked when he was saying most of it. He also never gave any indication that he intended to stick around to fulfill his ideals after Axis. He would have felt the same "have to do this" shit after Blex died too and we all know how that went.

> there's no other war powers in the galaxy but NZ and EFSF

That doesn't mean more won't arise in the kind of power vacuum that the fall of Axis, the EFSF and Earth would create. In fact, it's basically guaranteed to create several more.

> The thing is to ensure that new newtypes would be born

Which no-one has any idea how to do in UC, and there's very little interest in actually pursuing even from Char himself. He showed more interest in cyber newtypes than in that and he did fuck all to pursue that interest. Newtypes appear to awaken (not be born) and to do so during wars, so I'm not sure how you think they were going to pursue the birth of more of them.

> Beyond the Time

I haven't read it, so I can't comment but I wouldn't be taking it as relevant to Char's Counterattack personally.

>>13631330
>never gave an indication
I think that if he wouldn't follow his promises, he would be lynched by his subordinates.
>new factions
Probably. But who can be the new power? Somebody funded by Anaheim, the company which has the monopoly on the Mobile Suit production. That's why AE should be nationalized soon after the victory.

The reason why doesn't Char pursuing the idea of giving birth to the newtypes is that he has a greater problem than launching a research program. And the newtype world can't be built if Earth is still affecting the politics of colonies.
>newtypes appear to be awaken
No. They should work on themselves and their potential improvement, but the possibility of being a newtype is surely determined by genes. Like Karlmann or Marbet's child of Victory. They can barely do something, yet they're already showing their potential and abilities.

>>13631382

> I think that if he wouldn't follow his promises, he would be lynched by his subordinates.

Sure. Just like the Federation, the Zabis and so on all were.

> who can be the new power?

No idea. Doesn't mean it wouldn't happen. Maybe it'll be Side 7 this time? Maybe it'll be Side 1? Who knows? Let's spin the Lagrange roulette wheel and let fate decide.

> That's why AE should be nationalized soon after Victory.

If the Feds could never do it I don't see what hope Char has.

> The reason why Char doesn't pursue the idea of giving birth to the newtypes is that he has greater problems

Sure, like making sure that he and Amuro have the best machines they can and that Amuro has one that is equal to him so he can prove he's dick is bigger for once and for all.

> the newtype world can't be built if Earth is still affect the politics of the colonies

It's probably the only way it can be built given the fact conflict seems to birth them in the first place. Putting off even trying for a pissing match with his old rival isn't really any kind of excuse though.

> They should work on themselves and their potential environment

Should doesn't mean squat. They do appear to arise due to conflict going by the animation and no amount of flowery philosophy or high-minded ideals is going to change that.

> Karlmann or Marbet's child in victory

Karlmann was around a lot of conflict last I checked. Marbet's kid is about the only outlier hinting they could be genetic and I admit I have nothing to refute it or any way to explain it. It is an outlier and there's a lot more that awoke during conflict than Marbet's kid though.

0079 - kinda
Zeta - Yes
CCA - No

Absolute Truth.

>>13630944
Would it?
I mean, where the fuck was everyone supposed to go?

>>13631487
This anon has it right.

I like to think that Tomino had a stroke just before Zeta ended because anything short of that and I'd lose all faith in him.

>>13628807
Better than all G-recturd characters

That's for sure

>>13631115

How many times did Mirai bend herself over the helm and beg for some of that Brightcock. Jesus fucking christ my dick

>>13632397
Bright cannot go past the moat of Odawara Castle, he is a kekoldtype

>>13631419
>just like
Probably, you don't see the difference between a state, established after the revolution and already established state. The new state and its leaders have to provide the changes, otherwise they won't be able to hold for a long time.
>Feds could never do it
They never wanted to. EF is a typical "liberal democracy", which would rather befriend big business.

There's more than enough to his backstory to explain why he's an inherently broken person who acts inconsistently between his appearances.

>>13630745
Do you motherfuckers honestly don't understand that he is being sarcastic/deceitful when he says stuff like that?

>>13632434

Char is already isolated from most of his men by the time of Axis. He barely spends any time with them is more interested in pursuing his own agenda than in anything to do with them. His soldiers don't even really believe in the goals he's pursuing by that time either, and betray him without a second thought at the end of the movie. There's nothing to indicate they have easy access to him or that they'd turn on him personally if he did something they didn't like.

A new state and it's leaders also don't have to do squat and history is rife with revolutionaries who almost immediately betrayed their ideals or men with little to no consequences from their own followers.

As for Anaheim, Char has shown no personal interest in stopping their business, any more than the Feds did. You can go "well he could step in and nationalize them to stop them exploiting things", but really, it's just your own idea for what you'd do and has no bearing on what Char was likely to do. Especially when they are one of the main reasons he had any success at all and hold a lot of the power in the relationship given that they hold the keys to his mobile suit manufacturing and can turn if off any time they want.

>>13633632
it's laid on so thick in that panel i think anyone could understand

>>13633691
>soldiers betray him
You're saying that like there's only three pilots.
>betrayed their ideals
Like who? The only one I can remember Is Cromwell
>no personal interest in stopping
Why would he stop the production of his main financial supporter?
And what would you do if you would hear rumors about the big facility selling guns to the terrorists?

>>13633691
>and betray him without a second thought at the end of the movie
Not remotely what happened. The collective will of humanity (via the flying magical letter T) overwrote their previous misguided beliefs, or enlightened them to see that what they were doing was wrong if you prefer to describe it that way.

>>13635186

> You're saying that like there's only three pilots.

The only pilots we see betray him. We don't see any other surviving Neo Zeon pilots at any point.

> Like who?

The French Revolution for a start. The leaders of the Russian Revolution also rather quickly ensconced themselves in the lap of luxury while their people starved to death by the millions too and yet no-one ever did shit to them. Africa also has a history of warlords who preach one thing and do another and their soldiers just go along with it. Charisma, money or guns can carry you a long way and will stop even the most ardent people from killing you or even wanting to kill you in many cases.

> Why would he stop the production of his main financial supporter?

No idea, you tell me. You're the one saying he'd threaten to nationalize Anaheim and take away a major part of their profit margin in the process.

> And what would you do if you heard rumors about the big facility selling guns to terrorists?

Probably try and shut them down. The issue is that (a) I may not have the power to do so, (b) they may not just roll over and they're the ones arming me and (c) I'm not a part of UC where even the most powerful entity in the setting failed to do so for several decades in a row even when we know they were unhappy with Anaheim. Instead they just made their own company, SNRI. Which tells me Anaheim isn't that easy to shut down.

>>13635219

Not remotely what happened and there's literally nothing in the movie to indicate it did. All that happens is they see some Fed pilots risking their lives to push Axis away and then join in. The magic T never interacts with them and the psycofield doesn't even start growing out from Axis until after they join in in the first place.

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>>13628807

>>13635186
Try reading a history of Mexico's revolutions lmao

>>13635876
>the French Revolution
If you remember right, the leaders were changing all the time
>Russian Revolution
Here we go. The luxury life of the officials have begun in the later 30s and from 50s until the total decay of Soviet system. The starvation was usual thing for agrarian economics of the Russian Empire. The starvation of 1920s was caused by the Civil War crisis.
>no one did shit
But something was done. Some cultural values and gold was sold for bread. Yes, western countries said that they would accept the gold only.
>No idea, you tell me
He had no reason to stop Anaheim from producing more suits until the victory of Neo Zeon.
But I doubt that Char would let the production of the Mobile Suits without control. Anaheim could supply the EF remnants in the same way they supported AEUG and Delaz.
>>13635982
Never was interested in it. Maybe I'll try something, thanks.

Sometimes, yeah. CCA was pretty excellent in that regard.

>>13628837
Nah, dude. CCA did suffer from being too compressed, but Char wasn't really one of the characters affected by that.

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Rau Leu Cruset was a better Char

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>>13636591

Zeon ideals:

The Earth is sacred and must not be polluted

The Earth corrupts humans, and everyone should leave it so they can get cool psychic powers.

Gundam is DUMB