She wasn't that bad. She at least deserved a good ending.

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>>13627473

I feel like the only person who actually liked her character, her arc and her ending. She wasn't happy, but she was well set up and her unhappiness was of a transient nature. I don't know how her life would have turned out, but considering that she survived a war, became head of her family and was rich as well as well connected I don't think it'd have turned out badly once she finished getting over Loran.

>>13627473
Sochie was one of the few things in Turn A's story that I actually cared about. In a show full of caricatures she seemed really genuine and human, and I was really sad for her at the end. Other Tomino characters have gotten it much worse, of course, but it would have been nice to see at least a sliver of optimism, some new boy talking to her in the ending, anything other than her being enveloped in bitterness and throwing that fish in the river. It's normal to assume that she would eventually get over it and move on, but there's no hint of that in her ending.

>>13627473
Its only temporary anon. Dianna will die soon and loran will come home

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>>13627531
I actually think that Turn A is one of the most human anime ever, every single character feels like they had a purpose in the world and an entire backstory to them.
And Sochie was one of the annoying cunt characters that was actually tolerable and not just because she's a cute girl

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Sochie is one of my favorite Gundam girls.

>>13627473
I actually liked Sochie and found her diving headlong into the militia to avenge her father and wipe out Moonrace scum was a nice, especially how it contrasted with how Kihel was too caught up in Guin/Dianna's nonsense to really spend too much time on it.

She really mellows out once she falls in love with Gavane.

>>13627580

Kihel was never particularly caught up in a need for vengeance anyways. When their father died Sochie basically just curled up in to bed the first chance she got and wanted to stay there and mope. Miashei got her to leave by pointing out how she could take revenge by piloting for the militia, which she had already wanted to do before the attacks anyways and Sochie used that as a way of running from her sorrow instead of facing it. Which is why she was so angry and eager to stage attacks at any given chance for the first half or so of the show before Gavane is killed by the nukes. Kihel was a bit older and was able to deal with their father's death a bit better, but even she just buried herself in working with Guin in the peace negotiations instead of really dealing with it I think. And then the switch with Dianna happened and she had even more shit to bury her head in. She does get a bit of catharsis when Dianna goes to the grave in her place - which is one of my favorite scenes on re-watching, because it's not until the finale that Dianna mentions how she can't recall her parent's after living for so long. She's letting out her own sorrow at the emptiness she feels there and I think trying to imagine how she'd like to mourn them if she could remember, but it mirrors Kihel's well regardless.

>>13627627
I meant it contrasted with how Kihel was dealing with her fathers death nor did I imply Kihel was acting out of vengeance either, I didn't need a summary on the first 7 episode.

>>13627538
While I always assumed that would happen, I never would have believed that Loran would say this, and right infront of Diana, no less.

>>13627634

He didn't though, what are you talking about? Never mind that Dianna is wearing either an engagement or wedding ring in the finale.

>>13627511
You've still got to remember that her sister, whom she was pretty good friends with, has left the earth forever, and her only remaining family is her mother, who needs to be looked after since her husband's death left her mentally stunted or something similar? All I remember is that some time after his death they talk to her and she acts like he's still around, not in denial but like there was a legit mental problem there.

Loran wasn't the only sad thing about her ending, and I don't know why people think that.

>>13627689

Her sister might be gone to the Moon, but the ending alone features a load of people hopping in a space ship to go there too. It's a trip sure, but it's never put as so long or arduous that it's a once in a life time thing. She can go and visit if she wants and live it up in style on the Moon while she's there. It's no worse than having family in Australia or something. It'd take a few days to get there at most and she could probably go at least once every year or two if she wanted, especially given her wealth and connections. Even if she went broke for some reason Kihel could probably arrange passage given they have communications set up with the Moon even at the start of the show.

She also has two servants who help look after her mother, and while her mother definitely had some kind of psychotic exercise that means she thinks her husband is alive and just off working all the time she appears to be able to live normally enough aside from that. Like they're sad, but again, nothing about her ending comes off as so bad as to ruin her life or leave her irrevocably scarred to me. She'll get over Loran and find some new happiness and I'm fine with that.

>>13627720
she'll put the Heim business to work and start manufacturing mobile suits to go invade the moon

>>13627726

She could probably turn it in to a space ship manufacturing company fairly easily given she has a mining company for materials, connections to some of the Moonrace engineers like Horace and to the Queen of the Moon.

>>13627726
Why would she want to invade her sister's kingdom?

>>13627734
THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE

>>13627473
Sochie felt pretty unique among Gundam girls, or tsunderes for that matter

I think the choice of VA had a big role in that

>>13627860

She was certainly one of the cutest.

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http://082.digi2.jp/turn/hysteria-01.htm

>上は2002年5月に描いた物。映画ポスターのターンA煽り構図は、ヒゲの角度的にプラモ萌えガノタにはマイナス印象ではないかと感じました。そこで、ならばガノタの好きなうつむき構図ならばどんな感じのポスターを作れるだろうか･･･という訳で、謎のヒゲビームで∀マークを形作るという、いかにも富野的ベタベタな感じのレイアウトテストです(ただ髪の先を何も処理してないのが中途半端で練り不足)。でもって、この後あきまんのすごいDVDジャケにわーどっひゃー!!

is this a tomino sketch?

>>13628744
It's Akiman.

>>13627473
>She at least deserved a good ending
She got a good ending.

>>13628968

She's like that girl you grew up with all your life, one day promises to "show you something" later, kisses you...and then later that day she leaves for the summer texting you that she's sorry she couldn't...this time.

>>13627860
Tomino is always amazing with his choice of voice actors.

why is there no art of sochie in a titans uniform

>>13633686

Why would there be? It's like asking why there's no art of Emma in a Moonrace uniform. It's a random idea that most people have no interest in.

>>13633696
Because Sochie also wants to gas the spacenoids

>>13633698

I get the connection - I'm just pointing out that it's flimsy and that most people don't make it or care.

>>13633711
stop talking

>>13633715

Stop posting silly things and I won't have to post to explain why you're being silly. Not my fault you don't like hearing the reality of it.

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Sochie is love.

>>13627860
And yet, has she been in anything besides this and BP?

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I wanted her to die. Never liked her, and her development over the coarse of series never did enough in my book to change that.

the only thing i did not like about turn a was Dianna and Kihel

everything else was spot on

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>>13633781
Agreed.

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so on the subject of Turn A who the fuck decided on this cover art?

Im glad to have the series and everything really but of all the shit that happens in the series you go with that broad? Not the Turn X even?

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the first volume art is pretty damn good, sets up the tone of the first half pretty nicely, gives a good idea of what we're in for and paints a nice unique picture, so the fuck is going on with volume 2?

Teteth wasn't even around all that long

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>>13636455
>>13636460
Seems to me that these covers are designed to place an emphasis on the faux 19th century setting juxtaposed with Gundam. That's why the second volume opts to use a part of the series featuring a distinctive 19th century circus tent and characters wearing era-specific clothing rather than using a scene/characters from the Victorian-lacking space arc featuring Gym and Turn X.

>>13636485
>Seems to me that these covers are designed to place an emphasis on the faux 19th century setting juxtaposed with Gundam.

that's fine and everything but Im sure we could have gotten a better image all the same and Id argue an image of Kihel, Harry, Gym and the Turn X walking the opposite direction on a moon setting would really be more thematically appropriate

>>13636492
Well, you not liking it doesn't necessarily have any meaning. It's essentially just a pointless complaint.

>>13636529
>Well, you not liking it doesn't necessarily have any meaning.

doesn't mean I shouldn't be allowed to say something. Fascist

>>13627473
>>13627511
She reminds me of the typical Macross heroine: cute, sympathetic, but bitchy and annoying. I like her but she's a brat, a cute brat.

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>>13629341
This. I don't know why people assume otherwise. Loran is escorting his queen to the afterlife. She probably has less than a couple of years considering she needed a stick to walk due to sickness caused by the affect of hibernation. After that she gets him for herself. Even if she didn't it's not like her life ended because of a failed romance or two.

>>13637017

Well, the wedding ring on Dianna's finger probably helps. And the fact nothing ever says she's dying. The absolute most ever said is that she's weaker due to age. Which is a big leap from dying. There's also older characters who went through more hibernation and never display any issues. Basically the death thing is entirely made up.

>>13637017
The only time hibernation sickness is brought up is in relation to corrin, who was never unfrozen and had mild brain damage with no seeming other problems. That's why they periodically unfreeze people, and while she was frozen longer than most others she was unfrozen a couple of times.

And its common as fuck to use a walking stick while out in the woods or mountains. Both for the support and as a tool if you encounter something like a snake.

>>13637098

Corin had to be unfrozen on occasion because almost all the Moonrace recognize him and many know just how crazy he was by reputation. If was frozen since before the beginning of the Moonrace they wouldn't know him so well.

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>>13637085
Ring is probably a memento from Will Game. I find it hard to believe Loran would go and kiss Sochie if he was going to go off and propose to Dianna. Way I see it the emphasis wasn't about the stick itself but rather about the degradation in her situation. Her needing a stick is only one part of it, and her needing Loran to take of her is also an indication about another degradation in her condition. We also know for facts from the show that hibernation does have heavy side affects on the body, it's not far fetched to assume that she's probably dying. We know that she's been through several hibernations. If I recall correctly we don't know for sure if any of the older characters went trough the same amount or more hibernations.

>>13637098
>who was never unfrozen
Can you elaborate on that?

>And its common as fuck to use a walking stick while out in the woods or mountains.
Good point, but to me it seemed like she needed it because it was getting harder for her to walk in general.

>>13637113
Corrin was a convict implied to be from the dark history period and iirc was mentioned to supposed to be never unfrozen due to his crimes, which is why everyone is shocked to hear he's been sent to earth. His appearance is the first and to my memory the only time damage from long term cryo is brought up and it is entirely in relation to his brain damage.

>Dianna is shown to be walking and hiking all over the earth and helping with the labor and chores during their travels across the series with no issues shown or implied.
>She has a walking stick while out on a mountain.

Shes weak and dying guys, honestly.

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>>13637146
its true its in the novels

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>>13637128
I don't remember all that well but to me he seemed just plain whacko. The actual brain damage seemed to come after Loran defeated and after that he went traveling. Don't really remember anything else.

>>13637146
As if people sick with cancer start getting crippled as soon as they get the disease. It's a process. It's not unlikely to assume that after the journey ended her symptoms were getting worse or were just showing up.

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Second best character in Turn A. the first being Harry Ord
And best girl without a doubt.

The scene in question is she's out on a mountain in winter with snow everywhere and shockingly she's using a walking stick for support. She displayed no weakness at any point in the series but people seem to jump on this scene for some reason while ignoring the context.

>>13637177
The thinking here is that there's two sorts of brain damage in Turn A:

Corrin's a nut because he was possibly a maniac to begin with, but he was also stuck on ice for a single super-long uninterrupted period.

Dianna's sick because she's been frozen for 20 year stretches a ridiculous number of times. They keep putting her in and taking her back out. She's just gone through more cycles than others since she's important to the running of the society for some reason.

Meanwhile, the rest of the population seems to be frozen for 40-50+ year chunks instead, and allowed to die beyond that. Whole generations of families are torn apart because they're sent off for nap-time while others are thawed out. We see geriatrics hugging their own parents, who are still around 30-40. They're at least given decades out of the freezer and probably don't go in more than two times, if that.

Meanwhile, Dianna's been cycled out so many times and still looks like she's in her 20s. We don't have any information on how long she's awake each time, but it's probably not very long. The events of Turn A are probably the longest stretch she's been continuously awake since they started the process with her (after childhood). She's probably got something like a week or a month out of the freezer each time, then it's back to being a popsicle for 20 years; repeat for centuries.

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>>13637204
Scene is up for interpretation.

>>13637211
I wonder if the novels elaborate more about cryogenics and their importance to the moonrace. I'd get around to reading them but I don't have the patience.

Dianna is probably more than a hundred years old.

>>13637224
Yeah, there's also the possibility they are doing something to her so that she remains looking young despite being a lot older, physically, regardless of her time spent frozen.

I wonder what Kihel says when they tell her it's time for a nap.

>>13637113
>I find it hard to believe Loran would go and kiss Sochie if he was going to go off and propose to Dianna.

I interpreted it as Loran giving Sochie a pity kiss, which is why she's the one crying her goddamn eyes out.

He knows he can't return her feelings so he gives her a bit of love before going off with Dianna.

I find it kinda hard to believe that Sochie would react that severely if they knew Dianna didn't have much time left. To be fair, Sochie is known to react crazily

>>13637232
Must be depressing, knowing you can't really do what you want and instead have to go through these kind of "naps".

>>13637303
>pity kiss
Is this a thing in fiction? It really didn't seem that way to me. Also, he might have only shown interest in Sochie a couple of times but I always felt like his bond with Dianna was admiration, I'm not buying that they're romantically involved.

Sochie is a nutjob but the only logical conclusion I had is that she knows she's going to be separated from Loran for quite a while and goodbyes aren't easy so she's crying.

>>13627649

He's talking about the ending of SRWZ3.

Where Loran, Diana and Sochie discuss that very issue and conclude that it's okay because Diana is going to bite it soon and Loran will come back.

>>13637224
People in Cryogenics won't age, but they could still dream. Corin is kinda whacky because he has been trapped in dream state for too long.

Think of it as using drugs like LSD... eventually your mind can't tell what's reality and what's dream. So you start to act strange.

>>13637113

> Ring is probably a memento from Will Game

He never gives her one. Why would she have a memento from Will only in the finale and not have it shown or mentioned during the arc where he shows up? Occam's razor says it's from Loran, the guy she is living alone in the woods with.

> We also know for a fact from the show that hibernation does have heavy side effects on the body

We really don't. We know it has some effect, but the only effect mentioned is "becoming less energetic" - which a few episodes later Kihel and Harry give alternate theories as to the cause of.

> It's not far fetched to assume she's probably dying

It is really, given that she never says it or even anything close to it. "I'm not as energetic as you" is not ever short hand for "I'm dying".

>>13637128

Corin has to have been unfrozen at some point, and fairly recently, because several of the Moonrace technicians and militia personnel act afraid of him based on his reputation. If he was never ufronzen and had been in since before the Moonrace existed (which it's said later he's older than the Moonrace) then he'd have no reputation to inspire said fear.

>>13637211

> Dianna's sick because she's been frozen for 20 year stretches a ridiculous number of times.

The problem with that thinking is that there's nothing to support it. The only thing Dianna says is that she's not able to be as energetic as Kihel due to being frozen - not that she's dying from it. The fact she's using a cane when she's walking in rough terrain in snowy conditions in the middle of the countryside doesn't add up to "I'm dying". It just adds up to, "I'm not as energetic".

>>13637232

Unless it's mentioned, not really. The fact she's been frozen so much is explanation enough, it doesn't need more explanation.

>>13637658

>>13637316


> Also, he might have only shown interest in Sochie a couple of times

He never shows interest in her outside of that kiss.

> I always felt like his bond with Dianna was admiration

Admiration is soft-selling it. The two share the only even vaguely romantic scenes in the entire show, they both show concern for the others well being as well as their reputation multiple times, they both show implicit understanding of the other's feelings and wishes multiple times and they both grow much closer over the course of the show. Such things do sometimes end in friendship, but they also sometimes end in a relationship. And given the ring and the fact they're living together alone in the middle of the woods, I know which I think is more likely.

>the novels explain it
>SRW explain it
>the show explains it
and yet there are still retards trying to argue that Diana and Loran are a couple at the end. They are honestly that retarded.

>>13637780

> the novels explain it

Has anyone actually proved that yet, or is it just someone saying it? Cause there's kind of an important difference.

> the show explains it

No, it doesn't. The show goes out of it's way to portray the hibernation thing as not physically damaging and at most taxing while also pushing Dianna and Loran at least in the finale with the whole ring thing.

>they're so retarded they even try to argue that the ring is from Loran despite it being Will Game's ring she received earlier in the series
Someone should just put a bullet in their head, though I have a feeling it's less than three idiots.

Sochie vs Fraw Bow

>>13637799

> implying Will gave her a ring at any point in the series

Go on then, post a screen cap of it.

Why would they as a couple sleep in separate beds? Why are those scenes in no way romantic?

And seeing as all you fags go "struggling with running can't prove anything" "needing a stick to walk can't prove anything" and all that stuff I want a solid answer not some wishy washy shit

>>13637204
>mountain
she isn't climbing a mountain. She is on a flat bit outside the house

>>13637807
In a fight?
Sochie has killed people and she'll do it again.

>>13637838
Wow, someone with half a brain started posted. Amazing.

>>13637085
>weaker due to age. Which is a big leap from dying
That is saying your body will not last a normal life spam though. Maybe she does have 20 years left but arguing how much time is pointless. The extent just in these threads that people try to discredit the point is silly.

>>13637780
It's not that they explain it, but they understand the intention the same way each time.

You can interpret the stuff any way you like and argue about it forever, but each is as valid as the other with that. But when official material doesn't just suggest but outright states one is right multiple times then the answer is pretty obvious

>Hey I want to go to Earth to spend my last days even if it will almost start a war
>Oh man I get winded when I run
>Wow cryosleep fucks people up
>Ugh I need this stick to walk on flat ground
>Here's my ring from Will Game
>Harry is going back to the moon while I stay here, could you replace him Loran?
>Oh hey Loran is kissing Sochie
>Let's sleep in separate beds Loran
>"Good night, my queen"
>SRW spells it out
Totally up to interpretation amirite

>>13637939
But i can say your corroborating evidence is wrong and my much smaller set of evidence being just how i saw the end is right

>>13637958
And I can say that you're a retard!

>>13637665
Watch the middle of the series again. Loran clearly gets jealous of Gavan

He outright says so in a next episode clip

>>13637838
To start, there cabin is in the woods/mountain somewhere. And for another, we don't know where that creek/stream scene is because the view outside the house does not include it. Its also literally the only scene that includes her walking with it. The ones before didn't have it and the ones after were unfortunately just her at a table and in bed.

While you can take away that she's weak and/or dying, there is nothing in the series itself that directly supports it and its up for interpretation in the end.

I liked her. I liked her voice. I liked the voice actor in Brain Powerd. I was considering watching Mars Daybreak because she is in it, isn't she?

>>13638028
Yes we do we see a full shot of where it is. And even if we didn't suggesting she went up a mountain has no basis

Which is funny as you then claim the weak body has no basis, despite her literally saying thay and other evidence stated a few posts above you. There is simply much more to support this interpretation which all materials after follow

>>13638044
Bingo. Unfortunately, it's a PS2 game tie-in from Bones, so you may have to tread lightly.

>>13638049
>Which is funny as you then claim the weak body has no basis, despite her literally saying thay

That doesn't mean she's dying you tit. She just at most as some muscle atrophy like people do when they get out of a cast or something.

>>13638090
If that were true she wouldn't be able to get up, not tire quickly

What is more likely. The list of evidence including >>13637939 is right, or all that is wrong must be ignored and the 5 minutes at the end if seen a certain way and supported by no other matetial is right

>>13638108
Most of that "evidence" IS from the last 5 minutes though.

>>13638183
No it isn't though, you didn't even reaf that guys post.

But lets say both only had basis in the end, one is always supported in other official material. There is a clear winner even if you ignore all the other evidence

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>>13638108

that sounds like a really forced interpretation

>>Hey I want to go to Earth to spend my last days even if it will almost start a war

Or because it's our original home and we had planned to return forever anyways because the moon is a small rock with very limited resources

>>Oh man I get winded when I run

Queen. probably doesn't jog much

>>Wow cryosleep fucks people up

so doesn't sleeping on your arm wrong.

>>Ugh I need this stick to walk on flat ground

That's just being sensible, especially in winter

>>Here's my ring from Will Game

Never gave her one. It's from loran

>>Harry is going back to the moon while I stay here, could you replace him Loran?

Kihel is queen now. There's like 5 people who know this and Harry trusts Loran

>>Let's sleep in separate beds Loran

I could just as easily say Loran liked to stay up late and wouldn't be joining her to later. We never saw HIS bed. Also I love Lucy

>>"Good night, my queen"

that's just manners.

>>SRW spells it out

Glorified fanfic. Didn't Kaiser only exist because of Getter rays in one of those?

>>13638205
7/10 of the things he lists are from the epilogue.

>>13638219
See >>13637873

Your arguments against are weak and this just goes in circles because it is just interpretation, never mind you'll never admit a large amount of evidence gives more credence. Interpretation are just that. The fact that every single extra official material supports they aren't married bolsters the point even more.

>>13638205
>one is always supported in other official material.
>Crossover game.
>Gundam novel adaptation not written by the people involved in the series and no one on /m/ has actually read.

>>13638242

> every single extra official material

Super Robot Wars is not official material and that's about the only one that anyone has ever shown to include it. Someone in this thread said that the novel does as well but hey, I read the novel last night and I know for a fact that Loran ends up with Poe so that's pretty bullshit.

Even if the novel thing is true, then it is at best one official material that supports it and that SRW took it's cue from because the writers preferred that end. The actual anime very definitely leaves things open for interpretation.

>>13638283
No they are official. Are you saying that material is unofficially made?

So again. One side has more evidence and both can be argued about validaty till the turn a brings cows home. But more is more. One is supported by what is official material no mater what you think of it. What seems more likely?

>>13638219
>Queen. probably doesn't jog much
>so doesn't sleeping on your arm wrong.
>That's just being sensible, especially in winter
>Never gave her one. It's from loran
>Kihel is queen now. There's like 5 people who know this and Harry trusts Loran
>I could just as easily say Loran liked to stay up late and wouldn't be joining her to later. We never saw HIS bed.
>that's just manners.
>Glorified fanfic

>Didn't Kaiser only exist because of Getter rays in one of those?
That was literally the original debut of Kaiser.

Denialfags, everyone. Not even once.

>>13638309
Are you actually saying srw games are official material?

>>13638325
Are you saying they are unofficially made and just steal? No. Sunrise gives permission and looks over how properties are used while having a hand in it

And you didn't answer my question

>>13638338

Super Robot Wars writers write whatever the hell they want and are not any kind of source. Unless you are arguing that the kind of things they did with SEED and Destiny were the real intention of Fukuda - a guy who has publicly decried the games as not being true to his vision.

They're given the license to use the characters, suits and so on by Sunrise but they're not official material and are never going to be any kind of source.

>>13638350
You mean how they followed the original plan for destiny so do have knowledge and access to official material? And yes they are official works, they are not some stolen fan made thing.

And it isn't the only one. Again answer the question.

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>a bunch of people on an anonymous message board had the same impression of Turn A's ending as the entire SRW staff
>but it's completely baseless guise! You're just imagining things

D E N I A L
E
N
I
A
L

>>13638001

Loran never gets jealous of Gavane. If anything, it's the other way around, though not over Sochie. Gavane is definitely jealous of Loran's fame as a pilot though.

When Loran finds out Sochie is getting married he isn't upset, jealous or even particularly intrigued - he's completely ambivalent to it, primarily because he has other shit to worry about at the time. He never shows any negative emotional reaction to it or Gavane though.

And while I'd never paid attention to the next episode previews before I just went and watched the ones from 15 to 28 (episodes 29 and 30 are broken and need to redownloaded), and about the only thing even remotely suggestive of jealousy is Loran saying "And I seem to have lost my place in milady Sochie's heart". Which isn't actually jealousy, it's him commenting on the fact that in the show Sochie is starting to move on from him and nothing more - because his comments in the next and previous episode previews are him as a meta-commentator remarking about the show on a regular basis, including wondering at one point about the love lives of the cast and how there's not predicting them at the moment.

>>13638363

Which one of them followed the original plan for Destiny? Because there's been several different re-writes to Destiny as far as I know and Fukuda himself has decried one as not matching his vision of the show. So even if they were going by the original plans in one of them, they're no comment on what the actual show panned out to be.

And yes, they are fan works. They're made by fans, for fans with the blessing of Sunrise. That doesn't make the official in any way.

> It isn't the only one.

What other work is there beside the novel that no-one has read? What question am I not answering?

>>13638366
Not just srw staff. Literally everyone who has worked on turn a officially made material that mentions it, which has to be approved by sunrise

>>13637780
I can buy people saying Diana isn't dying at the end of the show. Sure, believe that.

But I don't know how anyone thinks they're husband and waifu. Loran never shows a lick of romantic interest in her, and the reverse doesn't happen either. He wants to serve his Queen, not bone some sexy lady. She's untouchable as far as he's concerned.

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>>13637807
Flawless victory for Sochie. Fraw doesn't have the killer instinct.

>>13638392

Such as?

>>13638410

I'd say the same thing about Sochie. He shows no romantic interest in her during the entire show bar the kiss at the end, which is very obviously a consolation prize. I do however think several scenes between Dianna and Loran like them riding the bike down the mountain, them dancing under the Turn-A, the laundry scene and Loran falling asleep in her lap show some slight bit of romanticism and a growing closeness between them. They're not explicitly romantic and very well could be simply friendship, but it's a lot more than he ever had with Sochie frankly.

>>13638392
>Literally everyone who has worked on turn a officially made material that mentions it

Care to list some examples? I'm actually curious about this. All I've seen mentioned that includes it that's actually sourced is the SRW game screenshots and translation in one thread a while back. I've never seen anyone post pics of or links to scans of the novel parts that mention it and given the boards past record with parroting untranslated information from gundam novels I doubt anyone here has actually read it.

Lets flip this on it's head

Post all evidence from secondary materials (aka not the show but still a licenced product) that Loran and Dianna are in love and married

Downloading the series to rewatch now as the amount of un-sourced claims flying around both sides based on memory is starting to make me want to check myself.

Nobody DESERVES a good ending.
I, for one, am perfectly happy with the ending she got. Sochie took too long to wise up, and suffered the consequences. At least she's alive at the end.

>>13638422
She's a killer in a Kapool.
Miashei's got the skills, but Sochie's got the edge.

>>13638453

Why not post something actually official that has Loran and Sochie in love instead, since no-one has done so in thread yet despite numerous claims they exist. Or post something from the show indicating Loran has any interest in Sochie besides the kiss where she's weeping as he drives away to live with another woman who suddenly has a ring on her wedding finger.

>>13638453
A someone who frankly finds this whole thing hilarious and doesn't care about either Sochie or Dianna, let me just let you know that licensed is not the same as official. It just means that someone bought a license to legally use material from something.

>>13638462
>besides the kiss where she's weeping as he drives away

Don't forget the scene where she throws his fish thing away into the river.

>>13638469
>licensed
>lʌJs(ə)nst/Submit
>adjective
>having an official licence.
no anon

>>13638422
I sometimes forget how amazing Sochie actually was.

Are people actually trying to say that a crossover game is official material?

>>13638469
As much as Turn A is the story of moon people returning and Loran doing whatever it is he does, it's also about Sochie's journey into adulthood. The show kicks off with her coming of age ceremony and she has the most obvious and far-reaching character development of anyone in the cast. Ditching the fish is the start of her getting over the crush on Loran. Whether or not he returns her feelings (which isn't really shown in the show) is irrelevent.

If we had a Turn A: Five Years After, I'd fully expect to see Loran coming back to find Sochie no longer gives a shit. Moon brownie missed the boat.

Okay, I know that people cannot accept the ending of Turn A because in their minds they cannot accept Sochie winning or Diana dying.

But let's not focus on that. Let's just look at Diana and Loran. Are they a couple? The answer is no. And the real kicker is that it's based on pretty much the same arguments that anti-Sochie types use.

There is no romance between Loran and Diana throughout the entire show. Loran only ever acted as Diana's perfect knight, never as a love interest.

>>13638475

Super Robot Wars is written by fans who are allowed to write whatever they want with the characters (within obvious limits of taste) and geared towards writing things they personally find fun or good. They might be reviewed by Sunrise to ensure there's nothing distasteful in there, but they are not obliged to write anything last I checked, nor are they given secret material that allows them to write towards the true ending. Mostly they just write what suits them instead.

Anything that turns up in a Super Robot Wars game is purely the will of the Super Robot Wars games staff and in no way reflects the staff of the anime it's based on. Nor is it ever any kind of official secondary source by which to judge the events of the anime given that it is, once again, written by fans to suit their own purposes and nothing more.

Trying to use it as a source is as desperate as the people claiming that Dianna's ring in the epilogue was given to her by Will Game during that arc. If you need to make shit up to explain something, it's desperation.

>>13638494
I decided to make a poll on just this, good timing

http://strawpoll.me/6295176

>>13638497
SRW may not be official material, but that's actually completely irrelevant because the actual point is >>13638366

>>13638494

Okay, I know that people cannot accept the ending of Turn A because in their minds they cannot accept Dianna winning or Sochie dying alone.

But let's not focus on that. Let's just look at Sochie and Loran. Are they a couple? The answer is no. And the real kicker is that it's based on pretty much the same arguments the anti-Dianna types use.

There is no romance between Sochie and Loran throughout the entire show. Loran only ever acted as Sochie's reluctant servant, never as a love interest.

>>13638494
>>13638510
This is the yin-yang essence of Turn A threads

>>13638503

But that's the same point. You're still trying to use what the Super Robot Wars writer liked and wanted as some kind of official source. Which it isn't.

>>13638519
His point is everyone else gets it but apparently you 2 people according to the poll

>All these arguments from both sides
>No scans linked
>No staff interviews linked
>Only a couple of screenshots from the series itself posted
>Open admittance from a couple people on both sides mentioning that they haven't seen the series in a while.
>Parroting everywhere

Holy fuck people, just link to a source or go into the series and screencap the scene you're talking about and settle it once and for all.

>>13638515
What is the sound of a WaDOM clapping?

>>13638530
Tomino made the entire ending fairly ambiguous which is why this debate is happening in the first place.

>>13638527
>Other people saw it the same way I did
>That means I'm right

>>13638534
A couple of thundering collisions? WaDOMs have hands. GIANT HANDS.

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>>13638540

>>13638527

Everyone else being 3 extra people you mean? Yea, that's real conclusive.

>>13638530

People seem to get annoyed when I've done it in the past, but sure, give me a few minutes and I'll image dump some stuff I've noticed in the past regarding Dianna dying being bullshit and character gossip regarding Loran's love life and what not if you want.

>>13638540
The vast majority did. Until you two can bring up some thing better you aren't changing the majorities mind

>>13638546
Does a Kapool have a Gundam nature?

>>13638557
>You have to think that they're in a relationship for Dianna not to be dying.

I don't think they're in a relationship and voted that they weren't. I don't think she's dying though.

>>13638550
>I've noticed in the past regarding Dianna dying being bullshit
You mean you'll post the scene where she says she is weak and then say that your own interpretation of this means it is nothing. You aren't going to bring up any shocking truths that haven't been discussed already

The whole conversation has been had in this thread already, you are late anon.

>>13638572
k
Is Dianna in a weakened state that will cause her to die?
http://strawpoll.me/6295328/r

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>>13638559
A Zaku, its monoeye having been shot out in a fight, was offered a glowing heat hawk to guide its way home to the Musai.

"I do not need a heat hawk," the Zaku said. "Darkness or light is all the same to me."

"I know you do not need a heat hawk to find your way," Gouf replied, "but if you don't have one, someone else may run into you. So you must take it."

The blind Zaku started off with the heat hawk and before he had flown very far someone ran squarely into him.

"Look where you're going!" he exclaimed to the stranger. "Can't you see this heat hawk?"

"Your battery has burned out, brother," replied the Gundam.

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>>13638557

> 3 people
> vast majority

>>13638575

It isn't meant to be a shocking truth anon, it's meant to make clear just how thin the premise is that the idea is based on. The entire theory is based on one line. A line where she doesn't even say she's weak, but instead say that she can't be as energetic as Kihel. Which isn't the same thing and also is not in any way an indication that she is dying - only that she isn't as fit as Kihel.

Especially when a few seconds later she talks about wanting to live a long and normal life. A line she repeats at least once more during the show. She doesn't talk like someone expecting to die soon at any point. Just the opposite, she talks like someone sure they could live a long life if things just worked out.

>>13638586

Probably be handy to not link to the results instead of the poll.

http://strawpoll.me/6295328/

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>>13638609
Never use your powers for evil.

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>>13638627

The issue regarding that line is compounded by the fact that a few episodes later Harry and Kihel muse that it might not be the hibernation that is causing Dianna's lack of energy, but instead her lifestyle and burdens that cause it.

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>>13638637

And not helped either by the fact that Corin has been in and out of hibernation for extremely long periods from before the time the Moonrace existed (so at least two thousand years according to the show) and yet is probably the most physically fit person in the show - and also the only one who actually works out by the looks of things, since we see him doing squats and shit several times in his first arc.

And the only thing anyone indicates is wrong with him is mental issues, not physical ones.

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>>13638642

Here's where we get the rough age of the Moonrace by the way.

>>13638627
>The entire theory is based on one line
this is why no one takes you seriously. You just straight up lie which can be seen by reading both sides comments

>>13638637
Also that scene you straight up don't get. It is saying why they are different as people and why Harry can tell, but now they have started to merge from doing each others job

>>13638642
Talked about earlier on, like other points. I was completely right about what you would do.

>>13638642
>And the only thing anyone indicates is wrong with him is mental issues, not physical ones.
Side materials translated by TE indicated that this had nothing to do with the process either, it was the result of some sort of weird moon punishment where they torture prisoners by showing them dreams until they go crazy.

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>>13638647

And now let's move on to Will Game for a moment. Here's where he "proposes" to Dianna. Which isn't actually a proposal - it's a promise to do so when he gets back, which Dianna says she'll accept. He never returns though, so Will never proposes and Dianna never gets a ring. She isn't wearing one at any point during the arc, she doesn't come across one (only a feather and a negative) and she doesn't throw one away.

>>13638661
>Dianna never gets a ring
I'm pretty sure she has a ring before the last episode, and it ain't Loran's.

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>>13638648

> this is why no one takes you seriously. You just straight up lie which can be seen by reading both sides comments

Then where is the lie? What comment is missing or not indicated to give another interpretation?

> that scene you straight up don't get.

They start of discussing how Harry can tell them apart yes - but the last part is Kihel saying that she's more energetic than Dianna because of their different choices and burdens and that she's starting to share that burden now.

> Talked about earlier on

Yet not actually refuted.

>>13638666

If she has I've not seen it after several runs of the show. Feel free to post it and prove me wrong though.

Anyways, moving on - characters gossip about Loran's love life a few times during the show and they always indicate a relationship between him and Dianna. It's never between him and Sochie.

>>13638648
>Talked about earlier on, like other points.
Statements were made but no one actually really sourced anything or posted screencaps. The fact that they're wondering if his brain damage is caused by prolonged hibernation and the fact that he predates their records means sort of implies that they aren't entirely sure what prolonged hibernation actually does. Dianna doesn't seem to concerned about what effects it could have had on herself either.

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>>13638677

Sochie herself speculates that Loran would prefer to spend time with Dianna/Kihel and Loran makes no effort to refute it. If Loran had any feelings for Sochie, why would he blank her here and not try and not try and deny feelings for Dianna even if he's not brave enough to admit feelings for Sochie?

>>13638677
>but the last part is Kihel saying that she's more energetic than Dianna because of their different choices and burdens and that she's starting to share that burden now.

Not him, but energetic could just mean her personality, not her physical condition. She isn't as depressed or weighed down by her position as Dianna is yet.

>>13638627
Nothing in that image suggests anything about how much time she has left.

>>13638637
They are not are comparing her hibernation at all. They are not using the word energetic in relation to her physical ability, but her mood.

>>13638642
Symptoms of hibernation aren't absolutes. What they are talking about here is one such adverse effect, which in Corin's case is mental in nature. The last shot specifically showing Dian_a thinking gravely about her own time in hibernation alludes to the complications the she herself may have. Which is clearly not mental.

>>13638690
>The last shot specifically showing Dian_a thinking gravely about her own time in hibernation

I don't get that impression at all, to me she looks like she's feeling pity for Corin, not herself.

>>13638685

Shit, I thought I had more screencaps, but apparently not. Well, Miashei makes at least one more sly comment to Sochie about Dianna and Loran having "that kind of relationship, huh" or something similar at the very least. I believe it's during the time where they're using the Gallop for a few episodes before the Wilgame is introduced, but I'm not 100% on that. I can try and find it if anyone cares.

Regardless, the point is that the only time anyone in universe speculates about Loran's love life it's always about him and Dianna ending up together. Even if they're not actually an item (and I can totally see why people wouldn't think they were), the point is that Dianna is the only person anyone in universe can see him ending up with and the cast themselves think a relationship is possible. That doesn't mean it exists, but it's certainly indicates there's cause to believe it possible if nothing else. And certainly more cause than is ever given for Sochie having one with him.

>>13638698
You forget this is a two sided thing. No one in the universe ever addresses Diana's feelings towards Loran, neither does Dianna herself who is obviously still involved emotionally with Will Game. On the other hand, Sochie has shown interest towards Loran and jealousy towards her sister getting his attention.

We have as much reason to believe he ends up with Sochie that we do that he ends up with Dianna. Only on Sochie's side there's also a very emotional kiss. The kind of kiss you don't kiss a friend.

>>13638661
>And now let's move on to Will Game for a moment. Here's where he "proposes" to Dianna. Which isn't actually a proposal - it's a promise to do so when he gets back
That was the entire point. Dianna never got his ring until she met his ancestor who had gotten it passed down in his family line.

>>13638685
She mentions both Kihel and Dianna, so for you to think this implies his love of Dianna is blatantly selective. And if this scene took place before Gavan died, then of course Loran wouldn't say anything when Sochie already chose someone else.

>>13638690

> Nothing in that image suggests anything about how much time she has left.

She's talking about how she's hoping to live a long life and die like a normal person. Not in a wistful "it'd be nice, but..." way either. In a matter of fact "this is what I want and hope I get out of this" way.

> They are not using the word energetic in relation to her physical ability, not her mood.

Okay, I can accept that. I don't believe it's true personally - but it's definitely a valid interpretation and I can respect that.

> The last shot specifically showing Dianna thinking gravely about her own time in hiberation

The last shot is Kihel, look at the eyes. So no, it isn't any kind of retrospection on Dianna's part. And again, there is literally nothing indicating that extended or repeated hibernation does anything but leave someone less energetic and certainly nothing indicating it could result in death.

>>13638681
Oh yeah, posting a screenshot of the scenes we all know about really change my mind. I mean he had convinved me but when he showed that characters joke about Loran and Dianna I was like, what more proof do you need? That could only be confirmation they are in a relationship

It's amazing only 2 people (well I guess 3 now brothers!) in this thread actually get it. Almost like these scenes could be seen in many different ways and they aren't proof

>>13638697
>So.. could this be the behavior of a person sent into prolonged hibernation?
>Diana looks down sadly in a contemplative manner
>"she's feeling pity for corin rite"
Do you have legit autism

>>13638705

> No one in universe ever addresses Dianna's feelings towards Loran

Miashei's comment that Dianna is his girlfriend would seem to be a comment on it actually, since it indicates she thinks Dianna would actually accept those feelings and return them - not just tolerate them. Since you can't be in an actual relationship if you don't reciprocate.

> Dianna herself who is obviously still involved emotionally with Will Game.

She barely mentions or thinks of him past the arc he shows up. She makes a comment regarding the name of the ship and that's about it. That doesn't seem like she's all that wrapped up in resolving those feelings to me.

> Sochie has shown interest towards Loran

And Loran showed no returned feelings for her. Not even when she was about to get married.

The point isn't that speculation on the part of the cast cements the relationship exists, only that such speculation indicates where the cast thing his feelings lie. A thing he makes no effort to deny, even to Sochie's face when she accuses him of it.

> The kind of kiss you don't kiss a friend

It certainly doesn't come off as a kiss between lovers. And can I ask, what kind of woman would let a guy go off to live alone in the woods with another woman for an extended period with no supervision or guarantees and then just let him walk back in to her life when he's done with that other woman? What kind of desperate person do you take Sochie to be that she has to play second fiddle like that and then just accept it?

>>13638711

> That was the entire point. Dianna never got his ring until she met his ancestor who had gotten it passed down in his family line.

The second Will Game never gives her a ring either. He gives her a music box that she finds a feather and a negative in, but never a ring.

> She mentions both Kihel and Dianna

Who the cast repeatedly treat as one person since they cannot differentiate them.

> if this scene took place before Gavane died

It takes place on the Moon about 25 episodes after Gavane died, and about 6 from the end of the show.

>>13638720

Again, not actually Dianna there anon.

>>13638685
>>13638677
>>13638661
>>13638642
>>13638637
>>13638627
Conjecture

You didn't prove it was "bullshit" as you said, you posted your own interpretations and are having an argument on it because they are vague. Post solid proof, I'll even take something not from the show

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>>13638760

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOSp5Oh9tiA

>Loran isn't wearing a ring
>Master-slave relationship and manner of speech event though they are supposedly "married"
>Nothing indicates it's an engagement ring
>Loran kisses another girl in front of his "fiance"/"wife"

Yeah, not buying it.

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>>13638771
>passionate kiss on the lip that last long
seems like something

>>13638772
>>Loran isn't wearing a ring
Very important as well

May I add no physical activity is seen between Loran and Dianna there, including different beds that seems to be never accounted for in these threads

> Sochie
> Treats Loran like a servant and not as an equal for much of the show
> Constantly bosses him around with no regard for Loran's own feelings or desires
> Regularly shows a misunderstanding of Loran's actual feelings or wishes
> Still questioning how loyal he is to her cause even in the final stretch of the show

> Dianna
> Treats Loran like an equal from the start and defends his person as well as his reputation regularly, including against Sochie when she sees Sochie talking about him as beneath her
> Constantly asks for Loran's input and always asks for help with achieving her own ends instead of demanding it
> Shows a intuitive understanding of Loran's feelings throughout the show, something which he often reciprocates

Can I ask why people actually want Sochie to end up with Loran? Like, I can't imagine it's a good relationship for either of them. Loran is a quiet, shy guy who constantly has a put upon expression when Sochie is berating him and treating him like a servant and seems much more comfortable and happy in Dianna's presence where he's treated as an equal. They're both rather old-fashioned and chivalrous too, so him not sleeping in the same bed till they're married makes sense to me, since he seems like the kind of guy who'd want to do that.

Sochie liked Loran because he was an exotic stranger as well as kind, but seemed to find Gavane (or someone like him) much better as an actual partner, since like her, he was assertive and mercurial. He challenged her as well as treated her well and she seemed to actually be happier in his company that she was or would be in Lorans, given that Loran is just not assertive enough to ever challenge her and he would just nod and go along with what she was saying passive aggressively till they both ended up miserable and resenting each other.

>>13638807

Just curious. People seem to want Loran to end up with her because they think Sochie deserves him more than because they'd actually be a good couple to me and I'm wondering what other people see that I'm quite possibly missing as to why they'd be a good couple.

>>13638760

You mean like how the idea that she's dying is conjecture based purely on a single line? As if, "I'm not as energetic as you" is secret code for "I'm dying", and how there's plenty of talk about cryosleep in show that refutes the idea going in to it will kill you? You're right though, I definitely over stated the case.

>>13638772

Guys normally don't wear engagement or wedding rings in Japan outside special occasions. Dianna however is wearing a plain ring (indicating engagement) on the correct finger of the correct hand to be an engagement ring. There's literally no other reason to put it on that specific finger, because that's the only time women generally wear rings on that finger.

And as regards to that kiss, it's followed by Sochie watching the guy she's apparently involved with walk about to spend an unknown amount of time alone with another woman who happens to be wearing an engagement ring a few minutes later. After which she throws away the only memento of that guy while crying and screaming. Yea, not buying that personally.

>>13638810
>You mean like
Yes it is all conjecture and not solid proof. That is my whole point there well done. You see that was a statement with a clear point

Now as you said you could present one of them on the subject. Again side material permitted

Sochie: kissed
Dianan: not kissed

If you watch
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOSp5Oh9tiA&t=5m20s
and think Loran is her lover, then there is no hope for your love life m8

>>13638821

You've yet to present any kind of proof yourself though, since as you said, the kiss can be read either way very easily. Outside of that one thing, when did Loran display any romantic interest in Sochie during the entire show.

Like, I'm open to the idea Dianna and Loran aren't a couple. I don't buy it, but I can definitely see the grounds for it and wouldn't be surprised if Tomino some day came out and said they weren't. I cannot see Sochie and Loran being a couple though. There's just nothing there on Loran's end during the entire show to indicate he has any feelings for her. Even after that kiss he just walks away to Dianna without ever pausing or looking back. He doesn't even seem to care that he's walking away from her there. Which is why it comes off as a pity kiss to me.

>>13638842
Conjecture

I have not made a statement on either side. You claimed to be able to show how "bullshit" >>13638550 the point was here. Please post this solid proof, again if you have side materials post them.

>>13638810
I can't see how you'd interpret their relationship at this point as anything but master and caretaker. You don't call your wife -sama, or use formal expressions.

Loran is obviously still in the role of a servant, he serves her tea, he makes her food, he clears up the plates from the table all while using polite language. They are obviously not equal and the little ring is hardly convincing enough to imagine they are both engaged.

As for Loran kissing Sochie, for the entire show from start to end Loran is portrayed as a selfless guy. He never does anything to hurt anyone and he never does anything that goes according with his own wishes if it conflicts with any of the two girls. He wouldn't initiate a kiss with Sochie had he not known he was going to come back for her. It's against his character and goes against relationship logic.

>>13638838
Pretty much this,

>>13638842
>when did Loran display any romantic interest in Sochie during the entire show.
There were times where he thought about her. I'd take screencaps but I don't have the show on my computer.

> He doesn't even seem to care that he's walking away from her there.
More likely he doesn't want to turn back because he is also in pain over having to leave her, but he is too loyal to Dianna to stay and do what he actually wants to do.

>>13638854

I also said a few posts up that I'd definitely over-stated the case in that post in case you hadn't noticed. I should have said that the line is at best conjecture based on, at least in my opinion, a really flimsy bit of evidence and that further lines from Dianna about what she's hoping to do along with further talk about cryosleep by several people show that it's almost definitely not true since they indicate Dianna thinks she's going to live a long life if things work out and everyone else indicates cyrosleep causes mental issues, not physical ones.

>>13638858

> He never does anything to hurt anyone and he never does anything that goes according with his own wishes if it conflicts with any of the two girls. He wouldn't initiate a kiss with Sochie had he not known he was going to come back for her. It's against his character and goes against relationship logic.

Kieth berates him for that exact problem during the show and afterwards he starts asserting himself a bit more. He makes it known he has no desire to dress up as Laura again regardless of how good the cause is, tells Guin to stuff it (and even physically attacks people) before leaving and starts being less passive around Sochie in general too. I'd also say it's entirely in his character to give her a goodbye kiss if he's walking away and he finally understands her feelings because as you say, he's a good person and if she wanted it, he'd probably comply.

> There were times where he thought about her.

Fair enough. I don't recall even one of those times. If you ever do get to screencap them though, I'd love to see them because I want someone to prove me wrong if such things exist.

> More likely he doesn't want to turn back

I don't think so. Sochie is crying and clinging on to him even before they kiss and then weeping bitterly as they drive away. Loran though is completely blank faced. He's not sad looking, he's not crying, he doesn't look back and he never looks torn or sad over what he is doing. And Loran is an emotional guy and not some kind of hardass who'd hold his feelings in. If he was sad, he'd let the audience know.

This is the most boring discussion ever.

>>13638547
Best episode

>>13638219
>Glorified fanfic. Didn't Kaiser only exist because of Getter rays in one of those?
That was Kaiser's first appearance you brain dead piece of filth

>>13637431

>Implied to have been in this state for nearly 2 millenia.

That would be hell incarnate to dream that long.

>>13628968
>tee hee Loran
>I have caught you naked bathing in the river
>I have hidden you cloths and can see your penis
>As a punishment for being naked before me,my hands will punish your penis.

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>>13642873

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>>13642878

File: So Chie wasn't quite as good as Naoto but I really think she deserves a solid 2nd place for the P4 girls. Also the Masked Detective staff is hard at work as usual.jpg (144KB, 720x480px) Image search: [Google]

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>>13627511
Sochie started as my favourite character but then she turned super anti-Moonrace when her father died.
I shouldn't have cared since personally I don't give a fuck about racism and while it was more a commentary on prolonged regional conflicts I didn't like that she said that shit around Loran.
I know she didn't know he was a member of the Moonrace, but he's my boy and it felt sitty having him shat on constantly by Sochie.
He's my boy, but Kamille will always be my nigga.
I did eventually warm but up to her though.
It helped when she said shit like this.

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>>13644738
I know she didn't know he was a member of the Moonrace, but he's my boy and it felt shitty having him shat on constantly by Sochie.*
I'm going to bed

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>>13644745

>>13638637
I found these scenes had a lot more context while watching G Reco. It takes place after Turn A, and we see a character who survived for 200 years I think without hibernation and it made him so weak. Moon people do some fucked up shit to stay alive forever.

>>13638772
>Steering wheel on the right
Doesn't seem very Amerian to me.