is he right or is he wrong? was Freud destroyed by him?

>>9522168
quick rundown on him?

Right.

haven't read him but there are several industrial societies doing perfectly well without freud: india, china, japan

>>9522168
A little outdated, Szasz focuses inordinately upon brain lesions in his argument, but he's still on point: it's extremely difficult to definitively link physical attributes and activities in the brain and CNS to psychological experience and behavioral manifestations, rendering it much more difficult to say someone has a mental "illness" in the same manner in which we say someone who has hoarseness, trouble swallowing, and viruses in their throat has a respiratory illness.

>>9522189
define "doing perfectly well"

>>9522189
>India
>china
>doing perfectly well

>>9522189
>india
>china

>japan
>suicide rate out the ass
>western suicide increasing after freud introduction

>>9522229
if that's his argument he's fucking retarded
we can define a syndrome (i.e. group of related signs and symptoms) without knowing the complete pathophysiology of the underlying disease

it's obvious that people who defend this position haver never seen actual psychiatric patients

>>9522189
>india
>china

brah....

>>9523200

Those definitions are subjective and arbitrary.

WHY DO YOU RELY ON VALIDATION OF YOUR OPINIONS FROM ANONYMOUS BOARD CULTURES INSTEAD OF YOUR OWN THOUGHT AND READING??????

>>9523242
>it's obvious that people who defend this position haver never seen actual psychiatric patients

>>9522168
>first remember feeling unhappy when I was a toddler
>first remember contemplating suicide when I was 8
>first attempted suicide when I was 13, take a bottle of St. John's Wort
>the adrenaline rush from experiencing the mental stages of death is pretty cool
>this seems like a good way to pass my time
>start carrying lots of over the counter shit on me in case I need to emergency an-hero in the event I couldn't handle my emotions (depression and anxiety)
>half-heartedly attempted suicide when I was 15, take like 75 aspirin
>have an OBE, got to a dark place that I assume is Purgatory
>wake up, vomit bile for like 2 or 3 days and menstrual blood everywhere, felt like shit for about a month after
>serious attempt at 17, take like two bottles of over the counter painkillers
>do it silently with friends present, because I didn't want to die alone
>puke up more bile
>FINALLY get mental help in college because I don't need my parents consent for antidepressants
>takes like 9 years to get me on the right meds
>last hospitalization worked out pretty good
>be 29
>first time in my life I have a normal sleep schedule
>psychiatrist thinks I may have bipolar II, but the official diagnosis is severe anxiety and depression; had some cluster B features that many years of therapy (decade +) and growing up helped to correct
Therapy and modern medicine saved my life. Mental illness is real, but features and presentation vary greatly from individual to individual.

>>9523687
>women attempting suicide
Jesus Christ. You never attempted it "seriously". You never tried to die.
You just did it knowing you'd get attention for it. Attention needed to help you, sure, but your purpose wasn't to end it all. No wonder you people all have suicide stories. It's just that you never actually do it because you want to.

>>9523701
Not femanon, but aside from your attitude being consistent with a pathological abnormality (don't take my word for it, it's just an opinion), you are also very self indulgent and dumb enough to think you can arrive to those conclusions based on that femanon's greentext. Wew lad. All the best anon.

>>9523687
do you have cute feet?

>>9523701
people who keep trying end up doing it
does it really matter if anyone does it for attention or not?

>>9523687
>>9523687

I don't think anyone serious doubts the existence of mental illness.

The debate is about the classifications of these illnesses (especially DSM diagnostic criteria), the "chemical imbalance" theory (which posits a one-to-one correspondence between physical abnormalities and mental illnesses), the usage of pharmaceuticals by large portions of the public, and the medicalization of success (ability to sustain relationships, a 9-5, and a bank account in the green).

It's not as simple as "the psychiatrists are right" or "the psychiatrists are wrong." As soon as one gets past the knee-jerk poles of "ADD and depression are total bullshit" and "depression is just like having Diabetes," a whole world of complex and interesting problems and perspectives emerges.

>>9523728
>As soon as one gets past the knee-jerk poles of "ADD and depression are total bullshit" and "depression is just like having Diabetes," a whole world of complex and interesting problems and perspectives emerges.
I agree with you 100%. Thank you too for clarifying the topic/debate at hand. In all truthfulness, I have never heard of Szasz, so I will have to read more into his theories.

>>9523274
Humans are social creatures, dumbass. Without conversation you just bounce your bad ideas off yourself and solidify them

>>9523687

damn bitches be crazy

>>9523708
Anon, isn't that all we do here? Analize characters from the information we were given? I'm doing just that. Aside from the fact that, even though you criticize me for doing it, you do the exact same thing by attributing me with a supposed "pathological abnormality", as well as brim "dumb and self-indulgent". How could you ever infer that from a couple lines of text? How monstrous and sick of you.
Anyways, she herself said that her "serious attempt" was made in company of friends so that "she wouldn't die alone". Taking a bunch of pills in front of people who will most certainly try to help you because they care about you certainly isn't the method you'd expect for someone who is seriously trying to die.

>>9523711
Well anon, your affirmation is a bit over the top. People who keep attempting either succeed or simply learn how to deal with it. I've been suicidal for the last 5 years, but every time I feel I'm near doing something excessive, I wrestle it down as a weakness.
Although I do understand why some people can't handle it, I hate how they try to constantly force the people around them to care. I personally don't feel suicide is something you should force others to understand, because most people have no idea on how to handle it

>>9523728
nobody believes that those diagnostic criteria are perfect in any way (as they are constantly changing), however they were necessary to globally uniformize the way we define the various disorders in order to get meaningful evidence in research

likewise nobody believes our current therapeutic tools are perfect, but someone who has some knowledge in the field must acknowledge that, for example, modern anti-psychotic drugs were a breakthrough in modern medicine

>depression is just like having diabetes
in a way it is. it's obvious that the mind has its basis on physical phenomena and we can assume that life events must affect the "physical mind" which is itself genetically conditioned. there's no clue about the true physiopathology of the disorder. we must look at depressive disorders not as single separate diseases but as syndromatic manifestations of multiple physiopathological pathways, as in the ways that life events are perceived by and influence the cerebral cortex which in turn are translated in the usual affective and cognitive manifestations of the disorder

naturally, our current ignorance, the enormous potential profit are exploited in every way possible with the permissiveness of the rulers of healthcare

>>9523854

I don't have any problem with anything in this post, anon.

These are definitely complex problems and you seem to recognize that so more power to ya.

As someone who's been through the ringer, so to speak, is there any book or writer you would recommend?

>>9523708
oh sweet irony

>>9523687
>1 year from now
>meds "stop working" (pro-tip: they never worked at all)
>"wtf I hate modern medicine ree"
>femanon tries to "kill herself" (ie histrionic bitch fishing for attention) again

>>9523871
those are just some poor reflections of a med student

I won't recommend any psychiatry textbook to you because there's no point to it and you'd be bored to hell

I'd be happy if you read freud's little book "on dreams" and think of it not as factual information but as a reflection and an approach on how the mind might work, it's a fun read

if you really want to know more about mental illness you should start by some psychopathology book to understand the manifestations of the disorders. i can't really recommend any as I've studied by a portuguese textbook and lecture notes

>>9522168
>is he right
r9k

>>9523903
>histrionic

nice psych diagnosis

File: 1492129881000.jpg (11KB, 240x240px) Image search: [Google]

11KB, 240x240px

>>9523594

I am a psychiatric patient.

As a psychiatric patient, I don't believe that my "problems" are caused by any kind of internal malfunction; there isn't anything wrong with my brain. I believe that they're a reaction to external stimuli. Modern civilization and living is unnatural, and some are unable to adapt as well as others. When you look at the world, it's obvious that nobody truly fully adapts to it.

>>9524405
if you are maladapted to your environment there is de-facto something wrong with you.

blaming the environment or society is sjw tier self-victimization. It will solve nothing.

File: feet.jpg (105KB, 498x665px) Image search: [Google]

105KB, 498x665px

>>9523841
>Well anon, your affirmation is a bit over the top. People who keep attempting either succeed or simply learn how to deal with it. I've been suicidal for the last 5 years, but every time I feel I'm near doing something excessive, I wrestle it down as a weakness.
>Although I do understand why some people can't handle it, I hate how they try to constantly force the people around them to care. I personally don't feel suicide is something you should force others to understand, because most people have no idea on how to handle it
this doesn't really answer the question

>>9522168
Wait, someone is opposing Freud's theories?

OY VEY ANUDDA SHOAAAAA

>>9523903
Eh, we are counting on 6 years of Cymbalta, still no issues. Latuda also killed my anxiety.

>>9525372
Well, basically, maybe women should try to deal with their own problems by themselves, instead of putting that burden on other people

>>9522179
Szasz spearheaded the movement to deinstitutionalize the insane in the late 1950's.
His peers called him out on it, but he started waving his hands around and muttering muh shoah, muh holocaust, and of course, they knew the drill, and here we are fifty years later with a tremendous homeless problem in the U.S.
As always, you've got to make sure you kick the ladder away once you've climbed to the top, so the powers that be have effectively buried his role in all this, so it just appears that the horde of neglected vagrants are simply a symptom of our society's constitution, and not the result its deliberate wrecking.