Literature for deradicalization?

You don't have to be a white Nationalist to be radical. You could just take a nuanced perspective

>>9473075

True. But I really don't even know what to think about how power works in the world anymore, and just thinking about it makes me more miserable. I'd stop thinking about it and silently vote if it weren't for the fact that everybody shoehorns in their politics into everything nowadays.

The only reason I was even on /pol/ in the first place is because it's probably one of the only websites where you could have fun and occasionally informative political discourse without people parroting the corporate media over and over again. I also go to an extremely liberal university without proper Socialist / Republican / Libertarian clubs, so I have no real life outlet, increasing the stress I get. Maybe it's an emotional maturity issue, but I'm certainly not going to let /pol/ get to me anymore.

>muh 17 intelligence agencies

Fuck, I thought us liberals learned from the Iraq War that the intelligence community is not to be trusted when testifying about anything related to geopolitics.

If you want to become bourgeois, you've got to stop reading so many people who were willing to live ascetic lives in response to the fundamental faults in bourgeois modernity. You have to start reading a lot of sanitized books by ivory tower academics in sinecures talking about how we can make things marginally better for marginal groups, but without rocking the boat too much. Remember, the key thing in being a bourgeois piece of shit is to keep the boat as steady as possible, because you have the best seats and are fundamentally content with the boat as it is, even if it occasionally affords you an unsightly view of the people dying and suffering at the other end of it.

Throw out that Adorno, the Heidegger. Keep the Chomsky - but only his recent stuff where he wants you to vote Obama to save the world. Get rid of On Liberty unless you can doublethink yourself into ignoring its loftier principles (like ACTUAL freedom to say what you think, even when it rocks the boat! perish the thought). Pat Buchanan might even be a bit too much. I recommend reading some watered-down neoconservatives, maybe get some Kagan or Fukuyama.

Right now, it might seem like the best direction to go in is the phony liberal progressivism of the Democrat "side" of the controlled dissent spectrum. But the Chomskies of the world, the ones who vote for the Blue Team, are as ailing as their paradigm. The pendulum of meaningless bourgeois sloganeering while you drink your slave-produced Starbucks is swinging back to neoconservatism, probably a trendy alt-lite libertarianism thoroughly sanitized of any of its actual anti-state elements, so that it folds nicely into existing Reaganite neocon globalism, and you get to keep your Starbucks. They might tinge it with some Elon Musk posthumanism, too, I hear that mentally retarded child-man is a Reagan-worshipping physical embodiment of Reddit proles.

So what you should do is, start aligning yourself with RIGHT libertarianism for the short term - that is, anti-state, radical capitalist "the free market runs itself" type libertarianism. Stay away from left libertarianism for the short term - those guys aren't mainstreamed yet, so have too many anti-globalist autarkic nationalists in there thinking unsanctioned thoughts, Hoppe types. Cling to a kind of milquetoast Randian right libertarian utopianism, while also reading lots of Steve Jobs venture capitalist jerkoff posthumanist utopianism for braindead Reddit faggots, and THEN in 10-20 years when that stuff enters the mainstream and they start using it to compress the working class and the third world slave factories into cubes you will enjoy a safe transition into an Outer Party job where you can swallow your boss's cum while he genetically engineers his children to be bosses and they do the same to their children until the New Republican cyborg managerial class is a permanent ossified layer dominating all of late post-liquid capitalist "humanity" until time itself comes to an end.

>>9473096

What if I'm not interested in becoming a piece of shit? You just gave me a path to becoming bluepilled again. I just want to be a realist about world events. I want to identify political factions, understand where power is concentrated and how it is leveraged, and then use that information to help protect myself and my family as I try to live a simple, educated life.

>>9473066
If you've read those people and are still a fascist you're probably going to be a fascist either way tbqh.
But if you really wanna try it, the only way I know of getting out of fascism/traditionalism is to try and properly gain an awareness of how life really is.

>>9473086
Maybe take a position of simply being independent, looking after whatever friends/family/local community you have, and not get so wrapped up in parties and factions? I try to just decide what I think about each issue without worrying about what "side" that puts me on, or if I'm now a something-ist.

>>9473110

Not a big fan of fascism. Oswald Mosley gets a bad rap, but everybody else got what they deserved.

>Maybe take a position of simply being independent, looking after whatever friends/family/local community you have, and not get so wrapped up in parties and factions?

Eschewing all civic involvement is not a good idea. I agree with avoiding "what side" I'm on, but you still have to band with other people to ensure that your needs are met. I haven't had a coherent ideology for a long time, just an extensive list of real-life observations and experience with a diverse amount of thinkers.

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>>9473066
Anti-Semite and Jew by Sartre is a good psychoanalytic takedown of the reactionary.

My
Diary
Desu

But really I'm working on a treatise in defense of Moderate Capitalist government and economic systems.

>>9473066
Blake. And Thomas Merton.

There's no need to have an ideology if you don't want one.

>>9473066
OP read Notes from Underground trans. Pevear and Volokhonsky. It's a critical condemnation of Humanitarian champagne Socialism that also argues in favor of traditional societal social structures (need for Religion, etc)
It also addresses Social Nihilism

>>9473066
I'm in a similar position if you actually want to talk. /lit/ is mostly just going to try and convert you to the left though, there's ironically no board bigger on ideology.

The tl;dr of the solution to your problem is: Don't look for something else to read, stop reading for a while. The answer to the outrage machine and radicalism lies in taking action and building your own life and personality. Sounds lofty but true in my opinion.

>>9473176
>Moderate Capitalist government
heh

>>9473066
>People I like reading: John Stuart Mill, Pat Buchanan, Noam Chomsky, Theodor Adorno, Martin Heidegger.
Blue pilled as fuck

>>9473206
For a board that loves Dostoevsky and Nietzsche it's kinda hard to call /lit/ universally Leftist. That slant, where it does exist, is likely owed more to the prevalence of Leftists in academic structures throughout the last 300 years.

>>9473142
...A traditionalist then? Maybe an ancap?
Well, that's less bad in general. Literally just try to see life as it is, no other way to get the ideology out.

>>9473160
>psychoanalytic
pseudoscience
>takedown of the reactionary.
I love to pathologize people who disagree with me!

I would recommend reading Jean Baudrillard. Ignore all of the memes about the matrix and shit, those things are not an accurate representation of his philosophy. It's pretty dense and hard to initially get into at first I won't lie, but if you're familiar with continental philosophy it shouldn't be too bad. Reading him really helped me to understand how things work and what is really going on in the current technologically accelerating society.

>>9473211
Moderation is an asymptotic principle to be strived for, it can't be permanently attained or permanently lost. That the government we live in today is leaning away from Moderation is not a condemnation of moderation in itself.

>>9473243
Moderation is subjective, if you lived under traditionalism what you call moderation would be considered extreme left, dummy.
Striving for moderation is literally impossible.

>>9473142
What do you mean abandon all civic involvement?
What affects you affects your family which affects your community and so on. it's all stacked together. The anon offered really good advice.
Start from the source(yourself) and branch out from there(your family, your neighborhood, etc.)

>>9473096
But history shows that gradual, incremental political change without rocking the boat too much actually delivers better results on average than going for radical change. Going for radical change tends to cause mass death and sometimes totalitarianism. If you really care about humanity, gradual change makes sense.

>>9473066

Ellison's Invisible Man

>>9473223
Good luck unironically praising Nietzsche here without getting shouted down and bombarded with shitty memes or anecdotes about his supposed failing at life.

>>9473260
*sips starbucks*

>>9473066
Forget politics. Go into science. In the modern world, politics is the guy riding shotgun in a car driven by scientific progress. Scientific progress brings about technological progress. Technological progress causes mass economic changes. Then politics reacts to the economic changes. That's how the last few hundred years have gone (maybe all human history, even). If you want the most amount of influence possible on the future, go into science. The big question facing us is how we can use science for good without being destroyed by its creation of new destructive capabilities.

>>9473270
Much better sip starbucks in a nice modern Western nation than live in some commie or fascist shithole created by people who wanted radical change.

>>9473280
tell that to the slaves who make your starbucks and don't care whether they live or die anymore

>>9473096
>and you get to keep your Starbucks.
Well...thank god for that.
>Elon Musk posthumanism
Er, well, thank the material that god gave us to work with...?
>New Republican cyborg managerial class is a permanent ossified layer dominating all of late post-liquid capitalist "humanity" until time itself comes to an end.

Well now, that's just silly...though, for some reason, I'm erect. Oh wait, that's right, that always happens to me when I die a little inside.

>>9473066
>I decided to get off the /pol/ train.
Good!
>I'm not interested in being bluepilled, but /pol/ is a type of bluepill in itself.
Forget this bluepill/redpill nonsense. The world is more complex than being awake or being asleep. People generally have good intentions, even if their political praxis leads to unwanted outcomes.
>I think it's really starting to impair my quality of life because I'd binge too much and it'd make me depressed.

This actually doesn't sound related to /pol/ or politics but more generally being too isolated and consuming too much media. Take up a hobby that gets you away from the internet. Frisbee, bird watching, hiking, dance classes, photography (not the instagram variety, the kind where you get film developed), billiards, painting, whatever.

Listen to the mainstream media casually, stuff like NPR news updates or BBC newshour. Just listen to a little bit, get a sense of what mainstream people believe, try to understand why they believe it. Realize that it isn't a matter of them being bluepilled sleepers, that its just one of many positions that are perfectly reasonable to have.

>>9473245
That doesn't conflict with what I just said

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The blackpill is the only interesting one.

>>9473066
Defensible Space - Oscar Newman
I guess Robin Dunbar too.

>>9473294
What slaves exactly

>>9473066
I was in your same situation, then I read War & Peace. Tolstoi made me a better person.

>>9473298

>The world is more complex than being awake or being asleep. People generally have good intentions, even if their political praxis leads to unwanted outcomes.

Your average person has good intentions. Those in the higher echelons in power are cynically "redpilled", or they're brainwashed beyond belief, and I don't think I can ever forget that. Power seems to attract the worst kinds of people.

>Listen to the mainstream media casually, stuff like NPR news updates or BBC newshour. Just listen to a little bit, get a sense of what mainstream people believe, try to understand why they believe it. Realize that it isn't a matter of them being bluepilled sleepers, that its just one of many positions that are perfectly reasonable to have.

Even NPR has become scorched earth within the past two years. They don't represent the views of the average person in the sense that they're average people collecting information about the average belief systems of the population. They're controlled distributors of information with heavy bias thanks to finances and ideology. I don't care if I get rid of /pol/, the non-ideological cynicism of all media outlets and the knowledge that most opinions out there have been manufactured for discussion will never go away.

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>>9473066
You should read Stirner if you wish to rise above the nonsense. Otherwise, you can try to find some meaningfulness amongst the romping swine.

>>9473294
>tell that to the slaves who make your starbucks and don't care whether they live or die anymore

I love when people pretend to have the capacity to "care" for abstract entities such as "slaves who make your starbucks". How about caring for beans that got roasted too. And the land that was used. How about we extend compassion to everything in existence all at once, then calm ourselves down and realise we're incapable of rational compassion altogether.

Also, I don't believe anything other than the truth that if you burn me with hot coffee, I will sue.

>>9473332
Probably referring to a wageslave LOL. But most are just college students who, again, would rather live in a nice western democracy than a commie or fascist shithole where academia is repressed. Plus with the added benefit of working to get some money to pay off that tuition/student loan debt or for some luxury shit.

>>9473332
The people who do 2-3 jobs and barely manage to pay rent and cover day to day expenses.

>>9473108
A buhddist monk had this issue he brought to his master once he learned the buhddist mysteries.
His masters reply.
"A broken mirror doesnt reflect in the same way again"

Once you take the red pill there is no going back.

You can only seek a new perspective.

>>9473233
Psychoanalysis is more a literary critical theory /phenomenological /existentialist practise than it is a scientific one. Desu.

>>9473066
>Buchanan
>Chomsky

Are you MPD?

I would suggest F.A. Hayek's The Constitution of Liberty. I started off conservative, moved libertarian, and then moved more lefty as I got more education and got out into the real word. However, Hayek's social thought always will stick with me. Unlike Ayn Rand, he is actually a moral person and argues classical liberalism from a moral perspective. He asks the far left to stop and think what makes the world work and what could go wrong if we throw a revolutionary monkey wrench into it. The world is complicated, no one knows everything, and spontaneous order with a respect for basic property rights just might be the best way. He wasn't against all welfare or government participation in healthcare, he just wanted us to respect the market and what it has provided us. In my opinion, neoliberalism along the lines of Bill Clinton and Tony Blair followed Hayek's lessons the most. He's conservative in the sense that he recognizes no generation can start from scratch, and we have to accept some of the hard-earned wisdom of the past without completely understanding it.

>>9473412
>MPD

No. I don't think Chomsky's views on power/media and Buchanan's views on demographic change are incompatible. Two pieces of the puzzle.

>>9473422

>In my opinion, neoliberalism along the lines of Bill Clinton and Tony Blair followed Hayek's lessons the most

Thank you for making the most persuasive argument to NEVER read Hayek ever.

Does /lit/ hate the Horseshoe Theory as much as /pol/ does?

>>9473452
Yes.

>>9473452
only a spineless retard wouldn't

>>9473452

I hate horseshoe theory too. The only useful concept to gain is it highlights how many political movements attempt to seize control of a population, which increases investigation into what the means of control and the centers of power really are. It otherwise wholly underestimates how many valid answers/perspectives there are to problems in the world, how often miscommunications can happen thanks to polar opposite identities, and how much of the current policies seen as "consequences" from valid perspectives are actually constructed by TPTB (think tanks, pundits, politician talking points, etc.).

>>9473395
That's not slavery and their failure to manipulate the Capitalist system is none of my concern; the larger argument that the system itself has failed in its responsibilities could be made but rarely is because contemporary pseudo-revolutionaries are just whiny spoilt children.

>>9473452
Horseshoe Theory is a predictive model, not an observational one. Hating it is like hating the weatherman for giving you a 70% chance of rain instead of just telling you whether or not it's raining.

>>9473513
>>9473381
>>9473369
Looks like >>9473096 successfully attracted some of the 'ummm capitalism is just human nature lmao i have never studied history or anything else' zombies

Let's all point at them and laugh

>>9473294
Slaves? We're all slaves to the laws of physics, man. The modern Western nation state is the best political system that has yet existed, to my knowledge, as far as protecring people from the cruelty of those laws of physics without impinging too much on liberty. Those Starbucks "slaves" have a better chance to become filthy rich than lower class people in almost any society that has ever existed.
Me: was almost broke for years, taught myself how to write software, now middle class, teying to become rich.

>>9473322
Hit us up with some good black pill reading material, brotha man.

>>9473397
Agreed to some extent. What's annoying about /pol/ is that they turn what are some valid, often taboo, insights into reality into a weird nazi-living cult. The red pills don't have to turn you into a fascist. Indeed, fascist society would be much much worse than the society we currently have in the west, for all its problems.

>>9473474
It's accurate, though. Try to argue against it.

>>9473571
It's not really about capitalism, though. It's about not drinking that revolutionary koolaid.

>>9473727

>Agreed to some extent. What's annoying about /pol/ is that they turn what are some valid, often taboo, insights into reality into a weird nazi-living cult.

This. Can't we have a middle-ground? I think I'd rather fall into some compromise between civic nationalism and ethnic nationalism, in the sense that equal opportunity and rights are maintained, but no attempts to subvert national identity are tolerated.

>>9473758
>subvert the national identity
what is the national identity?

>>9473773
For that guy, I'm guessing ethnicity.

>>9473758
>in the sense that equal opportunity and rights are maintained, but no attempts to subvert national identity are tolerated.
That worked great in France, until it didn't.

>>9473758
>>no attempts to subvert national identity are tolerated.

That sounds needlessly authoritarian and rigid. Cultures and national identities should be allowed to evolve and adapt.

>>9473362
> Those in the higher echelons in power are cynically "redpilled"

Bill Clinton praised Charles Murray as being basically correct, for example.

For example, a strong motivator for /pol/'s ethnic nationalism is the fact that many third-world ethnic groups have lower intellectual abilities and are more prone due to violence due to genetic factors. Regardless of what they say on TV, most of the ruling class probably knows this. The reality is that stoking ethnic nationalism is a recipe for disaster that will rile up the masses to the point where order is no longer possible.

Unfortunately, imo US politics has, out of the need to win elections, basically degenerated into race-baiting and counter-baiting (I will take money from racist whiteys to give you benefits and reunite you with your family members from Mexico! vs. I will cut benefits from those leeching blacks and kick out the spics!) as opposed to promoting order and growth.

>>9473796
>Cultures and national identities should be allowed to evolve and adapt.
College liberal as fuck.

>>9473727
>fascist society would be much much worse than the society we currently have in the west, for all its problems

I'm not convinced it would be very different.

>>9473808

Not really, just have enough historical knowledge to realize that the kind of "national identity" the far-right wants to hold onto is a relatively recent invention and has gone through countless changes in the past. That doesn't mean I find, say, Eurabia to be an acceptable outcome, I just don't want to fight against it by condemning our cultures to rigor mortis out of fear of any change.

>>9473758
What your describing is called Hoppean Libertarianism.

>>9473880
>have enough historical knowledge to realize that the kind of "national identity" the far-right wants to hold onto is a relatively recent invention and has gone through countless changes in the past

Your one post away from the /his/ meme that insists national borders were invented in the 1800's, stop.

>>9473066

Hey anon, i would recommend something in the leaning of Thoreau and similar social critic/internal development. Maybe try classic right wing thought while studying greek philosophy and literature. It will probably change you for the best

>>9473880
Accepting Middle Easterners isn't bad per se, the issue is that European countries are failing to discriminate. Selecting intelligent, successful people can be good for economic growth, and people of differing ethnicities can be integrated into European/American societies more successfully than others (say, east Asian countries) because they are less prone to tribalism. This is an advantage of said societies. The problem is that when you take an arbitrary cross-section of people from those countries, due to being unwilling to enforce borders or discriminate between people, you will end up with a large contingent of people who are unintelligent, devoutly religious, and hold backwards views. This will lead them to have poor levels of achievement in society and build resentment. Unfortunately, it seems Europeans are unwilling to discriminate here, whether out of guilt over Nazi collaborationism, desire to reduce native wages, humanitarian impulses, or what, I don't know.

>>9473066

But demographic change absolutely is a problem in the West. And if you accepted that once I don't think you can ever really forget it. There is no reason why white people should become a minority in their own countries.

>>9473796

I realized it comes across like as authoritarian, but I view the attempts to systematically change the demographics of the United States as far more authoritarian in nature. It doesn't need to be anything but "all immigrants must meet very high standards", "enforce the borders, no illegal immigrants", and "do not incentivize globalization... it should only happen because of economic pressures, not because Wall Street wants the wholesale destruction of American industry".

I have no problem with the diversity that we've had in the United States in around... 1960, minus the obvious discrimination. Mostly white population, sizable African-American population (they've been a part of the USA for 100s of years, can't deny them opportunity or identity), small assortment other well-adjusted minorities. Minimized multiculturalism allows for a cohesive national identity and prevents the fragmentation and exploitation that we're currently seeing today, with the welfare state sustained by identity politics, with the massive importation of Mexicans to serve as cheap labor and drive down wages, with globalization destroying the earning potentials of the American middle class, and the budget struggling to keep up with a permanent underclass of wage slaves who literally cannot be sustained on the McJobs that are left in the wake of globalism.

I really have no other way to describe it. It's not ideological as it is just stating the facts that wealth and power is being siphoned at every corner thanks to "attempts to subvert national identity". I'm not talking about having degeneracy police, I'm talking about stopping corporations from playing God a la the culture industry in order to rig the market, increasing their profits at the expense of everybody else, including small businesses and honest businesses.

>>9473941

Sure. I'd just rather talk about it as a sociologist rather than a racist. I don't have anything wrong against 80% white, 12% black, 8% other, like we had in the 1960s. I don't want corporations to get away with fostering division to increase profits and control, which seems so obvious to me with my background in both Marxism and conservatism, but sounds like Stormfront material to anybody else. I genuinely want us all to get along and reach our full potentials... I just don't want this multiculturalism shit to develop because it always comes with a sinister agenda attached that's far too complicated to explicate in all of its emotional, economic, political, and social consequences.

>likes reading Heidegger
lmao

>>9473959
>I view the attempts to systematically change the demographics of the United States as far more authoritarian in nature
It's not authoritarian, It amounts to: It would be racist and immoral to enforce our border with Mexico.

>do not incentivize globalization... it should only happen because of economic pressures, not because Wall Street wants the wholesale destruction of American industry
People with mediocre intelligence in rich countries, who are only suited for manual labor, assess their own market value to be far higher than the global marketplaces' assessment. Preserving jobs for such people will require increasingly heavy protectionism in the long run.

>the welfare state sustained by identity politics
It isn't sustained by identity politics, and the welfare state extends well beyond transfer payments to minorities. See: the military. Imagine if America brought most of its troops home tomorrow. What would they do for a living?

>wealth and power is being siphoned at every corner thanks to "attempts to subvert national identity"
capitalism subverts the national identity because it does not care about it.

I do sort of agree with what you are saying, but the logical endpoint of it is Socialism in One Country, not 1960s America.

>>9473959
Globalization isn't destroying the us middle class. Growing foreign competition and technological change are, but resisting globalization wouldn't make those go away.

>>9473959

This sounds reasonable, but is still a bit short-sighted IMO. If you heavily restrict migration, raise the cost of labor, etc. the only thing you achieve is that you incentivize corporations to double down on automation. The halcyon days of well-paying, stable jobs for blue-collar workers are over, possibly for ever. We need to come up with a new societal model to deal with this.

>>9474034
You don't know the first thing about economics. next.

>>9474040
>The halcyon days of well-paying, stable jobs for blue-collar workers are over, possibly for ever. We need to come up with a new societal model to deal with this.
Stop
Watching
CGP Grey
Already

>>9474045
Do you have any arguments against what I wrote?

>>9473452
Only fascists and commies hate it, but they unfortunately make up to 90% of this board.

>>9473096
holy autism

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>deradicalization

People like pic related are the radical ones.

>>9473452

For Horseshoe Theory to make sense, the left-right spectrum itself would have to make sense. And it doesn't.

>>9474090
not really. they're basically slightly to the left (or even dead center) on the contemporary political spectrum

>>9474042
Explain

>>9473758
I think its related in the human tendency to bifurcate our problems, solutions always seem to be an either or. Black and white

If you arent with us you are against us type of mentality.
Which can be a mentality imposed on any type of ideology that condones violence.

>>9474171
I blame Aristurtle

>>9473959
It sounds like you take issue with "coerced" adaptation.
Its all well and good when integration and synthesis happens organically.
But when human interests force us to adapt quicker than having it arise naturally, people feel oppressed.

I think one major issue with this. If it is the case. Is that this can be an observation after the fact.
That it often can feel that this synthesis or integration or adaptation is forced only becuase of the violent products that initial synthesis or integration often brings.

That isnt to say that isnt the case either.

Its just really hard to cinfirm when this adaptation s forced or natural especially when it comes to human behavior.

>>9474153

But that's my point. They SHOULD be considered radicals, but in our totally messed up culture, they are in the center.

OP thinks he's a radical for caring about immigration/demographics, but these have always been very moderate concerns. Its only now in the wacky modern world that caring about this stuff makes you a radical far-right fascist.

>>9473422

>He's conservative in the sense that he recognizes no generation can start from scratch, and we have to accept some of the hard-earned wisdom of the past without completely understanding it.

I think that is something that needs to change. Its really hard to find justification for things we regard as conventional.
I think we need to start giving people explanations along with our truisms and not just the platitudes by themselves.

We dont understand our past becuase the past only told us how it was and didnt give us adequate explanations.

>>9474090
Compared to whom?

>>9473742
This. Revolutionary ideals are inherently unethical and only arise from a failure in the governmental regime to adhere to its duty to the citizen, which inherently includes suppressing Revolutionary tendencies. That Market Capitalism allows people to ideally pursue their own self-interests without creating stress on the government or social contract (as does Communism and any anarchic system) simply makes it the most effective system de facto and a goal to continuously strive for in legislation. There will always be the cyclical leaning of power towards other systems and that's natural to keep the social contract intact.

Good for you, OP. That atmosphere is unhealthy.

I'd recommend reading everything. Fiction and nonfiction, written by anyone and everyone. Seek out authors who you know you disagree with on one subject or other. That's the best way I know of to get out of an ideological bubble.

>>9473996
>>9474034
>>9474040

>muh globalization is good for you and inevitable meme

Maybe for the least-skilled jobs, globalization would be natural. What you can't explain is advanced industries such as aerospace manufacturing going abroad because the Chinese are willing to subsidize the infrastructure, the energy costs, the education costs, the tariffs, etc., to outcompete the American product without any equivalent support. Cheap labor alone can't replace the skills and the materials needed for complex industries. And we're in big trouble, defense-speaking, when Boeing moves abroad.

What's happening right now is a massive concerted effort to siphon the accumulated capital of the United States into foreign countries, where they can be put to use by less demanding workers without any of the research and development costs that brought them about in the first place.

>>9474042
>>9474045

Agreed. I hopeyou people realize that meme magic (the Overton Window) is a serious thing. You shouldn't place your trust into somebody who has such little faith in human ingenuity. Do you really think that somebody who wants you all sucking off the teat of the government has your best interests at heart? Sounds like a cold cynic to me.

>>9474190

>Its just really hard to cinfirm when this adaptation s forced or natural especially when it comes to human behavior.

It's very easy to confirm when you can trace the origins of multiculturalism to specific policies implemented by the United States in the late 20th century. For example, less emphasis on assimilation and more emphasis on cultural preservation of immigrants (for the fear of "racism". The immigration policy that we've held that began to incentivize non-whites to immigrate over whites. The immigration policy that allowed millions of unskilled illegal immigrants to flood into the United States, oftentimes receiving amnesty in the process. The immigration policy that led to importing H1B workers to replace domestic works at home. i.e.,

>>9473223
It's not universally leftist, but there's a lot of them on here peddling their commie shit, and there's a bunch of transfers from pol. It's polarized.

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>>9474572
>Communism is for Liberals
>Education is for Liberals
>Opinions are for Liberals

>>9474577
> liberals are leftists meme

>>9474585
>liberals are not liberal meme

>>9474585

Find me someone who advocates for Marxism/socialism who doesn't also advocate for cultural destruction and demographic replacement of the West

>>9474599
First define "cultural destruction and demographic replacement of the West"

>>9473066
If you've been on /pol/, I'm sure you've seen Evola mentioned a lot. Memes aside, he is well worth reading; start with Revolt Against The Modern World, then Men Amongst The Ruins; if you want more, finish up with Ride The Tiger. Yes, the guy is an extreme reactionary, but his insights into le current year, even when he wrote them, are more relevant and profound than today than they were in the past.

>>9473233
>pseudoscience

Give it a chance before dismissing it with a meme. It doesn't claim to be science.

>>9473096
I like how OP talks about trying to not be pessimistic anymore, and instead you vomit all over him your negative thoughts about the future

>>9474042
You're an idiot. That's not an argument. He provided good points and even Friedman agrees with him. If you want to fight globalization, realize that it's not the corporations' at fault, but your local markets. Are they perhaps shackled and unable to compete with other markets? Oh well, maybe that's the reason. I bet you probably think the value of a dollar is determined by our GDP.

>>9473369
>How about we extend compassion to everything in existence all at once
That's what buddhists do actually. I quite like the idea.

>>9473096
hating the bourgeois has to be the most boring shit of the last 200 years, give me a fucking break

>>9475054
It's because jews jew each other. The whole facade of "muh 1%" was invented by competing jews to try to outjew the other ones. If you realized it's the government's fault why you don't have a job anymore, there wouldn't be any profit to make.

>>9475058
the reason you don't have a job anymore is because u went to community college and majored in english and got a 2.5 gpa, the jews and the bourgeoisie had nothing to do with it, unemployment is at 4.4% right now, stop being a snowflake and go get a laboring job that matches your non-existent skills

>>9475062
>the jews had nothing to do with it
how to spot a jew ladies and gentlemen

>>9475067
right the reason u don't have a job is because of the jews but then when a black guy says he can't get a job because of white people you'll call him a lazy nigger, no fan of judaism, but kys

>>9475070
>no fan of judaism
>vigorously defends jews
some mental gymanstics you're engaged in fella. and how quick you are to assume I don't have a well paying job because I criticize jewish machinations. try harder JIDF

>>9475071

did u seriously forget you posted this two posts ago?

>If you realized it's the government's fault why you don't have a job anymore, there wouldn't be any profit to make.

>>9473096
Anon this was beautiful.

>>9475086
>edgelord 'critique' of the bourgeoisie
>beautiful

spare me, pseud

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>>9475088
Sometimes just plan edgy bullshit is better than 500 pages of marxist critique or 3 tomes of muh cyclical decline of history,

OP should focus on his personal life, instead of thinking of any serious thoughts about civilisation, It's obvious he dwelled on theory too much lately and not enough on himself.

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>>9473066

If you don't want to go full /pol/, but don't want to be "so open-minded that your brain falls out" either, then I'd recommend this new book.

It points out a few home truths in a non-retard way, like the inevitable impossibility of retaining European culture/values/etc whilst accepting immigrants/refugees at the rate we are currently doing so.

>>9473066
>Unfortunately, I don't really have an ideology anymore, and I don't know where to go from here. What should I read to deradicalize without becoming bluepilled again?

Incoherent.
How can you be in need of deradicalization when you have no ideology?
Why is a lack of ideology "unfortunate?"

Ideological thinking is literally retarded and removes your ability to perceive events in their proper context. The problem with ideology is that it politicizes more and more areas of life. Lack of ideology is a good thing. Indifference is a sign of the freedom of your mind.

>>9475165

I heard Murray talking about this yesterday on the radio.

He seems right on the money, just a shame that he's a staunch neo-conservative.

>>9475165

Well it's just a numbers game, isn't it? I would be more interested in reading a book about why so many Europeans can't see the obvious demographic facts, but I'll probably still check this one out.

Not OP btw

>>9475202

It isn't that Europeans can't comprehend the impending cultural change, they're well aware of it, it's just that they don't care because they've been taught that their culture is evil, or even worse, non-existent.

>>9473758
This is your mind on alt-lite

>>9473908
>Only selecting the intelligent
First we can trust science, few of them are intelligent by our standards. We are talking about iq 130 and above people or even a higher, if we want geniuses maybe even 140 plus. There are statistically much fewer in those countries, than in ours. So this is only about one person in 10.000 to 20.000 from the middel east, depending on the country. Secondly, if we take them away this hole region would spiral into even worse conditions.
It's completely untrue that asians aren't loyal to their countries of native origin. Also those asians also alter our society to maybe to a less criminal and less desfuctional society, we will still end up losing our dynamic spirit and the higher standard deviation in iq, resulting in less geniuses and an ant society, which just obeys and hasn't the creative capacity to advance beauty standards and thought.
>>9473986
Worthless post, try to use arguments next time or at least pretend to do, if you aren't capable.
>>9474097
It's there for cybernetic reasons. There is no other use in the theory other than to tell simple minded people who to vote for. Like you don't want your country over by immigrants and live in gated communities? You must be a leftist because free markets means free flow of goods. Choseing who to vote or who you want to have in power is a complex thing, it's certainly multi dimensional, but in the end you have to go for the most pressuring issues and make compromises, especially if something important is at steak.
>>9474090
Isn't somebody who wants radical change of the current situation the radical? So it just depends on your point in time who is the radical.
>>9474171
>>9474173
It is ruted in human biology and in order to survive we have to make decisions and we have to act on them. The obvious example is you alone against the wild animal. There are an infinite amount of nuanced things you can do, but you have to decide fast and the most clear and distinct actions are all out attac or fleeing as fast as possible. You also need to decide it clear enough to not mix things up and really decide for an option.

>>9473066
Unironically, the greeks, specially the stoics.
I was pretty rad left but after feeling like that was somewhat wrong and reading letters from a stoic I became very center. Fucking greek aesthetic of balance and middleground.

>>9475338
>First we can trust science, few of them are intelligent by our standards.
Just take people who come through the better US universities.
>but it will brain drain the Arab countries
So?
>Asians lower the standard deviation of the national IQ
This is some /pol/-tier drivel made up to assuage their insecurities over not having the highest average IQ.

>>9473294
They can suck my hairy balls for all I care.

>>9475354
>This is some /pol/-tier drivel made up
Not even trying to make an coherent argument. What about scientific advances in history, it is clear beyond doubt that whites are the only ones who brought us into modernity? I think you are just angry that we whites with all our weaknesses are still the best and it's absolutely vital for the intellectual and scientific future to have us around.

>>9475354
>Just take people who come through the better US universities
Good amount of them is just rich corrupt foreign elites buying their kids in and affirmative action. The Us universitys are mostly considered to be pretty low quality on average under the Phd. level programms, with the exception of some very specific fields at a few universities.

>>9475434
I'm white you idiot. The meme about differently shaped IQ curves among whites and Asians is not backed by reality.

>>9475446
As opposed to US corrupt elites who buy their way in? If rich people want to come to the US, have their kids study, and pay a bunch of taxes for us, let them come. It's far better than taking Central Americans out of a pathological desire to rescue them.

>>9475434
Your arbitrary definition of white hasn't existed for 99.99% of human history. Someone nuke the US already.

>>9475446
>The Us universitys are mostly considered to be pretty low quality on average under the Phd. level programms, with the exception of some very specific fields at a few universities.
also lel at this, people are clamoring to come study at (the better) US universities for the international credibility and ability to work in the US that the degree confers upon them. If the US university system is bad, where are the good ones? Europe? wew

>>9475344
>center
>middleground
Like nearly all Greek Philosophers The Stoics were reactionaries you idiot.

>>9473233
scientism not even once

>>9475458
Everything is reactionary. Just because things are reactionary doesn't mean they aren't centrist and more often than not the reactions pull things toward the center.

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>>9473066
Cioran was a Fascist when he was young.
Read him and you'll be so depressed you'll see no point or worth in race, nation or any of that monkey bullshit

>>9473096
Nice writing man, cracked me up.

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>>9473096
Its posts like this that give me faith in /lit/

>>9475453
>Your arbitrary definition of white hasn't existed for 99.99% of human history.

People only say this to white people. They never say to blacks or hispanics that your definition of your race is arbitrary. Why?

Like it or not, it is simple not in white people's interest today to say that they have no right to fight for their interests, while every other racial group can.

>>9473108
Read Eumeswil.

>>9474384
>It's very easy to confirm when you can trace the origins of multiculturalism to specific policies implemented by the United States in the late 20th century. For example, less emphasis on assimilation and more emphasis on cultural preservation of immigrants (for the fear of "racism".

There's a number of liberal commentators that were very prominent liberals in the 50s, 60s, and early 70s who, by the latter half of the 80s and early 99s, were sounding alarms about then-current multicultural policies and the sheer levels of immigration. People like Arthur Schlesinger, Jr. and others. Their concern was basically, "the country was wracked by extreme inequality, massive social conflict and national and ethnic enmities for decades, and went through the Great Depression, until we finally managed to work that out with the New Deal, Fair Deal, WWII, etc, when we were finally able to build a coherent national society and provide rough equality for everyone as citizens (except for black people, which would take another 20-25 years). Why would we want to bring millions of people who have radically different beliefs and attitudes, significantly more than existed between European immigrants and who view the US and its history as oppressive, and not encourage them to assimilate? Nevermind that it's much easier to maintain ties to your home country today than it was in 1905. We'll just end up with tremendous social strife and a return to the inequalities that marked the decades preceding the Great Depression." This is my major issue with multiculturalism and uncontrolled immigration, as I can't see how you maintain a democracy and individual rights without a dominant civil society that undergirds the vast majority of people's beliefs and behavioral norms.

as someone right wing there's I've read from the left (and I have a left wing degree) that has convinced me to soften my beliefs whatsoever, it will be the same for you
instead find relatively non political things to get invested in, follow a sports team (better yet join one), start gardening, cooking or just play games or something
there's more to life than roleplaying on the internet

>>9475656
Who the fuck thinks "Hispanic" isn't an arbitrary race?

>>9474592
>title of a party is always accurate meme
Guess those Democratic Republics aren't actually authoritarian Commie shitholes then!

>>9476258
in full agreement anon, kinda like those authoritarian Commie shitholes aren't all that Commie.

Same thing happened to me but as a marxist...just stop hating the bourgeoisie and capitalism. liberal democracy is fucking great. don't get me wrong, i have no illusions, i know it's not really "democratic" and i know the stuff the cia does, etc. but there's a reason most people prefer democratic capitalism, it really is the best possible thing we can get in reality. i feel like a lot of /pol/ shit is really just people frustrated over not doing well in capitalism, like oh no immigrants will take my jobs, or jews are ripping me off, etc. it's all really anti-capitalist stuff at the bottom, and like some marxist (possibly marx himself) said "anti-semitism is the socialism of fools". learn to stop worrying, and love capitalism, trying to go against the tide of history and fight for lost causes is a waste of your life, better to go with the tide and ride as high on it as you can, you only get one life, don't waste it being spooked into wasting it on other people's crusades

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This is the next step after /pol/.

>>9476287

this is how cucks justify their cuckholdry. it's fine mate, negotiating a political world-view that minimises suffering is not easy and it clearly got to you. can't blame you; capitalism is rather seductive when you get tired, it's certainly better than anything else we've gone for - this might change in the future though. if you claim to be apolitical, have the decency to shut the fuck up, while not deluding yourself into thinking that you got to this mindset out of anything but cowardice and submission.

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Take the iron pill, OP.

>>9476324
capitalism is the "world view" that minimizes suffering you fucking fag, being an angsty crank in a basement is not "courageous", you're incapable and afraid of living in the world as it is, so you have to invent some fantasy utopia world where everything is nice and fanciful, looks like the coward is you, my dude

>>9476334
Everyone is incapable of living in the world that it is. You criticize others for their dreams of utopianism because you lack the wherewithal to experience the dispassion they have of the world you yourself utopianize in your pseudo-warrior fantasies

>>9476334
You shouldn't rush to envision me as some ill-adapted benefit scrounging meme marxist. I am perfectly capable of living in the world as it is anon, I was fortunate enough to have been brought up in a well-adjusted family and go to good schools while also receiving marketable skills for the present economy. Regardless of my social standing and how I managed to adapt to 'the world as it is', I won't compromise my worldview and accept this brand of capitalism simply because it made room for me. I can see it for it faults and can envision better systems, so I will speak and conduct myself accordingly.

>>9475338
lmao

>>9474603
I would say RATM and MATR are not worth your time. They were written during a period in Evola's life where he thought it was still possible to turn the world around, so to speak. When he wrote Ride The Tiger he was convinced Pandora's box was permanently opened - and that was in the 60s! If Evola were alive today he would be shocked and appalled.

>>9476381
then in practice you are a liberal capitalist, you say you are opposed to the injustices of capitalism to launder your privilege, knowing full well no revolution is coming and you can continue your comfy existence, glad you see it my way, comrade

>>9476402
>that "aristocrats of the soul" subtitle

so fucking cheesy

>>9476405
You sound like a cultist. You're way too emotionally invested in whether the idea you think you're a winner actually means anything

>>9476414
It's only cheesy because in the last decade we started to fetishize aristocrats as champions of progress.

>>9476405
I was merely accusing you for being a cuck. You know nothing about me, cuck.

I am not a single-issue voter, I sometimes vote against my immediate economic interest, I work for a private enterprise that functions as a cooperative, but can't say that if i were truly pressed I wouldn't compromise on that front.

So you're saying unless I go off the capitalist grid, as long as I benefit from the system, I can't be critical of it? I am not an anti-capitalist, nor am I a Marxist (whatever that means), although I do see value in Marxist critiques of capitalism. How is not supporting neoliberalism and neoconservativism hypocritical though?

>>9476445
>neoliberalism

the only way to really be against neoliberalism is to be an ethnic nationalist, and since you think you're some kind of leftist i don't suppose you would confess to this kind of racism

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>>9476448
>the only way to really be against neoliberalism is to be an ethnic nationalist

What the fuck is this goober smoking

>>9476445
>You know nothing about me, cuck.

you just wrote a braggadocios paragraph about yourself, fool

>>9476450
oh so you're one of those guys who thinks free movement of labor but not free movement of capital is somehow different from the reverse? instead of bring the sweatshop to asia, they bring asia to the sweatshop, same difference

>>9476263
Not Muh Marxism isn't an argument you mongoloid; adherence to Marx's theory is irrelevant when discussing the failings of Communism as a broader social concept. Any attempt to force people to work against their own self-interest is going to lead to the collapse of the Social Contract.

>>9476451
And?

>>9476459
lol u don't troll so good buddy

>>9476287
>like some marxist (possibly marx himself) said "anti-semitism is the socialism of fools"
Marx was a noted anti-Semite you tard

>>9476457
>instead of bring the sweatshop to asia, they bring asia to the sweatshop, same difference

Eh buddy there's this stuff called regulations, unions and labor rights that stops many sweatshops being set up in the first world

>>9476469
>Eh buddy there's this stuff called regulations, unions and labor rights that stops many sweatshops being set up in the first world

that's all part of liberal capitalism ya fuckin mong, lol you basically agree with me ideologically but you can't let go of your radical edgelord self-image, grow up

>we can make a more human and livable capitalism through careful regulations and trade unionism, oh but i'm totally REVOLUTIONARY and not just a liberal ok check out the patches on my jacket, i even have that one with the red fist! yeah i'm so rad!

lol

>>9476475
I'm not the same guy you were replying to...
Only pointing out you don't seem to have really thought out your arguments here past spewing provocative aphorisms

>>9476481
what are my arguments? i don't need arguments, i'm fine with the world as it is, i don't need to convince anyone of anything. if nothing happens then my vision for the world is fulfilled. i just offered some advice to op to help him stop being an edgy teen that's all, didn't mean to trigger a bunch of spergs

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>>9476490
Yeah you sure sound like someone who doesn't care what others think

The biggest tip to deradicalising yourself is being successful in life OP. As bullshit as that sounds, there's a reason why the majority of the disenfranchised are basement dwelling shitposters and ""autodidacts"". The best way to see the ladder isn't rigged against you is to climb it yourself, and stop blaming others for your failures.

>>9476498
Define success

>>9476511
when you reach a point where u don't need to blame capitalism, jews, jesuits, satanists, isis, the world bank, the imf, the federal reserve, goldman sachs, and whatever else for your life situation

>>9476530
Gee that sure is convenient measuring bar

>>9476458
you okay buddy? we weren't really discussing that now, were we?

>>9476572
He's an insecure one, he not only has to assert that everything he thinks is absolutely correct but more than that its not actually even possible to have a different opinion.

>>9473066
do shrooms

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/biz/ lit would be the best pill.

Dont do historical or ideological books. Do stuff like pic rel. Understanding capital markets is the biggest redpill ever.

>>9475453
And then every definition hasn't existed for 99.99 percent of human history. It's just tactical nihilism and you know it.

>>9476448
>>9476475
>>9476490
I wasn't claiming to be revolutionary, nor to be sporting red patches anon. I just want a better world for my children. I'm fine with capitalism as I can't deny the fact that you can't have universal equity and incentives work differently for people. I think there is strong literature to point to the crippling effects of wealth inequality, so I want to reduce that, I want to push private ownership towards syndicalism and I want to divorce the state from private enterprise, I want interventionism to be done merely because we can't stand aside claiming we know so little about human suffering as to pretend genocides are nuanced, not because we have a state-building agenda. This isn't new, nor revolutionary. But you're deluded if you actually think the political scene has something to offer along these very milquetoasty classically liberal lines.

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>>9473108
>wants to be an objectivist
>doesn't want to be a /pol/lack

Don't know what you want me to tell you, bucko.

>>9476598
>playing the financial game and gaining an understanding of financial instruments is the true red pill

Dear me.

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>>9476469

Unions and other means for worker representation have been permanently neutered and subverted by neoliberal interests. AFL-CIO works in tandem with the US Chamber of Commerce because 1) its membership has been declining; and 2) its ability to influence was crippled by the Feingold-McCain Campaign Finance Reform Act. Corporations and wealthy benefactors, like George Soros, are now the bulwark of the most prominent "left-leaning" political party, so all of the so-called stopgaps on neoliberalism, such as regulations, unions, labor rights, etc., have been corrupted.

If you are a leftist in today's world, and you vote in accordance to what is to be expected of leftists in mainstream leftism (the vast majority of leftist thinkers and leftist activists, unfortunately), then you actively voting for your own destruction with the appearance that you're making a difference in the world for alienated labor, for social justice, or for whatever pet project that motivates your brand of leftism. You can't No True Scotsman your way out of the problem because nobody else interprets leftism the way it "should" be anymore... it's been covered up by massive corporate influence, intellectual negligence, and party neglect.

>>9476632
Oh ok, I'll vote for Trump instead then

>>9476598

this kind of day trader bullshit is fucking gay, if active trading like that made money the richest people would be day traders not value investors and fund managers who skim off the top

>>9476643
Come on man, best return on investment is totally relative to the amount of capital you have to work with.

>>9476498
>>9476530

OP here. I don't blame anybody for my problems. I don't really have any "real" pressing problems to begin with. I go to HYPSM. I have a stable income. I have no problems meeting basic needs like food, sex, etc. I have a future ahead of me.

I care about the way things are headed, and like I said earlier, that everybody finds a way to promoting well-being, self-actualization, opportunity, etc. What really bothers me is observing the shitshow happening around me, in the way society and politics conducts itself, and the general collapse of ethical standards, especially among left-leaning individuals who can't fathom that right-leaning people have valid points about self-preservation and instant gratification.

If other people were authentic in their profession to have the moral and intellectual high ground, then they wouldn't be turn a blind eye towards festering such a toxic political environment. Are we supposed to turn a blind eye towards real socioeconomic impacts because it is politically inconvenient? What even matters for us anymore? I feel lonely because nobody seems to understand the gravity of what they're saying anymore and how utterly destructive it really is. And I wish I had a better way to say what I want to say so others could understand.

>>9476650
not sure if trolling, but no.

>>9476657
I'm not even saying you're wrong, only your argument doesn't work. Someone who is rich enough to be able to afford to buy large property developements has very different opportunities than someone who can only afford relatively small stock purchases

>>9476636

That's what you're unironically supposed to do until Trump has been subverted by neoliberal interests. That is to say, is no longer opposed by the dominant establishment faction that has controlled both parties in Washington DC for 40+ years.

As long as K Street, Wall Street, the corporate media, the activist groups, the establishment politicians, etc., all band against Donald Trump, then he's a safe pick for at least "freeing" Washington DC into the hands of the people. If you like pragmatic right-wing policies, then he's an even better choice, and you'll want him for 8 years rather than 4 years.

>>9476665
i thought we were talking about investing in equity markets, but as far real estate development goes: every heard of a loan, faggot?