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Les Fleurs du mal

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Thread replies: 29
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File: 20170504_094922.jpg (4MB, 4128x2322px) Image search: [Google]
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Which english translation of The Flowers of Evil do you personally think is the best?
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>>9466781
you'd be better off learning French mate./

PS: See Uncle Monty's excellent rendition of hémisphère dans une chevelure in Withnail & I.
Hilarious because he manages that uniquely gay English feat of making a French prose poem actually rhyme.
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>>9466781

I've got the Oxford classics version. No idea how good the translation is but the dual translation is pretty fun to read alongside the English.
>>
Let's take the last three lines from La Mort des pauvres, and compare the different translations (those lines are a definition of death):
>C'est la gloire des Dieux, c'est le grenier mystique,
>C'est la bourse du pauvre et sa patrie antique,
>C'est le portique ouvert sur les Cieux inconnus !

If you want the exact meaning, Aggeler is spot on (it's almost word-for-word translation), but the musical enchantment in the original disappears:
>It's the glory of the gods, the mystic granary,
>It is the poor man's purse, his ancient fatherland,
>It is the portal opening on unknown Skies!

If you want a rendition of Baudelaire's harmony and music, at the expense of the original words, Roy Campbell is interesting, as he delivers a reinterpretation of his own:
>It is God's glory and the mystic grange:
>The poor man's purse and fatherland it seems,
>And door that opens Heavens vast and strange.

Cyril Scott gives a better rendition of Baudelaire's tight and solemn form, which is the most visible thing in Baudelaire's poetry, while preserving the original meaning:
>'Tis the fame of the gods, 'tis the granary blest,
>'Tis the purse of the poor, and his birth-place of rest,
>To the unknown Heavens, 'tis the wide-open door.

Personally, I prefer Cyril Scott, by far. His translation feels almost as good as the original. It just works.

>disclaimer: I compared the different translations on fleursdumal.org
>>
One of my personal favourite translations, though it's very hard to find, is by Lewis Piaget Shanks.


my youth was all a murky hurricane;
not oft did the suns of splendour burst the gloom;
so wild the lightning raged, so fierce the rain,
few crimson fruits my garden-close illume.

now I have touched the autumn of the mind,
I must repair and smooth the earth, to save
my little seed-plot, torn and undermined,
guttered and gaping like an open grave.

and will the flowers all my dreams implore
draw from this garden wasted like a shore
some rich mysterious power the storm imparts?
— o grief! o grief! time eats away our lives,

and the dark Enemy gnawing at our hearts
sucks from our blood the strength whereon he thrives!
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>>9466781
Nice painting.
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>>9466781
J'ai commancé en apprendre le français et j'ai un question. Pourquoi on utilise "en" dans cette phrase: Je n'en *** pas.

Est-ce que recommandez-vous Voyage au bout de la nuit pour on qui a jusque un anée en apprendre?

Je suis lis l'étranger sans plus problème.
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>>9469500
"En" represents "any of it" or "some of it" ("it" being a thing alluded to before).

>Avez-vous des problèmes ? - Je n'en ai pas.
>Do you have problems? - I don't have any problem.

You can't say "je ne les ai pas" because you're not talking about "les problèmes" (the problems), but "des problèmes" (problems).

You could also answer "je n'ai pas de problèmes", but it's less elegant than just alluding to them with "en".

"Voyage au bout de la nuit" is not for beginners. It is too difficult, much harder than Camus. You have the master the language before even dreaming of "getting it". Random excerpt:

>Entre les lagunes d'alentour et dans le tréfonds forestier stagnaient quelques peuplades moisies, décimées, abruties par le tripanosome et la misère chronique ; elles fournissaient tout de même ces peuplades un petit impôt et à coups de trique, bien entendu.

Or:

>Notre galère tenait son mince sillon juste au ras des jetées, là où venait finir une eau caca, toute barbotante d'une kyrielle de petits bachots et remorqueurs avides et cornards.
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>>9469590
What's funny is that in France, even illiterate people can "get" Céline very easily... while an educated foreigner who made a ton of efforts to read our language will struggle:

>barbotante?
>kyrielle?
>bachots?
>cornards?
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>>9469610
care to explain?
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>>9469630
Even if French people don't know the exact meaning of the word, they "get it" from the context, from Céline's tone, from the musicality of the word...

The exact meaning is less important than the general feeling conveyed by Céline, so you instinctively understand what he means if that's your native tongue (and the words are somewhat familiar to you anyway: there are a lot of common words, or slang, or funny turns of phrase, all kinds of non-academic stuff that French people just know... while a foreigner will be puzzled).

Meanwhile, a foreigner doesn't know if he's missing something, so he really has to stop to look up "barbotante" or "kyrielle". The whole process is too tedious.
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>>9469466
Unfortunately it's not mine, and i cant seem to find it anywhere on the internet. Supposedly it was painted by someone named Anneli Queflander-Sarpaneva. It is included in a translation to Finnish by Yrjö Kaijärvi printed in 1962 by Otava.
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Aggeler is *by far* the best.
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>>9469714
Too bad, I can't webfu anything of hers either.
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>>9469745
But yes i'd say that her paintings did really fit the book quite nicely, i can take more pictures tomorrow when the lighting conditions are better ie. sun is up if you are interested.
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>>9469761
Please do if it's not any trouble.
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I got the reclam a couple days ago because some anons suggested it and im not fluent enough in french yet. But in the translation part they make it rhyme and have a semi noticable metre as well. So they change the meaning and words a bit at times and I really dislike that and it makes it difficult to search for a single word I might not know. Still really glad I got it.
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>>9469779
>Reclam

Is it German / French ?
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>>9469850
yes. They do foreign language with annotations or complete translations but always have the original text as well which is really nice.
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>>9469870
I saw Reclam books in the German section of a bookstore (here in France) and I thought they were really neat, practical and cheap compared to our paperbacks.

I'll probably buy some of them to improve my German.
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>>9469909
they are so stereotypical german.
>Simple
>but Bland
>still very good
>>
i like richard howards
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>>9469668
>>9469610
The rude vernacular, in a nutshell. Neologisms cloaked in expletives. That kind of thing. You'll know it when you see it.
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File: 20170506_132129.jpg (4MB, 2381x2322px) Image search: [Google]
20170506_132129.jpg
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Here's a possibly bit better version of the original picture.
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File: 20170506_132041.jpg (3MB, 1940x2283px) Image search: [Google]
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And here are the other paintings found in the book.
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File: 20170506_132522.jpg (3MB, 2009x2322px) Image search: [Google]
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File: 20170506_132814.jpg (2MB, 1628x1735px) Image search: [Google]
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>>9466781
>The Flowers of Evil
>not The Flowers of Bad
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>>9467950
Nice comparison anon.
I don't really see how Campbell's translation is more a reinterpretation than Scott's one.
From these extracts, I'd say that I prefer Campell's version but Scott is certainly interesting.

I wouldn't bother to read Aggeler unless you were trying to learn French.
Thread posts: 29
Thread images: 5


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