The sailor who fell from grace with the sea

it's not the sailor doing anything graceful, it's the sailor "falling out of good graces" either with the sea, or the sea's graces

>>9074749
are you native? For me, as an Eastern European, the first original sounds way more natural than the one you propose. I don't know about grammar

>>9074749
Gee I don't know, maybe if you read the book you'd understand.

>>9074749
Weird. The French title, which is the only one I knew, is "the sailor rejected by the sea". I guess the english title is better (also, if I remember, Mishima wanted his works translated from English, not from Japanese - he thought English was perfectly fine to express what he meant).
Spanish title seems to confirm what the above anon said - El marino que perdió la gracia del mar.
So yeah. Falling from the sea and its graces. Maybe the japanese for "falling" isn't as weird.

>>9074749

I thought it was worded that way because it was supposed to represent his fell from grace AFTER he came from the sea. He was a sailor who fell in love with a woman who lived on land. The sea was all he knew and he hadn't enough the grace for tribulations happening away from it.

Am I dumb?

>>9074869
As someone who's never read the book, I always assumed that it was about a man who was always at sea, and the sea loved him (you know, in a vague metaphorical sense), but then he either did something to spurn her, or, since the ocean is fickle, she simply stopped loving him.

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>>9074762
That's precisely it, I can understand the 'falling out of good graces thing', but it's the 'with the sea' that for some reason messes with my head
>>9074763
I am Portuguese although I am comfortably proficient with english
>>9074829
C'est bizarre parce que en anglais j'ai la sensation qu'il y a quelque chose qui cloche avec ce titre. Lisais en espagnol donne moi l'impression d'avoir compris. C'est que en français même 'with the sea' veut dire dans ce cas 'du' est pas 'avec'

>>9074977
C'est vrai, "with the sea" est bizarre.
Maybe : [fell from (grace with the sea)], mais "grace with the sea" est bizarre aussi.
Apparemment en japonais c'est complètement autre chose...

By the way, guys : does the kid kill the sailor ? I read this book 25 years ago and can't tell if the kid-killing-the-sailor happens here or in some other novel.

>>9074977
Pare de tentar traduzir literalmente, "fell from grace" = "perdeu os favores"

Lots of people have that problem with RL Stevenson's
>Home is the sailor
>Home from sea
There's a couple of markers for his death which have
>Home from the sea
including the one in the South Seas iirc

The original title translates literally to "The Afternoon Towing".

>>9077067
Do you happen to know if the word Mishima uses for glory in the end (Glory tastes bitter) happens to be a homonym of 曳航? I don't have the Japanese version, so I can't check myself, but I've been curious about this for a while.

>>9077346
Yup, I just checked and it is. That's pretty awesome and I didn't notice it at all.

竜二はなお、夢想に浸りながら、熱からぬ紅茶を、ぞんざいに一息に飲んだ。飲んでから、ひどく苦かったような気がした。誰も知るように、栄光(えいこう)の味は苦い。

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>>9077520
Thanks for checking, mate

K I'll explain it to you real quick. /lit/ tells you to start Mishima with Sailor. /lit/ is autistic, start with Confessions.