wtf I hate liberals now

>>8998523
>now

what took you so long?

Why did Kirillov bite Peter's finger?

>>8998523
how is this about liberals, how does it portray liberals badly? Liberal just means Free +the theft of taxation spent undesirably ,you dont hate Freedom do you anon?

>>8998853
I FUCKING HATE LIBERATION, IN EVERY SHAPE AND FORM, AMIRITE?

>>8998853
Try reading the book Plebby McPleb. It's more about the atheistic, nihilistic and materialistic nature of liberals, and their ability to put the success of the "cause" above all else, including basic morality. It was quite a prophetic and insightful book in that respect.

>>8998901
You realize liberals in his time just referred to social democrats right? Dostoyevsky is an excellent writer, but if you think we should regress to a tradionalist authoritarian society, youre an idiot idealogue.

It's a satire of Sergey Nechayev, the Russian nihilist who was basically excommunicated by Marx, Bakunin et al. gb2 reddit.

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I liked this book but for me it was nowhere near as good as Crime & Punishment. Would I like the Prince or should just go ahead and read the Brothers K?

>tfw you know that dosto suddenly gives shatov a wife and a child just so it'll hurt more when he dies (but you cry anyway)

The killing of shatov was a great scene btw, it felt so thoroughly wrong

>>8998901
Trofimovitch (or whatever his name, the writer who broke into french and cried a lot) was a liberal, critical of Shatov and his nationalism, and not part of the avant garde revolutionary club. His son Pyotr embarrassed him and cut ties. Why do you think that might that be?

>>8998918
>You realize liberals in his time just referred to social democrats right?
Again, the focus is on morals, religion, and philosophical beliefs, of which liberals of today still resemble those of his time, albeit now with the addition of authoritarianism.

>>8998953
Why don't you tell us

>>8998936
>The killing of shatov was a great scene btw, it felt so thoroughly wrong
Kirillov's suicide] was one of the most unsettling things I've ever read, the way he so suddenly descends into absolute madness, all the while knowing it had been lurking right under the surface for so long.

>>8999021
>Again, the focus is on morals, religion, and philosophical beliefs, of which liberals of today still resemble those of his time
My point is that both liberals and conservatives of today are what he wouldve considered liberals. He was staunchly anti materialist, meaning he probably disliked capitalism as much as he disliked socialism. Being so orthodox and anti materialist, I think Dostoyevsky would have likely adovcated for some Evola-esque spirtual society. My point is, even though he is an excellent writer, I think his politics were probably pretty radically different from todays western society. His politics shouldnt really appeal to anyone who isnt "red pilled"

>>8999021
Because Dostoevsky was writing about the atheistic, nihilistic and materialistic nature of the thoughtspring of liberals: revolutionary socialists, not of liberals like Steph.

>Americans trying to talk about political categories.

Really painful desu

>>8998918
No liberal didn't refer to social democrats you utter pleb.

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>>8998901
>atheistic, nihilistic and materialistic nature of liberals, and their ability to put the success of the "cause" above all else, including basic morality. It was quite a prophetic and insightful book in that respect.

Its ashame Dosto never encountered Stirner's work because the Ego and his Own did this 40 years earlier

>>8999021
>of which liberals of today still resemble those of his time, albeit now with the addition of authoritarianism.

>Liberal = free, easy going
>liberal- "we're going to force you to be free and easy going!"

>>8999134
*pats on back* thanks for the contribution friendo, you tried really well, and thats what counts, maybe next time, there will be something to show for it

Steph was portrayed as the well intentioned but naive spark that started the flame. That's why he denounced himself as one of the possessed swine who needed to be drowned and took up the Gospel before he died (though how much of that was delirium who knows).

>>9000474
meant to quote >>8999073

>>8998901
>implying republicans aren't just as guilty of that.

>>9000498
If y ou're talking about politicians I won't argue that. But, having lived in an extremely liberal city my entire life, I can say with certainty that as far as common folk go, conservatives far more moral and far less materialistic than liberals in general, and I believe this can be directly tied to the nhilistic leanings of liberals.

>>9000508
I disagree, but see I live in a conservative area where profits and materialism are more important than morality or the environment.

I can see both sides leaving morals for one objective or another and both sides are becoming more and more polarized.

>>9000520
Honestly I think this is more than just a left vs. right issue. There are different types of liberals and different types of conservatives. But the unifying variable is a lack of conviction in one's moral beliefs.

>>9000545
Well said. This I can definitely agree with you on.

>>9000545
>>9000520
>>9000508

Upper class, and not.

Upper class pretty much means, cares about materialism (many who are not upper class, might want to and work to be, and they care about it too)
What more does liberal and conservative come down to then, one postures to spend the masses money more on welfare, one a bit more on military, one a bit more on other things, one a bit less on everything else?

>>9000545
>>9000508
>>9000520

Those aspects of materialism white you seem to deem unsavory simply with your use of the word, are just almost unavoidable, automatic spillage, result of being so wealthy that you are uncontrollably and exceedingly patrician and your lively world is your wildest dreams of Nirvana (not the band)

Economics is the foundation. For eating, drinking, clothing, and sheltering, doing work to get money, is the foundation

>>8998857
>liberalism = liberation
Work sets us free desu

>>8998953
>His son Pyotr embarrassed him and cut ties. Why do you think that might that be?
This was never actually explained properly and I'm still not completely sure why. I assumed that he just resented his dad for abandoning him as a child; I don't see how it really played into his schemes, as his dad was no longer in the circle to begin with.

Just finished C&P. great stuff, Dosto is my love. Is Demons good? Wanna read that before Burger King.

>>8999473
It's a shame that ideas can only take upon a given subject's cognition through the illusion of a trusted figure, i.e. Stirner in your case. Everything is the progeny of poetry, everything you know is in Homer alone and yet is still unique to you. Everything Stirner postulates has been postulated before, his rhetoric is simply easy enough for you. There is an entire myriad writers with a greater amount of command over this material and your choice to expose an interest in a vogue, now overread comedian is is why I pity you and most others on this board.

>>8998523
The last book i couldnt finish. It was so boring. Sorry, Dosty!

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>>8998918

>regress

>>9003118
Part I was a little boring, but things pick up by the half-way point, and part III is probably some of his best work.

>>9001646
free from what?

>>8998523
You got an digital copy to share or what?

What is the name of the painting for that cover?

Dosto himself is the same bitter resentful characters he writes

>>8998918
>Regress

>>8998523
>liberals

you mean anarchists and revolutionaries right?

>>9004626
I had like 100 pages left to go and it was just a slog. One of the three books ive put down. Still own the copy though. Its from the 70s i think.

>>9007694
Don't give up,like the anon said earlier,it takes up real good. And done finishing it ,i might even add that it is probably one of dosto's best work.

>>9006589
Doesn't matter cuz that ain't the point to begin with.

>>8998523
You missed the entire point if you unironically fell for this meme. It wasn't about liberalism let alone about liberals. If it condemns anything then it condemns the force that eventually took over Russia,leaving trails of bodies on it's path.

Maybe it's the title of this book(DEMONS) that gives rise to these presumptions and memes,in that sense i agree that "The Possessed" would have better fit for the context and the content .

>>9006327
Portrait of Alexandre Benois by Leon Bakst

>>8998918
>regress

ideology at its purest

good.

>>9007742
>It wasn't about liberalism let alone about liberals.

And the fact that the revolutionaries were all faithless nihilists who were pushing for progressive causes is just incidental...? Okay buddy.

>>9009804
Say that to those "faithless nihilists" ,go and try to label them as liberals and see how they scoff it off . These are 2 dfferent political factions with very distinct beliefs and objectives.

I had the misfortune to live under such a government(and they didn't even have the central gov in their control,like USSR and China) that lasted more than 3 decades,wrecking up our industries,infrastructure and academia,while damaging the culture from where it would be hard to even get back, and calling them liberals will simply be the worst kind euphemism.

>>9010333
They're frequently referred to as liberals in the book. You're being pedantic.

>>9003089
>There is an entire myriad writers with a greater amount of command over this material

Care to share some of these figures? Do you not see the missed opportunity here much like others do with Kierkegaard and Nietzsche ?

>>9010408
>thinking he has actually read the book
Anon, he's just upset people are shittalking his pet politics.

>>9000508
>But, having lived in an extremely liberal city my entire life

As someone who grew up in a conservative city and then lived in a liberal one, I completely disagree considering these two groups have two different morals. Saying one is more moral doesn't mean anything because you have to assert what is moral. If you're a conservative then surprise surprise when you state that conservatives are more moral

If you are stating that conservatives stick to their beliefs more than liberals then you need to go to church or an AA/NA meeting in a conerstaive city and get to know a few who attend. Pretty soon you see the sad, sad cracks with traditional morality

Also
>far less materialistic

Seriously go live in a conservative city and tell me they are not flat our worst. You'd be better off comparing rural liberals to rural conservatives.

>>8998953

Pyotr insulted and mocked his father because Stephan wasn't in his life. He had no respect for Trofimovitch.

>>9006589
Dosto's self inserts are easy to recognize (underground man and Krasotkin particularly)