How do we create a valid foundation for ethics?

We don't have to since God already did. Next thread!

>>8983522
Go to bed Jordan Peterson!

>>8983522
How do we create a valid foundation for the belief in God?

Don't want to build a house on sand here.

>>8983839
>Thinking we have to build a case for god in order to make a case on which we base our ethics

>>8983513
You can't, discourse ethics tried but it has too many issues.

>>8983850
Issues such as?

>>8983863
You must accept discourse without any sophisms over rhetoric and violence, which is way better to convince people and make them act. It's very efficient in close, very intellectual systems, but it won't ever work for a vast number of people.

is bill burr /lit/?

This is why I'm increasingly interested in applied/practical ethics as an area for further research and study.

>>8983913
>loud opinions on everything
>doesn't read

our guy

>>8983513
Categorical imperatives, my friend.

>>8984067
> T. Kantbot

>>8984067
Antisemite.

>>8983513
It's not possible, since it's basically setting a universal standard for ethics. There's no consistent set of ethical principles that every person on earth will accept.

At least for right now. I expect some variation of Slate Star Codex's Archipelago Culture to become the norm in about a century or so.

>>8984443
>Slate Star Codex's Archipelago Culture
could you tl;dr that?

>>8984470
Basically it states that there's no such thing as Western culture anymore, because to live in a highly industrialized society requires conformance to a "Universal Culture" or an "Industrial Culture," which basically says you can do whatever in the privacy of your own home, which is in the metaphor an island in the overall archipelago, and when you go out into the ocean (mingle with others in the public spaces of the industrialized world) you don't bother people with attempts to impose your ethics on them.

It makes a really good case for the idea that what we call "Western Civilization" is really just "Industrial Civilization," and that China and the Middle East will be just like us in every way that matters as soon as industrialization hits, because that is literally the only cutlure that makes sense in a heavily industrialized space, and all other cultures are outcompeted.
The author asks people in the West, "When was the last time you twirlled around a maypole, or celebrated the Spring Solstice?"
To which the usual answer is "Never have I ever done this."

Basically, the only universal ethical tenet WILL be "Don't fuck with other people in public spaces, do your own thing in private ones." Right now there are no universal ethical tenets.

smoke heroin

By deriving the first principle from the possibility of its application.

>>8984489
So basically liberalism and secularism taken to an extreme?

>>8983839
>he hasn't read Kierkegaard
kys

>>8984067
>Kantlets
Not even once.

>>8984067
I Kant believe you've done this.

>>8984542
>>8984088

>>8984499

>>8984067

There aren't categorical imperatives, the is only the categorical imperative, which takes four forms. They are all the sane principle, though. Their different formulations are merely analytic explications of the principle.

>>8983513
You don't. Morality as a story is either an obfuscation or a rhetoric. What you are talking about is an agreement on an expected behavior that someone is used to, to the point they do it automatically.

The call to morality is usually just the confrontation of different norms.
It is the restatement of a wish or a desire for the other to act a certain way.

Just because you codify that behavior in laws or ethics, doesn't make it any more of a wish, doesn't mean the person has been raised with that story, and doesn't mean they have that behavior as a consequence of their own representation.

So ethics is just whining, and in practice is just hypocrisy.

>>8984559
>There aren't categorical imperatives
>Is only the categorical imperative

I'm sorry, but you aren't making sense, coming from a person who hasn't read Kant.

>>8984537
>just take the leap bro

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87KB, 640x436px

>>8983513
Through Communism.

>>8984489
what about phenomena like anime and robotics in Japanese industrial society?

Why does Western Civilization transitioning to industrial civilization imply every culture will, too? This is besides the effects of globalization, i.e. without globalization I am not convinced of this.

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3KB, 96x125px

>>8984636
lol no.

>>8984600

My post is full of typos, so that may be the barrier to understanding here, but what is the point of confusion for you?

>>8984669
So, you make mention of there being no categorical imperatives, but then it looks like you go on to say that there's only one, and then you say it takes on 4 forms expressing the same principle. I just don'd understand why this would mean that there are no categorical imperatives, because you just wrote that there was one.

>>8984688

There aren't imperatives, plural; there is just the imperative, singular, which has four formulations. These different formulations might make it seem as if there are several imperatives, but that is illusory. There is just the one categorical imperative, and its explication via the four formulations.

>>8984711
Oh, that makes more sense. So what is it?

>>8984717

Act only according to that maxim which you can, at the same time, will it as a universal law.

>>8984730
Sounds pretty solid to me. Thanks for that friendo. Really appreciate it.