Who was more right, /lit/? I'd say Hobbes desu.

>>8640107

Hobbes' state of nature is regarded, more or less universally, as the most realistic nowadays.

I also think that, as time goes on, we are seeing that Hobbes' argument concerning the need for an absolute authority (be it a sovereign or otherwise) was more and more justified.

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>Political """Science"""/"""Philosophy"""

>>8640132

>more or less universally

By who?

>we are seeing that Hobbes' argument concerning the need for an absolute authority (be it a sovereign or otherwise) was more and more justified.

Where?

Fuckin' weasel words...

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Hobbes: a posteriori true
Rousseau: a priori true

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>>8640200

>Rousseau

AKA The Last Man par excellence.

>"Tis matter of astonishment that men of quality and parts should suffer themselves to be so far misled by custom and implicit faith. Reason, if consulted with, would advise, that their children’s time should be spent in acquiring what might be useful to them, when they come to be men, rather than that their heads should be stuffed with a deal of trash, a great part whereof they usually never do (’tis certain they never need to) think on again as long as they live; and so much of it as does stick by them, they are only the worse for."
~ John Locke, the first STEMlord

>"Can there be any thing more ridiculous than that a father should waste his own money, and his son’s time, in setting him to learn the Roman language, when, at the same time, he designs him for a trade, wherein he, having no use of Latin, fails not to forget that little which he brought from school, and which ’tis ten to one he abhors for the ill-usage it procured him? Could it be believed, unless we have every where amongst us examples of it, that a child should be forced to learn the rudiments of a language, which he is never to use in the course of life that he is designed to, and neglect all the while the writing a good hand, and casting accounts, which are of great advantage in all conditions of life, and to most trades indispensably necessary?”
~ John "When am I even going to use this shit?" Locke

>>8640175
political science and political philosophy are two entirely different things.

>>8640199
>Wikipedia Words


On topic though, Hobbes is dad philosophy. It says nothing of substance, is mostly disorganized and begs the question of why should life continue if it has no higher purpose. He ignores all things sublime and beautiful and reduces man to a hedonistic animal that needs to be controlled.

I don't think Locke was right on everything but it's not right to compare an inferior thinker with a superior one.

spinoza desu

>>8640339
I highly doubt he experienced the sublime and beautiful during the English Civil War.

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>>8640325

His campaign against Classical Education was, in part, responsible for the pathetic and utilitarian education we have today - which essentially trains people to be servants of the state or industry, and confines them to a very narrow niche.

Someone who received (or receives) a Classical Education, on the other hand, had a wealth of general knowledge that would put most of our 'intellectuals' to shame.

Truly, Schiller was right to say "Je méprise Locke."

>>8641713
>a wealth of general knowledge
*middleclass bragging points

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>>8641720

You're right, now get back to coding sexbots in a basement for the rest of your STEM life.

>Tfw people still think the Apollonian must triumph over the Dionysian at all costs

>>8640339
a) only cucks need some 'higher purpose' beyond the veil of life to keep them going
b) Hobbes does not ignore the sublime, but maintains that aesthetic contemplation is only possible when mankind's libidinal desires are sated

>>8641729
would you have better counterbantz if you had had a classical education?

>>8640339

>Hobbes is dad philosophy

All analytic philosophy is dad philosophy.
Give me that fucking dank continental shit, the uncontrollable nigger-vitality of a Nietzsche or a Kant.

>>8641791

I think he meant dead philosophy...

>>8640107
they're so goddamn similar, one just had plain nonsense as his basis, the other one put it on stilts

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>>8641799

>they're so goddamn similar

Said someone who's read neither. Locke did more damage overall though:

>Responsible for modern education
>Brought the doctrine of equality to the fore
>Basis of the Whig interpretation of history
>Responsible for British/US """constitutions"""

>>8641803
>Implying the two aren't similar
>Not having read Bentham to get my amazing joke
>Being this American

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>>8641791
>the uncontrollable nigger-vitality of a Nietzsche

N I C E
I
C
E

>>8640107
Rousseau was a fucking idiot

>>8640132
How is Hobbes realistic? He presupposes such a thing as a 'natural' human brutish condition, which never existed. We were just dumb animals until a certain system came along according to Hobbes. Fucking bullshit.

Obviously, Tabula Rasa, for similar reasons, is kind of bullshit. We know now there's a mix between environment and genes.

>>8641713
I know, man. Utilitarianism was a mistake. Nietzsche said something like, "mass education will promote widespread stupidity". The fact of my terrible paraphrase proves the narcissistic cunt right.

>>8641798
I meant dad philosophy, the mediocre spouse of mom science.

Men is objectively prone to society. However, he is prone to SMALL societies, not large ones as the one we live in: therefore, the natural state of men is anarchy

>>8643770
the natural state of men is HIS society

*tip fedora