>Society is turning into Orwell's 1984!

>>8605581
its more like neuromancer desu

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>>8605581
>1984 was a dystopia

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>1984 was not a manual!

Society is turning in to Βάτραχοι του Αριστοφάνη

>>8605581
Huxley predicted it better

>>8605612
The kingdom of Aristophanes?

>>8605622
wow you're so well-read

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>>8605598

>>8605621

in 1984 the proles live based off pleasure and distraction too. he had pretty much the same idea

Look, you know nothing about this person (as is expected on this website), so why be a sarcastic snob? He could be very well read, or maybe they never read in their free time. Either way, who are you to judge? If you have nothing constructive to state about his assessment of the political sphere, in agreement or oppopposition, why make yourself look like an ass?

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>>8605611
>Idiocracy was not supposed to be a documentary!!

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>My opponent is a fascist!

>>8605596
This, except us poorfags aren't getting any of cool augmentations to make up for the wealth gap.

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>Trump is beyond the pale

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>>8605735
>trump is a breath of fresh air

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>Donald Trump is a regular Gregory Berrycone!

>>8605641
>he said, on a site where two clicks can lead him to endless porn or endless discussion

>>8605641
So? That post made no value statement about the situation in his post whatsoever. All it said was that 1984 isn't as different from Brave New World as people seem to think it is. For all we know he could be a hedonist that absolutely loves that aspect of our society.

>it can't happen here

[smugpepe.jpg]

>>8605678
>poorfags aren't getting any of cool augmentations
you're literally on one right now

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>Donald Trump is a modern Hitler

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>Paper Towns is my favorite book

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>>8605621
>>8605641
They both ripped off Zamyatin

>>8605735

Trump would be Big Brother no question

>>8605581
1984 is probably the most catastrophically incorrect novel ever written, considering its ubiquity in popular culture. Does anyone seriously believe that totalitarian government is possible in the information age when they can't even rein-in multinational corporations? It's complete nonsense.

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>WHAT DO YOU MEAN? WE ARE LIVING IN IDIOCRACY RIGHT NOW XD

>>8606105

You're joking right?

>>8606007
Abso-fuckin-lutely.

>>8606007
But at least Orwell had the balls to admit it.

>>8605598
But... wasn't it?

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>>8605780

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>>8606105
>yfw you wake up in this "impossible world" in a few years

>>8606146
Sounded p comfy to me senpai

It's a mix. Some stuff is so dead-on it's a bit scary though, I will say.

The number of times I have seen 'comply or die' on my facebook (fake to follow news) is beyond count now. Everyone loves the boot.

>>8606119
No? The power of the state over the life of the citizen has declined dramatically since 1948.

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A post-conference dinner. A mid-career male scholar is eating with a number of younger male PhD students. He is discussing the virtues of the small town where his university is based. One of the best things, he explains, his face alive with joy, is going to the nightclub early in the first term and seeing all the scantily-clad 18 year old girls. He gestures breasts and uses the phrase “fresh meat”. The younger men are clearly expected to approve. But we mainly force smiles, and drink our wine.

>>8605627
Oh gee anon :3

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At ISA NE a hearing-impaired woman observed how poorly equipped the conference and hotel were to accommodate her equipment needs (she had all equipment, she just needed long enough extension cords or something like that). She complained out loud to the organizer. After she left the organizer remarked how rude and demanding she was. After all they were doing her a favor! Yours truly failed to be an ally unfortunately and only sheepishly remarked that she needed that stuff to be able to participate….

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>XKeyscore
>Facebook's user agreement and handling of data
>ubiquity of social media
>the rising of fascist and proto-fascist parties in Europe and America

It's not that far-fatched, to be honest

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Sitting in a research methods conference session. One of the presenters stands up and is explaining a survey, and says people are to check “male or female,” followed by “I guess that’s all there is.” This would have been bad enough, but he then proceeded to laugh about this last line. I feel sorry if any of my trans or gender queer colleagues were in the audience that day, it hurt me deeply as well.

>>8606164

I think that it is inevitable. As a rule of thumb, history repeats itself. When a superpower is on the verge of collapse and chaos which will be the inevitable fate of the USA due to its unsustainable economic model and degree of consumption then it is likely in my opinion that the government would declare a state of martial law. This probably won't happen in our lifetime but never underestimate the emotions of those in power. We're all human.

>>8606180
For the sake of argument, sure. But martial law is pretty weaksauce compared to 1984, where the Party can literally turn war into peace and rewrite history at a whim. Something which is impossible in the information age.

>>8606187
>Something which is impossible in the information age.
Ha ha.

>>8605581
>dude surveillance lmao

>>8606187

While I see where you are coming from some might disagree and say that more than ever in the information age the gocernment does this. The vast majority of news is biased, politicians all lie, many Americans are totally brainwashed and are incapable of critical thinking. It's easy to twist the truth and instruct people what to believe.

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>the internet is turning all people into assholes!

>>8606212
That's not 1984. Propaganda works nowadays by *overwhelming* the reader with information, not restricting its flow.

Only countries like North Korea try to keep a total (totalitarian) hold on information, and as a result the country has to be so isolated it can't even feed its own people.

>>8606007
WUZ

>>8606233
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Wtcn_MkKL8

>>8606226
Is there a version of 1984 for the information age? One where power is exerted over the people while a great number of the people are unaware or apathetic to the fact that what they think is controlled not by the government but by corporations

Reality is way worse than 1984, kiddo

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>>8606233

saw it coming and laughed my ass off anyway, thanks anon

>>8606157
Most dystopian and post-apocalyptic settings are comfy. I think mostly it has to do with the void of responsibility.

>>8606246
jennifer government

it's not especially great tho

>>8605581
>Current Newspeak-
>Job Creators: The 1%
>PTSD: Shell shock
>Collateral damage: innocent civilians killed
>Extraordinary renditions: kidnapping of and transfer of terrorist suspects
>Enhanced interrogation: torture
>Low information voters: stupid people

>Current doublethink:
>ISIS in any other country: ISIS BAD!
>ISIS in Syria: ISIS GOOD!

>Countless perpetual wars in the middle east where the country we're attacking changes but no one ever comments on it even though the 'enemy' changes.

>Rothschild family funding both sides of every war since Napoleon and essentially rewriting history, controlling all national banks including the Federal Reserve which is an unregulated private bank even though congress has the rights to the creation of the country's money supply as the constitution states

>the nsa

>1984 isn't happening

You're just ignorant of the world around you.

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>1984 is a capitalist hyperbole that could never happen!

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>>8607010
>this guy would never create a 1984 scenario!

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>>8605581
>modern art is garbage

>>8606994
Did you even read Nineteen-Eighty Four? Newspeak is deliberate simplification, 'double plus ungood', not euphemisms like 'collateral damage'. And doublethink would be telling us the same thing is good and bad, not something similar in different places. It also didn't have anything to do with your jew-phobic fantasies.

>>8605621

That's because the Huxley family (who Eric Blair [Orwell] was associated with) have long been involved in bringing these changes in society forward. These books are not just sci-fi predictions they are in some sense blueprints of elites.

>>8606994
op isn't saying the people saying this are wrong, he's just noting how trite it is to make the comment

its like literally saying

>Wake up, sheeple!

>>8607033
Look at this O R W E L L I A N disinfo agent

>>8606213
It makes them more visible and entitled tho

>>8606165
>>8606169
>>8606177
Did you write this?

>>8607017
I like to imagine he would create a dark edgy cyberpunk future.

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>REAL communism hasn't ever been tried.

>>8607057
They should though.

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>>8607024
>modern music is garbage

The hilarious thing about people comparing modern society to 1984 is that you just fucking know they've never read or picked up the book.

Really just a misinformation tactic used kind of like how the nobles tricked the illiterate surfs into continuing doing labour for them in the middle ages.

>>8605621
100% This.

>Everyone wants to feel good about themselves,
>everyone has to be nice or it's a hate crime,
>welfare, raising the minimum wage in attempts to make everyone live a mediocre life doing some basic job rather than letting people take care of themselves and become successful or homeless by their own doing
>mainstream entertainment is dumbed down and is just purely for entertainment rather than trying to be great art or make people thing about things they never thought about
>most people find
>people are uncomfortable with intellectual diversity

weed is basically soma
>feel happy
>feel comfortable with mediocrity
>lose interest in things
>people are trying to legalize it
>won't kill you so you could potentially use it all your life
>inb4 stoners get mad and talk about how weed doesn't do that to them

Exceptions don't make a generalization less true and I think everyone deep down knows it's true that weed really does negativity affect your life in ways not linked to health. This is coming from someone who enjoys weed too.

>>8607716
Do you really believe that paying people an unlivable minimum wage promotes some kind of meritocracy? Do you think making the incredibly wealthy (e.g. not you or your upper middle-class family) pay their fair share of taxes is going to make their lives mediocre, rather than just making the lives of the poor more bearable?

>>8607605
i cant wait for society to collapse. no one is going to give a shit about literacy and from the ashes feudalism will rise once again.

>>8607544
Truth doesn't matter. The only thing that does is originality

1984 happened in 1948; we're already now living in a soft world of fascism, cutely and sweetly poisonous, like candy. You join the world of 1984 the second you piss off the government and come under surveillance or captivity; otherwise, life for the proles is a Brave New World, unless you're homeless and addicted to drugs.

>>8607775
I think the idea of having a livable minimum wage is good, but in reality it drives businesses elsewhere because they can pay people less and make more money.

If the entire world was on the same page as far as a minimum wage then I would be all for it but the western world doesn't exist in a vacuum.

I guess saying it encourages mediocrity was a far but it definitely enables it.

If there was no minimum wage it would be do or die; you get a good job, you live with someone else or you go homeless. That environment works to eliminate mediocrity and would make some people work a lot harder than they normally would.

It sounds heartless and cruel but unfortunately life isn't fair.

I really wish there could be a way create a safety net but I just don't think raising the minimum is beneficial because of the way the world is currently. My issue is not with having to pay taxes to help people out, because I wouldn't mind helping people who are less fortune; I just don't think that is an effective way to do it and I don't believe there is a way that would work until there is a change in countries like China.

>>8607716
>>8605621
Absolutely. 1984 is nightmare mode in one sense, but Brave New World is both more likely to happen and, even worse, closer to our society as it is now.

I wouldn't even boil it down to weed, though. Medication - depression meds especially - could be an easy stand in

>>8607866
It's more likely that you'll just get more homeless people. The average person is a lot more mediocre than you'd expect

>>8607519
but


it hasn't

>>8607885
It literally couldn't be. Human nature doesn't allow it

>>8607893
>muh human nature
It can't be because the state wouldn't wither away.

>>8606994
Shellshock and PTSD are completely different things. Nobody thinks that ISIS is good in Syria.

>>8607010
>orwell was a capitalist

>>8607893
So what does human nature allow, then? Making statements about human nature is like trying to describe a painting from a perspective on the same plane as the canvas.

>>8607869
>I wouldn't even boil it down to weed, though. Medication - depression meds especially - could be an easy stand in

Of course I wouldn't pin it all on weed and like I said, I actually enjoy smoking just like I enjoy sex and occasionally garbage tv.

It's just when it gets to the point where someone stops caring about important issues because they focus on hedonistic pleasures that it becomes a problem. Video games especially fit that.

Honestly depression meds are probably closer to soma than weed except that I would be scared to try depression meds because prozac has only been around since the late 80's and the health issues are only starting to be realized, whereas soma in BNW was completely safe.

A lot of drugs fit that except for most uppers because that always makes me feel even more ambitious and do research to the point were I re-watch things like the each debate many times first on its own then several more times with different people commenting on it from all areas of the political spectrum.

It still is kind of a waste of time but at least I feel informed and can understand better why people think the things they do. I think it is a reverse of weed in a way because it is beneficial in my life for working but physically unhealthy.

>>8607935
We're inherently selfish and self-centered - and not necessarily in a bad way. It's how we protect ourselves, our families, and our "tribes", for lack of a better term.

Communism needs selflessness. It requires no one to want more or desire more than any other, for themselves or their families. Impossible.

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>>8605581
>Society is turning into The Protocols of the Elders of Zion

>>8607953
>inherently
Opinion discarded.

>>8607953
Capitalism has the same problem. Rather than overlook greed, it asserts that greed will turn out for the better of all as if by an invisible hand.

>>8607985
But things do turn out better. Look down at what you are typing on. The masses have the most to gain when the rich invest and create progress.

>>8607985
Living standards and life expectancy has increased rapidly since the industrial revolution and is a direct result of our capitalistic economy.

>>8607985
And yet it's still better than any form of communism we've had.

Greed and desire can lead to innovation.

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>>8606105
10/10 bait

>>8607953
>>8607985
>>8607992

Capitalism and communism fail for the same reason: apathy.

In a communist society people are just expected to work without a personal incentive. When you work hard just to see a guy do work at half the speed have the same stuff you do and be as successful is a major motivation killer. Now everyone is working at a slower speed and this is exactly what happens in communist countries. Things take so long to get done and progress is stifled.

In a capitalistic society large business want to take more money from people and so sell them all kinds of stuff they don't need and they want people to remain unmotivated to do anything but get more stuff. They try to convince people they need things they don't need and make people feel happy enough that they just remain at the bottom where the can be taken advantage of.

I wouldn't say either is great desu. The pro of communism is everyone has a basic standard of living while the con is you can't advance yourself and things generally slow down.

Capitalism is good because people can work to improve themselves and the free market means people are always trying to invent new things to sell; while a lot of it is nonsense, there are also people looking for cures for diseases and new more fuel efficient engines etc. The con is that lots of people will be continually taken advantage and never will have good lives. Another bad point is the money is king and rich people can influence government a lot.

It's always a fight between leftists and right wingers. I say I'm more right wing myself, but I understand why people like socialism/communism and there are some good elements that we can try to bring into government.

Breaking up monopolies is a lot more of a left wing thing because government is interfering with business, but I think it is a good thing and I know lots of other right wing people who agree.


The perfect communist world is a one where everyone is super motivated to work and all have the same standard of living. The perfect capitalistic society is one where people are informed and motivated to work hard to support themselves.

Both require people to want to work hard and while the question of if people are good or evil could be debated forever, I think it is undeniable that most people are lazy to varying degrees.

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>>8608123

>>8608123
>Now everyone is working at a slower speed and this is exactly what happens in communist countries
In practice, the exact same thing happens under capitalism. Managers gain status by having more workers, but there's a finite amount of work to be done. If you work too efficiently you'll be punished.

americans out
>>>/his/

>>8607039
Wait, what?

>>8608253
Things go a lot faster in a capitalist country. Haven't you ever heard any of those old soviet jokes (not just from Zizek) where the punch line is how the plumber took a year to fix a problem and didn't actually fix it or something. I know people who've lived in communist countries and they always talked about that kind of thing. Or how it is really hard to get western clothes and anything from the outside.

The situation you described is completely different because in the communist country they would want everyone to work as hard as possible because they need to produce things and the production is slowed by works while the thing you said was a situation of have too many workers for the work to the point that people are encouraged to work slower. That situation is evidence in itself that the work is getting fast, too fast.

>>8605678
We are though.

Society is turning more like a mixture of 1984, Atlas Shrugged and Brave New World.

>>8605627
So well Google translated

>>8607017
The current establishment is already doing a pretty good job at it.

>>8607716
>>8607943

The way this fits makes me extremely uncomfortable.

However, like >>8607869 said, I don't think it's specifically marijuana, it's that we present easy solutions. Smoke everyday or anti-depressant will remove anxiety, drinking is the way to have fun, TV, vidya, online is how you relax.

Society no longer challenges itself. Different ideas are shouted and shamed into submission instead of considered and discussed. We cater to the lowest instead of encouraging people to reach for the stars.

This problem isn't new, but the conditions to be able to lie back and do nothing have never been better.

>>8608590
hey i didnt even google translate it

>>8606357
whats not to like?

Things correct about 1984:

Crime stop and wrong think and all that shit exist now.

The department of truth somewhat exists, but instead of a department is people who are willing to do it on the internet for free.

Other than that our social arrangement is more Huxley

>>8607716
I agree with this, even as a huge stoner and drug addict. I however, think that the soma comparison should be more aimed at the drug culture in general.

new word smeld: noun aubergine bird: when you poop on wen u poop u own face and it smeld

>>8608985
All drugs are definitely like soma in a sense but the reason I made the comparison with weed was because it is popular and generally seen as socially acceptable and now it's only becoming more and more normalized.

I did read the book like 5 years ago, but I also remember soma being completely healthy. I don't think a drug like heroin could ever been seen as being like soma because heroin addiction eventually becomes a massive problem and kills you.

The negative effects of weed, like soma, are more subtle and be can't measured by a simple body count.

>I agree with this, even as a huge stoner and drug addict
Honesty I told myself I have to stop weed because I just blew through $400 in 2 weeks. I also slept through half my morning classes and went to any class after 3pm high af and neglected to study the entire time. I was getting high on like $60-100 of weed a day with some friends at like 2 in the afternoon. Now we're all super broke.
That's the kind of thing weed does to people because honestly if I had unlimited money I could probably just be happy smoking every single day, but that's not how the world works.
It might not be physically addictive, but it sure is mentally addictive.

>tfw on the second day of not smoking

>>8608991
wot

>>8605581
The perpetual war and 2 minutes hate stuff is basically just Fox News, msnbc, and their effect on partisan politics in the US

>>8609057
Soma is never said to be physically dangerous but no one is living long enough to show any health problems, and it's basically illegal to even suggest you should stop regularly consuming it. If you said you were feeling bad you would just be told to consume more soma.

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>>8607024
>modern art it garbage
This one's actually true tho.

>>8606105
>KEK'D
Sublime